Transcript of What If Trauma Could Be Released? Trauma Healing Methods with Dr. Judith Swack

Welcome to Notes from the Edge, where we have the conversations we should have been having all along. We talk about the things that we're not talking about. I'm your host, Lisa Lacey, writer, trauma educator, executive advisor, and author of the upcoming memoir Notes from a Certified Madwoman. Welcome to the edge. Hey, hey, my friends! Welcome back to another episode of Notes from the Edge. I am your host, Lisa Lacey, and this is the place we have the conversations we should have been having all along. Guess what? You ain't talking about it. So today we're gonna with special guest Dr. Judith Swack, and today we're going to have a conversation. I am so.

Excited about. Today we're exploring that— a question that sits at the very heart of our show: what does it actually mean to heal from trauma? Not simply learning to manage the symptoms, not pretending the past never happened, but understanding what trauma does to our minds, bodies, nervous systems, and whether it's possible to change the patterns that keep us stuck. Before we dive in though, let me tell you about Dr. Judith. She is a biochemist, an immunologist, author, and the originator of Healing from the Body Level Up methodology, also known as HBLU. She brings together her background in biochemistry, psychology, hypnotherapy, neurolinguistic programming, and energy psychology energy, guys, in an approach designed to address the conscious and unconscious patterns associated with emotional distress. She is also the author of Clear Trauma Now: A Powerful Solution for Getting Unstuck, a book that challenges conventional thinking about how long trauma recovery must take. What are we saying here? It doesn't have to be a trudge, and she's going to tell us why today. Her work has been presented at professional conferences, discussed in scientific and professional publications. She just published an article that we're going to be talking about today.

So, Dr. Swack, welcome to Notes from the Edge. How are you today?

Thrilled to be here. Thrilled.

Yeah, thrilled. I'm excited. I'm so excited about this conversation because, uh, it's something we have, uh, touched on, but we haven't gone as deep as I have a feeling you're going to take us today. So you have made fascinating transition from biochemistry to immunology and into trauma recovery. So why, why the transition? What's— what happened in that reinvention moment or moments to make you go, wow, people need to know where all this intersects and they don't?

Right. So, you know, I was sort of a born scientist. I always liked science. I was going to be a doctor. I ended up going into research because my professor said, you'd be wasted as a doctor. You have a research mind. That means I'm curious. I explore things and I discover things that nobody else has ever discovered. That's called original research. And then I contribute to the field. I expand the field with my original research and I publish it so that other people can try it in their laboratories or in their practices. So I'm the one who discovers things and then turns it into a protocol. So how I got into mind-body healing, because I really wanted to be an immunologist and I really had this picture of me contributing to the immunology field and making hundreds of papers and all these discoveries, because I love the immune system. But while I was getting my PhD, I was also trying to have a love life.

That's hard balance.

Oh yeah. And, and that was a disaster. Let me tell you.

And I've had a few. I've had a few. I get it. I get it.

And I kept attracting the same emotionally unavailable man in different bodies. And at least I had the awareness that it was a pattern that was repeating. I could see it, but I didn't know what was causing it. And so I couldn't stop it. So I went to a self-help workshop called Actualizations, and I was introduced to the unconscious mind, which I wasn't aware of. And I got excited. Oh, there's this entirely new world inside of me that I didn't know was there. Wow. And it's running my life. And I don't have any control over it. And that's where the sabotage is. And I realized that if I'm going to make my life work, I have to coordinate the conscious mind with the unconscious mind so that they're in alignment and they work together in the same direction. So I took training in neurolinguistic programming, which at the time was the state-of-the-art mind-body therapy. And I learned how to talk to the unconscious mind. And I learned more importantly, techniques for healing and adjusting the patterns because all the, all the damage, all the sabotage that goes on is patterned. And I learned to recognize patterns and then treat the patterns with the right technique to dissolve the energy of the patterns so that they were gone and then never repeated again.

So long story short, I'm happily married for, I don't know, 35, 37 years. I have a happy, healthy daughter who's in her 30s, got married at the age of 23 to the love of her life, is very successful in business, healthy. You know, I'm healthy. My husband is healthy. My business is healthy. My clients are getting healthier. You know, it actually worked, right?

You did it.

I did it.

Yeah. All right. Teach us. So before we dig in, I want to talk about those patterns. Yes, that will repeat until we— what's the first step? What's the first step in stopping those patterns? Because they're going to keep on repeating.

The first step is the awareness that you're repeating a pattern.

Yeah,

the first step is noticing something isn't right. So remember, your conscious mind is your logical mind, but your unconscious mind is the land of emotion and memory and habit and creativity and stories and so on and so forth. And it runs behavior. And this is a very important— everybody should write this down. Emotion runs behavior. And the more strongly you feel something, the more you believe it. And the more it runs your behavior, even if your conscious mind knows it's not true objectively, it's the energy of the pattern runs the behavior. So you see this in dieting. People get a diet plan that works for them. They follow the diet plan. It works for them. All of a sudden, for some strange reason that their conscious mind doesn't understand, they find themselves binge eating some kind of garbage. And while they're eating cookies and their conscious mind says, well, you can stop at 2, that's enough, but there's a bag of cookies and then their hand keeps reaching in. And now you're on 5. Now you're in 10, and now it doesn't stop until the bag is empty and you feel sick. And your conscious mind meantime has been shouting at your hand to stop that and even criticizing yourself.

And it doesn't even make a difference because the behavior continues until the bag is empty. Now consciously, you know that that's inappropriate, that that's gonna wreck your diet. It's making you feel sick. Your body's not happy with it. But something in there took control of your behavior and ran it while your conscious mind sat and watched. Right?

Yeah. What took control? What took control?

Right. So the conscious mind needs to know that it doesn't control the unconscious mind, even though it thinks it should. It does not. So the conscious mind needs to know That there's a pattern running that has energy and its job. Your conscious mind's job is to find out what is the pattern that's causing this problem and then bring a technique that will release the energy of that pattern from whichever level it's running at. So I'll give you some examples about what would cause that repeated eating. So, you know, we have a conscious mind, we have an unconscious mind, we have a body. And bodies are the land of survival. Bodies want to be comfortable. They want to be happy. They want to survive. They want to get their needs met. They want to reproduce. Reproduction is big in all living things. Yeah. And bodies are very, very fond of surviving. And they're always searching for danger through the senses. It's automatic, you know, danger, danger. And if the body thinks it's in danger, it'll go into fight or flight. And it'll put out that adrenaline and get you extra strong and you'll fight or you'll flight or you'll freeze, but you will do anything you can to survive.

Okay. So you have to understand that. And then of course you have a soul. The point is you have a soul and it's in a body. And why are you even alive? Why are you here? Like, let's think about that because you see, scientists don't take anything for granted. We question everything and think about it. So I said, why do we have a soul in the body? That's a real question. And I believe, after thinking about it quite seriously, that we have a soul in a body so that we can experience this form of life, play the game, create the best life possible, and continue to grow and evolve and make a contribution to the world that's unique to this combination of is-ness. Yes.

Oh, combination of isness. Yes, bring your isness. I love it, I love it. All right, you covered a lot. I want to circle back to a few of your points. We're going to talk about, um, fight or flight because that is specifically in your book, but I want you to tell us a little bit about energy psychology. What is that field? Let's talk about that a little bit because you mentioned energy, the energy of the patterns.

Mm-hmm. So energy psychology is the field that says, um, the patterns that interfere with you are made of energy. All life is made of energy. And in order to free yourself from what I call unconscious self-sabotage, you need to connect in with the pattern and its energy. And I just think every, every sabotage pattern boils down to stuck energy. And then you need to use a technique that will release the stuck energy so that you flow again and all your levels align. So most people think of energy psychology as tapping, meridian tapping, because the tapping technique started with Roger Callahan. He published his first book, I believe in 1986, it was called The 5-Minute Phobia Cure. And he had taken a class in applied kinesiology and learned about tapping on meridian points from Chinese medicine. And if you tap on meridian points, it will release negative emotions from the body. And he had a client who was very stuck in a very bad phobia, and he was trying to use talk therapy to clear phobias. You can't use talk therapy to clear trauma or phobias. Because talk therapy is a conscious mind intervention and phobias and traumas are a body level pattern.

You have to bring to the right level. So he, he had her do some tapping and her phobia lifted instantly. And he thought, this is brilliant. I'm going to make a whole field out of it. And then it continued and became energy psychology. So most people think of energy psychology techniques as tapping that releases the stuck energy. And you can feel it release. You can feel the energy, of the emotion, the intensity of it in your body. And then when you release it, it dissipates and it's gone and it's not there anymore and it's not driving you. Now, energy field, energy psychology is a larger field than that. It's not just tapping. So it encompasses many different techniques that will clear patterns at the unconscious and body levels and uses a variety of techniques. But the point is that they all work In the nervous system, in your energy field, in your body, and they release the patterns that are holding you and running you. So let me talk about what causes the overeating.

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I had a client, she started gaining weight after her husband divorced her. Here's what she said. I'm okay at work during the day. I'm busy, but then I go home at night. And what she didn't say out loud is to an empty house, right? I go home at night and I don't know, for some reason I just start eating junk and I can't stop. Now, what happens when you have a trauma? And I have mapped the structure of trauma here. It's my book. Petting my book. Pet, pet, pet. So anyway, the structure of trauma is my original research, means nobody discovered this before. I did this by working with people, writing notes, testing other people against it, testing the results, following them for a period of time, and then publishing my results. That's what scientists do.

Nice.

This is my original research. Nobody else has published this. And I published my first paper on the structure of trauma And how to use tapping to clear it in, I think, 1994.

Oh, that was before anybody was talking about it.

Yeah. This is what I mean. Original research.

Yeah.

Right. So how do you know this? Because I did original research.

I've seen it. I've seen it work time and time again. Yeah. Yeah.

And then people followed.

Yeah.

But to this day, people don't know that trauma has structure. And I'm still, I'm still going to conferences and presenting this. And now I published the book and I'm spreading this around so people understand what trauma is and has structure. But when there's a loss trauma, what happens is you feel that something is now missing from you because you've lost something. You follow the logic?

Makes perfect sense.

Yeah. And so it's a feeling of emptiness. And usually where do you feel the emptiness in your body is your heart or your stomach. Right now, the body cannot tell the difference between an emotional sensation and a physical sensation, because from the body's point of view, it's a feeling. That's important to know. So now she goes home to an empty house and it triggers her feeling of emptiness. In this case, in her stomach. And so she's now trying to compensate and fill the emptiness literally by putting food in her stomach. Do you understand?

Mm-hmm.

But it doesn't actually work to clear the feeling of emptiness because it isn't a physical emptiness. So she's using the wrong technique, which is food. And the body ends up suffering because she gained weight. And now her conscious mind, ironically, is upset with herself, whatever self, whatever level of self we're talking about, because we're multiple selves, aren't we?

We are layers.

Yeah. She's upset with herself for gaining weight, but that's not the problem. The problem is she has this feeling of emptiness from loss trauma that she didn't know how to release. and is still triggered and reacting to these emotions. So that's why her conscious mind can say, stop doing this. It's bad for your weight. While the feeling of emptiness demands to be filled because it's painful and the pain is driving— the pain of the emptiness is driving the attempt to fill it. So I don't teach people to cope. I teach people to heal. And we actually find out what the feeling is that's driving the reaction or the behavior or the thought pattern. And then we use a technique to release it. Now I use tapping in my book. I talk about tapping because that's one of the best techniques for releasing trauma, but I have a menu of 52 techniques, 52 techniques. Why? Because not everything is caused by trauma. You can have religious brainwashing cause you all kinds of misery and suffering. You can have cultural brainwashing. You can have dysfunctional family system patterns. You can have past life trauma. So I, over the years, have continued to research.

The work continues to grow and people come in with issues and I use muscle testing. Are you familiar with muscle testing?

Yeah. Yeah. I've had it done before. Yeah.

So I use muscle testing, which for those of you who are listening is using the body like a lie detector machine. But instead of hooking up to the machine with the sensors to detect true and false answers from the body, we just use an arm strength test. Usually if they're in my office, I have them float their arms out in front of them. I press, body shows a yes, body shows a no. If they're by Zoom, I work with people all over the world. I have them do a standing tilt. They stand up, they relax their whole body. I say body shows a yes, they tilt forward, come back to center. Body shows a no, they tilt back. Or that you can do finger testing. This is a strength test. Body shows a yes, that holds. Body shows a no, goes through. So you— so your body will now answer true or false questions. The trick is knowing the questions to ask and knowing where to look. So if I didn't know I had an unconscious mind, I wouldn't think to look there. Right. That's why it was such a revelation. It's like, oh, I missed this.

And then if it's in the body, you have to think, I'm gonna ask the body what's going on.

I love that question. So I love that question. Yeah.

So we send questions to the soul, which is your heart of hearts, which is the, you know, center of your truth. And we ask the soul what the priority goal is, because in healing from the body level up, which is my methodology, Healing from the Body Level Up, HBLU for short. We ask the soul what the priority goal is. And then we ask the soul what the priority interference is. And I, and then I show up with a great menu of patterns. And then we ask, once we find the pattern and explain it and figure out what level it's running at, then we ask what's the best technique for releasing it. And the techniques work in minutes. And they're self-applied, but 52 techniques.

Self-applied, work in minutes. I, I don't want you listeners to miss that. Self-applied. You can do this work on your own and work in minutes to release years of stuff that you've been carrying in some cases. Trauma healing does not have to be a trudge and it does not have to take years. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Tell us a little bit about the trauma body structure, a little bit that you have discovered.

Well, I discovered that there are 2 main forms of trauma. There's loss trauma where you feel you lost something. And you have a feeling of emptiness. And then there's violence trauma where your energy field, your boundaries have been breached, and now you feel polluted and violated. So those are the 2 main categories. Pretty much everything else is a variation of that. Neglect trauma is a variation of loss and violence. Suicide is a combination of loss and violence. Attempted physical murder trauma, loss and violence. So, um, really the central core traumas that everything else is built on is loss and violence. So it turns out that the moment that the fight-or-flight reflex goes off during a traumatic event, an entire set of emotions and beliefs imprint in the nervous system. And it starts with shock and fear, right? I'm shocked. Yeah. I'm frightened, of course. And that's true for both loss and violence. And then of course there's anger and rage, sadness and sorrow, hurt and pain. And interestingly enough, there are a bunch of limiting beliefs. It's my fault. There's guilt, shame, and blame. It's my fault because— And remember, this is irrational. This is a trauma imprint.

So that means nothing about it is true and everything is exaggerated.

Hmm.

It's really important to understand. It's my fault because— it's other people's fault because— fill in the blank. Irrational. It's God's fault because— fill in the blank. Irrational. And then if it's a loss trauma, there's anxiety about who will take care of me. In other words, who or what will replace what I lost? There's anxiety there. You know, you lost a job. What's gonna replace that? You lost a parent. Who's gonna replace that? You lost a lover. Who's gonna replace that anxiety about what you lost?

I love it. Loss trauma, loss trauma. And loss can be, you're absolutely right, any number of things, a job, A moving— even, even positive changes can create loss trauma for us. A move from one house to the next, even though you want the new house, could create loss trauma for you. So I love, I love that you, uh, decided to call it loss trauma. Um, and I, I think people, uh, take for granted what loss really means and does for us. And it exists on the smallest scale, and then of course on the biggest scale. And the same with somebody violating even our energetic boundaries. Talk to us about that, even something that simple.

Absolutely. So when the body feels threatened, it goes into fight or flight. So all you have to do is yell at somebody. If you yell loud enough, the body takes that as danger and a threat, right? And the body goes on alert. This person is yelling and screaming. They could lose control. They could come at me. They could beat me up. They could hurt me, right? They could lose control. I have to be vigilant now. I have to be on guard. I have to— Watch out for what's going on here. So I had a colleague who was doing organizational development, and she was called in because there was a woman who was a very high producer on Wall Street. She was a stockbroker, and her manager was a bully. And one day she went into his office and he started screaming at her. And he took off his shoe and he stood up and he leaned over the desk and he banged his shoe on the other side of the desk. And she went into shock. She went into freeze because from her point of view, think about from the body's point of view, he's about to climb over his desk and beat me with his shoe.

And she went into shock. So then she could not perform at her job anymore. And she started losing customers and her sales dropped precipitously. And his manager got alarmed because she was the major producer. And he called in my colleague to correct the relationship between these 2 people so that she could start producing again. And she called me up and said, what do I do? I said, you will, you will treat her for the violence trauma. And she will unfreeze and she will leave. She will be free. And all she has to do is walk next door to another building on Wall Street and they will snap her up. Him, you tell him he needs to treat the bullying pattern. He needs to clear that inside and stop doing that. But we'll see what happens. So she did clear The, uh, the woman who did leave. But when she met with the bully, he opened the conversation in a hostile tone of voice and said, you're not going to try to hypnotize me, are you? And now watch the body, watch the body movement. And my, my, my colleague went like this, because what does that mean?

He just slapped her. Do you see that? Right? That's shock.

She went right back there.

Yep. So, but this is my colleague, not, not the employee, but the, my colleague who was sent to correct her.

Oh, it's your colleague sitting there and she went into shock too because he continued the bullying. Yeah. Yeah. Energetic, right?

Yeah. Yes. He threatened her.

Yeah,

tone of voice. My colleague went like this.

Okay, I was like, how is the— how is the girl working there gonna hypnotize him? Makes so much— makes so much more sense now. Yeah, so he didn't touch her, he didn't— he didn't— he just smart-mouthed to her, really. So, but it was— it was so jarring because what kind of comment is that?

Right.

It was so jarring to her system.

Yes. Right.

She actually had a repulsion, repelling, body repelling, um, moment.

Yes.

Yeah,

right.

Yeah,

right.

And so we take all— a lot of those our whole lives, some of us, you know, in coercive control situations. So Yeah, I love that example. I love that example.

So that's abusive.

Yeah.

So she— so I don't know what she did with that man, but she called me afterwards and said, what do I do here, Judith? And I said, well, clearly he doesn't think he has to change because there are no consequences to him. Mm-hmm. So you need to tell his boss who hired you That this man is unwilling to change his behavior because he can get away with it. And that if he's ever going to change his behavior, there have to be severe enough consequences to make it worth his while. And that is his boss's job. And hand it back to the boss.

I love that. Consequences worth his while. I'm borrowing that. I'm borrowing that one.

And then I said, and you did your job, right? That's it. You basically put it back where it belongs. And this, his boss will have to discipline him in a way that actually hurts enough for him to change his behavior or not. But that's not your business. You did your job. That was that.

And she cleared that. She cleared that.

Yeah.

Yeah. Because she was able to set a boundary again, because in that shock moment, she wasn't able to set the boundary because she was so shocked that it was said. Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly. So talk to us about the book behind you. What will we find in your book?

Ah, by the way, my daughter helped me design the COVID

It's beautiful.

Thank you.

It's beautiful.

Yes, you will find the structure of trauma and a bunch of case examples, including how to heal brain damage in one session. That works really well. And how it affects the immune system and how emotions cause physical symptoms.

Yeah. Let's go there next because that's what your article in Eden was about. And you just— was it just published?

Yes.

Okay. Yeah. Talk to us about emotions and the immune system.

Okay. So it turns out that the first layer of your immune system is your, is your skin and your mucous membranes and your saliva and your tears so that it prevents any germs from getting in. So the immune system is the backup system. If a germ gets in, okay, now you have to deal with it, but you should keep them out. Which is why, you know, you don't want to cut your skin and you got, you put a Band-Aid with antibiotic lotion on the boo-boo and so on and so forth. But once a germ gets in, you have these little Pac-Man cells. They're called polymorphonuclear cells. And the germ gets in and these Pac-Man cells come up and engulf it and eat it. And digest it and spit it out. And they're under your skin. They're running around your whole body. And those are the cells that make pus. You know, if you have an infection and you've got all this green pus coming out, it's because you've got all these cells rushing up and eating these germs and spitting them out. That's pus. But let's say a germ gets through. and it's not knocked out in the first day or 2, then it's still in circulation.

You have a backup set of cells called NK cells, natural killer cells. And natural killer cells search for viruses and cancer cells. And you know that viruses cannot reproduce on their own. So the way that a virus infects you is it gets into your own cells hijacks your cell reproductive system and makes copies of itself and then blows your cell up and makes— spreads all these viruses around. But NK cells can, can detect if a cell's infected and kill it before the virus has a chance to take it over. And also, we make cancer cells all the time. Our cells mutate all the time. But our NK cells say, oh, there's something wrong with this cell. I'm just going to blow it up. And it blows it up and it kills it and it's done. However, if you have a traumatic shock within 24 hours, if you literally took a blood test and looked under a slide and counted cells, the number of circulating NK cells 24 hours after traumatic shock has dropped in half.

Whoa.

Because the cortisol that's released from the fight or flight reaction kills your immune cells.

Wow. That's a big number.

Yes. It's really quite dramatic. And that's why 24 to 48 hours after traumatic shock, you catch a cold. Yeah. You get an upper respiratory viral infection routinely. So when my clients come in and say, oh, I didn't know I got a cold last week, Judith, I muscle test why they got a cold. Now, one reason is they're run down. They didn't take their vitamins. Everybody needs to take vitamins seriously. You need to take your vitamin D and your B vitamins, your vitamin C. And I also recommend Pycnogenol, P-Y-C-N-O-G-E-N-O-L, Pycnogenol, which is an antioxidant that supports the immune system. Very powerful. And of course your fruits and vegetables. So, all right. But let's say you have good nutrition and you know, you're sleeping okay. Your body isn't physically stressed, but you catch a cold. I ask what happened that was traumatic 24 to 48 hours before? And then I find it, and then we treat it.

I love that you get to the root of it. You gotta get to the root of it. All of it.

All of it.

So, okay, so there's layers. Talk to us more about— because I really want people to get this— talk to us more about how our emotions can cause things like the fibromyalgias and immune autoimmune disorders and chronic trauma can cause all of these things, fibromyalgia and autoimmune disorders. How's that happen?

Yes. Oh, okay. I'm going to tell you a couple of sad stories. So I had a cleaning lady. She was with us for years. She would come in before we had office hours and clean the office and then leave. One day at 10:30 in the morning, I walked out from my first session. My second session was gonna start at 10:30 and my cleaning lady was sitting in the waiting area. And I said to her, what are you doing here? And she said, oh, I just came to ask you if you're satisfied with my cleaning services. Now, She'd been with me for 20 years. So seriously, that was not the issue. I said to her, come here and talk to me. And I took her into my office and I postponed my other next client. And I said, what's really going on? She said, I can't breathe. I can't breathe. And I'm snapping at people. I'm angry and I'm snapping at people. And I went to the cardiologist. And I got a complete cardiac workup and pulmonary workup. And he says, there's nothing physically wrong with me, but I can't breathe. I said, when did this start?

Well, it started right after her third husband. She went for a month to visit her sister in another country. And when she came back, Her third husband had sold her condo. I don't know how he did it because his name wasn't on the deed. And he had stripped her bank account of everything. And he had left the country and disappeared. And not even his sister knew where he was. Hmm. And for some strange reason that she didn't know, she stopped being able to breathe and she's cranky and snapping at everybody. Surprise!

That's a pretty obvious one though. Ah, that's some serious trauma. That's some serious trauma right there. And talk about some betrayal. Boy, my goodness.

He broke her heart.

Yeah,

you hear that? So I did several rounds of tapping with her on the, on the betrayal trauma. Yes. And the breathing corrected and the snappiness went away. Yes.

I love this. I love this, Dr. Judith, man. We could, we could, we could geek out on, on brain science, on emotions, on energy, uh, forever and ever and ever. But if people want to find you, if they want to find your discoveries, if they want to find your work, if they want to realize by testing it out themselves, become their own emotional scientist, Try it out and see how it works, because you can clear years— I'm gonna say it again— years of trauma in a very short amount of time.

Yes,

if you're willing to. Now you can go pick it back up. Oh, oh, that's an important point. You can go grab that right back, can you not, with the stories that you start telling yourselves?

No, once it's gone, you can't bring it back.

Okay, I— there you go.

I, I, I heal people. I say, we're gonna clear you of this. Clear means it goes away and never comes back. It's cleared out of your system. It never comes back.

That's big.

You can't bring it back. It's gone. This is the point.

Healing permanently.

Yes. That's the point.

Healing permanently.

Right. And because I'm a scientist, I follow people up for years and years and years, and I know that it lasts.

Okay, I love it, guys. Trauma work does not have to be a trudge. Grab Dr. Judith's book, start there, and then if you really get stuck, reach out to her. Dr. Judith, where can people find you?

They can find me on my website, hblu.org, right? It's short for Healing from the Body Level Up.

Guys, we're gonna put clickable links for you so you don't have to write that down. So, uh, Dr. Judith, but I'm not done with you yet. I always ask our, uh, guests 2 questions to wrap us out. All right, you ready for the first one?

Yes.

All right, in your own life, what do you feel like you performed the most In order to survive? And what did setting that role, mask, or performance down do for you?

Um, I think what I did to survive was learn NLP and, and, and connecting with my inner levels and use tools and techniques to heal the damage that was done. And I was always surprised— I'm still surprised at how much damage People carry and still walk around and function.

We talk a lot about that in here. High-functioning survival, that's what we call it in here. Yeah, I did that for a very, very, very long time. I, I do not know. I cannot answer you how I survived other than just keeping trying, try one more day. But boy, they were chaotic days. Uh, doctor, they were chaotic days. So, um, NLP, guys, grab her book. Um, she has 52 different exercises that will help you. That means that you have options available to you to clear this stuff permanently.

Yes.

And by the way, you don't have to suffer.

In my book, I teach 3 techniques and they all work for trauma. So I'm already resourcing you.

Yeah. Yeah. All right. Last question. What do you want us as human beings to be talking more about that we're not talking about with each other?

I want people to recognize trauma. And treat it. Because as you said, people don't realize that a transition causes trauma. Any transition from moving from here to there, there's always a loss. People don't realize this. I was working out with a personal training trainer the other day, and I showed him a tapping technique to clear trauma from the body, and he was so amazed. And he said he does. He works with bodies. He didn't know there was a mind-body connection. I said, are you kidding me? This is a joke, right? You, you're a personal trainer. You work with people's bodies and you didn't know there's a mind-body connection? He's like, no, I really didn't. I thought he was kidding. Really? Yeah.

Oh, you just changed a lot of people's lives right there. You just changed a lot of people's lives because he's going to train them completely differently now that he knows that. It's like you not realizing There's this whole unconscious part to us driving our lives on autopilot that if we don't do something about it, it's going to run us right into the, into the wall over and over and over and over again. So friends, please do something about it. And it starts, Dr. Judith told us, with awareness.

Yes.

Starts with awareness. Edge note, it starts with awareness. All right, friends out there, I'm going to ask you the same question I asked Dr. Judith. What might you be performing in order to survive or just get by? And what do you think setting that role, mask, or performance down will do to lighten your load just a little bit? When you find the answer to that, I am your host, Lisa Lacey, here with Dr. Judith Swack. Grab her book. Thank you so much, Dr. Judith.

You're welcome, Lisa.