Transcript of The Best of SBS: Miami Dolphins Head Coach Jeff Hafley

You're listening to DraftKings Network. Looking forward to crack open the soul of this man right here, the Dolphins coach Jeff Haffley. Are you someone who enjoys Do you like this process? I know it's part of being the voice and face of a team, but the talking to the media twice a day, we like that or we don't like that so much?

Depends on what time of year it is. And, you know, right now I do. I'm new. I get to meet new people. And I do think that's very important. I think it's important for me to get out in the community, have people get to know me a little bit, understand me a little bit, and do everything I can to help the organization. But yeah, I enjoy it. When you get good people, a lot of this can be fun.

How does this work, though? Fun at this stage, because it's pressurized. It's all your dreams come true. And here, here's all the responsibility. And here are all the things you might not have known about what comes with leadership and a job, because that problem isn't one you've faced before.

No, I think it's, it's all on how you look at it, right? I mean, you work so hard in your life, whatever profession that it is, and you get to what some people view as the top. And a lot of times a place where we dreamed of getting to, if you can't enjoy it, then I think you have to take a step back and, and just think about all the hard work and where you're at. And because of that, I'm enjoying every day. I wake up, I look forward to going to work every day.

You feel like you're at the top. It feels like you've reached the top of your profession. You're the son of a coach, an inspiration of a father. Like, you feel like you've arrived at your dreams.

I don't know if it's arrived. I feel like, you know, when I was the head coach at Boston College, At 40 years old, I probably didn't know which way was up and probably wasn't as prepared, but I feel more prepared. Do I feel like I'm at the top? I'm not sure. Sometimes I walk in and kind of forget I'm the head coach and just go on with, you know, all the things that I have to do because of the grind of it.

Like every day for a coach is just buzzsaw ahead for 20 hours. And so you forget you're the head coach.

No, I'm not saying that. I think it's just more of who I am and it's— I enjoy what I do. I enjoy being around the people. So it's not like I walk around the building like bossing people around and pretending I'm higher up than everybody. But when I do take a step back and realize all the decisions that I do have to make, because that's probably the biggest thing that you find is when you do become the head coach at whatever level you're at, is instead of suggestions, you're now required to give a lot of answers and make a lot of decisions each day. But besides that, No, it's not a grind and it doesn't feel like that. It's going to work, being around good people, doing what I enjoy to do every single day. Um, and for now, without my family here, I go back at night and go to sleep and wake up and do it again. But I can truthfully say it hasn't felt that way. I've enjoyed it. I look forward every morning going in and we've got a great group.

What did the dreams look like growing up though? When you imagine, when you're sleeping on air mattresses, when you're, uh, when you're sleeping at the stadium in Pittsburgh, like your dreams look like what? Like now?

My dreams looked It's like game day. You don't sit there when you're a younger coach and dream about going into the office on a Tuesday afternoon and spending 5 hours watching college tape to get ready for the draft. You don't think about sitting in there trying to diagram up certain plays and all the things that you have to do. You think about the moments with your players. You dream about being in the locker room after a win or making a call, a crucial call in a game and seeing it work and celebrating with your team those memories, and that's what you dream of. All the other stuff is how you get there.

You're not dreaming of the 100 hours it requires to get to the 3 hours when the decisions are most important.

You're not dreaming of the process, I guess. You're dreaming of what you hope the result will be. And then I think as you get older, you learn to really enjoy and embrace the process and the work that goes into it. But then certainly once you get into the stadium, Those are the most fun times.

What do you look at and say, that was the very start of how committed I am to get to the goal of head coach? When you look at the landmarks on sleeping on air mattresses or making $2,500 a week, what are the places where you're like, man, do you know how much I wanted this?

Oh, I think it all started at my first job when I went to Worcester Polytech to be the running back coach. I was 21 years old. And I thought I wanted to coach. It's all I ever dreamed about, as you say. But you don't really know until you get into it. And a lot of people getting the coaching and they quickly get out because they were dreaming about game day, but they weren't dreaming about the things I had to do at WPI. And then it was staying in the office all night and then it was really getting no sleep. And it was—

What are those things? What else are those details of? This is you at the beginning of the bottom of the mountain.

The bottom of the mountain. The bottom of the mountain was was doing the laundry for the team. The bottom of the mountain was— I remember walking into an equipment shed and the head coach saying, "Clean this thing out," on a hot summer day before the players were there and spending 10 hours, hopefully not sticking my hand on a rusted nail, and pulling out all the equipment and all the dirty pads and everything that there was to make sure it was clean and taking pride in it and still enjoying doing that because it was something I was told to do and I figured it would help the the team, right? It was, like I said, making sure the field was lined and making sure that the grass was fine. It was doing little things that had absolutely nothing to do with football. I was having such little money in my pocket, I had to decide if I wanted to go out and have a beer or I wanted to buy a thing of peanut butter so I could take a spoon and make that my meal twice a day. Um, but not complain because I was doing what, at least at the time, I thought I wanted to do.

I was having the opportunity to coach football. I mean, but those are the things you look back on and sleeping in odd places such as under my desk or finding a friend's couch to sleep on and having to call home at times and ask for more money because I didn't have enough money in my account to pay for a toll on the way home. I mean, shoot, I remember pretending to honk at the toll booth, pretend to throw money out just so I could make it. Back because it was either that or not having—

The Miami Dolphins have hired a clear criminal. The statute of limitations has probably expired on that, but clearly they begin— I don't think it's felonious behavior, but you owe, you owe the city, you owe the city like a few, a few dollars.

The Jersey Turnpike, I probably owe quite a few. As I—

Why under the desk? Why were you sleeping under the desk?

I don't know why I was under the desk, but that's just kind of where my head went. I had an office that was decent size. I put an air mattress up, but I'd slide it so probably so it was a little bit darker. And then you never knew who was going to come in at night to clean your office.

To wake you up with— to wake you up with if you were sleeping because there wasn't much sleep because you were devoted to the craft. And they're going to make you prove it as you come up the line because you were a wide receiver in college and the football players are going to demand that you show that you love their sport, that you care about it, that you're passionate about it. And so through the architecture, you're not— Are you exaggerating when you say a couple of— you're eating half a jar of peanut butter for dinner because that's what you can afford?

That's right. Or you got somebody who was older and had a little bit more money and they took you out. But when you're making $2,500 and you don't want to rely on your parents and you have pride and you don't want to ask people for money, you just figure it out.

But before that, you were living in the basement of their home, right? You're writing how many letters? Are these handwritten letters? Are they typewritten letters? You're looking for coaching work.

Yeah. I came back my— it was a break in my senior year.

Senior year.

And yeah, I was breaking my senior year. I hadn't thought about that in a long time. And, you know, I wrote letters to just about every college coach and program I could think of to try to figure out if anybody would let me jump on.

And all different letters, all kind of the same, all saying some version of this. I want to get into coaching. Where— how do I— how do I start?

Yeah, they weren't all— they weren't all different. I would have taken me hours to figure out how to— different— a different method.

All right. So you— so what you did is you wrote one letter and mailed it to 100 people and changed the—

changed the changed some things around. But yeah, no, I wasn't that crazy where I was going to spend time to write a personal note to each coach.

Okay, I'm sorry. I would— look, I was trying to explain how obsessive and maniacal you were about trying to get into the game, and I inflated your story a little bit by thinking you wrote 100 letters.

Next time I'll make it cooler than it actually was. But, but then, you know, it was cool. I remember every day a couple weeks later going to the mailbox and hoping somebody would write me back, and a lot did. And a lot was just a company letter that was, hey, thanks for your interest, nothing's opened, or Those were all things that, you know, I remember going and seeing that. And then I actually got one back from the University of Pittsburgh. Chris Lasalla, who's still there today, who's the director of football operations, they invited me to come work their camp. And that was years later. I went to Pitt because of that letter that I wrote as I worked my way up and met people from Pitt because of that letter. So it worked.

Learn from Wannstedt and others among your inspirations, your father most of all, it sounds like. And I'd like to get into that. But when you're —writing those letters, and you're living at this point in your parents' basement, correct? And your football career as a wide receiver at Siena is over. You are thinking, what about your life? Are you scared? Are you filled with doubt? Or you know, I'm going to coaching. How do I get to coaching?

I knew I was coaching. It's all I wanted to do. I mean, I was the guy when I was young for Christmas to ask for a mini whiteboard so I could sit there and watch games and draw plays. I mean, that's what I did. How old were you? Right. I mean, that was— probably middle school. In middle school, people were asking for whatever video games. I was asking for a whiteboard.

Because you saw your dad doing it? Or because—

my dad was my coach. My dad coached me in everything that I did. I just, for some reason, I loved football. I wanted to coach football, and I loved the X's and O's from an early age.

It's weird for a kid though. You're not—

you're not meaning— so now you're saying I'm weird? I'm— look, I don't like that.

I don't want to be judgmental, but have you met a lot of middle Have you met— in your profession, there are all sorts of obsessive-compulsive, strange, unusual, unique people.

Um, I think there's a lot of people who are obsessive about a lot of things. It's usually just not X's and O's of a sport. So yeah, you can call me unique. You can call me obsessive. I guess those are all things that are true. I'll take them as a compliment.

These are the things Kyle Shanahan, I would imagine, was also, but I don't know if he was that, that young is what I'm saying.

I bet you he was drawing offensive plays. I was drawing defensive plays.

Fourth grade, fifth grade is the— like drawing on a board?

I would say probably, I can remember watching the Florida Gators play when Spurrier was the coach, sitting in my living room. I can actually picture it right now with the whiteboard and trying to draw formations and stuff that he was showing on TV. And then I would record them and rewind them back and try to draw the plays. So yeah, I would say seventh grade, maybe sixth, seventh, eighth grade, around that time.

And you don't find that to be unusual in the communities you swim in? No, did you find that unusual? Well, I just, I didn't think it started as early as 7th grade. Maybe wanting to play, but not to coach it, not to, not to teach it.

I think I had a lot of self-awareness. Like I was a good player for my age and for where I lived, but I think I have always had self-awareness. And even at that point, I kind of knew that I was not really going to be playing for a long period of time. Because of your size? Because of my size, because of my speed, because of how big I was going to be, all of the above. And Not that I wasn't trying to, but— Well, you played.

Playing in college is playing. Like, it's maximizing whatever physical skills and gifts you have in a game that's meant on strength and size.

Right. And that's— but even then, when I played in college, it wasn't— I never had the, oh, I'm going to be an NFL football player or go on to play in any other type of league. I, even as a player in college, like, I'll even give you another example. I was probably a better baseball player than I was a football player and probably could have went to more schools to play baseball than football, but I knew I wanted to coach football, so I went to play football. I mean, that's what— I mean, I went to Siena College because they recruited me the hardest, because I really enjoyed the guy who recruited me, who then gave me my first job, and I still talk to all the time. But I went there because they gave me a chance to play, and I wanted to coach football. So that's— yeah, I knew from an early age what I wanted to do.

What did your friends— no friends or loved ones thought it was unusual that the 6th grader wants to wander around with a whiteboard? Nobody was saying anything.

Oh yeah, my brother, they used to always joke around with me. I mean, it was like the joke, what are you going to take your football to the prom with you? Or, you know what I mean? That was always the joke. I mean, even at that, like, I just— I— yeah, a lot of people probably poked fun at me and my family. I think outside of that, I probably hid it a little bit. So no one knew exactly what I was doing, which is probably smart.

Oh, a secret shame. I say, that's my secret shame of I want to be a— I want to be a football coach. He's got astronauts.

There are all sorts of—

I haven't met a lot I don't know a lot of people who have dreamt that as a young age, but maybe in your circle it is more common than I believe. No, probably not. Because it requires a— how improbable is it for you to arrive where you've arrived? Because I imagine there's some pinch me in, you know how many people fall by the wayside because air mattresses aren't for everybody. No, they're not.

And it's kind of like we were talking before. I think, you know, a lot of people have done what I've done. I've had a lot of friends who did the same thing that I've done. Maybe they didn't take some chances. Maybe they didn't get around the right people. And most of the time it doesn't work out. So what I do get from a lot of those friends that I was in middle school with and then in high school with, like a lot of their response when they call or text me was, it's, it's cool to see someone who always knew what they wanted to do, and it's cool to see that work out. So those people I do appreciate because they saw all the things I did. And then it gets further, right? All the sacrifices that we do have to make, all the friends we probably lost along the way, all the events that we didn't get to go to, whether it was close cousins' weddings, whether it's family birthday parties or big celebrations. There's a lot of sacrifice that goes into it for everybody in our profession. I'm just very fortunate and blessed and somewhat lucky that it worked.

Because for most people, it probably doesn't. And I can look you in the eye and tell you that I'm very grateful for that.

You're not shrugging off though, the cost there when you say all the things missed, right? You miss out on life a little bit Because in order to get where you are in the profession, you're competing against a whole bunch of people who are just as competitive as you. When hard work is the foundation of everything you do, and I don't know if you regard yourself as special in many other ways, but I'm guessing no one's gonna outwork you.

Yeah, that was always my thing, is it didn't matter if I was smarter or more talented or had a leg up on someone in any other way. I just, I was never gonna let anyone outwork me. I mean, I remember when I was at the University at Albany, probably 23, there was a coach who I think is an outstanding coach and is still coaching, you know, at a smaller level. But if I ever woke up and he had beat me to the office, it would completely ruin my day. So it got to the point where if he was up at 4:45, I was up at 4:30. The next day he'd be at 4:30, I'd be at 4:15. And then I think at one point I was waking up at like 3:30, and I think I almost went down one spring practice because I just wasn't sleeping enough. But he wasn't gonna beat me in the office, and that was kind of You want to talk about a little obsessive? That's way more obsessive than drawing on a whiteboard. I think that's a little psychotic, to be honest with you.

No, it is.

Did he know though? Oh, we both went at it and we knew, but it was, I wasn't going to let anyone beat me in the office, which is why ultimately I got a mattress. I didn't have to race him in anymore.

Well, I want to ask you about some of those details too, but when I ask the cost, the cost of your dream, chasing it and what it requires, you say with a degree of humanity, Ouch, I've missed some things. Sure.

Yeah, I've missed a lot of things. And it really— right after college, you leave your college friends, you leave all your roommates and your teammates, and, you know, right away it's, hey, we're all going to go on this vacation together. No, sorry, I can't go. It's okay. Fast forward a few years later, say there's 6 or 7 of us. I missed every one of their weddings. I mean, every one of them. If they were getting married during the season, I couldn't go. If they were getting married during Spring football, I couldn't go. It's— so I'm starting to miss out and really lose a lot of friendships along the way. Not that I'm not on the text strings in there, but I missed most of that after-college life where, I mean, even going out on dates and doing— I wasn't doing any of that. And then it gets deeper, right? It's, you know, a cousin who I grew up with and is one of my best friends. His wedding is in September. You don't go to the wedding. It's your parents' whatever anniversary party. You don't go to the anniversary party. It's your grandparents'. Huge party, you don't go to that, where all of a sudden you're sitting there and everybody in your family and everybody that you love is doing all these things.

And it's like, what am I really doing this for? And those are hard. I mean, there were some hard days in my office where I remember, you know, my niece is born, I'm not going to be there. You know, I'm not seeing anybody in my family. And as time goes on, there's limited opportunities to see your parents and your family as you get older. And I was missing out on a lot of things. And it's just a matter of how badly I wanted it. And also being very fortunate that I had people in my life to support me and understand that at that time.

Because you showed up for your own wedding, right? You had time to show— you made the time in your busy schedule to get to your own wedding. I did it.

And at the time, though, I do remember standing behind the— standing behind the pew, kind of hidden with my brother. And I had my phone on me because we were recruiting a big defensive lineman. Oh, no. And I was like, hey, I got to get my phone out. I got this and this and this.

No, that's how my mind was going. Did you get him?

He turned out to be a really good player, and I haven't thought about that since, but we got him. And I remember texting him like over and over. You were like, put your phone down.

No, how close are you to having to walk up while you're recruiting? I mean, literally, what's the matter with you? This isn't—

I know, but that's where— so yeah, maybe, maybe something is wrong with me. You're starting to bring up a lot of things in my mind now that maybe I'm not wired the right way.

Well, the, the behind the pew on your wedding day, minutes from the I dos, and, and, and the self-assured— yeah, you got him, but you got her too, and she understands them both, and she's still, she's still committed.

I probably hope she doesn't listen to this.

She's not going to decommit. She married a crazy person.

She did marry a crazy person. But think about the type of person that I had to marry. You want to get into some story that I had to marry for her to understand and go through all this? I mean, she's the special one. Maybe we should be asking her.

Oh, but they're stronger than us in a million different ways and wiser and wiser. And also, if she wasn't supporting this, you couldn't do it. That's right.

I'd have no chance to do it. I mean, even now as we speak, she's meeting with a real estate agent to try to get the offer and close on our house that we're selling. We're closing on a house here. We got a million things in the air and I just show up and talk on radio shows and she's out there.

Well, no, but she's supporting with an understanding of what this opportunity has been for both of you, built by both of you. It's not just yours, it's shared.

It is shared. And there's no way I would have gotten to this point without a supportive wife like Gina. You don't have a chance.

Well, she must have been so happy when— I'd like to hear what you felt when you're getting the call, this job is yours, here it is.

Yeah, I can take you through that one. So—

And I didn't mean to move you off the other one, but the shared portions of it, because I imagine whatever the moving is in there, I think at the top end would be sharing it with her.

It is sharing. And think about all the different things that— and we can get back to that moment and anything else you want to talk about— but all the things that you have to go through when you move each time. It's not just your wife, it's your kids, and it's finding new schools, and it's finding new doctors, and it's finding new friends. My friends are built in. I show up to work and those become my friends, right? And that's the truth because I'm with them all the time. That doesn't happen for her. She's got to leave friends every time that she gets them, and the kids have to leave their friends every time after they make them. And I'm asking them to move from Green Bay, from Boston to Green Bay and now to Florida. Daddy selfish. Right. So, but it is in some regards, it's very selfish. And in a way, I'm fortunate enough where I'll be able to help them out later in life. But it doesn't always work like that. And it hasn't always been like that. But as for Gina, when, when we did get the call, I mean, yeah, I mean, she was— we had talked about it.

We had talked about all the interviews because after the playoff game, I had 6 interviews and it was a crazy week and we had talked about all the jobs and we had— and it was very important for me that she was comfortable for wherever we were going to live and my children, because we are to the point now where I'm probably less crazy, where I'm just not going to say to her, hey, I'm— we're going to Miami, like, pack your bags. I'm not there anymore. Like, I understand what we have to go through. So we sat down, we talked about all the different ones that might have worked out. And before I came on the plane to come interview for this one in person. I mean, we had talked about if the job was offered, what we were gonna do. And then when the job was offered to me, she was obviously my first call. And I mean, she was thrilled. I mean, thrilled. So we were both on the same page. This is one she felt good about too. And she was really excited.

And you, what were like, what put us there?

Yeah. Well, I went in for the in-person interview and we sat down for a while and talked and then they asked me to leave the room I wasn't quite sure at that point what was going on. I had hoped it was good. So I remember I actually had texted her and I said, hey, I think I'm going to get this job. I think it went really well. But then I was like sitting by myself for like a half hour and I texted her back. I go, maybe I was wrong. I don't know if we're going to get this anymore. I think they just forgot about me though, because then they brought me back in and they just said, you're just sitting there, just sitting there for half an hour. So good. And then I was like, oh my gosh, they're going to bring me right back in.

Right.

Because then I was supposed to fly out. I had a plane waiting to go somewhere else. I was like, we'd better keep that plane out there. I'm not getting this one. But then they called me in and I did, and my first thought was to call her. I mean, I— we hugged, we shook hands with everybody, but my first thought was to call her, and then I called my mom, and then I called my brother. I shut the door, which is now my office, and I wanted to make sure because it was gonna get out to the media, because everything gets out to the media. So I quickly went down to my, my mom, my brother, my sister, and then after that it was out.

Do you remember at any one of those points being the most moved, or like understanding that— and I, I know I know you've been a head coach before, but the specifics of being an NFL head coach and being an NFL head coach after you got to college and realized it was the dirtier game, like, it— somehow you get to college and it's less honorable in some ways because you're not coaching anymore. You're just chasing players around with dollars.

Yeah, that— the way that ended, I mean, I just— I no longer like the person that I was becoming, and I no longer like the person that I had to be to do that job. That's just me personally, which is why I ultimately left that job. But yeah, I mean, I think getting back to this league and wanting to be an NFL head coach, those calls were all very emotional, whether it was my brother, my wife, my sister, my mom. I mean, then my dad not being around was really emotional with my mom because she was thinking of my dad and certainly I was thinking of my dad. And those were all really emotional calls because it's— those are the times when— it kind of all comes out. And you've probably had those times in your life when you do something and just emotion kind of runs through you and—

Well, it's the all of it, right? If I would imagine, in all of those phone calls, without knowing what the relationship is with your wife specifically and the details of the entirety of the story, the call to your mom when you lose your father in 2011, and he was your coach, and whatever it is you would have shared as a family then, him seeing you now, like— I would imagine that you just— that the pain of the grief would return to remind you of the love. For sure.

And that was the call with my mom, and then her just telling me how proud she was of me. And then you start to think of, like we talked about, all the sacrifice and all the things that you missed, and then it was worth it in that moment. And I could see how proud she was of me. And the same even with my brother who's older. It's just— I was like, can you believe I'm an NFL head coach? Or like, he said that to me. And my sister just telling me she's proud of me. And for my wife, it's every everything. It's just all the things that we've went through, the highs and the lows, because there's so many highs and lows, right? And there's going to be highs and lows going forward, and you have to have someone strong where you could come home and I could shed a tear or she could shed a tear, and we're in this thing together. And then when you do get rewarded— because look, this is a reward, right? It is. And no matter how I feel, I'm lucky we're getting rewarded for doing this, and we've shared it together, and we've earned this together.

And you share that moment. And I wish she could have been in Florida at the time with me. But those were calls that I wanted to make immediately.

Going back to earlier parts of the journey, were you sleeping for 2 years at Pitt Stadium?

In Pitt, I was probably sleeping there for a year and a half because then I got hired full-time. And when I did get hired full-time, that was another emotional call. I remember walking back at the time exactly where I was and calling my mom and dad because about 2 weeks prior to that, it was starting to get old. It was— I still have no money. I'm like 26 or 27 at the time. And it was like, alright, take a deep breath. I gotta ask you for money again. Like, this is hard now, right? But then I remember that conversation when I told them I was now the DB coach. That was like a tearful, happy one to share that with them. And then I moved out of the office.. And then after that, I met Gina. Cause at the time, like up until that point, I said to myself, I'm not, I'm not going to do anything. I'm not going to go out. I'm just going to work. No relationships, no relationships. I just worked. And I said, I'm either going to do everything I can until about 30 years old. And if it doesn't work, then I'm going to do something else.

So I wasn't totally out of my mind, right? Just kind of. But it was like at that moment where, when I got the full-time job, I remember I even got a car at that point. So, cause I was driving something around that I don't even think you could take the key out of it. It didn't have air conditioning. The window wouldn't go up. So like everything just changed in that moment that Coach Wonstad hired me to be the DB coach at Pitt. And then I got a place to live, I got a car, I met Gina.

Well, hold on, we'll get to that portion in a second, but I want to be in that stadium.

You're bringing everything back.

I want to be in that stadium with you for a minute and how close you were. Like, is that the closest you were to quitting? It sounds like— or saying, is this too much? Am I in too deep? Or was there another time before that? Because you're, you're, you're in your late 20s and you're living in a stadium. Yeah, I'm living in the facility.

Facility. Um, quitting? No. I think there's moments that there's conversations that are, talk me back into this, Dad, because I'm starting to doubt this thing. You know, all my friends are doing this, my friends have money now, my friend and I have just year after year after year at this point of just really not doing—

was I wrong to believe in myself?

Is it— yeah, if there's sometimes just a little bit of doubt creeps in me. That, that's right. Someone else show me they still believe in me, because everybody needs that once in a while, and I needed that right there. Just like there's times when I needed to show my players, I still believe in you after I needed that.

But it sounds though like you were so delusionally naive about, well, yeah, this is what I'm gonna be, right? Because it's all I'm gonna be, because it's all I wanted to be. I'm gonna get there, right? Doubt— you're suspicious of doubt because it's— because, because you've been delusional though, right? Like, to choose this as a path can be so Scary at times that you think you're not going to— the odds were against you getting the head coach from Worcester Polytechnic Institute.

For sure. And yeah, doubt does creep in. And when you get tired and you're worn out and things aren't looking great, yeah, you do start to doubt yourself.

What do you think Gina saw in you upon— because you couldn't have been very evolved. You're emerging. You're— I don't know if you're feral, but you're not doing relationships and you're coming from the stadium out into the real world to try and date. You haven't learned anything about yourself yet in relationships. No. Your relationship is with football.

Uh, what did she see in me? I— That's a hard question. You're gonna have to ask her that one. It certainly wasn't my looks. So, we actually— She was putting on a recruiting event. She worked in fundraising. We were getting ready to do a recruiting event. I had to get ready to talk in front of a lot of people. And she had to come up and tell me it was my turn. So I thought she was coming to introduce herself to me for other reasons, which she probably was. So I'd introduced myself to her. And then I asked for her number, and I got hired like 2 weeks after that or a week after that, so I was not the young graduate assistant anymore, so she probably saw that maybe I had a chance.

So the first date was after you— there was a salary involved. You're now a professional man.

I was now a professional man who was no longer sleeping under my desk. Okay. I wasn't gonna have her— yeah, you want to come back to my office?

What are the details and the difficulties at sleeping in the stadium? You're using the facilities, like it's a good shower, it's the locker room, right?

It was great. It was a beautiful new facility. Facility. Yeah, I mean, had everything.

It's a great bachelor pad.

There aren't a lot of people living there. It got to the point where, I mean, I knew everybody. I knew the security, I knew all the workers because I never left. Where— so after a game, my parents, my dad and mom, would come to every game when I was at Pitt, and we'd go out to dinner and hang out until like 10 o'clock at night. And I'd be like, alright, you guys take me back now. And they would drop me off at the office, say goodbye, and open the doors to the office and go up to my room.

I would think that there would be one date in there that you could bring back to the place.

I would have gotten in a lot of trouble for that. There's cameras up everywhere. You can't be bringing girls back to the office.

I know, but you're living— you shouldn't be living— you're not supposed to be living at the office either.

Yeah, I don't think it was illegal to live there, but I always followed the rules as far as bringing people back.

But it's free rent, like you're getting a good deal, and you're a bit of— you're not a bit of a gym rat, you're clearly a gym rat, so it seemed some kind of normal to you that That's not when you were sleeping under the desk, was it? Was it at Pittsburgh?

Yeah, I was under the desk. Yeah, in my office, under the desk. Yep. And then the problem too was the air mattress started to have a hole in it. So every morning I'd wind up on the— I forgot about this. This is great. So every morning it would deflate and I would wind up on the ground. But then I didn't have to, like, deflate the thing. It was already deflated.

I'd roll it up, throw it under my desk. Efficient. Yeah.

And then I'll tell you another funny story is because I always had this special blanket. LaShawn McCoy was our running back at the time. Time. So he'd always steal my blanket and take a nap like in that area too. And I'd be like, bro, this is my bed, get out. So Shady used to always come and he used to, uh, steal my blanket and try to steal my room, but I couldn't let him do that after a while.

Uh, what are the other places along the path that you look at? I mean, because you've talked a lot about what the sacrifices are. Those are— those two stand out. Uh, it's weird to hear that you were disillusioned. The college experience isn't what imagined at all, right?

When I went back to college?

Yeah.

Because I went to the NFL, then I went to Tampa, and then I went to Cleveland, and then I went to San Francisco, and then I left San Francisco to go be the coordinator at Ohio State in 2018, I think that was, '18 or '19.

But thinking what as far as the career path?

Okay, that's a good question. So it was at this time I was with the Niners with Kyle Shanahan, and we're just getting that thing going, and then Ryan Day called and he said, I'm gonna get the Ohio State job, I want you to be my coordinator. And I was like, yeah, all right, you're not getting the Ohio State job, what are you talking about? Urban's But he did. He got the Ohio State job. And, you know, then what happened was college football was at a different place then. It was still college football that I loved, right? And then I started— I wanted to be a college head coach. Um, so then Gene and I started talking about, you know, maybe we should go back. Maybe I'll have a chance to be a college head coach if things work out at Ohio State.

At this point, though, there's not the knowledge that being in the Kyle Shanahan camp is gonna be a tree that bears fruit all over the place, 'cause that thing's about to be the most stable thing in college football. Coaching that there is?

Sure, there was, but more on the offensive side, and I was on the defensive side. And I think it was the offensive guys that usually get kind of picked off like that. And there was something about going to Ohio State and trying to be a college head coach that was really intriguing. So we talked about it, and that was a hard decision to leave, like you said, to leave Kyle and leave the Niners and go back to college football.

But not just— forgive me for interrupting you before we get there— not just leaving Kyle but leaving something that you guys kind of know— I don't want to— you know, you're ahead of the curve in knowing some things that people need to know about football because you're clearly doing things that are running a very strong organization that seems to have about to have interchangeable quarterback play because you guys know how to make a quarterback good.

Yeah, I think that all played into it. I just— there was part of me part of me missed the relationships with the younger players. Part of me missed wanting to help change young people's lives and pour into them. And that's really what led us to go back to Ohio State. Because at that time there was no NFL, there was no NIL, there was no transfer portal. That was like pure college football as it used to be.

The purity of coaching is what's luring you back? Can I help kids be better men?

That's what it was. It was, can I help Can I help a freshman incoming recruit as a freshman, take him through his senior year, just become so entrenched in his life that, you know, I had guys come to my wedding that I coached in college. Can I be a part of that kid's life in the future? I did miss that part. All those college coaches that affected me that I was with for 4 years that I still talk to, I miss that piece of it. Where in the NFL, I was leaving jobs like every 2 years and starting somewhere else. And this player's on a different roster and this player's on a different roster. So I figured I could go back and get more back into that.

The purity of teaching though here.

Yeah, it was the teaching. It was the, he needs to come and see me because he's having trouble with a girlfriend or he's just real life stuff that aren't involved with money that aren't, oh, I'm just gonna leave and go. You couldn't leave at the time. We were gonna fight through it together and I was gonna help him through that. And I wanted to be part of that again. Again. So we left and we went to Ohio State and we had a really good year, and a year later I got a head job. So it flipped like that. In my first 2 years, I mean, it was the same thing. It was the, it was the best ever. It was pure, and it was like, I love, I love that I felt there was so much honor in what I was doing and pouring into these players. And then I already told you, then the job turned and I just didn't like, I didn't like myself anymore.

Well, I want to talk to you about that, but do you regard that as your happiest year? If I made you choose one, the happiest happiest one along the path where you're like, oh, this is close to what I imagined? Oh, in college? No, just anywhere. The happiest year of your professional life.

Like, that's so hard. I will tell you, I— that's a hard question to just pick out one. Those— that year at Ohio State and those first 2 years at BC, those were as much fun and joy as I've had working with unbelievable young players and helping people. I helped change some lives. Those were unbelievable times.

It's just the reason I asked the question is because it's interesting to hear you talk about getting back to the roots of why you love this and then realizing that it gets contaminated, that you're sitting here, the purity of teaching and making help and creating relationships that end up at your wedding versus the commerce in this, the results in this, the need for winning. It's, it's interesting to see how quickly that soured for you and the whole system changed while while you were having the hap— some of the happiest times of your life.

Yeah, that, that part will never be sour to me. That purity of all of that is the greatest part of our game. And you can still accomplish that in this league as you bring in a rookie and really pour into him. Or even some of those guys I had in Green Bay, and I only got to know for 2 years. I'll have lifelong relationships with those guys. I just didn't like who I became when I had to do the other things that had nothing to do with any of that when the game changed, which is why That's why I wanted to come back.

Do you remember a time coming home to Gina that broke you more than the others on like, "This is shit. This is all money, and it's all commerce, and this isn't why I got into any of this at all." Yeah, I just remember that I wasn't myself anymore.

I mean, this was not about me knocking college football and what it was becoming. It was more personal for me where I was nonstop, I was scatterbrained, I was doing a million different jobs that had nothing to do with football, that when I got home, I couldn't even have a conversation and focus, and I didn't have time to talk to my kids. And when I was, I really wasn't there. And I wasn't— to me, I wasn't being a great husband, I wasn't being a great father, I wasn't being a great son, I wasn't being a great person anymore. And I missed who I was and didn't like that. So regardless of how much money I was going I was never going to do a job that I didn't like if it changed who I was. I mean, I took a job for $2,500 years back and I loved life and I loved who I was. So it wasn't about the money or the look at me, I'm a head coach. This was about me and really nothing else.

But there's not a transaction of any kind that you remember as sort of like, I don't like this person anymore, I'm unhappy. I don't think that people come by the awareness of unhappiness immediately.

I think it was— It was built over time with events that took place. And I mean, yeah, it's winning a bowl game and for the first time in a long time at a place and being on cloud nine after upsetting a top 15 team and all seems well again. And then going to the office the next day and certain players are telling you they're leaving. I mean, when the year before you did everything you could to keep Zay Flowers from leaving and pouring all your energy into that type of stuff. And I mean, like, yeah, event after event after event after event like that starts to take the joy out of what I wanted to do. And I honestly, I have nothing against any of that. There are certain people that love it. There are certain people that want to do it. There are certain people that enjoy it. It's a great game. I still love college football. This was about me not liking the person I was becoming. It sounds heartbroken though. It was heartbreaking. Imagine pouring everything you have and getting to where you wanted to be and establishing roots at a place and saying, I'm not— I don't want to be here anymore.

You weren't coaching either, right?

I wasn't coaching at all. At all? No, I didn't have time to do much coaching.

So the head coach at Boston College has no time to be the head— to do Do you do any part of the job that you thought was—

I do some parts, but I also didn't have an audience of people the way a lot of people do to do it. And again, I'm not— I don't want to be one that sits here and knock it. It just, it wasn't for me.

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I usually sleep pretty good. I think earlier in my career, especially my first go-round as a head coach, everything kept me up at night. It was a to-do list that was this long that you never got done. It was more and more and more and more, and I didn't sleep. I just thought about it all. Where now I kind of live my life where I do everything I can in the moment the best that I can, and when I go to bed at night, I kind of put it away.

And, um, there's real confidence in that. It sounds like you've learned some things about what you need in order to do this correctly. I've learned a lot.

Peace of mind. I've learned a lot from that first go-around. But no, I might not look like it, but I sleep pretty good.

Oh no, I just think that there are all sorts of stresses and worries that come. Look, I don't expect you to be in a position— I don't sleep well, I have issues with this— but I don't expect you to be in a position where you have to say that anything about this job overwhelms you. But I would think that the amount of change presently happening in your life could feel overwhelming to anybody when you throw in all the stuff, the family, the moving, the details, and hey, Hey, here you go, Coach.

You're responsible for all of the decisions. Yeah, for sure. You make it sound a lot more overwhelming than I guess I was thinking about. But I just honestly, I just try to do the best that I can and I try now. I've done a better job of delegating things, so I just don't— I don't do it all myself. And I've realized also that you're not going to get everything done in a day and you just got to wake up and go back at it. But yeah, right now, is there stuff that's overwhelming? For sure. I mean, I want to get my family here. I want to get my kids here. I want to get the players here April 7th and start that. But I've just done a better job of just being able to put it away, you know, get some sleep, wake up, and go back at it.

Has there been anything about the job that has surprised you thus far?

Um, no, nothing that's really surprised me. I mean, there's stuff that comes up that catches me off guard day by day, but nothing that I'm saying, "Wow, I can't believe this is what I've gotten into." No, nothing like that. Something like that.

Yeah, I don't mean, though, overwhelming. I just mean you had an idea in your head or an expectation in your head. And for whatever reason, that's not so. It could be anything. No.

And I think maybe that will happen as we get going forward. But this is— for now, no. I mean, we've gotten the staff hired. People have been here. We've been working on the draft. We obviously got done with free agency. The scheme's coming together. I mean, the players aren't in the building yet. So once that happens, there'll probably be a lot of things that pop up as I get to know them figure out this draft class and then bring in all the players from the draft. And so there'll be a lot the next— the next 2 months, there'll be a lot more going on.

Well, what is your relationship with conflict?

I don't mind conflict. And I didn't always feel that way, where I used to avoid having a difficult conversation. Now I just go right at it and understand it and kind of rip the Band-Aid off and have an honest conversation. Whether that be with a player, another coach, or anybody else, I just— I go right at it.

Uh, it's an unusual thing to learn. How did you learn it, right? Con—

You know how I learned it? I learned it by avoiding it. And realizing that that doesn't solve anything, and eventually you have to meet it head-on, or it's just gonna worry you more than anything and take up too much of your time. So I've been very direct with people, I'm very honest with people, and if I feel like something's off, I go right up to them up and have a conversation with them about it. And if I don't agree with somebody, I let them know. I mean, I do it hopefully in a tactful way, and— but I have no problem with conflict anymore.

Do you remember when you outgrew it or when you realized it was a necessary part of leadership?

Yeah, as I— probably after my second year at Boston College. I mean, it became a time where here you start to think that everybody thinks like think like you, right? And that was when I— 40 years old, I get the job at Boston College, and you're sitting at a staff table with 25, 30 people around it, and it's, hey guys, I think you should do this, I think you should do this. And well, no, if anyone ever told me they think that I should do something, I'd go and do it and get it done as fast as I can, as good as I can, and get on the desk. But when you realize that everybody doesn't think like you, and what I'm asking people to do aren't suggestions, they're get this you have to start dealing with conflict. And I think after my second, third year at PC, I started understanding that more and was able to be more direct with people. And if I didn't like something, instead of letting it frustrate me and eat me up inside and try to let them figure it out, no, I just, I went right at it and I told them the truth.

You were too nice? Um, I don't know if I was too nice. Maybe I was too nice, or maybe I was just naive to the fact that I figured figured most people just kind of thought more like I had always been trained, and I wasn't correct on that.

You don't need to be told twice to do something the way that you grew up in. If someone in charge is— it's not an ask, it's a—

it's an order. Yeah, it's— do— yeah, it's an order, and that's how I always took it. But you know what I did?

You were about to say, do your fucking job.

That's what you were about. But I didn't know if I could say that on here, but now I see it was right. I was Exactly. You were about to snarl.

You were about to snarl.

Like, if you told me to do something right now, I would do it, and I would do the best I could, and I would do it on time, and I would try to do it better than anyone. So I guess what I do remember in one meeting, basically saying, guys, don't take my kindness for weakness, because if you do, this is not gonna end well for you. And I think early on, people took my kindness for weakness, and that's not the case. That's when the jersey will come out. I mean, it won't be good.

I just wonder how specifically you learn that, right? Because there's a moment of self-awareness in the mirror with like, "Oh, I'm in charge now, and being in charge means occasionally I'm gonna have to remind everybody that I'm in charge because they didn't get to where I am of being in charge because they didn't— they may not have cared the way I expect them to care." That's right.

Or they didn't listen to when I told them to change something or do something different. And now I'm going to tell you, look, I've asked you to do this, you still didn't do it. If this happens again, you can't be here. And then when I had to call people in and have hard conversations, it shouldn't have caught them out of the blue. It's, we talked about this like 5 times, you still haven't done this, you can't be here. So I've learned along the way, I think my communication has gotten better, right? I tell people not to worry about conflict. If something's on my mind, and I have the conversation with them. And I tell people now from the start what my expectations are for the staff. These are my expectations. This is the best way to deal with me, right? Don't come and tell me that, oh, I didn't want to tell you because you're too busy. No, that's a bunch of bullshit. Don't do that. Come if you have something, come and tell me, because I'd rather be over-informed than under-informed. And if I find out from someone else, that's not going to be good.

So essentially, I've told the staff, don't take my kindness for weakness. Weakness, and give them some examples. And I'll be the best guy you ever worked for. Just do your job the best that you can, communicate with me, and this is gonna be great.

Without giving you the specifics of a hypothetical coaching crisis that you need some guidance on, where's the first call going? Without making it specific to any, you know, one scenario that someone would be more qualified to handle, you've just got a football crisis. First person that you trust enough to be like— and you just don't recognize Analyze it. Something happened with a player and it's different from anything else.

Who's the call you're making? It depends situationally. It could be a couple football guys. Dave Wonstein would be one of them. He's a guy that I lean on heavily, talk to weekly, has been through it, was a head coach, really one of my biggest mentors. He is the first one that jumps into my mind, so he'd probably be my first call.

It's funny that you say that, though, because his experience with the Dolphins following the people he, uh, he followed. It hasn't been that good since then. I don't know, do you know the history, the entire history of the last 25 years down here since Wannstedt?

Yeah, he's told me about it a little bit, so I know it, but hopefully we'll make believers out of even you at some point.

What are you smiling about?

I don't know, I just felt like smiling at you.

No, that you were smiling. I was rough on Wannstedt when he was down here. I called him Wann-steadt. Stache. Did you start the Juan Stache? Well, we had, we actually had, uh, uh, Juanie McStaches. We started a restaurant where we gave out chicken fingers that were shaped like mustaches.

You get to know him.

I love Dave. I knew Dave at the University of Miami when he was— I went to school when Dave was the defensive coordinator. Yes, he's, he's a fundamentally decent, kind human being. He's a great person. And he got ravaged down here for following Don Shula and Jimmy Johnson while going 11-5, 10-6, 10-6, and then it all—

then the wheels came off. You're right. I mean, but that would be my first call.

And so it's been 25 years since then, and you know the history of what it is that you're walking into from that perspective, from Wannstedt telling you what it was like to follow Jimmy Johnson?

Um, we haven't talked about that in as much detail. I just— I've heard a lot about the past 25 years. Is there anything else you'd like to fill me in on? Did I just open up a bad alley?

No, because Dave Wannstedt is the last time that this football team was nationally relevant, and he fell under the expectations of you come after Don Shula and Jimmy Johnson. I think— was he Coach of the Year? I think he was. He was Coach of the Year in Chicago. I don't think he was Coach of the Year here.

Um, he might have been.

But over the last 25 years, they've squandered down here. You're— I grew up near the stadium, and you're sitting in front of a heartbroken Dolphin fan who can't I can't believe the team hasn't won a playoff game in 25 years in a league that legislates equality by making the bad teams better with the rules. Like, 25 years.

That's a lot of coaches. I know. I know. We're going to do everything we can to make you happy.

You're still smiling at me. You're still— what are you smiling about? You know what? How about— can I speak for you?

No. You want me to frown?

No. Can I— can I— can I speak for you? No, I think you're going to say, we'll show you. We'll show you.

Yeah, that guy who slept under his desk I'm gonna come out and do everything I can to make you a happy guy.

Yo, what I see beneath the smile is— is what? We're gonna show you, just watch. But you believe in yourself. You wouldn't have taken this job if you thought you were gonna fail at it.

Correct. I took this job because I believe in a lot of things about it that I'm excited about. Excited about. You know, I— the interview process was long. It wasn't just me going on all these interviews. It was me doing a lot of the interviewing. This wasn't like, this is your only interview, this is your only opportunity, I'm just going to take the job. That wasn't it at all. I mean, I chose out of the 6 that wanted to fly me in to meet with me, I chose this one to go first for a reason, because usually the first one is going to be the one you're most interested in, because if it works, you're not going to leave the building and say, oh no, I'm just going to go look around. So there's a lot of reasons I took this. I believed in ownership when I talked to them. I believed in Sully, and I wanted to pair up with somebody that I was aligned with. That was really important to me because you mentioned when I— I was in some situations that weren't great in this league, and I saw it all firsthand, and I watched it very closely.

I'm very observant. And then when I got to San Francisco and I saw Kyle and John Lynch and how connected they were, which was way different than anywhere that I've ever been, and I saw it, and I saw it building, and I saw the alignment, I saw they work together. I said to myself, if I ever have a chance to get one of these jobs, that's how I want it to be like. And that's what I saw with John Eric, and that's what John Eric and I talked about for the past 2 years. So if it were to work out where we both get a chance to start together, I just think that's a very rare opportunity, and I don't think that exists a lot in this League.

Is that the reason above all others that Miami was the first choice? There's an existing relationship of someone I know I can work with, aligned at the hip, we're going to be a formidable team, we know each other, we can do this together.

That was a big part of it. And after all of the Zooms, after I, I Zoomed with the Dolphins and I Zoomed with all those other teams, that Zoom answered all of my questions from ownership to Sully to everybody part of that interview. View where I said, yeah, I believe if I go there and things work out and we get other questions answered and this feels good, I feel this is the best place for us. Do you guys argue, Sully and I? For sure. Yeah. What do those look like? You talked about conflict, right? I mean, I'll give you a great example, and this is where— this is where I knew, because that's important. This isn't going to be like, hey Jeff, do you like this guy? Yeah, I like him. It's like, hey Sully, how did you think we played? Great. Oh, we didn't play great, we sucked Like, no, like, that's, that's not going to work. So last year on the draft board, he came down and we started to watch film together, which I don't think happens very many places as the defensive coordinator and him in his position. And they had a defensive player that he had like ranked in the first round.

And I was like, yeah, come down and show me. I don't agree with you at all. Like, I wouldn't take him in the fourth round, you know? And he showed me and then I showed him and we didn't agree at all. Call on it. And eventually we came to, like, a middle ground on it, but we're not gonna agree on anything. I mean, that's a bunch of BS if I tell you we're just gonna look at each other and— That's not how you get better, right? So then when the season started, you know, I would text him right after games and be like, "Do you think we played hard enough?" And there's times he told me no. And I'd be like, "I agree. We didn't. Why?" Like, "I gotta figure that out." Or I'd be like, "How do you think this guy played?" And he might tell me, "I thought he played really good." And I'd be like, "I thought he played terrible." say this guy played bad. I disagree with you. But I think— I don't think people can do that. I don't think GMs and head coaches do that enough. I think it's just— it's behind back door.

This guy— no, that's BS. Tell me to my face, you know what I mean? Just tell me the truth and I'll tell you the truth, and then let's try to figure it out. But that's what our relationship was built on. Like, we weren't like friends outside the building, and we never hung out. I never went to his house and never had a beer with with him. This was just a thing in the building where him and I had enough respect for each other where I wanted to know his opinion. So I wanted to work with someone like that.

Where were the two of you on Malik Willis? Were you just in lockstep the entire way? We were.

We had a lot of conversations. Now, this wasn't just like, "Oh, we were with Malik for 2 years. Let's go sign him." No. Like, we spent hours talking about it. Like, "Is this the path we want to go? Why? Let's turn the film back on. Let's talk about him as a person." and let's go back to conversations we had with him. Let's think about practice. Jeff, what did you think about him at practice? What did you think about this? So it was constant conversation. And then what fits our team? And we, we did agree on that one. And just— and that's why we wanted to go after him.

But you haven't agreed on all of them going forward here just in these 2 months. No, with the draft.

I mean, today we watched a guy and he asked me what I thought about him. And I told him I didn't like him very much. But what I did say was, I'll go back and watch more because I— that is important to me. I'm not gonna be right on everything. I'm not. And that's okay. Let's just get it right. And I don't care who gets credit. I just want to win. I'm past that in my career right now. I could care less. Like, give other coaches credit, give him credit. I just want to win, period. So I'm in a good place in my life right now right now where I don't need to have the one with, oh, we're taking this guy. No, all right, I get it. You take him. Let's take him. We'll coach him. We'll develop him. That's our job. But we're not going to agree on all that stuff.

This is the version of you that has the most clarity about what you want and need to do things the way that you want and need them?

By far. Because I'm done with like— there's nothing else that I even think of. This is all about what can we do win, right? This isn't about me at all. I don't— I'm just done with all of that. And I'm excited about that for the coaches that I've hired to Sully and his staff. And I'll ask questions and we'll do the best we can to figure it out.

I don't know what's known about the process of trading Jalen Waddle, but before Malik Willis gets here, is he told that that's in the works?

There was conversation with Malik Malik about that. So he and, um, so he and Malik talked about that for sure. That wasn't just like, hey, here's surprise, we're going to communicate with people.

But what sort of things like that have existed that would create natural discomforts for someone who is now in charge and has to— I've been saying on our show, the Dolphins have never fumigated their building like this. For sure. Where in the history of the franchise, everyone is swept out and very few are allowed to stay. Usually there's some stability, where it's not quite this complete?

No, I think it's very rare. But I think there's a lot of reasons that have went into this, why it's been done. And I think Sully's done an awesome job so far. I really do. From the moves that he's had to make for a lot of different reasons to the people that, you know, you mentioned Waddle, who's an awesome person and an awesome player. And that's a very hard, hard decision to make. And now the draft coming up. I think he's done a really good job of doing exactly what you just said.

How is he built like you? Because I would imagine that somewhere inside him is the same person who wants to beat the other guy to work by 15 minutes every day.

Oh, he does. He is— He is a driven, motivated, hard worker. Very direct, very honest, not afraid of conflict. Which, which you hit on, which I think people underestimate. People who are scared of conflict and can't look someone in the eye and tell them the truth and just tell them what they want to hear, that, that doesn't work well.

Well, especially not in your league.

It doesn't work, and it doesn't work in any league. It doesn't work in life. Just tell people the truth, and eventually they're gonna respect you for it. I mean, that's the problem right now. Everybody just wants everybody to feel good. Just tell them how it is. Tell them that's how he is, whether it's with me, whether it's when he has to have a hard conversation. He's so direct and he's so comfortable doing that. I think that makes him a great leader.

I remember being startled when Erik Spoelstra took the Heat job, one of the first interviews he— we did with him, and he just said flatly— he was very young at the time— my job isn't for the players to like me.

No, I don't— I'm not here to, like, be everybody's friend and their buddy. Like, that's It's not— maybe when I was a young coach, I cared about that. Like, that goes back to where I am in my life right now. They don't want to be my friend. That's not what I'm here for. I am here to help them get better and help them develop. And yeah, you know what? I want to help them do great things in their life, get them money, get them paid. But ultimately, I want to win. That's what I'm here for. And I want them to respect me because they trust me, because I tell them the truth because I'm going to believe in them and pour everything I have into them. But then I'm going to hold them to a standard. And if they're not doing something good enough, I'm going to tell them. Whether it was Micah Parsons or Xavier McKinney or Ronde Barber or all the great players that I've coached, they all want to be told what to do and how hard to do it. They don't want to be told, hey, great job when it wasn't a good job.

They're not going to get better and they're not going to grow like that.

Doesn't work. When you say you've handed things around the room and realize that your player or some people there didn't— your staff didn't care the way you did. Who's the player you think of when I ask, uh, who's most like you? A player? Yeah, just a rela— somewhere along the line, a relationship that you have made that's different from the rest for whatever reason, because you've seen something in a player that, uh, that either reminded you of you or connected with you in the space of, oh, I admire how much that guy cares, that, that's an unusual amount of To a player, you're saying?

Me to one of my players?

You might not be friends with him because you're so similar either. I don't know whether there's just anybody that you've looked at and you said— you don't even have to give me a name if you don't want, but just what— how that went in a relationship with somebody where you recognize some of yourself in them.

Yeah, I mean, I could think there's a bunch of guys that I do still have great relationships with, and those are the guys that are in your office early in the morning before you're getting ready to go over the game plan with the team because they want to know it beforehand. I mean, Ronde Barber, who is a Hall of Famer and was 37 or 38 years old when I was 30 and I coached him, he'd be taking pictures of his iPad and asking me questions about what he— what I thought he should do on this, this, and this at 11 o'clock at night. I mean, that guy's a Hall of Famer. He's 38, I'm 30, and he's texting me at 11 o'clock at night to ask me questions about what he— what I think he what we should do. Richard Sherman, after practice every single day, would want to know how we practiced. I mean, that's later in Richard Sherman's career. After practice, he's texting me while I'm watching film with the staff. Hey, how'd it look today? What should I look at here? What should I do here? Like the greatest ones in the game who are going to be Hall of Fame players asking questions like that.

I mean, there's—

that's special. It's a different world from the excellence. Drew Brees said excellence was really lonely. And when you talk about those great guys still wanting edge. Football is different in just how much the guys want to just be made better. I don't know that everybody in the real world is walking around in their jobs wanting to be made better.

And I don't know if every football player is walking around wanting to be better. And I think that's our job and our staff's job is to instill in them that, "Yeah." Like, I want to have a great relationship with players, and I do. Like, the guys in Green Bay, those relationships I have and the calls and the texts that I got, that isn't because I tried to be their friend. It's because I tried to push them and help them become the best player and person they could be. That's what our staff and that's what I need to do here. It's setting a standard and showing these guys that they can be better than they think they are. And that's what I'm excited about them getting here to do. Thank you for the time.

Welcome to Miami. I appreciate it. I— you think I'm misreading that you had a smile smiling snarl that goes back all the way to Wansted on "I'll show you." I'll show you. I never said that. You didn't say that. No, you didn't say that. I just smiled.

This was fun. I'm glad you had me on.

I thank you for doing so. Welcome to Miami. I look forward to seeing your work. I look forward to being back.