Transcript of Hour 1: Hanging Your Hat (feat. Lucy Rohden)

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This is the Dan Levatore Show with the Stugats podcast.

Hi, this is Rose.

I thought we were going to dress because yesterday was Halloween, and I ended up being the only one dressing up.

Yeah, so according to my calculations, this is very embarrassing. Hi, Dan. Happy Halloween.

This is a special off-roading, spooky, spectacular Halloween edition, because what is scarier than coming back to Columbus, Ohio, the spot where our dear Rose was pepper sprayed? Well, it turns out we actually did find something scarier, something spookier. It's that Rose is the only person dressed up, and she looks certifiably insane because getting pepper-sprayed is bad. Being the peak of social embarrassment might be worse. Great, Scott. What do you think I'm dressed as?

Rick from Rick and Morty.

Oh, Rick from Rick and Morty. It could be that, but no.

Dr. Dushan.

No.

What do you think I'm dressed as? Albert Einstein.

I will take that.

I will take Albert Einstein, but no. What do you think I'm dressed A Laboo-Boo. I don't know what that is.

How would you rate my friend Rose's costume here?

Einstein is 10 out of 10.

Einstein.

M equals emcee squared or E equals emcee squared. I remember that back in high school. Go, go, Einstein. Go, go. Go, Bucks. Go, Bucks. We just got to remember that if it wasn't for Einstein, we wouldn't be here today. We wouldn't have the technological advancements to be here. We might have... If anything, we might not be defending the shoe. You know what I mean? It said without him.

Yeah, that was lovely. She's not dressed as Einstein.

Okay, sorry. Just a crazy scientist, I'm assuming.

Have you seen Back to the Future?

Yes. Yes.

Scott.

Something that works.

Do you want to come see it? In our handyman business, we get called out to fix flux capacitors all the time. If it wasn't for Marty McFly and what did it back to the future, I wouldn't be in business. Okay? Let me just put it that way. So shout out to Halloween, shout out to Marty McFly, shout out to every scientist that's in America, because if it wasn't for you guys, who knows where I'd be.

How are we doing just mentally right now?

Mentally? I mean, we're trying to just figure out the lay of the land. This is so much different than Penn State. Where's the tailgates?

Like, where's the tailgates?

The vibes are a little bad. The vibes are a little bad. Not even just as a Penn State man.

I haven't seen a single 30 rack being carried yet. I'm honestly really disappointed.

There's a point of alcohol around here.

Where's the alcohol?

Bring it on. No way to hear it.

Where do you say you're the biggest college football fan?

No, I'm just one of millions and millions of Buckeye fans and college fans.

Well, I'm going to give it to you.

I'm going to award you the biggest college football fan.

For me to say that I'm the biggest and the best, that's not for me to say.

That's for you to say.

Exactly. So now I'm saying it.

What is a Buckeye? Man, let me tell you something. A Buckeye is a Proud, proud, proud, American. And also we have Buckeye nuts that grow on trees.

So it's a nut?

Yes.

And it's a Poisonis?

Well, you already know the answer to the question if you ask me.

O-h. I know.

That's the way we go. Yes. This trip to Columbus was presented by Fox One. Stream your favorite live sports on the Fox One app and download today. What's scarier, losing to Penn State today or losing to Michigan again? Oh, Michigan all the way. Michigan.

Michigan again. They're Four years. They haven't won in what, 2,163 days? This is our second home. We use this as a vacation home. This is Ann Arbor, the second.

Do you guys have someone you would like for Penn State to hire as their head coach? Joe braided. Does Anyone miss James Franklin out of this crew? Yes. Yes.

No comment.

No. Not really. No.

No.

What do you think James Franklin went as for Halloween this year? Probably himself because he has a big ego. Unemployed?

Yes.

Not a costume. I mean, it's a fact. What do you think Ryan Day was for Halloween? Probably Cry Baby.

One of those big blow-up suits, Cry Baby.

Where we go, we don't need Rose. There's the scariest team in college football that's not Ohio State. Oregon.

Indiana. They're good.

They're good. They're real good.

They're real good. Kirk Signetti.

He's the man. Google him. Google him. If you want to go to a college football game, maybe even a UNC game, download the Game Time app and use Klucey for $20 your first order. Terms apply. It's spooky.

He's in two hours.

He's going to be in.

Dan, given the number of firings that I have been a part of recently, I was a little worried about credentials for this one, but I was like, no worries. We'll go to Columbus. We'll have a good time. I tried to walk into the stadium. They have this hanging up? They have this hanging up? Thank God they picked such a pretty picture of me. But guess they want to keep Ryan Day around here. All the gates are locked and they won't let me in. Because what? I'm too pretty? That's not cool. Because what? I might get your head coach fired? What do you think is going on in there? I feel like I'm being bullied, maybe discriminated against for being too funny. Is it because I'm wearing white? Do you think they're not letting me in because they saw how Rose was dressed? Michigan would never. Well, it turns out, Penn State didn't need James Franklin to lose to Ohio State. They could do it with an interim, too.

We're welcoming Lucy, who's heading to Boon, North Carolina, Thursday night for App State's matchup with Georgia Southern. A little good FCS.

I love Boon, North Carolina.

No, they're FBS.

Are they FBS?

Yeah, Group of Five action.

It's one of the best towns in the country.

You're still going Group of Five? I call Group of Six now, Lucy.

Oh, I always call it Group of Five. I still call it Power Five, even though I know that's wrong. All right.

What do you know, Zaz?

I'm a college football expert. What's the matter with you?

He does. He flies every weekend. He sometimes rides a bus.

It's one time.

Lucy, how long was that picture of you fold it up in your pocket? Because it was so creased.

Well, we did a bit where we were trying to throw it at me, so it looked like it was blowing through the wind, and it went so poorly. So we had to crumble it up into a ball six or seven times, and the bit didn't even work, didn't even make the video.

I love it. All right, so Lucy, we've got the college football playoffs about to be-Tonight. They're going to release-First rankings. The first rankings. And they made a big dog and pony show out of releasing this video of them hanging their hats. And so this sparked great controversy and conversation in the office. We were like, Doesn't that mean that they're going to be partial?

Because You would think that they would be putting their team hats on this, but no, they are hanging the hats of just the college football playoff logo. Essentially, they're saying they're putting aside their unbiased.

They're hanging up their neutrality.

Everybody's so old.

Me, too.

They all look the same. They all look exactly the same.

How will they know which one was their hat?

That's a great question. Maybe it's like a national anthem type of deal where they're like, We have to show respect for the college football playoff. You can't have your hat on. But yeah, it completely defeats the purpose if it doesn't have their team on it. Stupe. Luci. They definitely were all given the hat the day up.

The hat rack couldn't look older.

Who's got a hat rack anymore? Do you? Nobody. You don't have a hat rack?

I have a hat rack.

Do you?

Yeah, it's really funky looking.

Do you have hats on it?

I'm so surprised.

I have purses on it.

A purse rack.

Lucy, will there be any juicy storyline that comes out of the first college football playoff rankings tonight?

Well, there are three things I'm looking at, particularly. One is I really do think there's a chance in Indiana is the number one overall team, you're going to figure out how they're evaluating this year's group of teams where Indiana may not look as good, I test-wise, as Ohio State, even though I don't really agree with that. Indiana has the best one in the country right now with a road win over Oregon. So what are they going to do with Ohio State, Indiana? What are they going to do with Oregon, whose best win is now against Penn State, which is not as good of a win, and you don't really feel as comfortable with that? And then looking at the mess that's the ACC and the SEC right now? Do you rank Tennessee who hasn't beat anybody? Where do you put Miami after losing this weekend? I think we'll get a lot of questions answered. This is always one of my favorite days because everyone gets so mad, and it actually really does matter. We're like the eight people. I'm just mad at it for no reason.

Lucy, what is America's fascination with Vanderbilt?

I think it's just like, I don't want to call them lovable losers because they're not losers anymore. They're winning. I think there's just this like, this is a team that was so bad for so, so long. And you bring in Diego Pavia, who has this great story of he went to a military college, and then he went to New Mexico State, and now he's at Vanderbilt, and he's coming, and he's striking the Heisman pose. And you saw them this weekend, obviously lose against Texas, but play incredibly competitively, coming back from down double digits to be inches away from recovering an onside kick. That stuff never used to happen to Vanderbilt. I think it's weird to me that that fascination hasn't necessarily, I think, hit the same with Indiana, who's also as historically bad as Vanderbilt, if not worse. But I think it's because Indiana is so dominant, and it's just so confusing because we don't really... There's an SEC bias with it. But I think it's just this is a team that was so, so bad for so, so long. To see them win is really exciting.

Which fans will be angry tonight, Lucy?

Oh, that's a good question. I think Ohio State fans will be angry because I think they're going to put Indiana number one. I'm curious to see what happens. I think some SEC fan bases are going to be really, really angry. I don't think it's going to be Alabama, and I don't think it's going to be Georgia, and obviously not Texas A&M. But I think that the SEC right now, for me, is a very difficult conference to evaluate because I think, Mike Ryan, you'll appreciate this. The SEC and the ATC are very similar in the way they're beating each other, but there's a different narrative with both of those conferences. And so for me, I think the SEC is obviously going to get the benefit of the doubt. And you might see teams like Tennessee who has not beat anybody at find their way in a good position when they probably shouldn't be.

Yeah, it's frustrating. I've been on the SEC thing for quite a while, but I want to turn my attention over to the Big Ten because I don't think enough is made out of how bad the bottom third of this conference is. I think you have one of the more impactful games of the weekend, your Iowa Hawkeyes. If Oregon loses this game, the national narrative needs to be, they're out. They need to stack wins. Their best win right now is who? Northwestern? This is the second consecutive year. And credit to Indiana because no arguments there. They've done more this year, but they found a way. They found the hack inside that conference, which is don't really play anybody. And if you get one to two losses, you're in that discussion. Whereas Oregon, really soft schedule this year. Incredibly soft. So what do you think happens this weekend? 10? And what do you think the conversation should be around the Big Ten?

One, I know that me, personally, I'm going to be miserable because this game is already ruining my life because I really think Iowa is going to win. And when they don't win, it's going to kill me. This is like a playoff elimination game of some sorts for Oregon. Iowa, theoretically, if they win out the rest of the season, they should be in the playoff. They probably will be in the playoff. That's a stretch that I'm not really ready to take mentally and emotionally quite yet. Yeah, if Oregon loses this game, which, by the way, this is a very, very weirdly good Iowa football team. They're scoring a lot of points. Their defense looks phenomenal. If they lose, it's not a bad loss. But Oregon, I do believe they still have Washington and USC left on the schedule. Those are two teams that could really help your case. I think we're in a little SEC bias mode again. We're like Washington, Iowa. These are teams that probably should be getting a little more praise than they are. So nationally, they don't look as good of wins as they could possibly be, but they are really good wins.

But I do think that if Oregon loses this weekend, it's over for them. And it's another team that you look at and objectively view what you've said, it's true. It's hard to evaluate how good they are because the only real example we have is them losing by two touch downs to Indiana. Iowa did not lose like that. Iowa was a couple of plays away from beating Indiana had their quarterback not gotten hurt. So it's hard to evaluate this game. All I know is that I'm doing mentally really, really poor about it. It's ruining my life.

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Surely every time you're watching this, you recognize that your wife is laughing that she married Larry David.

I do, yeah. One of the great characters in the history of television, in my humble opinion. To my credit, my personality- In my humble opinion, followed by to my credit. To my credit. It's amazing. To my credit. My personality does predate Curve Your Enthusiasm. Stugatz. Oh, wow. I'm not going to say Larry David patterned himself after me.

All right, put it on the poll, please, Jude.

You did Greg Cody, Copyright Being an Ashole long before Larry David.

This is the Dan Levatard show with the Stugats.

Keeping it in the Big Ten, Lucy, am I looking at it properly where Michigan, Ohio State, last game of the season is potentially to get to the Big Ten Championship?

Yes, I think it would be because I don't I don't know who else would be in that conversation. I think Michigan's got a pretty easy schedule, but I still don't think they're as great as they're being heralded as. So if they were to lose another one, it wouldn't shock me. But yeah, this is almost a de facto playoff elimination game, which is so awesome, especially given just the narrative of you cannot lose to them for a fifth straight year, especially with this Ohio State team, which is just as good as last year's Ohio State team. It's going to be so much fun.

Let's talk about the Miami upset over the weekend Miami, once again, sitting at two losses, both by less than a score. Understandably today, I saw Heather Denej speak on this. She fully expects Notre Dame to be ranked ahead of Miami, even though head to head, Miami defeated Notre Dame. A month is an eternity in college football. As we saw with Alabama and Oklahoma last year, there was a really bad loss. And two weeks later, everyone saying, If they're in the tournament, then win the championship. I guess my long-winded question here is, if Miami, I think the hardest thing for them is to actually go 4-0 in the month of November. But if they do, they go 4-0, and they're at a better place at the end of the season, despite not even making it to their conference championship game, the Notre Dame thing is a pickle. Where do you see the CFP committee?

My movie to yourself, Pickles, dog.

Where do you see the CFP siding on this?

I personally don't love when you're ranking a team that beat somebody else ahead of them. I don't think that Notre Dame should be ranked in front of Miami because what you're telling me is that head-to-head matchups don't matter. Why did you even play that game if it doesn't matter? But that doesn't matter what I like. I think that it's so tough. I think there's so many extra circumstances with Miami where it really does matter of what happens everywhere else. What if Iowa does win out weird enough? That's going to hurt Miami. What happens with Georgia Tech after a really tough loss against NC State this weekend, giving up 40 points to the Wolfpack? There are so many extra circumstances, and I just don't see Miami getting the good end of things because like we talked about, if it comes down to a two-loss ACC team or a three-loss STC team, I think we all know what direction they're going to go.

Damn, Georgia Tech. What's Haynes King got to do to win Heisman? He's a Heisman, isn't he?

He's a frontman. I don't know. I saw this great tweet. I wish I could remember who said it. It's, Haynes King is what people think Diego Pavia is. Haynes King is running out every Saturday, and he's like, I'll die for this team. I don't care. I'll do it. You need me to play life with him because I will.

No big deal.

He's everything. I love him so much, and he should be in this Heisman conversation because he's maybe the most college football player ever. I just love him so much.

I know he's got no future after this.

Amine, you're the Georgia Tech guy on this show. Are you emotionally preparing? Because it seems as though down to the AP and the coaches poll, what everybody is doing is projecting the ACC to fall apart. And I get that. But right now, they have three one-loss teams that are pretty good, that have played some SEC teams that you can do It's a transitive property with some of the teams that they beat and the results that those teams that were defeated at the hands of the likes.

Did you say transitive property?

Transitive property. I think that the ACC, look, if the CFP does its job right, they should look at the ACC where it is right now and avoid the whole temptation of, Well, they're going to fall apart.

Dude, I think we did them a favor by losing NC State because if we were undefeated, first of all, we've been underranked this whole time. Part of my questions about Vanderbilt was a little shade on my part. It's like, Everyone's falling over over Vanderbilt. We're than them. But the loss to NC State actually makes it easier for them, I feel like, to dismiss.

What's your good win for Jordan?

It's Clemson.

Yeah, that's the difference.

That team sucks.

They didn't suck when we beat their ass, though.

No, they did, though.

No, not when we beat their ass.

No, they did.

When they beat their ass?

Well, then I guess Florida State sucked when Florida State beat Alabama's ass.

Well, let me tell you something. We beat Florida State's ass last year. That started this whole thing. They were good back then. All right.

All right. You know what? Don't answer the question. Lucy, same question. Yes.

Well, Amin's answer was, have you guys seen that tweet that's going viral of like, look at what Alabama did to preseason number 13, South Carolina. And so everyone's just been quote-tweeting with like, look at what we did against 1998 national champion. It's very, very funny. I can't even remember what the question was.

Beat the ass is the question.

Are they going to project the ACC falling apart and play into narratives? Or are they going to look at the ACC as a whole where it is right now, which has three really, really good teams in it?

I don't think they're going to look at the ACC and be like, This is awesome. I think they're going to look at it with the like, Wow, we're at this point. And Duke is in the conversation, and Virginia is in the conversation. I don't think they're necessarily going to look at the ACC and be like, I think that Virginia is better than Ole Miss or anything like that. I assume they're going to look at the ACC with maybe a three teams, four teams ranked. I don't think they're going to give them much benefit of the doubt at all because I hate to be this way, but they are going to push the SEC more than anything. And then it'll be the Big Ten, the Big 12 as messy as it is. I just think the ACC is going to get the short end of the stick. And I do think part of the reason that plays into it is because I think it would be very different if Miami was in Virginia's spot, where they don't want people to be like, Yes, Virginia is here. It just doesn't have the same appeal, even though us real ones know that we want to see Virginia do well.

We want to see Chandler Morris have a good season.

Chris, I believe it's time. Time to get in it.

It's Lucy's Internet Minute.

I love that so much. It never gets old. We have a rare college football Internet Minute that I'm excited to talk to you guys about. We've all seen the Oklahoma kicker, right? I don't like it. He is wearing some short shorts. I love it. Ridiculous. People are losing their mind. Kirk Herb Street was like, I literally thought he was going to-That's not a football uniform.

Yes, it is. What do you need knee pads for? You're a kicker.

That's a good point. You might have to title somebody.

Also, look, so what's our overall takeaway? I'm fine with it. I think, look, if you want to dress a little slutty for your football game, go for it.

I hope Amen. This is telling and probably fashion forward and where the sport is going. I really hope for this.

I've seen wide receivers do it. I've seen tight ends. I've seen corners do it. Everybody's starting to do it. So this kicker is not the friend. They wear socks, man. No, not like that. You've never seen it, buddy. You don't see everything.

I see everything.

You don't see everything.

I see. We already did this yesterday.

I can guarantee you don't see everything.

We already did this. I see everything. I watch everything.

What happened to the barefoot kicker? Why did you bringing this up?

My bad.

Greg Cody, did you not kick your 50-yard field goal barefoot?

I did, yeah.

About in short shorts?

Yeah. I think those shorts would be even shorter. Okay. Why stop there? You don't ride them up. Don't little five-inch in scene.

That's been Lucy's Internet Minute.

You guys are so horny for college football. It's great.

It's new to me, Lucy. This horniness is new to me. I haven't felt it in like 15 years, 25 years, maybe.

Yeah. Haynes King will do that to you.

Oh, man. Haynes King.

The exact guy will do that to you.

Black His name for a white cool backup.

It is cute. You think Georgia Tech's good?

What? They are cute.

I think Georgia Tech's good.

They are good, but their resume, when you really hold it under a microscope- You line them up, we knock them down.

How about that for a resume?

I have a take. I feel like nobody's resume is good. Nobody's resume is good.

I'll allow it.

Tell me the good resumes. Hit me.

Yeah. I mean, you could go Alabama with wins over, Vanderbilt, Mizzou, Georgia, obviously Texas A&M. But it's also funny that Alabama has right now what might be the worst loss, which is objectively really funny. A&m has a good resume.

That's about it.

Ohio State's unde. You only play who you have on your schedule. Line them up, we knock them down.

Ohio State's schedule is like, there's nothing left.

I'm sick of I'm sick of this Big Ten. How many years are teams going to get away with this?

I can't keep getting away with this.

They can't. It's just like, Well, we'll have three lost teams in there. We deserve it. That is our birthright because we expanded and added a whole bunch of shitty teams.

Get out of here. What is this? If you have a number in the name of your conference, the number has to reflect the number of teams in your conference. Good take. Enough.

I second that.

Big Ten? I get behind that. Better tell some of these teams to get out of here.

Says the guy with an ACC team with two teams in the Pacific Coast.

That's not numbers.

But again, no numbers.

That's not numbers.

Atlantic Coast Conference, but Pacific.

They're all coasts.

And Texas.

I was in Texas in an ACC game.

Sad stadium, by the way.

Still in the Coast down there.

16 teams in the Big 12.

Galveston?

Ever heard of Galveston? Last question. They cheated, right? The refs cheated in Dallas. They cheated.

Do you guys see the Clemson call at the end?

Yes, that was brutal. That was insane. What happened to the Gators was unfortunate. There's a lot of bad officiating. I got my eyes on Al Riveron. I got my eyes dead on Al River on.

It's been a rough year. We went to that Auburn, Georgia, game where the officials were so bad, they literally had to fire the crew after the game. They're not allowed to ref anymore.

Damn. Speaking of fired in Auburn, who do you like there? Summerall? Getting a lot of summer roll juice.

Yeah, I think that's where I would go if I were Auburn. But my whole thing is I think that's a smart decision. And because I think it's a smart decision, I know Auburn is not going to make that. There's no way Auburn makes that call. I just don't trust that school to do anything. Yeah, Hugh He's bad idea from the jump. They hired him because he beat nick Saban twice, and then nick Saban retired, and there was no point to having Hugh Fries there.

I definitely think they should hire Summeralls just so we can hear him say, Gannon, steps back.

Gannon, Gannon, Gannon. I thought it was Gannon.

Yeah, it was Gannon. Steps back.

No relation, right?

No relation to Gannon and Don Kannon. Or are you talking about the Summeralls? My bad.

Where is Don Kannon right now?

I don't know. Ask Pat Summeralls.

We need to find Pablo Tori finds out. Where's Don Canon?

Lucy is going to be in Boon, North Carolina, Thursday night for App State matchup with Georgia Southern. Lucy, thank you very much. Bye, all. There she goes. There she goes again. Yes, Jeremy, raise your hand.

In three starts with the Arizona Cardinals, Jacobi Braset has completed 65% of his passes, thrown for 850 plus yards, thrown for six plus shutdown passes, rushed for a countdown. The only other NFL quarterback to do this over his first three starts with the team was Kurt Warner with the Rams in 1999.

And we all know how that ended.

Greg, don't look so shocked.

You remember how that ended?

Don't look so shocked, Greg. I mean, are we still on Jacobi Berset? We are. He's had three seasons where he started more than half of the games, never had a passer rating above 88.

Kurt Warner was bagging groceries, great.

Good point.

You know what he did after that? He bagged a Super Bowl. Don Levatard.

He called me on my own podcast. He called me full of shit, claiming that I'm faking interest in the solar eclipse. You do this.

You love to just get excited about everything.

Okay, Junior. Stugatz. I had to school you and explain to you.

He was going to take you to Augusta.

When I was 17 years old, Alan Cherry and I used to haunt the Buhler Planetarium.

This is the Don Levatard Show with the Stugats.

You know what happens when you let a career backup be your starter? Go on. Gino Smith happens.

I was going to say Tom braided It happens, but to each his own.

That's an anomaly. That's the exception to the rule. The rule is if you're a career backup and all of a sudden you become a starter, you remind people why you are a career backup.

Sure. Agreed, Greg. But we can all admit Kyler Murray is on the downslide of what we thought he was going to be. In his prime, he should be a quarterback that should be dealing, running around, throwing shutdown passes, and he just doesn't seem to be doing that at the rate that we thought he was going to be.

His ceiling is still so much higher than %.

Does he not know the definition of a Career backup.

His career backup?

He wasn't a career backup. Yes, he was. He was the Orange Bowl MVP. I know he split time with Drew Hansen. We're not counting college. Well, then what are you counting? Because he was a backup for six weeks.

It was his second year.

So that was his career up to that point.

It means not right.

He was right about that. It was his career up to that point. The entire career.

And then they started him, and the rest is history. Same thing here.

So Shadr Sanders starts at one point this season for the Browns. Was he a career backup? Yeah.

So far, his career is a backup.

I don't like this game.

So if you don't start your first career game, you're a career backup.

As you're sitting, you know what you are? You're sitting as a guy. There's a QB1. You know what that makes you?

There is no two.

Backup. How long has your career been? What have you done in your career? You're going to start? No.

Guess what you are. Mac Jones started as a starter.

So not a career backup.

It's really fine to admit when you're wrong. Miami is not as good as I thought they were, and Tom braided wasn't a career backup. I don't understand why we have to hold on to this.

How are you not understanding the logic?

It's actually liberating when you're like, You know what? My Had that one wrong.

What do you think I thought? You think I thought that Tom braided around the league and then all of a sudden got a shot?

No, I think you thought he was probably in the league for several years.

That's what I think.

Several years?

Yeah.

That's what I think. How many years was he in the league?

His whole career?

When he was a backup.

Don't turn this on him.

When he was a backup, like 18 games.

So more than one season? Yes. More than one year? Yes. Hey, Tony, what happens when you have a year and then you have more than it? It's called years. Years. Years as a backup.

Jeff Hosteller did win. In a Super Bowl.

The last two Cardinals' quarterbacks with 200 plus passing yards, two passing touch downs in three consecutive games. Jacobi Brisset, Carson Palmer. Kyler has never done it.

Who's missing there, Greg? This is not a pro Jacobi Brisset conversation. It is an anti Kyler Murray conversation.

There's also an English language conversation for some of the people. Exactly. Thank you. For some of the people.

What is true is that there's a level of franchise quarterbacks where you think it's a franchise quarterback and the jury is still out. Two is one of those guys. Tyler Murray is one of those guys.

Journey made their decision there.

You think?

Yeah. Jury did.

Last few games.

Jury did.

Let's go home to your family. They said, Don't stop believing. We don't want to deliberate anymore. Bayliff.

Champ Bayliff.

To that point, though, it feels like Kyler Murray should be in some of these stats, and he's not. A pedestrian guy like Jacobi Brisset can go in and make those stats happen where Kyler Murray cannot? How are we still having this conversation?

If you take the contracts away from it, who has less value right now, Kyler or Tua?

Tua. I know the contracts away, that's a big thing.

Because at least Kyler Murray can run around and make plays. Tua can't. Kyler Murray absolutely has more value.

Does he have more value?

I don't know about that, man.

I don't know about that, man. A lot more value.

No, we're just taking the contracts out of it. Yeah.

He has a lot more value.

A lot more value. Really? Yes. He's a better player.

He's not a hit away.

Yes, he's not a hit away. That's one thing. I mean, everybody's a hit away, but not in the way that Tua is. And he's more dynamic. He's got an arm that's way more live.

He's much better.

Are we sure that Tua has lost it. He's He'll never get it back. That's what we're saying.

That's what happens when you're washed.

You're already calling it. I don't agree.

Judge Zaz?

I think he's washed.

I think he's washed. I said he was washed weeks ago.

Yeah, he's toast. I think he's toast.

Now, Kyler Murray may not be very good, but he's not washed.

It's not good. I think Kyler Murray has certainly way more of a chance to make something of himself in the NFL. I'm not even in on how we're talking about him. I don't think he's shown you that he's a complete bust just yet.

I feel like this is a classic, better to have loved and lost than to have never loved at all, right? Tua was actually great at one point.

So was Kyler. Kyler, that rookie season, everyone's like, They freaking nailed it.

His peak was never higher.

Kingsbury was so right to get Rosen out of there.

Tua's peak was probably higher than Murray's best season so far.

Much higher. Kyler never led the League of Pastors.

No, Tua had an amazing year.

His peak is undeniably higher. But Kyler hasn't been scrambled eggs, so that's what puts him on average better.

But even then- Kyler made the playoff his rookie year. Everyone was like, Wow, they nailed I feel hesitant to just declare that Tua is done.

You shouldn't. Nobody should.

Well, if you want to be accurate.

I don't think the dolphins are declaring that yet.

Well, clearly, they're not.

Yes or no. We see Quin Urizo.

You heard Diana say that there's dispute within the franchise about whether or not they want to move on with him, meaning some people still believe in him.

Oh, no, I took it the other way. What Diana was saying there made it sound like they are close to done with Tua.

Well, I think if When you replay the tape, she also said there's debate within the franchise.

Right, but that would be the first time that you've heard that before. That would mean we're trending in the wrong direction.

There's debate-I mean, he leads the league in interceptions.

Of course, you're going to be down on him. When a quarterback of a 2-17 His team has 11 picks, he's having a lousy year. Two years ago, he made the Pro Bowl. I'm not ready to give up on the guy.

Greg, do you think is there a possibility for Tua to have success somewhere else? In that sense that, let's say they do give on him. Like a Sam Darnold situation. Would you fear a Sam Darnold situation?

Yeah, I would think he has trade value somewhere. I don't think you're going to get three first rounds for him or even two, but I think he has trade value.

You'd be lucky if you got a fifth round pick for him.

Oh, That's insane. The way they're prognosticating it is you got to give pics away to get them off the roster and get them to somebody else's team.

You think he's less valuable to a team that needs a quarterback than Jalen Phillips?

You also got to remember, there's a money situation. We're talking about trade. You can't then say all All things equal. No, all things are not equal. You have to take the money. They'd be lucky to get a fifth. Jalen Phillips doesn't make any money right now.

You'd have to eat some money because they ate some of Jalen's money to get that third-round pick. I think to get anything for Tua, you'd have to eat a lot of money.

You would have to see him as a franchise quarterback.

They'd be lucky to get Jacobi Brisset because the Cardinal's passing offense with Jacobi Brisset, 287 yards per game, two touch downs per game, 25. 7 points per game. With Kyler Murray, just 192 yards per game, 1. 2 touch downs per game, and 20. 6 points per game.

The plot seems to be Kyler Murray. It's not that good. We've lost the plot. It seems to be that's the plot. Here we go.

All right, so let's talk about something completely different. Steve Ballmer getting sued, baby.

Thank you. Finally. All right, look, there's a lot of news stories out there. We chewed on the John Marine thing, but Steve Ballmer getting sued by, what was it, 11 people from Aspiration?

Well, 11 investors in Aspiration. Mike, this is what I'm going to say. The basic gist of it is, for the people who don't know, obviously, Aspiration Aspiration is the company that was paying Quye Leonard allegedly under the table, some caps at a convention stuff. There's a lot of evidence that Pappletree finds out, has uncovered. I'm part of that investigation, so I guess I could say I'm going to uncover some of it, too. But anyways, even as Aspiration was crashing, Steve Ballmer and other Ballmer surrogates were funneling money to the company to keep it afloat, simply to continue to make the payments to Quye Leonard.

Wouldn't that also prove Mark Cuban's point originally, right? Where you don't They want the company to go bankrupt because then everything comes out. It comes out.

It's a house of cards at that point. Yeah, it proved Mark Cuban's point. That proved Pablo's point. Right. That's the story. Then last night, we get the update that Steve Ballmer is being sued by people who are investors in aspiration. And the basic gist of it is we saw Ballmer's infusion in cash as a stamp that everything's on the up and up. A lifeline, almost. Not just a lifeline, but like, Oh, yeah, this Which is a real thing that we're right to invest in. And then to find out, literally through Pablo's reporting, that no, all that was basically a clearing house to pay kua, they feel like they've been defrauded because it was not It was not an up and up. They were committing fraud, basically. They're suing Steve Ballmer for that. The first thing I thought when I heard Pablo talk about it and I read through the lawsuit, I said, This is the most brilliant lawyer ever because they know they've got Steve Ballmer against the ropes with this situation.

There's two options, right? Either Ballmer pays or they go to discovery, right?

Yes, exactly. And if you go to discovery, now, everything that we've talked about, it wasn't Cap's circumvention. I was deframed. All that gets entered in, and now you're really in trouble. So I just think it's brilliant, but it's also a cash grab.

A hundred %. Oh, yeah. Does it feel like it's going from instead of salary cap circumvention to now wire fraud and fraud of other sorts for Steve Ballard?

Up until this point, it hasn't been a criminal conversation.

Does this make it, is my question?

I'm not as informed on the SEC and that level of it. But we do know that Joe Sandberg, who's also being named in the lawsuit, has been investigated and has been charged and taken to trial over this. So there are criminal aspects to this case, Greg, but the Clippers up until this point have always been like, Oh, no, this is an NBA story, and now it becomes a court story.

Yeah, I think that Steve Ballmer probably is going to try to settle this out of court, which is going to be incriminating to him, I think, on its own I think- The NBA will still be like, Yeah, it doesn't prove it. I know, but see, that's the problem. I don't think the Pablo Tori finds out report. I think it's been maligned, meaning unfairly criticized or not taken seriously enough. I think this lawsuit against Ballmer is going to force Balmer's hand. If you see him settle out of court, that's incriminating.

Yeah, I think it's going to force him to settle, though, Greg. It's going to force him to settle, Greg. I know. Because there's no way this goes to discovery. If this goes to discovery, they're doing the MBA's job for them. We already saw how the NBA panics when someone does their job for them.

It'll never get to that. Greg, the big thing is I'd rather people think I'm guilty than to remove any shadow of a doubt that I'm guilty.

And the NBA, look, if he settles, the NBA is going to look at me like, All right, it doesn't prove anything.

No, exactly. Greg's right. People are going to be like, Oh, they had to settle. That means they had something to hide. People are going to say that, but that is more advantageous of a position to be in then for them to, Oh, we're going to take it to court, and then everything comes out and it's like...

Absolutely. No, the lawsuit was filed as a money grab. There's no doubt about it. But if you're the NBA and you see Ballmer settling that out of court rather than facing discovery, that's pretty incriminating.

No. Yes, on the That's it.

I think the NBA is going to say it's pretty substantial.

The NBA is rooting for that.

Probably advising them on the side. Most billionaires don't want to go to discovery for anything, whether they did it or not.

But more than anything, the league doesn't want this. The League's best interest, obviously, I'm not saying that they're going to subvert. They're going to subvert the investigation that they're doing. But the best interest of the League is to find out that there was no Capsular Convention. To find out there was this massive Capsular Convention thing would be a huge black eye. So if discovery is withheld and this guy settles out of court and then they can't find anything corroborating on their side, it's a little bit of a, Oh, thank God, rather than, Oh, no. You almost don't want to find out.

Well, from day one, the NBA wanted this whole thing to go away and ignore it.

Adam Southerners said, I've never heard of aspiration. And in the words of Mori Povich, we found out that also was not a truth. Fraud. Not a truth. There you go. Shout out to Sid Ciscero. Fraud. Oh, man, I miss him. We should have him on again.

Kyler Murray has hit 260 plus passing yards and two plus passing touch downs just twice since Jonathan Gannon became head coach. Jacobi Priset has done it in three of three starts this year.

You know what that makes him? It makes him Fraud. Fraud.

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