Transcript of "RE-RELEASE: Selena Gomez"

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Hey, Will. Hi. Hello there. Hey, Sean. We got some real sweaty pits today. I know. Are you concerned about anything? Are you just nervous? I am nervous.

I just took a lie detector. Oh, wow.

And what was the result?

I'm a liar. Anyway, this episode is going to be great.

Yeah, We're going to work out some truth.

Yeah, it's an all new SmartList. Smart.

Lies. Smart. Lies.

Hot Mike. Hot Mike's.

Hi, Hot Mike's.

Hey, hi. Hot Mike's.

I sent his pics of all your hot Mikes. Post them on our page. We'd love to take a look at all your hot Mike's.

Look at it. He's so tired. He still got it. So tired. Still got it.

Sean, you had a hot Bob once, didn't you?

I had a hot totty, hot Bob and a hot Mike.

You ever had a hot bob haircut? Yeah, you did on the... What you might call it? Stooge's film.

I had that shelf haircut in the '80s where you cut it from the back.Of course. Start in the back.

Did you really? Yeah. That sounds very Deepesh mode.

It's T-D-M, total I had long and then it's short in the back.

You had it covering one of your eyes?

Yeah, just like coming up.

Archie's got that, right? Your eldest son there, listener. He's got a little bit of a what's that? Looking through his hair.

Now it's long all around.

What's that? That's a what's that haircut? What's that?

I can't hear you because my hair is blocking my eyes, not my ears.

Richard Ehrlich. The last thing he says to himself before he leaves. What's that?

Yeah, our buddy. Richard, I love him. The most incredible real estate broker in the world. He is so good. If you're looking to buy a home in Los Angeles area.

Especially in the west side of Los Angeles area.

Tricky dicky, Ricky Ehrlich.

Richard Ehrlich is your guy.

He's amazing.

He's an O-G super fan of smart looks. Yes.

Hello to Richard, if you're listening. I'm in your turn. Richard's got a... I may have bored you with this before. He's got a mirror face like we all do, but he's got a trigger sentence that That launches that mirror face. Everyone's got a face that they use. What's the mirror thing? Well, when you look in the mirror, when you want to look your best, like one last look to go out, you maybe tighten up the eyes. You maybe turn your head a little bit.

The Fonds had A, right?

Exactly. What Richard does to prompt the mirror look he's looking for is he pretends that he is asking someone for directions. He's pulled up in his car next to someone walking their dog, maybe, and he has some directions, and they give him the directions. He looks forward over a steering wheel, and then he figures, Well, maybe I didn't hear it correctly. Then he'll turn to his left to the person, and he'll go, It's where? It's where. The combination of the turn and the question Then we'll tighten up the eyes just enough and give him just enough disdain to look sexy. It's where?

Yeah, that's a good red carpet.

Sexy disdain. That's the new one, right? Yeah.

He never looks hotter than when he says it's wear.

Which is so crazy because he's such a nice guy.

He's a nice guy and he's nice looking. I know he is. But he's not good with directions. Sean, good morning. Good morning to you. What have you done so far today, aside from putting on some smartless swag, I There's a body there on your body. I know he's always wearing smartless shit, Will. We're televising this and he's helping move merchandise.

I wear it because I really like it. I sleep in it.

He sleeps in it. Sean, what was the sleep I did my schedule last night because you have a weird, you wake up in the night and then you go back to bed early in the morning.

I go to bed at about midnight. I get up at about 3:00 AM. I stay up until about 6:00 or 7:00. Then I fall back to sleep for a couple of hours and I'm good to go. Then I need like a 10-minute Then I'm good to go.

Total chaos, and then I'm good to go.

It is total chaos. I'll send an email at 3:00 or 4:00 in the morning. I know.

Oh, I know.

Don't start doing Will.

By the way, I love the way your impression of me just has the dumbest look on your face.

You know what we've done here, Sean, though? We've boosted up young Willy. Willy started this. See, he started real low. Started the pod a little bit down, a little bit out of Sports, and then there's just a little bit of love. Now the wings are flapping. All right, tighten up, guests. Here we come. Today, we have a guest who's a giant in many categories. She's a titan in music, acting Acting, producing, philanthropy, business, and social media. If you wanted to describe a person who's uniquely suited to soar in today's media and cultural systems, you would simply say her name. She's a Grammy, Emmy, SAG, Golden Globe, and Critics Choice nominated musician, actress, and producer. Her music has amassed 34 billion streams globally. She's got a movie coming out, a TV show that's already on, and a company that exceeds 300 million in sales Oh, my God. When she's not running those things, she's keeping up with her 428 million followers on Instagram. What else needs to be said, guys? Please welcome the lazy, unaccomplished, unmotivated, and perpetually failing, Ms. Selena Gomez. Wow. Oh, boy.

I love the unmotivated.

Unmotivated, perpetually failing.

It was so hard not to laugh. It was so hard.

Oh, my gosh. Selena, hello.

Hi, guys. I'm so I'm happy to be here.

I'm so happy you're here. This is so cool. This is a very nice thing you're doing for us and our listeners.

Oh, no. This is more my thing. I'm so happy.

It's pretty cool of you.

If we didn't know, it looks like you were lying in bed in sheets.

We have an A screenshot.

Yes. Well, that is my beautiful background that I made for you guys because I figured that would be better than- You're keeping it real.

Listeners, she's got just a sheet draped over just a bunch of dead bodies behind you. Yeah, perhaps. You know what it is? Good work.

Thanks.

Nice segue in the murder's.

Oh, yeah. Well, we're going to get to that. We're going to get to that. Selena, where do we find you this morning? Are you in Los Angeles?

I am. I am home right now, and I just had my coffee, and yeah.

What time do you usually get up every morning? I'm a 6:30 guy.

I'm about 7:00, 7:30.

Are there animals to feed?

Yes, I have two dogs. You do?

What kind?

They're little multi-poos. They're pretty annoying, but cute.

Two the same. Is that because your body gets you up at seven or are you just like- No, my body does.

I don't know. For some reason, maybe the show or something, it's just embedded in me that I'm automatically up, and then I feel like a piece of shit if I wake up at 10. Even though those are nice.

What is that about the body that'll just wake you up at the same time every single day?

Circadia rhythm.

Marveling at the body. Look at this.

Then if you just point Then if you point your eyes at something, it tells your brain what you're seeing. It's just a miracle.

You're like a one-man Spielberg movie. Just the wonderment of discovery.

Guys, if you put one foot in front of another, you'll just end up moving forward. That's incredible. All right, so, Salia, with these two dogs, they're multi-poos? Yes. That's a combo, right? That's a mix?

Yes, they're very cute.

Their brother and sister?

No, they I got them at two different times, but they definitely don't act like brother and sister.

No.

Rescues purebreds. We can cut that if you want.

No, I actually, not afraid to say, during COVID, I was very scared and lonely, and I found one on Craigslist because the mom was like, We have babies and we don't know what to do. They were like, We don't know what to do. Our dog had puppies. So I was like, I'll take one.

Clear out for a joke. Go ahead, Will.

No, no, no.

No, it actually was really sketchy, though. They drove in from Vegas and rolled the window halfway down and then passed me the dog and wanted the cash. I was like, All right.

My mom is that. I did have a bad experience once. Here we come, gang. Because this guy posted on Craigslist that he said, For a hundred bucks, you want to come out and check out these puppies? Let me say, when I got to his house, it was not dogs.

A dog.

It was not dogs. Come check out these puppies for $100. Great.

Thank you, Will. Thank you. You rest again. All right. Will's how you got- You did a literal spit-tape. In your own mouth. We're a little slappy this morning.

We are super slappy.

Super slappy. Selena, isn't it better to get this over with than an afternoon?

No, I actually don't mind this. This is a great way to start my day. You guys are making me laugh.

Well, keep your knees bent. It's We're not over yet. We'll let you revisit that at the end to see if you still love it. Okay. All right, now, Selena, you're incredibly accomplished. You started very young. I want to know, so you started with acting, yes, because mom was an actor and got you interested in that?

Yeah, she actually never pressured me or said that's what I should do. She just did a lot of theater growing up, so she never I really did anything television-wise. I was seven when I got my first job because I was an only child, super dramatic, and I was like, I'm so capable of this. That's all it takes. I thought it worked, and I've just been working ever since, and I feel really lucky. Was this Barney? That was Barney, the purple- That's crazy.

You were in Barney?

Started with Barney. Yes. That's amazing. That's a pretty rest.

The guy who played Barney, he was pretty hot.

Was he?

Was Yeah, he was hot. He had to be fit and cute because he's wearing this. Sure. Well, he doesn't have to be cute, but he was. No way. Hot Barney. Hot Barney.

This is changing everything. That's a new doc.

He was a plushy, yeah. Yeah.

I'm sorry, Sean. What was That's quick for Tracy, really quick.

Just break it down.

Does Tracy need to know this? Does she want to know what a plushy is?

Plushy is like a fetish where people dress up in costumes and stuff, right?

I heard you guess. What do you mean right? You don't need to say right question mark to us.

We're going to Something or something. That is correct, Sean.

All right, so we're with Barney, and we're having fun on that. Then from there-How did that happen?

How did Barney happen? I really want to know.

It was like a little thing, but I was in line with 1,400 people on a hot Texas day, and my mom was like, Are you sure you want to do this? I was like, Yeah. I was like, I'm fine.

Because you knew what TV was and you thought it'd be cool to be on TV?

Yeah. My mom wasn't very intense about what I could to watch. I would stay up and watch Friends with Her and Will and Grace. That was what I grew up with.

Barney and Will and Grace?

Barney and Will and Grace. For the longest time, by the way, on my bio on Instagram, says, I love Will & Grace.

No way.

That's so sweet. Thank you, honey. For a solid year. Then everyone was like, Can you maybe change that? I was like, That's very sweet.

Did you ever see the episode where Will was in a dance off with Sean? No, she did. With Janet Jackson. With Janet Jackson?

You did?

I It was a backup. I played a backup dancer.

That's right. Then Karen got mad because she fell for you. Yes, I remember.

Oh, my God. You really are a fan. Wait, Will, I remember you snapping those moves.

I think I was there that night, right? You were there that night. You really know how to finish a move.

Remember how we talked about it before?

Hard points.

But we were so tired, and Jimmy's like, Okay, let's do it again. I looked at Sean, I'm like, Why can't I do it again? What are you doing? That's it. But, Celina, do you know, just as a Willa Grace superfan, there's a podcast that Sean does called just Jack and Will that he does with Eric McCorman.

No, I do know. I actually do know. I remember my friend sent me the link because she knew that I was obsessed and I had no idea. No way.

Sean, did you know that Celina Gomez was such a huge Willa Are you a Grace fan?

I did because I'm really good friends with Marty Short. Then we chatted on the phone. Me and Selena chatted on the phone a year ago or something, and you were like, Oh, my God. I was like, Oh, my God. I'm a big fan of yours. I know.

I got a big fan of yours. I know. I'm I got a big fan of yours. Then I got, Oh, my God.

She was like, Shut up.

No. That's Likewise, Lena. I'm a huge fan of yours.

That's a bit of a meet cute.

No, I'm very excited. I grew up with you. Likewise.

Me, too. I grew up with you. Now… 53.

53 years. All right. We're galloping along with acting. We've got the Barney under our belts. We move into Waverly Place.

Yes, my Disney show. Yes.

And a few other jobs here, in and there, and things are really moving. And…cooking. And cooking. Then there's a cooking show later. We're going to get to that. But when did music start to tap you on the shoulder and say, Hey, come this way?

Well, I think that Disney is safe to say they're a machine, and they I've, in a way, not forcefully required that I know how to sing so I could sing the theme song. They know how to package someone and make it a whole triple threat thing.

This was happening during Waverly?

Yeah. So they asked me to do the theme song, and I had fun with that. And then they were like, Would you like to do an album? And I thought it would be fun. And I thought more than anything, it would be a hobby that I really enjoyed. And then-And how old are you at this point? I wanted to be a serious actress. I was 15. And I wanted to be an actress. I'd never really intended on being a singer full-time, but apparently that hobby turned into something else.

Yeah, you're doing all right. Now, did you have any idea that you could sing before you tried it?

Yeah. Well, I was on Barney, and I do, I love you.

You love me. Well, that's not very challenging.

It warmed up my vocals. Okay.

All right.

There you go. Then because of that, did you take singing lessons and developed your instrument, as they say?

I did. I don't think I'm the best singer, but I think I know how to tell stories. I love being able to make songs that... I I always get people coming up to me saying, I had no idea it was you that was singing that song, and that makes it feel nice. It makes to me that I feel like it's just about the song then.

Wizards of Waverly Place was a It was a gigantic hit show.

Yeah, I miss it.

I want to say my sister wrote on that for a second. Really? She was a writer on that, maybe. I might not be remembering.

But it was a blast. I will say, yes, that's why I love sitcom.

Would you say you have a good memory, Jason?

No, not really. Okay. Wayne, we're going to get right back to you. But Selena, I want to... It's Will, actually. What is it?

It's Will.

Thank you, Scott. That guy's the bits. I love the way it looks.

I love it.

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All right, so then you know that you can sing a little bit and the music starts to take off. I guess what I'm asking is, at what point was the acting and the music at the same level, and you thought, Do I have to pick or should I try to keep both these things going at the same speed?

I started having a lot of fun with music, and then touring was really fun. But I was doing my TV show at the same time, Wizards, and I just found it really fun. So I just kept going. But the older I get, the more I'm like, I would like to find something to just settle on.

Yeah. Well, it's exhausting, right? I mean, that sounds like super... That's so hard. I just think about the energy. This is such an.

Oh, my God. I went to a mental institute and canceled one of my doors. Really?

Becausebecause of too much work.

It was so exhausting.

Yeah, it just got to me because I love working and it distracts me from bad things, and I like that. So I just like working.

I was just saying that this morning. By the way, it reminds me my three-year-old Denny, he calls Lizards because he can't see El. He calls him Wizards. He's always like, there's a lizard in the backyard. I'm like, God, I hope he's right. I really hope there's a lizard in the backyard.

Because I want to talk to him.

But wait. But Selena, you're saying that in a perfect world, you would pick either one or the other going forward?

Well, I do feel like I have one more album in me, but I would probably choose acting.

You would? Yes. God Damn, you're so great at music, though. Well, thanks.

Here's the good news. You don't have to pick.

Don't have to pick. You're right. But I am going to want to chill because I'm tired.

But yeah, I mean, reading through, I can tell you we've had some very accomplished people on this show. Thank you, listeners, for making it a place where accomplished people want to come. I have never read so much information about a guest than I have about you. I mean, the things you have done in your... I mean, you're just barely 30, aren't you? Thirty-one. It's just so admirable what you've done. It's mind-blowing. In philanthropy and in global charities and being in what, a UNICEF ambassador?

I was a UNICEF ambassador, and now I have my own foundation.

It's just stunning. We haven't even gotten to Rare Beauty, this beauty company, the makeup company. What do you call Rare Beauty. Yeah, but I mean, what would you describe it as, a beauty company?

Yeah, I would say cosmetics. It's been really fun, but we're actually starting to get into skin now. I know this is all girly stuff, but I'm excited.

What are you talking about? I'm wearing makeup right now.

Yeah, exactly.

I know. But we're going into skin now. It's about three years old, and it's honestly been the biggest gift because I launched it during COVID, and it just took off, and I couldn't be more thankful.

Did you launch it during COVID because you had time to finally... Because you weren't on tour and you weren't shooting, you're like, Now I have time to dedicate to this? Or it came up, or was it something you always It sucked.

I was supposed to release it a month right into COVID. So I had done all the promotion and everything. It's about to come out, and then we figured, All right, we'll just try online. And I think makeup became really big during COVID because people would do the videos and they would create looks. It just took off. And I'm always confused and just grateful because I've never been the type of person that I don't want to be or need to be the number one anything. And I think that's what my mom has instilled in me because I don't feel like anything's a competition. So I feel like there's room for everyone. For everybody, yeah. I'm really proud.

Do you When you started Barney at seven and then Wizards and then all that, do you think that your work ethic and your drive and your ambition was instilled in you or would have happened in any way?

Oh, I don't know. I probably would have been a I can't mess if I wasn't doing this. I already am. But I don't know.

We are all hot. Obviously, tell us how.

I've been to four treatment centers.

Just because of depression, anxiety, right?

Yeah, Yeah, and I'm bipolar as well.

Yeah.

Well, you've- Carry on top.

I would say you've got an incredible dynamic head on your shoulders that takes a lot of management and analysis, and it sounds like you're doing a pretty freaking good job. Well, thank you.

No problem. No kidding. Thank you. I don't know. Disney was like boot camp. They were definitely-You know who doesn't have problems?

You know who doesn't have problems, Lena? Dummies. I mean, that's where you get thatFolishful ignorance. That's where it comes from. You need to be really smart to be complicated.

Yeah. So good for you. I don't know.

I can be a little bit-Yeah, I think you're doing great.

It's not getting in your way of your accomplishments. You and I have talked a few Sometimes you're incredibly nice. So your personal success is fantastic as well as opposed to your business success. So whatever you're doing, keep going. I appreciate it.

Are you super tight? So your mom, as you said, your mom is or was an actress, and that paved the way for you to get into it and take it seriously. You mentioned you're an only child. Imagine you're still pretty close with your folks. Yes. When you started to make that transition into becoming a star at a really young age, what was that dynamic like with your folks? How much did you rely on them to be there? How has that relationship changed as you've gotten older?

I think when I was younger, My mom was my mom. I was under 18, so I was getting invited to these events and stuff. My mom, from a very early age, was like, you're going to walk the carpet. Maybe we'll stay for five minutes, but then adult time is probably going to happen. It was like the vanity Fair parties and all that stuff. She was always very protective of me, but it never really felt like it was suffocating. She would always say the same thing to me. She said, the moment you stop having fun, stop. It's okay. You don't need to just kill yourself over something if you're not happy.

Because the hours of... People don't understand that the hours and hours and hours of work that it takes to do a TV show, a tour, whatever it is, or a movie. It's just for a kid.

It's hard enough to be a kid. I just think about my own kids and being young teenagers, my older boys, and I'm just thinking about.

Then the younger ones with the speech problems.

I was looking for Wizards. It It's like the idea of them. Like, Sean, we were over there watching the movie the other night with Archie. Can you imagine Archie, he's 15, being on the road and working all the time? I think like, no, he wouldn't be able to...

He wouldn't be happy. It was what Selena was saying. He wouldn't be happy.

It's tough, right?

It was tough. No, it is. The transition, honestly, happened around 25, where I didn't feel like I had to impress my parents more so. But my mom was also really cool because right after Disney, she put me in a movie called Spring Breakers. She found that movie, and it's very racy. Yeah, very. But it was fun.

Yeah. I'm sure your mom was not strategic with grabbing that, nor were you. But I'm sure that there was some thought put into it where this would broaden the public's idea about that which you can do and that which fitting of when they think about you, she can do this, she can do that. Or was it just a part of like, Well, this is a little bit closer to who she's starting to become, not somebody who's- My mom was a huge harmony crew fan, and she heard there was a script out, and so she was interested in it.

The character I play isn't as racy, so I was 19 when I did it, and she just came up to me and she was, This will make no sense, and you're You're probably going to think I'm crazy, but just read this. I read it, and I don't know. I gravitated towards the character, and then I met Harmony, and I was like, Oh, game over. He's just really cool.

How did your mom have the sense to know good material from bad material or the right material from the run.

She's really great at that stuff. She found the book 13 Reasons Why, which we turned into a TV show. She randomly was at a bookstore, and she was a young adult and found that, and we developed it. She just has really nice taste. And instincts, clearly. Yeah, she's really great. I like to ask her advice on things.

That's great. That's awesome. I love that you guys are so close. Yes. We can cut this part, too, but I am fascinated and thankful for how outspoken you are about mental health because I have somebody very close to me who I've had to deal with it, and not deal with it, but just help with it. I was happy to help with it. But do you ever- Will, you say thank you to him.

You've never publicly thanked him well.

No, I was going to say the same thing. All jokes aside, Jason, you dick. I was going to say... Oh, no, JK. I was going to say, I like the way that you're so open and frank about that, about mental health. I think that it's something that people, luckily, talk about more and more. But I think it's really refreshing to hear you talk about it in a way that's very just matter of fact. I think it's really Yeah, it's great. I don't know. It shows real maturity, and it shows... I think it's very brave, and I think it helps so many people the way that you talk, honestly, in that way. It really did. It struck me. I think it's really remarkable.

It is. It's great because my mom, I died of Alzheimer's a long time ago. I forget when. And because I... This interview is over. Because it was so painful. Because it was so painful, me and my sister and my family, there's a point where you have to start making it funny because you've cried too much about it. Then you cut it with humor. I have the funiest Alzheimer's stories ever because I lived through it and it was so tragic that my mom... We can cut I was, too. But my mom would go to the bathroom. She'd go number two in the toilet, and I'd walk in there. I go, Mom, you have to flush the toilet. She goes, I don't know who did that. I don't know who's that is. They came in here when I was here. They went to the bathroom.

No, we cannot prove that that's mine.

She had a hole in the air. I cannot prove that that's mine. No way. We would laugh because it was past the point. My question is, have you me dealing with somebody with me currently?

Have I taken a shit and forgotten?

No.

Have you ever... No, have you ever... I've ever just diffused humor into the whole situation?

Definitely. I also have a few friends that are in comedy and writers, and it's just fun. Now me and my family are in a place where we can do that. I don't mind saying the things that I'm walking through, and they can be fun and they can be messy, but I've always just- That you take the power back. Yeah, just knowing more, I feel better.

It gives so many people, myself included, a little bit more comfort in the reality that I'm not... I'm broken upstairs. We all are. There are as many mental variables in all of us as there are physical ones. You can see the physical ones. Someone's taller, someone's shorter, someone's thicker, someone's thinner, someone's got bigger feet, smaller feet. There are equal number of variables in the brain The fact that we've got medicine, therapeutics, an environment that is tolerant of all of those variables nowadays, as opposed to back when our parents were our age.

Jason, on top of It's a community. The idea that you're talking about it sheds the light and says, you're not alone. There's somebody else, and somebody else can relate to that and identify with it. Certainly, I know from my own life, and somebody else says, I have this, and they go, oh. They talk about their experience, and I go, oh, you have this, too. And then we can talk about it in a way, and that really breaks it wide open.

Definitely. It connects you as well. I mean, that's why I released my documentary. It's all based on mental health.

Which was incredible.

Thank you so much. I I haven't seen it. I'm so... Forgive me.

I'm going to watch it. Don't worry.

It's really sad. No, pause, we're going to watch it. No, I'm putting it on here.

But it ends well. I think that's why I did the documentary. I was terrified before it came out, and I had already signed the contract, and I was like, damn, I can't go back. But that was a really big moment for me. Then I had people coming up to me not saying, Oh, my God, can I have a picture? They would say, I've dealt with depression or I've done this. Then I end up having a connection with people. Yeah, I love that. Sometimes with all my health stuff, I've had a kidney transplant, I have high blood pressure. Gosh, I have mental health, and I don't even know. I'm sure I have other problems that I'm not aware of. I love talking about all that. But you can think about a situation and say, why me? Why me? And instead, it's given me the gift to say, oh, I know why it's me. I'm there for those people that are going through what I I went through. And I can say, I hear you and I see you, not just be in and say, My life's perfect, but I'm sorry. It's like, Well, I can be honest with you.

I'm a big believer that the person upstairs or whomever's upstairs for anybody doesn't give you anything more than what you can handle. Yes. The fact that you've been given all of these gifts, challenges, and that you're able to go through them so successfully successfully in a public space such that you can give encouragement and support to others is like, I mean, talk about using your years right. We've talked about it in the show before about when you get to the end, we're all going to look back and hope that we used our time correctly. I mean, the first 30 years of your life have been incredibly accomplished.

It's like 20 lives.

Spiritually, mentally, certainly.

I guess the question really is Now what?

You're fixing your brain. You're fixing the world.

I don't know. I think I gravitate towards things I connect to, and I'm all about authenticity. I can't really force myself to be anything other than who I am, and it's just luckily worked.

I bet your ability to recognize and attract those who are equally authentic is really keen to. I was just thinking when you're We're talking about the documentary, thinking about Ali Kashishian and his sister, Aline, who we both work with. People like that, you probably have a great team around you, great friends around you, like all of us as we get older, you have less and less friends, but that's usually by choice. Talk to us about your ability to pick up on people's uniqueness and authenticity or lack thereof. Is that something you always had or has it just gotten sharper?

Maybe it has gotten sharper, but ever since I was younger, I like to think I had good discernment with people. And I could just sense when I felt that it was being forced or that there was something they were wanting or whatever. I just could feel that in a lot of people. And I mean, obviously, I put some of those people in my life when I was younger, and then I later realized. But most of my friends, like I said, they're I mean, they can go from being a writer to one of my friends as a realtor. So I- Is that Richard Ehrlich?

It's not Richard Ehrlich, is it? No. Yeah. Well, it's having people skills, right? And I wonder if you're like me, that's part of what has always attracted me to being an actor is because I'm just fascinated with people, and I really enjoy reading people and seeing, is this person to match for me or not. Definitely. I just wonder what that is.

Also, it's just staying curious, right? The moment you stop being curious, then like Jason just said, you become one of those dummies.

Yeah, I know. I love life and I love people, and I find it really fun.

Which do you find is more cathartic for you, more a lane to explore and enjoy parts of you? Is it with playing different characters or or being a songwriter?

I think it's a little bit of both. I wrote this ballad called Lose You to Love Me, and that was probably the most personal song I'd ever released about something that was on everyone's mind for some reason. Then in acting, I feel like I have these moments in my life that have happened and I'm able to use that, and it actually feels great. It feels like after a good cry or something. It's like a good feeling.

Is there something that you... I mean, this is going to be one of the dumbest questions you've ever gotten. Is there something with every single thing that you've done where you're just like, You know what? I've never done. I need to do that before. Oh, yeah.

I don't think I've even began in a lot of areas. Not necessarily cosmetics and stuff, but like I've said many times with you guys, I think acting. I don't think I've been able to even touch the surface of what I know that I'm capable of doing I'm very selective or else I'd be in all of the movies that I get offered. I just fight for my roles and I'm always auditioning, so I like to earn it.

Yeah, good. That's great.

We'll be right back.

Now, back to the show.

Something I've really gotten more and more passionate about is not playing characters as much as just I'm playing somebody that doesn't force me to do a lot of acting and play a character. I like to be the audience. A lot of that comes from my desire to try to be as not full of shit as possible in my life and not be fake and phony and pretending to be other people. I really like trying to be as authentic as I can. Do you have a similar battle when you think about acting? Because you're so good about being really you and being in your skin and being honest. Does that run counter to the whole thing that we try to do as actors?

Kind of. But I just finished this movie, this Jacques Gardeillard film, and it's all in Spanish, and it's a musical, and it was one of the most challenging things that I'd done. That's cool. But it's really-What's it called? Emilia Perez. I think that will come out next year.

But it's so good if you just said none of your business.

I know. None of your business. I'm excited for that because, for example, there's the scene where I'm being left. I'm not giving anything away. I remember I channeled the moment when I had to go to rehab for the first time and leaving. I remember I told my co-star that's what I was feeling in the moment, and I just felt like it was getting that out when I remembered that first moment and being terrified. That's cool. It felt really cathartic.

Speaking of that, have you ever wanted to go to, you know what I'm going to ask, go to the Broadway or do live theater? Maybe you have.

I haven't. I think I would like to. I'm not sure I'm there yet because I think I'd still be a little nervous.

Oh, really? After touring and stuff, you've already been a stage performer.

No, but it's different because I love when I'm doing my concert because it's like, Oh, these are my peeps. You feel comfortable.

You feel safer. Yeah, for sure.

Will you talk more about that, About battling because I get very nervous when I have to speak publicly. Like, I can't even give a toast. Really?

Yeah, he goes white.

That's true. Yeah. But I have an enormous amount of confidence when it comes to other things that are going to be made for the public.

Like being in front of a camera.

Right. For millions of people, as opposed to 10 people at a dinner table. I don't understand that about myself, the difference between having a lot of confidence or zero confidence that are similar things.

Because, Jay, you're so well-spoken in life, just clearly in life. That's why it blows my mind that anytime we're at a dinner party or two or three years ago, we are at your birthday dinner party at Richard's house. I said, Let's go around the room and say how grateful, how much we love Jason, and I'll start. I got up and I gave this little speech, and it got to Jay. You were like, I'm out. I don't want any part of this.

I was Yeah.

How do you manage that? What is that switch that flicks for you when you can stand up in front of 100,000 people and give a concert or do a movie or a television show that's going to be for millions of people versus maybe going out on a date for the first time or doing an interview for a magazine or whatever might give you anxiety. Do you know what that is, that different Because I'm still trying to figure it out with myself.

I think when I was younger, I had a very public life, and it wasn't fair in a lot of ways. That I got to the point so much so that I was like, if I don't talk about what's going on, everyone's going to continue to narrate my life and people are just going to buy it, and I need people to hear from me. I genuinely stopped caring. I I don't care. I would be happy to stand up and speak very highly of someone. I'd be happy to do it. Even if I mess up, I'm like, All right, well, that sucked, but I tried. It's fine. I don't know if I've done it for too long that I just have lost a little bit of that fear, but I still get the butterfly feeling. Maybe I just got used to it, and then I'm like, Well, people are going to like it or not.

Yeah. I have a friend of mine Maria Shriver. I've known her for years and decades. Whenever I would have dinner at her house, she's the one who forced me to get up and talk like that. I was littered, Sorry. I was riddled with fear about it. But she forced me to do it. She's like, We're going to go around and stand up and speak how you feel. I was like, Pass. I'm going to the next person.

Were you so nervous because you had just littered? Is that what it was? I'm having It's been a tough time following what happened.

But now that you're saying it, I think for me, it's like I'm afraid of being accused or judged as either being full of shit or being stuck up. I had a real complex about being conceited and stuck up when I was in middle school. Like, sixth and seventh grade was really hard for me in school because people, Oh, here comes that guy on TV. He's stuck up. I wasn't I was shy about being confident because people would think I was stuck up. Then I tried to seem not confident, and then maybe that part of me took hold.

What's crazy about that, though, is, think about it, that's inauthentic.

Yeah, exactly.

If you think about it, you felt victim of the very thing that you were trying to prevent. I mean that honestly. When you're thinking about it that much, you put a space between you and people you're trying to connect with, Jay. I really mean it. If you can break that down and react in real-time, then it will never be inauthentic. But the second you start thinking about you're trying to curate what other people think of you, that's inauthentic.

It makes me so nervous because I'm having to manage two things at the very same time. Because you're taking care of their feelings before yours.

You're never going to be able to... I remember somebody saying, You can't tell everybody how to treat you or how to I look at you. There's nothing you can do about the way people think about you. All you can do is take it.

None of your business.

Well, yeah, there's that. Also, you'll never get to it.

Selena, one second.

Yeah, that's fine. No, it's okay. I'm enjoying this. I like this conversation.

But Really, just really quick, it's the same thing that I've carried around for so long being gay is like, I've constantly my entire life. What? I just came out. In my entire life, I spent taking care of other people's feelings and putting mine second. Then you have to reach a point where Selena is saying, we're like, I can't. I'm exhausted.

But why did you do that for being gay? With regards to you being gay? Is that what you mean?

Yeah. If I enter a room, even today, I still have a little bit left over, but for the most part, I don't care. It's like I have to check. I'm so used to it's in my blood now to check how people think about me entering a room. Are they thinking about my being gay or not? Really?

Oh, yeah. I used to do this when I younger. I remember I was doing an interview and I sat down and there was probably 14 people behind the camera. And I think I was maybe 21. And I started to sweat and I ran away and I started crying because this is what I was thinking. I was like, these people probably think I sound stupid. They're going to go home and tell their partners or friends about how much of an idiot I am. I feel like a horrible interviewer. It used to kill me. Really? Yes.

It would kill me. A panic attack. I've had that, and I couldn't... I was stuck there. It just becomes exponentially more horrific and terrifying because now you're convinced now they can see that I'm having a panic attack. Now it gets even worse. It's like, oh, yeah, yeah.

You have that, too, huh?

I still fall back into it, but here and there. But for the most part, I'm like, Fuck you out.

I really mean this. I'm sure there'll be a lot of listeners like, shut the fuck up. Really, this is new to me. I don't understand it in that way. Everybody's wired differently. It's a form of paranoia. When I got this, when I got this, and It was so, obviously-He's holding up an award.just.

Some just plain white faceless body.

I thought, fucking, thank you to everybody.

But I feel like the older I get, the closer I get to our favorite term, sexy indifference, or rather, better said, a healthy indifference, where you do care what people think, but you're not obsessed by it and you're not pulled around by it.

I will challenge you on that because we're doing it right now today. That is also put on. It's not real, because if you have to think about the sexy indifference, then it's not organic.

I'm trying to get to that place of honest and healthy indifference where it's just right-sized, where you do care about people. You don't want to be rude. You want to be sensitive to people.

You just don't want to seem desperate.

The freedom is when you don't even have to recognize that you do have indifference, that you're just living. That's the freedom. Otherwise, you're shackled by the idea of it. It still lives there as an idea.

But it's also what we do for a living, right? It's part of our job to be aware of what people think and manipulate that. We're professional liars. It was a little bit of a headscrew for me, obviously still is, when I was a kid, when you're trying to figure out who you are and who you're becoming, you're training yourself how to fake to be somebody else. It's a little bit of a blender.

That's so interesting. It's very weird. Do you still think about that, Selena?

Absolutely. I remember I was talking about this with someone, and there was a study that said, the moment you get famous at a certain age, you end up stuck in that area for a while because it's done. Emotionally. Yes, because it stunts... You're dealing with things that no child should be dealing with and criticizing my body or something weird. It felt just It doesn't feel good.

You can't grow privately like most people do. Yeah.

I don't regret my life, but there's a huge part of me that's like, Yeah, I wonder what that would have been like to just be me for a second.

But I'm I'm assuming that you've got millions, literally millions of people that admire you more than any of us could probably imagine because of how brave you are with how honest you are. That is not going to go away. Thank God. You're a role model, whether you like it or not.

Until I run away from everything.

No, you're not going to go. Wherever you go, you're going to be there.

No, don't take away her out until you run away, if you want.

I run away.

But I now get it, though, Jay. I want to say, because you just mentioned that. I want to say that I now get it when I earlier flippantly when we first started talking about how many millions of followers you have, I now understand. I get it now. Your relationship with that number, with those numbers of people is tricky. I have a little bit more of an understanding. I really mean that. Maybe I'm a slow learner.

No, it's weird. It's such a bizarre thing. They give you way too much information. They'll tell you how many accounts you would have reached, and they'll tell you the percentages of women versus male or non-binary, whatever it is. It's like, I don't need this information. I just want to post a photo and let it be for my fans and move on.

They are definitely attracted to all the things that are very special about you and not to take away from any of that. But I think it is also very indicative of how common it is for people around the world to be not perfect. I think they really are are comforted by how you are so honest about how not perfect you are. I think that's just a real gift that you give to people. Thank you. I appreciate it. And myself included. I thank you for that. I cannot believe I believe we're already past an hour. This is literally the fastest interview. Are we? Yeah, I'm stunned.

We got an hour right now, but it is pretty crazy.

Yeah. It is. I'm like, guys, let's go have brunch. I want to let you go, but I know we have probably a couple of more questions. Sean, go.

Yes. No, I just want to know Only Murders. I love the show. I love you in it. I love Steven Marty. How did it come about? What was it like when you started?

Did you just love Murders? Was that how you got in?

To be honest, yes. I like very dark documentaries sometimes. I tend to lean into those, especially scary stuff mentally.

John Hoffman is one of my very close friends of mine.

I love him. But no, it actually happened because we'll Steve's original idea was that it was going to be three men. Then John Hoffmann suggested that they hired... Who created the show. Yes, who created the show. He said, I think it would be really cool if we added a younger character character, maybe a female. And Steve liked the idea. And I guess this was really a gift because they had me in mind. And I remember thinking, I'm like, okay, well, what does this mean. Then I had FaceTime with all of them, with Steve, Marty, and John, and producers. And I was like, oh, I just have to do this because simply the people are amazing. Then the success of it after- It's a good hang. Yeah. Then the success after was just such a surprise, and we just were happy to do it.

Only murders in the building. Never manslauters.

Never manslauters.

Never manslauters. Just murders.

Okay, I'm fine. I'm allowed to ask.

Yes, you are. That is in its fourth year or fifth year, coming up on the-We just got renewed for season four.

Season four. We may have to cut this, but I asked John, I was like, How many more seasons? He goes, Well, I Steve, and Steve said forever.

I know he does. My favorite thing about Steve, and he knows that I've said this before, but my favorite thing is Steve will be like, I got to get home. I got to get home. I got to go. I'm too old for this. Then I'll be like, Well, I go, Steve, how many seasons we do? He's like, Oh, I don't want to stop. We're going to keep going. I'm like, what? You got to get home. Exactly. But you need to be home. Sometimes I'll be like, I'll carry the load because I get- It is the greatest trio, but as has been said before, one of the oddest trios ever.

It's just so great. It's just so great.

It's just amazing.

It's awesome.

It's infectious.

It's awesome.

Yeah, it's great. Thank you. Well, Selena, this has been great. Thank you, honey, for being here. Yeah, of course. I like it so cool.

I just wanted to tell you, Jason, really quick. Yes, ma'am. I am going to send your wife, Amanda, and your girls some of my new collection from Rare Beauty. Oh, you sweet thing. And a whole little box because I would love to see what they thought.

They're enormous fans of yours, as is Amanda, my wife.

I want to send you that because this is going to be one of the biggest collections that I've released, and I'm beyond stoked for it. I know it's little things like that that make me happy because- But it's not a little thing.

It's really impressive what you've done with this. This company is potentially, if it's not already, bigger than anything you've done in music or in film or television or in social media. It's a weird- It's an enormous company, and you really should be proud of that.

But I think it's good products, and we also just try not to be everything else. I'm not huge on promoting crazy makeup. I love makeup, but I want my line to represent yourself and to have fun with it.

It seems very consistent with you and what you represent.

Well, might I say your skin is flawless.

Oh, my goodness. Well, thank you.

She takes off her glasses. She goes cross-side.

She did a Richard Eerlik. What is it?

Say, It's where? Say, He's a little bit confused. Then that kid, look at that. Beautiful.

Let her say, It's where.

Say it. Ready. No, it's where?

I swear.

Oh, my God. That's good. That's really good.

You look just like Richard Ehrlich. Great. Celina, you're the greatest. Thank you so much for doing this. This was a big, big get for us.

It's so awesome to finally meet you, too.

I am so happy, and hopefully I'll get to meet you all in person. I'm sure I'll run into you, Jason. I'm a big fan of all of you, and I've really been wanting to do this for a while. I'm sure you know Jason. This has been really great. Thank you.

Yeah. Thank you for doing it.

All right. Have a great, great rest of the day. You too. Thanks for talking with us. All right. Bye, guys. Bye, Selena. Thankthank you. You see, now, guys, there's a nice person. You guys have asked me multiple times. You say to me, you say, Jason, how can I become nice? How can I become nicer and be pleasant?

Have success, right? Isn't that your theory?

Have success and then you're allowed to be nice. But then after that, try to be-Remember that job?Not before.

Somebody is-Not before because then they're going to be accused you of wanting something.

Kind and as gentle, as loving as she is.

What is that? Well, It's holding up a fake award.

This is my dressing room. I don't know. It's just something that looks like an award.

It sounds it looks like an Oscar.

Yeah, she's really terrific.

What did you both...

Did you learn anything, you guys? I did.

I feel like I'm lazy.

Yeah, I think you're lazy. Well, A, lazy because she's just so... It seems like everything she does, she's successful at. Even mental health, she's successful at that.

Because she's not running from it. She's going right through it.

It's pretty She's really remarkable. She's such a talk about... We were talking authenticity was a central theme today's, and she's so authentic.

Yeah, she's like, I'm a superhero. She's like, she really doesn't... Like she said, she just does what she loves to do. Everybody's ask them to come or don't come?

It's funny. I was going to say she said that she didn't care, but it's almost like she... It's not that she doesn't care. It feels like what she cares about is just being herself and being honest about it.

She turned that care internal. She's taking care of number one, which for me always lets me be a better person to the people around me. Sometimes I over index in the selfishness, but I'm trying to get the right balance.

Yeah.

Sorry. No.

Still rolling. Let's get one more of those, Will. A little more convincing.

No, Jason. By the way, I held up on so many because it was so many things I wanted to throw in, and I didn't because it was just atrespect. It was so nice.

You've got some unused jokes you'd like to workshop real quick?

No, not really. I mean, no, no, no. There was one at the end, certainly, that I wanted to make. Yeah, let's hear it. Which you said, Don't worry, I'll carry the load, Steve. I was like, Sean, how many times? Okay.

Do you want to know- It's Steve, right? It's Steve, right? Yeah, it's Steve. Do you want to know, though, speaking about Archie, your son, one time outside. Here we go.

This is a buy.

No, no. This is outside. Once I had a lizard crawl up my pants. Did you really? Yeah.

Truly? A lizard? A lizard.

How hard did it get up before it pulled a quick 180 and said, No, thank you.

No. That's such a funny thing Wizard. You could use it for so many things.Oh.

You know what?Okay.

Part of my... What is it called?

The gay tray that Jason calls it? Oh, yeah. No, no, no. It wasn't-Yeah, no, the gay tray.

It's an Invisalign thing.

I didn't know you had it in today. Yeah.

I have it in every day, but I can whiten my teeth. But my dentist three days ago said, you can hear some teeth whitening stuff. You can put in the Invisalign trays, but you don't have to put them in the back where the bicuspids are.

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