Transcript of "Denis Villeneuve"

I wanted you guys to know, I hope you're rolling on this, you ready? Here we go. I want you guys to know that this morning, this is the most serious cold open.

Yes.

I've been in a rough place and this really, I feel like I've shared a lot in the last year, I've been a rough place, but I have been. A lot going on. And this saved me this morning. After a

few days

I love that. I'm

not saying you might not have made it you might not have made it to lunchtime.

No. I wouldn't made it. I'm not I wasn't gonna take my own life, but I I was in a pretty bad place. And knowing that I was coming here and then getting on and seeing you guys, this is just made by day. That's it.

Isn't that nice? And is

that why you took a little shower, a little self care, combed your hair, put on a nice top?

I wanted to look nice for you guys, you know. I wanted to show up here and be respectful of the process that, that I the 1 the thing I can count on is is you 2 ding dongs. Yeah. And then the other and then the other 3 ding dongs who we work with as well, Rob and Bennett and Michael. So

To South Town.

It's a late Thanksgiving's been a minute, but I wanna say thank you and I'm very grateful for you guys.

We love you and we thank you and you make argue.

Anytime you want.

And so let's try to make other people's days, and let's let's Let's

record it all and get it in all this.

Fresh episode of Smartless.

Less. Smart. Less.

Oh, speaking of medical conditions I

know.

I can't even. I can't

even. Wanna talk about it?

We can talk. I'm I'm an open book. I'll talk about anything.

Shawnee wakes up in the middle of the night with his with his heart thingy, for any for everybody other than Tracy, here the reminder is he's got an AFib situation, right, which necessitates the paddles at the emergency room every once in a while. Resuscitates. Insane. It's like if you had a car that would constantly just, like, have trouble getting started, It would eventually replace the battery.

So you're replacing me on Smartless? Well, no. Just

your heart.

No. We thought about it for 1 second. We never did it. On the list.

We didn't even do a

deep pump. We didn't do a deep dive.

So he wakes up in the middle of the night, and, his heart's not working correctly, or so he thinks. And so he doesn't wanna wake up Scotty, so he calls away more for himself

Sure.

And gets himself to the ER. And Scotty wakes up, later with a phone call from Sean from the ER saying Yeah. Hey, buddy. I'm here. I just wanna give you a heads up.

All good. So I

guess it's kind of nice that he doesn't wanna trouble Scotty and worry him and just

call him

from from Chibi. Not once. Twice

that night. Night.

I got cardioverted twice. So I went under, and then they Jimmy Jimmy Kimmel calls me Paddles, right, because of this. Yep. Mhmm. So Paddles got it twice that night, where my car just and, yeah, it's pretty scary.

You still made it out to dinner the following night. Yeah. You weren't in

the you weren't

in a great place that night.

No. It was a

little foggy. It was a little foggy.

Oh, yeah. Of course you were

More so than usual.

You've been you've been, you know, electrocuted twice. Yeah. Your your body had been you know?

I know.

That's a lot.

Are we are the way the nurse the nurse told me a while before I did it. She goes, you know, I had a big tough cop come in here once, and he said, I don't wanna be put under when you cardio when you do the paddles. You know? Clear. And, and the cop is like he's like, I don't want it.

I don't wanna be put on her. She's like, sir, no. Everybody is put on her. She's like, nope. Nope.

I don't want it. And she goes, I've never heard somebody scream so loud in my entire life.

The guy got with

clear. He was like

Why? Because it hurts? What? It's an electrical shock. Right?

Body goes it's like being tased.

Right. So wait. So you're not interested in being tased? Shontaze. Shontaze.

That's your new name. It's not panel. Shontaze.

Alright. That's enough. Did he

yeah. I mean, you got weren't you tased once at an Indigo Girls concert or something? What's the story on that? You had parked your you parked your Subaru with all the stickers coexist and all that stuff. The park, you were at

We used to stay in college for the Indigo Girls.

Bend, Oregon. Okay. Keep going. Sorry.

No. I said it's college, and we'd say, if you take the n and the o out of Indigo Girls, it says it says, I dig girls. Yeah. Thanks, everybody.

What a call.

Did now was this you you were this was at Harvard? What a call.

Hey, Sean. Just to close the loop, are are you on the are you on the the backside of of, figuring out this heart thing? Or do you

have I'm going today after this.

I just wanna get I wanna say this. All jokes aside, I, and we, I speak for Jason, love you very, very much.

Likewise.

And the idea of you not being fully well is very distressing to me, to be honest.

Well, thanks.

And I wanna make sure that you're okay. So are we doing is there anything else?

Today, I'm going to, like, a super specialist.

Okay.

But what does that mean? You're going up into the thigh again. Is it like, are we knocking you out again? Like, is this a major surgery?

It's not surgery. It's just it's like a 2 hour procedure.

So it's in and out. It's not a general. It's just that, the tower. It's not even 2 hours. It's an hour.

You're getting the twilight?

Propofol. Propofol.

Yeah. Oh. This this is what's driving all of this.

You're so

addicted to to anesthesia. It's pretty beautiful. Yeah. I know. What is you know, what you know what happened?

To mister Jackson. Right? Yeah. Well, I'm

not taking it to sleep.

Well, you know, slippery slope.

JB, you had it right when you got your your thing? What do I have? When we had our things, when we all had our things looked at.

What happened?

What what

would When it went up our butts.

Oh, you no. You mean a body scan? Looked at a body scan?

No. You're talking about a, a a colonoscopy. Right?

Yeah. Remember in Yeah.

That's just a twilight. Is that propofol?

That's prop that's propofol.

Now like the cop, I requested no anesthesia. You're propofol.

Come on. Keep it going.

Respectable guest. Yeah. Come here. Real respectable guest on deck. Okay.

Let's well, let's hear it. Here's the go to the intro, JB. This is great. Yeah. Hey, guys.

Fresh off the pages of Wikipedia comes his very special he always talks about his special intro that he does, and it turns out he looked at it. Again, it goes back to my that thing that I hate, which is people go, like, I did some research, and I'm, like, oh, do you have the Internet? I do too.

That's my wife's line. I don't I've never I never say I've done research or

done anything. I know you don't. I know you.

Man, today, we have simply put 1 of our finest filmmakers living in the world. Okay? His films have received 28 Academy Award nominations, taken home 9 of them, and grossed nearly $2,000,000,000.

Oh my god.

His films have captured the small and the nuanced human condition as well as the enormous scope and scale of sci fi's most complicated stories. Guys, he's our perfect guest. For Will, he's a Canadian. For me, he's a beast of a director. And Sean No way.

He's a titan in the sci fi world right now. Oh. Ladies and gentlemen, here he comes. Denis Oh.

No way.

You're hitting me.

Oh my god.

No way.

I think I have to interrupt your conversation.

I apologize for my question.

Learning a lot of dramatic things.

Please. 1 cigarette, 1 mistress,

1 I got you.

Coffee with my mistress. No. No. Denis, what an absolute honor.

Oh, my my great, pleasure to be with you this morning.

Wrote you an email, like, a dorky email, like, 3 or 4 months ago. I don't know if you got it. Yes. Hold on. What what

do you know him? No. I just It's just a fan email.

Yeah. I just wrote you an email. I was just like, oh my god.

I He got it, but no comment.

That's right.

What was it? Was it notes? Was it notes

on a lot? It was notes on arrival.

You did? I'm not sure I got that email. I'm sorry.

No. But, you know, arrival, I've seen I don't know how many times. I just think it's 1 of the best movies ever, ever.

I mean It's just incredible. Thank you, Sean.

Yeah. I

so much good work. My goodness.

Thank you.

That's it.

That's it. Yeah. That's the interview.

Thank you for joining us. Bye now.

Alright. I go back in the dark.

Bye. No. No. No.

Alright. Yeah.

But it was pretty dramatic because I don't don't know you, gentlemen. And and, it was a very intense conversation you were having about your common friend that that being referred to.

But my house You know? It's not

I feel the

Yeah. It's it's it's actually sounds more intense than it is. Like, a AFib AFib doesn't cause a heart attack. Untreated, it can cause a stroke, but AFib itself is not that serious, I'm told. We are not a medical podcast.

We are not giving any

I'm not a medical second opinion on all of this. It's it's it's just too common, these trips to the freaking I know. It's pretty crazy. Anyway, well, you know, we're all of that age. Denny, we're you're you're near us.

Right? We're all in our mid fifties, or close to it. The all this all this shit starts to starts to wobble a little bit. The nuts on the on on the wheels start to get a little loose. Right?

And and we also

We are we are we are right at that peak, and now we're starting slow.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

It starts to ache.

Let's let's think that we're maybe plateauing. Before we get to the downhill, Denny, let's think that just enjoy a little bit of that. Plateau. Yes. Yes.

Keep talking about this part.

But we talk about we we end up talking about a lot of this stuff because Jason says, because it's happening and also we're friends and and it's I don't know about you guys. It does seem like I I said to Sean the other day fart? No. Life is in session right now.

Yeah. Life

is in session. Yeah. It does feel like

in the

world, life is in session.

Yeah. Fart. Sure.

And and you have to I I've had a certain amount of not to get lately of of surrender to it and just like I you I can't fight it. I have to kinda go with the flow a little bit these days and I'm concerned about things with health and with family and and friends. Yeah.

I literally listed all the things Will's going through last night. He's like, oh, yeah. Wow. That's a funny fact.

Nothing's happening to me. Life is just happening. Yeah. And, so anyway, so, Denny, you're catching us in a moment where we're Yeah. But This is about as philosophical as we get.

Yeah.

Yeah. That's the The thing is that it it's good that, that Sean is is is, actually taking care of it and making a test. And then because if it the the the the bad thing is when you have a surprise that comes out of nowhere Oh, god. Yeah. That as a like, if I lost a friend of mine that was, like, 58, Jean Marc Valle, the director of Dyer's Buyers Club.

Oh, yes. Yeah. And and, just biggest surprise. He was a healthy guy. He just fell on the floor, bang.

And and, it's it's things that so it's good that, you, you're you're at least you have you know you are taking care of it. There's someone saying, so so it's gonna be good.

Yeah. You have it does and that gives you perspective. Right? You when you have that sort of when you get that, that contrast of when you see that happen, and these guys know I lost my friend, my dear friend Jeremy, last year quite suddenly as well. He wasn't even, I I guess he was had just turned 53, at the time.

And it was very sudden. And, and it really does, it really puts everything in perspective a little bit, you know. For me, it did. I don't know about you with losing your friend, but it it the perspective.

Absolutely. Absolutely. This is a big big shock, you know. The things that the doctor said is that what is shocking and what we don't accept is that, people actually have dates of preemption. I mean, the the there's a sometimes we are meant to be of a certain length, and sometimes it's some people are meant to live less long.

It's it's and it's shocking, but it's true. An expiration date. Yeah. Yeah. Exploration date.

I I was I was doing French, sorry. No.

Well, somebody somebody put it well

the other day to be they

said, life is a journey. Death is a destination. You know? And it's it's it's true because we're all going

there. True.

You know? It's true. And it's like, what do you do what what do you do with your time? Are we doing are we using our time correctly? We're at that age where we are sort of at you know, past the midway point where we're at that age where you start losing your parents, and mortality really comes into focus.

And have you used your time well to this point, and what are you gonna do with your remaining time? And, a

wonderful theme in all of Denny's work.

Yes. Exactly.

But it's it's a theme that is is is, is 1 of the main theme of arrival. And that's what the 1 of the thing that I loved about the short story. It was based on, the story of your life written by Ted Chiang. That is a little masterpiece, and it's about, yeah, leaving to, to the present time to make the best out of it and not to be afraid of living because of the fear of death. And that that I thought was a nice thing in this movie.

And in the in the short story story.

I I Yeah. First of all, I didn't I didn't know I didn't know it was based on a short story, Sean. You you knew that.

You have to read the short story. I will. The short story is a masterpiece. It's like 28 pages or something, written by Ted Stern, a very, a very, very strong sci fi writer. And it's like, it's a little gem.

Yeah.

I'm gonna look it up today. And I I also think just hearing you say that reminds me of, it's really brought into focus to to and it seems almost elementary, like, kind of so obvious. But you gotta tell the people you love that that you love them, and you've gotta make the most of those. It's not it's not about living the most of your moment. Like, I'm gonna go out and I'm gonna parachute today or whatever.

It's it's more that go and and spend time and tell the people you love that you love them and and be as loving as possible. Mhmm. And and I've really been

I think so too. You know, I I just saw this thing, Willie, everybody, that, the pastor was saying at a commemorate, what is it called? A speech at at a college, a commencement speech. Yeah. And, and he said, when you're he goes, I've seen thousands of people die.

I've been on the, you know, or 100 or or 1000, whatever he said, standing next to them on their deathbed. And he goes, not 1 person said in their last breath, bring me all my awards. I wanna see my awards 1 more time. Bring me bring me bring me my certificate from college. I just wanna hold it 1 more time.

And he said, what people ask for are the people that they love, like Will was just saying. And that's the only thing they don't say. Bring me all this all this stuff

I've made. So I love

that. All the achievements I've

I've made.

They sent me the people I love.

Yeah. Yeah. And that's it. Well, Danny, so oh, I imagine you get, access to some of the greatest writers' stories, ideas, scripts. Is there it must be hard to pick.

And is there something that, jumps out at you quickest when a project, comes before you? You know, if if it's if it's a story about mortality or or the human condition or or just just the human part of something? Is is there something that that you really like to make movies about sort of a a through line that exists and everything?

It's a good question because, I'd say through through the my, the movies I've made, it's I always have the weird impression. Sometimes that the movie are choosing me more than us. It's like the projects comes and there's something a connection that is sometimes difficult to explain that is very intimate with the project. But, but recently, I I've been more drawn towards, books that, I all books that have been with me since a long time, like the Dune books, the books that I read when I was a teenager, and it those books have deep roots in my, my mind and in my soul and my those books have been with me through through the years. And I know that, because I have a relationship of decades with these books, I know that it it it means something so deep that, I I, it it makes sense to spend years trying to adapt them.

I will have the same, I have the same relationship with the book that I I, I'm starting to work on, in the adaptation of Arthur c Clark rendezvous with drama, which is a space, a movie that takes place in space is a book that I've read when I was very young. Again, it's a book that stayed with me through the years. And,

when

you have roots like that, it's a but to answer to your questions, yeah, existentialist movie about the question about our our our, why are we here?

Yeah. I'm trying to say it. Yeah.

Right? I love that.

And then

is it is it but is it is it somewhat daunting to you know, especially with books that you that you love, that you've had as a part of you for so long, is it is it brutal to try to adapt those? Because, you know, most books are too long to fit inside of a 120 page script, and so you've gotta get rid of a lot of stuff. Now with Dune, fortunately, you were able to break it up into 2 parts. And, the second 1 was the second half of the book, right, as opposed to a sequel. So it's just you broke the book up into into 2 films, which is incredible.

The third 1

potentially 3. Right?

Well, the third coming up, right, is a is a is a brand new story? It is a is

a second book. That will be the adaptation of Dune Messiah, which is the second book. The the first movies were about that that first book, Dune. Right. It is, the first, artist I've I've, approached when when, I decided to make this adaptation was Hans Zimmer because I was just out of a of a movie with him, and I absolutely adore working with him on on Blade Runner.

He's amazing. Yeah. 2,049. And and and,

For Tracy, that's the composer Hans Zimmer.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and he,

Why did why did you choose the composer first?

Because, I knew that I will need of, the score in Dune will be essential, will be absolutely, crucial to the success of the movie to bring that kind of sacred quality that I wanted. And also because I it's like it's a it's a matter of context. I was working with Hans. I he asked me what will you do next? And we were talking about Dune, and I saw his face, change it because it's it's favorite book too.

And and we start to talk about it and and and the brainstorm about it, and Hans said to me that he had not seen the the David Lynch movie because he wanted to stay pure, a virgin. He didn't he didn't want to see. He said that 1 day, I know I'm gonna make the score for a new adaptation. I want to to know nothing about what has been done. I want to stay.

Why why am I talking about this is because Hans, the right at the beginning, he said, but is it a good idea to tackle to the to get close to a a a teenager dream? Uh-huh. Try to bring to the screen something that is so dear into our art, and, it is dangerous. It's it's it's you're you're you're meant to fail. You're gonna fail.

It's like you have to accept that you're gonna fail, that you're gonna you will be able to bring a little bit a bit of it, a part of that dream on screen, and the rest will be, far away from it. And that space between, what you achieve, what you were able to bring, and the the thing that are different means that, I have space to grow and to get better to make another movie. If I had absolutely succeeded, then I'd be, in deep trouble.

Well, well, I mean, by by that measure, Denis, by that measure, it it it would seem that if if you were to look at it, trying to hit that target of of that dream of a teenage dream, if you will. If you were to do that to the letter, to the number, to be exact, that would be, in effect, the failure because the success would be everything beyond that, the unknown that you would bring that's new. Right? Like that idea. I I wonder if I I, you know, I think about the films that you've made and they have such scope to them.

They are they are these there's a sort of an epic nature to to all of them. I'm I'm such a like Sean, I'm and Jason. I'm such a massive fan of your films. And Okay. I wonder, they're so ambitious, visually, storytelling wise, all of it musically, all all those elements.

They are very ambitious. They are very big. And what was the was there a moment when you were young when you you saw a certain film or a certain type of film? You said, that's because for me, I and Jason, you may be able to answer this too. As a director, are there moments where you go, this is where I wanna go?

Like, this is the kind of thing that inspires me?

Right. There's a 1 I remember that, 1 of the first movie that had a big impact on me was, and I saw it on TV, frankly, was 2,001 A Space Odyssey. When I saw that film, I was like, oh, That really was like a almost a trauma at first. Yeah. Yeah.

Those apes, being afraid of that sculpture in the middle of the desert, it was so frightening and strange and and poetic and powerful images. I would say that, discovering the work when I was young, discovering the work of Steven Spielberg, I was, through, Close Encounter of the 3rd Kind. Oh, that's true. Really blew my mind when I was a kid. Totally.

Also, when I saw Blade Runner the first time, that is another 1. That Yeah. The original Blade Runner. That was something that I really, and I'm a a Star Wars generation. Yeah.

Yeah. The first movie that I I asked my parents to see in the theater the first time I said, I want to see that. It will usually, they were bringing me to the theater, but first time I said, I would love to see that looking at my dad's new newspaper. It was Star Wars, and and that was, something that, yeah, changed the I remember the oomph, the the energy coming out of this movie. It was incredible at the time.

I was 10 years old, like probably you. I was, like, the target audience.

Yeah.

I knew I was, like, it's it's was, the impact of that film was insane. Yeah.

And we will be right back.

And now back to the show.

Well, you know, something, that I I I love about I think 2,001 might be my my favorite film, and the thing that I I think really draws me to it time and time again is not only the music, but the, and his composition, etcetera. But something that I just realized while you were talking that it does so well that your films do incredibly well is, as Will said, your scope. Your scope your ability to, cinematically capture scope and scale in the obvious large scale, but in also in the internal scale as well, the the the massive scope of of a human's internal experience, in a certain story. Like, there's there are things that are incredibly small and intimate that that goes on in, in 2,001, as well as the obvious external large scope of space and and these these these machines and etcetera. Talk a little bit about, your ability to capture that and and the the departments that you're drawn to in filmmaking that that allow for you to travel as as wide on the internal journey of a character as well as the external of these these massive undertakings that you do from a from from a production,

standpoint. The thing I think that scope and visual effects and things, it's it's like it's not that difficult. I think that, the the thing that is a a challenge that that I'm focusing a lot on set is to try to make sure that the emotional journeys of the, actors of the characters are authentic. People are passing to me about intimacy, but it's I I think it's more it's, everybody, all the directors are trying to to be to bring the intimacy, the the the the inner world of the actors, the of the characters, sorry, their inner journey on screen, but it's it's about the the inner logic, the authenticity of the journey to make sure that it feels like genuine human reactions. And and and and I think that's where the strong emotional impact comes from when you feel that there's something that feels real, that feels like you can relate to.

Mhmm. And it's, it sounds obvious, but specifically in sci fi, I feel that very often characters are not they don't behave like real humans. It's a it's a personal it's a personal, sensation sometimes I have.

They can be 2 dimensional.

And it's it's coming yeah. Maybe or it's it's just like I I, coming from the documentary. I did documentaries when I I was young. I I, it's something that I think that I I'm really focusing as I'm writing when I write or when I I I read the screenplay or when I'm I'm I participate the the writing process of a screenplay. I I try to focus on and and with the actors as well to make sure that that journey is, feels like grounded.

It has roots in in in something real. So when Amy Adams see the alien, we believe it because it feels genuine. It feels like a real human reaction. Does it make sense?

Well, yeah.

Yeah. Well, Jason, Jason Jason, you you kinda brought it up about that inner and and then you were just touching it. I I was thinking about, specifically, Stella Skargard character in the 2 Dune films. Yeah. As this, I forget his character's name.

You know, the Baron Arconan. Yeah.

Yeah. And he's this he's this I mean, he's this incredible villain of all villains in a way. He's this sort of despicable person who does the most sometimes the capable of the most awful things. And yet, you see, in that moment when he's you see him eyeing the throne, And, the throne is available. That moment you see, he's not just a bad guy like Jabba the Hutt.

Not to make that comparison or talk down, but you see the envy. You see the desire for that, the thirst, the hunger for it, to reach with his eyes or reaching for it. Could it be mine?

Yeah. Yeah.

In this way, that's almost Shakespearean. Yeah? Yeah. And but very real and human too. I I found that shot of him when you cut to him.

I found that very alarming.

Yeah. Well, you're making my my day. Thank you so much because you're the first 1 who's talking about that moment. It's exactly this idea of addiction to power. Mhmm.

The man is about to die, but still the idea that he could get closer to to to power is like a human addiction. I'm I'm really thank you very much for pointing that.

Yeah. It's

it's But there are there are, you know, there are components to building a moment like that that you're just uniquely incredible at in your ability to to balance all departments to create that moment. And so for our listeners out there that that aren't, as familiar with with what happens on set and the sequencing of things, Talk a little bit about how you approach a a moment like that where you know that it needs to have the authenticity of of, sort of, the human condition to counterbalance this crazy odd sort of space world, netherworld that's that's that's not really that, tangible, but but the human emotion is. And so that needs to be real while this other stuff is not that real. And and are you thinking I'm fully reliant on the actor to really ground this with with no acting and just being raw, or, do you, predetermine a certain, visual language, a a certain piece of music from Hans, a certain bit of sound design from your your mixers. Like, you know, there's so many different elements that you can do to build a moment just perfectly like that.

Talk a little

bit about that. Good question. Thank you. It's it's it's a it's a all shots are different from that specific moment where the baron is, like, lying on on the on the stairs. It's a character for those who haven't seen the movie.

It's a character that that, is just about to die and see suddenly the throne. The king has left the throne and the throne is up the stairs, and he's looking at at the this this throne, and it's it's crawling throughout towards it. And with a moment like that, it's a it's a I will say it's a it's a very simple image. So it's it's about Stalin. It's, I I I explained to Stalin the idea, and and Stalin, Skarsgard, who plays a baron, will will perform and and bring that to the to to life.

Sometimes, I will say that the camera, angles and the the camera movement can help, to enhance or or Elevate? Elevate. Thank you very much. I appreciate it.

That's why I'm here.

Anyways, it's why you're reinforce into an idea. The the camera is is always very powerful, but but it's all the the the birth of the idea is acting, of course. Yeah. Yeah. That's cool.

But but let's say perhaps, especially in this this

And to answer to the the about music, it's something for me that it's a power. It's very music is super powerful, and but I try to not think about it as I'm shooting because, it needs to be on screen first to I I I it's something that Well, I had

a question about that. Well,

let let let me just finish this 1 point, Dushyant. Sorry. But so, while the music can come and does come much later in the process, the assets you may need on the set to create the visual of it, I e a techno crane or whatever it is that you wanna shoot that scene in a certain way, you need to have a lot of that stuff predetermined so that you've you've got your crane there that day, and and your your your your rigors have have set up the lighting in such a way, etcetera, etcetera. So how do you manage the balance between having an actor have the freedom that you wanna give them, but also fit inside sometimes a very technical and pre thought, and heavily prepped, visual sequence that you need them to fit inside of hit this mark, react this way, turn this direction, you know, to fit something that may have other, departments all predetermined?

But it depends. A good example will be the sandworm riding where Timothee Chalamet, playing will, attract a sandworm. And then when the sandworm arrives nearby him, he will jump on the the worm and ride the worm. So it's a sequence that is, like, heavily storyboarded Yeah. And needs a month of of of prep.

And, at this moment, the let's say that the the choreography that, I impose, I'm a more of a dictator. I impose a rhythm and precise choreography that somebody has to follow. But inside that choreography, there's tiny moments where, Timothy, when I'm in close-up on him, how he could he can, anticipate the arrival of of this of this beast toward him, the way you can act with his eyes or the there's tiny thing in the the micro precisions of acting that that he can bring. I mean, that I'm open to 2 ideas, but the general sometimes the it's more loose, some sequences. I I have there's more space for for the actor, and those are also I love when when, I have time to give space, yeah, to the actors to to

Let them freeze. To

breathe to to, to bring some ideas. I'm I'm talking about the, the the settings of a scene that it's it's it's gonna be, that it's gonna it's it's very inspiring when when when when people bring good ideas. But

Yeah. But complicated sometime when you when you have stuff that's pre and then you've got an actor that's got different ideas. And it's like,

well, no.

No. No. We can't this isn't 1 of those scenes where you could freestyle. You gotta do what I can

do. Exactly. But in the same time, it requires tremendous acting skills to be able to, to perform and and to bring life to to, like, Facing the Worm or any other fans facing the aliens or to be in relationship with something that doesn't exist. It's like, it requires nice, imagination, and and and it's not easy to to for actors to perform in those movies with big toys and all these things. And to to answer to your first part of your question about techno cranes or dollies or etcetera, those are are are, it's it's all planned in in, in advance, as, when I I built the scene, it's all drawn prepared so we can we know exactly what kind of technology we'll use on the day, of course.

Was there a was there a lot of, green screen versus volume stage on on Dune 12? Was, what was the did you use any of the volume stages? Was it all green? Was there a split half

and half? We were all out. We we we, It's

all practical?

We were almost as possible outside in the real environment or will with with real sets. Yeah. Built most, we built as much as we could, and and we we are we were, in the the real environments, in the desert, and and and the the those landscape are, for the people who have been in in in the landscape that have that are bigger than life that bring humility into inside you, that the impact on those escape is is tremendous on the on the actors and and myself and the similar Yeah.

I watched the whole I watched the whole behind the scenes, all of it, all of the Dune. We know. Both Dune. I was I couldn't consume enough of it. It was just I I was just blown away with how it's made.

And 1 dumb dumb question I have is when when people are walking in the sand and it's the first prints footprints in the sand Mhmm. That's 1 take. Like, how do you Yeah. How do

you do that? It's it's a it's a

Do you

know what I mean?

You're gonna love show business.

You're gonna love show business. I know,

but they do so much. It's it's

The red crew. It it required as a certain a certain amount. We can erase footsteps, in the background, things like that with CGI, but we cannot you cannot have an actor walking in his own footsteps again because that's a nightmare for VFX. So So

you have a crew with rakes?

So it means that we have, like, we have to plan to find, areas where we will each take move the camera, put the camera on a doll here and and move

Find another spot.

That we have the perfect sense place to do 5 or 6 or 7 or 8 takes that we will also, have the the crew will have the discipline not to make any footsteps on the other way. We choose it's it's it's feels it sounds simple, but it's not. It's like, when you have a crew of 800 people in the in the sand to, to make sure that everybody follow the same path and and Yeah.

Amazing. And

that it it gives the opportunity to see crazy things. Like, every night when I was going back from the set up, when I had sunset, the the the there were a 100 people grooming the the sand dunes during the the footsteps that we had made. So the wind will do its work during the night, and it's

it's maybe poetic.

It's that I felt, oh my god. I'm I am I Miguel Romagna?

Yeah. You're a monster.

Because people grooming their heads are sweeping the sand. Yeah. Believe me, I've had the same thought I went, Jason made some footsteps in the sand and he yelled at his caddy. He said, you missed a footprint, when he was playing golf. He's a he's a real monster.

But but, Janine, you know, when I was thinking about, you're talking about the actors and and and asking them to have imagination and working with them on all these thoughts and these inner life and stuff. And I was thinking about the collaboration that you've had with with a bunch of different actors across, a bunch of your films. You've you've used, and worked Not used. You've worked with lots of people in different roles. I was trying to think, who was well, certainly our friend Josh Brolin, you've worked with, a lot.

Yeah. You know, I think starting in Sicario, which which is which I wanna get to.

A great 1. Yeah.

Which is an incredible I urge anybody if you've never seen Sicario to please see that. Oh my goodness. So great. It's it's so phenomenal. Thanks.

Jake, Gyllenhaal, you've worked with a couple of times, I I think. Right? With prisoners.

Emily Blunt. Emily and

then, our our good friend Emily is

You've had a lot of repeat collaborators.

Yeah. But the, yeah, it's it's it's all about the nature of the project and the and the parts that reminds me a bit boring, but it's, the I I wish I could work with, all of them again. I'll do it. And and, but it's it's just but it's a it's a it's a thing that, honestly, I I adore working in the in United States is that we have access to, all of these incredible actors. Actors.

I mean, it's like a and his casting is very strange. I mean, it's a, you you, bring someone on on on on and it's intuitions about the the the proximity of a of a an actor and and and a role, and and you take a to gamble in some ways. But,

you can I go back

oh, god?

Yeah. Go check.

1 really quick question about the music because I thought that was interesting. You said you you were talking to Hans before you started. And do you listen to cues or music before you even start thinking about how you're gonna film it to get ideas?

Like Or writing, you mean.

You envision stuff from listening to music, or, or do you wait to incorporate it later?

I'm gonna be very honest. Every time I, write or direct listening to music, and that's why I say music. I'm I'm very sensitive to music. I absolutely love music, but it does like, you know I remember once, 1 of my first film, I was directing a specific scene, and as I was, like, alone in my bubble with my headphones listening to this fantastic piece of music, and I'm I was saying to myself, it's gonna be amazing. Woah.

It's gonna woah. It's gonna sound like it's it's the power of music. You know? Then you look at this thing with all the music, like Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I I it's the same with writing. Sometimes I write something, and I'm get emotional. I'm like, oh my god. Maybe I'm great.

And and then you you read it the next morning. It's like, no. It's the best Maybe.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. It sounds stupid, but but I I saw it sounds, but it's the truth. I cannot work with music. I I work with silence. Then I I I can try to, and it and silence is my friend.

I love my sets are very boring. They I I I'm not a funny director. I'm someone who loves to to to to be in the when I get in the car in the morning, it's total silence. I need silence. I arrive on set.

I need silence, and, I try to to protect that bubble all day long. That's where I can, find my way. When there's music, I'm gone. It's too powerful.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

And this is why when to answer to your question, say, it's like, even I have music from the from the the past movies right now, I cannot listen to this music. It's too powerful.

Oh, yeah. You you introduced me to Max Richter because I never I never heard of him. And then I was like, what is that? That's so powerful.

Oh, yeah. Staying with music, though, where where for you, does, the score and and the sound design begins? Talk talk to us about that process, for you and what when does it happen?

First of all, yeah, it it has to I'm I try to think about the sound, and the structure of the sound design as much as possible in the screenplay. Okay. And and, I know as I'm writing that that will need music there there. I'm I'm I would create a sequence with musical sequence more. It's something that is is in embedded in in the DNA of the screenplay.

Okay. But then when we edit the film, there's like I'm working with an editor, Joe Walker, who was a master that Joe is coming from, was, studied as a composer. He was a composer first, then he did sound at the BBC, as a sound editor. So where I'm going is that sound, what I love and 1 of the reason I started to work with Joey, we made many movies together, is that for him, is he sound is as important as the image, and it's something that the 1 I was making in the movies, I felt that the song was coming at the end of the process and with very little little time, and I was always kind of disappointed not having the proper time to make a a real embedded sound design. And so now, I try to bring the sound as early and and as possible.

So it's like as I'm shooting the, we, we have a sound designer that start to create the specifically with sci fi to create sounds that will be fit to the editing room very early on on. So I'm I'm these sounds are time to live with them and and make sure that they will enter the test of time and, and get used to them and and and make sure that they are right through time. It's not just flashes that the last minute flashes. It's it's on the end. It gives, of course, more time to explore, experiment, and and so the sound is something that is, again, as important as the image and and, with Johan Johansson and Hans Zimmer, both composer, were flirting close to the the the the sound design sometimes and meaning that the music sometimes there's like there's like a dance that I I install between the designers and the composer that, they will flirt and cross on time the border or 1 of each other, and for that, it needs communication.

But that sound design is embedded, prior to you spotting with the composer and figuring out where you're gonna put some of the music. Yeah. Yeah. But it's so it's it's it's the sound design first then. Yeah?

Yeah. But I will say that it depends on the sequence. Sometimes, I I I said to the team, here is Hans. We will let we'll we'll leave, Hans Zimmer is not known to be subtle. You know?

When he can't invade the the sound the soundtrack, it means there's no so there are some moments where we say, okay. That's the area. I said, here's gonna be here. We go we go full hands or or here we go. So it's it's it's trying, trying to find the right balance between what the sequence then scene needs.

Yeah. Yeah. It's about the the the need. It's the movie that that, guides, me.

Yeah. Yeah.

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And now, back to the show.

Can we just, touch on Sicario for another moment if we could because I'm, and just talk about how that came, how that came to be? How that came into you, into your purview, and what sort of legend I don't know. There's something about that film that I find, I just adore. It's so visceral.

It's it's a it's a I have been, very, interested by the the the the border between United States and Mexico. I thought it was, like, very meaningful place in the world about our reality, about, it it it it was very, and and and I, I was looking for I was reading about it. I was looking for a project and and, that will be for a story something that will allow me to explore that zone and came into my hands at 1 point. I read a lot, but 1 project came called Sicario written by Taylor Sheridan. Yeah.

The great Taylor Sheridan. The Terrible is, well known now for all the work he's done, but at that time, it was, 1 of his first screenplay. And it still today, it's it is by far by far 1 of the best screenplay I ever read. Wow. It's it's a the the amount of research that Taylor had done to bring that world to to life, I I still the best compliment I have for, about Scicarios was when I I I meet border officers or people to the police policemen or be or the, officers that people work at the border who saw Sicario and said that's the real deal.

And, honestly, it is because of the work that Taylor had done. He had done his homework. And when you were reading a screenplay, you knew you were in front of something that felt authentic. Very, very strong screenplay.

That's good.

I remember reading it, and I I was like, the screenplay was so intense. I finished the screenplay. I was drained of energy. I was like, oh my god. I love it.

I'm so sad that I love this so much. I will have to go in the dark, and I was just out of 3 very dark movies in a row, and I said, to go back there. But it's it's it's it was exactly what I was looking for. And Yeah. And it's it's it's by far the movie that that was the fastest process.

I read the screenplay, met the studio. We we got along spontaneously, and and, we did the casting. It went bang. I was behind the camera with Roger Deakins. It was like 1 of the fastest project I ever made.

And still to this day, it was a very nice shoot because there was, like, just a nice balance between the budget and the the subject, and and, it went quite, it was a nice shoot.

Yeah. I was I I just wanna say, JB, I wanna get your point, which is I just wanna touch on the the great Taylor Sheridan. I I again, I it you can tell, I I I never read the script, but you could tell the material was so strong, it really comes through, you know, not just, obviously, the visual and the way the film is is incredible, but also that the material was was really strong. I think it was pretty.

I had crazy ideas. I mean, like that border shoot, that slow motion car chase at the border. Great ideas. Great. Taylor is amazing to write cinema.

Very cinematic ideas. Mhmm. Great dialogs, great characters, but very strong sense of cinema. Mhmm. And that I I I I'm still grateful that I had the chance to bring that on screen.

Mhmm. That shootout you mentioned there at the the border is is is 1 of the most tense things I've I've ever seen

Yeah.

Still probably ever will see. And, you know, there's, you know, there's there's obviously great planning that goes into something like that, because it's just so intricate. But I guess I'm that's my question. How much planning did go into something like that? And and just more generally, when you're working and your your your visual taste, your esthetic, your your sense of composition and whatnot is just unmatched, and you're working with the your equals, in in cinematography, with people like Roger Dinkins and and Greg Fraser.

What how how do you when you sit down and you start to shot design and shot list and previs and all that stuff in prep and decide how you're gonna actually photograph something, what what is what is the relationship with with cinematographers like that that are so accomplished and and and so, in in a good way, opinionated, what is the what's what's the back and forth that goes there? Do you do you let them know kind of what you're seeing and look for them to kinda plus that, or is it the other way around? Do you do you let them start to design things and then you let them know whether that fits inside

your plan? It's it's a sequence like that battle sequence, for instance, has to be planned months in advance because it's a puzzle. The different part have been shot in different places, and and, you have to create a piece of highway with the with all these cars, it has to be very, very well planned according to its own positions, and and and and so it's it's storyboarded and and, of course, working with someone like Roger Dicken will have a will have a strong input. It it that's what I love. It's like a collaboration.

I mean, it's like we will find together the the the the right angle according to the board that I did, but it's, I'm always open if someone has a better idea and said, that will live in make the shot even stronger. What I the thing I love working with Roger is that we both are when we are looking for a shot, looking for the angle, not multiple angle, but 1 that we work, we we used to work with 1 camera and just making sure that that's that's something that that that search for the best angle possible is something that would

You're only working with 1 camera?

Really, really, loved. On Sicario, yes. It's a it's a

Only 1? Wow.

But but because they

they no. No. It's be I I I would say it's because I'm monomaniac, and it's something that Roger has. We try once to to put a second camera on 1, and and it was a disaster. I mean, if you feel it, you you know, it's not right.

It's like it's there's 1 place to put the camera and the rest is we we are both, on a movie like Doom, sometimes, there was additional cameras. It's because of the nature of the beast, I didn't have the choice, and and Greg Fraser had that that flexibility to to, but, I will say it's I have

4 cameras on me right now.

Yeah. And we wish it was 0 and we wish it was 0. We wish is there a possibility to do 0?

No. Because I wanna I wanna make sure

we get it.

Denis, I wanna say, I I was thinking about your films and your your filmography, your all the things that you've done and and they've not only have they been epic as we've discussed before and had a tremendous scope and and but but also they've been you've tackled a lot of, I I don't wanna say that they're dark, but there is darkness there. Challenge. You you challenge people in the in the sort of the darker realms. So certainly some of your your earlier films in your Canadian films that these guys might not know about, but

Polytechnique and Cindy's

I'm thinking about Polytechnique, which is about the Montreal massacre which is, which was a terrible incident in Montreal in 1989. I was there at I was in Montreal that at that time. You were? Yeah. Yeah.

And, I was living there and and I those films or or or as I mentioned before, prisoners and enemy, and and then you get into even Sicario. These are these are these are heavier subjects that you're tackling. My question is, where when's the rom com?

Yeah.

Actually, for for, my my first feature film was some kind of a rom com. Was it? Or not. Yeah. It's not a good 1, but it was it was it was, a and and She did lose

her life at the end, but Yeah.

She did. Actually, he dies. Wow.

But but the the it it is 1 of the reason when I did Scenario, I, I knew Arrival was coming after him, and and I did Sicario knowing that I will make a movie with more light, and because I I was like, it's true that I had made a series of film that was pretty violent and dark, and that is it it it it there's a toll to this. There's, like, a weight, and I needed to go, toward. And I think that science fiction also helped me to go towards something like, looking in in in the future or something that's more, there's more light there, I feel right now. So it's,

Please don't stop making the dark stuff too because there there is

an other I know.

But, seriously, there's there's there's an uplift and an excitement, watching a filmmaker do things at at at your level no matter what the what the genre, what the mood is.

Oh, j

b, you're j b,

would you agree that, like, if somebody says there's a new Denis Villeneuve film coming out, you're like matter what it's about. Where where do

it matter?

Where do I line up?

Thank you, gentlemen. You're very generous with me.

This is No. It's true.

Yeah. Yeah. Are you Oh, I'm gonna I'm gonna shit talk

you when this is over. No. Yeah. Yeah.

I've seen

that the Well, speaking of the of

the earlier stuff Let's ask Brollin. Let's ask Brollin for the real deal.

Are there any films are there any films from the beginning of your career that you would enjoy perhaps reshooting nowadays, knowing what you know now and and do not that you have any regrets, but anything that which which I should phrase it differently. Which film from your past do you think would be most fun to redo now that you know things now that you didn't know then?

Wow. That's a nice question. Do you know that the the past movies are like, your your your time, like, the father of those movies? I I, it's like I see movies sometimes as as a as a selfie of yourself. When you know when you look at pictures a picture of yourself when you were a teenager, the shame

Yeah. That comes with that. It's the hairdo on the clothes.

Yeah. Yeah. And I have that relationship with my past work. You know, sometimes I look at it and I, oh. Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. Totally.

That's the truth. So you say, well, I would like to go back to my teenage years. Nope. No. No.

Yeah.

Hey. How do you how do you, Denis? How do you take care of yourself with these massive months long shoots?

Yeah. Health wise or

do Honestly, that what what what, very simply, I need good hour sleeping hours. And 1 1 thing that, I did on on the past 2 movies, which was like, advice in fact for from Ridley Scott because I said I asked Ridley, how do you do it? How do you how can you make say when I make a movie, Ridley make 3 movies, and he has a very high pacing and it's just the how to make sure that your hours shooting hours are regular, That there's no and, so I I I, we do what we call French hours, meaning we shoot 10 hours a day, but, without break. No lunch. No breaks.

So it it means that the hours are always the same. You always start the day at the same time and end the day no overtime. So it's like it creates a balance in your schedule. So you're not, all content content.

You do that on on every job?

On the on the past jobs. Yes. Yes. Yes. Oh, that's right.

I didn't do that on Blade Runner, and I almost died. Yeah. Yeah.

What if

how are you on night shoots? Night shoots will kill people. I mean, literally, unfortunately, at times.

Yeah. It's a it's about to create a balance in the schedule. Yeah. Trying to find a balance so you will protect the from being exhausted. Because for the people who don't know about shooting is just that the nature of the the the the structure of the schedule because of the turnaround of the actors, sometime you have to you end up starting your day in the middle of the afternoon and finishing late at night.

So it's like being in constant jet lag. Yeah. And it's not good for for creativity. Oh, yeah.

So I totally agree. For creativity. It's terrible. Terrible. Terrible.

Knocking on knocking on an actor's trailer at 3 in the morning. We're ready for you.

Hey. You know what?

When they say they they say they go, hey, guys. It's lunch, and it's 12 midnight. And you're like, what do you mean lunch?

Yeah. This is

not lunch. I'm sorry.

Right? Are you lying on set at 6 PM and say, hey. Good morning. I said, cut the cut the crack. Yeah.

Exactly.

Yeah. Exactly. Denny, aside from the from the Are

you a Montreal Canadians fan? Is that what you're gonna ask him?

Yeah. Exactly. Well well, it was part of it. It's like aside from the good sleep, what what are what's what's the other thing that you do to really sort of decompress and get away from the incredibly, you know, immersive work, directing is. Do you do you do you watch something silly on TV?

Are you sports Do you

watch hockey?

No. But as I'm shooting, honestly, when I shoot, I'm like, I'm making a film. It's a it's a 24 hours, 7 days a week commitment. There's no, way to relax. That's a for me, it's it's a it's a I'm I'm 100% present to the project, so there's no specifically a movie of them.

Sci fi movies, it's it's every second. Not even sci fi, any movies, there's no the way I will recover from a movie is to go back home in Canada, in the forest, go with my my family, spend time with the kids Mhmm. With family, and and, that that's where I reach recharge my batteries. But, during a shoot, it's it's during a shoot, it's there's no moment where I can I know that, and it's that yeah?

And because of because of that dedication, you will now have made it will go down in franchise, just like you love Star Wars as a franchise as a kid.

You created You've inspired.

A franchise that will last forever in the in the in the minds of these kids.

I would say I was I didn't do it thinking about the No.

Of course not.

Franchise.

For me,

it was I was making 2 movies

Of course.

And and it was not, I it it it there was no, because franchise for me is always, like, something that is linked with commerce or, like, there's a plan for

Okay. 3 great movies.

Yeah.

3 great movies that are connected.

No. But it's not, it's not bad. It's just that I was not saying to myself, okay, I'm starting a franchise. It's But there

wasn't there wasn't your

I'm adapt adapting this book in 2 movies and Right. See what happened after.

But but for the fans, we're so happy you're making 3 of them.

But but but Sean, not only that, but but also does it ever occur to you, not unlike you looking your father's new newspaper and saying, please take me to this movie. It it must be kind of cool knowing that there there's somewhere, there's a kid who said to his parents, please take me to Dune. Please take me to Dune. Who 10 years from now says, I wanna study film. Who's who makes a film with people they know and makes a big huge film.

And they do it because they saw Yeah. Dune when they were 7, 8, 9, 10. To to be inspiring in that way, I think it's, it must be very cool.

I don't know if it it would it had happened or something, but it would be moving to think that, people could be inspired. I I I 1 thing for sure is that I made those movies. We were talking about darkness and violence earlier. The the movies were made in, for PG 13 instead of rated r. It was a first time after, apart from Arrival, all my other movies are are for adults.

This 1, I I insisted. I agreed with the studio also to to make it, PG 13 because I wanted the movie to be, accessible to a younger audience that, that that will have the same age as when I read the book. That so it's a it's a I thought it was, inspiring for me.

And adults like me who have the brains of a 13 year old.

Yeah. Yeah.

At best.

Yeah. But for me, I I like the idea that it's it's those movies are taking themselves seriously, meaning that they are sci fi that are not, that doesn't apologize to be sci fi or I love I remember when I saw The Empire Strikes Back when I was 13 years old, how the impact on the that movie on on Yeah. Yeah. 12 years old. Oh, gosh.

Yeah. I thought the darkness of it. I felt that it was someone who was talking to me as I was, was trusting me as a kid.

And and when Darth Vader said I am your father, I was like, what would that feel like? Yeah. Inside jokes. Oh, Jesus. Yeah.

Oh.

Well, Denny, you are, you seem as kind as you are talented. I I just I can't thank you enough for, talking to us, the 3, ding dongs for an hour.

It was a pleasure to to chat with you, Dave, this this morning then.

It's been

a pleasure. Thank you very much for the invitation, and thank you for your generosity as well. That means the world to me.

Well, thank you, sir. Congratulations on all your great work. Please keep it coming.

Take care. See you later. Alright. Have a good luck, Sean.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you.

Bye. Well, you got you got blessed by the great Denis Villeneuve. Sean. Sean. I think your prospects look good.

He just said keep basically, like, hope you live.

Yeah. Yeah.

From the guy, Denis Villeneuve.

He's yeah. I mean

Hey. Hey. If you're if you're if you're out there and and you're not familiar, and and again, we we I know that we do like we compliment our guests, a lot because we have people on that we like and we respect and and and we get shit for sometimes. You guys just all you do is compliment. Well, we like to compliment people who are really good at what they do.

And if you're not familiar who Denis Villeneuve is, and you're not familiar with his films for some reason, I really this is true. I I urge you to go and watch some of his film. All of his films. His Canadian films that he made and and his current he's just an incredible I mean, JB is a director. Yeah.

Right? Just

stunning. Yeah. It like, he's he's not there there aren't many in his league. I I think it's probably about it ain't deeper than 10, and it's probably closer to 5.

No. And, again, he made Brolin look good. You know what I mean?

Oh, that's very hard

to do.

I mean, think about that shows what a

filmmaker he is. Think how many cameras this takes.

Off the you know? Jesus.

But he's really cool. He's,

So cool.

Yeah. And and you can tell he's he's in charge, which I love.

Canadians are cool. Right?

Yeah. The accent, I think he needs to work on a little bit. He's from Des Moines. But he's

he no, he's not from Des Moines. No. No, dummy.

God. He's, he's from I think he's from Montreal. Yeah?

Yeah. Quebec.

Well, he's that's in Montreal is in Quebec, but Yeah.

Yeah. It's a problem. He's not related to Jacques Villeneuve or or or, Jill Villeneuve. Right. Yeah.

But, I don't know who those people are. Those are Formula 1 drivers.

They were

Oh, excellent.

Wonderful. They were.

You know you you know what,

Here he comes.

These shots are

really good.

What's up, Sean?

I love that he brought Close Encounters up. You know?

Oh, yeah. Why is that?

Yeah. Well, because when I remember that 1 moment when the you all saw the

movie. Yeah?

This is gonna be so lazy. This is this is honestly, this is gonna be so freaking lazy.

Kid is standing there waving waving to the aliens as they're leaving, he actually says out loud What does he say?

Nice. On your

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