Transcript of "Jude Law"

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Hey, good morning, everybody. How's everybody doing?

Real good. What a nice sleep. What a... Yeah. Will, you were snoring a little bit last night. I had to turn you over a couple of times.

I know. Yes, and I had no covers on me. That was weird.

No, you didn't. But I love that extra supersize Charlie and the Chocolate Factory Every bed we got.

Hey, be honest, what was the camera for? Because I noticed a camera this morning when I woke up.

That was my bad. I forgot to take it down. Okay.

Anyway, let's do a podcast. Welcome to SmartList. Yeah.

Smart. Smart.

Yes. Smart. Yes.

Smart. Yes.

How's everybody doing?

I'm great. I haven't even had a chance to open up my breakfast bar.

A little SMR.

This is Papa Steve's No Junk Raw Protein Bars, which I'm real keen on. My address you can find in the chat. Jesus. Okay. Have you guys had your breakfast yet?

I have.

I have not.

What did you have, Willy? I had one cup of oatmeal made with water and some berries.

Do they let you for an hour of exercise each day? Yeah.

I had a few berries with it, and then a dribble of maple Syrup, pure maple Syrup for taste.

A dribble ever again.

Yeah. Then I had five scrabbled eggs.

Jesus, my chest hurts. Five eggs?

Why? Your chest shouldn't hurt. It's not bad for your chest.

I think there was one report that said that eggs are not cholesterol problems anymore. I love that report as much as you do, but I'd love to hear a second.

Well, my doctor told me that.

This is the guy you found online?

Put it this way. What's your cholesterol and what's mine? You're the one who eats all this shit. What's yours and what's mine?

My cholesterol is horrendous. Mine is too. Because it's in my family.

Mine is 90.

I will tell you, I just had one of those full body scans. No brain?

Yeah. And completely empty? Yeah.

Sir, can we talk to you for a second?

It's just one microchip up there.

They said there's no heart. They just found a box with a picture of a heart in it. Did you get the results back?

Yes, thank you. The results were fine.

Oh, good.

Everything is fantastic. I'm very pleased because you never know what those things. You could get the... Okay, so your appointment to review your scan results, or is it tomorrow at three o'clock? Okay, so tomorrow at three o'clock, I'm going to find out if I've got something I've got to worry about the rest of my life.

You walk in and they got six doctors in there.

They got six guys in there. They'd actually like to do this in person.

The team needs to speak to you. Hey, Jason, can you clear your schedule for the next four months?

Do you have a wife, girlfriend, best friend, something that can maybe drive you?

Are you religious at all? Because we got a guy here on standby.

No, it was It's a real... We were talking about it, you and me, Will, the other day, and you were like, Well, I don't know. I mean, do you want to know? I was like, I do if it's good news. And thank God it was good. That's good.

Sean, did you get the shingles vaccine?

I did. I did. Yeah.

Did you, Willy?

I have not.

You have to.

You must. Now, what is it? If you've had chicken pox, you're susceptible to shingles or vice versa?

It's already living inside you if you had chicken pox, the shingles.

If you haven't had chicken pox, you're good. You don't need the shingles vaccine?

I think. I don't know. Don't get medical advice from this show. Yeah, exactly.

Change the channel, everybody.

How often would you say in any given week, do you have a conversation, at least with with a doctor.

Oh, God, on a weekly basis, for sure.

It's at least once a week.

At least once a week, you're interfacing with a doctor via text or call or in person. Why?

Because you're concerned or you just want to stay ahead of things.

I want to be one of those people that catch something before it happens.

Right. You just workshop things that could go wrong with you and what to do to be ready.

That's right.

You ever thought about just living life and enjoying it?

I'll take photos of shit and text them and all that stuff.

You could zip into a bubble, maybe, and just To have Scotty roll you around.

From room to room. Yeah, I'm not above it. I'll do that. You know what, though? We were talking about anesthesia, Jason, me and you, I think, at dinner last week.

God, I could go for some propo right now.

Wouldn't it be great? We were talking about how do you... Isn't it fascinating? How did somebody discover anesthesia?

They can just switch you off.

Anesthesia, who do you test that on?

Right. We're going to bring you as close to death as possible.

Getting that just right was probably challenging. That's too much. We lost them. Or too little, you can see them screaming as they amputate the wrist.

It's unbelievable.

Well, I tell you, when you don't want some Purple Falls, when our guest is performing-Great. Because you want to be wide awake for this person's work. I tell you, millions of people have been wide awake watching this guy. I'm going to say this. He's been dazzling people for a long time.

His- David Copperfield.

Well, his- David Blaine. I will just say, Jason, you might want to be careful because this person knows a lot of your secrets. Oh, okay. This person knows- Papa? This person knows a lot of the stuff that you've been up to, especially recently, because this person is somebody who has been in and out of your world. I'll just say this. Again, I always feel like with my guests, it's hard to start naming their credits because immediately you're going to go, blah, blah, blah.

Why is this person my guest then? You say, I know this person.

You do. And they could be your guests because I wanted to surprise you. Because this is somebody who has... This is somebody who's been doing... This is somebody who's been doing the films that we... Jay, this is the for you that fits in. They're doing the thing that the tastmakers like and all those words that you like. That's how much disdain he has. I know. Because there are films in there. This is somebody who's been nominated for Academy Awards, Golden Globe Awards, BAFTA's, Olivier Awards. I don't know anybody that's fancy. He's done television. He's played The Pope. He's been in Sherlock Holmes. He's been in... He's the Jude? He's been talented Mister Hey, Jude. There he is. I was wanting to get to, and he's Jason's co-star and collaborator on Black Rabbit. Is Jude live? Yeah. Good morning, my friend.

Hi, Jude. Good morning.

He should be your guest, but I wanted him because I wanted to surprise you, JB, with your guy.

Buddy, God damn it, this is great. Guys, get ready to just fall in love and clear out, make room for a new best friend. There's really... Jude, first of all, welcome. There's just nobody I'm more excited about as a new person in my life, for the last 10 years, than Jude Lough.

The feelings.

This guy is incredible. Jude, he has been singing your praises since you guys started working together. Honestly, I'm not making it up. He cannot speak more highly about it. He has generally disdain for people, as you know.

I broke through that.

I like five people in the world and there's three on the screen right now.

We finished just a couple of weeks ago and I'm genuinely going through withdrawals. It was a long shoot, so you know when it starts to become part of your daily routine. And dare I say, you not take it for granted, but you've been doing it for a few months and it's what you do every day. Man, I'm finding it hard. It's been a bit bumpy coming out. How about Yeah.

It's like, yeah, on that project, it was like waking up in your house each day and just hanging out with your family. It's just so easy. Then you're gone from your family. You start to miss them.

Yeah. It's a very odd part of what we do, right? Yeah. I was trying to explain this to someone. It's like, most people have their first day on a job in their 20s or 30s, and maybe they change their job once in their 40s. We change a job three times a year sometimes. It's crazy. Like a whole new group of people. Hi. Hello. I'm Jude. Nice to meet you.

Well, what's so unusual is that Jason has allowed himself to get attached to you because I have heard him describe, and this is true. He described recently to somebody, and this really, again, is going to give you a lot of info about who J. B. He talks about how when he starts a job with people, he tells himself not to get too attached because he knows he's not going to see them again. He builds in a distance with people so he won't get hurt. Am I right, J. B?

It's not as much of a defense mechanism as just a practicality. It's like, we're going to never see each other again, but there's a necessary bonding that needs to happen to really make the work enjoyable and effective. So, yeah, it's an odd thing we've been doing.

I've actually given young actors that advice sometimes because I remember when I was in my early 20s starting out.

You say, Don't fall in love with me.

No, you walk away from the film thinking, I just made 50 best friends, and we're going to see each other every week. There are, and then nothing happens, and you feel slightly heartbroken. So I'm like, They're not going to be your best friends. You're going to work together.

It's going to be a great experience. The good news in this business is you actually do have a realistic chance of seeing those people again, though, on another project.

If you're as old as we are.

On a podcast. Now, before we get going, I have seen Jude's film that is coming out, depending on when this airs. It's called The Order. I've seen it twice in the last three days because they very nicely asked me to introduce it at some screening the other day. This movie, Jude's the lead in it. It's also with Nicholas Holt and Jerny Smollet, and it's directed by Justin Crizzell. Guys, if you like a bag of money and a gun and something that is shot like one of those Sydney Lamey films, it's just this movie is so goddamn good. He plays an FBI agent that is after a white supremacist gang up in the Pacific Northwest. It's a true story. It happens back in the late '70s, early '80s, I think, Jude. It's just badass. Bank robberies. It's just go see. It's called The Ordr.

It's fucking great. Yeah, I haven't- I can't wait to see that. I haven't seen it. I haven't seen the trailer. I saw the one sheet. It looks really... Just the poster alone looked really cool. I think that you're holding a gun in it or something.

I see it a hundred more times.

Talk a little bit. Well, just if you can, It's nice because we're on this. To talk a little bit about the order and how it came into your world and what it was about it that you were like, Oh, yeah, this is something I got to do. Because I don't necessarily associate you with as a like a gun wrangling. You know what I mean?

I hadn't played a part like it. And it came my way through my production company. And it was just one of those. It was so full of potential. It had this incredible true story that I hadn't heard of, an awful lot of people hadn't heard of. It had all this relevance to today and the divisive society that we're living in and that we're seeing around the world. And then it's also wrapped up in a brilliant cat and mouse thriller genre film. And like Jason said, it's reminded me of those movies, those crowdpleasers that I used to go see when I was a kid with the great filmmakers of Lumet and Freekin. And it's funny, isn't it? It's the same with other genres, I suppose. But those movies were at once with Hackman and Newman and people like that in them. So popular. And suddenly, I don't know, they lost their edge maybe.

But anyway. I have no idea why, right? I mean, like French Connection. They don't make those movies anymore. And those used to be like the blockbusters, Wide or Dog Day Afternoon. What happened?

Well, I think, first of all, I think we do know. And they tried even into the '90s. I was thinking about Ronan, that great De Niro, Frank and I, remember the movie. Amazing. Again, trying to extend that idea, even out of sight with Clooney and those guys in Sodaberg.

Or Out of the Furnace, the Christian Bale movie.

Yeah, all those movies tried. But I think that what happened was, and I think I mentioned this before, we've spent the last at least decade of under the tyranny of IP. Yeah, for sure. These films that were made, that were made... All the studios owned all this IP, and they're like, How can we squeeze as much as we can out of this IP, whether it's this for people like Sean and Scotty, ruined the movie business because that's what they wanted.

I think they're trying to hedge their bet.

I hope they saved the planet Lindalore because that's when...

That's careful. Jude's got a Star Wars thing coming up.

It's called, yeah, I can't wait. It's called Skeleton Crew.

I can't wait. Excluding Jude. I didn't talk about Star Wars, not Jude's Star Wars. Anyway, I think that that is why. But I think you're right. There's an appetite for this thing now.

They're assuming they're going to get a built-in audience with this existing IP. And so these original things are put on the back burner. But my God, just a pure satisfying experience of going to see a caper or a thriller or something with just a true beginning, middle and end where you get invested with these characters and there's a sticky plot. Why do I need some dude flying around on top of it all?

Sean. But it goes full circle, I'm sure, right? People come, they'll always come back to it. It's like vinyl, everyone comes back to it. You hope.

You hope. Hopefully, this one will start. You know what? Guess what? It's the same thing with music. My kids listen to all this music that's very good, but it all comes out of electronic interface as opposed to like, plugin in an instrument and you hear a snare drum or you hear a guitar. I don't need to sound like an old fuddy-duddy, but I miss the sound of instruments and music. Hopefully, that comes back as well.

It'll come back.

I think it does come back. You're talking a lot about, I suppose mainstream pop music. There is a huge appetite for it, and there's a very thriving indie music, certainly. I'm like such an old-school '90s dinosaur indie fan, but that has come back. There's a lot of guitar-driven music out there that's excellent. A lot of great American bands.

Jude, how are you today?

Hey, F you, Sean.

Sean, go fuck yourself. Hey, do you guys want to hear my impression of Sean and Scottie going to the movies again? Yeah, please. I hope that they find... I hope he knows that his dad actually came from Scala's score. Do you know that his dad was in the other... And his key came from Scala's score, too. We By the way, we just watched Alien Romulus again. Again.

That mythology is so great.

Where does that sit in the order of the Alien?

It comes before the original in the '70s. Oh. Yeah. Or right after. I'm sorry.

Have you watched the original again recently? Yes.

It's incredible.

The design for it, all those who was it who was watching it recently, and they said they paused it and zoomed in on a little It was a cool area in behind, I think, Ian Home. It was basically an old speaker turned inside out, upside down and sprayed white or something.

It was really cool. In Romulus, the sets they made look like the '80s because I misspoke. It comes after the original story. In between the original.

But anyway- In that early alien- Are you a fan? I love Alien. Yeah. Yeah, so good.

What big science fiction- Where are you right now? Are you in a hotel? Are you home? Where is he?

I'm in a hotel in Beverly Hills. Oh, fantastic. Los Angeles for a while, promoting and- Yeah, he is humping.

This guy's got stamina like you cannot believe. He's not going to stop until December.

I've heard, again, I don't want to get too much because we do love the Black Rabbit we want to talk about. We're all so excited for Black Rabbit.

It was time to talk about that. That's a year from now.

I will say, again, this is the highest compliment from JB. He talked about your stamina and your ability to show up on set every day and deliver in every way. I've never seen him so impressed. As a producer as well. I've never seen him so impressed, Jude. Honestly, again, I'm going out of my way here, but it's so true.

The joy.

The joy that he had. I need your notes on episode three and four soon. If you can turn those around to me, Jude.

Let's not turn this into a work session, okay?

Let's just house it out now.

Okay, well, Jude, let's talk early days as you started as a performer. We know where you've been and where you are now, but let's flash back to when you were a kid and the first time you said, Mom, dad, I want to perform, or somebody said, Jude, you need to perform. What was the thing? Were you attracted to it? Did somebody notice it in you? What was the thing? How did it also- It just occurred because my parents were teachers.

This is in the '70s in Southeast London, but they had a passion for theater. They were members of a local theater company, and they were put on plays. And I grew up in a house where I remember there were always... The kitchen was full of people rehearsing, or I'd come down and half our furniture would be gone because they'd be using it on a set in the play that they were putting on. So it was just a big... And I just remember loving watching adults rehearse and goof about. It looked like it was a dialog. It was a language that made sense to me. And I felt very I was comfortable in it. So really, honestly, it was like a, what's the right word, segue, as opposed to a decision. I got involved the older I got and did plays, and I joined a company as a kid.

Brothers or sisters?

I had a big sister. Who she performed, too, but she's a painter.

I thought that was the name of the theater company. I thought Jason was like, Brothers and Sisters Theater Company.

That'd be a good one.

Yeah, it is a good name.

But she's a painter, yeah?

She's a painter, yeah. The decision, honestly, There was a moment when I got offered a job in a TV show. I was about 17 and had to make the decision of leaving school, moving out. They just knew that was going to happen. They made me promise if it didn't work out, I'd go back to school. I was like, of course. But they were incredibly supportive.

Wait, did you not finish high school like me?

No, didn't finish. Nice. Wow.

This is great. What I'm realizing also about your friendship with J. B. Is that he hasn't asked you any questions about your life in all the time that you've known. No, it's fine.

Jude, what's your last name?

He's like, Do you have a sister? Did you finish high school? How the fuck would you not know that already?

I'm not in there on the guy's jock all day on the fucking set.

We got work to do. It's called just human in a rational. It's just called being interested in somebody else other than yourself.

I got to scroll through my phone in between takes.

Jason and I stayed in character the whole time.Oh, my God.We only talked.Oh, my God. I will be honest, it was weird when he shaved the beer because he'd been my big brother with the beard. We've been hugging and fighting, and it's been full on. Then suddenly, he appeared and he was Jason Bateman.

Yeah, Jason Bateman.

Exactly. You guys did so much storytelling together.

Oh, God, Will. We will be right back.

Now, back to the show.

But that decision to go to a television or stay in school. When I hear you say it and I think about wanting to be a performer being 17, that's an easy decision. Hey, do you want to go to a... Yeah. Or do you want to stay in school? I love school.

When did you know it that you were safe, that it was actually going to be something that could provide an income for you?

Honestly, not until I was in my early 20s and I'd done a movie or two. Really, Yeah.

What was your first one? What was your first film?

My first film was a movie called Shopping, and it was about car thefts, and that was in the early '90s. Then I did a film, another English film, but a period film called Wild, about Oscar Wild. Stephen Fry played Oscar Wild, and I played his boyfriend, Bosi Douglas, who was a nasty piece of work. Around then, I'd done a lot of theater in the film. Yeah, I guess around then, I thought, Oh, this is a job.

When was the You were still in England at that point?

Yeah. Well, Wild, you got... That was the first... You got some recognition for that performance in Wild. That put you up a notch.

Yeah, I got those newcomer awards. Welcome to the Gang Awards.

That's good, though. When you're a young actor, it's meaningful, yeah.

Totally. But you know how it is. There's still that funny You're feeling of, God, I just want to get another job. You still think the unpredictable nature of what we do, the waiting is still quite alarming. And you haven't got enough money in the bank. You're thinking, Okay, God, this is unpredictable.

Even today, all four of us are not out of the woods. We never will be. The only thing that I think we have going for us is that if our careers were to end soon, there would be a downhill trajectory of maybe three or four jobs before you're done. That's the only pad we have built in there. Whereas back when Jude was starting, maybe this could be your last job. I think the four of us are at a point now with all of our... We're so lucky to have had our success, but it still only is built in like a three-job off-ramp.

Not if I release Sean's text. I think it's going to be-Oh, yeah. It's going to be immediate. I could use any. Jude, I will... So, Jude, then because I'm building towards this, which is the film I think that I first... That I, as a consumer and a filmgoer, and as a young actor, looking, aspiring to do stuff, noticed you in a film that I, to this day, adore and talk about science fiction, a really pure, I think one of the great science fiction films, Gattica, You and Ethan. That performance, that film- Andrew Nickel? Andrew Nickel. What an incredible Andrew Nickel, amazing filmmaker. But that film was really remarkable. Talk a little bit about that, would you?

Well, it was the first film that brought me to Hollywood, and it was the first time, and it was one of those rare occasions where you read a script and you just can't believe it's as good as it is and that they want you to be in it. That was pretty extraordinary. I was thinking a lot about that recently, and Ethan was such an incredible teacher, really. To meet and work with Ethan at that early formative moment was really impactful. He's such a gent, and he takes it so seriously, but with such a humor and a creative approach. I remember watching him and we had all our stuff together. That was really influential. But moving here, moving to the States and making a film. I remember going and rehearsing on the Sony lot. And yeah, it was a dream. It was fantastic. Fantastical.

Where did you move to? Where was your first spot?

What was it called?

I stayed- Were you down there in Culver City, near the lot?

No, I was in West Hollywood. I was in one of those funny little hotels where you got a kitchen in the corner, something sweet, Summerfield's Sweet, something like that. Where you have a bed and everything's in one room.

Wasn't as glamorous as you thought the Hollywood journey would be.

Honestly, I He was just happy. Someone else was picking up the bill.

At that point, you were just happy it wasn't raining. You talk about Ethan. First of all, I do want to say this, and we've had him on the show. We're such fans. I think he is such an unheralded artist, and I don't usually use that word as much because sometimes it makes me cringe. But he is such an artist, that guy, and started young, as we know. He was a child actor. We're talking about Ethan Hawk. Ethan Hawk. Yeah, sorry, Tracey. We're talking about Ethan Hawk. He's one of those guys. If he had more artistry, Jason could have been him, but he's one of those. I say that Jason is, and I love what you do.

It feels like a compliment. No, it is. I just got to look into it a little bit.

No, but- I'll pack that. He's like... I really do. I love, A, all his performances are so good and so raw and amazing. I love his approach and hearing him talk about art. When you told me that you learn a lot, I believe that. I believe that that relationship was inspired.

Generous, too. Generous, yeah. That's another thing. Really generous on set and aware that he's got... He was working with someone who was pretty green. I mean, I'd only done a couple of films, and I'm still a little bit like this, but just warm. It was a very happy time. But here's the funny thing. Again, too young to realize that that doesn't mean the film is going to be a hit, right? So you're sitting there going, Wow, I'm in Hollywood. It's really good. And it is. It's a great film. And the proof with that one is that people still refer to it. Thank you for what you said. You're right, it holds up. Oh, my God. But at the time, it just disappeared. That was my first taste of, Oh, you got to keep trying. You got to keep throwing the spaghetti at the wall because nothing until it sticks.

But I think, yeah, it's funny. You do have that, again, as a consumer of it and somebody who watched it and adored it. To me, it was a hit in the sense that it worked and it was brilliant and all that. I walked out of the theater with whomever and say, God, that was an incredible film and blah, blah, blah. I put it in that place that it's an incredible film. I don't know if the accountants- Funny that, right?

It's funny how that happens.

Yeah, the accountants at the studio- Because it also gets sticks.

No, exactly. But it's funny how if it stays in your... I mean, it's not one of those we look back on and go, it worked at the time. But again, this is why it's such a shame in a way that films are judged on their opening weekend. Box office. You think, let's come back and re-review this in 10 years, five years, 10, 20 years.

Well, that's one of the things I like about streaming. There is no scorecard. There's no results. It's just it's up there. If you like it, you tell somebody about it, and then they watch it, they might like it. It's just People then experience it when they want, how they want. I like that it's just on the merits. It's not qualified by- An old catalogs get rediscovered again, right?

Yeah. That's what we're saying that Grey's Anatomy is this show. It's suddenly being watched by everybody.

Oh, all these shows. What's the show? The-suits. The Suits. Yeah. Suits has had this thing where everybody's people are like, Oh, have you watched Suits?

But I wonder what the algorithm or their thing says to, Let's try Suits. Let's try Grey's Anatomy. I wonder. It's interesting.

Yeah, sorry, Sean. No, I was just- You go.

You go. You go. You know what?

I'm going to go. I was just going to say this, which is, so you do Gattica and you come out and it brings you out here and it introduces and brings you to Hollywood. And then what was the gap? You did that, and then you did... I want to say that you did... Well, the time between that and Talents and Mr. Ripley. Yeah. Because those are both late '90s films that were really amazing, impactful films.

Yeah, Ripley really raised my game because of the nominations and the other people in it. There was a little bit of a There were a few tumbleweep moments between Gattica and Ripley, where because Gattica hadn't been a financial hit, I did a couple of smaller parts, but still, there's that thing of It's not consistent. Ripley really was a leap for me.

Then you were on the set with another gem, Matt Damon. I bet you had a great time with him, too.

Yeah, I mean, he could be. He's a little... I mean...

He's not bright, but-No, He's not bright.

Matt's really not that bright. He's really hot and cold, let's be honest. He blew it. He blew it at Wurtl this morning. I will say- I busted two days ago.

I bet you did, too.

I did not. Everybody else busted on that day, and I did not. What was his name, Eddie? I got a six.

What was the name of that? Wait, what was it again? Was it Radar or something like that?

No, I'll tell you right now because Bob texted me about it and he was like, What did you get today?

Have you tried Quirtle?

Don't get him started, Jude.

I do Quirtle, Octurtle, and Wurtle, all three every morning with Matt and two other guys, every morning for three years. That's consistent. Every morning.

Okay, get back to your guest.

So get back to your guest. Wait, so you do a couple of tumbleweeds and then you do Ripley. Did you know Anthony Anthony Mingele before?

No. I did this really odd little film with a director from Hong Kong, and Anthony's wife was one of the producers on it. And he was watching the rushes for that while he was cast. I look back on that decision. That's the way that that works.

I don't know what he...

I don't know how. I mean, Jeff, I don't know what he saw. It's amazing.

Some raw talent and somebody pretty easy on the It was a bit of a leap, though. Was his daughter Hannah around? The great Hannah Mungala?

The great Hannah. Max, who's now a director, was like a little boy on set of that. He was, I think, I would say 10.

Was Hannah there, too?

Hannah was around, yeah, absolutely.

That's great. In that way, now that was shot in some beautiful spots, too, right?

Yeah. I mean, on location all down the Coast in Italy, we rehearsed at the famous Cina Cheetah studio in Rome, and then We shot in Rome. We shot in Ischia, which is this beautiful island off Naples.

Near Capri.

Near Capri. There's three. Then Progido. Yeah, it was beautiful.

But you're down there. Sorry, I just want to say, because God, this is so delicious to me. It's you.

Sean, I think Will's falling as much in love with him as I am.

I've been in love with him.

I'm going to have a dual with Will.

I've been in love with Jude since we had that dinner over at our buddy's house a few months ago. Wait, what? What a great dinner.

You were there, too. I thought it was a table for two. We were all there.

That was a great dinner. It was you and Matt and Gwyneth Paltrow and Phil Hoffman. Phil Hoffman. The great Phil Hoffman. K. Bunchet. Then Anthony Mungala directing, and you're in Italy. My question is, when you do something like that, it's like the Gattica thing in a way, but it's different. Are you able to, in the moment, did you appreciate it? Did you have moments where you went like, Man, this is really amazing, or not? Is it wasted on you?

Not as much as I wish I had. Yeah. It was a bit of me looking back.

But now you can, I'll bet.

Well, yeah, I'm better at it. But I thought, Well, this is what movies are like. You're sitting on a beach and sailing a yacht and hanging out with all these cool young movie stars. It was exceptionally special because of the goodwill that Anthony had deservedly been given through the success of the English patient and the people that he had assembled were pretty extraordinary group from the cast to all the crew. It was a great experience. I wish I'd been a little better at just living in it and realizing how special it was.

But the number of projects that you've done, speaking about your ability to assess whether you're on board a sinking or not, it's just the number of projects that you've done is just outstanding.

They're all huge hits.

Well, yeah. There's a lot of people that have worked a lot. It's just because they don't like home. And they'll just do whatever. Everything you've done has been incredible. You've certainly been incredible in it. Some of, out of your own power.

J. B, but also not just the volume, but how different A lot of them have been tonally.

Also just doing Shakespeare on Broadway and shit. I mean, this guy, you don't know what you're dealing with with this guy.

Jude, I remember Jason just said all these great things that you've done your whole life. Then I remember when Spy came out with Melissa McCarthy, and I was like, Is that Jude Law? It was the greatest left-hand turn ever. I was like, I've never seen Jude do something like this. It was so great.

I was just mad about her. I just so wanted to work with her and witness. I think a lot of... Honestly, I've been thinking about this recently about what drives me, and a lot of it is curiosity. It's why I've done different franchises, too. I'm a bit of a film nerd. I just love going to the movies and going to seeing stuff and having an opinion. But I'm also dead curious about, How do they do that? How's that done? She was flying at that time. Her and Paul Fegg in that work that they were doing, I just wanted to witness it. I'll be honest, I did not feel I was in my comfort zone. Really? There's a scene opposite her. I suddenly realized very clearly, Oh, you're the straight guy. Okay, this is fine. I can play that. Because Paul's coming over, writing all these notes, going, Try that, try this. And she's just firing off. I'm holding it together, just trying to keeping a straight face. Just don't lose it and really make a fool of yourself. But my goodness, the speed and the ideas and then just talk about going off on a tangent.

You're sitting there thinking, What are you talking about?

She's an absolute comedy titan. Melissa McCarthy is great. Also, by the way, it should be mentioned, our good friend, my good friend Jason, yours too, Pete Sarafina, which is in that film as well. Yes. The lovely Pete.

He's fantastic in that film. There's a scene where the two of them, I think, handcuffed together. They're lying on top. It's a weird sexy make-out scene. Can't we escape? God, he's good.

He's so good. By the way, a great Pete Turf, a great story. Last year, I hadn't spoken to him in about 18 months, maybe almost two years. We were quite good friends years ago. I mean, we still are, but we hadn't talked to each other. Out of the blue, I texted him, So what else is going on? After a while, I saw that I had been in a couple of years. He answered almost immediately, That's about it. So funny.

That's good. So, Jude, with all of the great incoming calls I'm sure you get, how do you... I'm sure you base your choices on many things. But is there one thing that is above all else will drag you towards a project? Is it the director? Sorry, I was just sorry.

It seems like money. Yeah, of course.

Well, but I mean, look, everyone needs it. Is it filmmaker? Is it role? Is it location? Is it money? Is it schedule? Is there one thing that is most important to you ever or does it change?

I balance it up. I love the idea of a challenge a little bit like the role I play in the order, which just felt like something completely new and different, and the opportunity to work with someone like Justin on that who I knew I was in good hands, and he He'd take me there. He's the director. But those films, Justin Kerzel, yeah. That experience was a very good experience, but you have to balance a film like that with... Then I was like, Okay, now I need to pay my rent. You got to find something that's going to balance that out.

But also-Black Rabbit.

I'm curious.

God, what a shot in the nuts. He did your thing for the money. Fuck, dude. You're in love with the guy. You've had a great experience, and he only did it for the fucking dough.

While he was there, he did a great job.

You're a paycheck to him. Keep going, dude. Sorry, I interrupted.

You mentioned all the boxes that you check, and all of them at a different time have a different order. Sometimes, yeah, it's where are we filming this? Who's in it? All of those things come to play.

Family, we're bringing kids and all that stuff is important, too.

Yeah. So I mean, specifically over the last two years, I've got a house that's being renovated, and I'm having one of those nightmares, and it's just going on and on and on. So me and my wife and the two little ones, I've just been like, Okay, well, let's just travel the world. Let's just go wherever I'm working. So we've been-For two years? For two years. So we really have. We've been in California, then we were in Canada, and then France, and then Australia, and then New York. So it's been a while. But it really has been just following the work.

And the kids love it?

And they're very little. They're both under five. So it's not like... As long as we're both there looking calm and happy, they're calm and happy.

Exactly. Do you ever find... I always find that fascinating when you do have this schedule that you do, do you miss a home base? Do you miss a groundedness to come back to?

I thought I would more, but I really haven't. And we found some really beautiful homes around and some not so great, but mostly really good experiences. I tell you what I have found hard. I found it really hard going back to UK because without my house, I had this lovely home there. I've always lived there. But going there as a visitor and renting something, it just doesn't feel right. It feels really disconcerting. I was just there for a couple of weeks to see my family, my parents. I don't know. But equally, I quite like being a foreigner. I quite like being a foreigner in a city. It feels slightly less emotionally tiring. I don't know why. In the UK, I read the news about the UK and I'm like, not again. What are they doing? I feel so emotionally. It's like your uncle letting you down. Don't behave like that.

Yeah, we don't have anything like that here.

Whereas here, I'm like, Well, that's not my problem.

When you go back and you're sitting with your parents at dinner, is there ever a time to reflect and go back like we're doing now about, Hey, remember when you guys lit the fuse in me with the theater and stuff? Things have worked out.

A little bit. My mom's not so well. The light in my mom is-I'm sorry. Or the spirit of my mom is slowly fading. She's happy and she's not in pain, but she's not who she... She was very much the lightning in our family. She was the trailblazer. She was the one putting on these and packing up our crazy little French de Chevaux car and saying, Right, we're going to drive across France and camp. She just was full of energy. Really, I think a big part of why I'm doing what I do and my sister does what she does. I miss that with her. I certainly have that with my sister still and my dad. That's fun. It's nice looking back at those... It's interesting, isn't it? The further away you get from that formative time, how you can reflect on what impact it was having on you and what direction it was sending you in.

We'll be right back.

And back to the show.

And having done all the stuff that you've done and really proven any point you ever would have wanted to make or make people proud or yourself proud, I can't imagine that there's any box left unchecked But you tell me, is there something if it came your way, you go, yeah, that I have not yet done or I've been avoiding? Is it a freaking musical? Is it a voice in an animated film? Is it... I mean, you've just touched so many things.

There are definitely filmmakers out there that I admire immensely and would really love to work with. And there's the odd part. Yeah, but not... I mean, there are roles in Shakespeare that I'd love to play one day on stage, but that's not necessarily immediately. But honestly, something you and I talked about and something you're so good at encouraging, I've seen you do it with others, is directing. I love the idea of it. It scares the hell out of me. You make it look incredibly straightforward and easy. I don't know how you do that. I mean, watching you direct, lead that team out of the gates and perform in it was really It was quite remarkable, mate. It kept making me think.

Having a partner like you makes it easy, truly.

It made me really look at it and consider again. It scares me because of the scale of the decisions.

Is it one of those because you thought like, fuck, if this guy could do it, anybody could? Exactly. I get that.

That makes sense. That's not as scary.

If this Simpleton... No, I talk a little bit about it because he is, and Jason is, and we are so proud of him. We love him dearly, and we're so proud of what he's been able to What it was like working with Jason as a director. Talk a little bit about that because we do talk about it. We haven't had anybody on here, really, to talk about that experience.

Okay. The mood. So talking to those who don't know.

Talk about his explosion?

Yeah, none. The explosion, yeah.

This is the thing. You guys will know, the most important thing I think on a film set is the atmosphere. It's a massive team, all these different groups and skill sets doing all these different things, but they all want to be appreciated. They all want their time, and they all need their time. Jason is just a master at keeping that going. The spirit of this company, I've got to tell you, cast crew, everyone, was so positive. That was demonstrated at the end. We had a wonderful wrap party. Everybody's there with their family. Everyone stays from early doors to the close. It was so popular. Which is unusual. Yeah, it is unusual. And that was led by him. And the style of the piece was set up by Jason Justin because it was how he saw it. And he, like I said, led us out of the gates. He directed the first two. And so setting that up and getting that right and... What's the word? Ingraining it in the DNA of the piece. And then as an actor, right? And then he's also there as an actor playing opposite you, leading by example. But also there are those moments where suddenly it's just those little tiny words of suggestion or little tiny nudges like, This is great, this is good, but why don't we go down this path?

Should we try this? It's those moments where you feel like, Oh, this is so much fun. You're playing. Even if you're doing a really dramatic scene, you're giggling to yourself thinking like, Oh, we're doing this.

Our parents are out of town.

Yeah. We're allowed to. We can't keep going.

Yeah, J. B, do you have that a little bit? I can't believe I got the keys to the car here.

Every second of the day. All the toys. Yeah, exactly. It was also like, you got to be such a smarty pants when you're directing and be serious and you got to think about every corner of the room. But this character I was playing was such a dingbat, like a lovely just simpleton. Having to throw that switch in between like, okay, here we go. Ready? Yeah. Okay, let's roll. Then I was joking. I told you that said the... What do you call it? The fix or the secret to going into my character. All I have to do is just separate my jaw because this guy's a mouth breather. Yeah, I go from director to this character by just separating my jaw. We're ready to go. Here we go. Let's roll. That's really funny.

Well, I will say before, you'd actually direct it before, but I will say for our experience of working on the rest of the realm, Jason was the ultimate team captain, and I also learned a lot about what it takes to be a captain. You should be doing it, too. No, but what it takes to be a captain from that guy. It was potentially the only thing I learned because he has nothing else to teach it.

I can get you to 10. You can count to 10 if I can teach you.

What's your impression, Jude? Just quickly, thin slice of Sean. Take a look at him over there.

I look like a thin slice. Thin slice take of white bread.

I mean, be honest.

Be brutally honest. I like the idea. I'm going to join Sean in that bubble. I I like the idea of being pushed around.

To zip him in. Yeah. He's just trying to keep his powder dry for the Star Wars section of the interview, which we can start now, Sean, if you're all set and ready to go.

But I have one question before. I am ready to go on that. But one question before- Scotty slides in on a chair like Saturday Night Live, Weekend Update.

Just like this.

We just sing stuff. No, Jude, we touched on it before a little bit. I want to go back just for a second. That time when you're sitting between jobs and you're like, God, is something going to come? And the uncertainty of what we do. When you were younger and you went through those, did you have other jobs? Is there a time you're like, God, I should start thinking of something else to do with my life because I don't think anything's going to come? And then talented Mr. Ripley comes or whatever it is.

Fortunately not. And I lived a pretty simple life early on. And then I became a father pretty young, and that would be all-consuming. So that I was always... I mean, there was always something to do.

So father But your motherhood didn't scare you into thinking about another occupation? Well, luckily- Like a more steady?

It was never so much that I suddenly thought, and if it was, then I was usually saved by the life support of another job or a potential another job. Yeah, for sure. But I realized in the last couple of years, it's been a really big shift for me with my company, because suddenly, even if they're not coming to fruition, although we've had a pretty good run in the last couple of years, just having the sense that you got You got your hands on the reins and you can develop stuff and you're communicating with writers and directors.

This is Riff Raffe with the great Ben Jackson.

Great Ben Jackson, who's been alongside me for like 22 years. And the company has given me a much better sense of navigating those moments of thinking. Because ultimately, you're still an actor waiting for someone to think you're right for a part.

But if you can cook your own food, that's a real privileged place to be. And you don't take it lightly. And you work really, really hard as a producer, as does he.

Yeah, I love it. I like the process. I love finding ideas. I love introducing writers to directors and seeing that blossom and bloom. And that is a side I love it.

That's the way it happened with order, right? Didn't you contact Justin Crizel for this? That's right. What was that conversation like? Did you know him before?

No, not at all.

You were just a fan of- Massive fan.

When you suddenly someone, and it's never me, I'm really good at chiming in having an opinion, but I'm never someone. I'm never very good with a blank page. People go, Okay, let's discuss the directors.

I always go,.

I want to be the smart one who goes, I've got a left of field idea. I'm always like, You go first. And then I'm really strong to go, No, not them. But someone mentioned Justin, I think it was Zack, or it could have been Brian Ross.

Zack Baylen.

Zack Baylen, our wonderful writer who we worked together on Black Rabbit. It just was one of those, Oh, yes, this is a perfect fit. This guy looks at really dark areas and toxic people, but puts them in a world where you start... It's not about empathizing with them, but you understand them, and he makes it safe that you go into their worlds. And then he also operates on this high energy. He's a big guy, and he loves capturing the energy of scenes and drama. He was just the perfect fit. So Yeah, we zoomed with him. He was in his house in Tasmania with his big beard, and it looked literally like his hair blown. It looked like he just come off a hauled in a whale and come in and sat there like this and just blew us away with his insight. Yeah, I think I could do this. Yeah.

And then when we were looking to get a director for the finale of Black Rabbit, Zack and Jude and Zack's partner, Kate, they suggested Justin Crizel. I was like, Are you fucking kidding? We're not going to get Justin Crizel to direct the finale of this thing? They were like, No, we can ask him. I was like, What do you mean? How do you know him? Well, we just finished a movie with him. Come on, you guys just did a I love it. I had no idea that they had just worked with Justin. Thank God it went well because they reached out and asked him and-He answered the phone.

Was the reaction from the crew when he came in was like, Now we got a director on.

Now we can get going. Exactly. I saw that. There was a lot of relief.

We just heed that up. I know. But by the way, if I don't do it, if I didn't say that, Jason would call me after and say, Are you okay? Are you sick? You were a little slug there. You were a little slug.

You were a little under the weather.

Let's talk about Star Wars.

Yes. Andor, Acolyte. Where does Star Wars skeleton crew come in the line?

I mean, it's absolutely standalone. Oh, it is. I like that. Yeah. I mean, it fits in. I think it's around the same time as a mandalorian. But here's what got me. I was six, seven when the first film came out, and I was thinking about this the other day. I don't remember going. I maybe saw The Rescuers or 101 Dalmatians. Yeah, totally. And then Star Wars. To me, that was cinema. I was like, Holy cow, what the hell is this? And not only that, for the next five years, it was what I played. I was living I was running around my yard going, right, I'm Han. I'm Vader.

Still am.

It was formative. And John Watts just had this awesome idea. He called me and said, so look, what if we... All that awe and wonder and dazzle that we had as kids, what if we put the kids in that world? So it's taking Goonies, it's taking normal kids. You argue and They don't get on with their parents, or they don't get on with each other, or they don't like school. They run away. They get lost, and they're in that world.

Yeah, that's cool.

That's really cool. I was just like, this is a great idea.

I love that. Have you enjoyed that style of work with the volume stages, the green screen?

It was all volume, luckily. I think had it been all green, I don't know that I would have enjoyed it as much. I've done that before. The volume is really wonderful.

Really?

For Tracy, this is a stage that's basically every wall is like a big movie screen. With high definition. Yeah, you're living in an atmosphere.

They put the flooring in. Say you're on a moon, the floor is dust and sand and rocks and boulders, but it goes right up to the volume screen, and then the perspective of the screen just carries on. You can be standing in a desert that disappears for hundreds of miles with ships flying around you and with a wind blowing, they use a wind machine. For all intents and purposes, you're on that movie.

It's not just for the viewer, too. As an actor, when you're performing, you're actually seeing that. You're experiencing that as well.

Yeah, that's really cool. And the same goes for then a more cluttered set, like a market. We did this huge spaceport, and they built all the bars and the stalls and what have you. And each avenue looks like it just goes on and on and on and on. And you've got creatures crossing over. And of course, what you've really only got is, let's say, 50 foot of that. And then the rest is just all on these huge screens.

That's really cool. That's so many-I want to go back to-Shon, you could do one where you have your dad like he's there.

You're going to be on the screen.

I don't think there's screens being nice.

You have it so that he's not leaving. He's staying. He's there.

You can just put the screen on pause.

He's not leaving your family. Wait, before we get out of the skeleton crew world to talk about who else is in that with you? Because I think I read somebody that I know is in that with you. Who else is in it?

Kerry Condon. No. Tunde from a TV on the radio. Then there are four kids. Do you know Tunde? He's a lovely guy.

I met him a couple of times. Really cool. A big fan of TV on the radio.

Yeah, me too. His interesting piece of trivia.

He was great, and Rachel got married. Remember he was in that film? That's right.

Demi. Demi film. Yeah. Did they play all the music live in that? I think they did. Did they really? In real-time. I think that was the idea on that film, that when... Because remember, they're in a band and they're all playing at the I love the way that film looked.

Do you remember the color of that film? Yeah.

Is it Ted Demi or Jonathan Demi?

Oh, good question.Jonathan.Jonathan. Both.

June, when you named all those-Nic Frost.

Is nick Frost in it?

nick Frost is the voice of a droid.

Oh, I love nick Frost. Nick Frost is one of my favorite. Sorry, Sean, he's one of my favorite of all time. I love nick Frost. I love nick. He's so fucking... I do, too.

Me, too.

We all know. He's so fucking funny.

Yeah, he is funny. When you were going, Jude, when you were talking about going from city to city in the last few years, just going all those cities you named. Is it hard to keep a schedule for eating properly, working out, taking care of yourself with the time differences, and then living in a trailer, and then coming back to a hotel. It seems like so... To me, it seems so disruptive, but a gorgeous life because we're all doing what we love to do. But how do you maintain a good schedule for yourself?

Allow a lot of time When I land somewhere to get over jet lag, I'm not one of those people who can just pick straight up and get... Give me a couple of days. Because I think jet lag really is like an illness. You got to love yourself. It's like you've got flu. Just go to bed. But you also Then once you're out of that, I really like keeping fit. I train quite hard every day, usually before I go to work. So whatever that time is, I usually go do something for an hour. And then I usually take my own food. I can eat when I really want. I can't be doing on a set where they're like, Lunch. You're like, It's 5:00 PM. What was I meant? I got to eat at the right time. I get up and I eat in the morning. I make sure I've got food. When it's midday or one, I eat my lunch.

Are you particular about your feeling? Do you eat quite healthily, et cetera?

Yeah, I'll eat anything, but I can feel myself getting a bit slower and stodgier if I don't eat well. But I am got a funny relationship. I really love a good restaurant. I love good food, but equally, it's just fuel.

You know what I mean? I like lamb. You like lamb?

I love lamb. Lamb chops. Yes.

Hang on a second. I love lamb chops. Hey, man, we're not doing non-secuiters at a left field right now. I love lamb. You know what? I had lamb last night. I want lamb chop. I had lamb last night.

Wait, they're at the house? Did you go to a restaurant, Willy?

No, I had lamb at home here. You know what? I was really upset.

Was it a lamb shank?

They were lamb chops, and I didn't have any... Somehow, there was no mint jelly or mint sauce.

You see my wife loves the mint jelly. I'm not fussing on it. As long as it's got a little reasoning on it.

I really need it. You know, Jude, honestly, I don't know about you guys. I mean, we could just keep this going forever, probably. If I wanted to. He told I know. Jason, you were so right. We're going to save this for the wrap up, but he is something else. Jude, what an absolute delight we have kept in the way to.

No, for me, too. Oh, God.

I'm so happy you did this. We'll do it again when Black Rabbit comes on in about a year. Yes, we got it. I'm crazy about you. Love you. I'm going to talk to you. I'm actually going to call you right off the end of this because I need to ask a question about something. But thank you, buddy, for doing this. Enjoy the rest of your press trip. Stay rested and get back to the family and enjoy the winter. Yeah.

It's what a joy. And so lovely to see the three of you. This has been a joy.

It's good to see you two.

Great luck with the order. Everybody, go see the order. It's so damn good. Go see It needs people to see it and talk about it.

Go see it.

Go see it. Go watch it. Go stream it. Go see it. Jude, you are a gentleman. Thank you, sir. Take care.

Thanks to you, buddy.

That's what she said. Thank you. Bye.

Do I do that?

He did it. He did it.

He That's fantastic.

Guys, I'm telling you, this guy, if you think he's great on a podcast or a Zoom call, try going in the trenches with him for eight months.

You always talked about how much joy you had with him, Jason.

You really did. It was unsolicited. You would just be like, God, that's your law. While you were making it from every stage of it, you're like, God, this guy is great. God, blah, blah, blah. You were just... And you meant it. Yeah.

He's one of the best partners ever. I'll tell you, one of the other ones was a guy we mentioned was Matt Damon. Did that little bit on air. Just the level of experience and professionalism with these guys is just not to be undervalued on anCruise.

Also, it probably comes from gratitude, too. We all know what it's like not to work. Then when you get... Exactly. When you're lucky enough to be in a position.

They definitely appreciate where they're at.

J. B, have you ever seen that, Gattica?

I did, but I don't remember it, which is not uncommon. Sean, you've seen it, right?

I can't believe I've never seen it.

Sean?

I know. I'm going to watch it.

I really urge people, and again, I've waxed on a lot about it, but that film is really a remarkable film. It's really good. Jude is so It's hard to imagine that it's one of the first things he did because he's so excellent in it.

He's one of those actors, never sucks.

Never, ever. You're exactly right, Jamie. He's in the John Goodman School. He never, ever sucks. Ever.

Actors who know what their goalposts are and have the discipline to not, or the overindulgence to step outside of that. He finds a version of himself in every character that he does, and yet he never plays anything safe.

Pretty cool.

Thank you for bringing him on.

I was so happy to be able to have him because obviously he should have been your guest, but I was happy to-We'll get him next year. I wanted him a long time ago before you guys started working together. Oh, really? Yeah. I wanted him a long time ago, and then it just this is when it happened. I'm glad that we made it through the entire interview without talking about fucking Robert Downey. You know what I mean? I mean-Oh, that guy. About Sherlock. Because Downey has gotten so much fucking free air. I'm so mad at Downey. Because why? Just in general, just because- Just success.

The success.

His success. I know he's very deserving of it, blah, blah. But I'm just Let's have a counterpoint.

Where do you think he's over indexing?

Opinions. Yeah. He'll call me. You want to talk about FaceTime? Downey FaceTimes in a way it's so out of the blue.Uninvited FaceTimes.Yeah. Then he's in the bath and he'll go, You know what I was thinking what you should do? I'm like, Fucking what, man?

Tauel off and just call me or write me.

I do love him. I do love him to death, though, I will say. He's doing a big play.

Go see his play.

Go see McNeill with our good friend Robert Downey.

I think it's probably closed by now. It depends when this airs.

Oh, yeah, it depends on what it airs. Lincoln Center. But I tell you, what never closes is Jude Law's talent. That's so good.

That is always open.

Always open, 24/7. They can see. Think about all... Jay, you said... Sean, you named out... Think about all the different films that he's...

When I was thinking about- But you're not even touching his theater. I know. This guy has been on Broadway with Othello or Hamlet or Macbeth or probably all three of them. I think he got a Tony nomination for one of those or maybe one.

I mean, he's just done... We did not mention the Sherlock Holmes films, which were major hits. Road to Perdition. You ever seen that? Incredible. Yeah, so good. I love that movie. Cold Mountain, he got an Academy Award nomination for that. That was amazing. Ai? He was in that film AI.

Yeah, I love that.

Like 20 years ago.

Yeah.

Enemy at the Gate. Have you ever seen that film? Enemy at the Gate, where he plays, I think he plays a sniper in Stalingrad. Is that the one?

Oh, wow, really? No, I haven't seen that one.

Oh, dude.

I'm up for all the same parts all the time. You are.

Three callbacks. You've been up for them.

Yeah.

The animated version of each of these. No.

Have you? No. Have you? Real snipers? Yeah. Really? Yeah. Sniper City. One's called Sniper City, the other one's called Sniper. Sniper City. There's one another one's called Sniper. I didn't even know Wow.

Yeah. You know what? I haven't heard of it. I wonder who all those were written.

Those are out now.

I wonder who they were written.

Those were written. Bye.

Jason doesn't even say it.

No.

Say bye, Jason. Bye. Smart.

Smart.

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