Transcript of Episode #160: Your ACNE Could Actually Be A GUT Problem! Featuring Katie Stewart

So many of us was given the birth control pill at 12, 13, 14, whether you had acne, painful periods, missing periods. I actually didn't have any of the above. I just took it because all my friends did.

When you start messing with hormones, especially as a teenager, you are setting yourself up for drastic failure.

People are like, what do you— what do you mean birth control? Like, I need birth control. It actually balances my hormones. If I don't take it, I have horrible periods. I tell them like, well, that's because your body is sending you a message. that there's something going on. And I can understand that we want to be stopping that horrible pain that you're having, but can we be getting to the root cause of what's driving that? Because when you eventually do come off of the birth control pill, what's going to be happening to your body?

Do you want to know why nothing seems to help you with constant cravings? GLP-1 is the hunger hormone that everyone's talking about, but your gut was designed to make it on its own. However, it needs the right signal. Bitter receptors in your gut and mouth are directly tied to GLP-1 release, and most modern diets are extremely low in bitter And so, this natural pathway rarely gets activated. But have no fear, because I found the answer with Just Thrive Digestive Bitters. Just Thrive Digestive Bitters deliver concentrated bitter botanicals that activate receptors in your gut, encouraging your body to produce GLP-1 naturally, supporting healthy digestion, comfortable fullness, and a balanced appetite without any synthetic inputs. No bitter taste required! The bitter receptors that matter most for GLP-1 signaling and digestive support aren't just in your mouth. They line your entire GI tract. So when the capsule dissolves in your gut, the bitter botanicals activate those receptors. Same signal, same response, zero bitter taste. Right now, Just Thrive is offering my listeners something special. When you start a 90-day Just Thrive probiotic subscription, you'll get a free 90-day supply of their new digestive bitters, and that's a $90 value.

So visit justthrivehealth.com/dylan to claim your free digestive bitters with your first 90-day probiotic All right, everybody, welcome back to the Dylan Gemelli Podcast.

So thankfully, my guest is a very patient woman, being that we've had to reschedule multiple times, but she's been gracious and, and I'm super grateful. Um, I am a complex individual at times, but we've— me and my wife both, because she can't wait to listen to you, and I am known for being a skincare person, snobby to an extent. So I, I can't wait to talk to you because I've talked to like skincare companies and people on here, but not like a real expert that's been doing this for so long, that's so experienced. So, I'm jazzed, I'm stoked, and I'm so thankful that you came to see me. My guest is a registered holistic nutritionist and functional diagnostic nutrition practitioner who specializes in adult acne. And, for the last decade, she's had over 3,000 clients over 15 countries. that have clear chronic breakouts. And she's— she does what I love because she does root cause nutrition and functional lab testing. And so, we're gonna dig into what I feel is the proper way to go about treatments and finding causes and how to go about preventing instead of just treating. So, my friends, you've probably heard of my guest, but if not, welcome Katie Stewart.

Thank you, Dale. I'm so excited to be here. Um, it's Something I love doing is podcast guesting, having people on my podcast. So anytime I get to come and do them, and especially in person, they're so much fun.

Well, like I said, you are well known in what you do, and I can't wait to get into everything that you do. I, I find that there's a lot of— well, there's a lot of misconception with everything.

Huge. Yeah, I'm sure we could have like a multi-part series on that, right?

So I should temper what I say here. But, there is a lot of stuff that I want to get into with the sun, with skincare products, what's in them, the whole nine.

Right.

And, I feel like you are one of the most qualified people that I could bring on to do this. So, let's talk about you first because I know you had some skin things that you've dealt with, which obviously were drivers into contributing to what you focus on. Talk to me about some of the things that not only you experienced because I'm sure what you experienced a lot of people do.

Absolutely. Yeah, I originally, you know, my previous career was in television. I worked for Hockey Night in Canada. If all the Americans listening, that's our version of Sunday Night Football.

Oh.

So I worked behind the scenes, uh, for 14 years in major market television where I was working with celebrities, NHL players, coaches, executives. I was also working as an on-air location host, so I was hosting a TV show every day. I was editing content, staring at my face in an HD edit suite every single day. And I actually started working on a gluten-free cooking show. This was like circa 2011. Gluten was not a thing. back then, if we can remember a time where gluten wasn't a thing.

Mm-hmm.

And I thought this lady was crazy. Why would I stop eating bread and pasta and all of these delicious foods? And I thought, you know what? Let's give this crazy lady a chance. I took it out. My lifelong migraines went away, stomachaches that I had, and the acne issues I had been having since coming off the birth control pill in my early 20s started to get better. Didn't completely clear, but I was noticing a shift. And working in television, we obviously know it's a very visual medium. And when I was getting these chronic breakouts and I'm staring at my face in an HD edit suite all day, or I'm working with celebrities and I'm like seeing them, like their eyes flutter down to the breakouts on my jawline, and being 20, 21 at the time, you want to be taken seriously in your career. You don't want to look like a teenager with acne.

Right.

So it was really impacting my self-confidence. And that's when I decided to go back to school to study nutrition because I really discovered that what I was eating was having an impact on my body.

Okay, let's go back to the birth control thing. Because there's— I've spoken out a lot on birth control use in general. Obviously, there's hormonal fluctuations there. Can you tell me what exactly happens when you take birth control first, and then how it affects your skin and your hormones?

Yeah, and this is a huge issue, especially I think for millennial women, because so many of us was given the birth control pill at 12, 13, 14. Whether you had acne, painful periods, missing periods, I actually didn't have any of the above. I didn't need it for its intended purpose. I just took it because all my friends did.

Oh.

And the doctor was like, yeah, here's 6 boxes. I'll see you in 6 months. And I think I was probably on 13 or 14 at the time. And I took it for almost another decade. No idea the impact that it was having on my body. And when I went back to school to study nutrition, my very first textbook, there was a small paragraph on how birth control impacts your body. And all of these like light bulbs went off. It was like a cartoon with like the light bulbs over my head. I was like, oh my God. Like I I had no idea that birth control could impact my body like this. And it was talking about the impacts it has on your gut microbiome and your detoxification organs like your liver, the nutrient depletions that it causes, and that the fact it doesn't balance your hormones. I was like, what do you mean it doesn't balance my hormones? That's what the doctor said.

It's an imbalance.

It's an imbalance and it's just acting like a bandaid. It's covering the issues that you have. And not only is it contributing to existing hormonal imbalances, but it can be creating new hormonal imbalances. So when you come off of it, you're now hit with a whole slew of issues that have been bubbling underneath the surface but you haven't noticed it because it's been suppressed.

Okay.

This is a whole topic.

It is.

You're like, where do we go?

No, this is good because this needs to be discussed because a lot of people think you're fearmongering when you talk about birth control or that you're playing a side and no, we're not. We're talking truth and fact and when you start messing with hormones especially as a teenager, you are setting yourself up for drastic failure.

Absolutely, because so many of these women or girls, girls that are being put on this, they're, they're still 13, 14. Their hormones have never had a chance to settle and become what they're supposed to and start to balance themselves. So if you're just flooding your body with, with these synthetic estrogens, especially if you're on, you know, the, like, um, not just a, on one of the combo pills, like where we're dealing with the synthetic estrogens and it's actually suppressing your ovulation, it's cutting off the communication between your brain and your ovaries. And we have remember, like, our body has a hormonal system and rhythm for a purpose, and when we start messing with it, it, it can be having lifelong impacts.

So a lot of the stuff that I did for many years in my background was working with bodybuilders that use steroids.

There we go.

And so it's the same thing when you're tricking your body and it's flooding itself or shutting things down, then it forgets how to regulate when you stop, even if it's a short time.

Absolutely.

And if you're going as a teenager or even in your 20s, you're not fully developed. Right. So early stage teenager, what would be one of the worst things you could do?

Go and flood it with a bunch of synthetic hormones.

Right. Because then your body's really screwed up because it never had a chance.

Yeah. And what I hear a lot from people, it's a very triggering topic for a lot of women, birth control. And I found, especially in the beginning years when I talked about this, where it wasn't widely discussed, people like, what do you— what do you mean birth control? Like, I need birth control. It actually balances my hormones. If I don't take it, I have horrible periods. If I don't take it, this happens. And I tell them like, well, that's because your body is sending you a message that there's something going on. And I can understand that we want to be stopping that horrible pain that you're having, but can we be getting to the root cause of what's driving that? Because when you eventually do come off of the birth control pill, what's going to be happening to your body?

People hate it because I just relate it right. You're playing God's work, and people don't like to hear that, but it's a fact. And if you don't want me to say that, well, you're playing your body's setup. And you, you can say whatever you want and say that somebody is Playing aside, like I said, or whatnot, it's, it's very, very evident what happens. And it— and then this is like I said, it goes with steroid use, it goes with GLP-1s, it goes with anything that tricks your body into doing something it's not supposed to do.

Absolutely.

That's what it is. Just people, you know what it is, is people have this mindset or one-track mind. You're telling them what to do or you're trying to control them. I always say, dude, I ain't your dad. Do whatever the hell you want. Yeah, we're not going to lose sleep over it. I'm just glad you're sharing so that people understand, coming from a woman that went through it, to explain. Okay, so now we know what it does hormonally. How does that affect your skin?

Absolutely. So like I mentioned, there's those 4 key ways. It impacts your hormonal balance, it is going to be impacting your liver, going to be altering your gut's microbiome, and depleting your body of key nutrients. Well, guess what 4 big drivers of acne are? It's going to be your gut, your detox, your hormones, and nutrients. So who would have thought? Who would have thought that you know, the things that are going on in your body is leading to you dealing with acne because acne is an external symptom of an internal issue. And for all of these years and decades, it's been treated like a topical problem with topicals, with antibiotics, with Accutane, with spironolactone, but they're just treating the symptom. They're not treating what's causing it.

I love that. Okay. Now we're getting somewhere deep that nobody talks about. Tell me, since the gut we know is so widely discussed and understood now like it never was. So, I I temper what I'm going to say here because I like to be fair about pulling punches about, you know, what we're told. And just— but let's face reality here, they're trained a certain way and that's what they do. Now that we understand more, can you just discuss like what it is gut-wise that we need to look out for that could cause this problem and how do we potentially prevent this?

Yeah, and I think it's a really important conversation to have because a lot of people have a misconception about gut health. Where they'll say, oh, I've worked on my gut. And I say, okay, well, great, what have you done? Like, oh, I take a probiotic. And I say, okay, well, that's one tool in the toolbox. And do you even need that probiotic? Like, do you need those strains? Is it something completely different? So I like to explain to people that gut health is more than just a trendy term of, oh, I'm working on my gut health, I drink kombucha or whatever. Is you have to be looking at, well, what's going on in your gut? And for our acne sufferers, there is almost always some type of digestive dysfunction. So whether they have low stomach acid where they don't have enough stomach acid to be breaking their food down. So if that's happening, you can be eating the best diet in the world, but if you're not absorbing your nutrients, then you're not getting everything like the nutrients, the proteins, the healthy fats that your body, your hormones, your skin needs to function and to repair.

And if it's not being broken down, then that becomes a perfect little buffet for all of the bad bacteria and yeast in your gut. When the bacteria and yeast overgrow. We're going to be dealing with more inflammation. It's going to be contributing to intestinal permeability or leaky gut. It is going to be leading to symptoms like bloat, constipation, diarrhea. And that's just from having low stomach acid.

Right.

And with the clients we've worked with, like conservatively over 90% of them have had low stomach acid and they don't even know it because like, oh, I don't have any gut issues. I'm like, well, your skin is a gut issue. And then like I mentioned, is we see a lot of yeast overgrowth. So Candida, bacterial overgrowth like staph and strep, we see quite a lot. Quite often. And then we'll also be seeing leaky gut where their gut lining is just so inflamed that it is now, you know, allowing undigested food particles, toxins, bacteria, things into the bloodstream that shouldn't be there and then causing body-wide inflammation, which is leading to acne. And that's just the tip of the iceberg that we're dealing with.

What are some of the drivers of low stomach acid? How would somebody know that they have that going on?

So a big one is going to be stress. You know, and here in North America, I think we all live a pretty stressful lifestyle. Especially the bulk of our clientele, late 20s to about their mid-40s. So like they're in that, you know, they have a career, they might have a family, they have people they're taking care of, um, they're dealing with a health issue. So that, that stress is going to be depleting their stomach acid. Maybe, um, we have had a growing up eating a really poor diet, you know, we've grown up, um, just destroying our gut health where a lot of the millennials, uh, partied quite a bit growing up. So like, have we just— yeah, like the millennials really need to, uh, repair their gut health. Let's just Let's put it that way. So I always feel like for our clients, though, stress is a major driver for stomach acid issues.

So nervous system plays a key role here.

It's one of our core pillars. And what's so interesting, Dylan, is nobody ever wants to do it. They're all like, well, no, give me the supplement I need to take. And I'm like, you can't out-supplement a fried nervous system. No, like, there's— you can't take all the ashwagandha and rhodiola in the world and expect your nervous system to calm down.

Yeah, you know, I spent so many years focused on the fitness, the nutrition, and those are very, very important. But I was missing the most important.

The most important piece.

Yeah. Because, you know, even as spiritual as I am, because I say it starts with God, but you, you, you have to get in the right state of mind. Because I would do my prayers, feel good, and then go right back to you know, where I was because my nervous system was so out of whack. And there's things that you don't even realize you're thinking or feeling. They're so bound up and gone. You don't think about them on the outside, but you are internally and don't even realize it. How big of a role does the nervous system then play in your skin?

It's probably the biggest role that it plays. Because when you peel back gut issues, guess what's impacting your gut? Your nervous system.

Mm-hmm.

When you peel back detoxification and hormones and all of these issues, your nervous system truly is at the core. So you can do all the gut protocols, eat all the healthy foods, take all the supplements, but if you're not addressing your nervous system regulation, you can almost never truly heal. And, you know, I have this one example of a client who I always think about, and she was our longest worked client that we had. She worked— we worked with her for 3 years. And she would— her skin was looking great and then it plateaued. We like couldn't, couldn't get any further. It was looking better but not where we wanted it. She shared with us some very traumatic things that had happened to her in childhood. And when she started to process them, work on regulating her nervous system, um, talking to a counselor, getting these, these traumas out of her body, it was like an actual miracle happened.

Mm-hmm.

And we just watched her acne like physically recede off of her face, all from allowing her nervous system to feel safe.

See, and that's— I think some people, they— you go day by day and you don't realize sometimes even the stresses you're going through until you sit down and evaluate.

Yeah.

And you're like, man, why am I getting so antsy? Or why can't I focus? Or why am I angry all the time? Or whatever. But you just kind of get in a pattern and used to it.

Yeah.

And it's hard to see.

And I think that's the issue is so many people are like, oh, I'm not stressed. And we're like, what do you mean you're not stressed? And they're like, oh, well, you know, I like— I wake up at 5 and I go into my HIIT classes and I get the kids ready and then I'm doing this and then I'm picking them I have to pick the kids up and I have this work deadline. And I'm like, did you hear all of the things you just listed out and you're not stressed? And it's because we get so used to our stress that it's our operating norm. It's like our, our how we love to operate. And you don't realize until you start listing it out. That's why we often will get our clients to write out all the things they're responsible for. And they're like, oh, I didn't even, yeah, no, my nervous system's not doing well.

We had to sit there and say, I have time over and over. And I had to process this and say it and keep saying it and doing it. And trying to regulate because I— and I had a guest on yesterday who does scalar energy.

Amazing.

Yes. And he was talking about 99% of the people are stuck in fight or flight and you don't even know it.

I 100% agree.

And we were talking about getting to here because you're normally like this. And I'll tell you what, Katie, now that I feel like I'm right here, I mean, it's like the whole world has opened up.

I can imagine, right?

It is. And I literally now every morning, I don't want to miss breathwork sessions or anything. I go outside and do it myself.

I love that.

Yeah. And I set up like a playlist of my kind of music that gets me going, and it goes like slow to up to up to like, let's fucking go.

Yeah.

So, but it's made me look younger is where I'm going with this. I feel younger, I look younger. I don't have as many like normal aches in the morning, or even when I don't sleep as well, I'm like, Let's go. I feel like— let's go.

That's incredible.

Yeah, but you see it in the face.

Absolutely. I know, like, when we have clients come in, I don't even need to know what their routine is because you can physically see it. Like, being with acne, we get them to submit photos and we're like, you can see the stress in their eyes even. And it's like, I love looking at photos from when they start with us to when they finish with us because it's not their skin that I'm looking at. I'm actually looking at their eyes. They look alive again.

Okay, so let's— let me give you a scenario here. I come to you and I say, Katie, my skin is a mess. You start evaluating me. You don't just go, okay, let's put you on Accutane or whatever the shit is now that they're using. I don't even know because I hate that stuff so much, but we'll get into that.

Absolutely.

So I come into you, new client, brand new. Do you take the time then to address my stress, my blood panels? Are you looking at those things, my diet, and asking me those kind of questions?

Um, I ask you so many questions you're gonna get annoyed with me. Like, we have a very— my team and I have a very intensive intake list. Like, there's questions on there like, why are you asking asking me about, like, we're asking about your oral health, we're asking like, do you have past traumas? We're evaluating everything. Um, and then we're looking at not just what you're eating and the supplements you're taking, but we're looking at your lifestyle. Um, we're looking at like, are you eating enough food? Like, when are you eating? What type of support system do you have in place? What's your stress levels like? Like I said, the past traumas. So we're looking at their intake. Uh, we're also really big in traditional Chinese medicine face mapping.

Okay.

Um, which we've a little bit tweaked over the years because we've worked with so many clients. So we will be looking at locations of breakouts as well, but we also run functional testing for any of our private clients.

Okay.

Because with acne, there isn't a cookie-cutter approach where like, take these supplements, do this one thing, your acne clears. With the thousands of clients we've worked with, I've never seen one client have the exact same root cause as somebody else. Sure, they might both have gut issues, but maybe client A is dealing with Candida, low stomach acid, poor methylation, And client B is dealing with sluggish lymph and like too much DHEA. Like there's so many different things that can be going on. So it really does need to be tailored to the individual. So this is why we're a big fan of functional testing. We use a Hair Trace Metal Analysis with every client 'cause it gives us like an incredible overview of the whole body. Where like, I love a GI map, a stool analysis, Gut Zoomer, Dutch tests, all of those. But we can see so much in a hair test. that we're— it's— we can even see personality traits coming through, which is really interesting. So we love, um, knowing what's actually going on in your body so we can tell you this, like, the pathway to do it. Because so many acne sufferers, they've been throwing spaghetti at the wall for years, and you don't have acne for the same reason another person has acne.

So I've got a couple questions. I'm going to give you certain scenarios here. So like, for instance, you come to me with low testosterone and you're, I want TRT, and I say no. know, we're going to look for, for example, if your SHBG is high, then I say, man, we can lower this and we might be able to free this up and get you going. So when— if I come to you and say, Katie, my skin looks like shit, you know, I need this cream, or should I take this wrinkle cream or whatever, you're going, hold up a minute, let's look at some blood panels and see if there's something going on causing it.

Yeah, so we'll be looking at specifically their hair trace mineral. Like, if they have blood panels, we'll bring them in.

Okay.

But a lot of like the regular blood panels are from their doctor, one, aren't going to be complete, um, two, often aren't going to be comprehensive enough to be looking at like the drivers of acne because it's often like gut imbalances. And like a blood test isn't going to be like, oh, you have strep and staph, or, um, oh, you have low stomach acid, or oh, you're, you know, you have a copper and zinc imbalance. So we're looking at those things. And even before— what's interesting is even before we get into supplements and testing is we spend about 4 weeks working on foundations. Like non-sexy, boring foundations where you're gonna be like, but Katie, that's not fun. Are you sleeping enough? Are you eating enough food in a day? So many women are undereaters. Yeah, eating enough protein. Are you getting variety and rotation in your meals? Are you working on your stress levels? And are you balancing your blood sugar? And are you having a bowel movement every day? Like, these are the unsexy things that we need to have in place first before we jump into any type of protocol.

I'm gonna do something with you then, because I think you're, you're ready for something like this. We're gonna do 1 to 5, 5 being most important, 1 being least important on the effect on your skin. These are just health things, right?

Let's do it.

Okay, let's start with the easy one because we already talked about it. Gut health.

Yeah, I'm gonna say 5.

Cellular health.

Can I keep saying 5?

You can say 5.

I might have to say 5 all the way across the board.

I'll get you on one that you're like, I don't know. Liver health.

5.

Okay.

I know.

Um, let's do ferritin and iron.

For acne specifically, I'm gonna say 2.5 to 3.

Okay. Yeah, we're gonna get— I'm gonna— I gotta get you. Yeah, yeah, I can't give you the most basic. How about kidney function?

Actually quite important. I would say like a 4.

A 4?

Yeah.

What about like, uh, for a man, like prostate health?

Um, I, I'm gonna have to put that around a 4 as well because like prostate health, it's for men, that's a huge part of their health. So, we need to be looking at— it's hard for the individual body systems. I want to say 5 for all of them because your body's— it's an open concept workspace. You're not in different silos.

What about progesterone for women?

That would be— for acne specifically, I'm going to say that's like a 4 or 5.

4?

Yeah.

Okay. That's what I was thinking, something really strong hormonally when progesterone, estrogen, testosterone, I would imagine have a pretty high implication level when it comes to that. Stress would be 5 for sure, I'm sure. What about like circadian rhythm, sleep?

That's actually something we do talk a bit, quite a bit. I'm going to put that at like the 4. And that's because all of these things is impacting your stress and your nervous system. Yeah, because if you're not getting quality sleep, like your sleep is when your body cleans house, like your sleep is when your cortisol is coming back down. So, if you're burning the candle at both ends, That's going to be impacting your cortisol, your nervous system regulation. And what's really interesting is I always say your, your today started yesterday at bedtime.

Mm-hmm.

Because think about it, if you go to bed late, you wake up and you're like already hitting the snooze button. You're like, oh my God, I need like 3 coffees to get through the day. So now you're rushing out the door, you're already starting your day stressed. You've grabbed a coffee and maybe grabbed like a bagel. And so your blood sugar is shot for the morning. And then you're rushing through your morning, your blood sugar dips. So now you're going to binge eat on like something refined carbohydrate, that bag of chips, that slice pizza, that whatever that is in the mid-afternoon, you're like, oh my gosh, it's 3, I'm exhausted, I need another coffee. So you have another coffee, and then you go into dinner and you haven't eaten all day, so you're starving. Then you binge eat all night, and then you snack all evening until 11 PM, and then you start the whole process over again. So really, like, your sleep and circadian rhythm is super important.

Yes, very. Here's one that's gonna be polarizing.

Sun. This is polarizing. So I would say directly for Acne, like, I would put it at a 3, but I think for your health, a 5. Yeah, like, we need sun, and so many of us are terrified of the sun.

Wait a minute, are you telling me it's okay to go in the sun? Oh my gosh, is that what you're saying?

I'm saying it's okay.

Oh gosh, end of world.

I think my DMs are gonna explode with that one.

Uh-oh.

As an acne nutritionist.

And then what's one of those things that pisses me off to no end?

Seriously, I could do a whole podcast on the importance of the sun.

I mean, I, I always preface it when I say get sunlight, I don't mean stay out there 4 and 5 hours a day.

No, no, no, no.

Yeah, but, but, but How important is it to get out there 20 minutes a day?

That's how you're getting your vitamin D. Like, if we're constantly covering up, putting all the SPF on, we're terrified of the sun. The majority of us are putting on really toxic sunscreens anyways, right? Which we're now showing that, you know, certain ingredients in the sunscreens have been linked to be carcinogens, where when they're exposed to the sunlight, they're seeing that they have tumors in animal studies. And we're slathering that on and going out in the sun. So like, we have to remember our body needs sunshine. And like I said, I'm not saying going out for 10 hours in the, you know, this Arizona sun here and baking, but, you know, getting 15, 20 minutes of unprotected sun a day is vital for you.

Yeah, my sentiments. I— people always go to one extreme or the other.

Yeah, there's no middle ground.

No.

And it's like, dude, you could— I mean, this is extreme, but you could flood yourself with too much water and kill yourself. And it's something you need to live.

Yes.

So people should just like understand when people say things, there's— you can't just take supplements for everything.

No.

You have to get it naturally. Yeah, food, you know, sun, different things that we need. I had the same problem with people that would want to sup— like substitute their whole day with protein powders, and it's like, brother, no, that's not how that works. No, it's a supplement because you supplement it.

Yeah, it's meant to supplement something, not be the entirety of your diet.

Shit.

Yeah.

Oh, let me ask you some stuff then about foods also. Oh, let me ask you a couple more that I just thought of. Trace mineral rights like selenium and iodine, how much of a factor do those play on Skin.

Well, they're super important. They're like— by— like, I don't want to say bi-factor, but they're so important for your adrenals, right? If we don't have the trace minerals— like, trace minerals are great for your adrenals. They are great for cellular hydration.

Yeah.

Where if you're just drinking tons of water but it's not getting into your cells, like, we're not doing it any justice. So trace minerals can be fantastic.

I'm a massive advocate for getting plenty of those.

Yeah. Yeah.

Okay, let's talk about, um, some nutrients and things that are what I would say you want to prioritize, because, you know, when I was back in the '90s and 2000s, it's like, oh, the— if you eat greasy, it's going to make you break out.

Potato chips are going to make you break out. Yeah.

How true is that?

Well, it's, you know, especially chocolate. It's not the chocolate that's giving you breakouts, it's the ingredients in the chocolate— the, the dairy, the sugar, the conventional ingredients, the refined oils. And the same thing is the fried foods. It's those refined vegetable oils that is leading to inflammation in your body that's impacting your liver impacting your hormones and your gut health. So we need to just be eating smarter and eating like real whole foods.

What kind of oils would you avoid and which ones do you think are okay?

Um, I would definitely avoid the seed oils.

Oh no.

Shocking, I know. I think I do really well living in Arizona since I've been here.

I—

so many seed oil-free restaurants.

There's, there's quite a few here. It's awesome.

Yeah, it's fantastic. So I'm a big fan of— again, depending on what you're cooking with, right?

Right, right, right.

So like an avocado Avocado oil, loving avocado oil, coconut oil, extra virgin olive oil for salad dressings, you know, putting flaxseed oil as like a finishing oil, never heating a flaxseed. So all of those unrefined oils can be really, really helpful.

Yeah, I like— well, I cook everything in grass-fed butter now.

Oh yeah.

What about—

let's go down the line of importance with nutrients. So let's start with healthy fats.

Healthy fats are crucial. like your, your body needs fats to produce hormones. So if you want to have healthy hormones, you need to be eating healthy fats, right?

So they have a pretty strong correlation with healthy skin.

Absolutely.

You know, and this is why I asked that first, and I've documented this quite well. I, I didn't eat any fats for like 15 years out of just straight direct fear.

Yeah.

And I go back and look and it's like, man, like, just culture we grew up in was very like fear fats. Yeah, but I was— I'm a nutritionist. I was coaching people to eat fats, but I was the exception.

Yeah.

And I— when I started to eat them, I went from like 15 grams a day to 130. And I see that, and I go back and look, and it's like, I look 10 years younger now than I did at the time from starving myself.

Absolutely.

And it's just the impact that it has on the glow. Yeah, I'll leave the mental clarity out. That's a whole nother story. But the skin glow.

It's because the hydration, right? Like, like the healthy fats are also helping produce, um, or keep that hydration in your skin. You have, you know, having really strong lipids and allowing your skin to just have that glowy bounce to it.

Yeah, I started even using creams that are phospholipid-based. And like, you know, I'm talking like regular, uh, lotion creams, not just face creams, just everything. And it's just based around having good healthy fats within them and plumping the skin. So then what about proteins?

Um, huge.

Foundational.

Um, especially for women, our chronic under-eating of protein. Um, I, I rarely have to beg a man to eat more protein, but a woman, I am like, are you eating enough protein? Like, yeah, yeah, I know I am. Like, well, like, what do you— how much— what are we talking here? And they're like, oh, um, I might eat like maybe like half a chicken breast at dinner. I'm like, okay, so we're maybe getting 25 grams, like 30 if we're lucky. And proteins are so vital because your liver needs protein.

Yes.

And liver is important for our acne. Guess what your skin needs to repair itself and to build? It needs protein. And if we're chronically undereating protein, we're also not getting like the building blocks that our body needs to build. Like we need the amino acids in the proteins, and we also need to be getting protein in for our blood sugar. So if we are not eating enough protein and we're also not eating fats because we're terrified of it, we're just relying on grains essentially, and fruits, like, what's gonna be going on with their blood sugar?

Right. Okay, well, then that would lead us to the dreaded carbs.

Yes, the dreaded carb question.

Yeah. So what kind of effect? And break down complex, simple, what's the difference? What's good? What's bad? Are they all good? Are they all bad?

Well, no, we need carbs, right? Like—

Oh, be careful.

I have seen some like really, really polarizing things today. We, we— our body needs carbohydrates. And again, growing up in that like '80s, '90s, early 2000s diet culture— carbs are bad, fats are bad, like everything's bad, just eat air basically.

Yeah.

So wonder so many people have eating disorders based on that culture we grew up in.

Yeah.

But carbohydrates, we— how do you think our body gets fuel? Like, how do we get that glucose? So we want to be having carbohydrates, but whole food carbohydrates. We're not, you know, having refined potato chips and like refined bagels and muffins and, and like just eating those pastas and white rices all of the time. We can be having our whole foods, but let's eat them with our proteins and our healthy fats to be keeping our blood sugar levels stable.

Yes.

Maybe we're looking at like squashes and sweet potatoes and, you know, those really great carbohydrates that isn't going to be spiking your blood sugar.

Yeah. And, you know, I always teach people to go down the line, have your protein, then your fat, then your carbs, and that way you're going to stop the spikes.

That's what I tell them.

Yes, and you'll— everything will run smoothly. And then go walk after you eat.

Go walk 10 minutes.

That's it. I actually go ride my bike now after I eat.

Amazing.

And I just go like 25 minutes. I do like this prayer time, ride my bike. I come home and I don't feel heavy or anything, you know.

I always tell clients, go for a quick walk after dinner.

Yes.

10 minutes, even if it's too cold out. I live in Canada, way too cold in the winter. Walk around the house a few times.

But you don't have to walk like a, a fast pace either.

Just move.

Yeah, move your body is so important. And I love that you said focus on your protein, your fat, and then your carbs, because so many of us focus backwards.

Yes.

I'm gonna eat a whole plate of pasta and I'll save that chicken to the end, and I only have room for 2 bites.

I know.

Gotta do it the other way.

Yes. When I, when I eat, um, I do a meal of like whole eggs, avocados, toast, and vegetables, right? And I start right with the eggs, right into the avocado, and then work Work my way backwards, and then you feel really good.

Yep.

And I'm like, man, I'm not hungry for 4 or 5 hours.

That's the thing is when you eat enough food in a day, it is like miracles happen.

You know how many years I spent miserable, hungry all day?

Yeah.

And, and everything I did— and I told my wife now, I said, you have no idea how many times we were out supposedly doing something fun and inside I was miserable. Not because of you or not because of the thing, because of me. Yeah, you know, and it's like, man, now I can— I, I get up if we have to go somewhere and we're gone 5 or 6 hours, one meal, and it's like, man, I'm good all day.

Stamina all day.

All day.

Absolutely. And I, I always tell people, if you can start with one thing, let it be to eat enough food in a day.

Yeah, like, I got one for you. I just thought of caffeine and coffee. How does that affect your—

Oh, I'm gonna, like, at a scale of 1 to 5, I'm gonna put it as It's like a 4.

Okay.

And let me explain though.

Please.

So with a lot of our acne sufferers, their nervous systems are shot, their adrenals are shot, and they're surviving on coffee. With acne, if it's going to be— if we're drinking copious amounts of coffee, we are going to be impacting our cortisol, and which is going to be driving— sorry, we're impacting our cortisol and our blood sugar. It's going to be increasing sebum production in the skin, which is a sticky oily substance that clogs pores and leads to more breakouts.

Okay.

So it's not that you have to give up coffee forever, but let's say that we're, you know, we're really working on rebalancing the body. We have to repair all these body systems. Can we temporarily hold back on the coffee? Maybe even like try having it just in the morning.

Yeah.

Because a lot of our clients are like, well, I don't sleep at night. I'm like, well, you're having 2 cups of coffee at 4 PM. Like, let's move that up a little bit to like before noon. And then if you do want to, you know, once we've done their therapeutic protocols and we want to add the caffeine back, the coffee back in, could we start with like a decaf, an organic Swiss Water decaffeinated? Because a lot of people, they like the experience of the coffee.

I was just gonna tell you, I don't drink it for caffeine. No, I drink it because I like—

Love the experience.

Yes. Yeah, yeah.

And so connoisseur, it's exactly what it is. And clients are like, oh my gosh, I never thought about it that way.

You're right.

I look forward to making it, having something warm to drink. Drink it throughout the morning, or maybe you swap it for matcha, right? I'm a big matcha fan personally. I have a cult of matcha followers.

Really?

I've created quite the cult, to be honest. It's getting out of hand.

You got to talk to Queenie after. She's like matcha queen.

We're gonna be best friends. I already know it. Matcha is— because it has the L-theanine in it, right? Yeah, the amino acid that's giving you the alert calm instead of the hard and fight fast spike and crash of a coffee.

So then if it gives you the alert calm, is that something you can have later in the day, or should you not be do that.

If you're struggling with sleep, I'm gonna say like, let's have it earlier in the day. It has less caffeine obviously than a cup of black coffee. Um, but if you're somebody that's struggling with their sleep, I would definitely recommend pulling back on the caffeine.

I'm not a big tea guy. It's not that I don't— it's just I'm just not a big tea guy. But matcha is great.

I love a matcha latte. Yeah, absolutely.

And it makes you feel good.

I, I feel physically unwell drinking a caffeinated coffee. Like, I, I actually feel like I've done some type of drug because it makes me feel sick and nauseous. Um, it's— yeah, it's a very strange feeling. So, if I have coffee, it's generally decaf.

I really like love coffee, but I've got to the point where I'm very specific and careful with what I buy and who I get it from.

Absolutely.

But I dress mine up. So, I do protein powder, I do SCT oil in it, and then I have like this gut repair thing.

Amazing.

Dr. Vincent, uh, Pedri makes. I don't know if you know, but, but he does a lot of gut work, and I just enjoy it.

Yeah.

You know what I mean?

I look forward to it.

Well, shit, when I'm working during the day and I have that, I'm just like, oh man, it calms me down, which is weird because it shouldn't.

I know, but when you're getting a really good quality coffee, right, we're not just getting like a Maxwell House or Folgers. I'm from Canada, so those are their brands, but maybe like a Dunkin' Donuts coffee, we could say, here in the States. And like, when you're getting probably like an organic, mold-free, high quality, like, it's, it's a very different type of coffee.

People don't know or understand because they're used to drinking gas station coffee on the run or something, and And you just don't know. I'll always spend the money on it just because it's so just amazing. I didn't start drinking coffee till like 2 or 3 years ago.

Oh, really?

No.

And what was the reason?

Honestly, my mom had stayed with us and she was a massive coffee drinker and I tasted a little bit and then I tasted again and I bought her— her K-Cup thing broke and I bought her one and I was like, I told Queenie, screw it, let's just buy one, which is horrible, by the way, to drink out of. So, I progressed from that. And then, when I switched over into biohacking from bodybuilding and fitness, and then I met Dave, and then I met him about the danger, and then I discovered the AeroPress from him, I started pressing my coffee. And then, it was like this just thing I do every day.

Yeah, it opens up a whole new world.

Yeah. I carry that with me when I travel.

Yeah, absolutely.

Everywhere.

You can't not now.

No.

Yeah.

And, my skin also once again has looked fabulous, but I think that it's temper it upon everything else I'm doing. All right, skincare time.

Yes, big topic.

First thing I want to ask you, but I brought it up earlier, is Accutane.

Yes.

So explain, because to me, I'm just going to tell you what I know about it, which isn't a ton, is that it's kind of most— one of the more widely used things when people have an acne problem, kind of like a statin for cholesterol, right? Would you compare those equally?

Yeah, it's— so what's interesting about Accutane is It's supposed to be prescribed for severe widespread scarring acne.

Okay.

It is prescribed for way less.

Really?

I have seen clients come in and they're like, their acne would not be considered severe widespread and scarring when they were prescribed it. So I feel like instead of being held back for very severe cases, it's being used for less and less and less. Accutane is generally not, depending on the doctor, but it's not often going to be the first step. The first step is gonna be antibiotics.

Mm-hmm.

Well, they'll do topicals, but we'll often see some type of antibiotic. The record— get ready to have a panic attack— is the record for a client taking antibiotics straight is 7 years with no stopping. A client came in, 7 years on antibiotics, did not stop once. And we said, well, why didn't we stop? Like, like, well, the doctor never checked back in with me and it was just an unlimited prescription.

We're like, oh, Okay.

All right.

Really?

So you can imagine the gut issues we dealt with there. And that was— it's in the— we see this all the time, like years and years and years on very heavy dose antibiotics. Birth control would be another one, spironolactone. But Accutane, I've had clients— and again, like some people take Accutane, have incredible results. Like that does happen. And in my experience with clients we work with, we've had clients take it 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 times And their acne comes back every time, generally between the 6-month to 18-month mark.

Do you know what the mechanism of action is on Accutane, how it works?

So Accutane is a systemic drug. So it is impacting your whole body. A lot of people have really bad side effects. It's very drying to the body. So you're going to get cracked bleeding lips, very dry skin. There's always a purging stage where their skin gets 10 times worse before it gets better. It can— you can actually have lifelong side effects with your eyesight. So I remember when I first started doing this, like over a decade ago, I read like a stat that I believe, and this might, this might be wrong now, but if you were a pilot in the US military and you were taking Accutane, you couldn't fly for a period of time while on it or afterwards because of the impacts it has on your eyesight.

Really?

Yeah, that was, that was a stat from a while ago, so we'd have to look it up again. But that just goes to show you how impactful it can be on your body. It's extremely hard on your liver. And because, well, at least in Canada, because of the ways that it can cause severe birth defects, that if you're a woman on Accutane, you have to be taking birth control alongside it. Wow.

So there's toxicity within it then if it's hammering your liver?

It is extremely hard. Side effects on the body.

You know, it seems to me that there's quite a few things that, that do treatments that have a nasty effect on the liver, like stuff for your toenails and just different things that— and it's like, man, are these really worth it?

I know. And you want to know what? Did you ever deal with acne?

No, not, not at all.

Yeah. So what's really interesting is when you have acne, it almost like blinds you to any of the side effects because it impacts you on such a deep level where a lot of people if you haven't dealt with it, it's hard to understand that concept that it's not just a physical issue. It's very much a mental issue, emotional issue.

Yeah.

It's like, I like to explain it like a wet weighted blanket that you're just carrying around with you all day because we live in such a visual society that when your skin is the first thing everybody sees, you're constantly feeling judged. You don't wanna go on dates. You don't wanna be intimate with your partner. You don't wanna ask for that job promotion promotion, you don't think you're being taken seriously at work. Some clients don't even leave the house. They will cancel plans. They will say no to weddings. They won't go on vacations. I have some clients that have said like, I haven't had a photo with my children in the last 6 years and I don't want to look back 20 years from now and not have any memories with my children.

Yeah.

And like those really impact me. So it's just, I can see why they get so, they feel hopeless, right? And they're like, I don't even care. I will do whatever I have to my health long-term health effects be damned. So I, I do understand that where they're coming from, because they're just so desperate is a really good word for it.

What kind of mental problems then can that bring? Because that's actually just gonna exacerbate the problem, right? Because if you go that stressed, it's gonna make it worse.

That's a lot of clients are like, Katie, I don't like— this is like a hamster wheel I can't get off. Yeah, I'm stressed because of my acne, but I know I have acne because of my stress, right? What do I do? And that, again, that nervous system piece, that nervous system work is going to be some of the most important but most difficult work that you're going to do in the process.

Yeah, because otherwise you're robbing Peter to pay Paul and putting them on 75 different medicines.

Exactly.

So you're taking one to calm down, then you're taking another for your acne, and then the one that's taking you to calm down could have a side effect to give you more acne.

Exactly. It's— yeah, it gets crazy out there. The acne world is very, very multifaceted and complex. Wow.

Okay, so that sucks.

Yeah, it does. Yep.

What's the most common age or age bracket where people start to have problems? And, and also, what about women in menopause? Do they tend to have that problem because of the hormone fluctuation?

What's interesting is we have clients— there's 2 groups of clients we have. The clients have had it their whole life. Katie, I've had this since I was 8 years old. I am 38 now. I've been having— haven't had this for decades. I was told I would grow out of it. I'm 40. So when am I growing out of it? Then I have the other clients that have developed it in their adulthood. So maybe they've had it at 21, 28, 35, early 40s, going through perimenopause. And what's interesting, those clients, like, it literally always say, it just came out of nowhere. I don't know what happened. It just came out of nowhere. And then we start to pull it back. And I like to explain it to them that your health is a bucket. And over the years, we're slowly filling that bucket up with, you know, trauma, food poisoning, you got a parasite, you took these medications, you had this stressor happen. And all of a sudden it's like we get to that last pour of the bucket and things start spilling over.

Yeah.

So what may seem like, you know, not a big thing to you, it was the last straw for the body. And the body is like, whoa, okay, we, we gotta fix something in here. So I do see a lot of clients, um, you know, starting to get acne after they've had kids, or a lot of clients are getting it coming off of the birth control.

Yeah.

Because they've been on it for 10, 20, some clients 30 years on birth control, and they come off of it, now they're getting all these skin issues.

When it's time for like, uh, your period every month, is that a time where you could have acne breakouts? Because I've seen that too, where people have them just at that time.

Yes. So we do have clients that have more cyclical breakouts.

Yeah.

So maybe they have it in the week leading up to their period.

Yeah.

And that's where we're like, we want to be looking at, you know, is there an estrogen dominance issue? What's our progesterone looking like? Um, but a lot of people will also get it around ovulation, which is when we're having that like kind of testosterone surge. So maybe it's that, that androgen component that we want to be looking at. And we, we really do look at those cyclical patterns. But a lot of the times when clients come in, they say, I have hormonal acne. I'm like, yes, and you have hormonal acne, but guess what drives a lot of your hormones? Your gut and your detoxification system.

Yeah.

And what's interesting is for 90% of our clients, we don't even touch their sex hormones.

They're—

when you give the body what it needs, it can self-regulate your hormones. So for our clients dealing with hormonal acne, We rebalance their gut microbiome and we have that unique subset of microbes in the gut of the estrobolom, which is going to metabolize estrogen. So if your gut's struggling, if you're not having a bowel movement every single day, you're just recirculating estrogen. So that hormonal acne is actually coming from your constipation. And when we start to clear up their gut health, get their detox organs working well that are filtering your hormones, the hormones are able to self-regulate.

A lot of people don't get a lot of fiber in their diet. A lot of people are lacking. Does that have any kind of effect?

Huge. Yeah. You know something that I've been talking about for over a decade now is the importance of your bowel movements on your skin. And I remember maybe like eight 9 years ago I did a post on social media about like poop and acne, and the dermatologist students that came at me like out of the woodwork was insane. They're like, "How could you think that bowel movements have anything to do with your health and your skin?" And da da da da da. I'm like, "Well, look at now everybody. Look, doctors now talking about the importance of your bowel movements." But You have to remember that if your body's not getting rid of your waste every single day, where do you think it's going?

You'd think that'd be kind of obvious.

Kind of obvious.

I don't see how there's any kickback on that. You're, you're full of waste and garbage.

Yes.

Stupid, man.

It's crazy. And like, to think that that wouldn't have an impact. It's like if your stool's sitting too long in your digestive tract, the toxins and bacteria and hormones it's supposed to be getting rid of is going to absorb back into the body. recirculate. Now we have higher levels of inflammation, toxicity, and hormonal imbalance because we're not having a bowel movement every single day. It's shocking.

You know, I have been— like I said, I went through a reset, so I try to be very temperate on my insults.

Yes.

Or my, my thoughts. But I'll tell you this, when something's so damn obvious, like for instance— I'm just gonna say it because I think at this point we know— going to a restaurant with a mask on and taking it off to eat and then having to put it back on to go take a walk to to the bathroom, that type of shit. When you start telling me that type of stuff, I just shut off. I can't talk to you.

No.

I just can't.

I agree.

I mean, I don't care who that pisses off. That's just like common sense.

Yeah.

So when you say something like that, it's like, is that not common sense?

Is it not common sense that a bowel movement would not be one of the most important things? And it's like, you can't start doing Candida protocols and gut and detoxifications if you're not pooping every day.

Exactly.

It's not going anywhere. So bowel movements is actually the very first thing we look at alongside cortisol and blood sugar.

Okay. What about people that drink alcohol on a kind of a normal basis? Wouldn't that have some sort of an effect?

Can we all just agree that zero amount of alcohol is the best form of alcohol for the body, right?

I agree 100%.

It's— and again, coming from a millennial, like, I feel like we're the same age. So like, yeah, I feel like our generation, aren't we the drunkest generation? generation that ever existed.

I mean, I, I'd have to say it's probably a high probability.

My liver probably agrees. Like, I'm still repairing damage from my 20s.

It took me a long time to get mine right.

Yeah, so I get it. Like, you know, being in that partying phase, but you have to understand that like alcohol is a poison to the body. And you know, a lot of people are like, oh well, like it helps me sleep. I'm like, helps you fall asleep.

It doesn't help you sleep well.

Well, you are getting into REM, No. So zero amount of alcohol is the best amount. And luckily, I— it's what's interesting is all my 30s clients and above, 30s, 40s, 50s, they're like, no, I need my glass of wine. Like, how am I gonna wind down on the weekend? It's a stressful week. And then all of my like Gen Z clients, none of them drink. Yeah, the 20s are like, oh no, I don't drink alcohol. I'm like, no, I love that. Stay that way.

It's great. I, I— and I used to— and I, and I say this, the, the— if you want to fall asleep fast, Alcohol may be the best thing, and if you want to sleep well, it's definitely the worst.

Definitely the worst.

Oh, some of the worst sleep nights I ever had, waking up in 2 and 3 hours, was those nights.

Absolutely. And like, you know, everyone knows it's not good for the liver, but it's not good for your gut health. It's irritating to the gut lining, your hormones, your blood sugar, your all of the things.

You know what, when you want something to, to go your way, you look for whatever excuse that you can make for it.

1,000%. That is human nature.

It is. And so it's This is the 2 things with the alcohol. Well, my red wine's got resveratrol.

Eat grapes.

Take the supplement.

Yeah.

Go eat some food.

Exactly.

That is—

that is—

I hear that all the time.

That is the worst damn excuse I've ever heard in my life.

And I grew up in an Italian household.

Me too.

So I understand the whole wine dinner culture component.

My family's full Italian and I despise wine.

You're like, I can't do it.

I hate it.

Yeah.

I mean, and here's another one too, and I've lived this and like, I had to go to prison to stop drinking.

Okay.

Like—

Silver lining.

Yeah.

So, um, when you, when you start to say, oh, but once in a while and once in a while and all of this, it— okay, fine, it may not kill you right now, but did— just like you, you said it perfectly. Every time you drink it, there's poison going into your system. And you can call it fearmongering, whatever. It's a fact. It's, it's proven. Drink till your fucking wheels fall off, whatever. But we know what we're saying.

Mm-hmm.

Every time you have one, What kind of an effect does it have?

Yeah, like just the sleep alone where, you know, it's— you're not gonna be able to get a deep sleep. It's going to be impacting your blood sugar. You know, the next day you're going to feel crappier. You know, you're gonna— you're like, I need to take ibuprofen. And I'm like, oh, I'm gonna go and eat that crappy food and the bag of chips. It's like, it's not just the alcohol, it's all of the things that come after.

It's, it's a multitude of cascading things that happen. And I wish people would stop that. Everybody wants to say fearmongering when it doesn't roll the way they want it to roll.

Every time. And like, you said is people will always look for the answer they want to the question. Yes.

And it's like— and I say this all the time, I'm not your dad. Do whatever you want. I'm simply just laying it out. I'm not selling you anything. Yeah.

Make your own decision. I think that's what's so important is at least if you have the information, you have the informed consent or the informed choices to go and decide what you want to do with your life.

No, because my mom drank soda every day and smoke cigarettes and live to be 100. Yeah, that's the one I get all the time.

All the time.

Oh, man.

Like, well, what's the laundry list of medications?

Exactly. And how well was that 100 years?

Did we live well into our centurion years?

Right, exactly. I just— whatever. Skincare time.

Yeah, everyone's favorite topic.

Mine too.

Love it.

I modeled in my 20s for a decade. So I've used every skincare under the sun. I am so damn familiar. So let's go down the line then on— because some of these are really expensive.

An arm and a leg.

Yeah.

Like a fortune.

Some of the ones that I'll bring up by name that I used that were like— because I have hypopigmentation, I did— I think I worked a lot through it with some of the skin correctors that I used. Um, and SkinMedica was kind of the one that helped me with that. But I started with Obagi. So these creams, like, are they really worth the money that we spend on them, in your opinion?

I think it depends on the branding, right? Or sorry, it depends on the brand, not the branding.

Is—

I like to say that skincare is a tool in the toolbox. A lot of people say, Katie, well, like, do I just stop using my skincare? I'm like, no, no, we want to have skincare because it's helping to reduce the severity, help to, you know, help with the scarring, the pigmentation. Like, having a good skincare routine is important. I don't think that you always have to be spending an outrageous amount on all of the high-end products.

Mm-hmm.

I understand people have budgets and like we need to work within their budget. But I do think if you're gonna spend your money on one type of skincare product, it's gonna be your serums. So your serums is where the science behind it matters.

Okay.

The delivery system matters. You want it to go deeper into the skin. So if I'm gonna be spending, investing my money in something, it'll be a serum. And then maybe your cleanser or like your face cream, you, you could, you could do a little cheaper, but it, it really is that serum. science behind it. But again, like I have some, I know of some really great brands that are like $50 or $30 for a product that are phenomenal. And then I've, you know, used ones that are a few hundred dollars and they're equally phenomenal. So I think it depends on the brand.

How many times a day would you recommend washing your face?

1 to 2 times a day. I know there's this whole like trend on TikTok where it's like, I don't wash my face in the morning. I think it's gonna be dependent on the person and where they are. I personally still wash my face Twice a day, but we don't want to be doing it more than that because we're going to be stripping our skin barrier. We want to be protecting our skin barrier. So making sure that we aren't overdoing it because we could be drying our skin out, especially if you're using a lot of like stacked acids and harsh ingredients.

Okay, so when you wash your face, like I used to have a Clarisonic that would, you know, you— right, yeah, all over. Is that bad or good, or how do you recommend washing your face?

Always have clean hands.

Yeah, of course.

So I find a lot of times those tools can harbor bacteria and if they're not getting sterilized and cleaned properly. So clean hands, making sure that you're singing like your ABCs once or twice to get right into the hairline, like under the jawline. If you are wearing makeup, especially in the evening for women, you want to be doing maybe a double cleanse. So maybe you're using an oil-based cleanser to be physically breaking the SPF down or the makeup. getting that off and then doing a second cleanse with like a water-based cleanser to make sure you're getting it all off, especially if you wear makeup or SPF.

Thoughts on moisturizers? Because I've had so many different differing opinions there.

So I think they're quite important. Um, and I know especially if people are like, oh, I have oily skin, I can't moisturize. Well, if we're constantly dehydrating, your skin's gonna say, oh, I don't have enough hydration here, I need to produce more sebum. So we're producing more of that sticky oily substance that'll clog the the pores and lead to breakouts. So like a lighter moisturizer, you don't need to have like a super thick, heavy moisturizer. Yeah, but maybe you need a little bit lighter of a moisturizer, gel moisturizer, but it'll also kind of dictate where you live.

Okay. All right. And then what are some ingredients that are in products that we need to be aware of that are actually quite harmful that are probably in a lot of the things that we use?

We probably need a full other episode for that alone. This is actually how I got into the health and wellness space is I Growing up, like I had like a 6-foot-long makeup table from IKEA, had like MAC makeup and all of like the classic early 2000s makeup and hair stuff. Like it was out of hand. I can picture it. And my mom bought, I was probably like 19 at the time. My mom bought me this book called There's Lead in Your Lipstick. And I was like, mom, this is BS. Like I don't have lead in my lipstick. My products are fine. And just to appease her, I started reading it. I'm like, I'm like, there's no way. And I remember sitting in my bedroom flipping over bottle after bottle and being, what are you? In the garbage. Every single product had multiple hormone-disrupting ingredients, multiple cancer-causing ingredients. And what's interesting is, you know, they say the average woman puts on over 168 chemicals on her body every single day. Because think about it, you wash your face, you brush your teeth, you shampoo your hair, you conditioner, maybe put a treatment in, your hairspray. You're putting your makeup on, you're putting bronzer, like you're putting multiple products a day, deodorant, body lotion, hand cream, and all of those ingredients are going into your body.

And what's interesting is a lot of, I think it was back in the '70s, an act was passed where a lot of chemical ingredients got grandfathered in without testing. So we had all of these ingredients added in and they kind of took the stance of, oh, well, if someone complains and there's an issue, then we'll look at the safety issues. So a lot of these ingredients that we've been using for decades have never been safety tested. And even if they are safety tested, we have no way of knowing the cumulative effects of not just that one product, but how are the ingredients in that one product interacting with all of the other ingredients that you're putting on?

Yeah.

So that's something that's pretty much impossible to study because we're all putting on different ingredients. And for years, they've been putting cancer-causing ingredients, hormone-disrupting, like I'm talking parabens, phthalates, fragrances.

Right.

All of these ingredients which are known to mimic your hormones in your body. So if you're trying to balance your hormones, but you're slathering on all of these ingredients that are mimicking hormones in your body, you're, you know, you're kind of just pouring fuel on the fire. So it's really being aware of what you're putting on your body and learning to kind of be a detective. And there's so many great resources these days. Aside from AI, you can literally go and ask it anything. You know, places like the EWG Skin Deep database where you can go in, type a product in. If they don't have your products, you can copy and paste the ingredients and it'll give you a toxicity rating of 1 to 10 on how toxic your products are. Think Dirty. Like, there's so many apps you can use.

Okay, so here's my advice. Yeah, without knowing the ingredients by name, if you pick up a product, yes, and the ingredient list is longer than a Cheesecake Factory menu, don't take it.

Don't take it. Yeah, put it back.

Oh shit. Some of those are like a book.

It's insane.

Seriously, 'cause, you know, I've always done that with the protein powders where you pick some up and it's like, man, there's way too many ingredients in here. And then I see the ones with 4 or 5 and it's like, okay, now we're talking.

Yeah, absolutely.

I did a run through Ulta the other day and did that picking out stuff.

It's terrifying.

Yeah, it is. And I finally found one, you know, a few body washes and stuff that like 4 or 5 ingredients. You know, I want one more question from you. Because Dr. Pompa especially and me got into this, uh, about anything that has a scent.

Yes.

Is it really bad to have anything scented? Because I had to be careful with the lavender around my cat. It freaked me out because I didn't realize, and I threw everything I had because that's like my favorite scent. I just get rid of it all. I don't care what I spent, throw it away.

Yeah, it's— the fragrances is kind of scary. It's like once you go down the rabbit hole with ingredients in your personal care products, it's hard to come back out of that rabbit hole. Because it's terrifying what they're allowed to put in it. And what's interesting about fragrance is it's a loophole for a lot of manufacturers where they can hide undisclosed ingredients labeled as fragrance because it's considered a trade secret. Like, you don't have to disclose your trade secret.

Uh-huh.

So it's— I think they did a study a few years ago and they took like the top 13 perfumes across the US and they found that there was an app there, like there was an insane amount, like 6, 7, 8, sometimes least 12 ingredients in the perfume that wasn't listed on the ingredient list. Oh shit. And how do you know that those aren't cancer-causing, hormone-disrupting ingredients? So fragrance is a pretty scary one.

We have so many things that we're gonna have to get into on another one. Like, I really want to get into like colognes, perfumes, fragrances, toothpaste, like all of this stuff.

It's a whole nother world.

Yeah, but like ingredients breakdowns and stuff, because I think that there's a lot, a lot, a lot of things that people would never have a clue about.

Never. Absolutely not.

And then when you get this, it's idiopathic, we can't figure out what's wrong with you. It's sitting on your counter. It's in your, your drawer, your medicine cabinet, the culprit.

Your cleaners. Yeah, like your cleaning products. Like, this is a whole nother podcast. What you store your food in, the water bottles, like when you go down that rabbit hole, like it's scary. It's pretty scary.

You have to start cutting them one by one by one.

It's not an overnight thing because you'll drive yourself crazy. Yeah.

And your kitchen and house will be empty.

You'll have nothing left.

Me and Queenie did that. I said, you know what, let's go through the, the thing here and let's take every powder and supplement and everything we have and everything with red dye or sucralose or anything. Let's look at it and take count. And I was like, come on, man.

Everything. It is out of hand with the ingredients that they're allowed. And especially in what's crazy is children's products. Like, they were still using talc.

That's what pisses me off the most.

Like, you'll still— like, you still find talc and parabens in children's products. And it's even worse for children because their bodies are so much smaller that it's infuriating that companies are okay with that.

When I'm on the fence about should I cover a topic or not, and then I see it relates to children, I'm like, I'm in, in, I'm in. Just forget it.

They're innocent. They're innocent, innocent beings.

Anything that hurts an animal or a child, I'm in. Yeah, it's sickening.

It's sickening what manufacturers will, will do.

Well, we're gonna talk about that after. So yeah, I mean, time flew and I feel like we didn't cover a fraction, but at the same hand, it was like super enlightening and super detailed. And I'm glad that you got to showcase multifacets of what you do. That's what I enjoy about this. When I get guests in here, you never do the same thing you did anywhere else.

No, never.

No, I want people to see more about you, which I feel like they certainly did. Um, and so I feel like that's when I do my job, and then you get to shine. And I hope that people really felt you shine because I did. And I think that everything you said resonated extremely well. So I appreciate it.

Well, thank you for having me.

Tell everybody where they can find you and, and anything that you may offer or anything to help people with, with what they have going on here.

Well, they can always find more at Instagram. That's where I hang out most, @katiestewartwellness. Across the board on social media, @katiestewartwellness. Our podcast, Keep It Clear, They want to come and get help with us, they can work with us inside the Clear Skin Solution. They can find us at katiesteerwellness.com.

Sweet. Go check her out because the, the information I knew was going to be good, but I didn't realize it was going to be this damn good. So check her out, please. Descriptions, check that out. You'll be able to follow Katie. Thank you again, Katie, for coming, but also your work because it's amazing.

Thank you.

I appreciate it.

And thank you for your work.

Thank you. I appreciate that. That being said, everyone, stay tuned for plenty more to come. Dylan Gemelli and Katie Stewart signing off.