Transcript of Mina Kimes, Shipping Joe Burrow, & Dan Campbell's Destiny

Worst, I gotta go with— okay, it's tempting to pick the Steelers beat the, you know, disgusting Stripes. It's actually Aaron Rodgers's other team, the weird pack. You know what I'm talking about? Those weird Packers throwbacks.

Navy?

What the hell with Navy?

Where you, you, you're in your name, the brown helmet. Like, just so humiliating.

So you call— you're, you're in Green Bay. The, the, the minimum standard is that green is in your uniform. I don't care what you did 70 years ago. Those people are all gone now. Oh, I didn't see you come in there, my fellow football American. Great news, you know who's coming in right behind you? The 2026 NFL regular season, that's who. We have a lot of work to do before then, like we have to figure out which AFC and NFC teams are going to miss the playoffs. Plus, our guest Mina Kimes is going to weigh in on one quarterback and one head coach for 2026? We'll also get your answer to that question. Plus, Major Randy is going to tell us why you think Joe Burrow ought to pair up with Ben Johnson. Then, state of the Detroit Lions— sneaky important year for Dan Campbell in the rugged NFC North. Kenneth Walker or his Seattle replacement, Ja'Darian Price? The Fantasy Fountain, Gino Fuentes, is going to weigh in on that one. Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy are back together, if you didn't hear. Do they have a shot I'm not talking about are they going to get a shot.

I mean, like, because we know how at least one of them feels. I'm talking about do they have a shot at winning it all? Let's dig in. Let's start the show. Yes. Hi and hello, my fellow football Americans, and welcome to Football America, presented as ever by our pals at DraftKings Sports, now in all 50 of these United States of Football. Football America, the regular season is drawing ever closer. I'm over the moon about it. I am not watching the month-long lie to your eyes called preseason games. I don't care about the scrimmage clips. I hope that my favorite players don't get hurt, my fantasy players. That's about the value of, of preseason football in my opinion. In the meantime, we have Mina Kimes coming up. Like we say, there they are behind the glass as I sit. In Miami, Florida, talking to my guys, Geno Fuentes and Buddy Budowski. Budowski outfitted head to toe in Dolphins gear. Yeah, I got to get out of pride.

I got to get ready for the season, you know, Dave. No, I'm still proud to be a Dolphin fan as much as they've brought me nothing but misery. We got to remind ourselves of good times. Yeah.

Well, instead of the aqua, shouldn't your shirt be red? Because that's what the Dolphins are doing with 2026, right?

What?

Waving the red shirt?

They're redshirting.

Oh Jesus, that one went whoosh.

Yeah, right. Waving a white flag.

And I was like, white flag, red, what?

All right, we have a lot to dig in on as we try to figure out where this season's gonna go, uh, with, with the great Mina Kimes in just a second here. Before we get to her, let's do a little Fantasy Fountain. And before we do even that Let's take care of our business. It's episode 76. Who is the player in NFL and/or all of sports who wore that jersey number best? Number 76.

It's not a great number, but I mean, we got, we got two that really piqued my interest here. One, Orlando Pace, just absolute beast. Rams, Bears, Pro Football Hall of Fame.

Great one.

But then the more interesting one, Lou Groza, offensive tackle, slash kicker.

Ah, back in the day.

I wish that, you know, I wish that you— that the NFL would be better. I know people think I'm making a joke. It would be way better if you made position players do the kicking. Now these guys are way too good and they have nothing to do with the rest of the sport for 59 minutes. They, they have nothing to do with it, and then they just run out there and do their one little thing that they do. And they— and ironically or not, they would be among the worst human beings in our society to throw out there and be like, hey, go do other football stuff.

Absolutely, they would be miserable at any other football.

The funny thing here is that he was a, he was a star kicker and an elite level offensive tackle, so he was not bad at either of these things.

But you know his nickname, right? You know his nickname?

Don't.

The Toe.

The Toe.

The Toe. He was the, the College Kicker Award for best kicker in the country is the Lou Groza Award, is it not?

I believe that's correct. I just like that. I mean, that's pretty, pretty on the nose, on the toe.

And Dave, obviously, if you're talking '76, you got to talk P.K. Subban.

P.K. Subban. You left out Mongo himself, Steve McMichael. One of the great things, him, all his Bears teammates, when he found out that he was going to get into the Pro Football Hall of Fame on his deathbed and with his wife, and for all those guys who he played with on that high-end '85 Bears defense, that they were all standing around him for for the big moment for him. That was lovely stuff. And '76, on the banks of the Three Rivers, old people will tell you that's the best edition of the Steelers, or at least their defense, the 1976— dig this, just a little bit of history for you— they're 1-4, Terry Bradshaw's their quarterback, he gets hurt. They're the two-time champs at that point, they're trying to three-peat, he gets hurt, they're 1-4, then all of a sudden The defense goes on a heater unlike anything you've ever seen since. 10 games, 5 shutouts. Their foes averaged 3 points a game. They went 10-0. Franco Harris and Rocky Bleier got hurt in the playoffs, and so they lost to the Raiders. But that, to many, is the best defense. But I also— mentioning Mongo McMichael— people always invoke still, like, oh, this defense, blank defense, ain't the '85 Bears.

We need to update that. Let's— let's drop us a line, would you, at Football America, #FootballAmerica. America. Let us know, what's the best defense since the '85 Bears? Because let's update that reference, right?

The best defense I've ever seen while watching football was the 2000 Baltimore Ravens. That's the one that comes to mind for me.

See, so I hate this to agree, but you're probably right.

When I go to the most recent reference for great defense, mine would go to the best name for a defense ever, the Legion of Boom.

Legion of Boom is strong, and, uh, that works neatly because while they won, uh, that Super Bowl, the Seahawks, as you may have heard, won the most recent Super Bowl as well. They're now the stars of Hard Knocks. Man, I don't know, we got to dig in on McDonald a little bit too. Not exactly a leader of men vibe, right? It's a little—

haven't gotten around to watching Hard Knocks yet. I think I'm going to this weekend. I'm going to watch the first episode this weekend, but when I do, I'll report back to you.

If one thing pops in terms of football, it's Ja'Darian Price, the replacement for Kenneth Walker, drafted out of Notre Dame. And that brings us to this week's Fantasy Fountain, NBD, Geno Fuentes, tell us about the Seahawks rookie runner Zach Charbonnet on the shelf to start the season. This probably means good stuff, eh?

So Zach Charbonnet tore his ACL in the playoffs last year, so that's going to be, you know, a late start to the season for him. First-round pick on a running back is usually a good bet. There's Jahdarian Price. Right now he's going in the 6th round. I have to imagine that's going to go up because anyone who goes on Hard Knocks and gets their life story told to, you know, the country at large is just going to become a fan favorite. So I'm sure by the end of all this, he'll probably end up in the third round. I don't know if I should be comfortable with that because Zach Charbonnet will eventually come back.

Oh, I think if he gets out of the second round, I'd be stunned. There is an effect that happens with Hard Knocks, even though it's not at the height of its powers anymore.

But it's splitting carries. It's splitting— it's at some point Charbonnet will be back. And you know that the Seahawks love to give him carries because they love taking away carries from Kenneth Walker.

He bangs around real good. There's no doubt.

Well, it's just— it's a weird thing because Zach Charbonnet, yes, you're going to want him toward the end of the season, but who wants to draft this guy and have him sitting there for 2 months?

And, you know, unlike a quarterback as the opposite end of the spectrum, running backs, plug them in.

It's not like there's a learning curve to hand them the ball and run them through the C-gap.

If you want to get off to a fast start, Jahdarian Price is likely going to be your guy because he's got Eugene Monroe behind him and really nothing else. Zach Trubini will eventually get back, but he's not going to be back till November, and until then I have to imagine they're just going to feed the young legs of Price.

Some questions. Clint Kubiak, of course, has moved to Vegas to toil with Tom Brady and their new friend Fernando. Kenneth Walker is in KC. The defense loses a couple of big pieces in Reek Woolin, and Boye Mafe goes to Cincinnati. I keep saying it. Look out for them Bengals. I like them Bengals this year. I don't like them, but I think they're going to be good. Long story short, Gino, you can only have one. Ja'Darian Price or Kenneth Walker?

Oh, Kenneth Walker.

You sure?

Yeah, because Kenneth Walker, they paid him, he's gonna be the star guy. You know Patrick Mahomes is gonna need to lean on the run. But Ja'Darian Price has this unknown at the end of the season. Zach Charbonnet comes back. Is Ja'Darian Price the number 2 at that point? Is Ja'Darian Price healthy at that point from all the workload he's had before then? So, I mean, if it's just down to the two of them, I personally pick Kenneth Walker.

It's interesting with the usage that you see from Seattle running backs and how that transfers to a contending team like KC that has not depended, not leaned on a feature back for the vast majority of their run in the last decade or so.

So they haven't had a feature back. Yes, I hear you.

Now they do. But we, but we're assuming a fair amount about how he's going to plug in and be a day one star for them. Maybe they do kind of flip. From being Patrick Mahomes-based and try to lean on the run a little bit more than what they have over the years. All right, interesting stuff, uh, Fantasy Fountain. And now let's dig in on the real thing with Mina Kimes. All right, she's the host of the Mina Kimes Show featuring Lenny and Viewer Discretion with David Dennis. She's a high finance whiz, a subpar lifer, a Love Island insider, and now, thanks to her Seahawks in football, and her brain in Jeopardy, a multi-sport champion. Long story short, she's what Jay Gatsby's pal Nick Carraway might describe as that most limited of all specialists, the well-rounded man. Except like Éowyn at the end of Lord of the Rings, she is no man. She is Mina Kimes. What's happening? Happy football season. What's going down?

Hello, what an introduction. I'm so curious to hear what your thoughts are about my thoughts. After hearing that you've consumed them, because I'm still working through my thoughts. And one of the things I love about doing Division previews, which is what I'm doing right now on my podcast, Meeting Couch Stokers with June Lenny, is it really— it's kind of necessary at this point to, like, refocus, not just, like, see who's actually on the, you know, every team, right? But also go back sometimes, watch a little film, revisit some of the stats. So I'm not quite ready, but I'm very close.

That's right. And you try to include— you're not just analytics, you're not just X and Os, you're a human being as well, and involve what's under the helmet as well as you try to factor in all those details. Before we start talking about the football players, college football likes doing their top 25 before and during and after the season. Um, as a human being, where do you rank among your top 25 favorite people?

Where do I myself rank?

Yeah, you, um, as a person, not as an animal.

Yeah, I would say outside the top 10, probably, but inside the top 20. I think it's important to have self-love but not be excessive about it.

I like that answer. I like that answer. Um, I wish I could achieve that level for myself, but I appreciate where you're coming from. All right, let's get warmed up here. I know you are, you already are, but for the audience's sake, Here we go. One head coach for 2026. Go.

One head coach.

Get one head coach. Go ahead.

I get to choose any of them.

Any of them.

I go McVay, probably because I don't know anything about what we're doing here. I don't know who my quarterback is. I don't know how good my roster is. And he strikes me as the kind of guy who I could probably get a decent amount of wins with most quarterbacks.

OC.

Well, I don't— doesn't really matter because I got Sean McVay, so I kind of already Cheated you there. But of the non-McVays, man, there's a lot of play-calling head coaches now actually, which makes, uh, you know, uh, picking the next head coach kind of difficult. Um, gosh, um, OC— I'm trying to think of a guy who's not already a head coach. This is actually really hard, dude, because it is mostly head coaches at this point. I'm optimistic. No, I'm not gonna choose him. Um, tricky, tricky. I keep going off all the top 10 offenses that I like. All— it's all the head coaches or the play callers. Trying to think of one.

It—

that's it. I mean, I know I'm buying time here. Is there a top 10 offense where it's not the head coach?

Well, here's an interesting place for you, I think, and we're gonna get to the Lions in, in just a bit here. But what about Drew Petzing? I think this is an interesting swing by the Lions. Get Ben Johnson's best pal to basically replicate what Ben what Ben Johnson was doing 2 years ago.

I think that's a good bet, especially because he's been given so much to work with. I think in Baltimore, Declan Doyle is going to be set up for success. Same tree, also Ben Johnson affiliated. So he is another kind of buy, buy the youth, you know, he's like 29. So that's one that I like. Yeah, either of them. See, oh, Mike McDaniel, he's an offensive coordinator now, right? I forgot.

That's easy.

Boom. I don't know why I didn't go to him. I was still thinking of him as a head coach.

Okay, DC now.

Okay, uh, so here I'm gonna go Vic Fangio, um, because Mike McDonald is the head coach. And then after him you're looking at Vance Joseph as a possibility, um, to see you at the top. Oh, Flores. Flores is, is a good choice as well, but I'll go Fangio.

Yeah, I know. And yet it seems like if I'm picking up what you've been laying down, you're not enthused about the Vikings. We'll get back to them. The one QB for 2023 One QB for 2026.

I'll go— I'm gonna go Patrick Mahomes because we're not— you're not buying me— you're not— we're not saying quarterback in their offense, you're just taking someone in a vacuum, right? I'm sticking with Mahomes. Okay, O-line, let's go with the Denver Broncos.

And one defense, Houston Texans. Oh, I thought you might go Broncos again. All right, here's what I could— based on what my Cliff's Notes of what Mina Kimes' world view is as we head into 2026. Check me after I run through this. Here's what I've written down: the Broncos are the AFC's best top-to-bottom team, the Rams are the NFL's best top-to-bottom team, Seattle is the NFC's 1A. You're not as bullish on the Madden cover boy Caleb Williams as a lot of other people are. You expect Jesse Minter to have the same effect on the Ravens defense that Mike McDonald's had on the Seahawks defense since he came over from the Ravens. Travis Hunter is the AFC South's X-factor, but the Texans' O-line is the X-factor of the whole AFC. How say you?

I like all of that. A little bit of context for the Caleb take: I think the only reason I'm not as high on him maybe as some is that on my podcast, Ben Solak ranked him 8th overall. So I am very— I know. So I'm— I am high on Caleb. I think arrow is pointed up. I'm excited about him. I just don't think he's the already the 8th best, you know. I did— to be fair to Ben, that my exercise is a 3-year timeline you're drafting, whatever. But I just thought I was a little bit more I, I had Love over him, for example, in, in the NFC North.

I know you did. And I think the same issue, and it's not a small one, that everybody has assumed will just resolve itself because it did for Josh Allen. But of course Caleb Williams is not the same person as Josh Allen. Accuracy, because he had this historic, a historical turnaround, doesn't mean Caleb Williams is going to do the same. Is that the long and short of it?

Yeah, the accuracy, just especially on like some of the easy throws Um, I think that's the main thing, but it's a big thing. Accuracy is arguably the most important part of playing the quarterback position. Uh, so I think just if we're really going to talk about him in that category, top 10 category, you just need to see a little bit more down-to-down consistency.

Okay. Um, you lose the right to watch Love Island for the rest of your life if you get this one wrong. So the stakes big for you here. One AFC team. This is a game we like to play annually, and you think it would be an easy one but it's very difficult. It's no playoffs for you. One AFC team that absolutely, positively is not going to wind up in the playoffs?

Cleveland Browns.

I'm sorry, Cleveland Browns and Jimmy Haslam and Deshaun Chidore. You did it to yourselves. No playoffs for you. One NFC team?

Oh, that's harder, that's harder. Um, the Arizona Cardinals.

Hmm, I'm hearing buzz about that team. Very hard to divine what they are because everybody's all over themselves about them in fantasy terms but not in real football terms.

Well, it's not even that I think the Arizona Cardinals are as bad as the Browns, the Dolphins, etc. They're in the NFC West, right? So you just— it's a hellscape. So if the Arizona Cardinals were in the NFC South, they might not be my answer.

But this one might hurt. This might hurt even more. Than losing, uh, Love Island. You lose all rights to listen to any of your Pavement albums. One NFC team that definitely will make the playoffs: the Los Angeles Rams. Okay, I feel like they're— you know, their quarterback has a bad back, and I don't— and are they really gonna roll? Is, is Ty Simpson really their backup QB? They're, they're— the price of this team is like This is the year, like, and your backup is a rookie who was kind of— a lot of people evaluated as a little bit of a reach where they got him.

I think that if Matthew Stafford actually were to get hurt, they might get a veteran, maybe lure Jimmy G out of retirement or something.

Yeah, maybe go the Colts route and dig up one of, uh, their, their proud alumni. All right, AFC team that definitely will make the playoffs. This is a murky one based on how last season went.

I'll go with the Denver Broncos. I think they're just such a complete team. I mean, it'd be hard— the Bills are right there, that's the easy one as well. I'm optimistic about the Ravens. I think the Patriots will be good, but the Broncos to me just seem like the most complete team.

And that does not necessarily equal you thinking Bo Nix is a, um, sort of a quarterback you could drop into any situation. Rather, he is the Drew Brees 2.0. He is the optimal fit for what Sean Payton wants to do. Is that accurate?

Oh, I don't think he's Drew Brees 2.0. I, I think, uh, he has a lot to work on and areas to improve, but he's shown enough where I feel comfortable saying on that team it's, it's good enough to win a Super Bowl, which is not nothing.

Oh, I mean, but the addition, it happened so long ago. I think that we continue to suffer from short and long-term amnesia. You forget that, like, oh yeah, the Seahawks won that, but also Drake Maye was probably hurt in that Super Bowl, and people just wash over that and what they saw most recently. I think the addition of Waddle. Yeah, one that kind of—

I don't—

everything that's happened since has now gotten obscured. That is a massive piece to drop into that offense.

Yes, totally agree. Actually, I really want Waddle in fantasy in like every league when I get a chance to draft him. I think he's so good. Um, and it got kind of slept on because what— you know, he was playing with Tyreek, and then when Tyreek was gone, the offense kind of went off. You know, Tua sort of— well, everything that happened with him that it got a little bit ignored that in spite of that, in spite of the greater attention paid to him, the quarterback uncertainty, he still produced like a close to top 10 level. So I, I think he's going to be excellent in Denver.

Well, you like to do your 3-year evaluation. I do a, a version of that. It's called the time capsule. Let's jump into the time capsule now and get you on the record. A few years ago, you did pretty well when I broke out the literal 10-foot pole. You said Patrick Mahomes will retire as the greatest quarterback in the history of people. I think that's still in play for him. And you said way back before it was in vogue that Cam Hayward is going to the Hall of Fame. So you have a good track record here. Now let's get into this one.

Where are—

what's our, what's our perception of the Dan Campbell era Detroit Lions 3 years from now?

Oh, that's a good one. Um, I think that because of the core that they have and because I think he is a very good coach, they will still be competitive. Uh, I don't think fans will turn on him. Maybe I'm wrong, it happens all the time. But I think the quote that always rings in my head is when they missed— when they lost in the NFC, which game was it? What year was it? A couple years ago in the playoffs. And he spoke about—

years ago when they got whipped.

Yeah. And they were so hurt, right? And when he was like, yeah, I'll be honest, there's no guarantee we're gonna be back here— paraphrasing, but it's very true. And I think just the attrition that's hit this team since then is pretty hard to ignore. Lions fans have been really giving me a lot of grief for not ranking them higher in my power rankings, but I think that defense has so many problems right now with injuries. So It's— I still obviously see some really incredible talented offensive players, and I'm optimistic, cautiously, about Petzing. But I do think, you know, the team isn't the dominant sort of NFC powerhouse that they were, uh, at pretty recently.

A brute of a division. And one of the few things really I feel like there's a big divide between where I am, and in fact Nate Theiss who was with us a couple few weeks ago, and where you are, is the Vikings. I think if the Vikings— obviously in that neighborhood— if the Vikings rise up, that could well diminish, especially with the other two, um, good teams in that division. Um, as one of the great empaths in society, I have to point it out, the broadcasters do— are not about that. They are more empathetic even than I, apparently, because they have to declare Lions have nothing to hang their head about as they leave San Francisco Stadium a couple of title games ago after that deflection that landed in Brandon Iyekwui. You miss your opportunity sometimes, it ain't gonna come back around. Like, well, there's nothing to worry about, Jared Goff's gonna be back. I don't know, he might not be back. And so I'm anxious to see that. Moving on, next time capsule. I do think though that the Lions kind of are, at least on the NFC side, they are— if there's an America's Team, this is the Rorschach team.

I think a lot of people are way higher on the Lions or way lower on the— their big swing of results for them in terms of our collective perception of where they're headed. True or no?

Yeah, I think if they really lose pace or their standing this year, there's going to start to be, right, oh, the same old Lions kind of talk. And, and I was— maybe, you know, I could have been a little bit premature and thinking people would still ride for Campbell. I could see pitchforks coming for him for sure, when in truth Mm-hmm. I think the GM maybe deserves a little bit more smoke for, you know, he got so much love for those early drafts and the Goff trade and whatnot. And like, you know, maybe like you'd have to take a harder look at like the last two classes.

So by the way, I think the Rorschach team, although I'm starting to hear more and more buzz for them in the positive with very little cynicism despite how CJ Stroud looked last year, is the Texans. Tyce took him to go to the Super Bowl, and I know you as well. And that O-line is everything for them, right?

Yeah, the offense in general. The O-line is definitely core. You know, I was— we're doing the AFC South this week on my pod, and I went back and watched some of the Texans offense. And first of all, CJ Stroud was like much better during this season than, uh, I think— obviously he was— it can be hard not to be better than him.

But like, that refers back to my earlier comments about what we most recently saw. I know, I know, because he didn't play well.

So many examples like that I can point to, especially especially when it comes to quarterbacks. So when we look back at the 2025 season, but the thing I'll say too about Stroud is like the— and I think Nick Kaley, their offensive coordinator, deserves a little bit of grace. The offensive line, it was so obvious they were trying to compensate for it constantly. Um, horrible rushing team. And I think I, I saw I had a stat that was like they had something like— I think they were like dead last in success rate in the red zone or something.— or close to it. The, the all kinds of like jumbo packages, quick game, rolling Stroud out. It was just always like so clearly hamstrung by how bad the line was. And they remade it again. I think it'll probably be a little bit better, but it's still probably not going to be a strength.

Boy, that to me, if there is a sort of thing about the way the NFL— like, are teams going to all go heavier? Or go lighter, or, you know, and who is going to dictate that? Are our offenses or defenses in 2026 building on what we've seen the last couple of years? But to the, um, back to the time capsule, what are we saying about George Pickens 3 years from now?

Uh, I think we probably are talking about him as a top 10 receiver still. Yeah, I mean, obviously the question is consistency and. But he's so talented, man. And it's maybe there'll be down periods and, you know, I don't know, more inconsistency, but I think his ceiling is as high as almost any receiver in football. I think the really fascinating question though is like, what does he actually stay in Dallas? Do they find a way to keep him? And if not, you know, then where does his career go? Because I do think in the wrong place you could hit the downside rather than the upside.

You would think that would be Dallas though, right? I mean, given its history and all of that, if it— you would think Big D is a place where he might blow up. He didn't. He behaved himself, kind of, sort of, not all the way, but that's part of the George Pickens tax. I like those Cowboys quite a bit, but what does it tell you that the Steelers— about the Steelers process, that they said can't win with a guy like that, and then he goes and thrives in Dallas? For the record, they haven't won yet with him. Nevertheless, where do you perceive the Steelers to be with their old quarterback and the roster overall?

I think I've been ranking them around 20-ish, right? Um, and the quarterback is the limiting factor. I mean, there's, you know, it's not a perfect roster, but I think it's pretty damn good. Like, the offense, I think, um, the way they've built this around Aaron Rodgers is smart. The receivers that they've added make sense for his skill set. They make sense together, like it's a well-constructed group. I think the offensive line has the potential to improve with some of the little tweaks and guys moving around and such. The interior is a strength. I think the run game should be good. The question is just, you know, whether or not Rodgers hamstrings them by not pushing the ball downfield sufficiently or moving around. And it's hard for me to think that's going to reverse compared to what we saw last year. He's only getting older. But I do think even if he doesn't, because of the receivers that they've added, the offense could still be efficient if not like terribly explosive.

You know, I, I always go back to the same, you know, he was, he was a more dynamic performer than Peyton or Brady were in their respective primes. Do you, do you like Rodgers at 43 more or less about the same as you like Brady at say 44? Peyton, when the Broncos made their run, you know, he concedes he was a passenger for that 2015 title. Is he more of a detriment based on his frame of mind. We talked to Nate Tice who said, you know, my— you and I have gone back and forth offline about— I just think he's spooked at his age about getting smacked around.

He doesn't want to. Yeah, that's exactly it. When you watch him, when he does throw the ball downfield, it mostly looks fine. Honestly, there's some moments where you're like, hey, it's not as strong as it used to be, but he's perfectly capable of doing it. I think the problem is because of the, you know, not wanting to be hit and also not being able to move around much, right? Which he's very aware of his physical limitations in that respect. He's just not going to do it a lot, and sometimes that'll like result in, you know, dirting it, short-arming it, um, passing up on opportunities. You didn't really see that with Brady, to be honest, at the end. Uh, I might be looking at the past, that year, final year in Tampa, through rose-colored glasses, but he hurdled it a lot.

I think what What Ty said, that was the hypothesis that I had not really considered, is he's stat padding. He doesn't want to throw a bad pick or, or diminish his career numbers, which—

oh, you're talking about Rodgers, not Brady.

Yeah, Rodgers. I'm sorry.

Yeah, yeah, because I was like, I think, uh, yeah, I, I don't know, man. I, I, all I know is last year, what was it, like the worst lowest average depth of target in football, probably, right? Um, And like I said, it was weird though because at times he would like hit like a slot fade or something, or, um, or even like move a little bit and throw it, and you're like, oh, that's Aaron Rodgers. But the lack of consistency in that department makes me kind of suspicious of the idea that we're going to see more of it this year.

I mean, Patrick Queen and, uh, you know, Payton, uh, I— the linebacking core on the interior The pass catcher, they're thin, at least at number 3. But I, I do like Michael Pittman because it does sort of DK Metcalf, you would think.

Anyway, good player.

Um, all right. Oh, here's one more time capsule. 3 years from now, has Josh Allen or Lamar Jackson won a Super Bowl?

I'm gonna say yes, and I'm not gonna say which one. I don't know.

I'd like you to say which one.

Uh, I don't know. I really don't. Um, I think the Ravens— I like the Ravens roster. Oh, I like the Ravens defense more, and I like the Bills offense more, so that makes it tricky. Um, I think I like the Ravens coach more. Got two first-time coaches, so let's go Baltimore, even though— and you know, Josh Allen has to deal with Drake—

that, that the Patriots, I think, are going to be pretty good for a while, so I, um, yeah, I feel like you and I, I know you were talking, I, I felt, uh, smart when I saw Mina Kimes talking about it as well. Just because they're called the Baltimore Ravens doesn't mean that they're still the Baltimore Ravens defense. And that's been going on in spite of Kyle Hamilton for the last couple of years too. It's like, that defense is not good. It's a, it's a deficit to that. It's a detriment to what the team's trying to do, but nobody seemed to turn it around.

I think that's going to turn around this year though. I really do. I'm really high on Minter. Man. Like, I always look so dumb— his— in Chicago with the Chargers every year, I'd be like, there's no way this is the top 10 defense. And then they would come out and they would play in a way that it was very obvious how well coached they were outside of just game plans, just the way they would rally the football, the way there would always be, you know, this feeling of like constricting. And I think, um, he has the potential to really turn around this Ravens defense pretty quickly, coupled with some of the additions they've made up front.

Let me get your answer on this. I had some fast action ones, but I am interested as we round out the time capsule here. 3 3 years from now, what is the conversation around Aaron Rodgers' football career?

3 years is—

he will be long retired, you assume, but not guaranteed, but probably disappearing.

Dave, we're never gonna hear from him. Um, I think that there'll be a bit of, you know, he was credible at his peak, uh, one of the most talented quarterbacks ever. Maybe some, you know, my, like, mild criticism. Well, you know, the postseason runs, could— shouldn't he have had more? And then I think further out they'll start playing, like, kind of like with Elway, they'll start playing the highlights and a lot, and people will remember at his peak, oh yeah, this is— this guy was— he was capable of doing things that I think maybe 3 quarterbacks of all time could accomplish on the field.

I just— I guess the question, what I'm getting at is, you know, what his prime was. It was great, but it fell flat in January. I wonder if he— the last 5, 6 years, because he's brought a lot of attention on himself from off the field and the— yeah, all that. I wonder if it's sort of like if it adds up to like, yeah, hey, yeah, further out.

I think 3 years is pretty fresh. I think the further out you get, the more it'll just be love for the football. Aspect of his career and appreciation for it.

All right, let's get through these, uh, real quick here. You are, like I say, a music person as well.

Yeah.

New— this is one I've been bringing up on Levitar lately and gotten some really crummy answers. Worst popular music of our lifetime. We can go with this specific band, but nu metal or hair metal? I'll say you, uh, option C if you wish.

Yeah, those are pretty bad.

Poison or Korn?

Yeah, I'm gonna go hair metal purely because I have nostalgic nu metal— not for the music, but like the videos we used to watch on MTV, uh, like Freak on a Leash, it's a great video. So I'll go hair metal.

All right, last one. I've never heard you talk about uniforms before.

You know, you're a big uniform guy.

One or two great— that's with 2, 1 or 2 or 3 best and the one that is an eyesore to you.

All time or whenever? Um, I am a huge fan of the Chargers Powder Blues. I was just at Chargers camp and admiring some of the gear and just thinking how resplendent it looked. I'll give a homer pick and I'll say the Seattle Throwbacks are simply magnificent.

They are.

Should be their full-time uniform. Uh, worst, I gotta go with— okay, it's tempting to pick the Steelers beat the— you know, disgusting striper conversation. It's actually Aaron Rodgers' other team, the weird pack. You know what I'm talking about? Those weird Packers throwbacks.

Navy! What the hell was Navy? Where you're, you're green, it's in your name!

The brown helmet, like just so humiliating.

So you call— you're, you're in Green Bay! The minimum standard is that green is in your uniform. I don't care what you did 70 years ago. Those people are all gone now.

And their normal uniforms are great. I love them.

The classics are also very good.

The whites are great. So yeah, I'll go with— I'll go with those. Oh, those are tough.

Mina Kimes, as good as it gets in this business. We're going to have to put a pin in my great idea from a decade ago. You and Ryan Clark with a great play-by-play guy in the booth as a 3-person Uh, but I don't think you could do any better than that. We'll wait for that one. In the meantime, Mina Kimes Show featuring Lenny, Viewer Discretion with David Dennis, so on and so forth. She's all over the place buzzing about football, and guess what? The great news is football season is here. Thank you so much for the time, Mina Kimes.

Thanks for having me.

You're the tops. All right, good times with Mina Kimes back in studio now. Anything jump out at you guys? I thought the Caleb Williams or Jordan Love ahead of Caleb Williams—

that was the part, that was the part I can Caleb Williams, you know, people have their opinions about him, but to put Jordan Love on top of him kind of does a little bit of slotting that I don't agree with there. I mean, I'm not going to be out in public saying I disagree with Mina Kimes. It's not a, not a winning position to be in.

But never want to take the side opposed to Mina, I'll say that. I'm big on both of these guys. Like, I like Jordan Love and Caleb Williams. I understand why they're kind of compared to each other. They're both like gunslinging NFC North quarterbacks that are going to be showing down for the next decade, likely. I do think she was a little harsh on Caleb, and I understand the concerns that the only guy that's ever, you know, there's evidential proof of a guy actually improving his accuracy is Josh Allen.

To the degree, right?

To that degree that Caleb Williams might need to improve his accuracy. But he did so much last year and made so many winning plays. That team has gotten better around him. I think the Bears are going to be really good. I know that division is going to be an absolute gauntlet, so it's hard to say who's going to come out of it. I expect another step forward from Caleb Williams.

For me, for sure, for Caleb Williams, what he needs to learn how to do is to do less.

That's right. I was going to accuse you both of reacting to the splash, although, you know, obviously the Bears outstripped the Packers ultimately last year. But I do think, you know, one's obviously empirically, you know, a dynamic player and the other guy is a pocket passer who rarely takes off with it. Man, those Packers, are under the radar. And it's like I said, it's because of amnesia. People forget, yep, how good they were looking to be as they were getting the receivers healthy. And Micah Parsons gets hurt and that kind of undid their season. But they were, they were lining up to be a factor.

No, I agree with you on that. But also people have amnesia that they lost to the Panthers and Browns last year, and that was before Micah Parsons got hurt. So they had flaws. Like, I thought they were the Super Bowl favorite but then they lost to the Browns and I was like, this team is flawed. They're really good. And now Micah Parsons is saying he expects to be back by October, which is a better timeline than the November that we thought it would be. It's now moved up a month, so that will obviously be a huge boost for them. I think the Packers are going to be really good. I think the Bears are going to be really good. I think the Lions are still going to be good, and I think the Vikings are going to be really good as well. Like, it feels like we talk about the NFC North a lot.

That's looking past, but I, I, you know, I, I happen to like the Vikings quite a bit.

I like Vikings too.

Yeah, I counsel everybody on what you just said there. Well, but they lost to blank. They lost to that bum team. Every good team, even good— what didn't happen 25 years ago was that the very best teams, the real Super Bowl contenders, rarely lost to bum teams. Now good contending teams get whipped by 3 or 4 touchdowns some weeks.

Any given Sunday, right, Dave?

I mean, right. Truer than it was when people first started saying any given Sunday.

Oftentimes. Those, those games that those teams lose, those teams will look back on those games and point them out.

Correct.

Turning points.

Yes. They'll say we needed a kick in the ass because we got too confident in ourselves. We realized where our flaws are and we got better because we realized where our flaws are and tried to fix our flaws, you know. And I do think that— I, again, I don't— I'm not saying the Packers are not that good because they lost to the Browns last year. Like, last year has nothing to do with this year. They're going to be a really good team.

I hear you. I'm picking up what you're laying down. But also, just as a reminder, the Seahawks lost in week 1 to the Raiders. Chargers. Yep. Wait, no, the Patriots. I'm sorry, I'm getting myself confused now. All right, um, also that was interesting. Of all the quarterbacks on the big blue marble that she could have for this season, Patrick Mahomes. It's a bold choice there.

I'll always take Patrick Mahomes over anybody else. I know he's coming off an ACL. If you can give me one quarterback, I'm taking Patrick Mahomes.

I know Josh Allen makes sense. I might go Joe I really like those Bengals. We have to dig in on them in the next couple of weeks as well. But right now, and when you mention Caleb Williams with Ben Johnson and how different he was, that reminds me of what we wanted to talk in this week's mailbag with. It's time once again for Major Randall, social media correspondent from the digital front lines. Look at that mustache, looking like a Civil War officer. How are you, Randy?

Major Randy, I'm doing well, doing well. Happy to be here.

The Puma logo kind of offsets the, the, you know, 19th century vibes.

19th?

Well, we're a little— yeah, we're going a little, uh, football America over on, on my end right now.

So is that a St. Pauli jersey?

Second division German.

Wow, it's a beauty too.

Uh, dork fest. All right, let's talk about pro football, the, the kind that, that I enjoy watching here. And as a reminder, always subscribe wherever you listen to your podcast and on YouTube, Football America. Leave us a comment, and perhaps on the next time the mailbag opens up, it will be your correspondence that Major Randy reads. What do you have for us this week, Major Randy?

Yeah, so this week, uh, kind of just going off of the conversation that you just had, we asked if you could have one head coach and one quarterback for this season, who are you taking and why? And we got an interesting mix of responses here because a lot of people were saying took that as, okay, if I could have anybody this season, as in active players, which I think is what I was trying to ask. But we actually got a lot of responses that were saying like all time, like any coach all time, any quarterback all time. And we asked this question with a photo of Aaron Rodgers and Mike McCarthy in the Steelers black and gold. So I can say at least initially that the majority of all responses were, ew, not these guys, or some variation of that.—

you led the witnesses.

Yeah. Yeah. They— there was a few saying that that choice of photo was, was rage bait.

But is there anybody that said they would want to have McCarthy and Rodgers?

No, there were zero people who chose Rodgers or McCarthy in any capacity, I believe.

Well, I do think it would be funny. Aaron Nagler, big time with the Packers, and we look forward to catching up with him before the season kicks off. He weighed in with an image of Bart Starr with Vince Lombardi. Lombardi, and I responded, be way funnier if you had Vince Lombardi with Aaron Rodgers. I would like— as long as they're videotaping it, as long as it's Hard Knocks running between the alleys, I just would love to hear those two.

Those two, we got a seal here and a seal there.

I don't know what you're talking about, bro. Sounds like a conspiracy to me. How are we gonna seal it off? Um, go ahead, Randy, what else? What do we have.

Yeah, so I'll just run through some of, some of the options here, and I can kind of just rapid-fire a bit and just interject, jump in where we want to have any discussion on it. Um, so I'll start with more of active players that I thought were interesting. So Jason Riffle says he would take Sean McVay and Joe Burrow.

I love that combo. That's a good one.

A lot of people said Shanahan and Josh Allen, which is a conversation that was also had on the show previously.

Shanahan would never willingly have a quarterback that good.

You know, he's never tried to have a quarterback that good. You talk about— or I mentioned as a joke— conspiracy theories, but there are people who will tell you that coordinators have enough of an ego that that is borderline true. I think if you're chasing a ring, then you would be— you would want to find that missing link.

On Shanahan, he's—

buddy, you forget Shanahan tried to have a quarterback that good. Trey Lance was supposed to be that, right?

And we all just kind of let him get away with the fact that he drafted Trey Lance third overall, I guess because it's worked out for them unbelievably because John Lynch is such a great GM and they draft so well. But yeah, they've never attempted to have a quarterback that good. I mean, I guess you're right.

Well, I wonder if his name will come up here, But probably, you know, Joe Gibbs always gets left off these lists. Reminder, he won 3 Super Bowls with 3 non-Hall of Fame QBs. He's the only cat to come anywhere close to doing something like that. Chuck Noll always gets left off these— 4 Super Bowls and 6 teams with teams that he had a big hand in building. But Bill Walsh is a name that gets in— I think he's probably the best for sort of transforming the nature of offensive football. Everybody continues to, to some degree, follow what he's doing. And people always say he didn't want a great— he didn't want to, you know, he had Joe Montana who was maybe not as highly skilled. He wanted John Elway and he wanted Dan Marino. And had they not won that second Super Bowl, there's a lot of evidence out there that they were sort of positioning themselves to take a run at one of those guys.

Well, this has been a Means take for a long time that he had this take a long time ago already about Rodgers, that Rodgers likes for it to be tough because then he, when he was in Green Bay specifically, he liked that they didn't have a defense, he didn't have a receiver. He brought, you know, he brings in Randall Cobb when he goes to, uh, New York, and, you know, Alan Lazard or whoever it was, right? Because he likes to do all that, because when it doesn't go his way, he can say, well, we don't have a defense, we don't have receivers, the, uh, you know, the OC's not the guy. Well, I'm not saying, but I think that like some people will apply that theory to Shanahan where he can say I mean, he's never going to put it on his quarterback or anything, but he's never had a good enough quarterback to win the Super Bowl. They've been as close as you can be at the end.

I mean, you know, listen, twice the Falcons—

well, okay, so that's an offensive coordinator, yes, but since he's been a head coach, they've been as close as you can be twice, and they haven't come out either time because they lost.

Well, he won, and he on purpose is going after Brock Purdy, but we'll see what happens after this year. Let's see if the equation changes a little bit if Josh Allen still hasn't won after this year and the Niners are sort of feeling feeling maybe like that this little mini era is not as satisfying as it looked like it was about to be 3 years or so ago. Jim Irsay famously or otherwise said, why would I be worrying about defense? Like, it's all about Peyton. We don't need a good backup quarterback because if he gets hurt, the whole thing is, is blown up anyway. There, I have some level of respect for that. Anyway, back to you, Major Randy.

Yeah, so most, again, modern interpretations of this are a mix of of Ben Johnson, Kevin O'Connell, Kyle Shanahan with Joe Burrow and Josh Allen. Not a lot of Patrick Mahomes, which is interesting. I, I get it coming off of the injury, but also it's— it is Patrick Mahomes. Um, there were a few Andy Reid, Patrick Mahomes, um, gotta take them if you have them kind of comments.

Where do you have your beloved Chiefs? Where do you have them slot in that division this I, I think they're going to win the division. I'm based on what? Beyond your— that you would like to see that happen?

And the Broncos don't, the Chargers don't, and the Raiders don't. That's—

no, that's good. That's what it comes down to, right?

Like, that's pretty much what it comes down to for me, is they have— they have Patrick Mahomes, they have Andy Reid, they now have the Super Bowl MVP at running back, they have a bad guy tight end. Yes, him at tight end. And it's just, I don't know, I'm obviously like to some degree I'm going to be a homer here, like no matter what. But I do believe that if I have, if I can have any quarterback in the NFL on my team, if I have a healthy Patrick Mahomes, I feel like I'm going to win every single time that team takes the field.

You're not being a homer, Randy, because I would say the same thing. Like, there is no guy still to this day. I know he was hurt last year and it hasn't been as pretty the last few years before that. He didn't win a Super Bowl that long ago, right? Like, it was what, 2, 3 years ago?

Neighborhood, 3 years ago, you know what I mean?

Like, I, I know that, you know, Raiders ain't a joke.

Broncos are real good, and the Chargers look like they're about to be real.

You know who else is coming off of a big significant injury? Bo Nix is coming off of a big significant injury.

Touché.

And the Chargers, what are the Like, we've done this thing with the Chargers for so long, and, and I don't—

I—

Chargers, I know, don't get me wrong, but that's a weird bit of logic that people like you and Jeff Schwartz continue to apply. Like, how many years are you going to do this? I don't know. As long as they continue to bring in talent, have Jim Harbaugh as their coach, no, they seem to set up for success.

When they finally get it done, I'll be like, okay, they got it done, congratulations. You know what I mean? The Carolina Hurricanes this past year, even though it was a total asterisk because the Panthers weren't in the playoffs, they finally got it done. Okay, congratulations, we'll see you next year. You know what I mean?

From the Miami guy. All right, uh, Major—

but no, the point being, Mahomes is still— to me, there's nobody I would rather have on the field at the end of the game than Patrick Mahomes.

Okay, still, I'm not gonna—

I mean, I was at that last AFC Championship and there was no point in the game where I felt like the Chiefs weren't going to win. That's like, that's how it— that's just how it's felt. And like, I mean, obviously they haven't won, you know, every Super Bowl ever, but I mean, you've won 3 Super Bowls with him, continue to go to the AFC Championship. I mean, been to the AFC Championship basically every single year of his career that he's been healthy. Until that starts not happening, I think I'm just going to feel that way.

I think. But you know what? There's a certain voodoo that is self-imposed, or at least the influence of, of that success in big spots by Reid and Mahomes that spooks the other sidelines and creates unforced errors. So we got to do something. They're going to do— we got to do something here. And that, I mean, that was the same effect.

That fake punt.

Belichick and Brady did that to teams over and over again during their run too. Major Randy, who else?

Um, we had Bill Walsh and Joe Montana.

Ha!

I mean, Bill Walsh with Dan Marino would be even better.

It would be even better.

Yeah. Well, following up on that, we have Dan Marino and Andy Reid would win 5 straight Super Bowls.

That would be beautiful.

That's nice. Listen, here's an easy one for me since he's a Pittsburgh guy. Put him on the Steelers with Chaz Noll. They should have drafted him when they had a chance to. Obviously, that's a lament for anybody from Pittsburgh. But for real, the thing that he lacked was a defense. As I've said before and will say again, Don Shula is great, but he also failed Marino in his prime. He just had terrible draft after terrible draft. Chaz Noll would have had a defense around him and, you know, Louie Lips or whatever.

You don't need to do this thing where, "Oh, if you were just on the Steelers." I'm just telling you that!

Dan Marino.

We feel bad enough that the Dolphins never won a Super Bowl with Dan Marino. Dave, you don't have to stick it to us.

One more major, Randy.

We have— this one's a little bit out there, but from the Austin Eater, which has 110,000 followers on Instagram, apparently suggested they would take Kurt Zignetti and Michael Vick.

Ha! Kurt Zignetti and Michael Vick.

I don't even know what college rank. Yeah, I don't even know what to say about that one. Just let him cook. Yeah, that's right.

Best college quarterback for one season, perhaps. And if he's not the answer, Joe Burrow might be. And if Joe Burrow isn't, Fernando Mendoza might be, right? Cam Newton might be, right? But he just coached Fernando.

But do you remember Michael Vick in college? Oh yeah, he had no conscience. He just would just take off every play.

He was the only player on that team. He, he didn't have to abide by any— the other 21 guys were like, yeah, Michael, you do it, because we have no shot. We're playing Florida State. What do you expect us to do, man?

He had no conscience. There were games where he— it was just him and 10 blockers out there.

Um, Social Randy, I thought this was another successful visit from the front lines. How say you? There you go. He just knocked—

yeah, I think so. I think so. I think we had some, uh, we had some interesting, uh, responses here. But, um, yeah, we'll— if anybody, uh, watching this has some fun ideas on what we can, uh, what we can bring up next time in the mailbag, feel free to please tweet them at the Love the Tart Show accounts or comment on the YouTube video and let us know.

Yeah, if we have any leftovers, he'll just keep them right in that mustache and pull them out when we need them. Well done, Major Randall Social Me. Thank you once again. There he goes. And I guess here we go too. So thanks to Mina Kimes for the great turn there. Thanks to Geno and to Buddy and to you, my fellow football Americans. Until next time, as pro football regular season draws ever closer. Thanks so much. It's been a thin slice of heaven.