Transcript of GOOD FOLLOW - Lisa Leslie Talks Angel Reese’s Motion, A’ja Wilson’s GOAT Status, Cathy Engelbert Gets Booed & More

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Hey, what's up, you all? Welcome to Good Follow Show, presented by DraftKings. I'm Roz Gold on Wooday, and today I'm coming to you from our LA studio, studio because we have a very special guest interview with a hoop legend, a Hall of Famer, WNBA great, just multifaceted queen, the host of Between the Lines, and friend to the show, Lisa Leslie is in the building. What's up, Lisa?

What's up? Happy to be back on Good Follow. Love your show, your podcast. You do such a great job. So this will be fun, of course.

Oh, my gosh. Are you part of the Good Follow family, Lisa? Lisa?

I am part of a good fellow family. You do a great job, Rye. I'm a fan. You already know that.

Thank you so much. I remember early, we're talking the 2010s and those years out at a college meeting you and telling you I wanted to be a broadcaster, and could I get some advice? And for real, the Lisa Leslie at the time absolutely had kind words, advice, and always tapped in with me. I really always appreciate How did that get you?

I always talk about I love being a role model, but then it's like when you actually... When action, you know what I mean? That's an action. You asked me to help you do something, and I connected you. I think back then it was maybe it was Fox or something. But you did. It's still like, yeah, it's like, Do it. You know what I mean? Help other people. I don't know. I'm happy because you never know how it comes full circle. The fact that we're working together, you don't know. One day you could be my boss. You just never know. I don't know. I think it's just important. So I was happy you asked, and I was like, Oh, I never let down people. When I say I'm going to do something, I follow through and do it, and especially young people to me. I think that's so important. So I was happy to help. And look at you, you just You did all kinds of stuff. Warriors, I was like, Wait, that's that girl. No, I'm just kidding.

No facts. That's how it be. And actually taking me down memory lane, it means a lot, too, because I think people see you with... You mentor a lot of the biggest star, up and coming But at the time, I was a nice starter coming out of Stanford University. But I wasn't Nneka Agumake, I wasn't Jane Appell. But it wasn't about what your status was. It was like, Yo, there's a young person that wants help, and you absolutely did that. And you did connect me with somebody at Fox. I remember that. Just giving you flowers because actually, you wear so many hats. In addition to being a beautiful human being, I see you in commercials. The family Fans are constantly calling on you to step up into something. They want you to be a Commissioner. They want you to be a coach. But one of your most recent roles that you're crushing is that of an elite podcaster. So how has it been hosting Between the Lines and being in this world with us as a podcaster?

Honestly, here's the deal. This is my real honest answer. I know that my spiritual gift is my ability to speak, but I oftentimes am really a homebody, and I don't necessarily need attention or to be in front of the camera just talking about anything. So I feel like whenever I do a podcast or speak on anything, it really comes from the heart, and I really try to give my honest answer. And I'm a truth teller. So if it's things that I feel is not going to benefit us as a whole, WMBA, or me individually, or whatever it is that I'm talking about, I don't really participate in it. I'm not a person who gives out. I'm not I don't believe in negative energy and giving out negative energy. I don't read negative stuff. I just keep it moving. If I don't like it, I keep it moving. That's the person I am. So I feel like podcast sometimes I get a little overwhelmed with them because everybody has one, and they're everywhere. And I don't like click bait. I don't like to just talk about something just to be like, Oh, I want people to see this.

So mention somebody's name. And that's not me. So I do feel like being a part of the podcast world, we have a major a responsibility because we're a part of the media, essentially. We have a voice and a platform, and I think we have to use that responsibly. So for me, I reluctantly am like, Yeah, I do have a podcast, and I really try to be socially responsible with that. But I'm also very hesitant. I do not do everybody's podcast for sure.

Well, first of all, I'm honored. Thank you for pulling up on our show. And also I've had the chance to be on your show. That's meant a lot. You're a real one. I've actually I really enjoyed getting to hear the way you see the game. And you do that at such a high level. And that's probably why you're such a great mentor to a lot of these up and coming hoopers. And that's another hat you wear, that of mentor. One of your girls was doing it big last night at the time of taping. Angel Reece walked the Victoria's Secret one way last night, the first ever WMBA player to do so. Actually, I love this clip that came out. This is her right after walking the runway.

Look how happy she is. Yes, she's celebrating. Oh, my gosh.

So what did you think? What did you think seeing her on that stage?

Honestly, Raza, again, I always describe stuff like I feel like a proud mom, but I'm really proud of Angel because I modeled. I had a modeling contract. Modeling is not as easy as look. I mean, people think you just put on some clothes and walk, but you have nerves. You have to confidence you have confidence. You have to have where you connect with the crowd and the audience. And I thought she checked all the boxes. This is your best body. When you are a professional athlete and you're in your 20s, that is your best body, baby. So I thought it was amazing. I thought she looked beautiful. I thought she had the confidence that she needed. And it's her first time. I don't even read all of these comments. I just sent her a personal message, and I'm very proud of her. I'm happy that she's the first WMBA player to do it because that's going to open doors, hopefully, for more. We have so many beautiful women in our league that could possibly do something like that. So I feel like every time we, we as a whole, get endorsement deals and get opportunities, you'll slightly just continually to bust down doors and open it up for that next generation or even one of your colleagues.

So very happy, proud. I can't wait to hear the details, of course, but that's for another day. But I love it for her. I really do.

Yeah, me too. And just like Angel, it's not like she just came in there and was like, I'm going to just go and do it. She worked at it. Honestly, is it just me? Is it just my algorithm? I don't think so. I think for a lot of the larger culture, the reason why we talked about the Victoria's Secret show today was because of Angel Rees. Absolutely. Yeah. Isn't it crazy that a WNBA player, Our WMBA players, not just Angel, are the reasons why people are talking about brands and moments and events? That's a shift.

I feel I'm proud. Listen, and I always say this, that the things that I tried to do personally to check off these boxes, to be the first WMBA player to sign a modeling contract I signed with Wilamina. It's a place in a space where we really belong, and we just haven't not had the opportunities as much. And so I always look at it as an opportunity to, one, make space, create space. Representation matters. But guess what? She just inspired a whole bunch of other little girls that are probably dribbling right now and thinking about, Oh, I want to play basketball, but I also want to be a model. I want to be in the Victoria's. It just continues to broaden the horizon, I think, for little girls to be able to dream, to be like Angel Rees. Why not?

I love it. I love it. And that young ladies can dream that they can be many things, that you don't just have to be put in one box. And so actually, on our last show of Good Follow, I was here with Angel McCartree who hosts with us. And we were just talking about, at this moment, there's no player in the WNBA that has transcended the sport and is impacting culture like Angel Reece. And while we were debating, okay, so now we were like, there's really no one who's doing it like Angel. But in the past, the name that we thought of was you. Do you like that comparison? And why do you think Angel has broken through like this and connected and resonated like this? Nfl fans, what's your favorite countdown? For me, it's the next one. With DraftKings Sportsbook, an official sports betting partner of the NFL, every countdown could put cash in your hands. First score, anytime TDs, live bets, every snap is an opportunity. Your team hitting paydirt pays out to you. New customers download the DraftKings Sportsbook app and use code GoodFollow. That's code GoodFollow to turn five bucks into $300 in bonus bets if your bet wins.

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I love it. I feel like in each era, we We do the best we can do, whether I was modeling, broadcasting, public speaking, acting. I did sitcom, I did movies. All of those things is because we're not just one thing. And again, you have to be what you're comfortable with. Everybody didn't have all of these talents, right? But everybody didn't have the personality. Everybody's not as articulate. Everybody didn't have the will to take criticism when you are in these spaces. She's like, who do you think you are? And I remember people and players like, where is she going? And why is she always dressed? Why? But it's like, I'm my authentic self. And I feel like I say Angela, she's 10. 0 me. You just come into this future with social media. Timing is everything. Her personality, her beauty, her attitude, her confidence, all of those things, same thing, line up where it's like, okay, but now Now we have businesses and companies who want a piece of the pie because the numbers are off the chart. Our audience has exploded. The women's basketball is the number one growing sport in the world right now in terms of just the numbers and where we've come from and where we've gone to.

And you look at that, the numbers make sense, right? Because at the end of the day, it was always about money. If we're not making money and bringing money in, how can you expect people to invest in it? So it took time. So I love I love everything that Angel gets to accomplish. But we also can't forget about Kaitlyn, because I feel like Kaitlyn is another one of those. She may not have the same type of endorsements that Angel has, but she's a game changer. Their Caitlin effect was real. And I feel like the two of them with their conflict in that right moment has been an explosion of women's basketball. And you can't say one really without the other because they were synonymous in terms in terms of creating this growth for women's basketball.

I think that's a good point, actually, because I do think in my circles, the way that Angel is hitting the culture, it immediately hits my timeline, my algorithm. But for me, I think no one has impacted eyeballs on the WNBA like Kaitlyn Clarke. That's a given, right? Hello. She's changed. Kaitlyn Clarke effect is real, but I'm just not sure she... And I'm not even sure that's really important to her. Their motion is different. I'm not even sure that for Kaitlyn's success board or her bullion to board, it's about being in all these different silos. Instead, maybe it's about building out all the different brands and businesses around her hoops and just the way she navigates the world. So I think their lanes are different.

I don't think that it's necessarily different. I think Kaitlyn is authentic to Kaitlyn. Kaitlyn is doing in golfing. That's authentic to who she is, and she's not trying to do something that she's not. And I love that because I think she's an amazing golf player, a golfer, and now she's going to have a chance to do some proam to her thing. So I think that she does what's authentic to her. And Angel is doing what she feels she wants to do. These are all of these different platforms that she's like, Oh, I could do that. Oh, and I can do that. And I have a desire to want to do these things. And I love that for both of them, actually.

Yeah, absolutely. I agree with doing what is authentic to self, and that being uber visible, successful, and relatable could end up looking different for both of them. Absolutely. Yeah, we're on the same page with that. One more question about Angel before I move us along is that you've also, just basketball-wise, you worked with her on Unrivaled before heading into the second season for her. Just evaluating her second year in the WNBA, what would you like to see Angel angel work on for year three in the W?

Well, I thought Angel, one, I think a lot of people didn't know, or maybe some people knew that, but she battled through a lot of injury this particular season, especially with her back, a little bit with her hand. I think she even had a surgery or something. So just all that she's been through and to be able to still lead the league in rebounding, I thought, is outstanding. I thought she should have been, I don't know, maybe second team, defensive. I felt like she got left off of some of those a little list of accomplishments. You can't go by the team record, and then Paige wins an award also. So it's one of those things where I thought, I mean, to lead the league in rebounding, people don't understand how hard that is. And to have more double doubles and all of those types of categories. That's a lot of work to not get recognized. But that's just, again, my personal opinion. But I think overall, and I did talk to Angel about having some more time with her in the gym working on more offense. I think just being stronger offensively and being able to finish and score more would really help her game.

But I thought overall, she's continuing to grow. When I watch her play, she plays so hard. She gives everything on both ends of the floor. I think that her basketball IQ is very high, and any team would love her effort. So I don't know that she necessarily had the veteran leadership that she should have had coming into the WNBA. I wish that for her because you think about the top teams like a Minnesota, and you think about Nafisa Collier having someone like- Big Sil.

Big Sil.

You know what I mean? To have a veteran that just like, Hey, this is what This is how we do. This is how we work. She didn't have that, and she still hasn't had that. And that's the part where I feel like, wow, that your introduction to this lead really hasn't been what most rookies have. And that is an opportunity to be a rookie and have a veteran that leads you. And even if that veteran is not necessarily leading in scoring and all of that, but just how to be a pro, how you carry yourself, things that you respond to, things you don't respond to. So I think in some ways, I wish she would have had more of that veteran leadership on the team day in and day out. And I hope for the future that she... I don't know what's going to happen with Chicago, but if she ends up somewhere else, that she can end up in a place where a team can really appreciate what she brings to the table because she's baller. And a baller and a dog and all of those things that you describe as a player, to me, I take that over a person who...

They may be a good player, but they don't have that heart and fight. See, Angel has that heart and fight that you need in order to be successful and win. And so I know that the top teams, they know that. You see that when you watch her play.

Yeah. I mean, it's absolutely evident in just how she attacks the glass and comes at it as a professional each game. The whole story of the season is the turnaround of the Aces to the Championship. Gosh, who would have saw that coming in June? Well, the Aces did, actually. Those players would tell you, Y'all counted us out, but we didn't. But I just want to start where it's founded around, where the foundation and center of it all is, and that's in Asia Wilson. Let's take a look at Asia Wilson's resume now after winning this Championship with the Aces. And we actually ran out of space. Asia Wilson is now the four-time WNBA MVP. We can't even read them all. She's the defensive player of the year. She's now on three championships in four years. Mind you, Asia only been in the league eight In half her year, she's been a champion and an MVP. Not to mention not only all her WNBA success, but don't forget her collegiate success. She was a champion there. Her international success, she's a two-time Olympic gold medalist. I would be remiss if I didn't have someone like you who was already in the GOAT conversation to ask you, How should Asia now start being discussed in the GOAT conversation?

And Lisa, dare I say, Is she already there?

Well, here's my thing. I never really talk about this whole GOAT thing. And I know that it's tough because there's different errors. Sheryl Miller was amazing, and she may be somebody's GOAT, right? Because she did so much great things in women's basketball and getting us to the platform where we were before the WMBA ever began. Then you have, I guess, you have the WMBA, and you have Sheryl, you I have myself, you have Cynthia Cooper, all different positions, amazing players, Lauren Jackson, amazing players. And you have Diana Tarazi, Sue Bird come, amazing players. Then you have Maya Moore come in, an amazing player. And I just feel like it's so tough. And then you have Asia. And I feel like Asia is taking home everything. I feel like Asia don't have the competition, to be really honest. The competition, I don't know. I just feel like when If you look at centers and forwards across the board in the lead, that position is starting to go away at a fast rate. Even it already happened in the NBA, where there's not a lot of true centers and forwards. And so I just feel like Our dominance is like when you take a person and you go, in any era, Asia would be amazing in any era.

That's how you get to GOAT status, right? But I feel like in any era, Cynthia Cooper would have been amazing. Sure, Miller would have been amazing. I would be amazing. We We would still have the level of success that we've had even now in this era. So to me, there's a lot of women who are really the cream of the crop at the top. And it would be disrespectful to me to try and say, One person who is accomplishing more awards in this time period is necessarily better than a person who accomplished it. It's almost like when you say Michael Jordan played when it was more physical, right? But LeBron plays now. Lebron is great. Michael Jordan, the errors are different. So I think it's just tough. I don't know. I feel like being a part of that conversation, it gets really tough for me. But I love and respect Asia Wilson. I feel like, and I know I say, a lot of players are like, Oh, I see this in them, and I see this me and them. But I'm like, Asia, I see our game is probably the most similar of any player that I've ever seen.

And the accuracy, the shot blocking, the defense, the energy, being able to guard people inside and out, I see that. So it's not like I don't recognize how amazing she is because I see it. I love it. And I think when you look at what happened this particular season for the Aces, now you're talking about a dynasty because They're never out of it. To have that record by August second, 14 or something, and then go on the run.

They were 500.

At 500, right? And then go on the run that they did and win the Championship the way that they did with Asia leading the way, never disappearing. I mean, even the game where we said, Oh, she didn't play that well. I think she had 16 and 10 or something. It was crazy. So I love the dominance that we're seeing from Asia Wilson. And I just hope that she gets her flowers off the courts because this is off the court, because this is what I'm always talking about, the endorsement deals and the things should flow to some of the best players in the world. And this is where we have to continue to push for things like that because it should show off the court as well because she's the best player in the world.

Yes. Do you feel that her marketing and the brands and all of that is matching how dominant and talented she is, Lisa?

I think Nike really stepped up to the plate. It took a while, and they were late, but they did. They stepped up, and I think that matches. And I don't know what other brands she has, which Gatorade, Nike, are things that I know. I know because there's commercials, right? So it's like maybe there's other deals, and hopefully other places will start to see Asia more. But I don't know, personally. I personally don't know what all she has, but she should have more. She's the best player in the world.

Another side of Asia Wilson's dominance. After the final She gets her finals MVP award and trophy. The whole presentation is awesome. Holly Roe is up there. She announces the person who's going to hand the trophy, and it's Cathy Inglebert, the Commissioner. And when she announces her, she is handedly, loudly, booed. For those in the arena, they said they couldn't even hear her.

Wmba Commissioner, Cathy Inglebert.

Thank you, Holly. Well, we're here today to celebrate a champion. Thank you to all the fans. Phoenix had a great run to get here. I just want to congratulate the Aces on a performance 2025 WNBA chip.

For me, it's the player's face Races, recognizing what's going on.

She did well, though. She kept her cool. She finished what she had to say, and she was strong in that moment because that was serious. And that was loud. I don't even think I realized it was that loud. I do feel bad for Cathy because nobody wants to experience not being a well-liked Commissioner of any league. The other flip side to it was in response to the the fans really supporting the players, it's cool because we know that the fans are listening and they're paying attention, and they see that these rafters are full all the way to the top, that they're sell-outs, and they want for the players to reap the benefits also. So you think about the CBA and you think about... I think one of the most important things is profit sharing. I think that's going to be important because fans want to know that these players are being paid also and that they're sharing in the success of all of the hard work that everybody did. Nobody wants negative stuff, whether it's in real life or on social media. But I wasn't mad at the fans because I felt like that was great support for the players.

You know, Lisa, we ran out of time. It's over. It's over. I really appreciate having you on and listening to you. You have so much great insight. You're the best. And you're so warm to everyone. So I just appreciate you. Thank you.

Thanks, Ros. Well, I'll be seeing you soon. Did you get done with the... We've seen you at Unrivaled?

Yes, I'll be down in Miami for sure. So I will see you there. All right.

Well, good. I'm sure I'll see you before then.

We'll do something. We'll do an oxtail date.

Say less. We just came doing on game day. Game day.