Transcript of Millersson | The Steve Dangle Podcast

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S

d d p. P. The Steve Dangle podcast with your host, Steve Dangle, Adam Wyld, and Jesse Blake.

Let's go. And what we have on our hands what we have on our hands is good news and bad news. The bad news, I'll start with. The Leafs are in a slump. The good news is Chris Johnson and Julian Mackenzie have officially sold out Boston Pizza Covert.

The Hut 300th anniversary show, 300th episode show, for Chris and Julian is going to be on this Friday in Coburg, and it is officially sold out. And I will tell you now that Chris was worried. He's like, well, who's even going to come? I was like, Chris.

I heard that on the show. I'm like, you scamp. Yeah. Stop. He meant bashful little scamp.

He meant it. He was worried. He was worried.

I

don't think there's any reason to be.

Isn't he cute?

He's cute. Yeah.

More more like cute j.

Coburg Papa's gonna be there too. So we're all thrilled about that.

C j stands for cute journalist. Sorry.

Please tweet that at c j.

I will. Hey. C j stands for cute journalists send. Please send that to him.

Yeah. So that that's happening this Friday in Coburg. We'll be there. CJ and Julian will be there. Other people will be there.

You hopefully, you will be there. And if you haven't bought a ticket, you won't be there. Mhmm. Yeah. So Oh, wow.

That's tough. Damn. Truth is hard.

Truth is hard. That's crazy.

Yeah. It is. It is. Now let's talk about the Toronto Maple Leafs who have been playing bad but winning until they started playing bad and losing. And now playing bad and winning, doesn't seem so fun.

And, you know, you guys were talking to me again after the Philly game going, well, they just know how to play tight games. It's not a play tight games.

They're tight

games. They know how to play them.

It is a skill.

Uh-huh. Yeah. I like that win. Like, the I'm not gonna go back and and renegotiate I will. The merits of that win.

I thought they They were bad. They they won a game based on defense, and I think that's that's a way you can win a hockey game, and and now they're not able to score at all. Right. It's a different conversation.

They have they have, 4 goals in 3 games.

That's not good.

Nope. No. You're gonna lose all those games. All of them.

Whoo. Who's having fun? Whoo. So what is it? So so last night, you've got, a goal by Matthews and Marner in the first 5 minutes.

The Leafs come out on fire.

They beat Jake Ottinger 4 times in the first 6 minutes of that game. Yes. They have the goal and 3 posts.

So there was a nice post. I think there was a Nielander post. Wasn't there? A Riley? Something like that.

Yeah. I think Riley, actually. Yeah. And so, you know hey. Listen.

It could have been 4 nothing, but it wasn't.

No. It wasn't. And Barry wasn't.

And then when Dallas ties it up, which is about the 10 minute mark if I'm I'm I don't know. You can look at the box score if you need the exact time. The Leafs just kinda like, I don't know. They're there. It's like, oh, man.

I can't get through my day unless I know when Dallas scored 1st.

That's still Adam with detail.

Well, who cares? But the point is the point is that they they you know, Jake, Joseph Wall is lined up perfectly with the shot. He makes the initial stave. Logan Stankovic bats in bats it and then bats in the rebound, and it kind of squeaks through Joseph Wuhl's pads. And I think Jeff O'Neil said it perfectly on the TSN panel, who, by the way, they all had a they had a ripping game last night, those those 4.

I missed the intermission where they

Oh, they tore into the refs. It was fantastic. 2nd intermission was great.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Because they're allowed to do that. But long story short, the, after that, Jeff O'Neil said they kinda played like they were chasing it. And it seems kinda like that's what happened.

That's what happened in the Carolina game.

So what what is it that with that first goal going in? I mean, they gave Joseph Wall. He was up until last night with 3 days of rest, 10 o and o in his career. Wow. So Wow.

That's his first loss after 3 days of rest. It didn't feel like a bad game from him. It felt like a team that really couldn't get anything going on the offensive side of the pot.

They went right back to it's it's 2 things. They can't score, which has been a constant, but now they can't defend. And the penalty kill, which we talked about last show, has been so good this year. So unbelievably good is very human because they're way too soft and way too easy in front of the net. And and the stat that came up yesterday did I delete it off my phone?

I hope not. I did. But it's okay. I remember it. The stat, that Sportsnet stats came up with was the Leafs points percentage Mhmm.

With players in or out of the lineup. The Leafs have a better points percentage with Matthews out of the lineup than in. Mhmm. Now we know that because we've talked about it. Well, the Leafs actually have a better points percentage without Marner than with him since the beginning of last season.

Oh, okay. Well, now you're just picking on Mitch. Well, they actually have a better points percentage, way better points percentage without Riley Mhmm. In the lineup than with. With Jake McCabe, the Leafs have a better points percentage than they do with any of those other players in the lineup.

Matthews, Marner, Riley, without him, the Leafs play like a team if I round up on a round up they play like a team on pace to have a 68 point season without Jake McCabe without Jake McCabe. They got 69 points the year they finished last in 15 16. So the this current leafs team since the beginning of last season, if they were to have a 7 game series against the 15 16 Leafs would lose, if they don't have Jake McCabe in the lineup. He is Jake Muzzin. You you killed the man, but not the idea.

The it they have 1 guy who can kinda do it all back there, and that's it. They like, Simone Benoit, bless him. I think we all love him. Bless him. Fun guy, fun teammate.

Advanced stats people do not

like it. Simone Benoit stuff.

Yeah. Because he gets caved. Because he gets caved. He's not even sort of kind of a Jake McCabe replacement. No.

I don't think that was ever the role though. Right?

No. But it just, like, when you lose that player, there's no 1 who could step up in his role. At least lose Morgan Riley. I have confidence OEL could step up in that role. You know what I mean?

Mhmm. They they just don't have a replacement for that player. So, yeah, they're getting some saves. They can't score. That's a constant and it's a problem.

And they don't have an answer for when 1 of their defenseman is out of the lineup. Listen, I think when they win, it's easy to make excuses for them. When they lose, they're a team with no offensive depth. They have limited defensive depth, and you hope the goalie makes some saves.

I don't I don't agree with you on the on the limited defensive depth. I don't agree with that. Yeah. I completely do not agree with that.

I think Okay. They're missing 1 guy in their shit. So Yes. But that's not

the reason they that's not the reason they can't score, Steve, and you know that.

No. It's not the reason they can't score. It's the reason they can't defend.

Okay. But the problem is scoring.

They're bad at both ends of the ice. No. The problem is both.

Okay. But that's not the reason. So okay. If McCabe's in the lineup and they hit 4 posts in the 1st period, they still lose 4 to Yeah. Maybe it's 2 to 1, but they still lose.

So so I don't know. How many games are you gonna win scoring a goal?

Okay. I understand what you're saying. So what I'm saying is with Jake McCabe in the lineup, you probably lose that game 21. And, that's I mean, a loss is a loss is a loss. They could lose the game Feels better.

Yeah. Feels better. I understand what you're saying. What I'm saying is it's still a problem.

I and listen. I think that I think slumps can be accounted for. Mhmm. Right? I think name a team.

Name a single team. Like, if you're a fan of another team in the Toronto Maple Leafs, and your team is good, name a team that has a fan base that is like, wow. When these guys are great, it's it's Technicolor. It's it's 8 k. It's the crazy and then when they when they don't have it, fuck.

I don't even know if this team could make the playoffs. Every team, with the exception of the 2023 Boston Bruins, has these stretches. Right? Every team. The key now is identifying where the issues are.

I think, obviously, and we'll talk about the forward group in a second, they need a 3rd line center. They've needed a 3rd line center since day 1. We know that.

Their issues are the same place they've always been. But that

I I don't I don't agree with that.

They don't have offensive depth. And they

and they had no goal tending the last couple of years, like, unless they're spotty. They got it. Yeah.

So then

you've got then you've got they do have defensive depth. No. They absolutely depth. Offensive depth, I'll get we'll get there.

Yeah.

The defense, I think, is actually great. But I think you've gotta you've gotta look at where these guys are being played. Like, here's the conversation I wanna have about Morgan Rielly.

Okay?

Everybody wants to have the Morgan Rielly conversation. Let's have it in this way.

Okay.

My question for Morgan Rielly is, how many defense partners do we need to try with you before we find out that you're the issue?

No. This is the yeah. Like, I see I know that

he hasn't played with great guys, but there are plenty of defensemen who are known as number 1 defenseman on their team

Mhmm.

Who make it work with somebody who's less than ideal.

Quinn Hughes has essentially saved Luke Shen's career. Like, how many 1,000,000 of dollars did he make that guy? The the Canucks move significant assets to get him a partner in Philip Ronick.

Yep. And And Philip Ronick's been injured a good chunk of this year.

And he gets injured, and now it's Tyler Myers. Chaos giraffe. And which is, like, 1 of the best nicknames in the league.

Chaos giraffe.

That's Chaos

I thought that was Logan Stanley. But, anyway,

I mean, he's A bad giraffe. Maybe he's just

bad giraffe.

I don't know. Mid giraffe. He's found a way to make it work. Like, so listen listen. Like, so the the the big forwards that that make a lot of money at least look like forwards who should make a lot of money.

Riley's not even in the ballpark of living up to being a 7 and a half $1,000,000 defenseman.

And 7 and a half $1,000,000 ain't what it used to be. Like when he signed it

Oh.

That was like, woah, that's a lot of money.

If we if we look up we don't have to, but if we were to look up other defenseman around the NHL in that ballpark, the okay. Who would you rather? This guy or Riley? This guy. Who would you rather?

This guy or Riley? This guy. Who would you rather? This guy or Riley? This guy.

You'd go down the whole list. He's not even kind of living up to it. Like, we should be able to survive the Leafs should be able to survive not having Jake McCabe.

Yes. And so here's the question, guys. When Morgan Riley is worth 7 and a half $1,000,000, when he is playing like the guy that that we've known in the past, what is he doing?

He's scoring a shitload.

And he's had 6 points in the last 20 games or something like that?

Yeah. It's so I mean, he he wasn't even the best looking offensive defenseman on his pair last night.

Yeah. Philip Myers had, like, 3 good shots, didn't he?

He had he had a couple defensive breakdowns, but, generally, I thought that was a really good game from him.

There is

Generally.

And this is this is this is the thing. You know, I I don't think all of this is Morgan Riley's fault. We've gone through this before on the positive side with, hey. Look at what he's done despite the names. And the names, the resume of names that Morgan Riley has played with in his Leafs tenure are terrible.

Give him a right handed defenseman. Here's Cody Cece. Oh.

Not that 1.

Like But

we could've told you that before he even got here with Cece. Right? We could've told you that.

Yeah.

The the thing with Morgan Rielly that is very clear is that he's loved within the organization. He's loved within the clubhouse.

I love him.

And he is gonna have more rope than most people. If William Nylander, who is also struggling

Mhmm.

At God.

Was playing to the level on his contract that Morgan Riley is to his, William Nylander would be sitting on the bench.

Willie looks so ordinary. It's But but do

you see do you hear what I'm saying?

So a a couple, what, episodes ago, you're willing to give Riley a pass with him being a new father and him picking it up after 4 Nations. Is that gone?

It's not gone. I think we have to acknowledge that it's not good. I didn't say I'm not saying they gotta trade him. I'm saying

There's so many games between now and that.

Yeah. Like Yeah.

We can't just go, like, what is that? 15, 20 games of him being ass? Like, we can't we can't have?

I don't know if I was even really willing to give him a pass, Jesse. I was just trying to find a reason.

Mhmm.

And and the reason to me feels like, well, maybe he's a new dad, and that's a huge adjustment. And I can't even imagine what it's like being a professional athlete.

Right. And you can't you can't change that part. So if that's the reason he's struggling and that can't be changed, then you gotta figure out a way to work around his struggling.

So this is my this is my point.

To shelter him in some way.

Is he do you think he's injured and and struggling with something the way Max Domi was injured and certain? Like, you're around the team. What do you think?

Morton Riley's injured. I have no idea, man. I don't wanna I don't think so. You don't think so? I don't think he's injured at all.

Okay.

I don't know.

Because because then because like I said with with Willie, and this this kinda goes for Austin and and Mitch as well. When Willie struggles, Willie sits on the bench. He misses shifts.

Right.

When Austin struggles I mean, it's rare. But when he does happened, I once. I've never seen Austin benched ever.

And Even dating back to his rookie.

But also he's always pretty consistently good even when he's hurt. Yeah. Mitch has moments where you're like, it wasn't my favorite, but he's not really benchable. Like, he's not that kind like, we're talking about superstar benchable. Like, even Alex Ovechkin got benched.

You know? It's by the way, the bloodlust thing that I was talking about last show, like, Mitch stood there near the end of the first period. Stood there and stood there and stood there because the play broke down because he's not expecting to be hit. Jamie Ben is on the ice. Move your ass.

Mhmm.

He oh, and there you are. You're on it. Now you're on your ass because that is a top of the food chain predator out there.

Okay.

And these these guys don't make them. There was a play yesterday. It was in the neutral zone. I don't remember exactly when it happened. I wanna say it was second period.

There was a loose puck, and Willie had a chance to fucking level the Dallas star who was going for it. He didn't he didn't he didn't get the player. He didn't get the puck. He didn't get nothing. It's a flyby.

You don't need to worry about what you need to worry about with Jamie Ben with the Toronto Maple Leafs. Now the stars of the Leafs can do things that Jamie Ben just can't do anymore. He's not at that point in his career anymore. I don't know if he was ever quite that. He's more like a Joe Pavelski type.

But you just don't expect to get hit by them. But Matthews put Rupa Hintz on his ass, and that was the end of it.

Yes. It was I I wanna bring it back to Morgan Riley.

The first 5 minutes of that game feel like a fever dream.

They do. Sorry. And I I wanna bring it back to Morgan Riley because I understand the organization loves this person. I understand the dressing room loves this person. I understand he's a leader.

I understand the city loves him. And I am willing to give leeway on, on a guy who probably is going through a lot personally. Just having a kid is a lot. And and it could be anything else. But my thing is, with with Morgan, is when he plays this bad, and there have been stretches like this before.

There have. Uh-huh. Except for that 1 season where he had 72 points where there really was no bad stretch.

The 20 goals. It was insane. 2023 playoffs.

It was insane. 2023 playoffs. But that entire 2023 season, people were like, this guy stinks. What's going on?

I do remember that.

Yeah. And I think it's time for oh, okay. Well, oh, well, Max Pacheretti needs to sit, while this guy needs to sit. Does Morgan can we can we play him down? Can we play him less?

Where where's the accountability there? It's not because you're going, I'm gonna punish Morgan Riley. It's because I'm gonna challenge him. Challenge this guy. What head coach, Babs, Keefe, did he coach did he play under Randy?

I don't I don't remember. Yeah. He did. But bat listen. Boracek.

His best place has been under Babs, Keefe, and and and now, Barube. What of the of these guys, who has ever said, Morgan, we need more in a public way? And I don't and, like, we're totally cool with it happening to Willie all the time. Willie who leads the team in scoring

Yep.

In goals anyway. Mhmm. We're not we're just not gonna do that with Morgan. He's untouchable. I can't I'm sorry.

I But you signed a long term deal here. It's for a lot of money based on what you bring. And at a even with the cap going up, it's a lot of money based on what you bring. You have got to, at some point, take accountability. Let TANF and OEL take the big the big minutes.

That has to be the the thing now.

I've I've been pretty open about the fact that, you know, I've dealt with Leaf players over the years, and and Morgan Rielly is my favorite. He's the best. Like, I I it's not that I've ever really had a negative experience. Just he's my favorite, and I've dealt with him the longest. And I I saw a tweet recently, and I think someone just said, it's time.

And it was a picture of Morgan Riley next to DeMar DeRozan. Oh, god. And I thought, damn. Like, we've yeah. Maybe we've been looking in the wrong direction this whole time.

But he's got a full no move. So, like, I don't even think that's a conversation. But, Especially with a new kid. He's gonna Yeah. You can

go fly a kite, man.

Yeah. I'm not agreeing to that if I'm him. I totally understand that. Man, man, you're just not getting enough. You're not getting enough out of that player.

You're not even getting So how do

you get enough? Because you know it's there. I love my play with Morgan Riley. Is it? Well, and if it isn't, if you don't believe it is, why is he the first pair?

He's not. Who's leading the team in ice time? I don't actually know.

I think it well, it might have been him yesterday, because I saw he had over 20. But there was a game a a few games ago we were talking about where he was 4th.

Mhmm.

It's Tan of McCabe. The Tan of McCabe is the best d pair they have. Yep. So I don't care 1st, 2nd, 3rd. It's the best d pair they have.

The second McCabe goes away. Like, all of a sudden, Riley Tanniff can't play together. They're that bad. Or maybe you wanna spread them out or I don't know what it is. It's it's rough shape back there, man.

It's it's like they're really disconnected.

Adam's right in that he's playing first pair of minutes game after game after game. If you look at his game log, the only outlier really is the Carolina game that was out of reach for the Leafs, where he played 18 minutes. But if you go through that, it's 23 minutes, 18, 20, 26, 21, 23, 23, 22. Yeah. 26 minutes in the Philly game.

23, 22, 21, 22, 22, and then a couple of eighteens in there. But he is playing first pair minutes. And I think Craig Barube gets a lot of runway from me because of how the season has gone so far. Like, I don't like to just look at the 3 games or this really from January onwards stretch and make over assumptions about this little stretch here. So he does get a little bit of leeway here, but I don't like the lineup decisions he's been making as of late.

And I think Morgan Riley is a part of that conversation that also will go to the Steven Lorenz conversation and all that.

Let me

I have a question for you Okay. To to ask you about that.

I'm glad you raised your

What lineup decisions don't you like? Tell me about it.

Well, that's what I wanted to talk about. The the Morgan Riley 1 that we're talking about. It's I don't understand why because Morgan Riley is struggling so much, and we're sitting here asking, like, what what are you gonna do? That's on the head coach to play him lower down in the lineup and shelter him with minutes. Like, there is an actionable item here if Morgan Rielly is not playing out, but you still trust him as a defenseman to run him out there.

Just don't do it in as so many minutes. This is a good time to give OEL a run with the 24, 23 minute at night time on ices, night after night and give Morgan Riley a depth role here because he's clearly not playing well and he can't live up to the minutes that Craig Groove is giving him. So I I'm questioning that line of decision from Craig Brubay. The other couple others that we'll get to.

Yeah. And I I do wanna talk I want you to save that. Like, star that 1, Jesse, because I wanna come back to the lineup decision.

I don't wanna go into Steven Lawrence

right now.

It's I don't wanna belabor the Morgan Rielly point because the thing with Leafs fans and if you're not a fan of the Leafs, maybe and you're not here, you probably don't understand this. But Leafs fans, whenever things go bad, tend to get existential. And what I mean by that is just that they lose 4 games in a row.

Cameron goes straight to me. Thanks, Matty.

I think they they simply instead of they simply don't have it, it could be that they simply don't have it right now. Yeah. Plenty of teams struggle. The eighties Oilers had struggles. No.

They had bad games. Wayne Wayne Gretzky had shit games, dude. Few of them. It happened. And, you know, Mario Lemieux didn't make the playoffs the 1st 5 years he was in the league, and that was back when there was 21 teams and 16 of them made it.

God. I would love to read some of those articles.

Oh, I'm I'm I would love I would love a Stephen a Smith covering hockey in the late eighties talking about Mario Lemieux ain't shit. And what about his legacy, and he's got nothing on Gretzky? You know, I this is this is how many games are there this season?

82 games.

How many games is that?

So many games.

So there are going to be things that happen like this. But I think Jesse hit on such a great point, which is why I interrupted him to reinforce his point, which is there are lineup decisions that a coach makes that only the coach knows why. And when you get familiar with the coach, they have a little bit of runway. In Toronto, it's about 3 months.

And

then we start going, what the fuck is this guy thinking? And, usually, what they're thinking is, Mark, well,

we gotta try. 10 games before people are like, fire him.

Yeah. Well, we gotta try stuff. And and I think we're in the try stuff part of the year, and they're 1st place. And the entire division sucks right now. Go look at the last 10 of the entire division.

Everybody's either at 500 or worse, except for the Montreal Canadians.

It's the 1 error I made in my Bruins might miss the playoffs, prediction is, teams need to pass them. Right. Somebody else No one's interested. No 1 is freaking interested. We are we

are this year's midropolitan.

Guys, don't you wanna play the Leafs in the 1st round? Let's go.

So so this is I'm gonna go to Jesse first on this. Jesse. And we'll and we're gonna we're not gonna conquer both of these or 2 or 3 of these at the same time.

Mhmm.

But give me your first questionable lineup decision that's been eating at you lately. You're at the games.

You're at the 3.

You're at the post.

The Steven Lawrence 1 is at top of mind immediately.

Now is does that fall under let's try it?

Yeah. It does, but it was also I think it was a little shortsighted. Okay. You know, in that in that because it's it's shortsighted because now we have hindsight on how things went and his decision to remove so Steven Lorenz got removed off of that line around 9, 10 in the second period, and that was it. And they went away from that.

Which is frustrating because they scored on, like, their second shift.

Yeah. Well, he didn't have anything to do with that goal.

So what? Like, they scored. You know what I mean?

No. But it does. It does. Like, if he's not contributing to the line and it's Matthews and Marner who scored that goal, then it does matter that they scored and he had no influence at all.

I guess.

I don't think just because he's his feet are on the ice doesn't mean he gets credit for he should stick to this line.

I mean,

if they're if

they're if you're gonna leave defenses, they start what they do.

The thing I wanna get to Let him get to that Plus is Craig Barube after the game, you ask him, what happened with Steven Lawrence? Why did you take him off that line? You only gave him a period and a half to try that out. And he said that at that point in the game, I was trying to get goals. So I switched up the lines, and I then I kept juggling everything.

You saw Willie was up there at a point. It was Matthews Marner, Nylander, and then he went back to Matthews Marner, Nies, towards the middle of 3rd, and Steve Lawrence went back down to the 4th line. And I I don't understand if you're a head coach and your goal is to get goals, so Lawrence is on the 4th line and Matthews Marner and Nysz are together. Your whole point of playing a hockey game is to get goals.

Yeah.

That's the only way to win. So ice that lineup that can get you goals at the beginning of the game so that you can get goals. And it goes back to why I think the Leafs are struggling here. And it's a large part because they have no offense.

No.

It's because those strong guys are taking shots here.

What do you what do you mean? What do you mean? How many times am I going to say this? Matthews Marner, Nylander, Tavares, what do you mean you can't score?

Do you know who led the team in shots last night?

No. Philip Myers. Shot? I'm gonna go with the defenseman. Oliver Ackman Larson.

No way.

Do you know the game before that who led the team in shot? Philip Myers. Max Domi.

What? Oh. 0. No.

Max Domi's bad. Max

Domi and Bobby McMahan. Well, talk

about it. Well, he should never shoot again.

Keep going, Jesse. Keep going.

Max Domi and Bobby McMahan with with 3.

Against the Canucks?

They shared the lead for shots. Against the Canucks? Against the Canucks.

Hey, Adam. Max Domi led the Leafs in shots, and they got shut out. Do you know the Shut your face. Do you

know the game before that? True. Do you know the game before that who led the, Leafs in shots?

Morgan Riley.

That would be the Carolina game.

Oh, boy. It had to be Willie. He had 3 breakaways.

Nick Robertson with 5. Bro. The game before that, the Philadelphia game, who led the team in shot?

They only had 17 that night. So this is the Who

led the team? Philip Myers.

Oliver Ekman Larson with 4. Damn. This this team doesn't know how to score anymore. And it used to be

They don't know how to hit the net apparently.

There used to be moments where they're down 41 to Dallas and you're like, it's middle of the 3rd period. They could get 3 quick ones here. Yeah. Because Matthews might go off, Marner might go off, Willie might go off, JT might do something special. There used to be an excitement around this Leafs team in their ability to score, and I don't know what happened.

No game was ever over. No game was ever over. Complimentary and derogatory. But when they

had the lead, you they was never

It was it wasn't over. Yeah. But I used to bet the Leafs all the time. You when you they're go down by 2, you take them, like, even or, plus 1 and a half goals or whatever and to come back and win those games. And for some reason, with Craig Barube, he's completely sucked the the shooting out of the stars of this team.

And I think that's a major problem, and I think little things like trying Lorenz at the the first line

Mhmm.

Doesn't help a situation where OEL is your shot leader, and Max Stomy, and Nick Robertson, and Bobby McMann are the guys leading your team with shots on goal. You have Austin Matthews, Mitch Marner, William Meehan, and John Tavares. That's unforgivable night after night.

They don't have the horses to do what Craig Ruby wants them to do, which is take shots from the point and bang them in. They don't

have the horses. They won't do it. Well, so so I thought the Steven Lorenz story was interesting yesterday because the it was and it was a positive way to frame it. I understand why TSN did it this way and everybody else did. It was like, hey.

Local kid comes to the team on PTO, won the cup last year.

I forgot he was a PTO.

You know? Like, this is a guy that that that said, no. You can other teams, you can take your guaranteed money and shove it. I wanna play in Toronto. Like, you should love Steven Lorenz, and I think all the fans do.

I loved him in the

4th line. I know that there is a limited skill set there based on what he brings outside of the 4th line.

That's fine.

Totally cool. That's what I love.

Mhmm.

I love this guy, positive attitude, and he's gonna go up there, and it's gonna be great. The story to me should have been Matthew Nyes is being punished. Matthew Nyes is being moved down. Because when you when when Barube needs a goal, there comes Matthew Nye's right back. And here's the problem.

He he tried to That

Nye's Marner Matthews line was horrible, horrible against Carolina, and then horrible again this weekend. And so I am I am wondering and I am asking, why is the story not and I said this last episode, Matthew Nis, when these guys are down because the the core 4 can't score every game. Mhmm. And that's a problem, and I agree with you. That's a salary problem.

They get paid to do it.

Matthew Nies needs to be the guy that steps up. I know he's 22. Sorry you're playing on the first line, though, buddy. That is what it required. I know.

So when they so when they punish Mhmm. When they move him off that line, first off, he gets a pretty sweet assignment next to Tavares and Nylander. 2nd, the the first sniff of trouble, they're like, you know what? Put it back. And it comes back to and I'll finish in a second.

They're remember they they did the line blender thing against Carolina? Do you remember that?

Mhmm.

And, like, you have, like, Patcharetti playing up with you know, it was all over the place. And the thing about the line blender thing is that if you go back to the exact same lines the next game, that's not punishment. That's not accountability. That's the problem.

That's the scheme out of ideas.

And I also think that's the stars dictating, well, actually, no. This is who I'm gonna play with. Because if we're gonna be honest here, guys, Matthews and Martyr want to play together. They were the only ones who scored last night. Really, they were the only 1, but

proceeded to do with the rest

of the game? Exactly. What did

they do?

Proceeded to do nothing after that.

You have the wrong guy. Like, you're focusing on I think I said this last time. You're focusing on Matthew Nye's, but the guy is Mitch Marner. The guy is splitting up Matthews and Marner and then throw Nies wherever you want with whichever pair, but that's the key to that first line. Because what's the common denominator here?

You they've moved Matthew Nies a 1000000 times. If he can't get it going wherever, it's not Matthew Nye's fault. It's the fact that he keeps running out Matthews and Marner together. Mitch Marner was a Hart trophy candidate without Auston Matthews in the lineup because he was a lot of his own. Legitimate.

I think still Still, if I'm voting for the Hart trophy, he probably ends up at somewhere in that top 5.

Yep. He's he's if the season were to end today, which it's not, he's getting votes.

Why are they playing together?

I don't know.

Dude, like What's the if they can't score, then what is it?

Let's continue the conversation. Attaboy there, Mark. Attaboy there, mister Messier. Freaking freaking they get shut out by the Canucks, and he's like, you know what? I like the way we played.

And he comes out and 1st or second shift and yeah. Yeah. Because he's a leader and he's guaranteeing because he's he's he's coming out and he's backing up his boys. And, no, I actually like the way we played. And after 5 minutes, he's got an assist.

Matthews has a goal against the Dallas stars, a really good team. And I'm like, hot damn. You know what? There's him putting his money where his mouth is, and then everyone evaporated.

Yep.

Toes curled up under the house that just fell on top of them. Where the hell did they get you can't do that.

No.

You can't be like, you know what? I actually liked our game in a game where we got shut out and then followed up by losing 41 on home ice. No. You stink. Like, what are you what are you talking about?

What are you talking about? That's terrible.

Mhmm.

It's in this team, when they're off, they're not fun to watch.

They're not. No.

They're not fun to watch. Like, it lose ugly. The, the lineup decisions I'm thinking of to make the team better are so pissy at piddly. Like who gives a shit when you think about the titans of Matthews Marner, Willie has to get going for the love of God. And Tavares has cooled off a bit.

I'm thinking about piddly shit, like take Ryan Reeves out of the lineup because he looks like he doesn't even like hitting anymore. And, legitimately, I think, Fraser Mitten at this point in his career is probably a better NHL center than Max Domi. I'm not taking Domi out of the lineup. I'd I'd like to see him on the same lineup.

Well, so here's what I think is interesting. They pointed out during the broadcast yesterday that, that that Lawrence got that shot and Domi didn't. And I think there's probably 2 reasons for that. 1, Lawrence is a winger, and they need a 3rd line center. They don't have 1.

Right? Yeah. And number 2 is I don't think they've seen out of Domi what they need to see to put him there. No. But here's the thing.

Good. When he played with Matthews Matthews last

year with Bertuzzi, which I will forever ride on, those guys were dynamite. Here's the difference, though. Like, some guys can play every position. I don't think Max can't.

And that's okay. Yeah. They At $3,000,000 No.

I know. And a half. I the but they, the the difference here, he was on Matthews. Right?

Mhmm.

I liked them on Matthews. Right? I think Max Domi is a right winger. Far and away, his best games as a leaf have been as a right winger. 2nd best is center, and that's a far way behind 2nd best.

3rd best is left wing. I don't think he's useful there. So I wouldn't put him in that spot. Not just because he hasn't earned it, but I that's, the opposite wing I think he's good on.

Now so I I I agree with you on all that. I I have to ask, because, you know, we talk about holding Morgan Rielly accountable. You need Matthews and Marner to lead the charge. You need Tavares and Nylander to lead the charge. K?

At what point again do we spread those guys around 3 lines, or do they just not have the depth? Like, the they need to make a trade for a 3rd line center. We said that coming out of camp. Even before camp, it was like, we need they need a 3rd line center.

They need to make a trade for a few things.

If you get a I know. But the most important

Yeah.

Is the 3rd line center.

Uh-huh.

So you need a finisher. Uh-huh. You know, I know everybody wants, like, Yanny Gord or something like that. To me, Brock Nelson is the answer, has been always because that guy can finish.

You think they're gonna get outbid.

By Brock yeah. For Brock Nelson. Unless they're willing to part with that 1st round pick in 26, which I don't think they are.

It's a bad idea. You don't trade 1st round picks over a year ahead

of time.

Dubas didn't. Well, Adam. Yeah. Well and and and listen. Generally Shani's out of contract.

What does Shani care?

You risk He might not be back. You risk giving up a lottery pick unless you protect it.

A 100%. And we've learned that

as Leaf fans with the Phil Castle trade.

Yes. The but the point I'm trying to make here is we've got we gotta figure something out with that situation.

Oh, yeah.

That third line, as nice as they play together, is a midseason third line. That is not a playoffs third line. And you need to you get that center in there who can give me give me a center who can give me 20 goals over the course of an 82 game season. That's all I need. Without There are plenty of those guys.

Without giving up 40. Without giving up 40.

Maybe with some size and who who can win some key face offs.

Yes.

I like a Nick Buke stat. That'd be nice.

That is bargain bin chopping. Yeah.

64. Can score 20 goals.

Every time he gets on the ice.

So this is my point. Like, let's let's solve that issue. And if there was ever a time and and CJ said this on insider trading yesterday on TSN. It's it looks like the Canucks are holding up the trade that trade market because they're still not sure what they're gonna do.

I don't. Yeah. So if I don't think the leaf should wait.

I think I agree with you. I think the time actually is pretty soon.

Mhmm.

You gotta make a you gotta make a move. And, I mean, I can't imagine that, like, getting I mean, maybe Utah feels like they still got a shot, and they don't wanna give up Buke's dad or or Seattle feels like they still got a shot. They don't wanna give up Gord or the Islanders who are in last place, you know, Lou Amarellos. Nope. Nope.

We won't score, but we'll make the playoffs somehow. And and you're right, Jesse. Brock Nelson will probably be too expensive for them. If

unless, you know, they they lean Steve's idea and just sell the farm, you know, because that's what Steve wants.

Sell the farm? No. I I dude, I am the ultimate prospect pincher. Yeah. You're I don't wanna trade anybody.

The joke is the complete opposite. Yeah. You don't wanna sell anybody.

Ever. Ever. Okay. This year's 1st round pick of from my cold dead hands, but Could be Gretzky.

Could be Gretzky.

And also, I don't think they have the No.

They don't.

They don't have 1 though. Great.

Well, no. Steve opens up a lemonade stand and then puts lemonade in his fridge.

And so I'm gonna drink this. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I like lemonade, and I don't want I don't want anyone. What if I run out of lemonade?

Yeah. You know? What about Ben Danford? No. What about Easton Cowen?

Hey. What about Fraser Minton? I'll kill you.

So so those 3 guys are not going anywhere. And everybody else, I'm, like, I mean, I could care less.

You know? There's so much there's little tinkery shit I would do. Like, I call up the Preds and I go, what do you give me for Pontus Homburg? We're not playing them. What what are you what are you offering?

Robertson's probably gone.

Robertson's probably gone. It's hey.

You got that center. You moved Domi to the wing.

Yeah. Can I get a third for Toby Niemola? Okay. I'll I'll get okay. I only have so much time for you to stop laughing.

Okay. What about a 4th? A fit, a conditional set. You know what I mean? Like, I would I would do tankery shit like that to acquire assets that maybe I can spend later.

Like what they did with the Timothy Lillegren. Yep. Right? Yep.

How do you know

what that was for now? 3rd?

3rd and a 6. Something like that. And you can use those assets. They're fun. They're great.

They're they're trade deadline coupons, but it doesn't solve the issue of your big guys don't score. Yep. And your top defenseman is your maybe 3rd best defenseman.

Wow. Timothy Lillegren, by the way, 3 points since December 21st. But they made a huge mistake letting him go. BetMGM is an official sports betting partner of the National Hockey League and has your back all season long.

What about my front? Listen. We got your front, buddy. Sides. Damn.

I don't even know. I don't even know. That's a lot of lot of places that we need to cover.

Oh, that MGM covers it all. Yeah.

Well, maybe they do. To get

your top. It's so high up. Yes.

Now, hey, here's the question. What's your bet on the next Leafs win? Oh. Like, here, I'll I'll pull up the schedule. Here we go.

We got the Devils.

They beat

they beat the Devils on Thursday.

You think they beat Keith and the Devils?

There you go.

They got Montreal on Saturday, scheduled loss. Right? Scheduled loss. And then the lightning next Monday. Which of those 3 games do they win?

I tell you what, it better be Thursday against New Jersey. Otherwise, this would get out of hand.

K. Well, if Jesse and Steve were saying it, unconfidently, you have to make your own call, to be honest with you. Raise your game to the next level with BetMGM, a sportsbook worth a selling even if the Leafs aren't, official sports betting partner of the National Hockey League. Betmgm.com for terms and conditions. Must be 19 years of age or older to wager.

Ontario only. Please play responsibly. If you have any questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact Connex Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an adviser free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. I look at I look at the, the other line of decision, Jesse, that I feel like you're gonna bring up, and I wanna set you up for it.

What what's the other line of decision that what what else bothers you? What else is new?

Oh my gosh. It's a quite it's quite a long list, actually, now that I think about it. And, like I said, Brube gets so much runway. He's new head coach. He had his full

He just got here.

He just got here.

But it goes for sure, the Lorenz thing was just curious. The way the broadcast sets it up is the right thing to do with some television. It's a nice story. You don't dump on something before it even happens. But then after the fact, we all see what happens.

The

Oh, the letter the the announced lineup is useless. Yeah. Useless. Yeah.

Split up Matthews and Marner. There's no reason for Marner to play with Matthews ever again. And then Wow. Bam. Ever again.

Well, unless, like, in certain situations, I guess, but, like

I split all 3 of them up because Willie's been so ass. You know? I I honestly do. Like, we talk about, oh,

they need well, they do need a 3rd line center in that 3rd line. It's it's a mid season 3rd line. Imagine if William Nylander could drive his own line. Things would look a lot better. I think he could, man.

A 100%, but they refuse to try these things. And then

you take out

of this lineup, the guy who this entire season has given this team the most energy. And Ryan Reeves is supposed to be the energy guy laying the big hits and all that fun stuff. And they have a guy who's actually been doing that, and his name is Max Pacioretti. And consistently, time and time again, Brube treats him as a part time player with the rest

record without him? With the

rest of the rotation of guys up in the press box next to me. Yeah. Like, he he's treating Max Pacioretti like 1 of them when this dude should be in the lineup every single night because he's a huge body. He's he's been a giant hitter. He's gonna kill someone.

He's given it his all. Like, you and you can't say that about every other forward in this forward group. So Max Patch already sitting is the, yeah, the third thing there. I think Craig Brube deserves some criticism right now for.

Help me understand what you think, and I asked this question to both of you. So I want both of your answers on this before we get off track again because we always do.

Okay. Yes. What would

be in in in Berube's mind, what's the reasoning for Paciorette being a part of the rotation of forwards? And I'm talking about Robertson. I'm talking about Reeves. I'm talking about Pontus Holmberg. I'm talking, you know, these guys that are are scratched once every 5 games at least.

Holmberg's gone. He's gone. Sorry. That was a question for you.

So Patchereddy. Mhmm. Patchereddy.

I don't think he thinks he's getting enough offense out of him. Like, I don't think it's That's fair. Rubin doesn't trust him to play up in the lineup. Like, he's he's never gonna give him that well, he might. But right now, the I don't see him giving him a shot up there in, like, the first line role or even, like, a significant stretch in the second the second line where he was actually successful in.

You you know what's frustrating about that? Yeah. He Right. Him Pacheredi Tavares' Nielander was such a good line. It worked.

Pacheretti got injured and they never tried it again.

No. It's something that worked early on in the season. And Brube, I don't I don't get the reasoning because to me, it seems like an obvious thing to do is you give Pacheretti, the time of day in the line the time on ice in this lineup to to play for a little bit here, especially because why not when your team is so anemic on offense, try something that, worked early on in the season and not Lawrence up in the on the first line.

Oh, well, I I I asked you last episode if that was gonna be, like, Noah Gregor, and it turned out to be.

I have an answer to something. I didn't realize producer Hayden was here,

and he's down the hall,

and he can hear everything I'm saying.

Okay.

I because I texted him. I go, what is the Leafs record without Max Patcharetti? And he immediately responded. And I'm like, how did you get it that fast?

Oh, nice.

They're 87 and o, which is above 500.

That's not good. Without him? Without him.

So that the they're pretty mid.

That means they're really good with him. Yes. Because they are way above our record.

Hey. Ask

him to do the other math.

Just just take her right now, dude.

Hayden, what's what's the math?

No. You have the record up. Just add them all the way. 8 from their wins, 7 from their loss. You know what I'm wrong?

Monetize.

They are 19 9 and 2. Yeah. With him. Excuse me? Damn.

I would

Excuse me. So we started this whole episode by talking about the Jake McCabe point percentage that they are without him. What why aren't we talking about the patch already points percentage that they are with with with him in the lineup?

He's a factor. He's a factor.

No. Don't play him.

It's him or Robertson.

Don't play him. Neither never Yeah. No. He's the same as Nick Robertson.

Alright. Let's get out the fun let's get out the silly blender. Let's just friggin do it. Matthews, Nies, Domi, because I'd screw you. Pacheretti, Tavares, Marner, because I'm having fun.

I like Tavares Marner. Tavares scored 47 goals with Marner in his 1st year. The reason Marner has this deal is because of that season.

McMahon, Minton, Nylander.

I think Minton is gonna stay in the AHL. They don't want him in the NHL.

And then, Duerkampf, Lawrence. Steve, that means they're scratching. Yep.

Who are they scratching?

I don't care. Robertson and, Holmberg's not in there.

Well, that's not surprising.

Yeah. I don't I don't care. That that's that's I would try that. I would earnestly try that.

Did we I know we talked about Morgan Rielly and Jake McCabe, but this just came up on my Twitter. I thought it might might be interesting to you guys. The points percentage with Morgan Rielly and without and with McCabe and without, did we talk about the That's

what that we just We

did hit?

Okay. I wanna say. Alright. Alright. 800.

Points percentage is 8 is it point 8 without Ryan?

I'd be curious how many games that is because to me, that says 5 games. Yeah.

They were funny. We talked about

I know. Because I'm always trying to pull up the next thing.

Because we started with it, and then I just referenced it, and then Adam brought it up against the 3rd time.

Well, it's a lot.

Wayne, here. 1 1 sec. Just can you pull this up? Have you seen the Leafs points percentage?

Hey. Can I can I ask you this? Why not McMahon with Matthews? If they if they're worried about getting scoring, McMahon could score. I know he's not Brube's favorite.

He didn't have a great start, but, like, we saw him score.

So let's take my lineup and and and flip it a little. McMahon, Matthews, Domi. That's kind of fun. That's a lot of fun.

And there's some defense there. Like, Matthews does come back and play defense.

I'd still do patch already Tavares Marner. And then you're doing Nies Mitt Nielander? Oh. Come on. That's 3 lines that can score.

That's fun. I don't know how good they would be defensively, but it's 3 lines that can score. You put out, the menopod line, which is Dewar who I don't know if he could score in a soccer net, like, but I do I love his hustle, but holy fuck. Give us a goal. I don't know if him and Kemp could ever score again.

They may never the 2 of them may never score.

Dior had double digit goals last season before he was traded to the Leafs. Minnesota might be at, like, how haven't they turned out the next Ovechkin? I I don't understand. Well, they might have How don't they have a 1200 goal score?

Yeah.

Camp Lorenz and then, yeah, everyone else be damned. I'd like I Robertson, I'm sorry. That's a shame. Who else is there? Homburg, what are we doing?

And Reeves is dire straits. Like

and not even money for nothing like a good dire straits.

You need to provide something other than yelling at the goalie to release you, like, for warm ups. Like, I love his enthusiasm. People point out him not fighting. I don't care about that. He's a deterrent.

But, like, he's barely even hitting guys. Can you

Some would argue money. He is money for nothing, Adam. Ah. Yes.

Now could you dress Reeves for warm up, get the boys going, and then not play him?

You absolutely could. Marshall Rafay's taking warm up. He hasn't played a game yet.

Yeah. No. All the guys usually take warm up.

Yeah. Yeah.

So, like, this is my thing. Right?

I'd I'd try I'd try I I brought it up on

Monday, man. Like, I don't I like Ryan Reeves. I am pro Ryan Reeves. I'm struggling to see what he's bringing right now. And that 4th line is really valuable, especially when he's not on it.

Adam, your

eyes your eyes work fine. He's he's not doing anything.

Your eyes work fine. Even saw him take a hit last night, and I know he played in Dallas, but, like, he could've he could've crushed Duchene in the corner. And did the you know, the the the side yeah. And he did the side hit. You know, the side by side hit where they both hit the wall, but it's together?

Oh, that. And it was, you know, it was like, come on, man.

It's like a wrestling bump. Yes. Why are you protecting this player?

Yes. Yeah. I, And I know you wanna kill guys. He's already been suspended this year, but it's it's like No. Take him out of the play, man.

But there's

because the second your skates hit that ice, Duchenne's got

you beat. And but, again, this goes back to a conversation that is kind of a recurring thing. What do

you keep having?

Reeves is Reeves. He's not an everyday player. And when he is in the lineup, he's a 4th liner. God, I'd love it if Willie hit someone. And he had an opportunity last night, and he didn't do it because it's just not how he's wired.

And, like And you're not talking about hit like Dionne Fanuff, mid 20 tens. We're talking about

well, I In the neutral zone, he had an opportunity to fuck someone up.

There is a there is a way to hit in hockey that is strategic, where you bump a guy, he falls or he doesn't. It doesn't matter, but it it takes him out of the play.

It separates them from the puck, which is something I think Marner is actually getting better at.

Yeah. I like Matthews is doing it too.

Yeah. Yeah. He's you know, it's been a slow progression throughout his career. Listen, generally speaking for Willie, like, he'll pass up playing the body so that he can flick the puck and get around you. And the reason he does that is because he's really good at it, and it works more often than not.

But, I wonder how many more of those plays he'd get if players just had to think about how Willie has that in his bag. Willie is a Viking. Like, people don't realize that maybe because of the way he plays. The first player Willie decides to hit with an open ice hit is gonna regret it. It's gonna be a bad day for him.

He's strong and he's tall.

Yeah. But, you know, he's in his mid twenties. Maybe it's just never coming. Okay. Just like him playing center.

Maybe it's just never coming.

Yeah. Yeah. And I I agree with that. I I and listen. If that never comes, I'm still gonna be a William Nylander fan.

Oh, sure. I just I just need him to start scoring again so we can get out of this.

But it's gotta be in your bag. It's gotta be in your it's gotta be a consideration. Nikita Kucherov, you're worried about so many things to do with him. Mhmm.

But that's that's Also, he'll kill you. Yeah. And Malcolm too. Yeah. Especially in his prime.

And could Chuck and okay. Let's keep going down the list until we name a guy who doesn't have a cup. You know what I mean? Like, it drives me nuts with this team. It needs to be a factor.

I am so sidetracked by how much I love the lineup I made. Yeah. I really want them to try it.

I just don't know. I'd like I think they're hard and fast on Minton staying in the AHL.

Okay. Knock it off.

Should Steve be allowed to coach the Maple Leafs for

a day?

It's a good question.

No. No. No. No. Okay.

I think there's a difference between making the roster and coaching.

No. No. I'm going. They should let you have 2 days, so you get to run a practice, and then you get to do the full game day. So you get, like, a Wednesday, Thursday, where you

Just keep running horseshoe drills, like, at freaking or adult skates.

Whatever you can come up with.

I

think that'd be fun.

You know what? I only have 48 hours with the Toronto Maple Leafs. You know what? I'm bag skating the shit out of you just for all the years of format. Hey.

You know what drill I do know? Get rid of the pucks, get rid of the nets. Bag skating the dog shit out of all of you. You earned it.

You're just punishing them for

the years.

Yeah. Shit. That'd be good. I think that's the right way to go. Adam, I wanted to interrupt to say that Ryan Reeves never played in Detroit in, Dallas.

Oh, he didn't? No. Why did I feel like I guess, Domi did, and Tanniff did, and Yeah. Why did he put why did I think that? He did play in Saint Louis, though.

He did. Yes. That has nothing to do with that.

He's been a suitcase. He played for Pete DeBoer. Maybe that's where you got confused. Maybe.

Oh, there you go. In Vegas. Yeah. Yeah. He played for Pete De Okay.

Well got confused.

Anyway, I think we've exhausted the Leaf talk for now. The question the question will be, how do they get out of it? And the and the answer to that is they'll start scoring. But the the question of how they'll start scoring is what the lineup looks like, and it's clear that it is time for change. And I wanna emphasize this before we wrap this segment.

The best we have seen Marner and Nylander play

Mhmm.

Is when Auston Matthews was not playing. Yep. So maybe we ought to swish it up.

Maybe they don't play together. I think the shots thing is so important Yeah. And that the wrong guys are taking the shots and that the big guys aren't getting anything on the net right now.

I'd be curious what the attempts are because it feels like they miss and get blocked a lot.

Mhmm. That's their problem. Adam I hit the net.

You, you you ever watch, what what's that? Pawn show? Pawn shop? Pawnbroker? Pawn Stars?

Pawn Stars.

Yeah. Adam, you want a third line center? Yeah. Best I can do is John Klingberg.

Well, oh, I guess we should talk about that. I don't have I was tweeting with Anthony Petrelli about this last night.

Uh-huh.

And I don't have an issue with the Leafs looking at this guy because, frankly, he would if he's I thought he'd have the right take. If he's 60% of of what he was, he's still better than half of their defense.

We why are we John Clayton. Why would

you not look at that?

He shouldn't be judged

on 7 games where his hip was falling off.

Yeah. He shouldn't be judged on what he was last year. He was not whole. I don't know, man. He's also free.

Like, you don't have to spend assets to acquire a defenseman. Why not just get a free person and try them out? And then if it doesn't work out, nobody else is gonna want them, so then you just get rid of it.

I think I saw somebody say

I don't understand.

They need to sign Johnny Klingberg pa or something like that. But but to be fair to him, Jesse, you're right. And any of it okay. So he comes and he works out. He comes and he works out.

They try him out. Like, they did with Patcharetti this summer. Sure.

People are

like, oh, Patcharetti is done. Well, actually, the Leafs flew him in, and they tested him for, like, 3 or 4 days. And they're like, ah, we like this guy. And look at that. He's a factor.

They're 198 or 19 9 and 1 or

whatever it is

with them in the lineup. How about that? How about that? That's crazy. If John Klingberg is your 3rd line right shooting defenseman who is a power play specialist, maybe maybe we get a good distributor and a guy with a real and by the way, John Klingberg did have a real shot.

Yeah. Like, a real shot from the point. A boomer from the point. Imagine that. Boomer.

Imagine that instead of what we're getting now, which is weak knead, milk, toast, bullshit.

Could Klingberg come in and potentially give you what Connor Timmons provides for cheaper?

Well, yeah. What's Timmons make? Like, 1.1. Yeah. Klingberg would be, like, $700 or whatever the min is.

The it's I don't know. It doesn't cost them anything to try.

No. You should look at it.

I don't understand why you wouldn't just try it, and then if it doesn't work, you get rid of it, and it didn't cost you anything, because then he's not on your salary cap anymore. And if it does work, then oh my god it works. If if it doesn't work. It's a 0 risk scenario.

You waive him immediately. What? And it like I don't give a shit if the Leafs pay him $700 a plan.

It's not our money.

Yeah. I don't care. Like, jeez, if I'm John Klingberg, I probably don't even report. Like, I don't know. Yeah.

I had a good career. I don't feel like riding the bus. I like

No. At that point, I think it's probably like mutual contract termination or whatever. You know, it just goes your separate way.

Maybe even gets claimed.

Yeah. Somebody else takes a flyer.

Yeah. I I take a look at them as long as the agreement is fully variable and the second it stops working, yeah, thanks for your service. Yeah.

I don't I don't understand somebody not willing to take a chance on a 0 risk today.

Well and it's the same thing, the John Jonathan Toews thing, which is, yeah, he he's working out and teams are in contact with his agents. And let's say Jonathan Toews is good enough to play 3rd line center on any team. Mhmm. Mhmm. What'd it cost you?

You you know Free.

You know

what I was And maybe he waits the

whole summer and comes back next fall, but free.

You know what I was wrong on? No player, a year ago, we were saying this. No player had ever come back from the surgery that Patrick Kane got. Mhmm. He looks great.

He looks like he was having a bad season, then the old Todd McClellan bump. He's been playing great. Like, I know this is anecdotal, but my uncle was telling me he got his hip done. I think it was 11 years ago. The procedure took, I think it was 6 hours.

Oh. He's gotta he's gotta get his other hip done. And it it he's gonna get it done sometime this year. It's the procedure's 45 minutes.

Right. Because they Like, technology. Yeah. Check

yeah. Yeah.

Well, they say that Bobby Orr with his his knee injuries, which ended his career, he if he'd had them today, they would have gone in arthroscopically on both of them, and his knees would have been better.

Yeah. And he would have he

would have played 20 years.

Yeah. They just didn't yeah. Like, technology

For the Blackhawks, Jesse. He would have played for the Blackhawks.

Yes. I'm wearing a Blackhawks jersey. Yeah. That's right. He's watching.

We're in an era of medical first. It's actually like, if you're looking for good news, like, you know, I know these guys are professional athletes getting really expensive procedures done, but the technology is improving. No player had ever played in the NHL after getting the surgery that Jack Eichel got. Mhmm. And then he got it.

And he's been really bad. And he's yeah.

It's been awful. Like, I think the Sabers made the right call.

Yeah. He won a Stanley Cup, and he's been great. And, Patrick Kane is having you know, it's a limited sample size, but somewhat of a career renaissance here. And he's still in the NHL even if he's not what he was. He's an NHL player.

Why not Johnny Klingberg? Why not?

I don't know, man. I'm I'm so down with that, like, especially right now. Give it a shot. Who cares? Now I wanna talk a little bit about the I mentioned the Canucks thing.

They were talking about it on insider trading, and, obviously, the Pederson, TJ Miller stuff TJ. JT. JT. Why am I saying t j TJ? I don't know.

JT Miller, seems to be the guy that's more likely to go, and it's because I I I don't care how many great defensive plays Alias Petterson makes against the Toronto Maple Leafs. First off, they looked bad again last night. The Canucks, they look bad again. The the Kyle Connor's just tearing them up.

Go ahead and ask it. But I Don't ask what you asked me last night.

Does that make you feel worse about the Toronto Maple Leafs?

Yes. Yeah.

Knowing that the Canucks played a bad game in Carolina, a really good game in Toronto, and then they went back to playing bad.

Yeah. What does this say

about the Toronto Maple Leafs?

I was, it's it's not encouraging. Doesn't feel good.

The the 1 get right game on the schedule.

The point I'm trying to make

they didn't even get right.

They couldn't even stay right.

They saved Logan Steakhoven's entire season.

Yep. We we didn't even I'm so mad that I drafted him in fantasy, by the way.

Cool. Yeah.

I bet you're mad you got rid of him before he played the Leafs. 3

points. The the thing with with the Canucks holding up, thing I get it. Right? I understand why this is happening. I feel like in these situations, the most most boring outcome is always the most likely, and they're gonna hang on to both of these guys to the playoffs.

You can't convince me that the Canucks if they if you were to give Canucks management truth, sir, right now based on the play over the calendar year of 2024, so I'm talking spring and fall, that they want to move JT Miller. That if if it came down to it and all things were equal and there was no salary cap if there was no salary cap, do you think that we're even talking about JT Miller moving? Not a chance. Elias Petterson is a great

He's not on a bad contract either.

He's on a great contract. Yeah. You think that the way and it's not what he did a couple years ago. It's what he's done since the signing happened. If you think that Patterson's deal is it is something a team wants to risk right now in the middle of the season, I'm sure tons of teams would take it in the off season.

But I feel like if if JT Miller is the guy they move on from secretly, he's he's the only guy they could move, and the situation was untenable. I don't think and I love Patterson when he's at his best. I don't think that the Canucks wanna move JT Miller. If it was him, he'd have been moved by now. And that's where I look at and I'm not taking sides in this situation, but I look at 11 and a half $1,000,000.

And what hap what do we say about $11,011,000,000 plus players in Toronto? They gotta score every night. Yes. And what's is Pederson scoring every night? No.

Is he good on the defensive side? Yes. Is he capable of scoring every night? Yes. Absolutely.

But is he? No. Mhmm. And so I think what's gonna happen here if if these teams are not creative enough, and by the way, none of them are, is you're gonna let the Canucks and their indecision hold up the entire trade market, and they're not gonna trade JT Miller. If they're smart, they're not gonna trade that guy.

That would be a ludicrous thing to do. JT Miller in the playoffs

I know. Ludicrous. I keep going back to keep them together. They'll be great in the playoffs. Now the Canucks aren't in the playoffs.

And by the way, Patterson wasn't great in the playoffs last year.

No. He wasn't. Mhmm.

This season by cap hit, Elias Patterson is the 5th highest paid player skater, I should say.

And by cap hit is the only thing that matters. The real dollars, who cares?

It's 13 Austin, Nathan, 12 6, Connor, 12 5, Panarin, 11 6, and then Pederson, 11 6.

29 points in 37 games. Pederson has how many goals, guys?

This season?

14. Jesse, how many? I have it because it's with the contracts. 10.

Oh. 0.

Yeah. 10 goal. I'm sorry.

Like, if goals in body, man.

The NHL is, what have you done for me lately?

Yeah.

It's Janet Jackson all the way, and, Pederson has not done a lot lately. Offensively. Offensively.

Matty, if you wanna bring this up, we can look at the this is the league skaters arranged by cap hit, and then you have the points column here. And you see Patterson has no has

no trade collection.

The difference between Patterson and the other top Oh. Skaters in the league. God. Austin, like I said, he's missed a bunch of games, but he's more than a point a game, 32 points in 30 games. McKinnon, 70 points in 45.

McDavid, 59 and 40. We got Panarin at 45 and 41, and then Pederson, 29 points in 37 games.

Okay. I'm having I'm having a bad season. I have 63 career points in 74 career Stanley Cup playoff games. Do you want me?

Yes. Jonathan Marcia. So Mika Zibanejad. Oh, wow. Oh.

Yeah. No. Maybe not. Dude, last year,

oh, man. He's having such a bad playoff because he had 3 goals. Mhmm. But he had 13 assists, 16 point 16 games.

Goals are what matter.

I don't Goals matter more.

1 thing that's interesting, I think, about your you talking about them trading Millerson and and Petr, Millerson.

I think we should just call them Millerson and I think

I might have stumbled on this whole thing.

That's the title of the show

right there. Millerson.

Go ahead. So the Millerson situation, I'm just gonna start referring to it as that. We just invented something. So with Millerson, Pedersen has no trade protection. 0.

So if there is a team who wants to take a shot at this player with that contract, the Vancouver Canucks can send them to Anchorage, Alaska. No. North Pole, Alaska.

Alaska. Steve's favorite place Did you know the Phoenix cop left from there? It's pretty cool.

Steve's favorite place on there. If there was a NHL team there, they could send them there. And with JT Miller, he has trade protection. And my understanding is that the teams he won't he isn't willing to go to are all the Canadian based teams, but there are markets where JT Miller will accept a trade to. And there might just because of the numbers of teams involved with Pedersen where it's all 31 of them, there might be a trade partner you can find.

I think what we're all coming to here is a move is gonna be made and there's a pretty high likelihood it's not gonna happen till the summer. Oh, yes. That's my point. It's just it's so difficult.

I I agree. So difficult. That's true.

And I I think that's true because you gotta wait for the cap to go up.

I think

I think this is a Patterson moves at the draft thing. Yeah.

That's what it's looking about.

So so if you're an NHL GM and you sort of know that, because that's the most likely remember, most boring is most likely. They the Canucks try it 1 more time with these these 2, and then they figure it out with Millerson. I think you don't wanna trade JT Miller because you're nuts. You're crazy to do that. I think Patterson probably needs a change of scenery, and the teams are probably more skeptical about this guy because of the struggles since the contract extension was signed.

You wanna get nuts? Get nuts. JT Miller, How close to both teams signing the deal is JT Miller for Jason Robertson?

I think that the Canucks want nothing to do with Jason Robertson Oh. Or what he brings.

Okay.

And it's not Jason Robertson that's a problem. I think it's you lose JT Miller, and you get

Robertson don't get a center back.

Yeah. You get you get Robertson who had the who's struggling this year, had the foot surgery fine. Also, there are rumors about the you know, is there difficult is is is the is the you know, every player's got somebody around that could be difficult. There's rumors about that.

Isn't that JT Miller?

Well, yeah. Not not Maybe

you're trading 2 cantankerous people.

Yeah. I suppose. Do you want that?

No. And and you He's gotta be a center.

Like like You're right.

It was fun while it lasted.

This has been this Canucks situation is worse than it's being portrayed. Oh. For it to get this far, think no. No. Think about your history with the NHL.

Me?

Yeah. Your history in following the league. How many times how many times really can you remember it's like these guys hate each other and everybody

knows. This is very public.

So what's been reported? This is an iceberg, guys. We know 10%.

Oh ho ho. Oh. Because you know how

the NHL is, the dressing room, sanctity, all that. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. And eventually, some more of this will come out after the trade and everybody's not interested anymore, but we'll know more.

I think you're so right that it's July. It's it's it happens. Makes a lot of sense.

So then if you're the least or anybody else, stop waiting. If if even if you're a seller, stop waiting. Because if you're a team that's selling, are you going after Pedersen? Maybe. If you're I could see the Ducks who are like, no.

We're gonna start to win now. I could see them wanting to to do that.

The moment I was like, oh, okay. So I don't think this is happening. Is, CJ, who is smart on the CJ show, he's like, well, the Canucks are gonna want a a top 2 center back. And I'm like, who the hell

Yeah. Who's doing that mid season?

Is, I mean, probably not someone doing well.

Exactly.

You know what I mean? Like, who is doing great right now? And they got someone who's giving you 1st or second line center minutes. And they're like, you know what? Take them.

Mhmm.

Yeah. It's I just don't know if really good teams are looking to make this trade. Oh, the Boston Bruins exist. Shit.

Yeah. But Yeah. But they don't have a top center to give.

I don't know

if they have the assets to send back. Yeah.

Unless you're given unless unless Brad Marchand's a Vancouver Canuck.

No. Oh my god. Be fun? More likely, like, Zacca? Zacca, I guess.

Yeah. It's

And you're probably 1 of your prospects, 1 of your good ones. Your LaSalle LaSalle or something like

that. Yeah.

And I don't think Boston wants to do that. So we'll move on from there. You know, I think the the other thing that we have to watch for now that we're starting to talk trade is the double trade deadline this year, which is pre 4 nations and post 4 nations. Mhmm. And I'm just wondering, I know that I know the the, the Predators beat the Golden Knights last night, but I don't think anybody's kidding themselves.

Sure.

The the report that we heard this weekend that I did not get to last episode, and you would have missed this, was Friese on on headlines saying, we we know that Ryan O'Reilly has, no trade protection, 0 in his contract. Yeah. But we're the the predators are gonna treat him as though he does. Well, if the predator's going, we'll trade him for sure. And, but, yeah, we're not giving him away, which is exactly what the flames did last year with Lindholm and Zadora.

I'm sorry. That's, your stupid hockey team. You can't operate like that.

Like what? Tell me. Why?

You okay. So we talked about, I mean, the rangers screwing dudes, like, just Mhmm. Screwing them. But at the end of the day, they didn't break any rules. Mhmm.

Ryan, you were a UFA and you signed for below market value with no trade protect. Who's this agent? Like, that dude doesn't even make 5, and he has no trade protection. Who told you to sign that contract, Ryan?

Well, he had identical offers, and he chose the Preds over the Leafs.

Okay. Great. Take care. I why? Why are you treating him like this?

I think because they're trying to pump up his value. So they're saying, hey, guys. This is how we're gonna treat him because, because we're not you know, we value Ryan O'Reilly. We're not letting him go.

I think that's a really dumb way to operate.

I think it's interesting that they would put that in Fries' ear, because who does who does that come from? Right? It comes from the team.

Okay.

And and Fries is gonna go to to to air with that because that makes sense for Fries to do. But what I don't understand is how nobody would see through that. You're telling us you're telegraphing to us that you're selling this player.

When do they arrest Barry Trotz? Oh, no. I'm asking to leave you mean?

What crime did he commit?

Why did well, he clearly held a gun to Ryan O'Reilly and made him sign that contract. No. I got I got like the ranger situation. I have all the sympathy in the world, even though they didn't break any rules technically. It's a shitty thing to do.

Like, you took 2 guys who had trade protection, and you're like, I'll just wave you, after going to the final 4. I think that's a really And

winning the president's trophy.

Ryan O'Reilly signed for below market value and got himself no trade protection. What were you thinking? You're in you're a professional athlete playing for a professional sports team in a professional sports league, and you signed for no trade protection. And now we're supposed to literally pretend. We're all grown adults pretending that you have trade protection.

No. Enjoy San Jose. Like, I or wherever.

I think playoff team.

Yeah. No. No. No. I'm I'm just I'm joking.

But, no. You'll go to the team that is gonna pay us the most Mhmm. Because we're trying to win games here. What are you doing?

Why are they trying to trade Ryan O'Reilly when he's under contract for 2 more seasons?

Because this is where his value is the highest. This is a guy on a great

deal because they stink. Oh, they also stink.

But that they this is a guy on a killer deal. He's on a they could get real assets back.

Yeah. But don't they if they're they're trying to be competitive next season, they just signed Steven Stamkos. Like, this is a team that's supposed to be winning. We all thought they'd be in the playoffs.

But, Jesse, if they don't turn it around soon, they're gonna start the rebuilding process. K. Terry Trotz's word. It's it it bears repeating joking, by the way.

It bears repeating because we've mentioned this a few times this season. I think we all like the Predators are like sort of a darling in this league we all kind of like them they're super fun fan base is fun the jerseys are fun the buildings fun we all like music it's a fun place to be they were a fun story last year I don't think they know what they're doing. They're 3rd last

of the league. They're 3rd last.

Yeah. I don't think they know what they're doing even kind of.

This is a team that's not deep on Centerman. I don't think you make your team worse by trading Ryan O'Reilly when you could have Ryan O'Reilly for next 2 years at $4,500,000.

But the other option is you could trade him, get assets back for him, and and do what you're really good at, which is spend a bunch of money in free agency because that worked out so well for them last year. Man. Stamkos can play center for the rest of the year. The the thing about Ryan O'Reilly is because he's got those years left, is it 1 or 2?

2. He just signed this 3 year deal.

Yeah. But he signed that last year. He's played a year there. He played in the No.

I'm sorry. It was a 4 year deal. Yeah. Oh, it's a 4 year? He's got 2 years left.

He signed through next season and the year. He's a free agent in 2027.

At 4.75, is it? 4.5. I run that choke With the cap going up, that deal, like, whoever gets that deal

is No.

Why? This should be the predators.

Yeah. But they're stupid, Jesse. Look, we established this. They're not smart at this. Dude, if I run an NHL team and you haven't called Barry Trotz by the time I get to the bottom of my morning coffee, fired.

He doesn't know what he's doing. He has no idea what he's doing.

Adam and Stamkos is playing center on the first line. Like

So so Ryan

O'Reilly's great second line center value.

Yeah. Jesse, do you think that

they're gonna compete next year? Do you honestly think they can?

I thought they could could compete this season.

Me too. But they're not.

I think they can compete next season.

Here's where things are.

If they

Jesse is looking at this like a smart person. Jesse is the general manager. Like like no. No. No.

I'm I'm like I'm I'm not even being facetious. You're You are. You're no. Here's a good player on a good contract. I am going to keep this player.

Yeah. That's how smart people operate. Yeah. The predators are taking a good player on a good contract with no trade protection, and they're treating him like he has it?

Yeah. None of this makes sense to me.

What are you stupid? You do you wanna wait or not? No. No. No.

No. No. We're we're in the, the what are the predators of freaking registered charity? Can I give them $50 and get a tax receipt? What what are we doing here?

What are you what are you hoping to win a gold in the good guy Olympics? Is that is that what your owner's trying to do? Does his name get on the gold medal for the good guy Olympics? You're trying to win a Stanley Cup. Oh, we're gonna treat him like he's got trade what?

Figure it out. Again, if I run a hockey team and my GM or AGM, someone in my management team hasn't contacted Barry Trotz by the time I hit the bottom of my coffee mug. You're fired. He doesn't know what he's doing. Call him call him call him and call him before and after every meal.

If you don't call Barry Trotz as many times in a day as you brush your teeth, you're fired. He doesn't know what he's doing.

You know who could have played center for the Predators if Ryan O'Reilly was, traded? Mhmm. Philip Thomas Thomasino. And I know he's been injured, but he's played well on the abominable Penguins.

He doesn't know what he's doing.

And I think I think now they know that they listen. You got Stamkos. You got Marsha Sow. If I'm the Toronto Maple Leafs, by the way, I call them every day about Marsha Sow. You want bloodlust?

That's the guy you need going into the playoffs. But if you could get here's a crazy idea. Imagine the Toronto Maple Leafs, but they have Ryan O'Reilly and Jonathan Marsha Sow.

Yeah. Well, are the Leafs on his imaginary no trade list? Literally That's a funny 1. Literally, you're laughing. I'm telling the honest to God that's what's happening through.

They could get this

news story. Yeah.

It is it reported on hockey night in Canada. Imaginary. No trade list. And and what the Barney the fucking dinosaur, it doesn't exist. The claim is that Imaginary no trade list.

Claim is that. I think what they're trying to do is pump his value, but the claim in actuality is saying, we'll actually take less because we'll go work with Ryan what Ryan wants, which is bullshit.

They're saying that we won't do a deal because we respect this human being, and wherever he wants to go, we'll send him there. So we'll work with those teams where he wants to go, which is a bad way to run your business.

Not every not

every Not every Not

every Not every coach can be a

good team. And if we wanna continue with the Preds just on this this whole thing, I I on top of, like, why are you selling players who are good and under contract and for cheap, they have so much cap space available to them. I think it's, according to Puckpedia, it's $13,400,000 in cap space currently.

Mhmm.

If we compare the Preds with somebody like the Toronto Maple Leafs who are spending 22,000,000 on defense, the Preds are spending 24,000,000. You know, it's great. That's unbelievable. It's about the same. There's 2,000,000 more.

The Preds are pay are spending $5,800,000 on their goaltending. The Leafs right now are spending 4.1, and that's with, no. That's that's just total contract with Hildebrand there.

So Now we go upfront.

And then we go to the forward group where the Leafs are spending $64,000,000.

Holy Santa Claus balls and scrotum. And the Holy shit.

And the Preds are and this is an off season where we looked at the Preds, and we said, they spend so much money. Look at all the pieces they got.

Yeah. Yeah.

How are they doing this? They're gonna be winning the Stanley Cup in a couple hours. They're spending $42,000,000 on their forward group. $22,000,000 less than the Toronto Maple.

Neither team can score.

And this team wants to sell guys who are under good contracts for what? So you could be the Arizona coyotes for the last 20 years and have no 1 playing for you and no cap cap hits?

Hey, Jesse.

That's What

what it doesn't make sense? That's hall of fame member Barry Trotz to you, sir. Listen. They're gonna let is he hall of fame yet? Isn't he?

Are you still there? He should be.

I don't know.

Here's what's gonna happen. Barry Trotz has got a halo in in Nashville. He was the heir apparent to David Boyle. Why? Because he was a great coach.

There was no managerial experience. And in fact, in every place that he was at, he vehemently disagreed with his general managers to the point that despite the caps winning the cup and the Islanders going to the conference finals, the both GMs said, let's move on. So now he's getting the opportunity to do the things that he couldn't do in Washington and that he couldn't do in in in New York. And how's it going? You know 1 of the greatest blessings in recent memory

in the NHL? Patrick Waugh quit on the Colorado Ave.

Oh, that's the best thing that ever happened to the Ave.

Yeah. Not because Patrick Waugh sucks, but because the avalanche didn't have to gas a franchise legend. You know what I mean? Mhmm. Steve Iserman.

Like, I know they're doing well recently. He would have been gassed a long time ago if his name was Chuck Fuckwit.

Well, if he played it if it was a Canadian market, no, he wouldn't. Well, no. You get about a 10 year runway here.

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, Jesus. But Barry is just I have a 10 month old, and she is a cube. And every side of the cube has different buttons that you can mash that do different things and make different sounds and play different songs.

And sometimes I look at her playing with that, and I go, what's she trying to do? Like, is she doing that on purpose? Is she picking up on pattern? No. She's just pushing the frigging buttons.

That's what Barry's doing. Jesse keeps going. Wait. This then why this? And he's just button mashing, man.

There's no reason for it.

He's my dad playing Mortal Kombat. Like, he doesn't know what he's doing, but he wants to participate and have some fun. He doesn't he's button mashing. He's complete how many more months consecutively do we need to talk about? He's just pushing buttons.

We're we're gonna treat Ryan O'Reilly like he's got like, why are we playing imagination?

Because they respect him.

Yeah. Hey. Cool. You you gonna respect your way to the Stanley Cup?

No. That's not. Certainly not true. Stanley Cup. No.

Hey. I'm I'm so happy for Montreal that they got Kari A, and he literally changed their defense.

I know it's insane.

They got him for Justin Barron who they wasn't useful to them anymore, and now Nashville just sent away a good player for Justin Barron that is not very good for them right now.

And and Montreal got better. Montreal got better because Kent Hughes called the Nashville Predators before he got to the bottom of his mug.

What does that mean?

As As

in before he finished his coffee.

The good

in the morning.

The good GMs call the bad GMs. Yeah. Tell them a few funny jokes, make them feel good about themselves, and may and then rob them blind.

Hey, Barry. Tell me about that, Caps run again. Just 1 more time. Alright. Cool.

Hey. You wanna make a deal? Yeah. Like, that that's what I would do. And, and What do

you what do you think about, this price? And you hear a pause on the other end of the phone followed by a few seconds of a fucking and then another pause, and then he says fine.

If you're the AGM his team worse. If you're the AGM in Nashville and you're listening to this, you cannot let Barry pick up the phone And to anyone. You do the

Lou Lamoriello fake phone line thing.

Yeah. Yes. Mhmm. Yep. Oh, it's the blue it's the blue cord, so it's secure, mister Lamoriello.

You know Justin Barrons playing with Romaniosi? Oh,

sick. Yeah.

That's great

for Justin Barrons. That's wow. Like, that's a thing that is happening

in the NHL these days.

Okay. So Who's the, who's the AGM? So so No.

We don't need

We gotta move on here because I gotta I gotta tell you that No. They're fascinating. Josh Yohee and Jesse drops a Jesse dropped a bomb in the group chat last night. We have several group chat going. 1 of them is with with Drew and Justin.

Stupid. And, Drew being producer Drew, who, you know, everybody loves to hate on Twitter, who's actually a great guy, and Justin, who is objectively a horrible person, but is our head of social media, which is perfect for him.

What has happened?

I'm kidding. Dustin would like to. I'm not.

Jesse Marshall tweeted last night, and Jesse said, this is Adam's porn. He said, Jari Jari has got to be jettisoned. That should be priority 1 right now. The contract was an albatross the moment pen went to paper. He cannot tend this net beyond this season.

And I wanna say, because I fucking told you so, that it was bad the second it was signed. I fucking told you so.

Now Adam, Adam. Adam. Get a message Adam. Get us banned in Florida. Tell him.

You're gonna get us banned in Florida. I'm

gonna finish.

Just context. Tell the people what the contract was.

Funded.

Signed. $5,375,000,

5 years. We're in year 2. Now I think I think the stat is correct me, Pens fans. The stat is that Jari has given

up a goal on the first shot of

the game at minimum 5 times this year. Last night

Oh, 0, wow. She gave up 6.

A shot, and this is according to our good friend, Cassie, who we love. Hey. Oh, yeah. Cassie. Oh.

She said she she vented her frustration, to me. Hit me. She said, oh, did you see the game tonight? And I was like, no. I was watching the league game.

And she said, it was shot 2 tonight. Hey. And it was a shorthanded goal. Oh. And this morning, Josh Yohe, who's the athletic reporter for, for the Penguins, from what I'm hearing, the Penguins organization has reached a breaking point with Tristan Jari.

Now here's what I can tell you.

Mhmm.

The Penguins also reached a breaking point with Tristan Jari against the Islanders last year when the Penguins blew the game and he didn't play the last 13, and they fell out of the playoffs.

The difference is, there was a while there where, a, he played well, and, b, the games didn't mean anything. And then But they made a charge. Well, then they crept back into the playoff picture, and now all of a sudden, the losses become a

lot more frustrating. And so and Malkin said he's frustrated with the team's play as of last night. And Crosby got cross checked in the back, by, Adam Larson

That was a bad 1.

And swore and went off the ice, and there was no call, obviously. Oh, cross checking's allowed. And, you know, let's cross check our star players, specifically Did you

see 1

of the best players of all time.

Did you see the Jarry goal, by the way?

It's bad.

Have you watched it back?

Yes. Oh, the shorty? I did see this.

The short handed goal. You can you can describe it for the people.

So Joey Decord picks up an assist. Hell, yeah. Yeah. It's a 2 on 1 the other way that actually the Penguins negate. So it's just a straight up 2 on 2.

Sure. It's what what's essentially happening here? It's Chandler Stevenson 1 on 1 with the goaltender.

Can we completely throw that free stream?

Can we throw that free stream? Yeah, kind of. No, no, no.

Because you're just watching this right now and you're saying like, no, no. What unfolds here no, Matty, you can leave it up there. What unfolds here because there's another man coming with the 2 on 1 is that it is essentially Chandler Stevenson just taking a shot on Tristan Jarius, how it will is going to unfold. Which is crazy. And you can't play this.

This is how it unfolds for the people. So we're watching it. Oh, my Yeah.

It just goes through. It just goes through. We'll we'll get a good pause

on that. We can even do a stop and go just so the people watching on YouTube can watch this. But, no. I went a little too far on the stop.

There we go. So Steve He shoots from pretty far. And he's pinned on that.

Steve's at the top of the face off giant circle. So not the dot. He's at the top of the the big part of the circle, and he just takes a wrist shot. Wrist shot simply on Jari, it's blocker side, and what happens is he lets it just go right through him. It hits him on, like, the side part of the blocker, and it just goes right through him into the back of the net.

And you are too It's embarrassing.

2 minutes less than 2 seconds. Seconds slow the game.

The goal happens, I think. Right?

The whole building goes dude, look at the front rows.

Oh, yeah. Also

No one's even in their seat.

Every quarter's built. Hey, bud. Building empty.

Did you guys have you guys, I think it's interesting because at the beginning of the season, the big chat was about the Penguins and their lack of attendance. Isn't it funny how that story has just gone away?

I I don't know.

I think that's interesting because I think

I don't even remember it.

Because I think the Penguins stops. I could be wrong on this, but from what I what I might be deducing

is they're not they're not announcing it anymore.

And because the Penguins used to sell out every game right up until last season, and rightfully so. It's the Crosby era. It's the Malkin era. This so here's the question becomes okay. So if this is the breaking the real breaking point, what I was told personally is the Penguins lost confidence in Jari, lost trust in Jari in that Islanders game last season.

And every Penguins fan that that listens to this show knows what the game I'm talking about. Mhmm. That that ended it. But then this year, they're like, well, we don't have a choice because Kyle likes to spend right to the cap before the team ever hits the ice. It happened here in Toronto.

Ask us about trying to sign Matthew Nyez and having to sign an emergency backup just to do it. It happened. Mhmm. And he can't move any players. He can't move the Grace deal.

He can't move the Jari deal. Wow. It's so great that who did he trade with with the Rangers? It was, Riley Smith.

Mhmm.

I was able ah, I could move you know what? I'll bring in Kevin Hayes. That's my big move. Because he can't do anything.

I'll give Kyle Doobas this. He never treated anyone like they had an imaginary no trade,

clause. Kinda did.

No. He would just give them literal ones so they were impossible to move.

Or too much money and they were impossible to move.

Or both.

The what I am looking at here is a team that can do nothing. Okay. You've reached the breaking point. Okay. Send them down.

Send them down again this year. Send them down again. Again. And it's bloom it's Bloomquist time. That's great.

What else? What are you gonna do? You got 3 more years, guys. And listen. I don't think that Tristan Jari at 2,500,000 as a backup somewhere is a horrible idea.

Who are you gonna get to bite on that?

So When you set him down, how much, how much did the cap hit? Isn't it isn't it still 4 and a half million?

It is.

I have no idea.

Because don't you don't you get 1.3 it's, like, whatever Ryan Reeves' salary is, that's what you get for, putting a player down in the AHL, assuming they clear waivers. Right? That's the cap relief you get. It's, like, 1,350,000 or something like that.

So no. I was just thinking, like, okay. You send them down forever. Is does that fix things? You know?

Do you get enough cap relief where

it's No.

Fine? No?

Okay. There's only a few situations I think you can even really look at. Cause you got a goalie who makes over $5,000,000 who's who's bad. Alright. How many of those are in the league?

Not a lot.

So I'm looking at Columbus.

Mhmm.

Danil Tarasov has a 4, 6, and 1 record, which is a miracle Mhmm. That he has 4 wins because he is an 862. Mhmm. That's not an NHL goalie. Elvis Merslekins is the dude making over 5.

He's an 889, which is poor and below league average. He's still got a record of 15, 10, and 3.

Yep.

Columbus is in the hunt. I don't know if they do it. Okay. Well, for me, the 1 that I always I keep bringing up, you look at the Seattle Kraken. They are a I think a clear cut playoff team with Joey DeCorden at and not even sort of in the conversation with Philip Grubaugh.

Do you

do a swap for change scenery?

What do you do what do you do if you have either of those goalies other than hope a change of scenery fixes it?

Well, I would say that Ron Francis is embattled. If there's a hot seat to be had that no one's talking about, it's Ron Francis.

Well, they're talking about it now.

So because, again, I don't think he did a great job in the expansion draft. Yeah. And so

AJ's, I wanna say the title of their last show was about Seattle.

So so does Ron Francis have the leeway anymore to take a risk like that? How many years left does Grubauer have? Did you say that?

Let me look.

Here. I can look. You keep talking. I think He's been brutal. Yeah.

But but

There's just so few goalies around the league, like, that are even in this competition.

Signed through next 2 seasons after this for $5,900,000.

So more money, less term. I don't think Ron Francis has the agency to make a deal like that.

I don't think the Penguins have the cap space. Like, do the do the Penguins have the cap space to take on a more expensive

They could yeah. I think they're 2 under. So yeah. They could it's because it's only a couple $100,000. You know?

Honestly, what Seattle should do, Steve, is they should just buy them out. The

They might.

The Penguins buying out Tristan Jari would save them quite a bit of money too. What what what

look like? Did you do the calculator?

Yeah. I can bring up the calculator here if you wanna look at it. It's, it's not

too Realistically, you should buy them both, guys.

Yeah.

Yeah. They may they save $3,000,000, $3,600,000 next season, $300,000 season after, $800, the season after, and then they just get cap hits of, like, $800, the next 3 seasons after that.

When the cap is gonna be significantly higher.

It's not bad. That's actually good savings. I'll take it. You know? Yeah.

Like, it's it's honestly 1 or it's 2 years, the 26 2017 season in 27, 28, where you're paying 5,000,000 to 4,500,000 for nobody to play for you, but you're paying that to not have Tristan Jarratt. And you can just, like, assume, like, hey or just pretend that he's in the minors if you're not using him at the ur NHL level. Just look at it that way or whatever, however you wanna twist your mind around that. But it's decent savings if you want that $3,600,000 for this coming off season.

I don't I don't hate that.

I don't hate buying them out at all.

Yep. And you know what? It fits with what they're trying to do. Because, listen, the Penguins don't make the playoffs this year. They'll probably do something stupid and try it again next year.

And that $3,600,000 could actually help them.

Mhmm.

And then after that, who gives a shit?

I think they're done.

Well, they should be done, but I don't think that they will. I think Dubas is stubborn enough. Now I will say this. It's official. As of 5 minutes ago, Tristan Jari is on waivers.

Oh, he's being sent down there.

Yeah. Oh, wow.

Does anybody have the calculation about how much they're saving with that now that he's going down?

Is that available on Puck Media? I don't know. I don't know what the number is. It changes every year.

They have a send down calculation.

It used to be, like, 1.1, which is what Connor, Tim, and Sinek

are doing. Think it's about the savings. I think it's about literally the roster spot.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. No. But I'm curious. It's just about the cap hit.

Oh. You know? I'll ask. I'll ask.

8 months.

What does a team save by sending a player down? I'm gonna ask. What is the max amount?

By giving a player with no trade protection, trade protection. Purely out of imagination. Let's

see. I I actually you know what? I wanted to bring it up Monday. We didn't have time. You called the trade

protection from your fart cloud coming out of your butt.

I'm so glad I did because when I heard that, I was like, what the fuck? And then nobody said anything. Nobody followed up with Freejana. Like, what the hell does that mean? Nobody made a video about it on on YouTube or TikTok or anything.

Nobody nobody said anything. I was like, am I am I crazy?

I'm glad I got to rant about it because, like, that no. That's a cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs thing to do running a professional sports team. What what are you trying to accomplish? You're nuts. Sorry.

I don't want your 1st round pick. Ryan wants to go here, so I'll take a 3rd.

What the fuck are you talking about?

What are you talking the the the I don't know, Blue Jackets. They're like, here's 3 firsts.

No. We won't take it. Ryan doesn't wanna play

it. Yeah. I I took meth this morning, and here's 3 firsts for Ryan O'Reilly. And, no. Sorry.

Mhmm.

Yeah. Listen. I hate to say it. I hate to say it. I'd love to see Ronald Riley back on the Leafs.

I know a lot of Leaf fans are mad at him. You shouldn't be. He went to a tax free state. Whatever. Fine.

Yeah. And signed for undervalue and no trade protection again.

Okay. But listen You're signed. Listen.

He signed a really dumb contract. Yeah. Like, I don't I don't understand.

You know who he'd look great on?

Oh, no. No. No. No.

Not the Bruins. Even worse. K.

Fine. Even worse.

The Ottawa senators. No. He'd be perfect.

Kiss my ass and bottomed.

I have

I have an answer. Give it to

us, Jess. The Penguins will get $1,150,000

of cap relief with Jari in the minors. That stinks. Yuck.

I mean, I guess it accumulates if they're not over, if they don't have LTIR. Something. I stole what's the hell what's that gonna do? I I say that now.

More than nothing.

They'll make the playoffs. More than nothing. Well, nothing is what they're getting

for 5.375. Because in professional sports, you fight for every inch. You don't give it away.

Somebody's gotta talk to Kyle, though. Like, I I was a fan of a lot of things he did here, and I was not a fan of a lot of things he did here in retrospect too.

Mhmm.

Somebody's gotta stop him from spending to the cap on July 1st. Ugh. You gotta stop doing that. Or September 15th when you're signing guys off of PTOs, Stop doing it. Give yourself a $1,000,000.

Here's what I want. Internal cap is a $1,000,000 left. So if it's 97 last next year, like Alan says it is Mhmm. So you you're the penguins. You spend to 95, 96.

And you know what that cap space does? It accumulates. It gets bigger and bigger and bigger throughout the year. You could add people.

I You could add people.

Imagine that. Adding people.

Adam, I wanna put money on this. Doug Armstrong is part of team Canada?

Yep. So is Jordan Bennington.

Kyle Dubas is part of team Canada? Yep. No chance they don't make a trade after the 4 nation face

off. Bennington Ferjari?

You guys are gonna oh, man. You guys are there's 0 shot. You guys are gonna have Doug Armstrong and Kyle Dubas in a box for over a week together, and then you're gonna have a few weeks before the trade deadline. They won't be able to help them.

Nola Char, are

you They are going to make a they're going to make a trade.

Adam, I what did you just ask about Cal Dubas and the salary cap?

Why he spends to the top of it every year?

I got 5 words. Uh-oh. That'll give you the answer.

Must see TV.

Brian Graves is a

pen. We can and we will. Ah. That is his mantra. That is what he said.

Of

course. And he always does it.

Oh, yes.

He don't, man.

Yes. Why did you do that?

Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, and he did it. Oh, boy.

We did. We can get Crosby a cup if we can make the playoffs. We can't do that.

I think the guy's philosophy in building teams is spending money.

Like, I And he doesn't like the midseason trade as much.

No. That's that's how I think we've we've learned through his tenure as the Toronto Maple Leafs GM. He loves spending those dollars.

Adam, that's not true. He loves a midseason trade that doesn't matter.

Yeah.

If you go and look like the Penguins actually trade more than most teams and and Dubas probably leads the league in trades that involve 2 dudes you don't recognize.

What was the Blackhawks 1 where we got, like, 3 guys? Was that the Blackwell,

McCabe, somebody? No. No. No. That was McCabe Lafferty.

At least got Blackwell from was it Seattle?

Something like that. I like the mid season McCabe Lafferty deal.

That was a good deal. That was a good 1. Good deal. Yeah. That was a good 1.

That that 1 mattered.

He That

was trade deadline. He did he makes

0 mid tier trades. He trades the franchise or 2 guys you've never heard of before.

That's right. Kyle Dubas I I love Kyle Dubas because he he admitted to this too. He's like Kyle Dubas's trades are like you you're given an entire sandwich and all you need is the crust. Like, he's he is he just nibbles around the edge, And then all of a sudden, wham. Cut the franchise in half.

It's a big 1. I don't know if they're gonna do that this year, though. I think they need they're hoarding draft picks now, which which does not support what they keep telling you they're gonna do, which is let's get Crosby and Malcolm another shot

at the cup.

Okay. The Penguins made a trade earlier this month.

Wasn't it with the Blackhawks?

Sabers. Oh, fuck. I don't ask. I don't know. Mhmm.

Colton Pooleman.

1 of my favorite

Penguins acquire Colton Pooleman from the Buffalo Sabers for Bennett MacArthur.

Man, I you know what big things about Bennett MacArthur.

Bennett. Bennett. Bennett.

Bennett. Bennett. Bennett. Bennett. Bennett.

Bennett. Bennett. Tucker's brother

has to be.

Yeah. Right?

Yeah. Like, there's no way there's 2 random Poolman. There's 2 Poolman families out there. Get out of my face.

No. No. They gotta be brothers.

Philip Thomasino for a further a 4th round pick. 10 and and and and and and and and acquired, the capital's acquired Lars Eller from the penguins for a 5th and a third. Oh, Rutger, McGrady for Braden Yeager is a pretty big 1. What, Adam?

You're just you're just going through.

Why is your mouth open?

For it is.

Well, I'm the next segment, I know we have to wrap the show, but we have to do 1 more thing. What the Jesse, I just sent you something. Okay. So tell me, Steve. Mhmm.

It's it's year 25 of this century. Right?

I think it's technically 26. Go on.

No. It's year well, that's the it's 25. Okay.

I'm gonna be 1 of those annoying people.

Yes. True. It is 26. But okay. So here's here's my question to you.

If you were to pick a Sabers' 1st team and a Sabers' 2nd team, as in the 5 best players, you know, 3 at forward, 2 at d, 1 on goal, for the Sabers' 1st team and then a Sabers' 2nd team

Mhmm.

Who would you pick?

Jack Eichel's gotta be on there Mhmm. On

the first team. Right?

If if I gotta pick 3 forwards, like, because this is what Sportsnet's been doing.

Yeah. And and the NHL is now doing it.

It's not Sportsnet.

It's the NHL. Oh, it's the NHL.

Okay. I probably go Eichel, Briere, Drury. Okay.

But, like, who do you have at center?

Eichel. K.

Briere is the center. So he can

Okay. Maybe Briere at center. It doesn't really matter. It's just 3 forwards. Right?

In net, I'd have Ryan Miller.

Mhmm. Yep. Good. Good. Who'd you

have on defense? Although, I wanna say Hasik did Hasik win business from the beginning of the 2000s onward?

We're talking about a total a total resume here. Hasik was gone there and gone after 2 years, like, he was in Detroit and Ottawa.

I honestly might give Miller 1st team goalie and Hashtag second team goalie, even though he was only there for a hot minute. And then defense. Dalen?

Good call. Good call.

Alexei Zitnik?

Now here's here's what I wanna I I wanna this is how this is how Sabers the Sabers are, because I'm gonna have Jesse flash the first team for you.

The first few years of this of the 2000 for the Sabers were really good.

This is yeah. But after that, it's been bad. And what's hilarious is they're petty. They're very petty. Look at the first team, Steve.

Oh, fuck you.

Read it out.

Oh, get out of my face. Daniel Brier, Jason Pomondville, Thomas Vanek, Brian Campbell, Rasmus Dahlin. That's actually pretty good. Yeah. And Ryan Miller.

Now look at team 2.

Okay. Let's see. Let's see. It's not on the screen yet. I am excited.

I am waiting. Chris Drury, Jack Eichel, Derek Roy, Jay McKee, Tyler Myers, Dominic Kashuk. I nailed the goalie thing.

Jack Eichel on team 2. I don't mind it. That over Jason Palmetto?

Screw you. You quit on my team. If I'm a fan

He didn't quit on them.

You know, you know He

didn't quit on them.

He did. He did before he even wanted to trade.

No. He didn't. Nah. If I'm

a Sabers fan, screw you. But I'm not, so, like, I don't know.

They're such petty babies.

I'd be a petty

baby too. Bunch of baby.

If that was my team and I was a fan, I'd be a petty baby. Dude. It's fandom.

Why in in, the Raptors who had Kawhi Leonard, they won a championship, and he was like, yeah, unless you trade everything for Paul George, which was a terrible idea, I'm signing in Los Angeles. And they'll still put them on team 1. You petty bunch of babies.

What are you talking about? This. Yes.

Yes. What are

you talking

about? Kawhi Leonard winning a championship with the Raptors is the same as Jack Eichel

not wanting to play for the Buffalo Sabers. I didn't

want to play for them because they wouldn't give him the surgery that he wanted. That worked.

No, no, no, no. Kawhi Leonard winning a championship with the Raptors after being there for 1 season.

Fine. Fine.

Just say you made a bad comparison.

I don't think it is. I don't think it is. He was here for 1 fucking year, man. 1 year. And we're talking about Haczek didn't even make team 1.

What did he Because he only played a couple years for the Sabers in the 1st 25 years.

In the 1 season.

He won a championship?

What's sports about?

Yeah. You know what? You know what's crazy?

Jack

Eichel Jack Eichel was the best fucking player on this team for the 6 or 7 years he played on it. You surrounded him with garbage. He had a bad neck injury, and you said, you know what, Jack? You get the surgery we want, or you're out of here. And what does he do?

He instantly goes and wins a cup with a team with a brain. It's fucking insane. The fact that Jack Eichel is not on team 1, I know he doesn't give a shit, but the Sabers Sabers management, you're a bunch of fucking petty babies. That's outrageous.

I don't even know who Anthony is. Eichel Who even came up with the list, though?

It's That's Sabers. You don't you don't know that.

You think Kevin Adams sat there with a crayon and made that himself?

NHL head office. What? Was like, you know what? No, Buffalo. You don't get a say in this.

You don't think that they ran it by the Sabers? No. Of course, they did, guys.

They don't. I think Jack Eichel's tenure as a buffalo saber is so similar to Kawhi's as a raptor. Here,

Adam. It doesn't have to be a direct comparison to be true, Jesse.

Adam. Adam. Adam.

The guy had fucking okay. Adam. 56, 57, 64, 82, 78, and then 18, and he gets

into it. Adam.

He's very good. But if if they wanna be a petty baby about something that really doesn't matter, cool.

Here's a better 1. Chris Bosh.

Matter.

Chris Bosh. Yeah. He'd probably be a Raptors first team.

I would probably be a petty baby about Chris Bosh. Chris Bosh sucks. He does. That sucks. I agree.

But he'd probably be is he 1 of the top 5 players to ever play for the franchise? Yes.

Mhmm. Mhmm.

And the Raptors would probably say, yeah. It's him. It's Vince. I mean, they might even put fucking Tracy McGrady left them high and dry.

Yeah. Tracy leaving. He regrets that too.

And he should.

Tracy's been nice about it. Chris Bosh.

Bosh Bosh sucks.

I agree. Chris Bosh has never come back to Toronto.

But my point is Chris Bosh has a a similar tenure to Eichel. Barely did anything, friend.

If I was in charge of the Raptors list, I would say, I'm being a petty baby. Go away, Chris Bosh. Go to you could be Miami. You go. That's your that's your whole career.

You never played in Toronto.

He made some funny sketches about going to the All Star Game. Yeah. No. Great. Yeah.

He wore a cowboy hat once.

That was hilarious. From Texas. Yeah. I will be a petty baby about Chris Bosh, but I am not the Raptors. Adam.

If I don't know. What? He's he's a lot of the secondhand. What? Not like they left him off completely too, you know.

Adam, I just want you to feel good, babe. So I wanna end the show on a high

for you. Give it to me.

By giving giving daddy the sugar

he likes. This is insane.

I gotta give daddy the sugar he likes.

Give it to me.

From J Fresh. Tristan Jari played 22 games this season.

Oh, no.

He allowed a goal on the first shot he faced 6 times. On the second shot, 4 times. On the 3rd shot, 2 times. On the 4th shot, 4 times. On the 5th shot, 3 times.

He made it to shot 6 without allowing a goal 6 times in 22 games. Yeah. I knew you'd like that. Oh. I knew you'd like that, babe.

Hey. You know what's crazy? What? Knowing those stats, Tristan Jari played 22 games. Like, at game That's a good point.

At game 1415, are you like, this guy is never putting on a Penguins jersey again? I don't care how good he is at the NHL level.

That's a good point.

Yep. It shows you how patient Dubas is. He is patient. He is. Dude.

Dude. Babe. No disrespect to Jason Palminville. Jack Eichel, you guys are being petty babies. Petty fucking babies.

He went he won without you. Who's the loser here? You know what, Joe? Petty babies.

I don't think

Not Saber fans. Saber organization.

I don't think Adam's gonna get his citizenship In Buffalo? To to to Palminville. Oh, stop.

That's good. I thought I got it.

Alright. Raptor Show. That's for God's sake.

It's like, they have called apples in Palminville.

Oh, yeah? Oh, stop. Oh. Hey. That's a bilingual show.

No.

Hey, Jesse. For my French Canadian fam.

Jesse, I've already mentioned this, but that Blackhawks jersey from the winter classic is quite sexy even though nobody watched the the the game.

Fanatics, sent me a nice Bedard Blackhawks.

Oh.

And it is gorgeous. Matty we're we're talking in the kitchen. Matty's, like, I love the off white of the white It's good. Because it makes it look more vintage. You know, it's so nice, and the stitching is really well done.

Thank you, Fanatics.

It's good. You you look better in it than they did. Yes.

You put on

a way better performance. They didn't,

they didn't play too well in this jersey. No. But it's beautiful. It's a beautiful jersey.

Is that the real McCoy 1?

What is that?

It's got

a mite that, like, top of the line?

Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's the, like, the 1 they wear. Oh. Yeah.

Right now.

You're looking pretty hot there, Jesse.

Real McCoyj. The real McCoyj. Thanks, grandpa. Genuine article. Steve Dangle podcast.

Follow the guys on Twitter at Steve_dangle@adamwyldeand@jesseblake. Blake.