Transcript of TikTok Documents, Hurricane Milton Damage, SpaceX Water Pollution

Npr has reviewed documents that TikTok did not want the public to see.

They show TikTok officials describing how habit forming the app can be. The company was aware its much publicized efforts to protect teenagers weren't effective.

I'm Michelle Martin with Steve Inskeep, and this is Up First from NPR News. Florida's recovery from Hurricane Milton is underway. As vast as some of the damage is, it could have been worse. Forecasters warned of an enormous storm surge that didn't happen, which is good, but why was the forecast wrong?

Also, SpaceX wants to test launch the biggest rocket ever made, but the EPA wants a word. The company is spraying enormous amounts of water under the rocket as it launches. So what happens when that tainted water flows into surrounding wetlands? Stay with us. We've got the news you need to start your day.

As we're all navigating a divisive election, no matter what happens, the question remains, how the heck are we going to move forward together? So in this season of the StoryCore podcast from NPR, stories from people who made a choice to confront the conflicts in their own lives head-on. And in sharing stories from the bravest among us. Maybe we can take their lead and find some hope for the rest of us. Get the StoryCore podcast wherever you listen.

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Democrats used to take Michigan for granted. Then the state helped carry Donald Trump to the White House. All this week, NPR's Consider This podcast is talking to Michigan voters about how issues like the war in Gaza could shape the 2024 race.

There There needs to be a policy change, not just a change at the top of the ticket.

What's on Voter's Minds in Michigan this week on the Consider This podcast from NPR. Secret documents show TikTok officials describing how habit conforming the app can be for teens.

In the documents, state officials say a teenager could become addicted to TikTok after 35 minutes on the app. That is, according to previously, hidden portions of a lawsuit filed by the Kentucky Attorney General's office. Kentucky Kentucky Public Radio and NPR have reviewed dozens of pages of the lawsuit that were blacked out from public view.

Npr tech correspondent Bobby Allen has been reading. Hi there, Bobby. Hey, Steve. How was this secret material made public?

It was a huge mistake. Kentucky was one of 14 attorneys general that have been investigating TikTok for two years over child safety, sent the company subpoenas, obtained reams of internal communications and internal studies. At TikTok's request, Kentucky and the other states redacted privileged and confidential parts of the soup. This is pretty common in lawsuits. But in Kentucky, the blacking out did not work. Our colleague Sylvia Goodman at Kentucky Public Radio figured this out when she tried to copy and paste a blacked out portion, which usually does nothing. Sure. But here, Steve, it worked. When she did it, the stuff behind the blacked out portions were revealed. So since then, we have been reviewing large swaths of the suit that were never intended to see the light of day.

Okay, so what have you found?

It's been pretty startling. This material is quite damning. And again, these details have not been made public before, including company officials admitting in these internal messages that features like a time on app reminder are not expected to reduce screen time as advertised, but instead aimed at, quote, improving public trust. There was an internal TikTok document that found the exact number of videos it took before someone formed a habit, 260 videos. And Kentucky authorities said that could boil down to just spending 35 minutes on the app since the videos are so short on TikTok, four, five, six, seven seconds long. You're flying by on this app. Another section describes how TikTok has demoted what they deem as unattractive people off the main feed. And instead, the app is promoting what the company sees as attractive users. Another document, Steve, quotes a TikTok executive talking about the app's algorithm, potentially addicting miners. And this quote here really stuck with me. The executive says, We need to think about how the app might deprive young people of opportunities, quote, And when I say other opportunities, I literally mean sleep and eating and moving around the room and looking at someone in the eyes.

Wow.

I mean, that quote from a TikTok executive hurts. But what has TikTok said now that its internal words have been made public?

I reached out to them and a TikTok spokesman condemned NPR for reporting on information under seal. To clarify, the documents are now sealed, but when we obtain them, they were indeed public. Anyone, you or I or anyone else would have been able to see through these redactions if you just went to the docket and pulled them. Besides that, TikTok said the company has robust safeguards and that they proactively remove underage users and have voluntarily launched safety features like parental controls and beefed up privacy for minors under 16.

Okay, so what do the new revelations mean for these lawsuits?

Yeah, well, these cases will be unfolding for many months to come, but the new internal communications we have from TikTok provide what the states will likely be showcasing at trial. The states here are trying to portray a company, they say, hooked an entire generation of young people to an app, misled the public, and buried its own research about a whole host of harms, and instead, pursued growth and profits.

Npr Tech Correspondent Bobby Allen, breaking a huge story here in connection with one of our local affiliates, Kentucky Public Radio. Bobby, thanks so much.

Thank you, Steve.

Cleanup is underway in Florida from Hurricane Milton.

Millions are still without power. At least eight deaths have been attributed to the storm. Five people died when tornadoes touched down in a retirement community in St. Lucy County on Florida's East Coast. So this was a serious storm, though not as bad as some feared.

Npr's Greg Allen went through the storm. He's in St. Petersburg. Hi there, Greg. Hi, Steve. I was watching the forecast. A storm surge was expected of as much as 15 feet in some places, and at least that didn't happen. Why not?

Well, just a few days ago, Milton was one of the most powerful hurricanes ever seen in the Gulf of Mexico. But as it approached land, it did some things that hurricanes often do. It made this jog. In this case, it was one that took it south Tampa Bay, which is an area that's really vulnerable to storm surge. The hurricane also weakened a bit, but even so, it hit the Coast with 125-mile-per-hour winds. But the effect was that the storm surge was much less than it was forecast. It was just 5 to 10 feet above ground level in the area where it made landfall. Tampa Bay, as it turned out, had very little surge. Here's Governor DeSantis.

You did have storm surge in Sarasota, Venice, Charlotte Harbor, and all the way down the West Coast of Florida, and some significant storm surge, but not the worst case scenario of what we were looking at.

Milton did a lot of damage, but far less than what was feared.

Yeah, and I want to pause to respect those who did suffer damage. I know it is serious. I know some lives were lost, but what have you seen around Tampa and St. Pete?

Well, Here there are a lot of limbs and trees down, but for the most part, the buildings and other infrastructure held up pretty well against the winds. A construction crane in St. Petersburg toppled into a building, and then the fiber glass roof of the baseball stadium was shredded. But homes on the whole did pretty well. In St. I talked to Jenna Michael about what she was seeing in her neighborhood.

There's definitely some with trees on their roofs. When we were driving by, we saw some that significantly have damaged. But for the most part, it looks like it's mostly down power lines, down trees, down fences, and not catastrophic damage to homes.

She had a 50-foot oak tree fall on her property. Thankfully, it missed her house, though.

I did hear you say, though, yesterday, 19 inches of rain in St. Petersburg, among other places. Can that lead to flooding in days to come?

Right. That's what we're watching for now. A number of rivers across Florida are rising and are expected to flood, and they have been flooding, not just on the Coast, but also in central Florida. The St. Petersburg area, like you say, got so much rain. In one neighborhood, Melissa Anderson said she spent the day using towels, blankets, even T-shirts to stop the water from coming into her house.

Water was just coming into the bottom of the house. Faithfully, just kept coming and coming and coming until we couldn't stop it anymore.

The whole bottom floor, yeah. Like other people in the neighborhood, her house is not in a flood zone, and she doesn't have flood insurance.

Which raises another question, Greg. Second big storm in weeks. Are people getting fed up with living in such a hurricane-prone area?

Well, that's always the question we have here in Florida, especially after these really destructive storms. The people I talk with in St. Petersburg all seem to take Milton in their stride. I think one reason is that did a lot less damage than Helene. People went through that. They said this one wasn't so bad. They all didn't have power yesterday. But one homeowner said, You learn how to deal with it. If you've lived in Florida long enough, As you said, you learn it's just part of the nature of the state.

Okay. It has other pleasures of being there without a doubt. Greg, thanks so much. You're welcome. That's NPR's Greg Allen, who is in St. Petersburg, Florida, this morning. Spacex is preparing a test launch of the largest rocket ever made.

It's called Starship, and the company hopes it could lift off as soon as Sunday from South Texas despite concerns that it may damage the surrounding area.

Npr Science Correspondent Jeff Brumfield is here. Jeff, good morning.

Good morning.

What's the problem?

Well, the first thing to know is that SpaceX's launch pad is actually in the middle of a major wildlife preserve down there in Texas. It's home to hundreds of thousands of shorebirds, sea turtles, and other species. The launch pad is right up against a sand flat where birds love to nest. I was out there last month with Justin LeClerc, a conservation biologist with the nonprofit Coastal Bays, and estuaries program. As we walked through the dunes next to the pad, he pointed out lots of debris. You can see some rebar poking up through the grass all over here. It was basically a minefield of debris out here after that first flight test. That first flight test, the rocket was so powerful, it actually blew up its own launch pad. To keep that from happening again, SpaceX sprays nearly 200,000 gallons of water in this incredible massive fowden under the during the launch. That prevents the pad from blowing up, but it's created a new problem. The water isn't contained. It just flows out onto the flats. Quite a lot does spill off, either is projected off or runs off.

Okay, I'm trying to get my brain around that amount. It's hard to conceive of that number, but it's not a bucket full, it's not a bathtub, it's an unbelievable flow of water. Is this allowed?

No. Under the Clean Water Act, SpaceX needs to have a special industrial wastewater permit. Npr reviewed documents and correspondence between the company and regulators and found they were told multiple times to get the permit by the EPA earlier this year, but they kept launching even after the EPA told them twice this violated the law. Finally, in July, they did apply for the permit from Texas regulators, but they've been fined roughly $150,000 by state and federal regulators for the violations, and that's what's been holding up this launch.

Okay, I do want to note we're talking about wetlands and this is water. Is this water in some way hazardous?

Now, SpaceX has put out a lengthy statement about this whole situation. They say this is a paperwork issue. The water being used is drinking water, and that is true. But experts I spoke to said it's not true that the water is drinkable after it comes in contact with the exhaust of the largest rocket ever built. In its permit application, SpaceX submitted some tests it had done, and those showed high levels of dissolve solids, zinc, and something called HexAvalent chromium. None of this you want to drink, according to experts, and it's not particularly good for the environment. Still, it does appear regulators are willing to let this next launch go forward, so long as SpaceX does some testing and shares its results after the launch.

What happens now?

So this next flight is really high stakes. The rocket's giant booster is going to come back and try and land at the launch pad. That's important for SpaceX for their plans to make Starship reusable. Of course, if it goes wrong, that means more debris is going to end up spread across the wetlands when the booster explodes.

Wow. Jeff, thanks so much for the update.

Thank you.

That's NPR's Jeff Brumfield. That's Up First for this Friday, October 11th.

I'm Steve Inskeep. And I'm Michelle Martin. Don't forget, Up First airs on the weekend, too. Ayesha Rosco and Scott Simon have the news. It will be wherever you get your podcast.

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