Transcript of Episode 535: Dr. Stephanie Venn-Watson: The Longevity Nutrient That Could Slow Aging and Protect Your Cells

Hi, guys. It's Tony Robbins. You're listening to Habits & Hustle. Crush it.

All right, you guys. Welcome to another episode of Habits & Hustle. And we have a real changemaker. Even CNBC called her that. This woman, her accolades are just extraordinary and super impressive. And her name is Stephanie Van Watson, and she's joining us today. She has a new book out coming out. Actually, her new book is called The Longevity Nutrient, and it's coming out on paperback, you said.

That's right, in March. So very excited about that.

Amazing. Well, congratulations, and thank you for being here. Thank you, Jennifer.

Fantastic to be chatting with you. Very excited.

By the way, I feel like we just did a whole podcast before the podcast, which is why I tried... That's why I felt like I liked you. And I'm like, oh, shoot, we're in trouble, because I knew that it would take about an hour to get into the room, and it did. And I didn't want to ask you any real pertinent questions because I wanted to make sure I asked you on the show. But so anyway, thank you for being here. And your background is quite impressive. I mean, it really is. Do you want to give people the origin story of why you're even here right now?

Sure, sure. So I was out of the Just kidding.

It all started in 1971 or whatever. So there it was.

Yeah. So I've always been a self-proclaimed nerd. I've always been loving finding patterns. Pattern recognition is just a natural thing since I was little. My dad would come home. He worked at a library, and he would bring home books, like just of numbers. And I would take him down to the basement and circle patterns. Like, what a nerd, right?

When I was young- Really, you are a nerd. That's what the thing that I would do.

So I don't think they were worried at the time. But so fast forward to college, and I was ready to go to medical school. And then I read a book from Laurie called The Coming Plague. And I learned what? There's a profession called epidemiology, where their doctors and their whole job is to find patterns. This is fantastic. So, met a veterinary epidemiologist, coincidentally, and he said, Gosh, if you really want to understand diseases stuff, become a veterinary epidemiologist because you'll understand how diseases work in a lot of different species. And then you understand the disease. So that triggered that Went to veterinary school. School. Got my epidemiology degree over at Emory. And- Next thing you know, you're in the Navy.

Yeah, there you go.

Signing up, ready to serve.

I've never met someone that actually... You are basically a veterinary. You're a veterinarian that went to the Navy and worked on mostly just dolphins. That was basically what you studied on, correct? Yeah, that's right.

Brought in to help... It's a huge testament to the Navy, right? So they have this population Navy dolphins that live in San Diego Bay since the 1960s. To their credit, they brought me in to help the dolphins. So it wasn't the fact that this has turned to it, spinning out to be able to improve human health is great. But this whole thing started because They wanted to bring in a veterinary epidemiologist to study 60 years of health data to continually improve the health of their dolphins.

Well, what I was going to ask you, I find interesting is a lot of people who are doing what you're doing in the longevity space, who are Or in general, a lot of the research is based on studying on rodents or worms or things of that nature. I've never heard of people doing research by accident, let's say, on a mammal like a dolphin or a dolphin in general. I've never heard anyone working with dolphins, to be honest. How much more accurate is the findings when you work with someone like an animal like a dolphin versus even working with a rodent? Because a rodent is a very different species, obviously, than humans. And then people are using that information to translate for humans.

Yeah, it's a great question, Jen. So a lot of the research is being done on worms and mice and flies because it's easier, right? Yeah. They have X amount of three years lifespan max for the mice. And so you can rapidly do studies for worms. It's a week. So it's like, gosh, if I can get a worm to live two weeks, then I can say we doubled its lifespan, and a huge win on that So it's easy to do that research. But to your point, while there are similarities among all animals, there are really important differences. And what the gift that the dolphins gave us was that if you step back and look at all this focus in short-lived species, evolution has already figured out how a human can live 37 times longer than a mouse. So it's like if evolution has already figured out how a mammal who has... We both have livers brains and spleens and red blood cells. How is it that humans live longer than mice? We were able to have the right question in front of us by putting in the dolphin angle, which is we were seeing that older dolphins were aging a lot like older people, naturally, not forcing a chronic disease in a mouse in a lab, but just saying all of a sudden we were gifted with this patient population that have large brains and long lives.

We have co-evolved have similar mechanisms that allow us to live a long time, but also similar mechanisms that help us be susceptible to diseases like high cholesterol and chronic inflammation and Alzheimer's. So it was just a really fortuitous gift.

It really is. I mean, so when you were brought in to even work with the dolphins, were you there for a very specific thing that you were looking for? And then you happenstance found all this other longevity or this main longevity, I guess, piece of information that nobody seemed to have known about, which is crazy to me. It is. What was the whole process? What did you learn? What was the whole thing there? Because how many years were you there?

Gosh, it's 20 years, almost 20 years working there.

So you were researching dolphins to learn about health and longevity in humans, basically, or how humans would live longer. How do they actually live longer? What was the basic reason why they brought you in? Right.

So they brought me in because they had accumulated more than half a century of dolphin health data. So they were so ahead of the times that they were routinely collecting blood samples that are part of their routine health care. They had it in an electronic database, data from 1980s, 1990s, and dolphins throughout their life. So every quarter, imagine going to your doctor, getting a full CBC and chem, and then all that data being put into an electronic database your whole life. And And storing the samples, the serum samples, so that you could actually go back, that allowed us to do this thing called metabolomics, and actually study thousands of small molecules and match them to which small molecules predicted dolphins that got high cholesterol or got chronic inflammation. And more importantly, which small molecules protected against it. So they brought me in, initially because it was about looking at infectious diseases that were present in wild dolphins and to make sure navy dolphins were protected. There's a virus called Morbilla virus, which is like measles. In fact, it's like it is measles in dolphins that was causing mass mortality events in wild dolphins. And so they had brought me in to understand what were the risks to the dolphin population.

It ended up being very low. But then while I was there over the first decade, then we started really transitioning to chronic diseases, which I'll be totally honest. I thought chronic diseases are boring. Vegetations are exciting, like a bullet. And then I got in and I'm like, oh, Oh, my gosh, this is for where we were studying, so much more impact, positive impact we could have on the dolphins. And then to be able to spin out and see these exact same patterns and the ability to translate it to humans was huge. The initial studies were all to help the dolphins. We found that this specific nutrient, C15, present in some fish, but not all, the dolphins that were getting the fish with a higher C15, were getting higher C15 levels, cells. We now know that this was enabling them to be protected against these aging associated conditions. The same epidemiological studies were popping up in humans. It's just it was hidden because it's a saturated fat. We thought, well, gosh, that doesn't really fit the pattern that we know. So it was just pushed to the side.

So nobody really was able to see that finding or look. No one was looking for it, really.

That's right.

Just by coincidence or just happenstance, you figure it out that it was this molecule called C15 that was really enhancing the longevity and the health of the dolphins. That's right.

And so we saw the first studies were association. Okay, they're associated with the dolphins that were aging healthier. And then, and all of this was funded by the Office of Navel Research. So we're held at the highest standard of these studies. So we said, Well, gosh, let's go find more fish that have higher C15 in them. Let's give them a modified diet that has higher to see 15 fish and let's see what happens. And we did it and they got better. Monty Python. They were able to... We were seeing anemia was completely alleviated. We saw cholesterol going down, inflammation going down. And It was changing fish, to be fair. But we saw as we increased their C15 levels through this modified diet, they got better. So then from there, we then moved C15, pure C15, into the lab and then spent the next 10 years, the past 10 years, understanding from a pharmaceutical approach. How does the molecule work? Is it bioavailable? What levels do we need to achieve what's active? Is it relevant to humans? And so all of those studies have been undergoing. Most importantly, we've been doing the work, but now there are groups around the world who are publishing now over 100 peer-reviewed papers on C15, an average of one new paper coming out on C15 a week.

It's such an exciting time.

Are you kidding? No. No. How do you explain what it is? So it's an essential fatty acid. Is that what it is? Saturated fatty acid?

Right. C15, it's an odd chain saturated fat. And we've been told our whole lives, all dietary saturated fats are bad. We now know 100 % unequivocally, different, not all saturated fats are equal. So these odd chain saturated fats. So if it has C15 means it has 15 carbons. So if it has an odd number of carbons, especially Especially C15, it protects against development of metabolic disease of type 2 diabetes and heart disease. If it's an even chain saturated fat, especially C16. So we're just talking about adding one carbon under the same molecule, increased risk of type 2 diabetes and the exact opposite. I mean, it's mind-blowing what nature is doing with just adding one carbon. We know this not because I'm saying it, it's because of the preponderance of data that have been published showing over and over again, meta-analyses of these large prospective cohort studies in populations throughout the world showing this over and over again.

What I found so interesting is that without enough C15, your age is accelerated at a very fast pace. You hear about all these other longevity medications or supplements, like I was saying to you, like metformin, repromicin, they say that also is another one. The other one I couldn't pronounce, astraxanthin. I think that was the other one. Oh, there you go. That's it. I said it. Do you believe I said it? I couldn't remember how to say it, but I could never pronounce it. What is the difference between all these other supplements, medications, and C15?

Right. So what's exciting is science, right? So all of a sudden, we have before us where longevity and anti-aging is going from fiction or from science fiction to science-backed. And so we now know there are specific longevity regulating pathways. It's called the Human Longevity Regulating Pathway. And it details those pathways. It's like, if you tap into this pathway, then this will lead to longer-lived mice and worms and dogs and humans. We also know that there are these hallmarks of aging, so ways that define how we age at the cellular at a regular level. If we can target these hallmarks, then, again, we could live longer. When we look at the traditional approach to longevity-enhancing candidates, rapamycin is at the top. It's because it targets almost the heart of the longevity regulating pathway, so much so that its job is to inhibit MTOR, which then enables longevity. Mtor stands for the mechanistic empty target of rapamycin. It's so important. I'll take your word for it. It's so important. Rapamycin is so important to longevity. It has its own pathway named in it. So that's rapamycin. We talk about metformin. This does the heart of the longevity pathway.

So it activates AMPK. And by doing that, again, this is a huge longevity enabler. It has the added bonus of also this is the mechanism that this is how metformin also helps improve glucose control. So you get a good one to hit. So when you talk about these various longevity enhanceers, they do provide a lot of promise because they're foreign molecules that tap into the longevity pathway and are showing a lot of promise. C15 comes in, right? Out of nowhere. And it's like, oh, it's in breast milk and butter.

It's basically found in dairy products, which is why it's concerning to me is because we've been Dairy has been vilified, I feel, in the media. That's the first thing. People are drinking now Oatmilk instead of drinking regular milk. And if you look at the ingredients of wheat milk, it is literally like having a Snickers bar. There's more sugar and shit in Oatmilk. I don't care what brand it is. I don't care what it is. It's not a healthy option. But we've been now with marketing and branding and just repetition, we're brainwashed to believe that Oatmilk is than dairy, which is... I even drink almond milk, even though I know even almond are stuffed with all sorts of poisons when they are... What do you call that stuff? What do you call it when they spray the almond and all the All the things. My point is we're substituting dairy for all these other alternative milks when there's so many health benefits to dairy, right? That's right. Unless you're lactose-intolerant.

Right. Which a lot of people are. But the whole point that you're making, Jen, is that we, that C15, while dolphins were getting their C15 from fish, our primary source, by far- Our human's primary source, yes. By far is dairy fat so much so that for a long time, C15 has been used as a biomarker of how much dairy fat we eat, even before we knew there were any benefits. Wow. So it's like how much dairy fat we eat dictates how much C15 we have. So Now we know that because we've been decreasing our intake of C15, that our C15 levels have been decreasing. The same thing had been happening in the dolphins, right? Because they had been moving away from a C15-rich diet after the 1990s.

What were they eating?

They had actually... Before they were eating eulicon fish, which is a super fatty fish, the eulacon, the fishery died out. They had to move to a less fatty fish. At the same time, we were moving away from whole fat melks. They were moving away from their whole fat fish. We had a coinciding 50-year experiment between two long-lived large brain mamalium populations. What we started seeing is we started seeing this rise in aging associated diseases in dolphins, including fatty liver disease, non-alcoholic, which showed up in humans in 1980 for the first cases and now present in one in three people globally. We had these parallels, really interesting parallels happening. That's where we learned that as our C15, one of the core roles of C15 is it helps to... It's a sturdy fatty acid that is essential in strengthening our cell membranes. It literally strengthens our cell membranes against what's called lipid peroxidation. What we now know is that if our C15 levels get below about 0. 2% of total fatty acids, it's like bricks bricks inside. If we don't have enough bricks, that cell membrane becomes fragile and it causes what you had talked about, this new form of cell death called ferroptosis.

This was discovered by researchers at Columbia University back in 2012. There have been over 20,000 papers written on this new form of cell death. We know it accelerates aging, so that's the accelerate aging component. We know it accelerates the onset and the exacerbation of type 2 diabetes, heart disease, cognitive decline. What nobody's been able to figure out is where did it come from? Why all of a sudden our cells dying in this whole new way? And that's where the dolphins taught us that C15 deficiency in the diet causes ferraptosis. And more importantly, it's fixable. We can actually reverse it just like vitamin C deficiency in scurvy and vitamin D deficiency in rickets. It's the nutritional deficiency of our generation, of our time.

So if people are not eating dairy, does that mean that they're most likely Are they deficient in C15? Yes. Probably a big portion of the population now are deficient, and they may have a lot of these health concerns and not even really know the root cause because they're not even looking for it.

That's right. What we're seeing is we're seeing younger people getting more aging, getting aging associated diseases faster. We worked with Dr. Jeff Schwemmer, and he's a pediatrician. He works with fatty liver disease. He's been on the forefront of fatty liver disease in kids. Jeff, what he started seeing was he started seeing not just fatty liver disease, but in general, kids are getting hypertension, high cholesterol, not just associated with diabetes. They're getting them early and earlier. He was seeing that kids are getting diseases of their grandparents before their parents. When you ask Jeff, Are kids aging faster? You can't even finish the sentence.

Really?

Absolutely. Our children are aging faster than they should. And again, getting back to this, we've been moving kids and young adults away from whole fat milk. And the plant-based melks have no C15 in them.

Of course not. So then where else would you even get C15 if you're not getting it from high fat dairy products? Are you even able, by the way, before you even tell me that, can you get C15 from 2% milk or non-fat milk?

You can get- That's a good question. So Whole fat milk has... In the 1950s, we drink two cups of whole fat milk per day as Americans. So we were able to get the amount between 100 to 300 milligrams of C15 per day. Today, the average American drinks about a quarter cup of what would be equal to whole fat milk. But if you drink non-fat milk, no C15. If you drink low fat milk, it has half the amount of C15 is whole fat. If you're drinking whole fat milk from cows that are fed corn versus grass, that corn-fed, the milk from corn-fed cows has 50% less C15 in it than grass-fed. We've got changes in agriculture. We have so many things that have been driving away and decreasing our exposure, healthy exposure to C15.

Oh, my gosh. So then what other... Okay, now you can answer the other part. Where else does someone find C15 if it's not in high fat dairy products?

So that by far, this is how we're able to successfully get up and over what's now being increasingly defined, not just by us, as C15 deficiency. So you've got to get up and over that 0. 2% on the population, global population is sitting, the average is 0. 2 %. So we're on average sitting right at that precipice of cellular fragility. So the whole curve has shifted. If you look at C15 in mom's breast milk from the 1970s and 1980s, compared to now, it's about half of what it used to be. So even from birth, our babies are getting about half the amount of C15 that they used to.

Because they're not drinking milk. That's right.

Because mom needs to get enough C15 to have it in her milk to give it to her baby.

It's just a ripple effect of what's happening. That's why you were saying earlier why the younger generation is getting all of these very aging diseases more than their own parents because at least the parents were drinking milk because it wasn't villainized as much. That is extremely interesting. Yeah.

Again, what's promising about it is there's so much data in front of us now. You just can't ignore it. We need ability to be able to take a good look at this data, remove our blinders on saturated fats, and say, yes, there are differences, and how do we get the good healthy saturated back into our diets through good agricultural practices, healthy, wholesome milk in our younger years. Then now what the Navy funded us to do was to say, okay, how do you, in your older years, as we get out of our teens and move up, how do we get pure C15 delivered, absent of the pro-inflammatory saturated fats and dairy fat? This is something that we could help to actually optimize our C15 levels to lean into the longevity space. We can do both. Let's fix deficiencies.

You are able to figure out a way to extract the C15 molecule from the dairy, the saturated fat. Let's just say the dairy fat. If you're someone who is those intoler or can't eat the butters and the whole milk or whatever, you can still optimize by taking like fatty 15.

That's right. And that's why it was developed. So we use a plant-based C14 and we add a carbon onto it so That and our approach was that we were developing this to see if we could have it as a treatment for fatty liver disease. We were thinking about this from a pharmaceutical perspective. And so the the robustness of all the data that we would need to do preparing this to help treat a disease, that was the first five years of work was all it was at that level of research. Once we realized it was meeting the criteria of essential, which means that we need certain levels of it in our body in order to just stay healthy, to not get sick, and that our bodies don't make enough of it, therefore we have to get it from our diet. That then tipped it from, this isn't a pharmaceutical, this isn't a drug. This is an essential nutrient, a foundational nutrient we all need. This can't be via prescription. This needs to be more accessible to the world.

Can I ask you a stupid question? I mean, I'm going to do it anyway. I don't know. No. So hopefully you'll be okay with it. But maybe you've been asked this before, but how is C15 different than omega-3?

Right. Okay. That's a super good question. Okay, good. Because if we talk about this discovery of C15 as an emerging essential fatty acid, that it would be like saying, we discovered vitamin E, and then how does that compare to vitamin A? So the omega-3 is omega-6, that there are essential fatty acids, and so they are also essential. They play a role in helping to keep our cell membrane because they have these double bonds in them, which are like hinges in the structure. Their job is to help make our cell membranes more flexible. C15 It's your brain's job, because it has no double bonds, it's just a super sturdy 15 carbon chain, its job is to keep our cell membranes stable. It's like a yin and yang where they work together, where we need both flexibility and stability in our cells. When we focused, leaned in hard on just omega-3s, and then we actively took C15 out of our diet, then that created an imbalance in what we need for ourselves.

Because I think that some people who would be listening would be... That's why I asked the question. It's a good question. Because it sounds like when you say fatty 15 or an essential fatty molecule, acid, whatever it is, you automatically think, Why? I take omega-3s? Because that's, again, been something that's been drilled into our brains. There are certain things that over time we've been conditioned to think that are essential. Like vitamin D is essential now, omega-3 is essential now. Basically, those are the two you hear all. Now you're hearing a lot about creatine as a supplement to take. But what I've noticed is there's so many things that just because it's not popular or people by the masses don't know about it, it doesn't mean it's not essential. And in fact, a lot of times They're just as, if not more important. And so what I even notice is people take their blood test and then they think, okay, I'm going to take these supplements, and then they do that for the next 20 years of their life. They're probably not even deficient in those things anymore. And then they get all of these different diseases or ailments or problems, and they don't even know why, because they don't even know what to look for.

So is there even a blood test? Is there somewhere that people can be like, hey, can you check my C15 levels? Can people even do that?

They I can. And this is such an important question, and it really gets to the heart, right, of being able to use science, that high-quality science, to get us to where we are today, and then be able to transition that into the clinical practitioner space. So It's like even for ourselves to take care of our own health and have ownership of it, that you can measure C15 levels. We worked with Genova. It's been included as part of their NutraVal panel for a long time. So I was talking. Really? Yeah. So I was talking with Dr. Mark Hyman, and we were on a podcast, and I was like, Yeah, it's on the NutraVal. He was like, What? So he went back.

Function house. He's probably like, Oh, why are we not testing for this?

We need to get them to do that. So he went back and he looked at it and he's like, I cannot believe. He's like, So it's been collected all along. He's like, I went back and looked, I cannot believe how many of my patients are low in C15. Nobody's known to look at it. So there's actually been a good There's a number of people who have already have test results on C15. If you had a fatty acid panel done, they don't all include it. We're trying to make sure that they are all including C15 in that panel. But for folks like Genova who do include it, they're able to measure it. We worked with them. They developed an at-home blood spot test. You can measure C15 that way, too, because we think that's important. This is not just saying, Hey, totally cold off in discovery. Take the pills.

Give Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's more like that what has... What's been so important about this is we brought on Dr. Nick Shorke. He has been head of NIH's Longevity Consortium for over 20 years, Jen. So he's seen every longevity nutrient or even molecule under the sun. And nick said, I am watching the preponderence of data that are supporting C-15, like from all different angles, cell-based studies, animal studies, human studies. He's like, I have never seen a molecule have more support for its core role in supporting longevity than C15. And he specifically said, this is going to be a geroprotector. I was like, great. What's a geroprotector?

Yeah, I was going to ask you the same question. I was embarrassed.

You seem really excited. But it was... And so he said, a geroprotector is a molecule that can effectively slow our biological aging rate to stem the onset of the diseases kill us. So it's not about you just tap into a mechanism of longevity. If you're a Jeroprotector, you're going to have meaningful benefits within months. And he's like, this is the Holy Grail we're looking for. Because to do a clinical trial that you don't feel or see any benefits and you just wait and see if you live longer is just not going to be done. No, exactly. But with C-15, he's like, this is checking off all the boxes. Of a Jeroprotector. And that's why when we brought the supplement, fatty 15, to the world, again, funded by the Office of Nival Research to do so, then it's because it's intended to improve the strength of our cells, that then translates into improved health and wellness within weeks to months. So we have 70 % of our customers, and this is a survey of over 6000 people, 70 % report feeling better within 16 weeks. Hold up. Bless you.

Thank you.

It stops sneezzing. It's amazing. No, it does not stop sneezzing.

It's a panacea for everything, actually.

It is not a panacea. And what's most importantly is with regard to health, then people go to their doctor, and when they go to their doctor, their doctor is like, What are you doing? And they say, I started fatty 15. And it's those benefits. So we encourage people, Start on fatty 15. Get your C C15 levels, if you can see where you're at on the spectrum, are you deficient? So your goal is to not be deficient. Or are you in the middle? And now you want to optimize to like Sardinians have C15 levels that are 2-3 times higher than us. So it's like, how do we optimize to get to Sardinian level?

Is it because they're drinking a lot of full fat? I bet you European's in general, because they don't have the same nonsense over there with the food. When you go and get a latte or you get you know, you get cough. People We're drinking whole milk there. They're not asking for the oak milk and this macadamium and cashew milk. I mean, this is very much like a North American thing. That's right. But wait, because I want to ask you where else you can get C15, because I know that we jumped that. But while we're still talking about this, I wanted you to tell us, besides the things that we talked about, which is diabetes and what you're saying, you said diabetes, of course, fatty liver disease, blood insulin levels, what are some other symptoms or things people can look for that maybe that C15 can help with and that it helps with, that you know that you've researched?

It's the best way is via the blood test. The blood test that there's specific things you can look for to actually see signs of cellular fragility. The way that we look to see are our cells fragile because our C15 levels are low. First, test your C15 levels if you can, but not everybody has access to that. Then the second is when you get... It's standard to get a red blood cell panel, and that's where they usually look for signs of anemia. If you have a low hemoglobin, an increased amount of what's called red blood cell distribution width or RDW, that means that your red blood cell size is... There's a lot of variability, which means the cells aren't stable, so the cells are dying too fast, so you're needing to make new ones, and that creates a lot of different-sized red blood cells. Rdw has come out as one of the strongest predictors of biological age. So it feeds into what's called aging cell pheno, which is now a gold standard measurement of our biological age. Rdw is important not just for cellular stability. That stability then becomes a marker for how old we are biologically.

We need those stable cells. So RDW. When we get to then this ferroptosis, so if you're progressing to where C15 deficiency is leading to this new form of cell death, then your blood results will show up high ferritin level. So hyperferritinemia would be something we see a lot of physicians light up when they hear they're like, Oh, my God, I have a solution for why I'm seeing this in so many patients, I'm seeing this combination. I haven't known what it was about.

But what does it show? How does it show? If I don't know all the science stuff, and for me, just a layman person, talk to me like I'm 11 or 10. Okay.

Are you ready? Yeah. Okay. So we're going to do two levels. We're going to do adult going to their doctors and they get their blood results back. Okay. So you're going to see high cholesterol, chronic inflammation, signs of insulin resistance. You might see higher glucose levels, elevated liver enzyme levels, so called ALT and AST. So these are standard things that your doctor is going to send you back and be like, eh.

And this can help. C15 can help with all of it.

If it is part of this whole issue with regard to accelerated aging, then Yeah, the aging part.

So also because I heard for skin, I have eczema. I know that that's a big thing as well. Can you talk about how it can even help with skin issues? Because to me, I get eczema, dermatitis, atopic dermatitis. It's a real problem, and I can't control it. I do all the things right, and yet it still flares up and people are like, Sorry, you got to put some more cortisone on your arm. I have it actually right now, over here.

I'm like, you're pulling it off pretty well. So- I mean, thank you.

Thank you very much. I'm covering it like this. No.

Yeah. So I have also... I also have atopic dermatitis, and it's from if I eat any raw fruits, vegetables, or nuts, that it triggers an allergic response in my skin. So I don't- Oh, wow. Which is like anything healthy. So make a joke in the book that I have a diet of a six-year-old birthday party.

Yeah, I was going to say. Like you've seen pizza and fries all day? Yeah. Oh, wow. And you're glowing.

So, yeah, you have to find creative ways.

And milk shakes, which helps you for your C15. Yeah. There you go.

All right. It's a benefit. Six-year-old birthday party. I'll be in my next day. Your next diet book. That's right.

Yeah.

So with regard to... When we ran C15, so we look at how does C15 work. It's called these mechanisms of action. We talked about how it strengthens cells. It also inhibits MTOR, it activates the MPK. Those other things we talked about rapid myosemite formative. It's called a pleotropic molecule, which is just a fancy way of just saying it gets around. It does a lot of things.

It's a very slutty molecule.

Yeah, exactly. Very slutty molecule. That will be the title of the podcast.

That's going to be the thumbnail, actually. Let's write that down.

So it does a lot of things, which an essential nutrient should. One of those things is it helps to inhibit what's called JAKSTAT. So it's a JAKSTAT inhibitor. This is the mechanism that's being used for a lot of drugs that are being used for things like eczema and for atopic dermatitis and for psoriasis. So when we were doing those early screening of C15, back when we were assessing it for a drug, One of the first things you do is say, okay, what are its different mechanisms of action? And that is where it revealed it had this anti-allergy, anti-autoimmune disease activities. So to be clear, the supplement is not to treat or cure any diseases. But really interesting that as we saw this dose-response effect, that the higher the C15 went, which we can achieve in our bodies, the stronger activity it had against these pro-inflammatory cytokines that cause what you and I feel with regard to experience with eczema. So it calms things down. It's for me, it's helped to calm. It doesn't get rid of it. I can't go eat strawberries and have a great day.

But it can improve it slightly or it calms it down.

If there's a lemon juice snuck into my cocktail, then I don't have a bad day.

Wow.

So it takes the edge off of it. And again, it feeds into the question that keeps coming up is we see a lot of these conditions have been increasing in the last couple of generations. The question we're feeding is, again, if a lot of us are sitting on C15 deficiencies, is that actually increasing our susceptibility to various conditions that C15 was meant to be in our tissues to just help keep things balanced, to keep our immune system from going out of whack or glucose metabolism and everything else?

I want to take a quick break to talk about something I genuinely think is a game changer for healthy aging, and that's fatty 15. Here's what you need to know. Scientists discovered the first new essential fatty acid in over 90 years. It's called C15, and it's a big deal. When your cells don't have enough C15, they become fragile and they age faster. And when your cells age, your body ages. Full stop. As many as one in three people worldwide may have low C15 levels, a condition called cellular fragility syndrome, and most of them have no idea. Fattie 15 co founder Dr. Stephanie Van Watson discovered C15 while working with the US Navy studying aging dolphins. Based on over 100 studies, we now know C15 is a key nutrient for slowing biological aging at the cellular level. And Fattie 15 has three times more cellular benefits than omega-3 or fish oil. By the way, 72% of Fattie 15 customers report seeing or feeling benefits within 16 weeks. Things like deeper sleep, improved energy, and healthier hair, skin, and nails. It's vegan friendly, free of allergens and preservatives, and clinically proven to raise C15 levels. So if you care about your age, and I know you do, this is worth your attention.

Go to www. Fatty15. Com/habits and use code habits at checkout to get an additional 15% off their 90-day starter kit. That's fatty15. Com/habits code habits. You can find the link in the show notes. Now, let's get back to the episode. I've got two questions. So comparatively to, let's say, compare it to a metformin, which one is more effective? C15 or metformin for blunting blood sugar? I know that you are an expert in C15, I understand. But you've seen tons of data, tons of papers and research. Where is the research strongest?

On C15?

No, in general, for blunting blood sugar to being a longevity molecule that is the king of all longevity molecules. Where would you say C15 lies?

So if I spoke for nick, because I'm slightly biased. I know. So nick, that's where we get a lot of our confidence is really coming from experts in the field. And so, nick spoke to a community of his peers in Copenhagen two years ago, and it was the largest anti-aging conference in Copenhagen. And he presented C15, and he showed the data of why C15 has the most support as a longevity-enhancing nutrient, a. K. A. Geroprotector, than any other molecule that he has seen, bar none. He stood there unapologetic and started out the talk. We have it on. It's on YouTube, but you can provide a link to it.

Yeah, what's it called?

I don't know what it's titled, but it's a nick Shork.

No, it's called nick. What's the title of the talk?

Ardd, Anti-Aging Research for the Development of Drugs.

Oh, gosh. That's a mouthful already.

Ardd. But we'll I'll send you the link to the video.

I'd be curious to see it myself. The other one I forgot to ask you about is NAD.

Oh, yeah, that's a good one.

I mean, NAD is the hottest thing. It's been hot for a couple of years now, two, three years, but it's climbing in its popularity. Everyone's injecting themselves with NAD. And I don't know if this is because my algorithm, but now it's like every second reel is like, yeah, I'm taking my injection of NAD and no one can live without it anymore because I know that your NAD depletes after a certain age, and then every year it keeps on depleting. And that's what I've been taught or told many times, that that's the anti-aging panacea. What is your take on that compared to C15?

So NAD says, so if you look at this longevity regulating pathway, right? And so it's a super complicated, fancy-looking pathway. You put ANPK, activation is in middle of it. Mtor inhibition is up here. Nad is right after ANPK. So it's part of the longevity regulating pathway. Anpk can help upregulate NAD. And by doing so, it can help extend longevity. So again, all of the players in the longevity space are there for a good reason, and it's because they're tapping into these important pathways. Nad, as far as being able to under... So it makes sense of why it's there. And so in the clinical trials, continue with it. And I do think it's encouraging. It's less about it being essential because our bodies, it's something that our bodies make. But then to your point, as we get older, the levels decline. And so to be able to hack into that and be able to get our levels back up is a good thing. Right.

So there's precursors like NR and NMN and all these other things. But I've also been, I think that NR is much It's my opinion, but NR is a better precursor than Nmn for the size of the molecule and all these other things. That's from all the research I've seen. But I wanted to ask you because you've deep dived on, of course, C15, and that's what you do for a living, and you've probably seen a ton of data on a lot of things, and there's a lot of noise out there. So if you had to create your top longevity cocktail, and it could be everything, anything and everything. Exercise, of course, is a piece of it. Nutrition. What would you put in that cocktail to live a healthy long life? Not just long, but healthy and good. Right.

And it's a good question because when we first came out with the book, The Longevity Nutrient, a lot of people, Jen, especially women, they're like, I don't want longevity. I want health. But if I can live a long time and be healthy, then I'll take that. It's that whole... It's just It's sometimes a very different mindset.

If you can live to 100, but be very incapacit, completely like- No, thank you. That's not exactly a quality. I think how to live long and with a quality life is the goal, right?

Yeah. So I'm going to sound real boring on this one. Go ahead. I'm boring, too. But I am a true, true believer in absolutely, like you said, exercise, and that includes not just aerobic, but as for resistance training. We're all understanding that now, that to be able to be social. Socialization is huge. Yes. Keeping our hearing, we're now understanding that if we, when we lose our hearing, and if you do not get hearing aids, that that decreased stimulation to the brain increases the risk of the earlier onset of dementia. And so that's not a lot of... Repeated studies are showing this, and we all end up losing, a lot of us end up losing our hearing over time. Hearing. And it ends up that we really need that stimulation within our brain. It also, as we start losing our hearing, we become less social. And then as you're not interacting and being social with people, we know that decreases longevity and leads to depression, which again, shortens longevity. So socialization, hearing, exercise, sleep is huge. And if we don't, it's not just how much you sleep, because there are some people who sleep too much.

So if you sleep too much or you sleep too little, there's this Goldilocks zone in the middle. And not only do you need to sleep enough, that quality of sleep has got to be good, right?

By the way, in everything, your social circle has to be quality, your food has to be quality, your sleep has to be quality. I think it's a a given, right? Yeah. Just because it's there, just because it's available or you're doing it, doesn't mean it's the best quality. You're going to get the best results, basically.

Exactly. And then, of course, C15 is in my stack, like 100 %. I never took supplements before this. Really? Yeah. I'm not a good pill taker, and so I just didn't do supplements.

Is that why you started the gummy? I'm like, Wait, I need a plan.

So these capsules are super tiny. Tiny? Tiny.

I can't believe how small they are. I was like, Where are they? They're like little micros. They're like little bee, like little buds.

Yeah, which makes it really easy. So 99% of our customers make Fattie Report that Fattie 15 is part of their daily routine at six weeks, like at two weeks and at six weeks. So it's an easy habit that sticks. And then they stay. We have over 95% retention rate on it because people are feeling the benefits. We have 70% of our customers report feeling deeper sleep, calmer mood, better energy within 16 weeks. And we like calling those delights and surprises. This is really about the long term benefits. The delights and surprises are coming. We've recently discovered C15 has, again, about being a slutty molecule. That it also has... Permiscuous, we'll go with that.

Yeah, I like that's a better word. That's nice euphemism over there.

So that it also inhibits two enzymes one called MAOB and the other one called MAOB and the other called FAH. And by doing, having those two activities, it helps increase dopamine levels and endocannabinoid levels. So by helping to boost dopamine and the of cannabis, endocannabinoids, that is explaining why people are like, Oh, I'm sleeping better. I'm feeling better. Really? So the retention rate is really high because we have the added benefit of the gift the dolphins gave us, which was you actually feel better for a lot of people within a few weeks. So people make a part of their routine. So for me, it's a non-negotiable, and not because I'm co-CEO of the company. It's because it's genuinely helping me feel better.

Right. If it helps sleep a little bit or a lot of it, depending, do you recommend people taking it at night or in the morning?

Right. So for me, I take them the capsules in the morning And I still get the sleep benefits, which is interesting. We do have customers that say they'll take one in the morning, and then they'll take one at night, or if they shift it to the night for the ones that really need that sleep benefit, that it's beneficial. And now that we have the gummies coming out, I'll take a capsule in the morning, some gummies at night.

You can double stack it. Yeah. Okay. I like that. Okay. I'm not finished because I have a lot of other questions that we haven't... We went through, but we jumped over. Where else can you get C15 if it's not in dairy? Right.

So dairy is our primary source. That's how we get up and over not being deficient. However, there are other things we can do, in addition to supplementation, to get everything Everything we can do, right, to help improve. So we know that if we exercise, it increases our C15 levels. We think that's because it's when you exercise, C15 is stored in your tissues. So as your exercise, it's helping to release C15 from your tissues and get it in circulation.

Another added benefit for exercising. I mean, every day, there's like another thing that you get from exercise.

You get a C15 boost in your blood.

I love that.

So that's good. Fiber. So there's a great study that was done showing that it It was a great series of studies. And what they showed was that, how is fiber helping liver health? And so they did a whole series of studies in mice, and they showed that...

Again with the mice. I know.

And this is where it is. This one where it's helpful. So when you eat fiber, inside of fiber is a molecule called inulin. So not insulin, but inulin. Inulin is then used by specific microbes in our gut to make C15. So our microbes can produce some levels of C15, which explain that even people who eat no dairy, nobody has zero C15 levels. It's just about it's essential because you need a specific amount. You have to get enough from our diet. But I'm eating fiber. So I have high quality cheeses, Pecorino is what comes from Sardinia. So high C15 cheese is Pecorino.

So that one is so sorry not to interrupt you, but I'm going to. Yeah, please do. So does Pecorino have the highest C15 content?

Some of the highest I've seen. Really?

What other cheese is? I love Pecorino. It's good to know. Yeah. I really like that.

Hard cheeses. And those are specifically because they're from Sardinia. These are grass-fed sheep. I believe the sheep's cheese.

So grass-fed for sure. You said that earlier. And now the specific places where the highest C15 that you've seen is Pecorino cheese.

Let's see, Swiss cheese. And then it just becomes a A mix of cheeses. They're equal. The more concentrated and hard the cheese is, probably the- But fiber is another place. So fiber. So then our bodies can make fiber, exercise, eating the high-quality cheeses. And then there was actually a study that just came out two months ago that showed that people who ate more cheese, specifically of all the dairy products, had a lower risk of developing dementia. This is the It's a study of it. It had over 27,000 people, and it followed them over 17 years. Again, it's association, but the timing, right? It's like, do they start by having a certain dietary change? Do they see that outcome over time. So it's interesting that there are these parallels. So again, it's been too absolute. It's been too, don't eat their whole fat dairy products. There's just differentiation. Some of that differentiation may be from which foods have the most C15 in them.

I also, as you're talking about this, do you have a patent? Because can't people just replicate this? How do people know? You would think with 100 now peer reviewed studies, that's a lot. There's a bazillion supplement companies out there, right? What's to say that tomorrow I can just go and be like, you know what? I know all about this, and I'm going to create a pill and put some C15 in it and call it a day. Can't people do that all day?

So they can't because... And it's the Navy. So because the Navy made this-Oh, the Navy. Okay. Because the Navy made this- The Navy. The Navy made this discovery. So I made the discovery while I was at the Navy. So the patent is around the use of C-15 to be able to have these benefits. And there was a time where I was like, Gosh, how do you feel about this? Like, this is for to improve global health. It's a patent. And then I feel really good about, and this is why, is that when we have seen competitors come to the market and they put their C15 supplement out, Jen, we go and test it. There's either no C15 in it at all or the C15 in it, the quality is terrible.

I talk about this a lot, actually.

So the patents are actually protecting the highest quality and it's preventing or allowing us to be able to at least try to keep this massive number of... It's like whack-a-mole out there.

Well, I talk with a lot on social I talk a lot about this in just all my shows, because I feel like because it is the Wild Wild West, you have no clue what you're getting online. You have no clue. I've even tested multiple things and was really shocked at the limited amount of whatever that ingredient is that they're selling as the ingredient. Because people don't know. And people think if it has a lot of reviews on Amazon, oh, then it must be a good thing. You can buy reviews. You can do all sorts of wacky things online. So really knowing where you're getting a... This is for everybody listening. Know and research where you're getting everything from because it is dangerous out there. You can probably just... Or at the very best, you're just having a bunch of dust or flour or whatever. Right.

And that's been... Yeah. I was like, go ahead.

No, I was going to say it's very... That's why it's very important. But that's why I wanted to know, because you have to have some restrictions around what people can do with what, so they don't just go go out there and make and create a bunch of baloney, basically. Yeah.

It was... I mean, maybe super naive. I never would have thought that there'd be a product that said it. This is what... It has this. It has C15 in it.

And you believe it.

And it has none in it.

But that's because people don't expect that. It was so naive.

Right. And now it's like, so it is. It's incredibly disappointing. It makes me glad there are patents to project to say, this one, and therefore, and Then we're participating in programs like Supco. Supco is, they do measure on 26 different levels of quality. And so we have a Supco score. Oh, that's really good. So it was 963. In a couple of weeks, it'll be 9. 88. Of out of 10, which is in the excellent category. That's amazing. And so the ability to have these platforms so that, exactly like you're saying, that we need to, as consumers, we need to be able to separate the wheat from the chaff. And because, like you said, it's not only what's not in there, it's what is it?

That's the thing. What is it? That's the thing.

That's right. Anyway, I'm glad they're out there. We're obviously thrilled to be participating in the programs because it gives us a chance to say not just is this great science. And the reason why it works is because of the quality of the ingredient that's in it and all the science that's been dedicated to it. But we're also going to uphold. We do third party validation for its quality. We had an independent group assess that it was generally recognized as safe for one year and up. And we even had an independent team come in, if scientists come in, evaluate our claims and determine and reconfirm that they're based on competent and reliable scientific evidence called CARS. So it's just like for us, it's just so important to be able to say, how do we separate ourselves from all this noise? There are ways to do it. So we're owning that.

That's really good. Okay, so let's get to the dolphins again, because I know I skipped through that a little bit. I have more questions the dolphins, if you don't mind. Do you mind if I keep you here another few minutes? Yeah, not at all.

So you're going to talk about how you don't like dolphins at all.

No, I love dolphins. Who doesn't like a dolphin? I mean, they're such a beautiful animal. But what I was going to say is, when you were looking at all these dolphins. And you said some had higher C15 than others, they don't eat cheese, and they're not eating those fatty fishes like the Yukonfish that you were mentioning earlier. Where were they getting the ones that had the higher C15? Do they have a higher C15 because of their genetics or because in their muscles, it was releasing faster, like you were saying? Did they eat more fiber? How were they higher in C15 than the other dolphins? Yeah.

So what happened is when the Yulican went away, then the Navy went to five different types of fish. So within that, so then they were getting herring and capelin and squid and mackrel. So what we found was... And then based upon preferences of the dolphins, they we get more of one versus another. And so we had, even though we think fish are fish, they're not. And that some of the fish called capelin, there are these tiny little fish, which are great, and they loved them, but they ended up being like the chips of the sea, right? It's like they had no C15 in them. Really? Yeah. So the way it differentiated between some dolphins that were getting more versus not, which is a great question, was based upon which dolphins were getting more of the mackrel and herring that had higher levels of C15 versus the percentage of their diet that was getting.

Oh, interesting.

A lot of capelin and squit, for example, had no C15 in it.

So mackrel and herring have a higher C15 than other fish.

Yeah, and mullet, the really popular fish.

Yeah, I've never heard of mullet in my life. Except for haircuts. More than a haircut. I was going to say, except for those weird haircuts. But other than that, yeah. Yeah. Some mullet. Yeah, some mullet. Some mullet fish. Okay, I'm not going to plan on eating that. So does tuna and salmon, do they have C15?

They have C15, and then salmon has a decent- A lot of omegas.

Right?

Yeah, exactly. C15 has a decent amount in salmon. When we tested the fish, it's in the highest levels in the skin and the heads of the fish. So I think that's why it ends up for us not being... There have been studies saying, we know C15 is a biomarker of dairy fat. Could it be a biomarker of fish? Because it is in our fish, and it's not strong at all. I think it depends on what type of fish you're eating. If you're Scandinavian or Norwegian, you might be eating the skin and heads of fatty fish. If it's anchovies and sardines, and then Asian cultures, used to traditionally, the person of on her at the table would get the head of the fish. Little did they know it was because they were getting... They wanted to get some anti-aging C15.

Exactly. Okay, I have another question about C15. If it's so good for anti-aging and inhibiting the acceleration of your age, why are beauty products not using it yet? Are you going to be making beauty products? Because they always jump on every bandwagon. They put everything in. Can it be used topically? If I opened up a supplement of fatty 15 and just put it on my face with that- I don't know.

Let us know how it goes.

I've done that with creatine to see if that would help. I mean, I don't know. I made a nice mask. I think that's about it. But I was wondering, are there other ways that people can... Because I I would think it is such a... Is that a product line that you would make? Yeah, it could be. It could be. Or kids. I know you're coming with kids stuff, right? Because I couldn't believe it. Like you were saying, how many kids are not getting enough of this very essential, what do you call it, molecule because their parents aren't drinking or eating it. It's crazy.

I don't know if you remember, but when our son, when Ben turned two, we got the paper, sheet of paper that said, okay, it's time to move your kid off of whole fat milk. And it was like, it's not like he was overweight or he had diabetes. So we... And it wasn't just before all of this was happening. But it's like that has just... So why? Why? Why are we taking kids off of whole fat milk?

I was actually going to ask you. And by the way, I don't know if you... I do notice that whenever you take away, you go from an alternative. You know the whole thing, remember Snackwells? Oh, yes. The green bag. The green bag. Everything has its trend, like low fat, this thing, that thing. Whenever you take out one thing and you substitute it, it's never good for you. That's right. Why do people even do that? I don't even know. Like, cold milk, the people I know who drink cold milk, they are very lean. They're thin, they're thin, they are healthy. There's this crazy psychology around, I'm going to get fat if I have these whole milk and wholefoods. I know you're not a psychologist. I'll take that up with somebody else. But I just find it interesting how sometimes, leaving something in its natural state and using it for what it's utilized for, it's the best way to do it.

Yeah, I completely agree. And at some point it'll kick in, right? We just need to keep everything balanced. We just need to Like you said, don't do these extremes or you're taking one thing out and replace it. It's just, it's a balance. I know. All it is, it's just keeping... And exercise. And exercise.

It's like those two things. It's like, P. S. And exercise. I want to ask you one more. We didn't really touch about, but We talked a little bit, but is there anything in this book that is... Because we hear so much about longevity. Is there any other tidbit that you can share that maybe we haven't heard 400,000 times? I like it because I'm always looking for that little nugget that might be a little unique. Right. By the way, this is why I wanted to talk to you about C15, because I have never heard about it. I wanted to tell that to people because we hear about the same things at Nauseam, and whenever there's something that has been a little bit less covered, I want to bring it to the ethos or my audience, at least. So what else can you share that's a little bit more unique than what we've all heard?

Right. So this goes over, obviously, the book, the focus of it is on, it's to increase awareness of exactly that, of C15. It goes through the dolphin discovery story. It goes through the mechanisms. Like, how do we... So it does, something that's new is going through what a geroprotector is. So how do we differentiate between, sure, it taps into this, here are the 12 hallmarks of aging, here are the mechanisms of action. And they're still in there, but it's reframing to say, then what are the things that we should really be paying attention to. It's the ones that meet the criteria of a geroprotector. This is a list that every consumer could actually work their way through and say, Gosh, is there evidence that this molecule does? It doesn't have to be the deep science part. It's just like, wow, is it actually going to help change my cholesterol, glucose? Things that I care about. We have so many people with comorbidities that they have this multiple diseases at the same time because of aging. It's like something that then again, a Jeroprotector. The whole name is not a very sexy name, but it's factual.

It protects us from aging. By doing that, it can help address these multiple components that lead to having these multiple chronic conditions. So it's a new way to challenge interventions and to say how we should be thinking about it isn't just sexy longevity science. Like, oh, here's something cool because it taps into this pathway and it helps a worm, which is still exciting. But is it going to make me feel better? You made a really good point of I've been taking this supplement for 10 years. Why?

Yeah. Well, I think That's majority of people, right? Why? Unless you actually ask the question or hear someone say, yeah, why? That's why... I'm going to do my blood panel again, but I just did one a couple of months ago, three months ago. And all the things that I've been taking has been nonsense because I've been just... Like, vitamin D is a great example because I thought, okay, I was deficient in vitamin D 10 years ago, so I kept on taking it. And guess what? Now I'm over vitamin D. I have too much the level is too high. And so that's what I'm saying. Just because you hear it in the ethos does not make it true for you, particularly. And so that's why I urge everyone to, A, get their levels checked regularly and see where you are, and then base where you are, reverse engineer. Do you feel better? Is that improved because you're taking this, not that? So if you guys have not checked your C15, I would urge you to do it because that could be the reason why your having an ailment that you never even connected the dots to.

Yeah, that's right. And so that's the whole purpose of behind it. It's data-driven, nutrition, and you can personalize it. And you can see, do my levels How did it grow up? Did I move from deficient to sufficient? Did I move from sufficient to optimal? And most importantly, am I seeing or feeling benefits? So give yourself six months. And then if it's not really doing anything for me on my bloodwork or how I'm feeling, you don't take C15. It's just like we really challenge people to get, use the data to drive to say, is this the right thing for you? And what we're finding is in most cases, again, this 95 % retention rate, people are like, This has changed my life.

Yeah. I've had a lot of my friends say really positive things. It's helped them a lot. And I think that, to your point, I think once you start taking it, I think that what people have noticed is a real improvement. Yeah.

And then when they go off of it.

So sometimes they're like- That's another great thing.

They're like, I'm not sure if it's helping me. And then they're like, And then I went off of it, and I was like, Oh, yeah. Okay, that was helping me. I was helping with sleep, so I'm back on it. So that's another test, right? And so we really encourage people to like, Taylor, it's good for you.

I love the fact that it's new to me anyway. Maybe it's not new to everybody, but it's new to me. And so thank you for being on my show, and thank you for telling me and talking to me about this. Is there anything else I haven't asked you that I'm missing in Dolphins or you, or besides your crazy resume of badassery? Is there anything else that we can talk about and tell people?

I don't know how many badass nurses or nerds there are out there. A lot of badass nurses. I know.

That's true.

I'm going to check my notes to double check my side. For me, Jen, it's been an absolute pleasure chatting with you.

Pleasure's mine, honestly.

This is a movement. The Dolphins gave us a true gift, right? And again, this whole new perspective to be able to look at things. Ten years, over 100 peer-reviewed studies since then is now lighting. It's something we can no longer ignore. We have an opportunity to help truly improve global health. And we aren't alone anymore. Now, we have a giant community of scientists and doctors and moms and dads and kids. It's the movement is on. You're now part of it. So thank you. And it's just been a gift.

I appreciate this because, like I said, I always... I was telling you earlier, I always look for ways to sneak health into my children because if I tell them it's healthy, number one, they'll do the opposite because they're kids and they'll never believe anything I say. So I'll just tell them it's junk. And now that you're making a gummy for kids, it's a great little sneaky way to get a very essential molecule into them, which then helps them because now I didn't even know the amount of kids that are actually deficient. So you just did me a favor. So thank you. Thank you. It's been a pleasure. No, pleasure is all mine, guys. So check out Fattie 15. Check out Stephanie. She is, I'm telling you, just deep dive, and you'll be super impressed like me. So anyway, thank you for being with me today.

Thanks, Jennifer. Okay. Bye.