Transcript of My Husband Has Always Kept Our Finances A Secret From Me (I Want Out)

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Start budgeting for free today. Normal is broken, common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio, this is the Ramsey Show alongside the lovely Rachel Cruz. I'm Ken Coleman. The phone number to jump in is 825-5225. 828-825-5225. You ready to go?

Let's do this, Ken.

She's ready, folks. Joe starts us off in Newark, New Jersey. Joe, how can we help today?

Hi, sir. I got a small distribution business plus a honey tacking facility. We recently had a fire. I lost all my merchandise and goods. I owe SBA and credit card bills, 70,000 on the card, and SBA, about 60,000. I don't want to file bankruptcy, but I want to know what is the best way to move forward.

So you've lost everything in a fire? Is that what you said?

Yeah, there was a fire in the warehouse. Burned all my Yeah. Burn all my merchandise and my machinery.

Any insurance? Pick up some of that.

Unfortunately, I did not have insurance.

Oh, no. Okay. Wow. How long How long ago this happened, Joe?

This happened on January first, this January.

So have you been running the business at all for the last 50 days, or has everything been on pause?

Everything been on pause. Just had a little saving on a side that I am using to stay alive.

Oh, my gosh.

So you literally have no business to run. You can't just start up from scratch again. True or false?

I can start from scratch again.

What would you need to start from scratch?

Merchandise.

What were you selling?

I was selling A lot of stuff. I was selling tea, oil, cooking oil, essential oil, salt.

Do you have enough cash to be able to buy some products, some supplies, so that you have something to sell?

Yes, I have a little cash.

Okay. What's your question for us?

I am concerned by my SBA loan and my credit card that I have racked up, 70,000. I don't want to file bankruptcy. I want to know what is the way to go with these guys, and how do I explain them so this way at least they give me some time to get back in there.

You don't have anything to worry about on the credit card because you just call them up and you tell them what's going on. The fact of the matter is, if you were to file for bankruptcy, they're not going to get much. We talk all the time about people have to settle with credit card companies. That is the least of your worries. The credit card debt is down the road. We're going to have to get you back up in operationals. So whatever cash you have, that has to be stretched, I guess, between two key things, Rachel. One, taking care of your needs right now because you have no income. Two, buying some inventory that we can turn around, which helps us get paid.

Yeah. On the income side, Joe, that's what Ken is talking about, which is what you're going to have to start doing and/or getting another job where you can be making an income ASAP, right? That you may not have the leeway. This is to be working. But then the debt side of it, yeah, with the credit cards, especially if you are late and it goes into default, it'll go into collections. And in this case, I'm like, some people want to do that way, Joe, and they have the money to pay They just don't want to pay it, so they take that easy way out. You don't have money to pay it. So you legitimately, probably if you stop paying them, they will go to collections and you're going to have to tell them, Yeah, I don't have money. And then that's where the settlement can come in, that if you save some money. And a lot of the times, it's a nickel on the dollar, pennies on the dollar that they'll settle for. So there's a good chance that this 70,000, if you get some money saved, you may be able to settle some of this for 10, 15,000, right?

But that's one side of it. Is the SBA, who's it with? Is it bank or credit union, local bank, big bank?

Well, I applied SBA to Chase. Okay.

Yeah, you could go down the same route and talk to them. I think that's a little bit of a harder game to play than the- Although, here's the deal.

There is a shot at the humanness of your situation. And by the way, they're going to be very suspicious. But to the extent that you can show them, you're not making this up. This isn't some fraud in and around. Your world got rocked, and you hope you can get a real human on the phone, and you just tell them what's going on. And to the best of your ability, say, Here's what the next three months looks like for me. I've got just enough... Excuse me. I don't know what's going on with my voice all of a sudden. But I would be casting vision. Now, they may not care, but, Rachel, I think it's important to at least go, Here's where I'm at. I don't want to file bankruptcy. Yes. Because they know what happens if you file for bankruptcy.

They don't get anything. Yeah, that's right.

I do I think there is a humanness to this. I think, again, I'm such a take the bull by the horns guy. My advice is always going to come down to, it may not matter, but I certainly would cast vision with them for three. Here's what's going to happen in the next three months. In six months, I think I'm going to be able to start making payments again. I would do this with the credit card company as well, because you have an extraordinary circumstance. If you got a good track record, your payments were always on time, you make a case for why they should not harass you. Got you. You have nothing to lose with that approach and everything to gain.

That's right. And do not, by any means, Joe, give them access to your checking account or any accounts, okay? So this is keeping them at an arm's length, if you will, but seeing if they'll negotiate at any point. And usually with that, that settlement, you usually have to have the cash on hand to say, Hey, here's $5,000. Will you settle 30,000 of it? Or whatever the case may be. So You have a couple of lanes you're going to have to be thinking about. One, restarting the business, which is what you were saying at the beginning of the call, Ken. Also, just having money to pay your bills as we sit today. If you have a family and you're supporting people, figuring out some income, which means you may be doing a job that is different than what you were doing for a period of time, which is fine. We're just bringing in an income. Then to start talking to these creditors, credit card companies, and Chase about the debt, just to see if there's what that looks like. Again, it may take a few months of you not paying for it to get to that point.

But I'm with Ken. As proactive as you can be in these situations, the better off you're going to be, versus just going and filing bankruptcy or keeping us around for an ever and ever and hoping you can do some negotiations.

I think it's really important. Okay, bigger audience now. We're not picking on Joe. We feel bad for Joe. But what can we learn from Joe? There's two really key lessons for small business owners solopreneurs. Key that you catch this. Number one, when you need to insure something, don't put it off. Insure it. If you have something that is insurable, I'm not talking some scam. I'm talking like you've got a warehouse and you have product You need to insure yourself because these things happen and it can rock your world and poor Joe's dealing with it. Second lesson, and we teach this in Entree Leadership, which is our business division here at Ramsey Solutions, retained earnings. In your business, I don't care what you're selling, always make sure in those early days that you adopt this principle and you stay with it. That when you make any profit, that there is a percentage of that that goes to a good old fashioned savings account. We call it retained earnings, but it's just a savings account. You should have an emergency fund for your business, just like we teach for your personal life. I think he's done that to some degree.

Thankfully, he has some cash. Oh, yeah, no debt, of course.

Yeah, and that, too, right? No debt. The idea of what you do in your personal life to be wise with money Stay debt-free. Have savings that applies to you business owners. You don't get a pass on common sense. And so move at the speed of cash with your businesses. It creates zero risk and a lot of peace.

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Com. Use code Ramsey. All right, Susan is up next in Las Vegas. Susan, how can we help you today?

Hi. Yes. I have been married for six years to my husband. When we got married, he wanted me to sign a last minute prenup the day before we were going to go get married. Nothing was written up, so I didn't agree to sign anything because he wanted me to sign a blank piece of paper and have him, and his attorney was going to write up whatever he told him to. And I said, Well, we've never even discussed finances in our year of dating, so I'm not comfortable doing that.

Good for you.

Good for you. I've never even heard of such a crazy request.

Well, yeah. So The day before we were leaving to go out of state to go get married, he said, Well, I want you to come down to the attorneys and blah, blah, blah. Anyway, I just said, Well. And then he said, Well, don't you trust me? And I said, This is ridiculous. I said, We've never even talked about. About finances. And when we were dating, he was throwing money around like he had all this money, but I didn't know what he had or didn't have.

Sure.

Anyway, so anyway, fast forward, I didn't sign it. I'm not signing a blank piece of paper. That's ridiculous. And so anyway, so fast forward six years, finances have always been kept a secret. He gives me a small allowance. He puts in a joint checking account to cover whatever, small things on the side. He pays the main bills. I pay the groceries and other small things. But anyway, so now he, fast forward, he wants a divorce because I've finally put my foot down and said, I'm not going to live in secret anymore. You either become transparent because as far as I can tell from how he's acting, he's put his one business, I think it's like going in the hole because he's an accountant, and He went from having a dozen employees to having two. Anyway, I think he's just lost a lot of money, so he started another driving business on the side. He started that a year and a half ago, and he went into a ton of debt for that.

Susan, this is really bad, and I am so sorry you're going through this. What specifically would you like us to weigh in on today?

Well, I'm just wondering, with all this debt, I'm like, what am I responsible for? Is he really in debt or is he not? I mean, I don't really know what he's doing.

What's his reasoning? When you push him, to the point that he said, I'm going to divorce you, when you push him on, I want transparency, I want to see everything, what's his response? Is it, It's none of your business? Is it- Yes.

I just said, I need to know what's going on. Where are we and how can I help, and what's going on? And he just says, I'm not telling you. It's none of your business. Yeah.

This is an Overlord, not a husband. He's acting like some crazy, maniacal Overlord. I think let's answer your question as technically as we can, Rachel. If your name's not on it- Yeah, the debt, you're not going to be responsible for it. Then you're not responsible for it. But that doesn't really help you with your problem is that you don't know what he's done. You don't know what he's put in your name. Do you guys have a mortgage?

We have a mortgage. So right after we got married, he had the house appraised.

Are you on the mortgage?

No.

Your name's not on the mortgage?

Only his is? No.

So he bought the home about a year before we got- Great.

About a year and a half before we got married. Great news for you.

So then we got married, and then a couple of months later, he decides, he doesn't even tell me, but he's talking to the bank about refinancing. So the morning of, I said, Where are you going? He goes, I'm going down to the bank, I'm refinancing the house. And I said, Oh, well, that would have been a good thing to know. And Anyway, so he just goes down and does it. And I'm like, Well, wait a minute. We haven't even discussed. Do we want to put it on 20 or 30? Or what's the plan and how much is on?

But your name is not on it, even after the refi?

Nothing. Okay, which means you- He put my name. Okay, so that's hard because any equity that's built into this thing, either you don't have, which is a negative, but also if he is underwater 100 grand in business loans and he has to file bankruptcy, they're going to take the house and and use the equity in that. You know what I mean?

Our hope is that your name's not on any of his debt, but to Rachel's point, you're not going to benefit from the house.

From anything. From the house. Yeah. Susan, the way he's talking to you with money This doesn't... Your marriage overall- No, he doesn't engage in any marital- Okay. Anything. I think you have to make a decision, Susan. Either he changes and he chooses to be a spouse in this relationship, which means a commitment and transparency and oneness and a team and everything healing in all areas of life. I think not just money is what this sounds like. And if he doesn't do that, which you probably want, then you have to make a decision, Susan, on how you want the rest of your life to be. And we never are pro-divorce, right? I never wanted to get to this point. But I also want you to protect yourself in a situation like this, where all of it... It is the most controlled financial situation on his benefit and not yours, and that's unfair.

Well, and that's what he's told. I was trying to fix it and go to the counselor and stuff, and he just told the counselor, he just said, I set things up the way I wanted it. This is the way it's going to be.

Okay.

So then You have grounds here. We're not recommending divorce, but this is a marriage that's nonexistent. It's only on paper, and who knows what else he's hidden from you. Yeah, I don't know how forthcoming he's going to be in divorce proceedings, but he won't have much choice when you start getting down to it. At this point, it's like you have to take your losses, and you call it asking, What do I do about death that's in my name? If it's in your name, you're going to have to walk our process of the baby steps out It's a baby step one, baby step two as you start over. But the reality is you don't know and we don't know.

But don't you build any credit? What's that? Don't you build any credit after you're married? Any equity that is built- But it's not in your name.

After you're married.

It's not in your It's not your name. Here's the real answer, Susan.

But in our state law, it does say that any equity that's built from a marital perspective- Great.

From a marital perspective. Yeah.

Well, again, that's where you need a divorce lawyer. A good one.

Right. We don't know. But I'm saying, though, Susan, if he goes and tries to get any assets that he can to avoid a bankruptcy or something, you know what I mean? He's going to be finding anything, which scares me that there's going to be nothing for you. Well, I know.

That's what I'm like.

I'm going to be for least- Are you working right now? No. Okay. Do you all have kids?

No. I went to school for this last year. I just finished and I have $9,500 in school loans that I have to start paying back in six months. For what?

What did you go to school for?

Master esthetician. I have a cosmetology license. Great.

Can you go get a job in the next week or two as an esthetician or doing makeovers at Nordstrom or something like that? I don't know. I mean, I could probably go to a spa. Sorry. It was a trick question. The answer to my question is yes.

No, I can't go make enough money in the next month to support myself. That's the answer.

Well, no. Okay, but you got the wrong mindset. I didn't say to be able to make all that up. You have to now go get a job, like Rachel said, because you have to assume that you're You're not going to get any money out of this and you need a job because you're going to need to go rent an apartment or go find another divorced lady who needs a roommate. This is your reality right now, and I hate that I'm telling you this, but- It's that, or if you choose to stay in the marriage, you guys have No.

No, I'm just saying, either way, you're functioning as an individual, whether you stay in the marriage or not, which means you need money to your name, Susan. Yeah.

So go get a full-time job.

Because you don't even know. He could take everything tomorrow. I know. So how old are you? 59. 59. Okay. Do you have any retirement, anything in your name? No. No. Okay. Okay.

Urgency.

It's the word. I'm proud Thank you for going back to school, though. Yeah, absolutely. Seriously, you're making the right steps. Yeah. But there's some- Well, I just kept seeing this coming, and I'm like, I've got to have some more something as a foundation to be able to earn some money.

I'm just like what you're saying. I'm scared that I'm going to be left with nothing.

Yeah, but here's the deal. Here's the good news. You have a very good skill and you can work and make enough money as an esthetician. You can. So now you must.

But what do I do in the meantime if I don't have any access to funds?

You open up your own bank account. You're a grown woman. Your money goes into your account.

Go work at Target for now if you need to. Go work somewhere and you start your own financial life.

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Hey. My situation is basically I'm in a pretty toxic relationship, not abusive, but definitely needs to end. And I've been working on saving for a house, and it's been more pressing lately that I move out due to the nature of the relationship. So I found a home, and It's within my budget. I'm working with a Ramsey agent. I have no debt, but the home needs pretty significant repairs, and I legitimately cannot find another one. It's a seemingly good value in the property, but it does need repair. So I don't know what to do and how to move forward.

Yeah. My caution always when someone goes and buys a home in an urgent situation, it's not always It's not always the best purchasing mindset to be in, if you will, right? So if you had called and said you had been looking for a while and you find this and you really love it, and you're like, there's some more... I don't know. There's one situation I may say, yes. I'm a little concerned that because you're running from a situation urgently to get out of, which that's great.

It's not really urgent for what it's worth. It's been prayed through and thought through for years, and I just now have the ability. So I don't know what the right move is.

Well, my actual question is, you said, I have some concerns. I'd love to know what your most pressing concerns are about this move.

It definitely needs new electric, the entire home. It's very old. So I'm looking at 10 to 12K for that. It needs a new roof within the next several years. It needs a new porch. Those two things combined are probably another 30 or so. It really looks like it needs about 50 to 70,000 worth of work within about a five to seven year span. Now, I can handle it. That's the thing, is I can actually handle it, but I wanted to truly make a 20 year mortgage work. I couldn't get a 15, but I couldn't afford the 15. I could make a 20 year I wanted to make that work. But in my head now, I do need to leave the relationship. I don't actually qualify for an apartment. I can get a house, but I can't get an apartment because I have no credit because I do what Dave Ramsey says.

We have a lot of Dave Ramsey listeners who can get into an apartment.

I understand. I'm in the low 600s, and everywhere around me needs a 640, but I did qualify for a mortgage with about 6%.

Well, Well, again, I'm going to challenge you that there's a way. This is, again, you go in and you get past the policy and you go talk to a person and you go, Here's why my credit score is what it is. Let me show you my entire financial life. If you sit down with a manager in a place like that, I think there's a way where there's a will, there's a way. But let's go back to this, the house itself. You're the one that called us with concerns about this house, and then you just said, I can handle the costs. But I just wonder if this is the right house. I also wonder, back to Rachel's point, I bet you there's some elderly folks who have a room over a garage, be happy to take your money as you're in a transition. This just doesn't seem on the evidence that you've given me, like this is a really solid decision. I don't think you think it's solid either, and that's why you called. I would not do it for those reasons. It's an old dilapidated house. It's going to have way more problems than you've just identified.

You're moving into this house only because you think you can't get an apartment. And what you've done is you've narrowed your choices falsely to this, and yet your gut and your brain and heart are going, This is probably not a good idea. Why don't you call two strangers and get their take? That's where I'm at. So that all tells me- Or your guys are strangers.

We're friends. Yes, Steve.

I'm not your friend. I'm not Steve's friend. The point stands. I appreciate the respect that you called us, but we're completely objective. And I'm telling you, it's screaming bad decision.

I would rather see you say, Yes, I have three homes I've been looking at, and out of the three, this is probably the best deal. Maybe more work and all of it, but I have multiple options, or I have an apartment that I... You know what I'm saying? Whenever there's only a one solution to a problem, that's usually when people make bad financial decisions. I'm not saying specifically this is a bad decision, but all the circumstances around it give us some red flags from what we've seen. And again, you said it's not urgent, but you're like, I need to leave this relationship, but I can't live in an apartment. So it does feel like, you say it's not, but it does feel like it's become the only solution right now for you. Is that true? Absolutely, yeah. So that's what we don't like. I'd rather you, again, Have option A, B, and C. And you may hate B and C, but at least there's other ways out that you can figure out that it's not just the one. So I would run the numbers. Usually, homes like this, as you probably know, Steve, you're smart guy.

It's always more expensive than what you think. There's always more issues than what you think. If you choose to walk into that, which a lot of people do because they'll have the fixture upper, and that's what they know when they're comfortable with it, that's fine. If you have the money for it, and that's what you want to do, it's It's just all the data points around it give us hesitation and pause. I would call on a few more apartments, Steve, honestly. We did that a few years ago. I mean, it's here in Nashville. It's not in Hartford, Connecticut. They were, I don't know, 15 apartment complexes that were called. I think, I don't know, maybe five of them said no, but more than half said yes, that you don't have to have credit card. If you have first month's rent, last month's rent, all of it, you're going to be able to find a place. This house is not the only option.

Those policies are designed, obviously, to be a filter for people that have made bad financial decisions because I don't want to rent a place to somebody who's not going to pay. But you have a very different narrative, I'm sure, and you can prove it. You got to go sit down and prove it to somebody and go, Let me tell you why I've got this score, which flagged me. I think that's far more doable than you think. But again, if I was coming out of a toxic relationship, Rachel, and I loved your advice, I just want to go land somewhere for a bit, and I want to be flexible as I possibly can.

Home purchase, you do not want to rush into.

It's certainly not an old- And justify it.

Do you know what I'm saying? It's like, Oh, it's going to be fine. At the end of the day, you're like, Is it, though? Is it really the best option right now?

Yeah. Here's what I know about really old houses, because I have a friend, you and I have a mutual friend. I will not say their name, and they have a very nice old house in this area. It's almost like a landmark. I swear to you, every time I talk to him, he gripes about all the things he's doing in that dadgum house.

Yeah, it's a lot.

My point is, it's more than the porch and the roof, and it's just a mess. Electrical, it is. Yikes. That's why we're staying away from it. Let's go to Andrew in Phoenix, Arizona. Andrew, how can we help?

Hey, my friend. Appreciate you taking the call. My daughter was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes at the end of October of last year. Because we're getting out of debt, we had the $1,000 in the emergency savings, but we blew through that in about two days. My question is, we had great friends who stepped in and helped us. Everybody listening who knows type 1 knows that it's not the same as type 2, so type 1 is a little bit more involved. One of my best friend's daughters just was diabetes with that.

We've been able to recover. It's a lot.

Yeah, it's a lot. There's a lot. We've recovered from that initial. We've been able to put 2,000 back in the bank. My wife started about seven sinking funds just to get our money in order. But my question is, because of this, should we put more into the savings? I'm sorry.

It's okay.

It's still a lot. Four months later.

Totally understand.

She's 11 years old. Honestly, we have four kids of the four. We're glad it was her because she's I'm an independent woman. I will handle this. This is my responsibility. Real quick because we're- Yeah, I know.

No, no, no. What I'm saying is we're going to hold you over, okay? So that you can get a chance to gather yourself. This is heavy stuff, man. So no apologies. I got three kiddos. We get it. Rachel's got three. It's a lot. It's a lot.

Yes, one of my best friends, because we're heading into break, but her daughter was last December. It was horrible. Horrible. It's been a A full year. It is so much, Andrew. It is a lot. The scariness and the tears and fear, that is real. But from the financial perspective, hold on the line because we're going to get back- Yes, we're coming back to you. To talk through how you guys can get an order financially as you're Maybe step two.

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All right, so we're going to get back to Andrew in Phoenix, Arizona. A dad whose heart is really, really heavy. 11-year-old daughter, type 1 diabetes. We're going to dive into the money question that we've got here. Andrew, coming back to you. I hope you had a chance catch your breath. You're such a good dad. Let's walk through your money question for us.

Basically, we're taught to have the thousand in the bank while you're getting out of debt. But because of her illness, we have Good Samaritan Health Insurance, so we're self-paid. But they've now put my daughter as it's a terminal illness. And so we only have a health insurance for this situation for, I think, another 30 days. And then they won't really cover any of her medication because of the type of plan that we have. And so we're looking at other health insurance options. I'm not really worried about that. I'm worried about in the event that she has an emergency and I have to take her to the hospital or I have to go see a specialist and there's money that's demand up front on top of a house issue or something like that happening. And believe me, when she got diagnosed in that first week, my other daughter got hurt. We did have a house issue, and this is how we blew through our $1,000 within five days. But again, we amazing friends who stepped in and helped us. We have been able to get $2,000 back into the bank. But should we put more away while we're still trying to pay off debt?

Or do you guys feel like, No, that $2,000 is okay. Keep tackling your debt We are cash flowing our medication. We are cash flowing her insulin. We are cash flowing her Dexcom patches. We are doing that.

Okay. How much do you make a month and how much is going towards medical expenses each month?

I bring home after taxes and paying ties and offering, I bring home about 72. And with the medical expenses, we're spending about six or $700 a month. Okay. But we're hoping the next few months that she will get approved to get an insulin pump. That's going to be $5,000. That only lasts three or four years, plus the insulin that goes with that, obviously. So these are things that we're looking for. We don't want our kids to feel like they're being punished because of this. So we're taking care of them at the same time with the things that they're trying to do. We're not trying to take them out of what they're doing with their extra cooker activities. And we're not going further into debt with them doing their things. We're cash flowing everything. Again, I just wonder because of the type of- Yeah. I think- Yeah. Should we put more away?

Well, I think the key is to get a stable number eventually. I think four months in, you're probably not able to do that because there's so many things in the air right now with, is she going to get the pump? How much is insurance going to cost? Are we able to get more insurance, new insurance? There's a lot floating around right now. Because of how new this all is, yes, I'm good with a bigger buffer right now just to have some breathing room for you guys to make sure that she's taken care of. Our families are the number one priority. Getting out of debt's amazing, and we love that. But when there's medical stuff, we say, Pause, take care of your family. But also this is going to be an ongoing for the rest of her life, right? She will have this. So I do want you to get to a place, though, where you can say, Okay, here is a regular number that we're comfortable in month to month. Let's put that in the budget. And then beyond that, we're going to go back and freaking tackle this debt, because how much debt do you guys have?

We have two credit cards that have medical debt on. My wife had the bad COVID a couple of years, and we're still paying on that.

And- How much? And then another- How much is all of it?

With the car and the two credit cards, right at 34,000. 34,000, okay. My wife has this on track within the next 14 months, 16 months to have that paid off.

Amazing. And that's with- My wife is amazing.

She's figuring... My wife is phenomenal.

That's awesome. She's figuring all this out.

By the way, you can speed that process up at any time. It's just going to require more time of you to work, sell some things. You can be more aggressive on that time. Oh, I know.

I know that. But at the same time, my family needs me present Isn't it? Totally good. I'm a mechanic by trade. I'm a mechanic by trade, and so I work hard in the house.

You're a good dad, Andrew. You all's life- You're doing great. Your life just got turned upside down. Yes. And we get these calls, whether it's spouses that got diagnosed with cancer. I mean, this is the stuff that happens in life, and this is one of the reasons why getting your finances in order is such a gift to your family. So everything that you all did up until this point of getting out of debt was a blessing, right? You don't have what you had before this because you guys have been paying it off, which is amazing. So I would get some stability in this. And then I think there is a point that you got to press play again on life and on this plan so that you guys don't have to stress about it, right? So again, give yourself some grace. Give yourself some time. Everything's okay on the money side. But I would you and your wife sit down and just say, Okay, once we get the insurance figured out, check. The insulin pump I know, that's a big deal. That's a huge checkmark for them. So check that off. And then I always like to look at the months and just say, Okay, it's February.

By June or July, we want all of this figured out, and then we're going to press play and get intense again. And then by Next April, we're going to be debt-free, whatever it is. So have some grace, but also be still looking out there to say, When can we press play back on this gazelle intensity? But we want to have some stabileness in her life and you guys as a family.

Yeah. Thank you for the call, Andrew. You guys are going to make it. You're doing a great job. All right, let's go to Sam in Lafayette, Louisiana. Sam, how can we help?

Hey, guys. Thank you so much for taking my call. You guys have just changed my life and my wife's life for the better. I really do appreciate you all taking my call.

Thank you.

Thank you. I understand Dave's traditional advice as it relates to student loans. My question is a student loan question. I'm a physician, and I have a lot of kids, and I've often wondered if my kids want to pursue medicine, is it reasonable to suggest that they do take out loans for medical school, but to live small after they finish and to pay these loans off very aggressively like I did? My reasoning for this, and something I grapple with because we're very davish about a lot of things, but I really do feel like medical training is definitely a young person's game. Plenty of sleepless nights, 80-hour work weeks. It's very difficult for a college grad with really no skills to save what can be $200,000 for medical school. That's just tuition before housing and food. In your early 20s, you're often married and starting families, too. My question is specifically for my kids. I wonder, no med school loans at all if they decide to pursue medicine, or is it reasonable able to take out loans prudently but pay it off very aggressively?

Do you know right now if Ken Coleman and I said, Gosh, Sam, you're so right. We didn't even think about medical. You should get student loans. Dave and Cabo would be turning over right now.

I know.

We will never, ever say- I was trying to catch all on the day when Dave wasn't on the studio.

Yeah, well, I don't think you understand how our employment must work. Here's a couple of real questions. How old are the kids? Sure.

Well, I have seven kids, my oldest is 11.

Okay. How much money do you make as a doctor?

About 550 to 600,000.

Okay. What baby step are you on?

We have no debt just paying off the house at this point.

Okay. How much are you putting away each month for all 11 of these kids? I mean, excuse me, five kids? How much are you putting away? Seven. Seven.

Yeah, I intend to fund their undergraduate education. But when it comes to medical school or professional school, I just have no intention of it. I think that would be pretty detrimental to our overall financial health and family I'm sorry.

Okay, well, so there's the answer to your question. You paying cash for it is detrimental to you, but you're willing to, because you did it, that you think they can do it. I did think this was the wrong question First of all, your oldest is 11. We have no idea what medical school is going to look like. Honestly, things are changing so rapidly. Then why don't you invest in their med school? This doesn't even That makes sense. I'm going to stop myself because here's the deal. You don't know what they're going to do. So you're asking a question about kids. Do you have no idea if they're going to go into medicine?

Sam, you make a million dollars every two years. Save for your kid if they want to go to medical school. You're not going to ruin all.

I was going to say that. Oh, yeah. I don't for my kids. Save for grad school.

If my kids decide to not go to college, I'd be, I mean, sure. I just want them to live a virtuous life. My question is not necessarily for me. It's just that broad traditional student.

Oh, no. Yeah, there's ways. We have talked to people that have gotten medical degrees because they've done different programs and situations. It happens. But no, we're not taking out loans. We'll never, ever say to take out student loans.

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Go to healthtrustfinancial. Com today. That's healthtrustfinancial. Com. Welcome back to The Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union studio. Alongside Rachel Cruz, I'm Ken Coleman. Glad you're with us today. The phone number is 888-825-5225. Dylan is joining us now in Lincoln, Nebraska. Dylan, how can we help?

Hi. I am in $90,000 I have student loan debt, not including a mortgage. And me and my fiancé are living paycheck to paycheck. I'm wondering how we can further our life without living like that.

Is it 90,000 combined, Dylan, you and your girlfriend, or just yours, your debt?

Just mine. She was, luckily, a good enough athlete to where she didn't have to pay for college.

Okay. So yours is 90,000, and it's all student loans? Yes. Okay. And how much are you making a year?

I make 55 before taxes, roughly 40 after.

Okay. And how much is she making a year?

She makes about 30 before taxes.

Okay. What does she do for a living?

She is a receptionist at a vet, a vétéran, a client.

Okay. Yeah. And what do you do?

I work in low voltage. Okay. So cameras and whatnot.

Okay. And you guys are engaged? Is that what you said? Yes. Great. When's the wedding? August. August. So exciting. Okay. I would say, first and foremost, I would not combine your wedding until August. It's not that far away, but just as a rule of thumb, I don't want her paying on your student loans right now until you guys are officially married. And then once you are, you guys are going to combine your money and look to say, Okay, we have a $85,000 income before taxes, household, and What does our life need to look like to live within these means? Do we need to be renting somewhere cheaper? Do we need to be taking on or finding more work? She probably has the most opportunity, I would say. She's making 30. There's probably other opportunities out there for her to be- What is her field?

She has a psychology degree.

Well, that's just her degree. What field does she want to be in?

She likes the Well, she likes a vegetarian field, and she wants to further pursue that and go back to school for that. But at the moment, it's not in our budget.

Obviously not. So what is she doing now to make 30 grand?

She is just a receptionist, a front desk gal at a vet clinic.

Okay, well, so since being a vet and going to school, and vet school is insane from everything I've heard, as far as cost, let's go get a better paying job, or let's go I got a second job, and let's tackle this debt. You guys are double income, about ready to be double income, no kids. This is the moment to get after. She's a former athlete, if I heard this right. So let's set some goals in place. She knows goals. Let's look at how do we increase her income from 30 to 50, okay? Whether that's through two jobs or a better primary job. She's got a psych degree. Let's just see what's out there. This is the moment where you all are all in on ideating. Let's get out there and let's make more money because you guys can do this. If you take Rachel's advice and you go all in after you combine income, you guys can knock this out and not be paycheck to paycheck. But cutting costs and raising income is how you do this.

Okay. How much is your rent right now?

Well, we don't own the house, and our mortgage is 1400 a month.

You do own it or you don't?

We do.

Okay. So you have a house together, and it's 1400 a month. Okay. Which isn't terrible. And then where else is your money going?

So we got the mortgage, and then it's an older house. So especially now in the winter times, the electrical bill and gas bill skyrockets because, like I said, it's an older house. We're working on redoing it slowly because of financials.

Okay, well, so how much is the heat a month? What's the number? How much you pay?

Gas is around like $250 a month in the colder months.

Okay. And what else? I'm doing a rough budget for you, and I got 3400 left out of your monthly income. Where else is it going?

And then I have 750 in student loans. Yeah. And then electrical is around 200 to 250, depending on the month. In the summer, it's a little bit more, but not much.

Okay.

And other than that, grow trees. And we just got done paying off a couple of pet bills because we have a dog.

Okay. So, yeah, I want you guys to do a written budget because I'm sitting here, I'm just doing rough math. I'm not saying that this is exactly what everything is. You should have around two grands-ish left. 1800, two grands. And I'm like, Where's that? And It's probably eating out and some target runs or whatever. It's life. I understand stuff. But I think if you guys do a written budget, you're going to feel like you got a raise. And I mean, a strict budget. We're shopping at Aldi, we're not going out to eat. We're doing nothing and we're doing food for... It's just the two of you for 400 a month, which can be done. I think it is a level for you guys of actually living on a plan and being pretty frugal until this 90 grand has paid off and working extra.

Pausing the little housing projects. If it's not an emergency and it's a $250 little thing we'd like to fix, no, we're not doing that. We signed up to live in an old house. We've got to focus on this debt. So that means we're camping a little bit, right? Again, emergency common sense here. But other than that, if this floorboard creeks and it's going to cost $300 to fit, sorry, the floorboard is going to creak. So Rachel's right, and I just want to throw that in there because you need the right mindset in order to adopt what she's talking about, which is a strict budget. So you go, What does strict mean? And strict means the four walls, Rachel. Yeah. Explain that. I'll give it back to you. But I think that that's what they've got to have. It's like, we are saying there are certain things that we are not going to spend money on and simplifying so that we can be super strict.

Yeah, that's right. And if she ups her income, Dylan and you guys get an extra, gosh, 1,500, 2 grand a month just from a salary job. Game changer. That's huge. You know what I mean? So it is hard. How old are you guys?

We're both 23.

Okay. So there is a hard reality, Dylan, of coming out of college, getting your first jobs, which are always entry-level, you're starting at the bottom, and seeing how expensive life is. Life is not as You look at your parents and say, Oh, my gosh, look at the life they're living, or people 15 years older than me. There's a reality of starting off, and you all are feeling that. You know what I mean? So there's something really beautiful about it. I think there's something that creates and you all some really good habits to tighten up. But it's a little bit of you get hit in the face with reality that it's not an Instagram world. When you actually got to make the money and you actually see after you pay taxes and insurance and everything, you're like, Oh, wow.

Everybody wants to own a home. I thought it was going to be- I'm like, You should probably enjoy renting and let the supervisor take care of all your problems for two years. Because as soon as you own a home, you got problems. I'm not in any way knocking the dream of a home. Sure. But it's not all it's cracked up to be. Okay? I mean, you could talk me into going right now in some apartment where I don't have to do anything. I'd change my mind in two hours, but for two hours, it would be. Everyone is at risk of identity theft. I don't care if you're a hermit living off the grid listening to the show on a battery-powered radio. All of your data collected by every company you've ever done business with lives online. Your bank, your doctor's office, retailers, the apps on your phone, the gas station where you have loyalty rewards, they all store your info online, making them ripe for a cyber attack or data breach. No matter how careful we are, once steeds hack a company, they've got that data forever, meaning you could be victimized at any moment.

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Hi, Ken. Hi, Rachel. Hey, so admittedly, I've been Dave-ish for seven years, but two days ago, I became debt-free.

Congratulations.

Congratulations.

Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that. My fiancée, the woman of my dreams, and I just got engaged this past August. She also started law school about five hours away and is taking some student loans for that and starting to accumulate some more debt. We're considering a couple of things. One, independent, and we're not married yet, should I just start building my emergency fund and saving for a wedding, or should we maybe rush the engagement management, maybe a lope to a small wedding and start cash flowing law school.

That one.

That one, okay.

I was going to say- He gave me two. Whichever one you want. There's not a right or wrong, necessarily.

Did I say one was right or one was wrong? He called the show. He gave us two scenarios, and I voted.

And Ken said the- Well, maybe I can throw in something else then.

I'm not super fulfilled with my current job in the place I'm working at. Not necessarily what I'm doing.

I'm even more concrete now on this decision.

Okay, we'll keep going. So what do you think of? Yeah, sorry.

And then living five hours away. So I commute over almost every weekend to spend time with her. But if I keep my current job, we can cash flow everything, but maybe not live with each other for the next two years.

Okay, that's absurd.

Wait, when's the wedding?

Well, he doesn't know. That was part of the question.

Oh, yeah.

The I love for a fair say. He's like, Do we save up and do the wedding? I know you love a good wedding, or do I elope? I got more questions. I was having a little bit of fun- Yeah, no, it was great.

With the certainty of it.

But okay, so let's go back to, If I stay in my job that I'm not fulfilled in, I can cash flow the law school, but we can't actually live in the same city. Did I hear that correctly?

You heard that correctly.

That's a terrible idea. The question is, Can Can you start to look in the area where she is, and is that where you two would like to start your life, where she currently is? That would be the first question.

Yeah, we've agreed that's not necessarily where we want to spend any time after she finishes school.

It's going to take her, what, two years from now?

Yeah, about two. May of 2028 is going to be the graduation target.

Can you find a job where she is, where she's going to law school? Do you have a job that's pretty easy to transfer and make similar types A similar type of money that you are now?

I would probably take around a 10 % pay cut to live in that side of the state. But I could probably find something similar.

And how much would it be? How much would you be making?

Probably closer to 89 to 90,000 instead of A hundred to 105.

What is she doing now?

She is part-time for a law firm, a family law firm, and she is doing legal intake and processes for them while she's in school.

She has started law school?

Yes.

Is that helping pay for her? Is it all what she's doing now?

Yeah, it helps basically cover the cost of living. She got a really good scholarship that's non-conditional, which is awesome. The out-of-pocket cost for tuition is $13,000 a semester.

That's not bad for law school. I think you moved to her temporarily. I have a plan.

Rachel has a say She has a plan. I just wrote it down. Stay tuned. She has a plan. It's right here. This is what I would do, Adam. What? Okay. I would plan for a December wedding. You got 10 months, okay? Okay. If you can make similar money, I'm leaving. I'm going to go next to the fiancé. You know what I mean? A hundred %. So I'd go rent. You go rent an apartment that you both like and say, Okay, this is probably we're going to live for two years. You stay there, stay at the new apartment, and you start working at them. You start saving, saving, saving, saving, saving. Spend a little bit of money and have a little wedding. It doesn't have to be big or wonderful or fancy. And then you're going to use some of that savings and/or savings in the future after you guys get married to cash flow the rest of law school. But I'd move on this. If you guys are really going to get married, get married. I don't like this two-year hanging out.

Yeah, but you pushed him out to December. I like your plan.

Oh, you'd go faster? I would literally- I just have a December wedding, and I like December weddings, so that's what I would have planned.

This is why I do what I do on this show, because I am agnostic about weddings. I'm very public about this lately. It's come up a lot on shows. I'm very strong position that no guy ever wants to go to a wedding. It's only their wives. So what are we doing? We're spending money on something that, quite frankly, we could just do very intimate, small group of people, take some really nice pictures, skip the trip.

True. Okay, fine. Move it up to what? May?

Whatever, now. Like, now. I'd go get a job first in this other place. And then when I got the job, and somewhere around the same week that I started the new job, we would go get a pastor or a justice of the do a small little ceremony, get married, combine finances, move forward, and then eventually do a really amazing honeymoon to celebrate it. But I understand what I'm saying does not play well with women.

I understand. It was half of the equation.

I understand that what I'm- She's also someone that just chose to go to law school, and there's a little bit of like, Hey, I chose this, so then this over there is going to have to give, right?

Trade-off. Yeah, it's fair.

What do you think, Adam? Did we cover everything?

Yeah, no. I think you covered everything quite a bit. I appreciate all of that. I think it gives me some real clarity on finding a job on the other side of the state and seeing what's going on. I'm just starting a new life.

I love that you're going to cash flow law school. That's amazing. That will be the greatest decision that you ever make.

How smart is she to get that job that she was getting and scholarship and all of it?

The fact that they can cash flow law school, Rachel, is why I'm so bullish on, let's just skip the $20,000 or whatever. Because a small wedding now cost- I know.

It's expensive. It's absurd. When you can renew the vows and have a big thing there. In five years or something.

I should get some online license, and I'll just marry people live on the show.

Just Pastor Ken.

Yeah. Just get Adam and his fiance on a video call. I'll do the thing. We'll marry him. We'll do a Doing it. It's great.

Then it's done.

For people who want to move quickly like me. Yes, it's fair. Efficiency is the game. I love it. We get fun social questions, Rachel, from time to time. Yes, we do. I've picked out one for you over here. All right? Give it to me. You like the TikTok, don't you?

No. Aren't you over there? I don't like the TikTok, the Instagram.

Let me see if I have one from the grand. I don't, but I'm going to give you one from TikTok because you're super cool.

They're younger than me, but go ahead.

This is Hayden from TikTok. Why do you recommend term life insurance over It's a whole life insurance?

Who was his name? Hayden. Hayden.

Yeah, he's on the talk, throwing it your way. I'm trying to sound cool, and it occurred to me that doesn't sound cool at all. No. Okay.

Okay. Basic reasons is whole life is significantly more expensive than term life. And with whole life insurance, they're mixing. Why it's expensive is because you have this investment inside the insurance. So always remember, keep your investments and your insurance separate, because when you combine them like that, you get a crappy rate of return. Whole life insurance, there's so many different names for it, but there's so many hoops of... When you die, they keep a certain amount. You don't get as much. I mean, it's an exhausting product that actually ends up screwing the consumer in the long run, where you could have had, which you should, term life insurance, if someone is dependent upon your income, that's significantly cheaper. And then whatever you would have paid for the whole life, just invest that and you will come out so ahead. We did We did this on the show, it was maybe last week. Someone had a whole life policy that their grandparent opened for them when they were seven years old. They were 40 something, and they were going to cash it out. And there was only, I want to say, 90 grand in there after all of that.

When we I said, if they had paid and we had did the investments, it would have been... It was over a million dollars. Make you sick, your stomach. It's unbelievable what you are missing out when you are using your insurance as an investment. Don't do that. And that's what a whole life does. It's usually a family, a young family member selling it, too. They come out of school.

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Today's question comes from Steve in Minnesota. My cousin is a home builder and needs $150,000 to fund his business. He asked me to loan him $75,000 and my brother to loan the other $75,000. He says that he has all of his assets in property that hasn't sold. I'm concerned he's over-leveraged and won't be able to pay it back. Should I do it because he's family? I mean, my short answer is no. I wouldn't be loaning money to family regardless. If you have the 75,000 in cash and you want to give it as a gift to help the old cousin out, you're welcome to do that. I probably wouldn't. So I wouldn't because it's a loan, and I wouldn't because of the assumption that just because it's family, you're supposed to help all the time. No. But if you guys are really close and you're like, Hey, I don't know, this is Steve. What do you think Steve's cousin's name is? What would you guess?

Steve from Minnesota. So I feel like I need to go with a strong Minnesota, Midwest name. Brian? I'm going to go Owen.

Oh, wow. Okay. So Owen. Maybe. Yeah. So if you love Owen- Or a Ben. And you and Owen are... Oh, my gosh. My friend Ben is from Minnesota.

Oh, that's right.

Yeah. But yeah, if you and Owen are brothers, you're really cousins, and you're like... Listen, am I giving you a situation? Steve's a millionaire, and Steve's like, poor Owen and Betsey, his wife, they need help. Steve is not a millionaire. And we're going to help him. Then you can. You can give if that's what you choose to do. Sure. But that's probably not the situation.

There's a reason why he's asking for 150,000 from you and his brother. I know. And goodness gracious, you've got to trust your gut on these things. If somebody presents like that every time, he answered his own question. Just a little object lesson, really quick. I'll go right back to the phone call. But you need to hear this, folks. If you ask somebody this question or you say, I'm concerned. He is over leveraged and won't be able to pay it back. Should I do it because he's family.

He's probably over leveraged.

No, the leading sentence, I'm concerned he's over leveraged and we'll be able to pay it back. Ding, ding, ding. There's your answer.

I think sometimes people just- Follow your concern. Need someone else to say no.

We really should say, Would you like to hate this guy in the future? Because you're going to hate him when he doesn't pay you back. Terrible.

The whole loaning money to family, you all, it- I'm sorry. Don't do it. It ruins the relationship. Do not do it.

Oh, such a hard pass.

So I believe no, unless you're a multimillionaire.

I don't care what his name is. Christina is up next in West Palm Beach, Florida. Christina, how can we help?

Hi. Thank you for taking my call. I really appreciate it. Sure. I'm going to try to be straight to the I'm 56 and my husband is 57. We make about 200 to $250,000 a year, and we have a networth of $2 million. That $3 million networth is made up of our primary residence, which is worth about $2. 2 million dollars, and we have no mortgage on it. We also own an investment property that's a townhouse in the same area where we live that's worth about 350, and we have a $200,000 mortgage on it. So of our $3 million in networth, $2,350,000 is property and property that is unrealized because it's sitting there as it is. In our retirement account, we have about $500,000. We have well over six months of living expenses, so about $150,000. And that makes up where we get to the $3 million. So here's my question. My question is, in about seven to eight years, we're going to probably want to retire. We'll be around '65. If we sell our primary house right now, it's worth 2. 2 million. As I said, we have no debt on it, so we would get the 2.

2 minus real estate commissions minus taxes, capital gains, and all of that. And then in seven to eight years, the money that's left over about $1. 9 million based on investing it conservatively, like you guys have talked about, and putting into a good solid mutual fund, that 1. 9 could be really worth close to 3. 8 somewhere in that range. So then when we're retiring, now we're up towards a 3. 8. And of course, over the next seven to eight years, we're not going to retire. I work from home, so I can be mobile. My husband has a small business that he would sell. It gives us a different chapter in our life that we're ready to start, we think, but we're nervous, which is why we're calling you. As a matter of fact, I'm calling you. My husband has no idea, but we're calling you. And because it seems like... So we would be working for the next five, seven, eight years. So we'd still be dumping money into our retirement.

We would still be putting money away. Christina, if you just... Let me ask you this. Let's pretend for a second you sold the investment property. Okay, just go with me. You'll net out about $150,000. Add that to your $500,000. So you're at $650,000 in retirement right now. You're not going to stop working. How much could you guys be putting away in retirement for the next five years? How much extra do you think they'll be in there?

We could probably put away now that our home is paid off. And if you were to sell the investment property, which really is an expense just probably $15,000 a year, we could probably put away into retirement.

So another $3. 50.

Yeah. Okay, so with that, with the money doubling every seven years, we'll shorten it to five years, just for the math's sake, you probably would have around $1. 5 million without selling the home. Okay. If you run that out through retirement, my question to you is, and you may want to sit down with the SmartVestor Pro to look at all these numbers more specifically, but would that be enough for you guys? No. Because how much do you live on a year?

About $200,000 a year that we live on.

So you live on basically everything you make? You make 200? Oh, I'm sorry.

I'm sorry. Yeah, we make 200. I'm sorry. No, we live well above or below our means. We probably live on about $95,000 to $100,000. We put the rest into retirement and paying down mortgages and things like that over the years. Yeah, so probably closer to $100,000.

Yeah. So I would run those numbers out and just see what it looks like, because ideally, you don't want to touch the The nest egg. But you'd be hitting it pretty close. You'd be squooking by at 1. 5 million.

To that end, I'm wondering, have you guys discussed staying in this house long term, even as you are aging? Do you want to stay in your current home that's paid for, or is that at some point we're going to downsize or relocate?

Our home is a very small home. It's a two bedroom, one bath. Our home is not worth the money. It's worth the 2. 2 is the dirt. We live in an area where people are coming down and knocking down the old home and building big, huge houses. For us, the house that we want to stay in, we're getting to an age where we want to be in a community, not a downtown area where there's a lot of Airbnbs and people coming and going and people staying for two months out of the year and then leaving. We like to be in a community where it's people more... I don't know, maybe.

Do you have a community in mind? Yeah. Do you have a community in mind right now that you guys see that it would be fun to live in?

No. We have looked into staying in Florida and perhaps It's maybe going to a different area of Florida, maybe the Tampa region, or maybe the Jacksonville.

Okay, yeah. So I would just look, go online and just look at some places, see how much those are. Because depending on the city in Florida, depending on the community, depending on how far you are from the Coast or not, the prices are going to vary. And I would see, what could you get if you would get what? 2. 2? Is that what you said? And golly, a million bucks. What would that buy? I don't know. Do you know what I mean? It could be an expensive area.

That's what I'm saying. I think it's worth the exercise in the chance that you might go, Well, let's go ahead and cash out of our current home right now, and we take the windfall of that, and let's get that invested, to Rachel's point. I'm saying that's possible to put that money in, and you guys live a little bit less expensive, maybe in another place. Just all stuff to be thinking through. You guys aren't in bad shape, but you're not in great shape. However, at any point in time, 2. 2 million by selling that current home as you're older, that puts you in good shape.

Yeah. And Christina, the good thing is, too, from a mental perspective, it's a small house. It's the dirt that's expensive. And so there's a part that, God, you get 2. 2 million for not a big house. So it's not like you're going from a nice big house to a small one downsizing. You actually may get the same size house somewhere else for half the price. So nothing's on fire. I don't think that you need to rush by any means. But yeah, here in the next two years, you guys really start thinking, okay, if we take these numbers and expand it out, could we live on this? And do we need to sell this? It sounds like you want to sell. You don't want to be with next to all the Airbnbs. I think your mind's made up on selling. So I'd do it sooner than later if you guys want.

Tax season is coming up fast, which means a lot of you are paying more attention to your money and maybe realizing the holiday damage. So if you're trying to clean up the budget and start the year strong, cutting your phone bill is an easy win. With Boost Mobile, keep the phone you love and pay just $25 a month for unlimited data, talk, and text forever. No contracts, no traps, just predictable savings that help you stay in control. Switch now at boostmobil. Com/ramsey. Restrictions apply. See website for details. Okay, breaking news. I love to do a little breaking news every once in a while. Oh my gosh.

I thought you were being for real. I was like, Oh my gosh, what?

You just killed the fact that I'm not being for real. I'm trying to act here.

I think of all the current events happening.

You just stepped right on it. Did something happen while we were on break? Folks, you got to know this about Rachel. She's lovely. She's exactly who you think she is. She's very literal. I'm being sarcastic about something I got to tell you about.

I knew you were. I was playing a little bit, but you're like, We got breaking news. There's a lot of things happening in the news right now. We are on pins and needles.

Well, this is breaking news. Okay, go. Ransy style. The VIP package on the Live Like No One Else Cruise has sold out. What? I I told you it was breaking right here.

What's it when they had the newspapers back in the day? Right.

And they, What would they yell? We need a broadcast news style flashing logo that makes it seem even more important.

I cannot believe it.

Well, it's going fast. This is a lot faster than the last one. You're looking for a trend.

There it is.

Now, that means that there's what's left. It's a good question, Rachel. Thank you for asking. The preferred package for extra Access, better seating, more time with Dave and the Ramsey personalities, for those of you that care about that. If you're debt free, this is your chance to celebrate with us. You can secure your cabin with a $600 deposit. That's nothing for you people that are just four, five, and six. You're just cash-heavy. You just got cash. 600 bucks gets you a cabin. We're going to the Western Caribbean in March of 2027. And so there you go. Vip package, too late.

No, breaking news. Preferred package.

Sold out. But the preferred package is still available. It's there.

What was it called, though? When the guys would have newspapers on the street, something in like Titanic days, what would they yell for you to buy the newspaper? Do you know what I mean?

Hear ye, hear ye.

Extra, extra.

Extra, extra read all about it. I went about a hundred years earlier. I went with the Hear ye, hear ye. That's what I said. That shows you where my brain is at. There's people in the audience out there going, I don't know what ye means. It means you, but they said ye. Hear ye, hear ye. All right, William is up in Birmingham, Alabama. William, how can we help today?

Hi. I am so much stressing about finances to the point where I have given myself a few months of a miniature stroke. My doctor says that I probably want to see past 40 because of how much stress I'm under. Oh, William.

Good gracious. How old are you?

I'm 29.

Okay, then what is this How much debt? How much debt are we talking about that's causing you to have a stroke?

It's not as much as I've heard on the show. It's about $15,000, give or take.

Okay. I'm not a doctor. I have wanted to play one on TV. It's never going to happen, but I do like to wear scrubs. Okay? Long setup. I think you're going to be okay. $15,000 feels, and I'm not in any way minimizing your feelings, what's going on, but I want to give you some advice here that we're going to walk you through how to get out of this $15,000. It is very doable and nothing that you should be dying over.

Yeah, but the doctor may be for real being like, Well, he may be really... He may be all the way- No, I believe he is, but I'm trying to say- Yes, as a financial expert- We can help you. Yes. William, how much do you make a year?

Roughly about 55,000 a year.

Okay. What's the 15,000 in debt?

10,000 of it's for car payments. The rest of those collections.

Okay. What's the car worth?

I want to say it's worth 15.

You could sell that. That's private sale. You could sell it for $15,000? Mm-hmm. And you owe 10 on it.

Great. That one's solved.

We can solve that. You can sell that today and sleep like a newborn baby.

Yeah, you're done. Like, literally. Like in five days.

What's the collections? Five grand of collections for what?

Credit cards, stood at loan, and I believe that's it.

Okay. I want Rachel to walk you through what she would do if she were you with those collections.

Well, I would... Do you have any money saved?

I don't. I don't have any nest eggs, emergency funds.

Okay. I'm living paycheck to paycheck. Okay. So here's what I would do. Today, I would go find us, sell the car, get a $5,000 car, be done with that. You have $5,000 in collections. It's what? Mid-february. I'd make it a goal by March 30th, I'm just throwing that out there, that I would have $5,000, William. That my life depends on it because apparently it does for you. Like, literally. You need to go and work every night till 10: 00 PM somewhere. You need to sell everything. You need to eat nothing but beans and rice, rice and beans, as Ramsey would say. Do nothing for a month and a half and work your butt off and save $5,000. Make it like an extreme goal. It's extreme, but I would do it.

What do you do for a living, William?

I'm retired military. I got up medically. I have two kids recently divorced. I still have custody of my kids.

So are you on full benefits? In other words, you're not pulling income from any other source?

Correct.

What do you- What do you do during the day? What are you doing during the day?

I'm looking for employment. I made some really bad choices a couple of years ago. It left me with incarceration. I'm still dealing with it with drug courts. Hopefully, I'll be getting my charter dismissed in September when I complete the program.

I think the stress is coming from other places than $15,000 of debt. You're right? Yeah.

Oh, okay.

I could tie with the employment and finances and all that, tying to the bigger picture, but I think it's more of the bigger picture.

Yeah, I agree.

Okay. Well, that does make more sense, and we can't necessarily help with that. But I would tell you that you need to be doing something. It will help with all of this. But this ruminating all day long, getting rejected because you're applying and you've got the incarceration. So what I hate about the American culture is it's very hard for someone like you who didn't do anything crazy, but you should be employed. I know someone can employ you. Here's your homework assignment. Where in your area are people working that have stuff on their record, probably worse than you? You know what I'm talking about? Where are they working? I can tell you where they're working on construction sites. In the trades, do you have any skillset that would allow you to do some basic trade work?

Not trade work. I have a degree in business management, but as far as trades, construction, all that, I don't have anything on that.

Are you any good at it? Can you pick up Can you work for a masonry crew and haul around bricks and make brick mud all day long?

I think I can manage.

Yeah, I know you can because I did it at 18, and I can barely put gas in my car at 51. So I'm talking manual labor. No one wants to do it except the Williams of the world. I'm going to go find a manual labor job just to get out there.

Yes, I was going to say, honestly, it's less about the money. The money is going to help get you this five grand ASAP, which you need to get just to pay it off. But it's the dignity piece. There's something about getting up, having a destination to go to, completing something. There's something in that, William, that that self-confidence comes back to you.

But you need that $20 to $22 an hour labor job in a warehouse. Don't get locked in on my one example. I'm just trying to get you. If I was you and I needed to do what Rachel told me to do, and she's right, by the way, I would go, Where are the jobs that most people don't want? Because they're hard. They're like my good friend, Mike Groh calls them dirty jobs. Go do that because they pay really well and it will help you in the short term on this money stuff and then help your soul.

You got me? Yeah. How old are you, William?

I'm 29.

You're 29? Okay. And you said recently divorced? How recent was that?

We finalized yesterday.

Eesh. Man, William, I'm sorry. You've had some challenges, some uphill, really hard things in your story. But what a beautiful thing that you are still so young, honestly, and that you could turn your whole life around. You probably are making steps to do that now. But getting some of this accomplished. And I think there is something about paying off that debt that actually, again, good financially, obviously, but there's something about that self-dignity and progress that you make in life, that you're actually making positive progress towards something positive, the direction is Going positive, positive. And it's just one day at a time making those decisions. And then over the scope of a year, two years, three years, William, you're going to be a different man. You really are. But you got to change, and you have to put in that effort because that's what's going to help, help this whole process from the financial and the work and who you are, William. So we're cheering for you. We're so glad you called.

Welcome back to the Ramsey Show in the Fairwinds Credit Union Studio. Alongside Rachel Cruz, I'm Ken Coleman. The phone number to jump in is 888-825-5225. Wes is up in Los Angeles, California. Wes, how can we help?

Hey, I was just calling. Me and my wife, we make around 165 a year. We have no debt. We have about 50K in savings. Now, I was just wondering It would be dumb to do a night's vacation this summer instead of about 10 grand.

Okay, 10 grand. And are we cash flowing this or are we going to pull that from somewhere else?

We are going to be cash flowing it. Okay.

Yeah. I don't see any red flags here. What are you concerned about?

Well, I mean, we still own the house, so we could white-knuckle it, and We project to pay off the house in about eight years, and that's way faster than 30 years.

You're doing great.

Could throw more in retirement. I don't know. I just hear a lot of stories about people who retire and don't have enough or stuff like that.

You think your $10,000 vacation is going to put you behind some of your key goals?

Well, I don't know. That's why I've been going back and forth about this for months.

Well, but I'm actually trying to dig into the source of why you would ask that question, because we need to get that up and to the top and go, okay, if you're concerned that $10,000 is extravagant based on your financial goals, then you have to play that out and go, okay, if I didn't spend any money on vacation, which I I think is crazy, and I would never recommend that, so what would be the difference? What would be the budget-conscious vacation? How much would you spend on that if you didn't spend $10,000?

Well, we've done other vacations where we spent maybe five or four.

But this would be a lot.

I could do that.

But also, I mean- Well, let me play that out. Let me play that out. I'm trying to help you. Let's say we say, No, $10,000 is too much. And so we spend five because we've done that before. Now you've saved $5,000 to go into one of two of those buckets, either towards the house or throw extra five grand in retirement. When you play that out, I think that's important to go, how much impact is that really making? Versus, I'm really winning in the baby steps. I'm going to pay my house off in eight years, and it's a nice vacation that we'll remember the rest of our life. And oh, by the way, we're not promised tomorrow. Now, that's where I'm coming at it. And so I don't think it's too much, especially that you're cash flowing it. I would 100% do it.

Yes. You guys have no debt. You have good savings. How much do you have in retirement, just in general?

Okay, so we both have California pensions, and I also have been maxing out an IRA for the last year and a half. I'm worth only in our 30s, so I'm going to continue that.

How much do you have currently in all of your retirement accounts?

I don't know. I know I have about 12,000 in my IRA that I started about a year and a half ago. The California pension stuff, I don't know. It doesn't have a cash value the same as others do. It has like, you will make 85% of said salary at the end of your job or whatever.

Well, hoping that the California pension is still around is a bit of a risk, in my opinion.

But maybe That's not… Maybe I'm being crazy. But I mean, seriously, the way that government runs.

What does your wife say, Wes?

She hasn't cared about the vacations as much as I do. I'm just going back and forth because I'm like, How much do I really need in savings when I'm 60 versus how much did I miss on living during the time?

That's right. Yeah. Are you taking, is it wife, kids, just you and the wife? Who are we talking about?

Just me and the wife. Just me and the wife.

Going where?

Hawaii.

Yes.

Bro. Life is short, man. I would go to Hawaii. Eat all the shave ice you can possibly get away with. Make memories, man. That's what I was thinking.

Go enjoy, Wes. Don't worry. You are doing fine. You're doing great. You guys are doing awesome. You are.

I like these calls. Wes, you're fine. Go do it. No guilt.

That's it, too. It's such a scarcity mentality. But you got to look at your facts and play everything out. Debt free, 50 grand, makes 165 a year. We're all going to be okay.

He's cash flowing. It's great. We're all going to be okay. Fantastic. I love it. All right, Stephanie's up in Greenville, South Carolina. Stephanie, how can we help?

Hi, we're a military family. We have one income, no debt, and we're just feeling a little bit behind on this step six because of our frequent moves, and so we have a news this summer. I was just curious if you would recommend, I know you guys don't normally, running out our current health since retirement is on the horizon.

Renting out your What? Sorry, say that again.

Our current, the current home we live in right now before we leave this summer.

So you're talking about being a long-distance landlord?

Correct. Yes.

We're not fans of that. It's just if you If you look on the numbers on it, I bet you'll find that the amount of profit after all of the expenses that are required to take care of this home, if you take what I'm going to get in rent, minus the mortgage, minus expenses, I bet you're going to find it's very little profit, if any at all, and it's a whole lot of hassle.

Our thought was that we might potentially move back to this house, and we have a really great interest rate. I didn't know if any of those factors mattered, or if you guys always recommend it just so long.

How long would it take you to get back?

Because we would be ready for the next place. Somewhere between two and four years.

It's a short-term deployment, and there's a... How much control do you have over being transferred back in, or is this the idea that we're going to get out of the military and then settle back?

He's at 20 years right now, so retirement is very much on that horizon.

Okay. I do think that changes the question a little bit, if they're talking about short term, coming back.

Yeah. I know. The only thing, which this is- Still a headache, and all the things I said are still true. Yeah, and this is going to be picky, but I'm going to be honest, Stephanie, too. You got to remember, if you have someone living in your house, maybe two or three different people on 12 month rentals, and you move back in, it feels different. There is a reality of people living in your home, that's your home, that you're going to do it. Do you know what I mean? Not that that's the reason not to, but I think we paint this ideal situation situation. Then when the rubber meets the road and we're actually walking in it day to day, it's like, oh, it just hurts so much when you go in and the house is all banged up because of renters. You know what I mean? All the things.

Okay, that actually brings up a good point. Is this house, Stephanie, that you're currently in, that you would rent and go somewhere else and then come back. Is that a house you would stay in long term if the move wasn't involved? If you weren't transferring out.

We've been staying here five to seven years. It's not a forever house, but we do We just, like I said, we're feeling very behind on Baby Step 6 because we just haven't had a mortgage to work to pay off, and we're 43.

That's fine. But how much is the house worth if we were to sell it today, and how much would you make on it?

We would make somewhere around 100, 110. It's worth about $450.

Well, the fact that you guys would not stay in it longer than 5-7 years, and it's for... I would, honestly, Stephanie, I would, too.

If you had said, This is our dream home. That was where I was going. I would have changed my mind. I'm with Rachel. I'd sell. I got to sell- Hock at the 100 grand, let it work for you.

Yes. Put the 100 grand, gosh, for four years, you may even just throw in an index fund, Stephanie, honestly. Then When you guys are ready to buy again after and settle down, you'll have a good amount in there, too.

I also sense that he's probably going to go into a private sector job. If that's the case, we want to know what that is, how much money he's going to make, because that's all to play into what we buy when we come back. I love selling this house. Peace of mind, extra cash. It does. I like it all. You guys are not behind it all. Hey, guys. What's up? It's Jade, and I'm pumped for the new year, and I hope you are, too. But the problem is, most people start the new year with a lot of promises and no real plan. You know how it is. I'm going to save money or I'm going to get my financial act together. But without a plan, you just wing it and hope it works out. Listen, don't play yourself. I want you to win, and our EveryDollar app is the game changer you need. In 15 minutes, EveryDollar helps you build a plan based on where you're at with money right now. And every day, the app coaches you with ways to find extra money so you can beat debt and build wealth faster. It's like having me in your pocket, helping you stay on track all year long.

So don't just wish your money works out. You can be the one to actually make it happen this year. Download the EveryDollars budget app and get started right now for free. All right, folks, one of the best things you can do for your finances is to have a really good tax pro in your corner. They're going to help advise you on the best moves to make for your situation or for your small business, especially if you've had some big life changes in the past year. Go to ramseysolutions. Com/taxpro. Ramsey Solutions Cpages. Com/taxpr to find CPAs and enrolled agents that have been vetted by the Ramsey team. All right, let's go to Bill in Detroit, Michigan. Bill, how can we help?

Hey, how are you doing? Ken, Rachel. Thanks for taking my call.

You bet. Absolutely. What's going on?

I have about 850,000 in my 401k and my other investments. Good for you. My advisors wanted me to...

Excuse me? I said good for you. Great.

I don't know if that's good or not. I'm 62. I want to retire in a couple of years, and my advisor is wanting me to invest in an annuity. Is that something I should think about? No. Don't do that. No. Nope.

Your advisor probably does because they make a lot of money off of annuities. Not saying that he's a bad guy, but yeah. No, annuity- That's a pain in the road. Yes. Yeah. Not a great product. I mean, there's variable and fixed. Variable, there's certain times that maybe, but that's after everything is maxed out, and you have no other options for retirement because you have so much and everything else, and maybe you want to do a little thing over here. But no, the short answer is no, I wouldn't. I think you have it in a good spot. Are they in mutual funds within the 401(k)?

Well, I think I got to pay taxes and all that stuff, I'm sure. I got a mutual fund in a bank. I've got a couple of different styles, I guess. And the ones are just through work. It's a 401(k) regular work, 401k where they match and stuff like that.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Well, I would... Yeah. Just to look in because retirement is coming up for you to make sure that whatever thing is invested in feels like a good spread. We always talk about four different types of mutual funds so that you have enough diversification. So there's growth, growth and income, international and aggressive growth. Those are the four buckets that you can look at within the mutual fund space, which is great. But no, I would just keep them in mutual funds. You'll get a better rate of return, lower fees. And it is. It's just a better way to invest your money than being stuck in an annuity.

Okay. Now, I shouldn't look into rolling over into a Roth or anything like that, how some people do that.

Okay. Well, so for the IRA... Yeah. So for the IRA, how much is in the IRA versus the 401k?

The IRA has 117,000 in it.

117? Do you have cash available to pay taxes?

Oh, yeah. If I have 60,000 in my savings account, which is dumb, I know.

No, no, no, it's not dumb. That's good emergency funds.

Bill, I've never met somebody doing so good who thinks he's doing so bad.

Well, I'm by myself, and I'm pretty scared about retiring.

You're doing wonderful.

You're doing really good, Bill. Yes, yes. Well, I would look to see... Yeah, I mean, the Roth conversion. There is a tipping point of if you have too much, and depending on tax bracket, everything, that may It will not be worth it, but for a lot of time, it is worth it to start rolling over, even if it's a little bit each year. I would still keep some cash on hand. That's your emergency fund. And you may need less than 60. I don't know, but you could use some of that. I would contact a SmartVestor Pro, Bill. They're advisors that we recommend, and they probably will not be pitching annuities and all that. They'll be able just to look at your situation and really help from a strategic strategic perspective with your money, where you are, to help guide the next steps. I really would. Check out a SmartVestor Pro, one that's in your area, because they will be able to... They have a heart of a teacher. They'll be able to sit with you and really look at this and dig into the numbers. But I'd say no to annuity. Yes, probably start rolling over to a Roth.

We cash flowing some of the taxes.

Yeah. Bill, thanks for the call. Christian will help you find that information on the website where you can find some smart investor pros in your area. Not a fan your financial advisor because they're selling you a bad product. Remember on this, you want to understand everything so that you're not feeling alone and scared. The right financial advisor, you're going to go, Oh, I know exactly what I should do and when I should do it, why I should do it, how, and I'm calling the shots. That's why we want you. That's your homework assignment. Have a couple of conversations and move to somebody that you feel really good with, that they're teaching you, not selling you. Lucas is up next in Bangor, Maine. I think that's how you say that. Lucas, how can we help?

Hi, guys. So me and my wife are both 22, and we have $65,000 in savings right now, and then a three to six month emergency fund of $10,000. We've been saving for a house as we're in an apartment right now, and we were curious on what's a good point to stop aggressively saving because I'm not actually contributing to any retirement right Yeah, it's a great question.

So a rule of thumb when it comes to home buying, which you've done all the steps, which is to get out of debt, have a fully-funded emergency fund, which you've done, and then save. For first-time home buyers, we save a 5% down payment. You go as low as 5. 20 is ideal, but I know that's a lot for people. But just to go ahead and get in. Looking at that, to get a 5% down payment, when you look at the house and how much it's going to cost, we want your payment to be no more than 25 % of your take home pay on a 15 year fixed rate. Okay? So when you plug all that in, you can actually do this on ramseysolutions. Com, the mortgage calculator. You can put some of these numbers in and figure out, Okay, here's the number for our home of what we can afford right now with our income and what we have saved. How much do you guys make a year?

We made 115,000 last year.

115? Yes. Okay, good for you guys. That's great. Yeah, so after taxes, your take home pay, you guys are bringing in what? Probably 9,000 a month-ish?

It was more like... I have a lot of overtime, so it varies every month. It's usually about 5,000 to 6,000, like 6,000 a month.

Did you guys get a big tax return? Are you going to?

We ended up getting about $1,700 back because my wife was a part-time student for some of the year.

It feels like a lot going to taxes, 115, and you're only... Okay, well, that is what it is. So yeah, so I would be looking at what you're bringing home a month, and you guys just look to see, Okay, how much is a fourth of that take home pay? That's what our mortgage payment has to be on a 15 year. But again, that mortgage calculator can help figure that out. And it may take a little bit of time, more time to save. I wouldn't go longer than probably two more years, Lucas, of not saving in retirement to be aggressive with this down payment, saving for the down payment. If the house that you guys really want is more than what you can do right now or in the next two years, it's okay to keep saving and be funding retirement. It may slow down your savings, but you guys are 22. It's great to get in the market. When you are ready to get in, it's good to get in, but I don't want you to feel rushed to get in because you guys have some time.

Yeah. Here's the thing. I hear this, and it's so fun to listen to young couples think about this. There is such cultural pressure to get a house as soon as you possibly can, because if not, you're some loser. Do you feel that That's still out there? I certainly believe millennials felt that.

Yes. I think it's... I don't know, I could be wrong. I feel like it's less with Gen Z just because the market is so expensive versus 10 years ago.

For them, they're like, I can't even consider it.

Yeah, it feels so big. But no, that's a real thing.

But to that end, even if you can't do it so you're not expecting to do it, it still feels like you're behind. Yes. I just want to point it because this is awesome. We have so many young people coming in in the show. Listen, A, it is not easy to get a house right now. You are not cuckoo. You aren't a snowflake. I feel that pain. But what I'm trying to tell you is, is you aren't behind in the life category because of circumstances outside of your control. Right. And so, yes, it stinks that you will have to wait longer and save more. It does stink. I get it. But my point is, if you can just hang on, and hopefully the market conditions change.

Yes. I'm running. I just pulled up the calculator on my phone. Good. Sorry. No, I knew you were... This is good. I know. Yes. For the down payment, I put 12,000. He had 65, right? Oh, yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, home value, I did this quick, but 300 to 350-ish, they should be able to do. So great starter home. Lucas, there you go. But you guys look in your area, figure it out, and just take your time. No rush, Lucas. No rush.

Hey, guys. Dave Ramsey here. Every day on this show, we help people work through real money problems and figure out what to do next. Now, you can get that same help anytime with Ask Ramsey. Ask your money question and get answers built on Ramsey principles we use on the show. Whether you're making a decision or just want something explained, Ask Ramsey is here to help.

It's fast, simple, and free to use.

Go to ramseysolutions. Com and try Ask Ramsey today. That's ramseysolutions. Com. All right. Every once in a while, we love to get a Baby Steps Millionaire on the line so that you can hear their story and make the connection to how possible it actually is. This is not a myth. These folks are not unicorns. They're real. Stephanie's up next in Phoenix, Arizona. Stephanie, how are you?

I'm nervous, but I'm good. Hi.

How are you guys? We're doing great. Thanks for spending time with us. We really appreciate it. Oh, thank you. Hey, nothing to be nervous about. We're just going to ask you simple questions, and you already got the answer. You're going to get an A plus already. Really? Oh, yeah. Okay, so Tell us your net worth.

I'm approximately 1. 6 million. 1.

6 million. What's the mix?

It's my TSP and IRA, so my retirement. I just paid off my house right around the new year.

Nice.

And my various checking and savings account.

Okay, got you. Very good. And what is your income?

Currently, It's about 110.

Okay. What do you do?

I'm federal law enforcement.

Nice. Now, how much of the 1. 6 million did you inherit? None. Zero. Zero. And we always like to ask, but I'm always afraid to ask a lady's age. But because it's for the show, I feel like I should get away with it. How old are you, Stephanie? 47. 47. My goodness, you're young. Wonderful. You're so young.

Two and a half years from retirement, so I'm very excited.

How many years? Two and a half. Wow. What are you going to do after that federal retirement?

I have not figured out what I want to be when I grow up, but I'm sure it'll come to me.

I've got a nice little fun gift for you. It's called Find the Work You're Wired to Do. It's my gift to you today. It has to get clear assessment in it. It'll be really fun for you. Oh, thank you. Yeah, because you've got more to do and more money to make, but you're in great shape. Okay, I assume you got your degree in some type of, what, law enforcement?

Actually, no. I was a young kid that had no idea what they wanted to do. I had gone to school for my plan was to become a lawyer. I went for pre-law, and I got a degree in government. There's absolutely nothing with that because my current job does not require a degree.

Yeah. Isn't that something? What was your GPA?

I think it was around a 3. 1.

Show off. I've never- It's been so long. Rachel, I never snipped a 3. 1. Never even got it.

I don't even know what mine was, honestly.

Really? You strike me as a 3. 4 person.

I'm more average than that. I'm going to go 3. 2. I might be a Stephanie. I might be a I don't want to. Okay.

All right. Very good. Okay. Rachel, do you want to ask any questions here? I'm just rolling through our list.

Yeah. No, I love it. Stephanie, what do you feel like was one of the things that helped you the most to build build wealth to become a net-worth millionaire?

I think I really did look out.

I got a really good paying job right out of college.

It was completely unexpected. But as a 24-year-old, I started a job that I was making decent money, about $40,000, and it offered a way to start my retirement. I can't. So I think that's That's exactly what it was. I've always been a person that's really... I love seeing my savings grow, so that was always a goal for me, to see the savings get larger and larger.

Yes. Yeah, that's a motivator, the progress. Seeing that progress constantly was so good for you.

What would you say to people who say $110,000 is not enough to make a living, much less be able to become a networth- To pay off your house? Yeah.

It's It's not easy because you have to say no, and you have to make decisions, and you have to hold off on some things that you want. Maybe you can't get it this month or even in six months, but maybe in a year, if you just wait for it. So, yeah, I think it's absolutely possible to live on $110,000 and actually be able to put stuff aside. You just can't go and buy everything you want at the moment. You have to just hold off Yes, living below your means.

See, that right there is fascinating. I mean, you will find one viral TikTok a month or a week or a day on somebody screaming and freaking out saying, You can't make a living and cannot live comfortably on $100,000. I think The answer you gave is so real. It's just delayed gratification and discipline is what I'm hearing.

Yeah.

I mean, it's not that I don't want nice things or that I don't get nice things.

It's just sometimes I have to take that Just a second to talk to myself and go, Okay, do I need that right now? I want it, but I don't even need it. I don't even want it right now. I can hold off on it.

I don't have to put it on a card or anything.

I can pay cash for that.

You know what's crazy, too? I find as time goes on, especially six months or a year later, you don't even want the thing anymore. You know what I mean? It's just a memory, and you're like, Oh. That was a moment in time. But to that point, we live in such a world where you want it right now and you just get it. There is no suffering and saying no to yourself, right? That's become uncommon. And so the fact that you've pushed through and that you're smart about your decisions, about what you're spending. And I do think there's something about that motivation of seeing money grow in savings. That's real, right? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. And in my opinion, it's the right way to lean versus I would rather that excite me than all this new crap I can just buy and spend all my money on. Do you know what I mean? Which feels easier, almost. Yeah. And so keeping all of that in check is so big.

Well, and I got to thank Ramsey so much. I started listening to the Ramsey show in 2018, and I really had no plan to pay off my house very early, but that really gave me the kick in the butt to really push for it and start focusing on it and knocking it out. But that's like that mindset. I had the savings mindset to begin with, but actually paying off the house was not something I was initially thinking, Oh, that'll happen It's amazing.

He did in eight years from then, from that point.

What is the house worth?

Currently, the house is, according to online, it's worth about $320.

I bought it way back in 2007.

You're 47, and you're about ready to, what are you, two and a half years? You're going to have a really great retirement program, I'm hoping, from the government?

Yes.

I am blessed that way.

Yes. Fantastic. Then again, you're going to find another way to serve because you've got so much transferable skill and experience. That's why, by the way, I do want you to take the assessment. It's my gift to you. As you start to read your results, it's going to give you a written purpose statement that is essentially a dream job description in the sense of I'm good at it, I enjoy it, and it creates the results I care about. Because here's the deal. Let's say that you just find something you really enjoy and you work until, let's say, 60, 10 more years of income on top of all of this. Stephanie, my goodness.

Yeah, so much.

I feel like you're too young to not do something.

It is.

Now, have some fun. Slow down. I get a lot of people come after me when I say things like retirement is overrated, and they're missing the point, but I'm also bringing it on myself by making such a generalization. What I am saying is, listen, if you want to retire and be super active and volunteer and play shuffle board half the day, go get a massage, that's fine. I'm not saying relax. That's what I'm going to do. I'm going to relax and have fun, but I'm still going to do something. I think whether that's 5 hours, 10 hours, 15 hours or 40 hours, this idea of making a contribution and it mirrors work, whether or not it has a paycheck attached it or not, is not the point. So yes, Stephanie, I say yes and amen to what you're saying there. And again, you're a young lady, and you have a lot of time left. So it's going to be really fun for you to be able to retire and go into this next chapter really relaxed. And that allows you to make some really fun decisions because you have no fear.

Well done, Stephanie. Way to go. You're amazing.

You're amazing. There she is, folks. Stephanie, you didn't sound nervous at all. No. At all. You did a great job. Thanks for sharing your story with us. There it is. 47-year-old lady making $110,000 a year, are going to retire in two and a half years in a federal law enforcement job. All right? No glitz, no glam. Paid off house and all. Not a huge amount of money. It's crazy. She's worth 1. 6 and growing with a paid-for house. Folks, you think sometimes that we're just saying stuff to hear ourselves talk? Stephanie is absolutely living proof. If you've been working the plan, paying off debt saving and changing your family tree, I'm proud of you. If you're in Baby Step 4 or beyond, it's time to celebrate. The Live Like No One Else Cruise is back, March 14 through 21, 2027. Join the Ramsey personalities and me as we sail to Half Moon Key, Cozimel, Jamaica, and Grand Cayman on the ultimate debt-free vacation. Cabins will sell out just like last time. Lock in yours with a $600 deposit at ramseysolutions.

Com/events.

Our scripture of the day comes from Isaiah 43: 2. When you pass through the waters, I will be with you. When you pass through the rivers, they will not sweep over you. When you walk through the fire, you will not be burned. The flames will not set you ablaze. Our quote today from Simone Biles, I'd rather regret the risk that didn't work out than the chances I didn't take it all. How about that?

The Olympics.

Yeah. Do you watch the Winter Olympics?

I was out of town this week, so I haven't started, but I love it.

Really? Yeah. More so than the Summer Olympics? I'm a summer guy. I'm picking Summer Olympics. Yeah.

I'm going downhill skiing, though.

You like the downhill skiing?

And, of course, the ice skating.

I like the curling. It reminds me of Bocce ball, but it's on ice. Yes.

That's a good one.

It's a very soothing sport to watch.

And very hard, apparently. It looks easy. I want to be the guy with a little brush. Then you think with the broom, I think you'd be very efficient.

I think I'd be great with the brush.

I think you would do great. I really do.

Yeah, I got to try that. Got to see if there's a local curling.

There is. In Nashville- There is? Yes. It's like a new thing. Oh, my gosh. This is exciting. You do dinner. It's like a whole experience. Really? And then you go curling.

This is a new thing. Let me tell you what else is new as we're wrapping up the show. Remember that you can always ask your question at ramseysolutions. Com and get it answered the way we would answer it on the show. This is the Ask Ramsey feature at ramseysolutions. Com. It's our own AI. It's free. So there you go. You can't get in on the phone to talk to us? No problem. Ask Ramsey's there. Check out the link in the show notes. Justin is up in Huntsville, Alabama. Justin, how Can we help? Hey, how are you doing? We're doing well, and Rachel's got a topped off cup of tea. So things are good here in the studio.

Oh, yeah. Well, I'm a little bit nervous.

Well, that's why I told you about Rachel's tea. She's calm, so you'll be calm.

So relaxing. Oh, yeah.

What's your question?

I've moved down here recently, and I'm at a job. I've been here since December. I I've made a bundle. I'm 22 years old, and I've made a bundle of poor decisions financially. I'm only about 15,000 in debt, but I currently work a job as an electrical distributor, and I make right around $16 an hour, like 16. 25 or something. It's very low. I left a handyman business to move out here. And so I got an opportunity. I feel like I've been stressing financially, so I've found an opportunity He's got an opportunity to work at a construction job, making 18 an hour, which I think could probably go up more. He's saying he likes his employees to be 20 to 25 an hour. Love that. But I'm struggling because I I have an income problem, and I want to get that resolved. But my boss, where I work now, has been paying for my gas because I don't make enough to pay for my gas with the debt that I'm in. Okay. And he bought parts for my truck, too, that I put on the truck. And he doesn't know about this job offer, obviously. And I don't know if it's morally or ethically right for me to take it.

I just feel like I owe him.

Of course it does. Well, if you feel like you owe him, then why don't you take this better paying job and then pay him that money back? He probably won't take it. This is a good man who knows that he can only pay you 16 an hour. Now, when you go to him, you can say, Hey, man, I've got this other opportunity and I need it, and I'm so grateful for what you've done for me, but I know you can't pay me what they can pay me, and I've got to take that job. I'm so grateful to you. If he gets mad about it, then you know that the gift wasn't a gift. It was just some type of manipulation and whatever. But if he's a good guy, and I suspect that he is, he's going to be like, Hey, man, I totally understand. Or, Hey, I can get you to that, but it's going to be six months from now. It'll create a conversation. But let's just remove the moral, ethical. There's nothing immoral, nothing unethical about you taking a better paying job that also has a ladder to even much better pay. There's There's nothing wrong with that.

Yeah. One of the stipulations was it's on a 1099, which I'm not used to, and I don't know that I'm ready for that. I literally have less than a dollar to my name in my bank account Let me address that issue.

Okay. You're talking about the new job would be 1099? Yes, sir. Okay, great. Here's what you would do. You would go talk to a legitimate tax pro, and if you go to ramsey solutions. Com and just search tax pro, you can find local tax pros in your area and go sit down with somebody or do your own research and go, based on somebody who's making 18 an hour or 20 an hour, what's the tax rate? This is not difficult. Then what you do This is when you get a check. It's 1099, you're going to get the entire amount. So you take out a percentage of each check. You can do this. It's just you have the mindset that if I get paid $2,000, $2,000 is not mine. It's $2,000 less. Let's take 20%, it's just an easy number. That money is the federal government's. They're going to ask me for it, and I need to have it in savings. It's that simple.

I just worry. I've never budgeted before, and I'm listing out all my stuff on Google Sheets, and I stress with it.

All I'm hearing is reasons why you're going to fail. I don't know if you want me to just say, Hey, man, you know what? You're right, Justin. Most people would to be able to do what I said, but I think you're a complete buffoon, and you are incapable of doing this. You have convinced me that this advice will not work for you. But I'm not going to say that.

Rachel, talk to me about budget. I was going to say you're 22, you're learning a Adult skills, right? I mean, they don't teach. They should be teaching this more, but they don't. And so you're thrown into the real world. You're making money for the first time in your life. You made some mistakes. Now you're scared to death that you don't even want to move. It's almost paralyzed you to do anything because you don't want to keep making worse mistakes, but you don't know how to move forward. I don't know how to get out of it. Yeah, you just need a couple of steps. So you need some goals, Justin. So my first one would be for you, which we'll get you. If you hold on the line, Christian will pick up and we'll get you a year of every dollar. It's our budgeting app that actually plugs in all of your entire financial pictures. You'll do the onboarding. It takes like 15 minutes, plug in all your info into every dollar. Then it has a set budget for you. It already gives you some categories. Some categories you won't need, so you can just delete them, then there's going to be some you may need that's not on there.

So you just add them. It's a very easy app. Attach it to your bank account so you can connect your bank account to it. And every time you swipe your card or use Apple Pay or whatever it is, a transaction is going to drop in and you drag and drop it. And you start to actually plan out and say, Here's how much I'm spending on food before the month begins. You plan food, clothes, gas, insurance, and you go down the line and you say, This is how much it takes to live a life, right? And you're You're going to do all of that minus what you make a month. And so that's the goal, is to live within that income. And you're going to be able to do that very proactively. It's going to take about three months to really get it right. I would start, get it and start planning out March. I think my key for you would be next week, I want you to have a budget done for March. You're looking ahead. You're going to have your March budget. It's going to be terrible. You're going to think, Oh, my gosh, I didn't know I spent this much here.

I forgot about this bill over here. I forgot about that subscription. It's coming in. You're going to have to be readjusting some stuff. April is going to get a little bit better. By May, it's really going to start working. So that's one goal. The second goal is I want you to get $1,000 quickly. Justin, in the next 30 days, I want you to get $1,000. So I don't care if you do grocery delivery. I don't care if you're doing part-time somewhere. I don't care if you're selling stuff. I don't know what it is. But I want you to get a thousand dollars as fast as possible. And if you're doing those things, if you're planning your monthly income, you know where it's going, and you are seeing money in your account grow for the first time ever, even if it's a hundred bucks here and there, right? You're just watching it go up. And then after that, it's like, Okay, that's progress. You've made two huge progressions in your financial life. You have a plan for your money, and you have your first savings. And then you're going to start tackling this 15,000. What debt is it?

It's mostly personal loans, and I have probably, let's say, nine $1,000 in a personal loan that I used to pay for my truck. And then about another $1,500 in credit card debt.

Okay. So then you're going to work to pay off that $1,500 first, okay? And if it's multiple cards, split those debts up. If it's $500 in this card, a thousand on this. Make them separate so you can attack small goals at a time. Cut up the credit card, be done with debt. I'm telling you, at 22, if you just don't have debt for the rest of your life and you save and then you start investing later, Justin, you're going to be fine. You're going to be fine, but you have to do these things, and we know you can. So we're cheering for you. We're glad you called in.

Go, Justin. Go. And hey, to everybody else, remember, there's ultimately only one way to financial peace, and that's to walk daily with the Prince of Peace, Christ Jesus.