Transcript of Trump Top Pick Falls Apart Under Cross Exam at Hearing

There goes another one. Democrats intensely cross-examining one of Donald Trump's top picks. This time, Trump's latest pick to be CDC director, Dr. Erica Schwartz, after Trump's prior CDC pick was fired for not immediately authorizing flavored vapes, which was a major priority of the Trump regime. Get those flavored vapes. In the hands of little children. So let me show you what went down as Dr. Schwartz was cross-examined by Senator Bernie Sanders, by Democratic Senator Hassan. Let me start off with Democratic Senator Hassan. This was not a good day for Dr. Schwartz, who showed what a hack she is. Watch as she crashes and burns under cross-examination from Senator Hassan. Let's play it.

Dr. Schwartz, the CDC director is responsible for protecting Americans and especially children from life-threatening disease outbreaks. If Secretary Kennedy ordered you to stop promoting the flu vaccine during a deadly flu season, would you carry out that order?

Uh, Senator, when I was the Deputy Surgeon General, I worked at the Office of the Surgeon General, and one of the things that was very concerning was that the, the The Surgeon General had a number of campaigns, public health campaigns that he wanted to do. And yet we had very limited resources.

Yeah, ma'am, I'm asking you a different question and I have limited time. So if you are instructed to stop promoting the flu vaccine during a deadly flu season, would you carry out that order? Yes or no?

We had to prioritize what we could focus on, what we couldn't focus on.

Look, I'm gonna stop you again. This isn't a hypothetical question. The flu season last year killed almost 300 children, and we have clear data from the CDC that the best way to save children's lives is by giving them the flu vaccine. Nevertheless, in the middle of the deadly flu outbreak last year, Secretary Kennedy personally directed the CDC to immediately stop all promotion of the flu vaccine, including promotion campaigns that were already planned and paid for. So I want to give you a chance to answer again. If the secretary ordered you to stop promoting the flu vaccine during a deadly flu season for children, would you carry out that order? Yes or no?

So, Senator, you know, I don't speak in hypotheticals, but I—

This isn't a hypothetical. It happened. And I've got the email if you want to see it later. So yes or no? Are you going to protect our kids or are you going to follow an uninformed order from the secretary?

Senator, I will always, always protect our children.

I know you—

you would refuse that order. Yes or no?

Senator, my understanding of what happened back then was that the secretary has— he has various priorities. And as he's— as he's looking at his priorities in terms of what to fund, what not to fund—

that's— I'm sorry, that's not acceptable. You just heard Senator Kaine talk about the appropriations process. The money was in the budget. It was there and it protects and saves lives. And your answer is really disappointing. Let's go on to another issue.

More cross-examination here from Senator Hassan as Dr. Schwartz says Donald Trump and RFK would never ask me to violate the law. That's not in their character. They would never— I would never believe they would say to me to violate what my job requires of me. Here, play this clip.

Dr. Schwartz, just a few minutes ago, you said in response to a question from Senator Kaine, you will always follow the law. Mr. Kaufman, I assume that you would say the same thing.

That is correct.

So just to be clear, if the President of the United States instructs you to take an action that would break the law, will you follow the the law or follow the president's instruction? Dr. Schwartz?

The president would never ask me to not follow the law, but I will always follow the law.

Mr. Kaufman?

Follow the law.

Thank you. And Dr. Schwartz, there are multiple examples of the president actively instructing people to break the law over and over again. So I hope you will update yourself on that because it's not a satisfactory response to say he would never do that.

The way—

great questioning here by Senator Hassan. More cross-examination here, who says, you know, if confirmed, You'd be at the top of the food chain when it comes to vaccine recommendations. You know that, right? To which Dr. Schwartz goes, I think that's actually RFK Jr.'s role. To which Senator Hassan goes, no, that's your job. CDC director, vaccine recommendations. That's what you do. You do not know what your job even is, Dr. Schwartz. Here, play this clip.

Federal regulations and decades of precedent make it clear that if confirmed, you would be at the top of the chain of command for vaccine recommendations to the public in the United States. So, Dr. Schwartz, do you agree that you will be at the top of the chain of command with regard to final vaccine recommendations?

Senator, my understanding is when the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices makes a recommendation regarding vaccines, they've been doing this since the 1960s. The CDC takes those recommendations. We will— the CDC director will work with his career scientists, work with the chief medical officer of the CDC to analyze those recommendations, look at the evidence that the ACIP used to make those recommendations. And then the CDC director certainly can make that decision regarding should they accept or not accept those recommendations. But I also understand, and I could be wrong on this, that the secretary ultimately has the policy decision regarding that.

Let me update you. The President here is clear, and even the recent charter that Secretary Kennedy's new ACIP will operate under makes clear that the recommendations go to the CDC Director. The CDC Director, after consultation, examining the recommendations, all the things you just said, decides whether to adopt those recommendations or not, and then the charter says they inform The Secretary, it is— the buck stops with the CDC Director when it comes to vaccine recommendations. So do you commit that you will consider and make decisions on vaccine recommendations from scientific experts without political interference from outside the chain of command, including Secretary Kennedy or President Trump?

Senator, your premise is, is interesting. I don't think the Secretary or the President would do what you just said, but you have my commitment to follow the science wherever the science may lead.

The Secretary has interfered with vaccine recommendations to the point that he has dismantled ACIP and rewritten the charter in an attempt to provide a particular scientific, or I would say unscientific, view on vaccine safety. It is outrageous and it is making us less safe. And I hope very much, if you are confirmed, that you will stand up to that kind of political interference. Thank you, Mr.

Chair.

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Then we heard from Senator Bernie Sanders, who brought the house down. Senator Sanders, great cross-examination here. And he just says, look, CDC director was fired for a lot of reasons, but also failing to approve Kennedy's anti-vax agenda. So you're going to be filling in that role. What you would say you— what say you? Here, play this clip.

And quote, Within days, the CDC director was fired for failing to approve Secretary Kennedy's anti-vaccine agenda. Dr. Schwartz, if confirmed, will you commit— will you commit that you will report to Congress if you receive directives from Secretary Kennedy or any other individual in the Trump administration to implement policies that are unscientific and could harm the health and well-being of the American people?

Senator, I do not believe that the president or the secretary would ever do what you just mentioned.

Really? Do you think that is the record? He would not do that?

Is that what you're saying, Senator? That I do not think that the secretary or the president would ask me to do something like that.

Okay, thank you.

Now Senator Sanders says, you know, when RFK Jr. says, uh, spreads all of this disinformation about autism, um, and, you know, particularly with people who have someone in their family who has autism. RFK Jr.'s junk science is, is really dangerous. It's really, it's really, really dangerous. What say you? Here, play this clip.

Um, according to the American Medical Association, which represents over 270,000 doctors, quote, an abundance of evidence from decades of scientific studies shows no link between vaccines and autism, end quote. In fact, there have been more than 40 scientific studies in 7 countries involving over 5 million people finding that there is no link between vaccines and autism. And yet today, the CDC has published false information on its website suggesting that childhood vaccines cause autism. Dr. Schwartz, do you agree the existing scientific evidence shows vaccines do not cause autism? If confirmed, will you commit to removing information on the CDC website suggesting a link between vaccines and autism?

Senator, we do not know what causes autism. 1 in 33 children have a diagnosis of autism spectrum disorder, and we owe it to the American people to figure out why. The president had— has asked Secretary Kennedy to find out why it— what is causing it.

I don't have a lot of time, and we all want to find the cause of autism. The evidence is overwhelming that vaccines do not cause autism. Do you accept that evidence?

I do accept that evidence, Senator.

If confirmed, will you commit to removing information on the CDC website suggesting a link between vaccines and autism?

If confirmed, Senator, you have my commitment that I will look at that exact website. I have not seen that.

I will speak with the secretary to understand why the secretary has put that stuff up there. What I'm asking you is, will you remove information which suggests a link between vaccines and autism?

Senator, I have been in many situations where I have had to go to my superiors in the military to have conversations, very difficult conversations about things that may not have been— that may have been concerning to the troops or to the military personnel. And I will do the same with the secretary. I will go to the secretary.

I just have a brief amount of time.

While we're on the topic too, I know I showed this video yesterday, but right down the hall there was another hearing of Donald Trump's DNI, Director of National Intelligence, this guy Jay Clayton, who Donald Trump wants to have in that role, who's currently the United States Attorney for the Southern District of New York covering up the Epstein files there. That's who Trump now wants to be the Director of National Intelligence. I just, I got to show you this cross-exam one more time. I'll do the short clip. Of Senator Ossoff cross-examining Jay Clayton. He's the guy who the Trump regime wants to now lead ODNI, the Office for the Director of National Intelligence, in essence, the top national intelligence position in our country. Here, let's play this clip.

Who won the 2020 election?

You know, I'm not—

I'm not going to do this with you.

This is a job interview. We have established that you have an obligation to be honest. And forthright with the committee. Yes, you do have an obligation to be honest and forthright with the committee.

Yes.

Who won the 2020 election?

Like I said, I'm not, I'm not going to get into that with you.

But you do have an obligation to be honest and forthright with the committee.

Is anything that I just said not honest or forthright?

Yes, you're not being honest or forthright. Who won the 2020 election?

I think I just asked the question. We can keep doing this.

Well, we're going to keep doing it because you're not being honest and forthright.

I'm not going to engage in in the theater.

It's a simple question, Mr. Clayton.

And I've asked—

who won the 2020 presidential election?

I've answered it.

You're here asking for the support of senators to lead America's intelligence community. We've established that you have an obligation to be honest and forthright with this committee and with the American public, but you refuse to answer a simple matter of fact about the 2020 election. Is that right?

No, that's not right.

Then answer the question. Who won the 2020 election?

I have answered the question.

Answer it. What is your answer?

I've given you my answer.

What is your answer? You refuse to answer a basic question about who won a presidential election? No, I— But you asked to lead America's intelligence community? Isn't it humiliating to be unable to answer this question? To have to indulge the president's delusions? We know, you know, everybody in this room knows the truthful answer to that question. Why can you not give it?

I think I gave you the answer.

Oh, before we go, may I share with you some great questioning by Senator Rochester of Delaware cross-examining Dr. Schwartz here? Play this clip.

But I also know that in April, Secretary Hegseth, our Defense Secretary, rolled back the flu vaccine mandate that had been in place in the United States since World War II. And so I guess my first question is, you know, it was widely reported that, that unsurprisingly, a major flu outbreak occurred at Lackland Air Force Base in Texas that prompted the Pentagon to to then restore the flu vaccine requirements for new military recruits. So my question is, would you have advised Secretary Hegseth against the decision to roll back the flu vaccine mandate for American troops, particularly as we talk about readiness for our troops?

Uh, Senator, I, I really don't like speaking in hypotheticals, but what I will tell you is So let's not speak as a hypothetical.

Let's say you— let's— you are actually in line to be the next CDC director. So you're going to be thought of as a medical expert for this country. Would you advise that?

So, Senator, I believe, as a board-certified occupational medicine physician, I believe that vaccines are safe and effective. I have personally given thousands thousands of vaccines to military members for force health protection and readiness. I do understand that there are some concerns specifically about influenza because it has the 35 to 57% effectiveness season to season. So I can understand why certain individuals may have some concerns about mandating a vaccine that is not— But is it good medicine? Not— I believe personally that influenza saves lives and vaccine saves lives. But I can understand why there are some concerns about mandating a vaccine that has, you know, 35 to 57% effectiveness season to season.

I want to shift also to the measles outbreak. The CDC did not post a single message in 2025 encouraging people to get vaccinated for measles, even as we were in the midst of one of the biggest measles outbreaks in over 2 decades. The CDC also halted the wild-to-mild flu vaccine campaign and dramatically scaled back its back-to-school vaccine education efforts. Will you publicly urge Americans to get vaccinated?

Senator, absolutely. I am, as I said, I'm an occupational medicine physician. I have been vaccinating people throughout my entire 25 40-year-plus career in the uniformed services. I believe in vaccines, but I do also understand that there is a, there's a large swath of Americans who have some vaccine hesitancy concerns, and I want to be—

CDC, would you reinstate the back-to-school vaccine, uh, campaign?

So, Senator, what I would like to do is make sure that I say yes or no if you think you know the answer.

If not, you can say you don't know yet.

I would, I would actually like to talk to the CDC career scientists to understand what the current resources are to see if I only have 14 seconds and it says Senator Moody here, so I'm going to jump to—

can I jump to my last question for without questions for the record? In January, Dr. Oz, Dr. Bhattacharya, and Dr. McCary presented a memo to then-acting CDC Director Jim O'Neill recommending the U.S. adopt a narrow childhood vaccine schedule based primarily on a comparison with Denmark. Do you agree with the memo's recommendation to no longer universally recommend all 17 vaccines.

Senator, I agree with the president of the United States who asked HHS to take a look at that said memo and to find out if those recommendations were sound, if they were not sound. So if I'm confirmed as a CDC director, you have my commitment to take a look at that said memo to understand whether comparing to Denmark makes sense or doesn't make sense, whether the evidence suggests that those 6 vaccines influenza, COVID, hepatitis A, hepatitis B, meningococcal— My time—

unfortunately, my time has expired and I want to respect the committee. And I know that, Senator Cassidy, we have talked about this issue of vaccines for a while, particularly comparing ourselves to Denmark, which is ridiculous. And I will share with you, while I think you are immensely qualified, I am very, very concerned.

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