Transcript of #2209 - Paul Rosolie

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The Joe Rogan experience. Train by day. Joe Rogan podcast by night. All day. All right, well, take a selfie.

No, I'm just making sure that there's nothing completely retarded looking about myself right now.

What could possibly be different than the way when you walked in here?

I have no idea, dude. I'll tell you what. Much fun walking in here and not be, like, ready to throw up out of nerves. The first time I walked out of here and I went, holy shit, I was actually nervous. I don't get nervous, but the first.

Time, I was not nervous. Now, though. No. Good. Beautiful.

Perfect.

It's good to see you again.

Good to see you.

Every time I see him, like, I'm glad he's still alive. It's like, where you live is so crazy. Let me tell you, man, I don't understand why you continue to do it, but I guess you love it.

I have to do it. Nothing else I can do at this point.

How long do you think you're going to stay out there for?

Until the mission's complete. Until the mission's complete. I mean, we have. My whole life has been based around one goal. It's been protecting this river. So. And this year, we've just been experiencing miracles. What's happened in the last few months has been life changing on a level that, like, I didn't understand these things could happen. When Lex came down and everything that happened, we didn't think. You go out and you don't think that. That miraculous things are going to happen. And there's just been. We've actually been making strides towards notching winds in protecting this river. Saving the Amazon. It's wild.

So is it? Because have you become more high profile? You've got more support? Like, what has been the change?

Well, I mean, coming on here helped a lot. I mean, first of all, just coming over here, like three different people stopped me in the airport. And we're like, are you that guy from Joe Rogan? And I was like, are you serious? Like, I'm over there. Like, I'm not used to this. I live in the jungle, so I don't know. And then I come back here, and then people are like, dude, I know you. You're the jungle guy. And I'm like, oh, shit, that's new for me. But so really the thing that happened recently was that, you know, so I went on Lex's show a year and a half ago, and he said, I'm gonna come down to the Amazon, which.

Everybody says you went on Lex's show, but Lex actually went on your show. You can say that in the Amazon. And to see Lex with his suit, his customary suit on. How hot was it?

It was hot. If you watch that carefully, you can see him.

Yeah, he looks glistening.

I was doing fine, but we both covered ourselves in bug spray and we sat down and we said, okay, we're just gonna try it out. And if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. It's fine. But yeah, he came, like, when he said he was coming down, I was like, yeah, you and everybody else. Everybody says they're gonna come down. I didn't think he would actually do it. And then.

How long is the flight?

It's not long. To get to Lima from New York is 8 hours, so from here it's even shorter, I'm sure.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, it's really not bad. And he came down for two weeks the first day that he was, I was like, I want to show you the start of the Amazon rainforest, which starts in the Andes mountains. So we're in the western edge of the Amazon rainforest. And so you have these glacial peaks up at 17,000ft. So I was like, lex, I want to take you up to 17,000ft. I want to go from source to river. And so his first day, he arrived, and then we drove 5 hours, got to the base of this mountain, then we met up with these dudes that are experts and they brought us up to the glacier where we can't breathe.

Wow.

Yeah, it was, you're driving on roads where the cliff goes down 1000ft.

Fuck all that. I've seen those roads.

And I opened the car door to try and goof around with Lex to be like, oh, I'm with lex Friedman right now. And the thing, and I look over and I see the wheel go over the fucking edge and skid back on.

And I was like, it happens all the time.

So, yeah, we got out of, we walked, we let the car. I was like, look, the car drive. And then what we did was we took a rock and I was like, yo, Lex. I was like, this would be us if the car flipped. And we threw a rock over the edge and this big rock was just spinning like this. And I was like, man, we would be chopped meat by the bottom. So we got up to 70,000ft, we saw the glacier. And whenever you bring somebody to the jungle, the thing is, you don't know. Some people take to it, some people don't. Some people get to the jungle and their skin doesn't react well to the bug bites. They're overwhelmed by the fact that they're far from everything. Lex's eyes lit up like, I didn't know he had that setting. He walked into the jungle and was like, I like this. He got this grin on his face.

Lex is a secret savage.

Yeah, look at his face. He wasn't fucking around.

Yeah. He could live out there.

Yeah. And if you notice, he came to the Amazon and he looked like the first, like Lex in his profile picture. And when he left the Amazon, he looked totally different. And that process is what happened. He said, you know, he's like, if I'm coming down, he's like, I want to do what you guys do. I want to go on like a deep expedition. And so me and JJ, who's the guy I work with down there, the local indigenous sa. Aha. Native, who is the reason that I do the work I do. I support his work. And so we said, okay, what are we gonna do? Let's find the wildest place we can think of. Let's go way up our river. So we're already like two. If you take a boat from town, it's two days deep into the jungle to get there by river. We said, let's go five more hours uprivere, leave the boat, and then we're going to go from our river up to this other tributary and it's like 20 miles. 20 miles, right? Fuck, it'll be fine. We got our backpacks, machetes. We get off the boat and Lex is all good to go.

The first five minutes we're out there. JJ, machetes a branch that has wasps.

Oh God.

His whole head and neck gets surrounded by wasps. He gets 30 stings on him, he runs. And so right away we're like, oh, God, here we go. We had to use a stick to get his hat out from under where the wasps were attacking. We hike all day and here's the thing. You think it's the rainforest, there's going to be water everywhere. There's no water. So picture being in the sauna for 8 hours straight and then no re up on water. We drank all of our water thinking we're going to find a stream. We didn't find a stream. We camped that night, like dry camp. Nothing, fell asleep, woke up. We were like, we got to find water. And at this point, Lex is, how.

Do you find water?

Well, I mean, there should just be streams, right?

This section were there that you just didn't run into or it's like it.

Was a weird section of forest. And this is integral to the whole story, was that this part of the forest, unlike where we are, which is very, very flat, and there's all these, like, little streams. They're clear, this cayman and anaconda in them, but they're clear. And the jungle works like, the roots work, like a huge filtering system so you can drink that water right out of the streams. Where we were, it was up and down and up and down and up and down. And so that's why we're sweating all day. We camped. We didn't have water. We start going the next day, no water. And Lex starts looking at me, and he's like, dude, we can't keep doing this. We're slipping and sliding down slopes. We're hiking up slopes and just grabbing onto things. And when you grab onto trees in the Amazon, they have spikes on them. You're worried about stepping on venomous snakes, you're worried about twisting an ankle. It was brutal travel, like level ten hiking. And JJ made eye contact with me behind him, and he was just going, this is. This is not good. And so I think it was day three.

We're going, and here we're in such a.

Did you go a whole day without water at all?

We went with a whole day with no water whatsoever.

And what's the temperature?

99 degrees, full humidity.

Oh, my God. So you're like, full dehydration? Yeah, probably a little delirious.

Completely delirious.

And so we're body's not working well.

And you start making errors, right? You start taking bad steps cause you're tired. So you go, I'll just step on this thing. And so you step on a root that goes down, you slide. Poof, you hit the ground, you get tangled up in Vinesen. We had pack rafts. There's this company, alpaca rafts. We had paddles sticking out of our backpacks that kept getting stuck on vines. And what happened, though, was, as we're going through this forest, we're going, God, this is so incredibly dense. And I see this tree, this huge tree the size of this room, and I go, JJ, what tree is that? And he smiles at me, teacher to student, and he goes, you know why? You don't know what that is? He goes, you've never seen a mature mahogany tree because the loggers down there, they took them all out. This forest has never been cut. Millions of years, the Amazon rainforest, forming geologically, has never been cut. And so we're going through this forest, we see jaguar tracks, ancient mahogany trees. We're seeing ironwood trees. No one's been there, not even signs of uncontacted tribes. This is forests that no one's been through.

And so right at the time, I remember, we stopped for lunch. Lunch. We stopped to eat the last food we have. And the problem that we were doing was I had a compass. And we were getting to the top of these hills. And, you know, when you look on the ocean floor and the sand makes, like, those geometric ripples and there's a pattern to it. And so we were coming to the top of a ridgeline and we were like, we don't want to go down again, and we don't want to hike up again. So we're staying on the ridge lines. And what that was doing was taking us a 30 degree tick to the. I think it was to the west. But that what that was doing, though, was taking us about another 20 miles off course. So we had to hit the river here, but we were going to hit over there.

Oh, no.

So we had to correct for course. We stopped. We were eating the last of the food. We have. We drank water out of a puddle. I have a video, and we're gonna release all this.

Do you have a filtration system?

We went with nothing. We had our tent. We had our tents in our machetes.

Jesus Christ.

And I have a video, a video of Lex, and he's looking, why don't.

You bring a steri pen or something?

Cause I do everything with the local guys. And they were just like, oh, it'll be fine. There'll be water. And we just. We didn't anticipate this happening. And I. Lex was crouched by this puddle with his backpack on, and he's, like, looking at the water, and he looks at me and he goes, I'm gonna drink it. And I said, do not drink that. I was like, please don't fucking drink that. And he goes, I'm gonna drink it. He goes, I don't care about anything else on earth right now except for water. And I was like, please don't drink it.

Giordi is no joke.

Nope. We stopped for lunch.

Did he drink it?

He did not drink it.

Wow.

No, he, you know, I mean, we didn't want. Because now we're going. If we get sick, we have no sat phone, no communication to the outside world. We're at least 30 miles from the nearest river, let alone help. That's 100 miles away, deep in the Amazon. And the feeling of deep jungle, that feeling of wilderness I know. Like, you know when you're, like, elk hunting, I'm sure you know this when you're out there and you get that feeling like this is out there.

Yeah. Uncaring.

Uncaring. Yeah. You start, like, the ocean where it's like.

It's almost like, lonely.

It's very lonely.

Even when you're with people, it starts.

To press on you. We started getting quiet. Like we weren't having, like, an awesome time. We were. We were feeling it. And so we ate, like, some nuts and we had nothing to wash it down with. So we're just. Just chewing on it. And we got up and then we took a few steps, and all of a sudden everything changed. We came out onto a road, and it's a logging road. And JJ's face fell. I was heartbroken. Lex. Lex looked confused. What we realized was, in this ancient patch of forest, the progression of the metastasizing destruction that's moving through the Amazon forest comes in roads. This road. Somebody had just cut a road and they hadn't cut the ancient mahogany trees and they hadn't cut the ironwood trees. And the wildlife was untouched. There's a road. So they're coming. We used the road. We hiked. We hiked out. We reached water. And this is amazing, when we reached water, because we just plunged into this river, we were drinking. We did have some iodine tablets. We put that in our water bottles. We drank as much as we wanted to. And then we had to raft for an entire day back to the place where we got picked up.

But what happened was that now we know, and this is on our river. This is where we're trying to create this corridor with jungle keepers. Now we know that some of the most ancient forest on earth is about to be destroyed. And we get back to our base, to our research station, and it just so happens that there was a client there, and he was staying in that treehouse, the Alta sanctuary treehouse. And we tell him this whole story, and we're drinking and we're eating, and we're all sunburnt and bug bitten and dehydrated, and our cheeks are stuck to our skulls. And we tell them this whole story and we go, it's going to be brutal watching this dismantled. And he goes, well, I want to help. He goes, find out how we get that land. And it hadn't really occurred to me that we could do anything about it. And this dude, this guy's name is Jay. And he said, he goes, I'll start you off. He goes, whatever the land costs, I'll give you 150 grand. Do a fundraiser, put it public, and try and get matching donations and talk to the lockers.

So while we set up the fundraiser, JJ local called up his friends who happen to own that land. His friends don't want the land. They're contracting it to loggers to get the trees out to make some money so they could just sell it off. We put it up on instagram. We raised $150,000 in 48 hours, talked to the loggers, bought the land. And then the craziest part is that when we were. We went there, we physically, with all the directors of drone keepers, we went to the land, and the Peruvians, the peruvian directors sat down with the loggers and they were like, look, we own this land now. It's for conservation. We're going to save this forest. And the loggers went, that's fine, but can we still work here? And we went, what? And they said, we do this because we love it. And we went, what? They said, yeah, could we just be rangers? Like, we see you have rangers. Could we be rangers? And we were like, yeah, you could be rangers. You could be rangers. These dudes are over here destroying the thing they love because they have no other opportunity. So the fact that this is that we now have this global network of people that care, the local people in the Amazon rainforest are trying to protect the Amazon.

And now we have all these people all over the world because of stuff like this, because of all the work that we've been doing that people know that. They just, you know, we have people that give $5, $10, $100 a month. We have this huge network of donors, and now we're able to get those wins. We see a threatened patch of forest, boom, we grab it, hire the loggers as rangers, everybody wins. And we're saving forest. This year since the last time I saw you, we went from 55,000 acres to almost 100,000 acres. That's one third of the way to protecting the 300,000 acres that we have to protect. So we're one third of the way through the goal.

Wow.

That's all been happening in the last month and a half.

That's incredible miracles. So are you, when you're navigating, you're not using gps, you're just using a compass.

Yeah.

Why?

Commitment.

What?

Because, look, so I actually.

Wouldn't you want the best tools for the job?

I agree with you. And if you're in a really, can we go out to really remote places when you just cannot fuck around. Yes, we do bring, like, a Garmin GPS and we do the map.

That sounds like you cannot fuck around if you guys are without water for two days.

We thought we were going to go in the forest and go on a walk. 20 miles is 20 miles hike is nothing. We do that every day. We did not. The reason this forest hadn't been cut was because it was up and down and up and down and denser than all the other forests. Cause it's fucking ancient. And so we discovered it and how hard it was. And that's where I'm going. Holy shit. We brought Lex Friedman out here. He's gonna die, and he's gonna die of dehydration. And he was looking at me. I mean, there were so many times during the trip where he looked at me and you could just tell he was like, fuck you, dude. Just. Just fuck you, man.

How do you find water? You just stumble upon it.

From our base. You walk five minutes back into the jungle, and there's a beautiful, clear stream. And I drink straight out of the stream. No problem. Now, I wouldn't. For someone that comes to the jungle, I wouldn't say, just start doing that. Say, like, take a sip the first day. See how your stomach goes. I've been down there 20 years, so I'm fine.

Is it just your gut bacteria changes? Is that what it is?

I mean, some people, you take them, you know, you go to Italy and they get sick, you know, but, like, you know, it's like people sometimes fragile folk. Fragile folk, you know, sunscreen and bug spray. But we. Somebody said that, too, because I posted a video of me drinking, like, monkey head soup and coffee out of a bowl.

What? Monkey head soup.

We went with the locals before everybody. All the PETA people freak out. I don't care. Freak out when you live with locals, when in Rome, you know, if you go to someone's house and they're local, they eat monkeys. And so we were on a beach and some of the local guys hunted monkeys. And so we woke up in the morning and they heated up the food. And what we had was bowl coffee because we didn't bring cups. And we're on a canoe, right? You just bring. You cut your toothbrush in half to save weight. And so I posted it, and I was like, here's. Because everybody messages me going, you know, how do I get your job? And I was like, here's one reason why you fucking don't want my job and think you do.

Monkey head soup.

Monkey head soup.

What does monkey head soup taste like.

Exactly what you think. At the same time, it's not as bad as you think.

Monkey tastes like monkeys, though, right?

They love monkeys. Part of the conservation strategy is just like, you know, just like we have deer tags to make sure that there's continually deer for local indigenous communities. They want to keep eating monkeys. They love monkeys. Really? Yeah.

So they want to keep the monkey population manageable. Is that the idea?

And they want to eat them eventually, yes. And so I would say it's kind of colonialist conservation to come in there and go, well, you can't eat monkeys because we think you can't. But then, like, you go trout fishing and deer hunting. That doesn't make any sense.

Right. But it's like monkeys are too closely related to us. It's like the people that. This is one thing that I've noticed. People that get upset about hunting don't necessarily get upset about fishing or don't get upset about a piece of fish. Like if you put a plate of salmon.

Yeah.

You know, like, oh, this is my lunch today. Everybody's like, oh, that's healthy salmon. Yeah. But if you have a picture of a salmon, people get a little upset. But if you have, like, a steak, people don't get too upset. But if you have, like, a dead deer, people get very upset and forget.

Yeah, I mean, it's very weird. So I disconnected, I think, yesterday, sometime this week, I posted a video. We were out, and I was with, again, some machiganga natives, and we caught a yellow catfish and their daughter, who's three, three and a half years old. Now you're out somewhere where there's no refrigeration. You have a two hour boat ride back. What do you do? You put the fish in the bottom of the boat with a little bit of water, and you let it stay alive, right? Just enough to keep its gills going until you get back. Because if you kill it, as soon as you catch it, it'll go back.

It's rotting. Yeah.

And so this girl picked up the fish and she's. And she's hugging it. The comments on this, the vegans went crazy. People were like, I'm unfollowing you. That's disgusting. This girl's excited. Cause she's gonna eat. She lives out in the jungle eating nothing but rice and yucca. Like, if she didn't get that fish, she's gonna get malnutrition.

Yeah, well, people are just so accustomed to supermarkets. They're just. They're so delusional about where your food comes from. It's a fascinating thing. And vegans are probably the worst at it because they really, if they really on the ground level understood monocrop agriculture, which is what supplies most of your food, they would be horrified. They'd be horrified at industrial pesticides and herbicides and all the shit that we put in the soil. How many small animals get murdered in the process?

Well, you got to clear space for a farm.

You not only have to clear space, you have to kill groundhogs and ground squirrels and anything that's in the way, anything that's going to eat your crops.

Well, in the jungle, that's what they're doing. All this burning, all this Amazon fires, shit that goes on is every year is people coming in and 60% of it is for beefe, but the other percent of it is for papaya and corn and cacao. I see a lot of stuff where they're like, oh, sustainable cacao from the Amazon. I'm like, how is it sustainable cacao from the Amazon? You cut down an ecosystem and trees that have thousands of species living on them, right? It's not.

And so sustainable, sustainable is one of those words like organic. People like to throw it around, slap.

It on the pack.

I mean, that's like that apl stuff. They call that organic. You know what that is?

No.

It's this coating that they put on vegetables and fruit to keep it from going bad. The wax, well, it's some weird. What's the ingredients of apeel? See, like part of it is quote unquote organic, but they don't tell you what the actual ingredients are. Apeel is a plant based coating that's applied to fruits and vegetables to help them stay fresh longer. Seems normal, right? Like yeah, it's plant based, but what's in there? It's a commonly found organic apples, but you're supposed to wash it off with soap and water. Like, we were reading that if you have an avocado. So we were in elk camp and we were reading about this stuff because we had Starlink. Starlink is fucking amazing.

That's how we do it, dude.

It's like the size of this cigar box.

I know.

You put it down on the ground and you get fucking high speed Internet in the middle of nowhere. So we were reading that they were saying that to take it off of avocados, you dunk the avocado in boiling water for 10 seconds and then rinse it off. Like, what are you talking about? What's in this stuff?

Also, nobody knows that. I don't know that, right? So I come up here, I'm eating that shit.

Exactly. Most people are just gonna eat the apple. They're not gonna wash it off with soap and water. But the thing is, like, they're saying it's plant based and organically, that's the thing, like, sustainable. These words that people use that make you feel okay about what's going on. But, I mean, I don't even know what the fuck is in there. A brush. Scrub it.

Do you scrub your apple?

What the fuck are you talking about? Why are you putting something on the apple that I need to scrub? This is only. You can only remove it 100% by peeling it off. Oh, my God.

But I don't know of an apple because apples, like, you want to eat.

This, click on that. How to wash, remove, appeal, coating, vegetable coating. Let's see if we can watch a video. It'll show us how to do it.

Let's see.

Which one do you want to pick? Let's go with the first one. That lady, so she's peeling it? Yeah.

Why do you peel produce, but isn't a lot of the nutrients in the skin?

Wax and peel? So this is different, though. This is wax. That's cartonuba wax. That's like, normal. But appeal is a new product, and it's one of those. Yeah. Okay. Let's see what this lady has to talk. Let's talk about appeal. I don't like her earrings, but let's listen to her. And reduce the use of plastic. This compound uses plant material to make monoglycerides and diglycerides, aka fats, a fat coating on fruits and vegetables. The intent, less plastic. Amazing. Longer shelf life. Fabulous. Fabulous. What? Human crops. These fats are extracted from plants using ethyl acetate and heptane. In the chemical process to make these fats, they add ingredients that contain heavy metals. Oh, great. Not all fats that come from plants are safe for human consumption. Generally speaking, olive oil comes from plants, and it's healthy. Canola oil, rhapsody, cottonseed oil are fats that come from plants, but not healthy. They cause a lot of inflammation. It all depends on how the fats were extracted and how the chemical compound was created. At this time, there's no human trials to show what happens to humans who consume fruits and vegetables with appeal on them on a regular basis.

Oh, great.

Keep going.

Yeah. Why would there be human trials on something that people eat? And it's all over supermarkets.

But there's a lot of stuff coming out right now about the safety of our food. Oh, yeah, I keep hearing about this. It keeps showing up.

Yeah, well, there was a big hearing in front of the Senate that Brigham Bueller, who was on yesterday, he was talking about it, you know, in front of all these representatives, and they're trying to explain what the system is and how fucked it is and how there's, most of these european countries and Canada, there's a lot of ingredients that, particularly dyes that we use. Like, you know, he was talking about how lucky charms that you buy in America, you can't sell it in Canada. They have to sell completely different lucky charms in Canada because Canada doesn't allow.

All these dyes because there's the super bright color thing.

Yeah, those are toxic dyes, and we allow them because we want people to. And there's also a bunch of other ingredients that make the food more addictive. Those are in our food supplies, and some of them are illegal in other countries. It's not good. And there's. And it seems like the way he was describing it is like the FDA is just completely overwhelmed, and they, you know, and then these companies are just pushing this stuff through, and it's kind of like the way we described it yesterday. It's like a hoarder's house. Like, how do you clean this up? Like, you get into a hoarder's house, you're like, oh, God, where do we fucking start? That's what our food system's like. Our food system is like a hoarder's house.

Well, I heard that guy, I don't remember his name. He was like, he's a venture capitalist. In the last week, you guys were talking about, he was saying that, like, when he travels abroad, he can eat whatever he wants, and then when he comes back to the US, he puts on weight.

Yes. And that was chamath.

Yeah, that was a great one. He was. He was incredibly intelligent. And. And then I was looking up something. Something else popped up where they were saying that the bread in, like, subway sandwiches is considered cake in Europe because of the sugar content.

Yeah, some countries consider it cake because it's. It's mostly. It's like, it's fucking cake. It's not really. It's bullshit. We have bullshit food, and, you know, I don't eat most of that stuff, but if you do, you're going to be really unhealthy. And most people aren't educated. You know, it took me a long time to understand this stuff, and mostly, I mean, I tried to eat healthy before that, but mostly through the podcast and talking to people, getting an understanding of how bad this stuff really is for you, and then experimenting with diet and watching how much better my body felt and seeing my friends who don't do it. They just look like hell.

And you're mostly carnivore now?

Yeah, mostly fruits and mostly meat and fruits. I mean, I hardly eat any vegetables at all, but I don't avoid them. Like, if I want. If I go out to dinner and I want to have a Caesar salad or something, I'll eat it. It doesn't seem to bother me. But what does seem to bother me is pasta. Pasta and breads really hit home. They really wreck me. But not in Europe. Went to Italy last summer, had pasta, had pizza. No problem at all.

I don't understand why it works.

There's a bunch of things that we do. Robert F. Kennedy Junior explained a lot of it. So did Gary Breca. He explained a lot of it. One of them is enriched flour. What's so called enriched flour contains a bunch of chemicals like folic acid and a bunch of shit your body has a hard time digesting. It's also. They use heirloom wheat in Italy, and heirloom wheat is the original wheat. What we did was we changed wheat to make higher yields so that a smaller piece of land, you can get more weed out of it. So because of that, it has more complex glutens, makes it more difficult for your body to process. And then on top of that, the big 1 may be. This is a lot. There's a lot of speculation about this, but there's some serious evidence that most people who eat the common american diet, it's. What was it? The number of the people that had roundup in their system. So glyphosate.

What?

Yeah. Glyphosate is a really powerful pesticide that they spray on all kinds of different plants. And I think it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 90% of people tested had glyphosate in their system.

Roundup.

Yeah, the stuff you sprayed.

Everything.

Exactly. And it's illegal in some countries and should be illegal in America. But the problem is, if you make it illegal, how are these monocrop agriculture companies going to function? Okay, it's 80%. That's 87% of children. 87% of children. So this is 2022. I would imagine this goes up every year. 80% of Americans have roundup in their urine. That is so crazy. That's so dangerous.

That's terrifying.

And it's also fairly new in terms of human history. I mean, I think Roundup has only been around since the, is it the nineties? When did roundups, when did glyphosate start becoming ubiquitous on, on crops? It's fucking dangerous, man, because we're rolling the dice. A lot of the stuff that people eat causes long term health consequences. And so when you're dealing with short term stuff, like stuff that's only been around for five, six years, it takes a long time before you figure out what's happening. Also, 74 roundup, which contains active ingredients, glyphosate was first introduced to commercial agriculture in 74. So, like, so scroll down so we can see, like, when it, like, ramps up. So 74, okay. Wasn't widely used until 96. That's what I read. So Monsanto began selling genetically modified seeds that were resistant to roundup. This allowed farmers to spray their entire crop beds with roundup without risking losing their crop. It's an herbicide, right? Yeah. Okay. Not a pesticide, an herbicide, but it's fucking terrible for you. Terrible. And 80% of people have it in their blood.

Roundup, microplastics, DDT.

Yeah.

And then in the old, and then what was it? I think it was during the gold rush times that everybody was using lead to re plug cans after they opened them. And then, you know, thousands of people died from lead poisoning before they figured it out.

Shane Gillis has a great joke about George Washington. George Washington's dentures were made out of lead. That's why George Washington was such a fucking psycho. He had like, lead poisoning.

He wasn't brave. He was just insane.

I read that when they were talking about the amount of plastic that people find, like most men have plastic in their sperm, plastic in their testicles, you have plastic in your brain. And a lot of that plastic is the plastic that's derived from PVC. So it's coming from water pipes.

I thought our water pipes are metal.

Some water pipes are metal. But when I used to do construction, we did a lot of houses where they used pvc pipes.

Yeah. See this?

This is a lot of pvc pipes underneath kitchen sinks and stuff. So all that stuff, when water is going through that, you're picking up these little particles of plastic. And those little particles of plastic. You know, you cook your food in it. You drink a glass of water from the tap. All that stuff is getting you plastic. And then there's cooking in microwave. You know, if you have like one of those things you lift up and you have a piece of plastic over the lid and you cook microwave and it's in a plastic bowl. That's all fucking getting into your body. That's all getting in your blood.

Well, I scared myself with that because we had plastic cups on an expedition, and we boiled coffee, and then I poured it into the plastic cup, and I was like, we gotta stop doing this. So we started bringing, like, metal and glass cups on conditions.

Obviously, they make stuff for campers that you can get, you know, and that's why we switched these steel cups here. We used to just go through so many bottles of water. I was like, this is fucked. So we bought a filtration system and, you know, and started using steel cups. But it's like our, this whole thing in America. One of the things we talked about yesterday with Brigham is the Make America healthy again movement, which is Robert Kennedy Junior and a bunch other folks that are involved in this. And it's exciting that this is gaining steam because people are concerned about their health and they are concerned about all the different chemicals that are in your fucking food. But the problem is now that's been attached to right wing ideology, so people are calling people that are interested in that far right people, and it's just, if you're worried about food safety, yeah, it's nuts, man. But it's just because it's attached to Trump, because the Trump administration, you know, make America great again and also make America healthy again with Robert Kennedy Junior, he's involved in that. So people are just labeling that as some sort of alt right fuckery and woo woo bullshit.

And it's not. It's fucking dangerous for all of us. We really need to wake up.

Isn't it also true, though, that in America, at least, like, the poorest people are usually the ones with the worst diets?

Absolutely.

So, I mean, like, you've naturally progressed towards going, okay, so I eat elk and I eat vegetables, and I care about where I get my stuff from, but people that aren't able to make that decision, that would seem to me there's certain things where you go, shouldn't we all agree on this? Yeah, you know, food safety. Shouldn't we just all agree with this? I don't understand how that becomes political when it comes to nature conservation. I never understood how that, you know, I'm like, we need clean rivers can.

Be solved, and this is what's fucked. It's like, we have so much money to solve other countries problems, and we don't have any money to solve our own health problems. That's very strange. It's. It's very short sighted and very bizarre, and we need to do something about it, we need to do something about it now. It's just, it's really scary when you think that this, if this unchecked happens, these corporations will continue to sell you things that are very bad for you if they're profitable, as long as they're not penalized for it. And I guarantee you, those people that know that, the people that are important, they probably don't eat any of that shit.

That's like Steve Jobs. I don't know if it's true. The Steve jobs wouldn't give his kids screensh. They know people.

You go to restaurants, you see little kids with an iPad sitting on a tray, just standing there so their parents can have a conversation. The kids just like hypnotized, dude, by some kids in cartoon.

Kids are swiping before they're talking. They know this motion. Oh, yeah, they got that finger out.

Yeah, they try to do it to magazines. Ever see little kids?

Yo, I saw a kid try to expand a magazine.

I think I did that once.

I was just hanging out with a baby, and I was like, look at this picture. And I showed him a book, and he put his hands on it, and he went. And I was like, nah, it doesn't work like that.

I think I almost did that once. I think I looked at a magazine. I brought my hand up. What the fuck are you doing?

Yeah, my thing is, the worst thing that I've done recently is I didn't have, you know, I start doing activities without my phone on me, and I went for a run and I saw something cool, and I was like, oh, I need to take a picture of that. And I was like, how? The idea that I couldn't take a picture of something had become something that I forgot about, right? I take a picture of everything. I probably take 400 pictures a day. I'm like, I like that logo, bang. I like that street, bang.

Like, it's cool to be able to do it. But now we're also inundated with images all over the world, and a lot of them are horrific events, which is the things that people are trying to capture the most. So it's like every day, like, what? What's going on today? Like, there's. Right now Iran is bombing Israel. So there's missiles. Do you know about this?

Nope.

It's fucking terrifying, dude. It's on like donkey Kong right now. See if you can get some of the footage. Iran is launching hundreds of missiles at Israel, and there was a mass shooting, some sort of a terror attack in Tel Aviv today. As well. So there's some sort of coordinated attack on Israel. Obviously, Israel just did that stuff with Hezbollah where they blew up the pagers and blew up walkie talkies and killed a bunch of people and then shot a bunch of bombs into Lebanon. And it's all getting. It's all getting very, very scary. It's all ramping up in a fucking terrifying way. But this video, it also shows that the Iron Dome, you know, Israel's famous missile defense system, it doesn't seem to be catching all of them. I mean, if you have enough launched your way at the same time, some of them are going to sneak through. So this. This is what it looks like right now. It's fucking crazy. These are all missiles, man, flying at Israel. Yeah, it's fucking terrifying.

And the Iron Dome, this isn't even the best video.

The video that I was seeing was them impacting.

And the Iron Dome is basically a system to shoot them out of the sky.

Yes. So this is where you see the Iron Dome is working. So when they blow up, that's the Iron Dome. So what it is, is they find the trajectory of these missiles. The ones that are going to open area, they let them slip through because it's not going to harm anything. And then, like, those, those are hitting down, but the ones that are going into the city area, they shoot down. And, you know, I'm. I don't know how many missiles they have to do this. I mean, you'd have to have fucking thousands on standby because if they just launch enough at you, you're not gonna have enough missiles. It's like it's launched 180 ballistic missiles.

Wow.

You imagine being in a city, you see 180 missiles coming at you.

I don't know how people live continuously in areas where there's war zones. Like, I know, like my friend Matt Gutman from ABC News, like, he works there and I've seen him running through the streets and doing that hard hitting stuff. But there's also just people getting their groceries.

Yeah.

And they're like, yeah, man, this happens every day. Like, I have friends that live in Israel.

Human beings are very adaptable, unfortunately. Well, fortunately, because that's why we're still here. But unfortunately, we get accustomed to some pretty horrific conditions and that's what people are accustomed to. I mean, imagine living in Gaza. Imagine that you were living in a place where literally a year ago today it was fine. It was. Was normal.

Yeah.

And then now it's rubble and there's tens of thousands of people dead.

And that's an example of what you're saying about seeing these images all the time. I had. I remember when that popped off. And I'm a big believer in you pick one thing that for most people, unless you're, you know, Elon or somebody that can have a bunch of different things going on, but for most of us, you gotta live your life, and you got to pick one thing that you can help from a lot of people. That's your family. For me, I've dedicated myself to protecting the Amazon when it comes to everything else. Like, when I start opening my phone, I remember this. I was at my friend's house and it was 07:00 in the morning, and I opened my phone and it was a picture of a guy lifting his dead baby with a crushed skull. And I threw my phone across the room and it ruined my whole day. And how, like, it's absolutely horrific. And I have become a person that really shields myself from a lot of what's going on because the hysteria levels right now, I don't think even World War two times, they go, okay, Pearl harbor just hit off.

And people are like, wow, this is crazy. But I don't think you were inundated with it all day long. You read the newspaper, you talked to a few people, and then you're like, all right, well, cool, I gotta go get Johnny from school and blah, blah, blah, right?

You didn't see it on your phone. Twenty four seven and it's nothing.

Israel's popping off. The south is getting flooded. The Amazon's burning. Everything is happening all at once, and it's all coming through on the screen.

So it says Iran launches missile attack on Israel, but israeli military says no casualties reported. So I guess that that was the thing that we're saying, that the Iron Dome, when they know that something's going to go to an open area where there's no one there, they don't even bother wasting a missile on that. A us defense official said the United States intercepted some of the missiles to help, help defend Israel. So we're over there, too, doing that. The IDF is doing and will do everything necessary to protect the civilians of the state of Israel. The israeli military said in a statement, warning people in the country to stay in shelters. The explosions you hear originate from interceptions or falls of missiles. The air defense system detects and intercepts threats all the time. So what happened in Tel Aviv today, Jamie? There was some sort of mass shooting in Tel Aviv that coincided with this, which is really scary. You know, it's like what they experienced on October 7. Okay. Fucking ads. At least eight dead and suspected terror attack shooting in Tel Aviv. So they even. Oh, so Jesus Christ. Let's scroll down to that image.

So some dudes just. Yo, just gunning people down. Scroll up. The deadly ordeal unfolded when two gunmen jumped off a train. The central israeli city of Jaffa. Jaffa. And started firing at just 07:00 p.m. local. Just after 07:00 p.m. local time. According to authorities, eight killed, at least seven wounded. And, you know, a lot of people get. That guy's dead right there. A lot of people there are armed too, which is fucking crazy.

Civilians.

Yeah, just walking around hot girls and in, in Israel, like, you can see him at a coffee shop with the fucking. No, with an ar.

Really?

Off of rifle sling. Yeah, there's like a bunch of videos them. Cuz so many of these people. You have mandatory military service in Israel.

Yeah, that I know.

All the civilians have to. There's no civilians. Like, everyone is at least a former soldier.

You got to be ready, right?

Yeah. You have to be shit like that. Walking on the street with machine guns.

Hot girls with machine guns.

How nuts. But that's just the world they live in. It's.

They're just hanging out.

Yep. There's a baby, right? I mean, look, she has like, cute shoes on. At any moment it could pop off. And so they don't fuck around. They just stay strapped. They don't just stay strapped. They stay strapped with fucking weapons of war.

Those are. Those are.

Yeah, those are no joke.

That ain't a six shooter.

No, she's got a gigantic magazine. She's probably got spare magazines. Yeah. And she probably knows how to shoot it. She was in the military.

Know how to use it.

Yeah.

So it's men and women. Men.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Women have to join the israeli military as well. Look, they're surrounded. I mean, this is. This is something that's very different. It's very different than us.

Well, I think that one of the problems that I see with us is I think that people have forgotten. Like, I grew up with the World War two generation, all the. All my old uncles as I was growing up, Paulie, like, you know, these were guys that had, you know, either storms beaches in the South Pacific or were in Europe. And so world War two was fresh on their minds. It was part of the culture I grew up in. And I think when I look at kids born 911 and down or later, I think we've forgotten the fact that safety is a huge privilege.

Oh, yeah.

We grow up safe. Some of the people, the things that they're screaming about or worried about or whatever else, it's like some unity would happen from remembering the fact that that that's. That's a reality.

We can so few attacks on american soil. You know, you have Pearl harbor, which is kind of America. You know, Hawaii should be its own country. I mean, it's feel like it we own Hawaii. I mean, I guess it's good that Hawaii gets the protections of the United States, but it's kind of crazy that it's five mile, 5 hours rather by airplane over the ocean in the middle until you get to Hawaii. And that's considered America. America. But I mean, I don't know how they feel about it. I'm assuming they'd probably like to have sovereignty. But the. The point is, like, that was world War two, so that was Pearl harbor. That's an attack on american soil. What's that? What's after that? It's 911.

911.

That's crazy. Like, we are so used to being safe. Whereas you think of even Russia, what Russia went through, the losses that Russia went through during World War Two. Absolutely fucking horrific. And they've done that throughout history. There's been conflicts throughout history in Russia. Now you go into any other part of the world. I saw something terrible today. Some fucking workers at the Great Wall of China. They didn't want to go the long way around the wall, so they broke down a section of the Great Wall of China so they could drive through.

Did they have machinery? Do they have sled?

Yeah, they're doing fucking construction work out there. So they just broke down great wall jail. Oh, they're gonna get worse than jail, China. Yeah, they're gonna turn you, in case.

That'S terrible.

Make you make iPhones for 20 years, and then they're gonna turn you into a jacket.

That's terrible.

It's fucking horrible, man. It's. And it's. It's a. People are just so gross. Like, imagine that mahogany tree that you saw. Like, look at these assholes. They broke through the Great Wall. Chinese construction workers accused of plowing a hole through the Great Wall. Monsters.

Dude, this reminds me, there was a. There was this. I hated this story. There was a beautiful tree between these two hills. I think it was in the UK or Ireland, I think it was the UK. And like a 16 year old went out with a chainsaw and just cut this tree down. It was this iconic tree, and no one could figure it out for like two days. And he just went and cut it down. It's just like, man, just.

Yeah, people are gross. People are gross. And we all. People are also very short sighted and sometimes don't even understand the consequences of what they're doing. They just do things.

You know, normally I would agree with you. I just think. I think the world that I've been living in the past year, so I've been in rooms and out in the wild with so many incredible people. And I think that more than ever, people, I agree, we're moments away from disaster in any given capacity. But we're also alive at a time in history where people are more considerate than they've ever been.

Yeah, I think so too. Right? Yeah, I think there's just. You're going to get everything right. You're going to get people that are willing to launch missiles at Israel. You're going to get people that are willing to chop down ancient mahogany trees. And then you get people like you that dedicate your life to saving the rainforest. It's one of the cool things about people because it makes people like you so much more exceptional. It makes people so much more interesting because it's rare. And then someone dedicating their entire life to doing what you've done is even more rare. And that's part of the cool thing about people, I think. And it's a horrible thing to say, but I think it's unfortunately true. You need evil to appreciate good. You need hate to appreciate love. It's just a part of the way the human mind and our just overall psychology, the way we operate in the world. It's unfortunate, but it's a part of being a person. And I think hate and anger and destruction actually motivates love and construction and progress and doing things correct and recognizing what can happen if you do things the wrong way.

Let's do things the right way. Like organic farming, like people changing their farms to regenerative agricultural farms, is coming out of people who are looking at these industrial monocrop agriculture farms. And the waste that it produces, which is legal, the waste that it produces in river systems. It's fucking insane. There's a guy that we've had on. His name is Will Harris. And Will is from this farm in Georgia called White Oaks pastures. It's a regenerative farm. He got this farm, it's a family owned farm. They've had it forever. And it took him years to change this farm from an industrial farm to regenerative agriculture. But there's a section of the river near his property where his property line meets his neighbor. So his neighbor has an industrial farm and he has regenerative agriculture. And you could see it in the river. There's a clear line of differentiation. Look at that.

I'm guessing his is the clear one.

Yes. All that stuff. So most of these farmlands, the topsoil is gone. Whoa, Jesus. There's no minerals, there's no nutrients, there's no nothing. And so you have to use industrial strength fertilizers. You have to lose all this garbage and bullshit. And so that stuff, it just sits on the top. And so when the rain comes and when they spray the crops and water the crops, the runoff goes right in the river. So these poor fish are just getting fucking choked to death on all this shit. And then there's the pesticides and the herbicides and whatever the fuck they're spraying.

And this guy is trying to turn it around. He's trying to do the right thing.

That's not will.

Okay?

I don't know who that gentleman is. I think he works with Will, but he's explaining how bad the situation is that comes off of these other farms. So the left is what the creek's supposed to look like, the right is what happens and no consequences. You should be in trouble for this, right? Like, hey, you can't run your farm this way. Like, is this what happens when you run your farm this way? Stop the farm. Okay. We gotta figure out how to do this the right way. Is there a way to. For your water to look like the water's six inches away? Is there a way? Well, that's the only way you can make farming. So in Russia, organic. Like, they don't even allow genetically modified crops anymore.

Really?

No, no. Putin is like, this is bullshit. This should be illegal. When you're a dictator, you can do stuff like that.

But that's a fundamental thing. If you go to a building with a sledgehammer or to the Great Wall of China and you start messing with it, you're going to get in trouble.

Yes.

And it seems like you can cut down forests, pollute the rivers, dump shit in the ocean, and for the most part, it's okay. Yeah, no one's really going to come after you.

And we can do a lot less of that too, if we. Here's another issue, commoditizing hemp. A lot of the stuff that we cut trees down for is paper. Let's google in America how many acres of trees are cut down every year for paper. So the demonization of the recreational drug cannabis came entirely from hemp. The commodity. It wasn't about the drug. No. People had consumed that drug for thousands of years. It's one of the safest drugs in terms of, like, risk profile. The LD 50 of marijuana is nuts.

What's the LD 50?

LD 50 is lethal dose at 50%.

Is that. Can you lethal dose yourself with marijuana?

I used to have a joke about it. Like, the only way, the only way you die from marijuana is if they drop a bundle of it from a CIA drug plan and it hits you in the head. You can do stupid things that could wind up getting killed. You can abuse everything, right? You certainly abuse marijuana. And by the way, I want to say marijuana is not totally safe. Everybody thinks it's totally safe. No, it's not. There's certain people that have a tendency towards schizophrenia. And high dose marijuana has been proven to cause schizophrenic breaks in people. Alex Berenson wrote a book about it. It's called tell your children. And I agree with them. I've met people that have had schizophrenic breaks from marijuana. 40% of the world's industrial logging goes into making paper. This is expected to reach 50% in the near future. US uses approximately 68 million trees each year to produce paper and paper products. Worldwide consumption of paper has risen by 400% in the last 40 years, with 35% of the harvested trees being used for paper manufacture. That's crazy. Crazy.

And you're saying hemp could grow faster? Kind of like van Gogh could grow faster.

That's actually renewable, like that term that people like to throw around. Renewable. Actually renewable. It grows like a weed because it kind of is a weed. My friend Todd used to have, like, a stalk of a mature hemp plant on his desk. And it's about this thick around. Like, if that was a piece of oak, it would be really heavy, but it's hard. Like this table, which is oak, but it's light hemp, like styrofoam, it's light, like balsa wood, but it's hard. So it has incredible power, like, in its fibers. Its fibers are extremely unusual, so they make the most durable clothing, like canvas. The word canvas comes from cannabis.

But is this weed itself? Like, if you have, like, a weed plant, it's not the same thing?

Well, you can. It's the same shape, but you can also grow strains of it that are not psychoactive at all.

It's just a similar, exact same family.

So they weren't growing it as a commodity for drug consumption. They were growing it to make paper. See, this is what happened. I'm taking you down the dark conspiracy of marijuana road. What happened is, in the 1930s, they invented a machine called the decorticator. And what the decorticator did was it allowed you to effectively process hemp fiber easily and quickly. So when Eli Whitney came out with the cotton gin, now, all of a sudden, cotton became a very easy cloth to use, and people started wearing cotton ubiquitously. Right. Well, what they used to use was hemp, because hemp is way more durable. I mean, crazy difference. Like, I have a hemp jiu jitsu ghee made by Datsusara, and you can't rip this motherfucker like, you grab it. And I've had one, one of my ghee old. But if I have a cotton ghee, eight years in, that shit's torn apart.

Yeah.

So the only thing that goes on those things are the threads. And, you know, I don't even. I guess you can make hemp threads. I don't even know if they do. But the point is, it's, like, far more durable as a paper. It's a far superior paper. Far superior. Like, it's much tougher. It's tough to. Like, I've had hemp paper demonstrate to me, like, it's hard to rip, man.

Yeah, crazy.

It's weird. It's a fucking alien plant. It really is. And when they invented this decorticator, well, William Randolph Hearst, who also owned Hearst Publications, who also own paper mills and Scientific America, had on the COVID of their magazine hemp, the new billion dollar crop. And as a show showed the court cater to him. It was all when they invented this thing. So the propaganda to stop the industry of hempen hemp from exploding, Dupont came out with a chemical composition for nylon. They thought, like, they were going to use nylon for ropes. Hemp was what they always use for ropes. Hemp is what they use for sales. So that's a decorticator that looks like a modern one.

It doesn't look too complicated either.

Well, it's basically like a wheel with some teeth to it, and it grinds the shit out of the hemp. And what they used to use back in the day was slave labor, so. Slave labor. And, you know, poor people would have to do all this incredibly back breaking work to break down the fibers because they're so tough and durable. Well, then they invented this machine, and once this machine got rolling, they're like, oh, shit, let's start using hemp because it's way better. So all this forest cutting down shit doesn't need to be completely unnecessary.

And it's because a paper guy wanted.

100% and a paper guy in the 1930s, and so he got together with Harry Anslinger and they utilized all these people that they were using to make alcohol illegal. The pro, excuse me, the prohibitionists during the time where they were going after, you know, whiskey manufacturers and gin makers and these moonshine people, which is where NASCAR came from, by the way. NASCAR came out of moonshiners driving quick. Yeah, they needed a souped up car. So they took those people who were just arresting people all over the country for alcohol, and then they sicced them on them, on marijuana. And marijuana was never the term for cannabis. Marijuana was a slang term for a wild mexican tobacco, a totally different plant. So William Randolph Hearst starts printing articles in his paper about Mexicans and black guys who were smoking this new drug, marijuana, and raping white women. And then they fund reefer madness and they fund these movies, these propaganda, and.

That'S where that comes from.

Marijuana cigarettes, it all comes from hemp. It all comes from the commodity, from them having this interest in paper. Research suggests that hemp is twice as effective as trees at absorbing and locking up carbon. So hemp is one of the fastest growing plants in the world. Can grow 4 meters high in a hundred days. So in a hundred days? High in a hundred days you have a new crop. Yeah, it's the best fucking thing we can grow for paper, which is 40% of all the trees we're chopping down. And it takes forever. You've ever been to old growth forests in, like, the Pacific Northwest where they do logging? But you've been to the Amazon, you've seen the worst slash and burn art. But, but the point is if you go to these, these places where they cut the trees, they grow new trees, they plant new trees there, but it takes forever.

I mean, so how old is a sequoia tree? How old is it?

Reds of years, thousands of years.

There's. I see those pictures. I can't remember this dude's name. He takes a picture with the trees before the loggers come through. And I mean trees, you know, double.

The size of this room. Yes.

And then he has this picture with the tree after, and it's fucking heartbroken.

It's a horrible thing, man. It's horrible that we can just walk up to something that's 1000 years old and make a fucking basket out of it. Like, this is unnecessary. It's totally unnecessary.

Yep.

And it could. Well, it can all be mitigated. This can all be mitigated. All of it can. You know, the real problem is hardwoods. You know, hardwoods are very, very valuable and people like them and, you know, and they're protected in some places and not others. Like in California, if you have oak trees, you can't chop them down unless you get it permanently. We had a tree that was about to fall on our house. It's like, it's like it's on the way. Go. And, you know, California, the earth tends to shake a little bit. Things go sideways and your fucking house gets crushed by a tree. But you know, you have to, there's, we have to figure out how our desire for hardwood, like the source of that hardwood. If your desire for a beautiful, you know, mahogany table, well, they're beautiful. Gorgeous. Look at your desk. Amazing. But if you could go to the Amazon and see that someone chopped down a tree that you were describing, that massive tree that people had probably hadn't seen in 100 years or whatever, maybe ever. Who knows?

Some of these trees are 1200 years old.

Maybe there's no one else dumb enough to walk through that place with no water.

We might have been the first people to ever see that tree.

When I was in Scotland, they were claiming this. I don't know if this is true, but. Cause there's a lot of really old shit in Scotland. They have these stones.

Really?

Yeah, we were in Scotland. There's these guide stones on the ground. And I go, what's that from? They go, we don't know. I go, how old is it? They're like, it's about 5000 years old. I was like, what? You just walk up to a 5000 year old stone? There's a stone circle out there. There's a stone circle like that someone has constructed. It's similar to Stonehenge but on a much, much smaller scale. And it's older than Stonehenge. And it's just on the street in front of this dude's house. So this guy said, you want. No. It has a little plaque that's like that big. So we got out of the car and we walk over to. You walk on it. You can stand on it. I'm like, this is so weird. Like, how old is this? They're like, we're not exactly sure, but it's thousands and thousands of years old.

Like the druids made where it came from.

They don't know. They don't know who did it. They don't know why. This guidestone was just on the ground next to this pathway. And I was like, what is this? Like, that's a, you know, 5000 year old guidestone. Like, what is what?

Whoa.

Who may put that there? Why isn't a museum built around this fucking thing? That's crazy. It's just laying on the ground.

No, I mean, it's. It's what? This is a meteorite?

Yes. So weren't they saying that? So they were telling me that the oldest tree in the world is in Scotland. I was like, what? I don't know how that's true.

I thought the oldest tree was.

Has to be in Africa.

Mmm.

Wouldn't it be?

I thought it was in the Middle east somewhere. It was like one of those. It's like, you know, like 6ft tall and like super, like predates Jesus. Like, you know, it's like ancient. Ancient.

Real tree. Yeah, like, what's the oldest tree? No, this is just. I didn't want to tell the guy. Get the fuck out of here. This ain't the oldest tree. He was. He was giving me a tour. A tour of the land. These are coos. These are coos. Cows. They call the cows coos. I go, what are you saying, mandy, man? Scotland's oldest tree. So it's 3009 thousand years old.

Between three and nine. That's a big swing.

Yeah. They don't know. They're just getting. That's the thing about that area. There's a lot of just guessing. There's a lot of just guessing. So see if you can show me a photo of the oldest tree. Yeah. They're gnarly looking. Like, you're saying it's not like a massive tree. No, it's, you know, when you walk by it, you would think, oh, it's just a tree. You never think that thing, 9000 years old.

But. Well, I'm curious what the oldest tree period is.

I think that's the one. That's the one they were saying is the oldest tr. Well, this is just what this guy is telling me. What is that one? The oldest tree in the world? Where? What's that one? That one looks like the Middle East. I don't think so. No. Couldn't be right.

Bristlecone.

Where's that one?

Pine creepation. Hundred years. Doesn't say.

Where's bristlecone?

California.

California. So the oldest tree in the world's in California? Oh, no, no. It says it. Yeah. I don't think they're thinking. They're saying trees. Atlanta is the website. That's kind of weird. Is that maybe just like trees around the world that they're studying in Atlanta?

Wrong.

Rabbit hole is all me. Mmm. The oldest tree in the world. Looks like shit. Looks like you would expect the oldest tree. You wouldn't expect the oldest tree to look like those great redwoods. California.

California doesn't have a single fucking leaf.

So how old is that one live? How old is the oldest tree in the world? 4855 years old.

Yikes.

Methuselah, they have a name for it. So some cocker sucker, you know, there's some dude that's thinking about turning that into a desk. You know, there's some fucking tech shithead. US Forest Service doesn't tell visitors precisely where methuselah stands, nor does the organization release photographs of the ancient tree. Someone's gonna. Yeah, someone's gonna fuck it up.

Can you, can you look up what the. What the, what the. Like, how old the general Sherman is. I'm curious about the sequoias, but this.

Is interesting, Jamie, because this is, I guess, that other websites. Incorrect, because the other website was saying it might be 9000 years old. This is the same tree right here, I think, the U from northern Wales. Wouldn't that be. Yeah, but that's not Scotland. Different country. But I'm sure they have some old shit, too.

Prometheus.

I think that's the thing about a lot of these old, old trees is it's kind of guesswork.

Yeah.

I don't think they really know. And I think it probably behooves them. Behooves them to exaggerate a little hooves, you know, because it's kind of a good bragging point. Say we got the oldest city in the world.

That's a draw for your. For your town, whatever, sort of.

There's no one out there. It was really cool.

Like six people.

There's no one in Scotland, bro. Just fucking Scotland is like the whole country is like the size of Austin. Something about the oldest in terms of population living. Single stem tree on. Yeah, single stem.

Not all complicated like the ones we just saw. This is like a pole. A lot of the rainforest trees are like this, where it's just a pillar.

General Sherman. So is that a sequoia?

Yeah.

Yeah. Man, you've. You. Have you gone up to northern California? Did that rain for us?

I haven't been up to the northern Cali, but the, where the general Sherman is, it looks, you know, you know, like if you play like Super Mario 64, like when you get like, you go into like giant land. Mm hmm. There was a sequoia tree that had fallen over. I mean, the thing was, you know, 36ft thick, I don't know, but I couldn't climb on top of the tree and it fell over and it went from here for like a city block.

Yeah, they have one that has a tunnel carved out. Yeah, well, you could drive your car through it.

They're so cool. And people want to cut them down. Yeah, there's people frothing to cut those.

Oh, yeah, people are gross. Especially some fucking psychopath who's on Adderall. Sherman tree contains more wood volume in its trunk than any other tree on earth.

And, you know, that's not the best one.

That seems like, to make sense to me. Like, that's the oldest tree. You know, when I see that little ratty little fucking bush in the desert, like, that's not the old. You lying bitch.

Yeah, I see. I thought it would be somewhere on the side of a mountain where that. Where it's like high wind and they're growing slow over a thousand years. So no humans would have been up there. And every year it's just adding, you know, a millimeter to its. To its, you know, its.

Well, we know so much about the world in comparison to what they knew 500 years ago, but yet we still know so little. They still, like 2010, they found a new human species to the Denisovans. They didnt even know the Denisovans were a thing until 2010. And now they think that the Denisovans, like a lot of the Aborigine people in Australia, have Denisovan in them and maybe possibly even neanderthal in theme.

They only described the fact that there was two species and not one species of fucking elephant in Africa in the nineties.

Well, wasn't a gorilla like a myth until they went, I think gorillas were like, mythical creatures until like the 18 hundreds. Like, when did they discover gorillas?

I mean, I think the first European to see a gorilla probably, well, I'm.

Sure african saw gorillas, but they couldn't get the word out.

But like, the first explorer with his, you know, his chainmail to show up and look at a gorilla.

It wasn't until early 19th century that people native from the areas where they live, such as the democratic republic of the Congo and Gabon, knew gorillas better. But among people outside of Africa, they were mostly mythological creatures.

There's human, like, big 400 pound monsters in the, like insane. Yeah, well, there's insane.

There's the. This is a really controversial one. It's the Bondo age, and that's a particular area of the Congo called Billy. And Billy has this unusual strain of chimpanzees that have a crest on their head like a gorilla. So, like, this is a normal chimpanzee skull.

Okay.

See how it's smooth on the top? Gorillas have this big crest because their mandible muscles are so massive because they mostly just. They only eat plants, so they're mostly eating fiber. So they're just crushing roots. And all day long it has to grab onto that massive muscles. Well, these chimpanzees, they thought initially they perhaps were a hybrid between chimpanzees and gorillas because they're much bigger. They're like 6ft tall. A hybrid between chimpanzees and they're enormous. It's a really controversial thing. Like, some people think that it's just an unusual group of chimpanzees. Like, there's this area in Africa, there's a documentary on it called Relentless Enemies. It's an amazing documentary about this river changed course over the years, and these lions got stuck on this island with nothing but water buffalo. So all the lions look like Yoel Romero. They all just look fucking brock lesnar lions. Just super female lions as big as male lions in other parts of Africa. Super jack female lions just fucking up these water buffalo.

They do all the heavy lifting.

Yeah. Because they. Well, they have to adapt to their environment. So there was some thought that maybe this was a particular strain of chimpanzees that had adapted and was just unusually large. But they're fucking huge, man. There's a guy named Carl Arman. He's a swiss wildlife photographer, and he dedicated his life to exploring these animals and documenting them. And he got photographs of them on a camera trap walking on two legs. But you guys see what they look like? Oh, yeah. They look nutty. They look nutty. I mean, they're hunched over a little bit, but they look so much bigger than a regular chimpanzee.

So this is a real thing. This isn't like cryptography?

Oh, no, no, no. They have. They have tissue samples, they have bones.

So we have separate DNA for.

Yep. Plenty of videos of these things. It's an actual animal. The question is, is this a subspecies? Is it a completely different species? It's like. Right. You know, they have bonobos, the tissue. Well, it's a novel tissue, though, right? So it's a new thing. So if it is, they're trying to figure out exactly what happened and how many of them there are. And it seems to be in this incredibly dense, war torn area of the Congo where these things live. But we know there's bonobos, right. Which kind of look like chimpanzees, but they're really different. They're not violent at all. They just fuck. Yeah, they just make. They have arguments. They fuck each other, and that's how they get over everything.

They use hemp.

Yeah, they probably do. They're probably stoner monkeys. I wonder what's in their diet. But these monkeys are these chimpanzees, rather very different than the other chimpanzees, like, from chimp nation, where they're super violent and they kill monkeys all day, and they, you know, they fight over fruit.

Chimp. Chimp nation is the. Is the Netflix.

Netflix document. Fucking amazing. That's the one where the scientists were embedded with these chimpanzees for 20 years. So the chimpanzees behave completely normal.

When you say embedded, like, what goodall did? Like, sitting there, like, yes, right there.

They lived with them.

Yeah.

So they set up camp in these forests, and they had very clear rules. Number one, stay 20 yards away. Always not much, not much. Pretty close. But when it gets closer to 20 yards, get out of there. No food. Don't bring any food. Don't look them in the eyes. No fucking around. And so the chimpanzees, they. Their whole life, chimpanzee lives, you know, in the wild, probably 1520 years or whatever, their whole life, they've been around these people, so they act completely normal. Those people are just like another tree, just another thing that's not of consequence. It doesn't steal resources from them, it doesn't try to intimidate them. It doesn't infringe in their territory. Never gets closer than 20 yards. No worries. So because of that, they've got this insane footage. It's one of the most incredible documentary series of all time. And they study the social behavior between the chimpanzees. And I had the guy on who directed it, it was really fascinating. I'm like, how often do they eat monkeys? He's like, dude, we couldn't even show them all. They just eat monkeys all day.

Monkeys all day.

That's their favorite thing to do.

And they just rip them apart.

Yeah. And they didn't even know that until the nineties, when David Attenborough went to the jungle to film chimpanzees. They caught them hunting monkeys and eating them alive.

It's terrifying.

It's crazy. There's a monkey, and he's this chimp has it, like, his hand is around its waist, and it's just eating it from the hips. Down like this. And the monkey's going, Jesus. It's just got this little monkey face that looks so much like ours. It's so close to us, and this chimp's just chewing chunks.

And so they have 20 chips pulling.

A leg off and handed it to this other chimp and he's chewing it.

They share.

Oh, yeah, they share. Well, that's a big part of this docu series. Interesting is how they set up those social structures. Their social structures are so similar to ours. It's like we think that the biggest chimpanzees, like the alpha male, it's not some of them. It's not. It's a smart one who has made comrades and made a community and is very fair. Chimpanzees have a very strong sense of fairness and being slighted. Like, if one of the elders doesn't get a piece of the monkey, they get fucking furious. Like, what have you done? You have to make right. Like, you have to, like, soothe people's or monkeys. Chimpanzees anger being slighted, dude.

Yeah, well, I. When I was. I always remember this as a kid, I was watching a nature show and they had a. I had called the third beetle principle. There was. The two male beetles were battling and the females watched. And while the two male beetles are battling, the third beetle comes and fucks the female.

That's what happens with elk all the time.

And it was just like, you know, be a third.

Yeah. They studied whitetail deer as well. Same, same thing happens. The big guys are fighting when the big guys are fighting. The little sneaky ones, like, hey, yeah, ladies, like that. See? Do you have any. See if you can find a photograph of that bondo ape.

Yes, please. I need to.

Again, very controversial, though, if he has, because, like, people don't want to believe it's real one. Right? So that's one. Yeah. That one's a dead one. They shot at an airport. Holy. Look at the size of it compared to those guys. It's so much bigger than trying to.

Get on a plane.

This is, um. You ever see that movie the congo? It's a stupid movie.

Like, uh, I read the book. It was a cool book with, like.

The gorillas, but those chimpanzees, the crazy chimpanzees, were based on these bondo apes. Yeah, that's the idea.

So look at that picture up in the top, right with it. The black and white one.

Yeah. Well, see if the fire find the camera trap photo. Scroll down a little bit. It'll probably be one of the first photos that you see, there's a camera trap photograph of. No, that's a different one. That's one that lived in America.

If I saw that in the forest, I would kill myself.

There's one. They called them humanzi. And they thought at one point in time that maybe somebody had fucked a chimpanzee. These are all. That's it. That's it. Where it says world of Carl Aman on the top shelf? Yeah, right there. That's the camera trap photo. That's not the best version of it I've seen. More. Clear version. But he's walking around and they're enormous. These guys said they had a Land Rover and they had a defender and they stopped or whatever the truck was. They stopped the truck in the road as one walked by. And it was taller than the truck.

What, so they're huge.

They're enormous. Some of them are. Like I said, they're like six foot tall chimpanzees. And just imagine how strong a regular chimp is. So that is. That's definitely that one up there. Click on that. That's. Click on the gallery. So Karl, Armand is this guy who was this wildlife photographer that when they became aware of this subspecies.

See.

See the photographs of the skull?

Yeah.

See that ridge? Right. So the one behind it is a regular chimpanzee skull. And then the much larger one is the bondo ape skull. They also nest on the ground like gorillas. Yeah, they're like, nobody's fucking with me. They're fucking huge, man. And there's not a large population of them. And they're not.

It's not very well studied because it's so remote.

Very fucking dangerous to get there. But you see those bones on the ground? Show that image again. Look at the size difference between the regular chimpanzee skull, huge in the background, and then the bondo ape in the foreground. And look at the crest on the head of.

Yeah.

The locals have two names for chimpanzees. They call them tree beaters and lion killers.

Lion killers.

Lion killers. And the lion killers. First of all, there's no lions in the jungle, right? No lions.

Not king of the jungle.

Well, there's no lions. Lions live in the savannah, right? So calling them lion killers is probably just a fun name. But they have found. They did video one that was eating a jaguar or a leopard, rather a leopard, but they don't know it. Found the leopard dead and ate it. They don't know what the fuck happened.

Could've coordinated it, did it really did jack a leopard.

I mean, maybe it was a small leopard. Well, you got to think if it's really 6ft tall. So a regular chimpanzee gets to be like a full grown male, is probably like 180 pounds. Like a big giant jack chimpanzee.

100, 8180 pounds.

And the strength of a 500 pound man. Like, so you what you weigh probably close to it, right? You probably. Yeah. So your weight. But the strength of a 500 pound man. Now imagine. That'd be cool. Now imagine one that's not 5ft tall but 6ft tall and is not 200 pounds but 300 pounds or 350. What?

Get that guy in the octagon, dude.

Fuck that. A regular chimpanzee would fuck a human up. But that photograph of those two men that's sitting there with one that they shot, that's one that they think is confirmed to be one of these bondo apes. And it's so much bigger. Bigger than them. But you have to think like, okay, these guys, like, first of all, they're in the background. Just like when you catch a fish, you hold the fish out in front of you. It's a perspective.

This is an anaconda thing.

Exactly. But the guy does have his hand on his shoulder and just. There's some things you can't fake. Like the size of his nuts.

I was gonna say the size of his nuts is the size of that guy's face.

And look at the size of his hand. His hand's massive. There's a massive chimpanzee.

Grab onto some serious branches with that.

Google humanzi. Because humans II was a weird one. They had this. These people had this chimpanzee and they. They dressed it up like a person and it had weird facial features where it looked like so similar to a person.

Yeesh.

It's. We. It looks weird. There's better images of it and there's video of this. But I think along the way. That one right there. To the left of that. Yeah, right there where you're at is good too.

So.

So look at his face.

I don't like that.

Strange, right? Strange features.

He could work at a bank.

Very weird. So it led people to think that his name was Oliver. That led people to think that Oliver was some sort of a hybrid. But it doesn't seem like he is.

It just seems like he's a weird chimpanzee.

Odd facial. But look, they put him in a fucking suit and tie and shit and they're fine. But he came sexually attracted to his care and preferred humans over chimps. The problem with those things is they're horny. Just like, you know. And he doesn't even know there's other chimps because he doesn't get to see them, you know, close enough. He's like, I'll fuck you, lady. And like, she's taking care of him. Was like, take care of this. He's jokes. He's a horny, fucking terrible chimpanzee.

I've heard that orangutans do that, too.

I'm sure they're primates. Well, this is, you know, that's that chimp nation show that's on. Have you seen that on Netflix?

I haven't seen. I've been. I been obsessed with the hundred foot wave.

I'm not. I'm serious. Not chimp nation. Chimp crazy. Chimp crazy is all about these people that are like the Tiger King people that are all. Instead of having tigers, they have chimps.

Just crazy people with chimps in their house.

Yeah. Crawls up. He's like, what the fuck? Chimps. They'll eat you, Carl, you know? Goddamn heartbeat. This article about Oliver has this photo we've used a lot as. I don't know. Oh, that's not Oliver. No, that article. Yeah, that's just another chimpanzee. That's not him. But he. I'm sure they took him from the Congo, I mean, or wherever. There's apparently. This is also something that we learned from the guys from chimp crazy that were on. We're explaining how this trade works where they kidnap these babies from their mother, and then they start raising them in captivity in America. And some places, like Wyoming, it's legal. So they all go to Wyoming and. Or was it Missouri? Where was it they buy chimps? Missouri, right?

I mean, that. The whole tiger king thing.

Fucking nuts, man.

Dude, those people all are just normal people that have wild animals. Ligers, dude. They. I don't know if I should say this. They. Way before the tiger King thing, one of. One of the dudes, not the main tiger King guy, one of the other guys. And the Myrtle beach guy invited me to his place, and he's like, is.

That the guy runs the sex cult?

Yeah. And he was like, you gotta help me legitimize my shit. I'm a real conservationist. And so me and my friend Mohsen, who, you know, we do all the photography, all the Amazon fire stuff together, and we were like, you want to go fucking hang out with tigers for a weekend? He was like, yeah, let's go. And so they were like, look, we're legit. You gotta, you know, you're a real conservationist. Come over here. Tell the world about us. Yeah. So what they do is they have people sit in a circle and you can go, like, with your date and pay for this. And they put a tiger cub in your lap. Great. Cool. But then what do you do with those 16 tiger cubs next year when they weigh 500 pounds? And that's the answer. They all have an incinerator on site.

Oh, no.

Yeah. So they're breeding tigers and incinerating them. Also. I was standing there. So many weird things happened that weekend, dude. It was like. It was going.

So when they get to be dangerous, they just shoot them. I think, burn them.

I don't know how they euthanize them, but they have an incinerator on site and they're producing tigers. When you go, where do the tigers go?

Oh, my God.

They go, well, you know. And they're going, save tigers. Save the world. And there's animals everywhere. I was. I was doing something, and the girl walks by with a liger.

Oh, yeah.

I felt like I was on mushrooms. The thing's fucking head is this big.

Yeah. They're so big.

You know, in sandlot when they see the beast and it's like. It's like an animatronic giant. It looked ridiculous. This liger walked by and was as tall as I was, and I was just went, I don't like it here.

Well, it's a weird hybrid, because I think it's. Is it a male tiger and a female lion or a male lion and a female tiger? I think it's a male tiger. So, in. The problem is, in male lions, the gene that regulates size exists. So when a male lion breeds with a female lion. I might be fucking this, but I know that this is the problem with the liger, why they're so big, is because whether it's the male or the female. So it's a hybrid offset male lion and a tiger female. Okay, so in the female lion, then, or in the male tiger, one of them, there's this gene that regulates how big you get, and it doesn't exist in the liger.

They don't look right.

They just. They get so big.

Their head.

How big do they get? Jim? Amy. Jesus Christ.

Although a siberian tiger, I think, can also get, like 900 pounds. Like that. Like an emerald tiger. Like, I think they can get pretty big.

I think so, too.

I think a liger is way off the charts.

I think ligers might be bigger than that.

Yep. That was their. Scroll down a little bit, Jamie. Just 800.

There's. There's the 1900 pounds. That one's.

That's the cat. That's a dude.

Yeah. So this one says it got to 922 pounds. Hercules, the largest non obese liger. So he's non obese. Not fatso. They try to cheat, give him donuts.

That's some body positive bullshit.

He's obese. I bet he's not if he's 922. Wow. When he was three years old, he weighed 408 pounds. Oh, God. My God. 900 pounds. 408. My God. And now it weighs. Oh, my God. Valley of the Kings animal sanctuary in Wisconsin had a male liger named who weighed over 1213 pounds. Oh, my God. So lion and tiger in captivity are under 1100 pounds. Like, what is. How big does a siberian tiger get? What's the largest siberian tiger?

See that? I would say 900 pounds. I feel like that upper limit is 900 pounds. And I have, from nose to tail, about 12ft.

That's a.

Those are my guesses.

That's such a big animal. The Siberia. 11ft long.

Yeah. That book. That book, the tiger is one of the best books.

It's ten foot, eleven inches long from nose to tail, weighed 932 pounds. Look at that face, bro. They're so beautiful too. That's what's crazy, that it's a cat that lives in the snow. Like, you think of tigers, you think of India.

Jungle.

Jungle. Yeah. You don't think of a cat that lives in Siberia and it's the biggest.

One and messed up up the bears.

Oh.

And controls the wolf populations, that paw.

Oh, my God. Yeah. And just. It's crazy that it's such a gorgeous thing that's killing you. Like, when you see them, you. It's probably part of the trick. Like, you're, like, hypnotized by how beautiful it is. Like, wow, look at this thing.

Would you ever see in life and color? They show you the spectrum that deer see in. They don't see orange, right? Because that was my question growing up as a kid. I was like, why? Like, why would. If you want to blend in, why the hell would you be orange and white and black? It seems like that's like the most. It's like having a neon.

Well, it's because the most dangerous thing in the forest is people, especially people with guns.

Yeah. No, no, but I'm saying before, that.

Is why they did it. They do it so that you don't get shot by hunters. That's the whole reason why you have orange on.

Sure, but I'm saying it stands out. But I'm saying. So my question was, why would a tiger. Because deer see orange.

Tigers live in the grass and there's a lot of shadows and stripes.

Yeah.

They show you can move around.

They show you deer vision. And it's. They literally don't register that color orange. So it just looks like more green shit. And a tiger vanishes. It's such a cool clip. It's on one of those. David Attenborough.

Also, why zebras have those funky stripes? I think with them.

Yeah. Confuses.

I think all those lines fuck with them because they're not seeing things. Like, we're seeing this cup, we're seeing, you know, your phone, seeing writing. I don't think they see like that. They reckon, like, it's. A lot of it is edge detection and motion. Like, you know, I was just elk hunting and I got a video on my instagram. So. Yeah, they, like, blend in.

Yeah.

So they would not see all that stuff. They would just see what looks like branches.

Yeah. Like, squint and look at that image. And it's easy to see it for us. It's very difficult to see it for them.

And if they're in the jungle, densely foliated jungle and there's all these trees and shit, they would just blend right the fuck in and just lay in water. Wait for something that's slower than them.

But I was thinking when you were saying about the Bondo ape, one of the things that we're doing now is we're using Starlink to deploy camera traps in areas. Because you just take a Starlink, put it up in the top of a tree. I have a guy on my team, Stefan. He figured this out. We take Starlink, you put it up in the top of a tree so it has access. Someone's got to climb the tree.

Put a solar panel.

You got to have Starlink and a solar panel and just like, a little box to run everything. And then you can deploy remote camera traps around. And so we're getting. Now, we haven't published this yet, but we're getting live feed from parts of the Amazon where there's no people.

And with the Starlink, you can send it back to with Wi Fi so you don't have to get the cards.

Dude, we get updates on our phones.

Oh, my God. That's incredible.

So if we did this in Bondo.

Ape territory, probably find them. Yeah, but you probably get fucked up getting in there and putting that stuff up there. That's the problem? It's humans.

Me and Lex could do it.

Yeah. The problem is the humans. I mean, it's essentially run. It's a war zone run by warlords. And then if you go into the Congo, you have the cobalt mines. You have all these things that are run by China. There's all the slave labor operations that are going out there, and it's just the whole area. My friend Justin, he runs this charity fight for the forgotten. He goes to the Congo and he builds wells. And, you know, we've had him on a few times talk about his experiences over there. But getting to these people to try to build wells for them is fucking just fraught with peril. You're dealing with just gunfights break out, people get robbed, people get pulled over and guns held to their head. Everything gets stolen from them.

Blood diamond.

Yes. Just lawlessness run by warlords. Different, you know, different towns. You go into a run by different people. You have to have translators sometimes. Translators? Like, this is not good. This is not good. Oh, fuck. And, you know, you're just over there trying to help people, and you're. So if you're going to study these chimpanzees like, this ain't no. This ain't like the fucking Pacific Northwest. Just going to the woods and like, oh, there's a deer. No, this is. You're dealing with humans, dangerous humans who are desperate and who have lived their whole life in these conditions.

When you go elk hunting, how long do you spend? Like, how. How long is an elk hunt for you?

I give myself a week. I always have a week. But, you know, a lot of guys who have more time, they'll do ten days. It depends on what kind of hunting you're doing. I'm doing it in places where there's. It's private access, so it's not. If you have public land, you're gonna get a lot of hunters on that land, especially if there's elk, and it pushes the elk deeper and deeper into the forest. And if you want to really find them, a lot of these guys, they'll put their, like, my friend Aaron Snyder, he'll put a backpack on. He'll go two weeks, and they'll go, you know, 26, 30 miles in.

Yeah.

And that's where the elk are. And so not only that, you have to pack them out.

Oh, yeah.

So if you kill an elk 30 miles in and it's 30 miles as the crow flies.

Yeah. It's 30 miles of terrain.

You're going up and down and up and down thousands of feet of elevation, and it takes them days to get the animal out and had it.

Yeah, I've seen the videos of that guy. You had this guy on. He's. He's awesome. Donny Vincent. Yes, I've seen. He does a very good job of documenting his elcons. And he's always got the backpack with the antlers on.

Yep. And you have to have a fucking strong back, man. And trekking poles are a must. And, you know, you're carrying something on your back that's almost what you weigh. You got a person on your back, and you're trying to go 30 miles, elevate, and that's only one trip.

Yeah, you get.

You're done. You drop it off. You have to get it on ice or do something, depending, rather, on what the temperature is outside. You have to preserve the meat. You have to put it somewhere, usually in a cooler. You lock it down. Whatever you do, you quarter it out, bone it out, and then you're going back. So you're going 30 miles for load number two. And if you're so low, there's a lot of guys that solo elk hunt, you might have to go in four times to get all the meat out because you physically can't carry it all 30 miles up and down the mountains without risk of, like, dying.

No. How much does an elk. I mean, elk is gigantic.

Hundreds of pounds of meat. So I could tell you exactly, because we shot these elk in Utah, and then we brought them to this meat processing place that makes you sausages and all kinds of cool shit. And they weigh it. So they weigh your meat, and it was 400 pounds of meat?

Of harvested meat.

Yeah. I mean, on. There's bones. No, there's still bones and the quarters, but the bones aren't that much weight. Let's. Let's just say. Let's say the bones are 100 pounds. Let's just. I don't think they are, but let's say they are. Yeah, I don't think they are, because it's just a couple leg bones. It's quartered. So it's basically the femurs attach, you know, like a rear hind quarter and a front quarter. Let's say it's 100 pounds. It's still 300 pounds of meat. You got to get out on your own.

Yeah. You.

300 pounds on your back. So you've got to do it in hundred pound trips, probably, if you're smart, but some guys get crazy.

100 pound pack is a lot.

I know it is. I. I know a guy fucked his backup because he tried to do 180 pounds and he went like 25 miles and his back's destroyed. His back is so destroyed that one of his arms is atrophying. Yeah, because his nerves are getting pinched because his fucking disks are all bulged out. And I fucked up.

So you shoot an elk and then you, you, let's say you're with two guys, I don't know, and you, you take as much as you can and you come out. Now, in the meantime, that carcass is sitting there. You just. You just try and get back as soon as you can. Like, the meat doesn't go bad.

No, it's cold out. It's cold out. When I was hunting, it was hailing okay, you know, so it's like some of the days it was in the thirties, some of the days it was in the forties, but it's play over. Yeah, it totally can. But we didn't have to wait overnight. We packed it out that day. I got very lucky that my friends came down and helped me. So we were in the bottom of this canyon. It's very, very steep, this part that's like extremely difficult to get to, which is why the elk go there. So it's like you have to be very physically fit just to get there. Just to get, like when I do cardio getting ready for elk hunts, I'm literally. I get ready for it. Like I have to go into a fight or something.

You train for it.

I'm doing sprints on the air dime machine just to pump my legs up, just to do, I'm doing box jumps and box steps with weights. I'm doing all these bodyweight squats just to have strong legs. Just because you have to deal with this terrain if you want to go where the elk are. Yeah, because they know where the cats are and they know where they can hide and they know where they can get away from people. And that's in the areas that are hard to get to, which is the mountains, and the more hard to get to. And the elk go up it like it's nothing. Like they just fucking run right up it. Like it's. It's so wild to watch because you, you're struggling to go like a mile an hour. And these motherfuckers are like running over the top of the hill like it's nothing. But that's why they're there. They're there because they know that it's tough to get there and people won't fuck with them there. And, you know, they rarely get fucked with there. So that's how you have to get to. So I got lucky that there was five guys in camp with me and everyone took a load.

And I think Cam Haines has a photo of it on his instagram of all of us packing it out. It was in one of those multiple photo things. But so that helped a lot because if it was just me and my friend Colton, who was my guide, it would have probably taken this fucking most of the day. Most of the day just to get it to the top of the hill where you can get a four by four to it.

So you're not worried about. You don't have, like, camping gear also, so you're.

No.

Okay.

No, that's good. Yeah. But a lot of guys do. And those guys, the most effective hunters that go into public land, which is a much tougher thing to do. Right. Cause I said because of pressure and also because if you want to go where the elk are, the elk, there's a lot of people, there's pressure, and the elk are gonna get the fuck out of dodge. And so you have to find out where they are. It's a lot more groundwork work, and you're covering a lot more miles. So these guys, they put their camp on their back and they do the chop the toothbrush in half, that whole deal. Bring stereo. They know where the water is, and they use things like onyx maps, so they chart their pet. That's all of us.

Nice.

So we're packing out. That's all the elk quarters on different people's backs. And that head up there, that's me carrying the head out with the antlers.

Nice.

You know, and it's that we were real, like I said, real lucky that we had friends there to help us. But if you do that by yourself, if you're out there by yourself and you're 30 miles in, you got to be so strong. Who got to be so strong?

Whose shot was that?

I think it was Adam, my friend Adam Green tree. He's an awesome photographer. That's in Australia who's with us hunting, too. But that's the kind of hunting that I do is the easiest kind of hunting as far as that goes.

As far as bow hunting in the wilderness goes. Yeah. In that you could do with a gun. There's hundred times easier.

Oh, it's. No, but what I'm saying is, like, there's not going to be a lot of people there. No one's going to fuck with you. And, you know, the elk are there. So the much more difficult path is like the public land hunter who has to go deep into the forest to get away from all the people. Like, my friend Adam told me he went 23 miles into the forest once, and he's like, no one's going to be any found two tents. He's like, motherfucker. These hunters, they're all realizing, like, so there's like, a category of hunter that's like these athletes that love it. Yeah. And. But they're athletes. Like, these guys are super physically fit. So they can go 25 miles, 30 miles in, and they can be by themselves, which is.

Which is pretty serious.

Oh, yeah, man.

Yeah. You did a great job of explaining to that one guy about why wolves and elk, and because you're saying, like, you know, fundamentally, like, you know, goddess and the fact that animals eat each other, and you're like, because there's wolves, elk are mega athletes that can run up a mountain. And I was just like. I was listening to it. Yes, yes, yes, yes.

Yeah. That's why they are the way they are. You can't take that out of this equation. Like people want, oh, let's have all the elk live in harmony where they never have to worry about getting eaten. That's not real.

Just standing there.

Yeah, what you're saying is not real. So if you're saying you don't want hunting, you're saying you want these animals to die in a far more horrific way. Because we need population control. Some say we need it with people, but that's the World Economic Forum. But what I think is, with animals, at least we understand, like, we have wildlife biologists that are incredible at this job and they understand what the holding populations are. They're like, this is how much food is there. This is how many deer are there. This is sustainable. We can give out this amount of tags and so we keep the population. But you have to also take into account wolves. When wolves move into an area, everything gets fucked. Everything gets fucked. They kill off a giant percentage of the calves. They kill off domestic animals. They do surplus kills sometimes. Like in Wyoming, they found this crazy surplus kill where these wolves had killed like 100 cow elk and they were just laying there because if they can, they can't help themselves, man. If they can do it, they're going to do it. Like, if they're stuck in snow or something's going on or they can't get away, if they got them cornered, they just go on a slaughter fest.

Well, it's like, that's like when we were in school and they were like, you know, the Native Americans only took. You know, and then, like, you read empire, the Summer moon, and you're like.

Oh, it's all lies. It's all lies. The Native Americans were unbelievably brutal to each other.

The Comanches were insane. That changed my whole view of everything.

They're gonna do a movie.

They better. They better.

Is it a movie or a series? It's a movie, right?

I hope that. No, it's.

But it's Taylor Sheridan.

Yeah.

So, yeah, he'll do it.

Right. I was reading that book on an expedition, and I was like, when did we stop being warriors?

Never.

When. No, I'm talking about going on right now. But the mentality. The mentality where they'd be like, oh, yeah, Quanta was, you know, by this stream, and they saw some other. Another tribe going that when they. They just went, let's go get them. You don't need to do that. You might die. Well, they were just like, let's go.

They went on raiding parties, so they.

Thought it would go.

And that's what it was to them. They'd go and find other native tribes and fuck them up and sometimes eat them.

Yeah, but I'm saying, like, that, to me, given the modern context, like, we're raised to be so sensitive and so considerate, and it's like these people you read about, the. I don't remember Quanah's mom's name, but the. Cynthia Ann Parker, the woman that was.

There's a photo of her on the lobby.

Yeah, yeah.

Breastfeeding her baby.

Yeah. She was kidnapped, and I think she had a baby that they killed. And then fast forward, like, five years, ten years later, and she only speaks command.

She didn't have a baby when they caught her? No, she was only nine.

Okay, so there was someone that they caught, and she had a baby, and they killed it on the.

Yeah, like.

But. But then she became a Comanche.

I think they killed her mother's other child. Yeah, I think that's when they killed her mother. And they raped her mother. And they were unbelievably brutal, but they had a hard time with their population because they're riding horses so much, they're.

Losing a lot of babies.

Exactly. So to mitigate that, they would take young kids. So they find young kids and they kidnap them and bring them into the tribe. So they kill the parents. Incredible. Oh, my God. Some of the stories are so. And what the craziest thing is what our government. Our government was like, hey, you want a homestead? Go out there. We'll give you a chunk of land.

What was that?

They did it to bait people.

The first scene of that book, the guy goes out there, and he's like, hello, good friends. Like, good day to you. And they, like, cut his head off.

And peel his face off, and it's like, holy shit. They kill everybody. Well, you know, you're on their land as far as they're concerned. What the fuck are you doing? And what the government was doing was saying, hey, you can go homestead out there. And it was baiting them. And so then they made these people fight off the Comanche for Jack Hayes and the Texas Rangers.

Texas Rangers.

Texas would have never been settled.

Yeah.

This was all the Comanche. Dude. There's so many arrowheads here, it's mad.

I would go nuts if I found an arrowhead in real life. Like, if I was walking and I found an arrowhead, I would. It would be the found day of my life.

I found one once in Nevada. There's.

You found it?

No, I did not find that one that was given.

So this is a real.

It's a real arrow.

American arrowhead.

Absolutely. My friend Remy said that's probably one they use for fish because it's large. He said the ones they use for deer are smaller because, you know, they don't have a lot of force on their bows.

No.

They have to penetrate. So we want a smaller diameter arrowhead. Ouchy. Wow. I'll fuck you up.

Oh, that's so cool.

And they used to have the ability to hold all their arrows in between their fingers so they could fire off arrows one after another. This is why when they came up with the musket, they're like, this is not good enough.

One shot.

Yeah. And then they got to sit there and fucking. And they're just filling you up. Arrows. So when Colt developed a revolver, that changed the game.

Yeah.

Because now. So these guys had cartridges. I think the initial one was five shots. So then he's carrying. Just pop the cartridge out, put a new one in, change the game.

Yeah. Crazy thing is, he was sitting over there in New Jersey, I think, developing that. Yeah. Like, I'm tinkering. And he sent it to the said he sent it over there, and everyone was like, what is this?

Not only that, the government didn't want it for soldiers. They're like, what, do we need this? We don't need this. But the Texas Rangers used it, figured it out. Yeah. And they're like, we need that fucking thing.

And so they were really, the predecessors, like, to our image of like, the cowboy. Like, that's the birth of the cowboy, right?

Like, well, I mean, that whole image.

Of, like, a dude with a hat on a horse, like, that was the. To me, that's like. It looked like you were getting towards after the Comanche, like, the end of the comanche times into the. I don't think cowboys were around for long. Like, that period that we think of, like, the Wild West. I think it was like, a period of, like.

It's kind of funny, right? Because it's such a genre in our history. Because not a whole lot of civil war cool movies.

No, because nobody likes this, but there's.

A lot of western cool movies because it's romantic. But the history of genocide in North America in terms of, like, what happened to the Native Americans has been so poorly documented in movies because nobody wants.

To watch that, right?

So the movies are all just. Just, you know, guys in saloons having shootouts with other bad Americans. And every now and then, some Native American would get into the picture. You have to fuck that indian up because he was trying to steal your goats or whatever.

It'll be the cool tracker.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like in Butch Cassidy and the Sundance kid, where they're running and, like, they're like, oh, these guys have a native american tracker?

Like, what a weird genre of films that only looks at it from one perspective. The perspective of the people that came over there. And nothing, even the real thing that happened to people is exactly what happened to people in the Amazon. It's disease. That's the lost city of Z, right? You know, when they went there, these. The first people were like, this place is amazing. They have these complex cities. It's. Gold's everywhere. It's gorgeous. And then. So people made the trek back, and by the time they went there, all those people were dead from dirty, stinky european diseases.

You're like, here, you want some blankets?

Yeah. Well, that blanket thing's not real. No, no, the smallpox on the blank. No, they think that. I mean, there might have been some instances where people knowingly gave people blankets with smallpox, but smallpox just spread. Just spread, like, because everybody was immune to it from Europe. Like, not immune, but they had some sort of antibodies because smallpox was everywhere. So when they came over here, we brought a bunch of shit over here that just wrecked those people.

Yeah, there's. There's. I did an expedition in. Right before Lex came. I did an expedition in March, and me and JJ went to. We basically picked a part of the Amazon that we'd never been to and went let's go see what's over there. And it took us.

Picked a spot.

We picked a spot because it was around in a place that, like, on the map, there's. There's no. There's no towns. There's no nothing. So we said, let's go there. And it took us a week. We had to take a commercial flight to a smaller flight to a smaller flight, and then we had to take a boat for three days, 9 hours a day to get to the start of the expedition.

Now, when you do that, do you check to see if there's uncontacted tribes that have been reported in those areas?

We. What you do is you get to the last town and you go. You wait, what's that way? And they tell you, and the scariest thing, and this was one of the worst things I've ever seen in my life, Washington. That there were these tiny little people there, and they were so there was like normal Peruvians walking around like loggers, gold miners, their chainsaws. There's people who had gasoline barges. There's also prostitute boats that drive around, like brothels that go on a boat. Yeah. And you can pay them in wood, surprisingly enough. Board feet of timber. No joke.

Whoa.

Yes. You get to the real, like, this is a place where, like, you feel like you went a time machine. And you get out there and there's people with modern machines. But then off in the corner, there were these little people, and they were still holding onto their bows and arrows. And you look at them, and as soon as you look at them, they hide. And we were like, who are they? And they're like, those are the Nahua. And we were like, what's going on with the Nahua? And it turns out that the Nahua were shooting at the oil company guys that were trying to get into this deep again, a part of the forest that never has been accessed before. Now it's starting. People are reaching deeper into the Amazon, and the problem is they'd be going up this river and there'd be arrows flying by them.

Oh, my God.

So how'd they solve that problem? They funded the missionaries, sent the missionaries out there to talk to the Nahua and convinced them to come back to the nearest town. So these are uncontacted tribes who are right there. Like, we're standing there, like, kind of talking to them. We're like, hola. And they're.

How do the missionaries communicate with them?

The missionaries go like, you know, bible up, and they just hope. And they just fucking hope.

Are these the Mormons. Like, what groups?

I actually don't know.

Mormons love to do that.

I don't know what group it was. I know I saw. I saw the missionary, and he gave me a dirty, evil look and walked away like, this is dark shit.

The missionary gave you an evil look?

Oh, no. These are not people that are okay. And so these terrified. Think about this for a second.

So what are the missionaries up to?

They're working for the oil companies. They're clearing out the forest. They're clearing the way. They're just doing it peacefully.

But are they actual missionaries, or are they acting as missionaries?

Whatever it is, they're. They're going with the missionary protocol, getting these people to come in. So what they did was through two translators from Spanish to yine to Nahua to something, we asked this guy, and we had to stay away because we didn't want to get them sick. And we had to say, like, what are you doing here? And the guy was like, I'm trying to go back to my house, like, where I live in that house, my jungle. And he said, these missionaries said if I came here, that then they'd help me and the food. And, you know, and they were very confused because the missionaries had brought back a boatload of them and kind of tricked them, because then when they got to the town, they just showed up to capitalist society, which, even though it's super remote, they're like, you want food, you got to buy it. And these people have a bow and arrow, but there's no more animals around because they've killed everything. And they go, but I want to go home. And the missionaries go, well, do you got gasoline? Now they're stuck.

Oh, my God. How far?

Like, three days of driving in a boat. So, like, 70 miles by river. And so these poor people are coming into modern society a thousand years late with their wooden bow and arrows. They're this big. They're tiny little people, and they're terrified, and no one's helping them.

Oh, my God.

And it's the edge of the world. And it's exactly when I was. And I was reading this Comanche book on that expedition, and I'm going, this is the same thing. It's that manifest destiny. This is the end of their culture. Culture. There's no one. There's no one who's gonna help them. And they were just terrified, sitting there at the edges of the streets, and all these people are riding by on, like, motorcycles and rickshaws, and there's boats going by, and these people are trying to look for, like, a rat to shoot.

Oh, my God.

It was terrifying.

Oh, my God.

It was terrifying. I felt so bad for them because they had no idea. You could see they had no idea.

And they don't even speak the language.

They don't even speak. They're two degrees separated with language. So, like. Like, you could speak gine, which is the local tribal language there. But these people don't even speak that. They speak their language. So you'd have to go from Spanish to Guinea to Nahua.

Oh, my God.

And we were there, and these people.

Were going, how does someone know Nahua that you talk to?

Because one of the Yena guys that I knew was. Had been living there, so he'd picked up a few Nahua words, and so they were. They were going, so, so these people.

How long these people been there for?

I didn't get that. But they were. They were. They were literally living in a camp at the, like, where the trees were. They stayed by the trees. They wanted to be by the trees.

Oh, my God.

So there's people. You could buy a Coca Cola there. Like, this was like, you could, you know, you could buy gasoline, coca Cola, whatever. Way out there. There's a boat that has some, like, gasoline cylinders you can fill up your boat. And then this. This is where. This is the law. It's like during the gold rush in Alaska. It's like the last place before you go into the wild.

Oh, my God.

And these. It was just. It was really horrible to see. And I think reading that the empire of the summer moon was made it even worse because that's so dirty.

So they tricked these people into going to the town, and they just abandoned them.

Yeah.

Oh, my God. And these people, how could they know that someone would do that to them? They don't even know what a town is.

Like, they don't even know what a town is.

Oh, my.

Terrified. And so they're still, you know, you see them. They're washing by the river, and they're trying to feed their babies, but they're still probably.

No one gives a fuck.

And no one gives a fuck. And they're treated like dirt, too, because people. Because humans are humans, and so.

Right.

No one wants to help them. Nobody can talk to them. And then, of course, they're. They're kind of frustrated, right? Like, they're not exactly friendly either.

Right. Wow.

Yeah. Crazy, crazy, crazy, crazy, crazy.

Have you seen that overhead fit? There's. There's a view, like a camera is on some of the helicopter or something. And it's photographing these guys, and they're all fucking pointed pose and arrows. This one. How wild is that?

You think that's wild? I can show you something that I can't show publicly, but look at this. Yeah, I got something that no one's seen. This is from last week.

I'm gonna show everybody.

No, you're not. This is from last week.

Oh, wow.

So what. What Joe's looking at right now is a bunch of uncontacted tribes standing in the rain. And again, they don't speak the language of the people that are trying to interact with them. So this is across a river.

Are these those same people that were in that town?

These are not the Nahua. This is a different tribe.

Oh, my God, man. This is wild. This is like imagining what it would be like to run into people hundreds of thousands of years ago.

Are you on the single guy yet? Yeah.

Incredible, man. I mean, that guy looks like someone from the past.

Yep.

He doesn't look like someone from now.

Yeah. And so what they did was they sent them a canoe full of bananas. Now that guy's standing there in the cold, shaking his head like he might just not know the word for blood blanket.

It's insane, man. This is incredible. And these are essentially some of the last people on earth like this.

Yeah. And so there's a huge debate about how we protect them because there's two camps, there's some people that say they're running scared. During the industrial revolution, they pushed further out, and they're too scared to come in and get help. And then there's other people that go, no, they're noble savages, and they live out there because they want to, and they're the last free people. But looking at these videos and seeing some of the stuff, they're trying to carefully interact with some of the most remote tribes. And so there's people that live seven days from the nearest town that speak a dialect of native language in the Amazon. And the tribes will come out and they'll, you know, they'll come out and they'll. You saw it, they'll. They'll come out and they'll just look. They'll look at them, they'll make gestures, they'll do things. But if you get too close to them, they shoot you. So you can't really. You can't just go up to them, be like, hey, man, what's up? Do you want some eggs?

Right?

You can't do that.

Right.

So what happens is this standoff on either side of the river, where you have people that live a remote lifestyle and are very, very indigenous, but that can still interact with us, that know our, you know, mother modern world. Have seen a dollar before, have seen a spoon, the wheel.

Wearing an under armor t shirt.

Yeah, exactly. And then these people show up and they got their dicks tied to their stomachs and they wear no clothes and they're doing. They're making sounds. Sometimes they're using animal calls.

They tie their dicks down so they don't get scratched up.

They time up. They. So if you look at this dude here, look, I'll just pause it on when he's.

That's so gangster. I mean, think about the stuff they're walking through.

You don't want to drag it on the ground.

Everything's got a thorn.

So, like, look. Look at that. Like, he's tied up. But, yeah, you don't want to get in. You don't want to get in. I guess, you know, I'm like, mosquitoes having access to the head.

That could be a problem.

That could be a problem.

Aren't there, like, little fishies that swim up your dick hole?

That's only if you're peeing in the water.

Oh.

A much worse thing is when you take a shit in the jungle.

Uh oh.

All the bugs are coming for you. So you got to, like, you got to like, be on the. On like, dick patrol while you're doing that, because you're gonna get bug bites on your ass. But you gotta make sure they don't.

Go in your asshole.

Well, sure. That too. Yeah. Because as soon as you. As soon as you crouch, dung beetles bigger than golf balls start flying through the air. So as you're trying to take a shit in the. So they know fart, there are animals falling. And so you're sitting there and you have to. There's a bunch of things. Things you gotta do first. You gotta break your stick, right? So you have like, some leaves. The leaves is to keep your ass bug free to get the mosquitoes away. And then the other thing you gotta do is you gotta be holding a tree. Cause you're crouching, right, right. But then you use your a stick to swat away the dung beetles. Cause they come in and one dung beetle hit my friend Mohsin in the eyeball and, like, scratched his actual eyeball cause it flew straight. And they have, you know, rhinoceros horns coming out of their faces and their exoskeletons. Brutal. And they're heavy. It's a big bug. And they're airborne and they're moving quick. And when they want your shit because. And they're gonna take it and they're gonna roll it into balls and they're gonna push it through the jungle and they're gonna lay their eggs in it.

Oh, God.

So, yeah, taking a shit in the jungle is like a hole. You have to know how to do it. If you don't know how to do it, you could end up in a lot of trouble.

Good lord, man. So many things to think about. And this is your everyday existence. Yeah, yeah, I just. So when you went to that spot, when you decided, let's go there, and it takes you three days, and you get up there and you see these people, did you wind up going deeper into the jungle and seeing how they actually live? So can you or is it dangerous?

Well, both. Well, I had some trackers with me who were extremely experienced in all of this. They knew where we could and couldn't go. And we went on a. It took us a week to get to the launch point. And then we went on a six day expedition from there where we're eating fish out of the river, we're drinking out of the river, camping on the beaches. And then we did reach a point where they found signs of uncontacted tribes.

And that's when it gets dangerous.

And they went, we're going back. 100% going back. I mean, you have to. For everyone's. There's absolutely no way that you can continue going. You're gonna either get killed or be killed. Like, it turns into. I mean, these guys turned around, they loaded the shotguns and they were like, we turned around this moment. They turned to the boat the moment that you.

Because they know you're there before you know they're there.

Oh, they know you're there.

Yeah. If you're coming in a boat, too, it's probably making a lot of noise.

Yeah.

Right.

Oh, yeah.

Wait. Thing from a long ways out.

Two, two, three weeks ago, some loggers, they found them. They were. The chainsaw.

They were.

The loggers were chainsawing on the Tawa Manu river. The loggers were. From the look of the. I'm kind of Sherlock Holmes in the image. I saw that the loggers were cutting this log log. They were dead where they were standing. So you think these guys cutting this log and the tribes are surrounding them. They had no idea.

Wow.

And they just started throwing arrows from the shadows. And so they found the bodies of two loggers. This was. This was within August Peru tribes killed. There's a picture, like a blurry picture.

Of it, of the loggers.

They don't show you anything. It's just when it comes, I bet.

You could find it.

I bet you my guys have it.

On WhatsApp dark web. I bet your WhatsApp group is wild.

My WhatsApp group is ridiculous. I got to show you some of the pictures. I got to start sending you some. Some crazy shit.

Yeah, let me in.

Yeah, man.

I promise I won't share them.

I got terrible pictures because one time they killed these guys, and their bodies were on the beach for a few days, and they blew up and became white. So they look like the Michelin man. But then when the vultures got to them, they started ripping out their eyeballs and disemboweling them. So by the time people went to find just skeletons, it was like the skeleton was half out of the face. It was some of the most gruesome shit you've ever seen. It was incredible. It was incredible. That's like, dude, now, because of, you know, having a large social media following, people just send me their craziest shit. So I gotta be careful what I open. Cause people will send you a video. And, like, one thing that I found very disturbing, somebody sent me a video, and it was like, here, click on this. And I was like, I don't know.

If I really want.

And it was somebody, like, there was like, a deer, and he was feeding a deer and feeding a deer, and then he takes a handgun and shoots it in the head. Like, that's fucking hard. I was like, no. So now I'm careful. But somebody sent me a few weeks ago a video of which this one I'm probably going to share, but I have to make sure that they don't get me for it. An elephant trainer in India, and he's working next to this elephant, and he's just working next to the elephant doing his thing, and this elephant just decides that today ain't his day, and the elephant just knocks him over and crushes his pelvis. And then it's like, that's not good enough. So it pushes his foot on the guy's head and just flattens them, and it's all on video.

Oh, my God.

It's wild. Actually, Jamie on there is this one picture of it might even say, yeah, it says, elephant dead. And it's just a picture of a guy. His gun is broken in half and his head is flattened. And that's in India, that the elephant just.

They just flattened the guy. It was just like, enough is enough.

Well, I mean, people torture elephants.

Oh, that's the guy. Oh, boy.

Yeah.

Oh, God. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Why'd you make me look at that?

Hey, you want the good stuff or not?

I do. Give it to all the arrows and the guys.

I'll show that the one next to that one is the elephant stepping on the guy if you want.

Okay. I'm here while I'm here.

I mean, it's important. People should know not to. Not to go, not to be. People think elephants are cuddly. They're not. They're not to be messed with.

He's not enough.

This one's horrible because it's not quick. It's not quick. But, like, see, this elephant is not. You know, he's probably around this elephant every day and it doesn't look like he's doing what this is doing. He's poking the elephant.

That shit's annoying.

Yeah, this elephant's gone. You know what? That's enough. Look. So at this point, he's already broken.

At this point.

I mean, his pelvis is gone. Even if he lived.

Oh, everything's just getting crushed and. Oh, my God. That's that. He just had enough. Oh, this is horrible, man. Just stomping this guy. He's already dead.

Yeah, he's dead now. He's.

Oh, my God, he's so flat. That's so crazy. He's picking him up in his mouth.

I mean, this elephant is angry. Angry.

Oh, my God. This guy's so dead.

I mean, that's not even a big elephant.

And this other guy runs in to stop it. Are you out of your fucking mind? But that elephant's probably tired of wearing that fucking stupid outfit too.

Yeah.

Tired of getting poked out with a stick.

Yep. What's. And that's probably like a 5000 pound asian elephant. Whereas the largest elephant, largest african elephant was something around 24,000 pounds.

Oh, my God.

Yeah. These are. These are, you know, 18 wheelers. They're huge.

Yeah. And what's fucked up about that is like, when you have tribes or towns or villages of people that are growing things.

Yeah.

And the elephants find it, they just like, sorry, it's ours now.

That's because there's not enough jungle for the elephants. And then turn down an entire field full of pineapple.

Yeah. They're like, no, this is my pineapple.

These are my pineapples.

Yeah. They don't have any energy of ownership. These are pineapples that are on the ground. No one's eating them. Of course I'm gonna eat them, and they can eat all the pineapples. And so now everybody starves, and no.

One can stop them. People come out, they throw rocks at them, they'll push your house over. They don't care.

Oh, yeah, they'll stomp you into the fucking dirt. They don't give a shit.

Can I tell you? Can I tell you my favorite elephant story from. So I started doing work with this private game reserve in Africa called Buffalo Kloof. And it's these incredible people, Warren and Wendy riponous. And I started going over there because they were using post 911 veterans to protect their elephants and rhinos. But their elephants, they found out, they call it the holcroft herd. They found out that some saudi prince had elephants in this reserve, and they weren't irrigating it. So the elephants were dying. So they went and they did a flight over, and they saw dead elephants. They saw dead animals. And there was, I think there was. I think there was ten or eleven elephants that were still alive. And so they went to the south african court. They repossessed the elephant, heard the owners of the reserve that I work with, they went with a helicopter, you circle it around. They got the elephants together, they darted the whole family at once, all eleven elephants. Got them on trucks, like, semi lucid, just kind of awake. Got them onto trucks, transported them to Buffalo Kloof, where they're going to be safe.

Released them. And they said that when these elephants woke up and came off the trucks, and now they're in a private game reserve where they're going to be safe the rest of their lives. He said they just exploded. They went flying into the water, started drinking, playing, bathing, just eating everything. They rearranged the entire ecosystem. And one of the females was pregnant, and they didn't know that the female was pregnant.

Wow.

And so these people are doing this in this crazy work where they're protecting black rhinos, which are critically endangered elephants, white rhinos, all this stuff. And they're doing it through hunting. They're doing it where they have hunting. They have a reserve that is fenced in because South Africa, everything's fenced in but the elephants and the rhinos. And you're keeping. At this point, we're keeping black rhinos on the brink of extinction. We're keeping them from going extinct. But it's like, you go there, and these elephants are so happy because they're living in a place where they're free for wild.

They have food, and they have as.

Much food as they want. They have like 50,000 acres.

What a dream for an elephant to get rescued. You're like, oh, I'm fucked.

You see a helicopter and you're like.

Oh, shit, there's no water here. Everyone's dying. And then all of a sudden you're in this bountiful place.

In this bountiful place.

That's pretty dope.

And it's funny too, because talking about, like, the people, the anti hunting people, and it's like, this is a place where very, very different reality than the Amazon, but where the owner said to me, he was like, no one's going to pay you $30,000 to take a picture of a buffalo. He's like, people pay $30,000 to hunt a buffalo all the time. And so they use sustainable hunting of like, the zebras and the buffalo and the impalas and stuff that to protect the entire ecosystem. You have leopards and elephants and black rhinos, white rhinos, and so you have tourism and hunting side by side in this incredible game reserve. It's wild.

Well, unfortunately, the only way where people really appreciate animals is to make them a commodity. Whether you make them a commodity for going on safari, whether you make them a commodity for hunting them. Because before that, when people were just poaching and doing market hunting, they were on the brink of extinction. There's a lot of animals there, a lot of the undulates that were on the brink of extinction. Yeah, you know, there's, there's animals in Texas that you can hunt that are endangered in their native lands, but that.

They'Ve bred them in Texas.

Yeah, they bred. So there's more tigers in Texas than there are in all the wild of the world. Just in people's yards.

Yeah, I just met somebody that had elands on her property.

This giant elands, very common, huge fucking animal, crazy horns. They're cool looking. But these wild game reserves in Africa, people go over there and they shoot these animals, and then that meat gets donated to these tribes. And this friend of mine who went over there to do that was saying that they went to this school, which was like, to call it a school. It's dirt floors, no windows. It's just this building where kids go and the food they get is all canned. So they have canned foods and so they brought them hundreds of pounds of meat and everybody went crazy. The whole village comes, they get baskets of it, fresh meat. And it does help. It helps. But really what's fucked is that people live like that. Like, really the way to get people out of that situation when you have these insanely impoverished countries where you can take advantage of people and have a mine for cobalt, is to try to elevate the standard of living for those people. Tried to bring them power and give them irrigation and give them fresh water and. And figure out a way to get them resources. Like.

Yeah, and I mean, that's exactly what we're doing in the Amazon is. Is give the loggers a better fucking job.

They don't want to be loggers.

Nobody wants to be a gold miner.

Right?

Nobody wants to be a poacher. In Africa, a lot of people want.

To be gold miners.

Not this kind of gold miner.

No, not. That could mean. Well, that's not gold mining. That's.

This is sand mining for bits of gold. Like, this is what they cut down the animals Amazon for.

Right. But gold mining in Alaska, probably pretty fun.

Probably.

Imagine being part of the minor 49 ers that came over here in 1849.

That's different. You find a nugget of gold. Yeah, that's different. That's a whole different thing.

Have you seen the movie sisu?

Mm.

It's like a John Wick movie from World War two. It's about this crazy soldier who becomes a gold miner and he finds gold, and he's, you know, retired, done with the war. And then he's hiking out with his gold, he's riding out with his gold. And the Nazis.

Yeah.

Show up and he has to kill all this.

One of those movies over. You can kill everybody. Like, awesome. I can't.

I bet you can.

I can't. The only reason it's okay in the Matrix is because they're in the Matrix.

Right?

Every other movie with one guy, like the taken where he can, like, take down a room full taken.

A little ridiculous. But this guy, you kind of believe it.

Yeah.

Yeah. It's pretty fucking. I mean, this guy's, like, covered in scars, his whole body. He's been in war his whole. His whole life.

Yeah. Give it a chance.

This is. This is the guy.

Wait, who's the actor? That's not Brendan Gleeson, is it?

No, it's. I don't know. I don't know his name, but it's not american movie.

Look at the. Look at the trailer with the knife through it, bro.

This fucking movie rules. Yeah, it rules. Yeah. That's the gentleman's name. I've never heard of him, but he's fucking awesome.

The farthest I can go with violence was Peaky Blinders.

Oh, my God. What a show. What a show, yo. What a show.

I have so much trouble not just talking like Alfie Solomons my entire life. I fucking love that character.

By all the picky blinders.

That. And then my newest thing is the hundred foot wave. If you haven't watched this thing, man, no. Oh, my God.

Surfers.

Garrett McNamara, the other, you know, the wave in. In Portugal. Yes, right. It's the dude and his wife who discovered it. You know, they tell the whole story where, like, you know, he's looking for big waves. They're all chasing big waves, like point break shit. Like, you know, and then I think they get an email from someone. She. She gets an email from someone. She's like, we should go check out this wave. And this dude goes, first of all, wave porn all day long. Such a fucking good show. And I'm looking at this going, I want to make. I want to make a show one day about how we made our national park. How the fuck did they die? Document this.

This dude is so insane to do that. So insane to.

This is some of the best shit I've ever seen. I'm riveted by this also. I just can watch that wave again and again and again.

Those guys who do that are different humans.

But this is. It's the cinematography. It's the storytelling. Oh, he goes down.

No.

Yeah, dude. No. Oh, the injuries. The injuries are brutal. I mean, you're talking about a 70 foot wave.

Oh, my God. The weight of that water must be insane.

They literally went looking for the biggest wave. And then just like that old tree in Ireland, this has, like, become the thing for that town. People come there for the wave.

Now, how many people die there every year?

They have a pretty good safety system. They have like, a jet ski rescue system where, like, if you. If I. If I tow you onto a wave, I feel like I know it now from watching the show. If I tow you onto a wave and you catch this epic wave, but then you get trucked and you're under 40ft of foam and you're getting just bashed under there. When that wave goes to the shore, I have like 10 seconds to race in there with my jet ski. And you got to grab on before the next wave comes. And if I don't. If you don't grab the ski, I got to leave you and you got.

To go under there.

So as you're watching this show, you're like, do they die? Do they die? Are they okay? Holy shit. And the whole time they're just showing you this beautiful wave porn. Constant waves. And you're just like, this is this is. And these people wake up every day and have the same affliction that I have. They're just like, how do I get my advice? Adrenaline. They're like, how do I get my adrenaline? It's like, I feel like I can relate.

You ever meet those dudes?

They're so calm because they're always coming down from it. They're like, oh, man, there's no waves today. Just like, when you meet. When you meet, like, certain veterans, they're just like, well, man, look, we're not getting shot at today, so it's all good.

Yeah. It's fascinating how calm they are. Kelly Slater?

Yeah. Have you had him in here?

Yeah, I've had him. He's awesome.

You've had Laird Hamilton?

Yep.

Laird Hamilton.

Shane Doran. Good friend of month. He does that shit, too. That's all these guys are there. They're all chill dudes. Like, real serious people.

Yeah.

You know?

Yeah, Laird. Laird shows up in there, they have him, like, being like, yeah, that fucking wave is crazy with his huge neck. He's just like, dude, you ever see.

His workout where he takes weights in.

The pool and walks on the bottom of the pool?

He's a fucking maniac. Yeah.

No, he's. He's always been just. I mean, you just look at him. He's just built. He's built like an action figure. He's always been incredible.

No days off with that guy and that world of just wanting to constantly get on the biggest waves, it's just such a nutty proposition.

I totally understand it, though. I think it's to do something that that's. It's like, say, you know you can ride a dragon, right? Yo. You know? Or, you know, Elon's like, I want to go to Mars. Like, somebody tells you, look at the big. A mountain of water, right? You can fly on that. Right in, right? Sign me up. I mean, I feel like that's snowboarding, and snowboarding is chiller. You're not, like, taking your life in your hands, but, like, when you're going as fast as you can on a snowboard down a mountain, like, man, I am fucking surfing a mountain right now.

Yeah. It is flying.

It's an apex of life. I feel like that when I jump on an anaconda, I'm like, I am going to die.

What? I'm on a snow. I don't snowboard, but I ski. And when I ski, I'm like, don't get hurt. Don't get hurt. Don't get hurt. Don't get hurt. Didn't get hurt. Yeah, yeah.

Don't eat a tree.

I've just been injured so many times in my life that I see people falling down. The last time I skied too, I did wipe out pretty hard.

See, skis, I don't like that. Your legs. I feel like I'm gonna tie my legs into a, into a, into a knot.

Yeah. But I don't like being attached to that board.

Nope. Because when you hit ice and you fall forward head first coming right out.

I know a dude who got fucked up on a snowboard that way. The snowboard went up and he landed head first and just got out cold, you know, friends, how to find him.

Yeah, I teach, I teach. Somehow I've taught all my friends how to snowboard and I've never had anybody get hurt too bad. It's always like, you know, that's crazy bunny hill to like, you know, whatever.

Shane. My friend Shane Dorian that I was just talking about, he destroyed his knee. Snowboarding.

Yeah.

Slammed into a tree, tore it apart. How to get reconstructive surgery. And, you know, think about that guy's whole life is riding waves.

Shane Dorian.

Yeah, yeah. And I was.

Yeah.

Big wave server. And so, you know, he had to get his knee reconstructed as soon as he got fixed right back to snowboard.

Yeah, I mean, dude, it's the thing you love. It's the thing you love.

I don't get it.

No matter how many dung beetles fly out my ass, I just keep going back to the jungle.

I understand, but I don't get it. I do understand. I just, like, my brain didn't go down that path, but I get the path. I could have gone down that path. It. I see the lure. I see the lure of the big wave. I see the lure of the jungle. I see it.

I think you do it in a lot of. I think you, you know, I think you do a lot of things obsessively. I think that when you get interested in something, whether it's elk hunting or whether it's archery or whatever it is, you go 100% and so you kind of get that same hit from it.

Yeah, I understand.

These guys have just attached themselves to something that's insane.

I think it's in everything. I think everything is like that. There's things that human beings find that are complicated and challenging. We gravitate towards those things because we get these rewards of accomplishment. And I think these rewards of accomplishment are built into our system of what it is to be a human being and what our purpose is on earth. And I think that there's. You can live your whole life and not find a thing that you find challenging and rewarding, and I think that's a tragedy because I think you're living a boring ass life. And there's a lot of people. That's the great Thoreau quote. Most men live lives of silent desperation, and that's real. Most people don't have a thing that they do that excites them, and it's difficult and challenging and rewarding, and that's not a good life. It's a safe life. Right? That's what people want. They want a safe life. People want to retire. I want to go off in the sun. It's all bullshit. You want a life filled with challenges and rewards, and you want to learn about yourself along the way. You want to make mistakes because that's how you grow.

You want to do challenging things because that's how you find out how far you can push yourself. You want to learn more because it elevates your capacity to understand things. It's part of being a human. It's a fascinating thing that's elective, and that's the part about it that makes it interesting. It's elective. You don't have to do it. You can get a very plain, boring job that's not challenging or intriguing and just exist. And you can exist on bad food, and you can exist on bad information and watch television all day and never challenge your mind and just dull yourself with alcohol and slowly rot until your body gives out.

I think a lot of people clip their own wings thinking that, you know, that's nothing. Not me.

Yeah, that's true, too.

I don't have access to that. And then you don't realize that the difference between you and goggins or, you know, McNamara is just, it's just obsession. It's just go out and do it.

And a lot of times it's getting on a path. And then, like, think about Goggins, like when he first started that. What if he never did decide to get fit? What if he stayed? That 300 pound dude is just drinking milkshakes all day, and he was big and fat, and he couldn't even run 100 yards. That's who he was when he first started working out and a switch flipped and he got on a path and he stayed on that path. He wasn't on that path his whole life. And then all of a sudden, he gets on that path and becomes the biggest psycho of all time on that path.

But you have to either have a traumatic event that wakes you up or some sort of just boundless innate optimism that makes sense.

I don't know what's possible. There's a. You have to have this or that. I think there's a whole bunch of different things that can happen to people. I think near death experiences. I think loss of a loved one. I think maybe a realization that sometimes people just wake up and say, I can't do this anymore. Whatever they're doing that's boring or sucky or just soul sucking, they just get to a point where they go, I can't do this anymore. And sometimes it's just like an alcoholic hits rock bottom. It's like, I'm not drinking anymore. I'm fucking done. And people do. My friend Dave did that. He never went to rehab. Didn't do nothing. He crashed his car. He got arrested. Cause he ran away from the scene of the accident. He was drunk driving. And he said, I'm never drinking again. Never drink again to the day he died.

Just. Just reached his limit one night.

Just reached his limit. Didn't go to Alcoholics Anonymous. They're like, you have to go. He's like, no, I don't. I'm just not drinking anymore. I'm done. And he just had to. His whole life, he was drunk. He just had to get to this point where he's like, this can't be me anymore.

Yeah. You just discussed yourself.

There's a whole bunch of different ways to get to that. Sometimes you get to it through inspiration. Sometimes you get to it through desperation. Sometimes you get to it just through intrigue. Like, sometimes, you know, you walk into a jujitsu gym, and you've never even done a martial art in your whole life. You take a lesson and you're like, oh, my God, this is so fun. And then five years later, you're a fucking jiu jitsu wizard, and you're obsessed with it. You train every day, and you're on this new path as a human being because you found a thing that excited you. And it could be big wave surfing. It could be playing chess. It could be. There's probably a thing out there, there that resonates with you. You just haven't had it. And then there's the thing of getting outside of your comfort zone, which people.

Don'T like to do, where people struggle.

Yeah. Because they have never had any experience with it, and they don't understand the reward of doing it. But the people that do do it all the time, whether it's, you know, David, goggins or Jocko or anybody that you see that's like a fitness influencer or people that are, like, super fit, they just stay on the path. That's the key. The key is just every fucking day is a new challenge. You don't want to do it every day. If you're a guy who runs marathons, there's no fucking way you want to run every day. But, you know, if you want to run a sub three hour marathon, you got to run every fucking day, and you got to check your heart rate, and you got to make sure you're eating correctly. You got to do all those things. It's fucking hard to do. But because it's hard to do, people get obsessed. You know, maybe they run a five k. They're like, I can't believe I did it. Wow. I ran 3 miles, and then the next thing you go, you know what? I'm gonna run a half marathon. And they prepare for a half marathon.

The next thing you know, they're a fucking runner.

Yeah, well, but that's happens, and that's the thing that, to me, what I see is so many people going, you know, especially, like, at this point, people go like, oh, I can't believe, you know, you do this work in the jungle. And they go, I always wanted to do this. And I listened to when people say, I always wanted to do it. I'm like, go do it. Yeah, go do it.

Some people can't, right? Because some people. I mean, the reality is some people have families and they have mortgages and they have loved ones they take care of. There's not a chance in hell you can take a father of four and all of a sudden this guy can become a jungle keeper. It's just, he's not going to leave Ohio and, you know, and quit his job in Columbus.

And I mean, not full time, but I'm saying, he could. He could.

He could do something.

He could do something.

But the point is you. You went on this path very. How old were you when you first started this path?

17.

Yeah, see, that's a good age, 17. You don't know what the fuck is going on in the world. You're young, you're all full of cum. You're fucking crazy.

What to do? Yeah, fuck these people.

Fuck these people. And then you.

There's no rules.

Confidence and intelligence, and you decided to make this a path, and then you find this incredibly rewarding part of the path, which is saving the rainforest. And so now you have a reason to live, so your life becomes filled with meaning. And that's the problem with a lot of people even that have jobs that are really good jobs. They don't have meaning. And that's why people fill their life up with bullshit. They just buy things and do cocaine and fucking, you know, get a luxury yacht, you know, they just get these things that are trying to fill some sense of purpose and meaning because they don't really enjoy what they do. They don't get just purely satisfied by what they actually do. Do they need all these other things to motivate them to keep doing it? And then they get caught up in this numbers game where a guy only has a billion dollars, feels like a loser when he's hanging out with Jeff Bezos.

I never understood that dude. I never understood what making it past a certain amount of income and not just going, cool, now I'm going to go enjoy. Now I'm going to take care of my friends. Now I'm going to take care of that one neighbor that I always knew needed help. Now I'm going to do this and just start doing good with that shit. And there are people who do that.

I could tell you as a person who grew up poor.

Yeah.

One of the things that happens is first, initially, you worry that you're not gonna be able to maintain it. That's initial fear. That's, that's super, super common. And guys start getting, like, really famine. It's interesting when they start making more money.

Yeah.

They start getting more freaked out about money. I understand that that happens, but there's a limit with, like, a lot of Hollywood people. They, like, change how they talk about things. They change their opinion. They want, they don't want to take any risks, you know? So you want to keep that gravy train rolling. But if you're doing something you enjoy doing, then I think if you like, especially if you're independent, like podcasters, right. It's a good example. You start making money in podcasting. You like, oh, this is great. Like, I just can make money doing a thing that I love to do. Like, I'm not going to stop doing it. Why would I stop doing it? And I also can keep making a lot of money. I think I'll just keep doing it, especially since I enjoy it. So I don't even think about it, like, doing it for the money. I think about, like, I would like to talk to Paul. He's an interesting dude. He lives in the Amazon. Oh, this is my job. I get to talk to Paul. Why would I stop? I mean, I would do this for free. But I'm not going to.

Yeah, but you're also, you've trans. You've. You're in the, you know, you've. You've. You've changed the world of podcasts and you've kind of like flown above that, I'm saying. But even for the normal guy at a business.

Yeah, but all that makes first.

I know, but I'm saying a normal person makes his 1st 5 million. You know what I mean? Like people.

You. No, no, no more. You need more because you got a mortgage. You got this, you got that. What if your kids go to college? Also your money's not gonna be worth as much because of inflation. And what if you're. If you invest in this fucking hedge fund and this and that and this goes under or where if you're an idiot, invest in nfTs? Yeah, or bitcoin. I know a dude just lost a sh. Load of money. Money in crypto coin. Like, you get nutty. You think it's free money and like. No, it's some kind of crazy thing that's going on. We got fake money, some weird created money. You just spent a lot of real money to buy some of this weird, like, fucking imaginary money, digital money.

Do you want to buy a. What were those things, those fake pictures that people bought for a while?

Nfts.

Yeah, those.

What was that?

What was that about?

What was that?

That was crazy, bro.

And they sold for millions of dollars. I know a dude who made. He got rich. He was an artist. He got rich selling nfTs. Yeah, yeah. In the beginning when everyone was like.

Frothy with it, it sold and then they dropped to nothing. So I always have all these people coming up to me and they're like, oh, man, you're trying to raise money for the rainforest and they're like, you need to get into the NFT market. So, like, I almost got by the NFT people.

Yeah. No, I've had multiple occasions where I've been asked to do things for nfts and I've been asked to do things with crypto and I was like, I don't even know what it is. So how the fuck am I gonna do. How am I gonna endorse? Like, I won't endorse something unless it's a product that I've used or makes sense or they can explain to me, oh, this is how it works. Okay, it makes sense. But if you're doing something like an NFT, like, Jamie tried to explain it to me, like six or seven times. And I was like, okay, but you have it on your phone, right? So I can take a screenshot and I have it on my phone too? Yeah, no, but you don't own it. Okay, what does that mean? I have this, I have the same thing. You have the exact same experience of having this million dollar yacht ape. Is that what it's called?

No, it's the board ape.

Was the board ape? What was the ace?

A fucking cartoon picture of a monkey.

What did they call though? It was a yacht apes or board apes? Was there was like one that a lot of people were buying and I was like, what the fuck are you paying money for? This is crazy. Called the board. Oh, that's board ap. Okay. Bored. It show an image of what these fucking things are. And what was the most expensive one that went for, by the way? That's an NFt okay thing. Yeah, but that's. That's a whole gent different pro. Yeah, that's Elon Musk. That's.

Okay. Did it just change color? Cuz we talked about it.

That thing? No, that thing. No, that's like a digital piece of art, right? That's a completely different thing.

So you have to plug it in.

Yeah, but that thing was a gift from an artist. What, people. Oh yeah, but beeples, he puts up digital art every fucking day. So when you. He has like a gallery and you go there and these giant digital art art, it's like those kind of nfts make sense. This thing is like a shit cartoon. And how much did they go for? So those numbers at the bottom right there are showing. That would be like, I think it's ether. So 111 ether would be the price. That's 3000 a coin right now. So it'd be 300 grand, but 300 grand, it said it was sold at 769.

You could just screenshot.

So it sold at 769. So it's sold at close to a million dollars. And what is that, that's getting into the screenshot thing is a tough thing because it's like you own a car. But me having a picture of your car on my phone doesn't mean I own your car. Yeah, but you don't understand what I just said earlier. I said it's the exact same experience. Yeah, I know. The experience of having it on your phone is very different than the experience of you having a picture of my car. The same with any art then. That's just the argument for art that I. No, but it's not because it's a bad example. But Mona Lisa, I can look at the Mona Lisa on my phone all day long. I don't know. Right. But there's a big difference between owning the Mona Lisa on your phone. So, like, the Mona Lisa was only on a phone and you could just screenshot it and you would also have the exact same experience of the Mona Lisa. The difference in the physical Mona Lisa is it's hundreds of years old, right? It's painted by a master. I'm not.

You don't just own it on your phone is the sort of the thought. But you.

Where do you own it then?

But the thing is, you can replicate phones, an access point to where you do own it. That's like saying your bank account, you know, like, is only on your phone. But I hear what you're saying. But it's not the same because there's no real value in that. Nft. It's fake. Like, the experience of having it is no different. It's not like, I mean, I get that you're saying that it's money. Look, I'm gonna trade it as my. I agree with everything you're saying as someone that is invested in this stuff. And I'm like, how much did you waste? How much did you waste? I didn't waste any because I was getting stuff when it was you gonna hit a chair or whatever, you know, like, I bought it at the right time. I could have sold it and made a bunch of money, but I did not. I would have had to pay taxes and all that money too. People are doing or did and all that stuff. It's also kooky. The thing I was gonna bring up is I'm in the sports cards now. Those are. Why is that stuff worth money? Well, because they're physical things and then they're also like, have serial numbers on them.

I guess if you had a fake one, that's where you don't know if anyone's faking it. But the thing is, the real ones, you're also getting like a little piece of history. History like this arrowhead. If somebody made this arrowhead. And I didn't know because guys do make arrowheads. There's a lot of modern day people that make arrowheads. But this one was found at a friend of mine's ranch. I have a bunch of these. I have a few of them at home. They're. They're fucking amazing because these are like little windows into a time in history that was not that long ago. That was right here. And they're all over the place.

Somebody made that.

Somebody made that and it took a long ass time. And then they had to make the.

Rods for the arrows, which is not that easy. No, no, it's not like if we went out in the forest right now, we said perfectly straight stick.

Well, not only that, you have to use sinew to make the string for your bow. You have to know what woods to use for the bow. You have to know how to harden those woods. And if you're making a recurve bow now, it's even. Now you're talking even crazier.

That's. That's. Even if you're just trying to make a simple.

Yeah. A simple longbow. And you have to be accurate with that thing.

And so that means you have. You have to have enough arrows.

Yeah.

Practice with.

Yeah.

Fire is the same thing. Every time I try and show someone how to make fire, it's like, this is such a process.

It's such a.

To get fire started.

Yeah.

Which is, again, it's so much fun being out in the jungle because whoever you are, no matter how rich you are, no matter how hot your shit is, you're on the jungle, you're shitting with the dung beetles.

You bring firestarter. You know that stuff that so, like, they sell, they have like bricks of this stuff or cords of it, and you cut off a little bit of a piece of it. And then you have a flint and a piece of steel and you knock the two of them together like this. Steel. Yeah. Those.

Those rods. The ferro rod.

Exactly. That's exactly what it is. Right. And you. You light that stuff and it's. It's soaked in chemicals. Probably fucking terrible to breathe in, but that will keep fire for a long time. And you can use it to start fires.

Yeah, we don't. We go. I mean, usually we just have a lighter with us, but it's. There have been times. That's the problem. So the only real way, especially in the rainy season, the wood is soaked through. Like if this was a stick, it's soaked through and through. It's not gonna burn. You have to be very creative. You have to, like, put some diesel fuel in a tuna can and make a fire over that and then let the. Let that burn for a little bit.

So it dries everything out.

So it dries everything out. And then, like, even then, it's a very, like. It's not a very enthusiastic fire.

Right.

It's like, I guess I'll burn if you need me to. You're trying to, like, cook a pot of beans and it's your last pot of beans, and it's all the food you got.

Oh, my God.

It's a pain in the ass. Things don't want to burn, but when there's rain, we're happy.

So you never bring, like, a little bunsen burner, one of those little camp. Those little lightweight ones?

No, no, no. And honestly, that's a great idea for expeditions, but what we do, we bring these big propane tanks and just throw it on the boat. And if you can't bring that, then nothing. But, like, what we have at the camping stores here, they have, like, the little ones that go in your backpack. They just don't sell those in the. Where we go.

Right.

You know, so, like. And you can't bring them plane.

Oh, you can't?

No, you can't bring a propane tank on a plane.

Whatever you want, you can't.

Like. Like, if you go to Rei and buy a. Whatever those little camp stoves have in them, you can't bring that on the plane.

So is there a place where you could receive packages? We can get it shipped to you?

Yeah, we could probably get it shipped to Lima and then have it shipped down and whatever else. But, I mean, right now we have a system that works. But again, to me, this may be me being like a, you know, like a Luddite, but it's like, when we're out on expeditions, like, to me, I'm. I want everyone's shit off. Like, people like, oh, I have this new device. I can get network anywhere. I'm like, turn it off.

That makes sense.

Turn it off.

This. The thing about this is it helps you boil water. Jet boils what they call. So it's this little thing. It's got a little tank, and it lasts for days. You just cook it up. When you want to cook food, you know, you turn it on. You have a little thing with you and freeze dried food and shit. That's what a lot of these guys pack when they go 30 miles deep into the woods.

They have coffee real quick.

Yeah, you can make a coffee if you want to. Yeah.

I brought a guy who used to work at National Geographic on an expedition with me, and it was a couple local guys, me, my friend Mohsen and him. And we went up this river, and in hindsight, he was like. He actually thought we were messing with him. He was like, this can't be what you guys. He was like, you just have a fucking boat and tents. He was like, it was the bugs, the sand, the brutal, the sun beating. He goes, why don't you have a fucking roof?

Do you become accustomed to the bug bites?

Yeah.

So is it just you just deal with it, or does your body develop any kind of an antibody to it.

Or anything to the sand fly bites? Like, me and JJ get bitten and we bleed, but we don't get the, like, the elevated skin like that.

So your body doesn't react to it anymore.

Dude, wasp bites. I don't even react to bullet ant bites anymore. I'm on number eleven.

What are you talking about?

I'm talking about I just got bit by a bullet ant as I was trying to go to bed. I got up to go to bed. I was, like, doing something with people. I stood up, and I know the feeling by now. You're just, like, out there it is again. Bit me right in the foot. I just went to bed.

No way.

Yeah, they're stopping. It's starting to lose its efficacy on me.

Wow. That. That was the case because I saw those rites of passage thing that they do. They take these guys, the glove, and they fill their hand up with bullet ants, and they have the bullet ants stuck in the glove, so they can't go anywhere. So they just keep fucking you up. And it's supposed to be some thing that they do that is like a religious experience.

It's. It's a.

It's a rite of sand.

It's a rite of passage. So they'll. They'll. They'll pair. It's kind of like a bonding thing.

They'll, like, find a video that it's a.

It's a fucking mad rite of passage thing. They'll take, like, a young man, do it to him, and then they'll have a girl take care of him afterwards. And it's. And it's like, sort of trying to think. Trying to encourage them to, like, pair up. Oh, I know that Steve O did it. I saw a video.

Of course he did. That retard. Every time I talked to him, I'm like, please stop.

Please stop.

Don't let people punch you. Please stop. Don't let this happen.

Just take care of yourself. Please stop so much.

Yeah, he's so banged up. Such a wild man. You ever seen the one when he was in Africa and he climbed up the trees and a lion climbed up the trees with him and pulled his hat off? Yeah, those are real lion.

He's in, like, lion lies. I always wanted to ask about that because he's in a hammock, and they have meat hanging from the hammock, and there's lions, like, biting their asses.

Yeah. I don't understand him.

He looks good.

They played keep away with hyenas, so he's got it on. He's freaking out.

Yeah.

Let me hear some volume. And the next day, Chris's hand. What a fucking psycho.

Wild boys was a show.

You can get stung by those things now. And I thought it was like, my friend Steve got it. He said it was like 12 hours of excruciating pain. He said he could barely walk.

My first one was like that. My first one was like that. I was like, out. Like, your lymph nodes swell up. You have horrible pain in your body. You have a headache.

One bite.

One bite. One bite of the arm. And now do it on purpose. Yeah, well, because the guys were like, yo, what up? They're like, you think you're tough, big guy? You could down there. I'm big up here. I'm not big down there. They're like, oh, you big guy, huh?

Does anybody work out? You're the only guy works out in the jungle. You're out there doing chin out there like, what the fuck is this? They think I'm weird. I mean, sure they do.

Because I'm in the sun with my shirt off, doing push ups, sit ups, pull ups, doing my jungle workout, and they're like, walking by, like, what's wrong with gringo logo? Why does he do this?

Crazy.

Yeah, but then I go climb the giant trees, and I'm like, all right, listen. You know.

Yeah.

You want to come? And they're like, no, but they.

So they said, you think you're tough?

So they took a bullet ant and. And you play bullet ant roulette. You just, you know. So we each take a bullet ant and I put it on my arm. So it starts walking around, and then you take your arm, and we just mash our forearms together, and we go like this.

Oh, and, boy, whoever.

It stings.

Oh, boy.

It's super fun. It's a great drinking, dude. You mix that with shots.

Really fun.

Awesome.

Sounds really fun.

So much fun.

So you were wrecked for how long?

How about a day and a half? I took it really bad.

That's not fun.

Took it really bad.

You and I have a different understanding of fun.

The excitement of wondering who it's gonna hit is fun.

I would rather not know, dude. I don't want to know what that feels like.

See, that's my. That's different. If it. When I see the wet paint sign, I go, really?

I don't.

Oh. See?

I go, let's paint. Somebody painted it. I don't respect that guy's work.

No, no, never. I have to end with the dumbest things, too.

Bullet ant. So how many times did you do it voluntarily? Once. Okay.

No, never more than once.

And every other time after that was.

Just every other time than that. You're just doing your life. And there's pain rating.

Four plus on the Schmidt siding pain index. Sting pain index. The highest possible rating. And you can just go to sleep after that. Causes waves of pain for up to 12 hours after a single sting. No study for use as in biological insecticides. Of course it is.

Of course it is.

Paralyzes insects and causes pain in humans. Affects voltage gated sodium channels, and blocks synaptic transmission in the central nervous system. Yo, how many people die from bullet ants?

I don't know, but it does feel like something that, at the level where you have it as a glove, could kill you. Yeah. Like, I feel like, given the intensity that my system felt from one.

Do you think that those people have already been stung a couple of times?

Those kids have grown up being stung. So, JJ. JJ said he didn't have shoes until he was 13. Grew up walking through the jungle. He said he had his first bullet into ant sting when he was, like, two years old.

Oh, my God.

Which, like, as a two year old, that's like being stung in the face by, like, a wasp. Besides this water pitcher.

Imagine what that feels like if you're a baby, a soft, mushy baby. And that can't just fucks you. So they are experiencing it akin to what you experience now. So when they're putting the glove on, even though it's horrific and it's getting their whole hand and there's a yde bunch of those bullet ants in there, they're probably much more custom.

I think that they have, because they've grown up in the jungle, they're much, much more custom. But, I mean, you're watching Steve o do it. Like, I would think twice before putting my hand in that glove and not having a hospital nearby, because I would think that you could go. That could be overwhelming to your system. They're very intense. It's not a joke. Like, I could get bitten by a bullet ant right now and go, all right, well, we're going to do the rest of our day because I feel like it. But what you really want to do is just stop living, because it just.

Even today, everywhere, even today. So is it that you just accept the pain and you understand what it is and you don't freak out. Or is it your pain threshold? Has it lowered because you've done it a bunch of times so your body's immune to it?

Yes. It has to lower to the point that you can make the decision to, like, grit and bear it, you know? Cuz. Cuz at first it's so bad that you walk around going, wow, wow. And you're like, wait, okay, if I walk, I'm in pain. If I lay down, I'm in more pain. If I leave you, there's nothing you can do, right? Nothing you can do. You just fucked.

And so now fever.

And now I'm like, man, God damn it. And I'm like, well, let's go do what we're gonna do anyway.

A wasp sting to a normal person.

Yeah. So now a wasp thing to me, like, I'll just catch a wasp now. Because, like, I was like, you know, like, I come home and I see people, like, running from a yellow jacket and I'm like, I'll just, like, grab it with my hand. Let it stick.

We were talking about this yesterday. I genuinely think that people must feel pain differently. And it makes sense that some people just. I don't even think it's a tolerance thing. I think it feels different. I think that's sort of like the same thing with spicy food. And there's a bunch of different things. Like that cold water, there's things that people can tolerate and it seems like they're not just being tougher. No, like, it's not as hard for them. Like, there's a, you know, maybe their ancestry evolved around being in pain all the time. They got a custom makeup dude.

My friend Noel, my childhood best friend, he always calls me. He goes, dude, you want to go surfing in Montauk? And I go, bro, it's February. It's fucking February. There's going to be ice on the water. And he's like, yeah, but the swell is awesome. Well, wear wetsuits. So one time I tried it it with him. I will never do it again.

So are your hands in a wetsuit or.

No, no booty boots on. But it's so fucking every time a wave washes over you, it goes flying down your back. Of course you're in ice cold water. And yes, the waves are incredible. I don't care.

And you can't breathe, right?

I mean, it's so. It's. It's like, I mean, you do the cold plunge all the time and it's.

Like, yeah, but I'm not moving and.

You'Re not out there for 4 hours and you're not sitting on your board.

Balance my cold ass knees.

But. But so to me, I look at Nolan, I go, shit. Either he's way tougher than I am, or he just is predisposed to not really giving a shit about cold water. I hate cold water.

It could be that, but it aura is. It could be. You get acclimated, you get accustomed. Because we were talking about people.

Yeah.

We adjust to our environments. We adjust to all kinds of different things. You probably get accustomed to that experience and the rush of riding those waves.

Yeah.

Is. And it's also. There's a thing about being a badass. Putting that wetsuit on. Well, that's where it gets.

That's where it gets me. Where it grows. No, I'm gonna make myself do it.

That.

That's where I get myself on it. Where it's like there is a certain satisfaction to going, yeah, take it. Take another frozen wave.

If you're warm in your house and you're looking outside and it's snowing and it's ice on the ground and you're looking at your wetsuit, you're warm.

You're warm.

Ah, you're drinking soup. You know, you got some chicken noodle soup. Oh, you're just so warm and you're watching television. Why would I go to the ocean?

Good moon 90.

Are you guys really gonna go? Let's not go.

You sure you wanna go?

Come on, pussy. We're gonna go. And the guy comes back with fucking icicles in his beard and shit. Yeah, there's a. And we admire those people.

Well, you. You fucking savage. You said you wake up cold and go in your cold plunge.

That's not that hard.

That's terrible.

It's not that hard to wake up.

Cold and not do any push ups or something. Worked up a sweat first. No, I would say, okay, fine.

I do it sometimes after the sauna, but then I always finish on the cold.

Yeah, but that feels good.

I always. If I do that, I never go, cold, sauna, heat up, and then go outside. I go, sauna, cold. Sauna. Always end on cold. So you always freeze your dick off at the end. Oh, God.

I just.

It's not that hard. It's just three minutes. If you count slowly to ten two times, it's three minutes. That's what I found. So I just count slowly to ten for three minutes and that's it.

I respectfully disagree with you. I think this is one of those things where you. You have found that this is a way for you to sort of flex for yourself and you've gotten used to it and you've come up with a system. I would never. I just. There's certain things I just don't want to do.

Yeah, it sucks. I don't want to do it. Every day. Every day I don't want to do it. But I tell myself, shut the fuck up. Pick up the lid, put it down, climb in. You know you're climbing in. Stop. Set your. Oh, I do want to say. Garmin, your new Phoenix eight watch shuts off when you get in the cold plunge.

No.

So this is a fe. I have a Phoenix eight and I have a Phoenix seven. They're awesome. I love these things. But the Phoenix seven I have to wear when I do the cold plunge. So if I work out with that one. But this one has a better heart sensor. Yeah, this one. This one's just better overall, the eight. But it sucks that if you go in cold water, it doesn't even make any sense. Like, how did you go backwards? The old one, you go into cold water and nothing happens. Underwater. Operating temperature range zero to 40. Yeah, that's not true. So Google this. Phoenix eight shutting off cold plunge. Google that. Trust me, I looked it up online. It's not just me. Yeah, see, watch turns off and reboots in cold water. Yeah, that's what everybody notices. So if I'm in the water for 5 seconds, it shuts off.

Damn.

Yeah. So they're apparently gonna fix that. They think it's a hope. It's a software issue, they better fix it. Now the crazy thing is they have a dive feature on this watch. So if you're swimming and you're diving near in cold water, it's gonna shut off.

That could mean if you're down there and you're like, how much time do I got on this exact. You can't have your watch turned off.

Right. And if you get down to depths and it's below 40 degrees, it's probably gonna shut off. I don't even know what temperature it shuts off, but people have done it in cold water. So they've taken a glass of cold water and dropped the watch in cold water and it shuts off.

Hmm.

Not good, Garmin. It's just not good that you just release this thing and didn't check it. How did you not check for cold plunge when you got a dive function on the watch?

Interesting.

Yeah. So apparently they think they could fix it with software, which I hope is true.

Well, that would be good.

But the seven works. That doesn't make any sense. I've never had a problem with the seven. I put the seven on in the sauna, I put it on the cold. Never have a problem with it.

Yeah, well, I'm like that watch. Cold kryptonite.

Message boards say it's a software issue and you can fix it by putting it in beta. If you know how to do that. Right. But beta disables the divider. Yeah. So the beta that they put out, it disables the dive function. I think there's some talk of another workaround, like maybe shutting off the touchscreen, that maybe that would help. But the problem is, it's like you have a watch that everybody's used to coal plunging in. They used to jumping in the ocean in. They're used to doing stuff in. And then the new one doesn't let you do it. That's. You can't release that. You gotta fix that before you. You didn't have to sell it yesterday. It just came out, like in, I think, September. I took. I ordered one. It took a while to get there. I was all excited. And then first cold plunge. I'm like, what in the fuck? That's a wolf tooth.

That's a wolf tooth.

Yeah.

Nice.

I forget who gave me that one. Yeah, I got a lot of shit here, man, from cool stuff that people have given me. But, you know, it's the. Having things like that. Like a watch that does gps. Like, this watch has maps on it?

Yeah.

Shows your elevation. You can get a lot of information off of these things and you could track waypoints on them. And I always use a thing called OnX hunt as well. And onyx Hunt is a software app. You download maps for the specific regions and you can hit attraction. No, it doesn't. I bet it can. I don't know how to do it.

I don't do it on your phone.

I just do it on my phone. I use this mostly for elevation. You can use gps on it, but it will drain your battery a lot quicker. Because if you don't use. If I don't use the gps function, this thing will go like 30 plus days with. Without charging.

Without charging, yeah.

And monitoring your heart rate, doing all kinds of different shit. It's a flashlight. It's built in.

A flashlight?

Yeah, flashlight built in. It's nuts. So if you're out in the woods and you don't have a flashlight, it's led flashlight. It lasts for fucking ever because it's led, because it doesn't draw a lot of power. Power. These fucking things are incredible. But this new one, yeah, you guys fucked up. But having those things, like do you bring an in reach or anything?

Well, I mean, because we also do tourism. We bring, you know, we bring out a sat phone. But now, dude, now Starlink right now at my, at our base, at the treehouse and at our research station we have two different starlinks. So we have better Internet there than I have in the Hudson Valley in New York.

Dude, I can, dude, isn't that incredible?

It is, it is. It's absolutely incredible.

It really is amazing. It's amazing how small it is too.

You can also take it and put it on a boat if you need to. So like, so I finally let, like Lex broke me down on this. I finally started a YouTube channel and it's like I'm gonna start bringing people on all kinds of shit. Cause now I can just stream it from there.

Right.

Fuck tv crews.

You could have it.

I'm gonna take people on nightlight your.

Car as you're driving around the jungle.

Yeah, well, hopefully there's no roads, but I want to take people. Like I could literally put on your backpack. Put it on my backpack?

Yeah, you probably could literally have it flat on the top of your pack and walk around. At least catch some signal.

Catch some signal. Or you know, for the boat. Like if we go, look, we're going to be going 4 hours upriver and we know that there's an invasion and we're going with the police to go check out these loggers and there's going to be some fucking action going down. Throw the starlink on the boat. I could live stream that and take people with me.

Whoa.

Yeah. Or now. So we, a few weeks ago I sent you that picture, that huge anaconda, the one with the blue eyes.

Yeah.

And we've been working slowly on breaking the 20 foot mark. That one was 19 something. And so we've been working more and more on the Anaconda project and my guys and you know, like when you, when you know, you have your people with elk hunting where they go, dude, I saw an elk that like in certain people you trust, they went, we found one that's over 7 meters and they haven't caught it yet. Are you talking over 21ft? So we've broken 19, right. And so we're gonna be going out for that. And so that's the type of thing where I'm going. Imagine bringing people. Cause I, after our first show, the comments were hysterical where people going, this guy's full of shit. Like absolutely hysterical. Like, people about the anacondas, about everything we talked about.

Oh, that's funny.

Like, the Internet was just like, great show.

So much documentation of it.

I know, I know.

But all they have to do is go to your page.

They were like, oh, this guy really is there. Some of them were really funny. I laugh at a lot of the comments. They're like, oh, I'll take that. Never fucking happened for 300, Alex. Like, you know, it's like, okay, great.

Well, people always want to say that.

People always want to say that. But now it's like, now we can fucking livestream this shit and we go jump on a snake with a head this big. So we're putting together an expedition to do this now. And it's going to be fun in.

These areas that you do, that you go to. Have they ever done any of those lidar explorations of it, where they fly drones over to try to map out if there was some ancient structures in these areas?

Yeah. So we talked to the local people and they find the terra Praeta earth and the pottery in the areas that it is. So usually the places that it is. And we kind of talked about this, that grant, like the. Graham, Graham Hancock. Yeah, I always want to say Graham Watkins, Graham Hancock. I think that on the Amazon proper, I think there was a lot of civilizations out in the tributaries where I am, it's very rare to come across those things.

Those ancient civilizations, those people, the uncontacted tribes out in the tributaries, they're probably living the way they've been living for thousands and thousands and thousands of years.

So my book publisher, it was so funny, I got kinda like, I was writing something and I said something about these Stone Age warriors. What this guy must have seen as these Stone Age warriors came and murdered him with arrows. And they were like, how dare you call them Stone Age warriors? And I went, what? They don't even have stones. So first of all, right, they're really stick age. Yeah. Did I just get woked for so dumb?

Is Stone Age a bad thing to say?

But I mean, it's not very often that you come into that problem, because we wouldn't call most normal people Stone Age.

Well, the native Americans were essentially Stone ages.

Well, he uses it in empire of the summer moon. Well, these Stone Age warriors, or da da da. And I was like, well, these are pretty much stone age people. And so I wrote it and I basically got told like, hey, don't say that.

God, how weird is that?

Yeah, I also lost a book deal because I retweeted that Elon Musk liked.

Our treehouse, but she lost a book deal.

Yeah. I had an amazing meeting with, like, all the people. This lady was like, you know, like the devil wears Prada, like Meryl Streep. Like, she was, like, the big head honcho, one of the major publishers, and they were like, dude, you're next. Textbook is gonna kill. She had, like, 20 other people on this Zoom call. We had, like, an hour long thing. We talked about you. She was like, and how close are you with Joe Rogan? And I was like, we're bros. And then. And then they were like, well, you know, either way, it was going really good.

Liberals.

I was thinking I was gonna get a life changing amount of money. I was thinking I was gonna get, like, a million dollar book deal. And that got confirmed through a bunch of avenues that it was a Ydev big one. And then. And they were very impressed with Lex. They love Lex. And she was like, you have Lex Friedman in the Amazon? I said, he's right over there. I was, like, on the phone on Starlink talking to this publisher, and she's like, so your next book is going to tell the whole story. And then that week, Elon tweeted, cool treehouse. Now, when the greatest inventor of your generation tweets anything that you did, you share it. So I shared it. The publisher got back and went, not only are we not even, we're just not making an offer anymore.

Wow.

They don't like the type of people that I associate with.

Just you retweeting that. You sure it wasn't me?

No, it was him. They vetted you. They were like, how close are you with him? And I was like, listen to me. He's the fucking nicest guy in the world. I was like, you can't. I was like. And they were like, would he write a forward for your book? And I was like, I don't. I was like, I think, like, I need, like, a more, like, a Harrison Ford to do that. Like, I don't know. I don't know. Like, Joe could do it, but I was like, I think we need, like.

Yeah, they just want, like, famous.

They just. That. That's all they were doing. That's all they were doing.

Famous people to say you're awesome.

But. But. But as soon as Elon's name came into the mix, I didn't know this. I was unaware of this, that Elon has people that hate him.

Hate him.

I didn't know that.

Well, it's a lot of propaganda that really works, and a lot of it is what happened when he took over Twitter. So you have to look at it from, like, what, what really happened? Was there real outrage when he took over Twitter? Yes. Yes, it was real outrage. I firmly believe there's manufactured outrage that's done in a very directed manner. And I think he was most certainly the victim of that as well. And then there was a narrative that continued to get pushed like hate speech on X.

Hate speech that he's promoting it.

Yes. That anti semitism, that racism, that all this stuff is up. Well, if you allow people to just speak freely, you're going to have that. You're going to have that, but you can always, like, not look at that. But you're also going to have many more good things, too. And the point was, what he really exposed was that the FBI was involved in suppressing the Hunter Biden laptop story, and that these journalists who studied the Twitter files, Matt Taibbi and Michael Schellenberger and Barry Weiss and all these different people that went over these documents found that, hey, there's something very inappropriate happening where the government is getting these social media companies to take down true stories and to sign off and say that it's russian disinformation.

And Elon confirmed this and Elon confirmed this.

So that's when he became very dangerous to them. And so then the narrative of Elon being a white supremacist and Elon being, you know, but then the thing that happens also is he will tweet wacky shit and then he will retweet wacky shit that turns out did not be true. True. And all that, they attack and it builds up and you get a distorted perception of his value in our culture, in our society. And he's one of the greatest inventors the world's ever known, one of the greatest engineers we have alive. And he's involved in multiple different industries, and he's changing those multiple industries in incredible ways. What they've done with space travel, with SpaceX, where these fucking rockets can land now, what they've done with these starlink things that we were talking about. Incredible. If it wasn't for Tesla and electric cars, do you really think there'd be as many electric cars there are today? Wouldn't even be close. You wouldn't have governor Newsom saying that California has to be all electric by 2035 because no one would be making electric fucking cars like that. There's a documentary from early two thousands. It's called who killed the electric car.

Yeah, yeah, I saw that in college.

You want some coffee?

Yeah.

Fascinating documentary. And if it wasn't for Elon and making Tesla's awesome, you wouldn't have all these fucking electric car companies. And he makes everything open source.

Okay. And that's all fine, but my problem is people that take the guy who's trying to save the butterflies and the monkeys.

Yeah.

And kick me out for that. For naughty. I've never even met the guy, dude.

It's akin to being a Nazi.

So I have to pretend to not like him.

Right, exactly.

Align with their worldview.

It's what I was talking about with Hollywood when I was talking about how people start making money and they start being very careful about what they say because they're worried about it's going to go away. You also realize there are consequences, like what you experience. So those are real fun. So that's it.

Yeah.

And so minor, right? So that is how you get people to stay in line. That's how you get people to only think the way they think. And then you start reinforcing it in yourself and you start wearing pearls and doing all kinds of wacky shit because you want them to, like, you want to think they're what, you're one of them.

Now that. That was really creepy because, you know, I mean, I live in the jungle, but, like, I hear about all this stuff, but I don't know, like, who the players are.

Right.

What the temperature is in the room and you just thought it was cool.

The guy said, you have a cool treehouse, dude. It's like one of the coolest guys ever.

If this guy goes to fucking Mars, a historically relevant inventor said, something I did was cool, great. Share it, you know, and it cost.

You a million bucks.

Yeah.

This is the world we're living in. That's why. And it's primarily the left that's that wacky. Like, if Bernie Sanders had said, cool treehouse and you reached out, he would have been fine. Everybody would have loved you. You would have been fine. And the right wouldn't have attacked you. No, they wouldn't have cared. They wouldn't have been upset. You wouldn't have lost businesses. No one from the right would have not given you a book deal because Bernie said, nice treehouse, and you're like, thanks, cool.

No.

And retweeted, no one would care.

Obama. It could have been anything. I mean, that, by the way, that was super cool. I loved it. My friend sent me. My friend Connor sent me a clip where you were telling one of your guests about me. And so I shared it. But it was like the first time that I shared a clip where it was really just you talking on my instagram, and the comments were berserk. I didn't realize you were such a polarizing person, Joe.

It's the same thing. It's the same thing. It's a distorted perception of who you are by people that have very low level information. They have surface information, and they've decided that you're an alt right. This or. There's been many, many articles written about me being like some fringe right wing person, which I'm not at all. But if they say it enough times, the people that have low information, they believe it.

Well, but this is where. This is where I'm interested in. When you say, like, okay. And this is like the shit that's going on in Israel, the hysteria that everyone's feeling. You're either a good guy or a bad guy. Elon's good, if you like Elon bad. I just want to see everybody start to calm down. I just want to see the adults be running the room again. I think.

I think that's cute.

No, no, no. Pre 911. I'm sorry. When I was a kid, and let's just, like, we'll go back to, like, I was in 8th grade and 911. Somehow back then, it seemed like, I know there's still corruption and there's a lot of fuckery going around, but somehow things have gotten more off the rails with this. This stuff where it's like, you know, remember the Obama Romney debate where they're like, yo, man, what's up? And they're like, we disagree, but we agree. Like, we're both gentlemen here. Like, come on, come on.

Super cordial.

Yes, it's very nice. Yeah. And so, like, I think. I think that what I've seen in the last few months or in the last year was that a lot of people, again, I'm really speaking from my perspective here, and I'm just kind of hoping that this is the case for the rest of the world, that people are chilling the fuck out and some.

People are waking up and realizing how stupid it is and how most of the problems that we have are bullshit.

Yeah.

In terms of problems we have with a. Each other.

But then the next thing is, then we can actually start focusing on, if we're not hysterical and we're not doing all this crazy shit, then we can actually start focusing on, okay, well, look, how do we fix things in the Congo? How do we fix things in the Africa in the Amazon. How do we pragmatically fix things so that the american food system is better and everyone benefits and stop fucking arguing over it.

Yeah. And to realize that this is not a right wing or a left wing issue, that's a human health issue.

A very unhealthy way to argue.

And also, like, real charitable organizations, like, real ones, like, what you're doing. Like, it's actually helping things. It's actually designed to help. It's not designed as some sort of a front to make to cover money and as a tax shelter. It's, you know, there's a lot of philanthropy that's good. Yeah, a lot of it. A lot of it. But then there's also a lot of philanthropy that's not really philanthropy.

It's like, posh.

It's money.

Sure.

It's. You're making money with this philanthropy. You've got economic.

Well, that's the thing. So now that I have an NGO, we went and looked up all the other NGO's, and, like, a lot of the NGO's, their CEO's are making $500,000 a year, like. Like big paychecks, so. And that's where I do think it's, you know, gets weird. It gets really weird. But I think also that what I told, the first story I told you about, like, when. How we saved the ancient forest, it's like, I think what we've done that's very exciting, that we're feeling this swell. We're kind of riding this wave right now, is because the guy with four kids, or classically. I had this mom in Ohio message me, and she was like, I have two kids. I show them your instagram. I love what we do. We give you $5 a month, and it's like, $5 a month from enough people. And we saved the whole fucking Amazon. Not to mention that. Then people like Dax de Silva from Lightspeed reach out, and he's like, look, man, I won captain. I'm gonna fund your whole ranger team. And it's like, people are reaching out.

That's amazing.

And so we. And so I'm surrounded by all these incredible people that. That want to do good. I got approached by those dudes at Vivo Barefoot. Shout out to Vivo barefoot.

David grapes. I use their stuff all the time.

So they. They're my first sponsor. They reached out to me.

Great shit.

The. Well, I also. I hate hiking boots. Right.

Those barefoot hiking boots are legit. The ones they make, they're.

I like theirs. I hate hiking boots that are restrictive. So they reached out, and this was the cool thing. They went, are you interested? But it was like, only if you check out. They were like, are you good? Are you sustainable? Are you this? And I was like, I run a fucking rainforest organization. And they were like, because. And these guys care so much about their shoe and about how people wear it and about where it's used and the materials. And I just read Yvonne Chouinard's book, let my people go surfing. The guy who started Patagonia, dude, he. I mean, he just worships rivers and mountains. And they started making this stuff. And I just. I just think. I just think we're on this cusp of that. We still can save a lot of the endangered species. I mean, I'm living miracles every day. I'm like. I'm like, watching us draw in this map of protecting the Amazon. And when you're one third, you're like, we're gonna do it. And so it's like, I just think that as people. I got really scared of when I got woke. That Elon Musk thing was so weird.

I was like, we all gotta just sit down. I got woke right in the face and it's got dicks left.

Innocuous thing you did. It's so funny. But that's, like, wrong think, wrong speak. You're not allowed to like this guy.

Well, that's the thing. Who am I allowed to like?

That's. It doesn't. None of it makes any sense. It doesn't make any sense.

So I gotta stay in the jungle, man.

People are just so polarized. And it's also, you have to realize that the pressure. Yeah, that they're under is not from that many people. It's like the commenters on Instagram. Unfortunately, the reality is most people comment on things all the time, or morons, and they're not happy. They're unhappy morons. So it's a bad sample group. Right. So you're getting a lot of people that are making comments, but people, if they're commenting, they can't. I would like to know, like, what percentage of comments. And just overall, if the Internet, if anybody's ever done this analysis, are positive versus negative, I would have to say it's probably at least 50 50.

I would say it's 50 50. Again. I think I'm jaded, though, because when I look at, like, I look at. If I look at the YouTube comments on a Lex podcast, all the comments are like, thank you, Lex, for having this important conversation with amazing Lexus fans. Lexus fans are great. Yeah, every. I mean, every. I don't know. A lot of the support that I get online, I've very. People tell me I look like the lead singer of system of a down. Other than that, there's nothing that, you know. Right. Middle east. Amen. Serge Tankin's a fucking hero.

He's a dope dude.

I love that guy.

Yeah, he's awesome.

I listen to his music every day.

If you're. Yeah, if you're getting compared, that's a good guy to get compared to. But this. This polarization is just like, there's a bunch of people that feed into it, and they attack people because they know that the people that are on their side are like, yeah, you're one of the good guys. And so there's that weird shit where you got a lot of really weak people and mentally ill people that like attacking people. That's a lot of what it is. It's a lot of people that lack nuance and understanding.

But don't you think it's coming back? Don't you think we hit a peak and now it's starting to come back?

Yeah, because those people are kind of being exposed for what they really are. They're very damaged human beings. Like, the people that attack people all the time. They're all fucked up. All of them, 100%. Why would you? You only have so much energy in your day. Why are you spending it getting mad at some guy? Because he retweeted, the greatest genius of our generation said, nice treehouse. That's fucking ridiculous. It's a ridiculous thing to get angry about.

I'll tell you, one of the conversations I heard recently was, this is, like, such a simple point, but someone I know was going, you know how? And forgive me, I don't understand these issues. He was going, how dare they make a mandatory minimum wage? They were going to raise the minimum wage or whatever else. I was watching two people, and one guy was passionately going off about this, and he was, I think, a Republican. My other friend was sitting there, and it was such a great thing that he did. He went, that is, he goes, I 100% disagree with you. He goes, but could you explain to me why you think what you think? And they had this amazing conversation where.

They just debated, yeah, that's great.

And it was with respect. And I was like, oh, fuck. Cool. I watched it like it was a podcast because I don't know who. I don't know any of this shit anyway. So I was just like, I don't know.

It's a complicated issue. It's about restaurants and places that operate at the margins. They're very close to going under all the time. Time. And you can get cheap, unskilled labor from, like, young kids and high school students and people getting first jobs. And that's how they operate. And when you say no, you have to pay a living wage to everybody who works. They're like, okay, now this is a.

Lot less money as a business owner.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I mean, but the point was, though, that they were able to completely disagree and go, I completely fucking disagree with you. No, and there's fine.

It's great when people can do that.

I love that.

When people don't attach themselves to the ideas. That's the problem is almost every man that I know has a hard time. Women do it, too. But for men, it's like a dick swinging thing where they have a hard time not being attached to an idea. Like, if they've espoused an idea, if they believe an idea and they're arguing that idea, that idea is a part of them.

Yeah.

And they'll even lie and fuck around with things and, like, half truths to try to make their point. Make a little, you know, they'll do bad faith arguments. You see it on podcasts all the time where people make bad faith arguments about political issues. You're like, oh, God, now I'm never going to listen to you again because I know you do this thing that's a gross thing that you don't have to do anymore because we live in the Internet now. Like, you don't have to do that gross thing you do where you pretend you're right about something so that you can win this argument. That's a stupid person's way of talking.

If you're debating honestly, you could in many situations be happy to be proven wrong.

Yeah.

With my friends, if I say there's absolutely no way you can lift that fucking thing and you do it, I'm like, I was wrong.

Yeah.

You know what I mean? Like, I'm stoked. You just did that.

Well, also, it's like, you're not your ideas. I say this all the time, but it's a really important thing for people to recognize and to people have it in your head. You are not your ideas. You are. And these ideas, they come and they go and you agree with them or you disagree with them. And sometimes you're going to agree with an idea, and then a few years later, you're going to have some life experiences or talk to some people that will make you look at things differently and go, you know what? I used to think this, but I don't think this anymore. And here's why. And you have to be very cognizant that your ideas can capture you, and then you can become like, so many people are captured by the way they want people to think of them. This is a very Hollywood thing. They want people to think of them in a very specific way. So they'll say the things that they've heard other people say who are accepted, and they'll talk in a certain way. You know, you get. That's where you get accents from. That's also where you get uptalk.

You know what up talk is? So when you do this thing, and so when we build these infrastructures, what we're trying to do. So someone talked like that, and a group of people talked like that. To get in with that group, you had to kind of talk like that. So you let them. Oh, Paul is a really good guy. So what Paul is doing is quite amazing. Paul goes to the Amazon, and he's in the rainforest, you know, so they're talking valley girl. But this is a thing that they do to let everyone know that they're on the team. It's a very tribal thing. It's almost like another language. And these tribal things that we do, we attach them to everything. We attach them to religion. Religion. We attach them to technology, even health. We attach them to ideologies. And if you don't, if I can't trust you, if you're retweeting Elon Musk, don't you know he's the devil? You know, if you're. You're hanging out with Joe Rogan, oh, my God, he's a piece of shit. Like, these people have these, like, little religious ideas in their head that you can't eat pork, you can't violate this.

It's Sunday, motherfucker. Why are the lights on? They have these weird laws in their head. They attach them to everything, man. People have, like, a place in their mind for religion. And if you do not have religion in your life, you will take social issues and you will treat them with the same fervor, the same fucking fever pitch that people treat religion. That people who are, you know, evangelical christians, the people who are fucking snake handlers, you'll do that with your thing. And if your thing is trans kids or whatever your fucking thing is, no oil. Now, whatever your fucking thing is, it becomes a religion because you don't have religion. And the human mind is set up in a way that you need some sort of divine structure. You need something that's bigger than logic, bigger than all of us. And people will apply those things wherever they see fit. You can join a cult, and that's a whole different thing. Oh, we're different. We do yoga, and this is our life. Yeah, we all fuck each other.

I mean, but then there's casualties. Like, then Kevin Hart doesn't get to do the fucking oscars.

Yeah, but Kevin Hart shouldn't do the oscars. Fuck the oscars.

I wanted to do the oscars.

Those things are gross. And what they are is you're having a contest for art, and I think that's gross. I get it that it helps your movie sell, and if it's an Oscar, Academy award winner. And I get that people are celebrated for great work. I get all that. It's awesome. I get it's a seller. But it's also gross, you know? And when it was revealed to be gross was when Chris Rock was on stage and Will Smith slapped him. And then a few minutes later, will Smith wins an Academy award, and they give him a standing ovation after you just assaulted a guy in front of him. It just shows you there's no ethical moral structure to the way these people are living their lives. They're living their life by the whim of what the crowd agrees with.

But that's also, like group hypnosis.

Yes.

Like, if you. If that happened in any other situation, like, everyone was just like, we don't really know. Know what to do. You know? Like, you just keep going.

Well, it's also they're afraid of being racist. They don't want us to. Two black guys are duking it out. I can't get involved in this. This is not my thing. I don't know what to do. I'm gay. It's like sitting there watching this take place, and then they're clapping for him and standing up when he wins the Academy award. And so the rest of the world, unbeknownst to them, had already cast their judgment. The rest of the world's like, are you out of your fucking mind?

Yeah.

This is insane. And so they're like, oh, the rest of the world think we're out of our fucking mind? Cause you are out of your fucking mind. You guys are all in a cult.

Like, no, but see, that's what I mean about adults. Nobody else walked on stage and just went, all right, everybody, we're taking five minutes out. You get the fuck over in the corner. You stop. Are you okay. Okay, great.

There's no way we're going to commercial. Grabbed him immediately, escorted him out of the building.

Everyone just awkwardly continued on with the night.

It was not. And he awkwardly continued on with his set.

You did great.

Not really. No, no, no. Chris Rock, right after that, he was all fucked up. Like, his jokes that he. They were flat. Everybody was like, you just got slapped. Like, this is crazy.

But that. I don't think that was his fault. I think that was because.

Well, it's totally not his fault. He just got slapped.

I thought he did an incredibly classy job of just being like, well, I'm gonna do the best I can and do my job as a professional.

He did that, but he went back on with the script, which is just insane. But the good thing about that is then Chris Rock really became Chris Rock again.

Yo.

Like, he didn't give a fuck anymore, yo. He's like, what, tv. I'm going off, yo. So he became like Chris Rock from bring the pain again. But I think what kept him from doing that in the past was that he was in the club. He's in the club. He's hosting the oscars, doing these big movies. You gotta be in the club.

Gotta be safe.

Can't be retweeting Elon Musk.

You gotta start learning the rules.

You gotta learn the rules.

I gotta quit you. You would know the answer to this question. So there was, there was a. Again, I missed all these things. Didn't somebody rush Chappelle on stage? I took him out.

Yeah.

Tell me if my. My memory is accurate, because I saw a video. I don't remember who tackled the guy or whatever else, but did they like to dislocate his arm?

Oh, they beat the fuck out.

They beat the fuck out of this guy.

Yeah. Once they got him, they beat the fuck out of him. I'm sure they broke his arm. I'm pretty sure. I'm pretty sure. He's had multiple injuries.

I'm pretty sure.

Knife?

Yeah.

I mean, he was a crazy homeless person. Terrible lapse in security. Who are the security guys? Are. They got fired. Yeah. And it was. The whole thing was a fucking mess. The guy ran onto the stage.

I. Sometimes I do this thing where I don't believe my own memory. Like, I'll see something amazing and I won't really?

Yeah.

It's out of.

They probably Camorra didn't look at his face.

He looks like he went through a whole five round fight.

They beat the show. He's lucky he's alive, you know, I.

Mean, you go after. No.

With a knife.

Fuck, man.

You know, I mean, he didn't have the knife in his hands, but he had a knife on him like some big fucking dude.

That's also terrifying.

Brass knuckles looking thing.

Terrifying?

Yeah, it's terrifying. It's terrifying that there's people that are so out of their fucking mind that. And it's, again, the same kind of thing. He's transphobic. He's transphobic. Jokes are transphobia. But words are violence. No, that's not. That's violent.

Chappelle, listen. It's.

But that's how nuts we are.

Listen.

That's how nuts we are that a guy.

Can you listen to this special? Right?

They didn't listen. They don't care. That's the thing. No one's listening. They're not listening to me. They're not listening to Elon. They're not listening. Yeah, they just. They have these things, and they're just like religious dogma, and they lock down on those things. And Dave Chappelle's transphobe. We got to take him out.

Dave Chappelle's a living saint.

Yeah, come on.

He's untouchable.

Amazing person. But he makes jokes about things that are real in our culture, and that's a real thing in our culture. And if you say there's a thing that you can't make fun of, that thing's bullshit. If there's ever a thing that you can't make fun of, that thing is bullshit, dude.

Yeah, I had to do. I was taking care of somebody actually, I wanted to tell you this. I was taking care of somebody that had life saving surgery, and I was helping them recuperate. And so I was just staying with them, and it was like, you have a brush with death. You see your mortality. Things are down, whatever else. And we caught our breath. I was like, let me just do something. And I put on a clip of you, and it was. It was. It was a. You were telling the story about, like, a hotel, and you was. It was you, Sagura and Chappelle. But anyway, we were watching you guys do various bits of comedy on YouTube, and I made this person. You guys made this person laugh so hard, we had to stop watching it because they were going to bust a stitch. It was like the best medicine you've ever seen. And it was like. It was. You were telling a fucking crazy story about waking up in a hotel and everyone's cramming down the exit.

Yeah, the hotel was on fire.

Yeah, that was great. And then it was Sagura doing when disabilities are funny, he goes. He goes, not all disabilities funny. He goes, but sometimes they're funny. And he does, like, a ten minute piece on that, and we're just crying. And it was just such a great transmission of just comedy, just being.

The thing is, comedy is comedy. And to try to say it's normal speech is ridiculous, because it's not your opinions, it's things that are funny about these things. Like when someone's saying something about anything that's inappropriate, you should never say that. That's Louis Ck's whole act, is saying the wrong thing. You're not supposed to say that. So he's gonna say it, and it's hilarious. But it's also really well written. And I. This is not like if you sat him down and asked him his opinion on people and life, he would give you a different version. This is just an art form. It's just like a movie. Like, you go to a Quentin Tarantino movie, none of those people really died, okay? This is just art. It's just like, something's creating something, but.

That, and that's the sense where I feel like it's coming back, because, like, look at the shit that Chappelle's pulling. Look at the shit that you're pulling. Like, people are saying stuff again.

Well, people are realizing that you don't have to give in to list. It's a small, very vocal minority of people, but most people are tired of it. Most people Miss Old. You don't get a good comedy movie anymore. You don't get super bad anymore. They can't make that movie.

Tropic.

Tropic Thunder. You can't make that movie. You can't make that movie. I asked Robert Downey Junior. He goes, oh, you could. You could, but you can't. I mean, we fucked ourselves. We fucked ourselves by listening to these mental patients. Because I think some of it's gonna.

Come back, because I think it's gonna cut now. It's gonna. I'm usually right. It'll swing back. You look at movies from the seventies, they're fucking brutal.

Oh, yeah.

Everything now is so sanitized and, like, you don't.

But still. Tarantino, though, he's sort of the only one he's sort of grandfathered in.

The last time that I saw a scene in a movie that. That made me really cringe was in bastards. When. When the bear jew comes out of the cave, and the guy is the nazi soldiers, he's. He's on his knees and you're so used to that. They cut on impact.

Mm hmm.

He comes out and he fucking takes that swing and they don't cut. I don't know how they film that shit. Movie magic. But you, you go, oh, God. And Brad Pitt's sitting there chewing on a piece of bread and like clapping, like eating while this guy gets beaten to death. And. But like, I remember being like, oh. Because usually you watch John Wick, you watch whatever the fuck you watch. A thousand people die on screen, it doesn't matter. But every now and then they make it so real. Yeah, those seventies movies back in the day.

Yeah.

Cuz all the shit was real. Oh, yeah, car chases were real.

Yeah, man.

And now I watch movies and I'm like, dude, come on.

Remember bullet though? Like ten minutes. McQueen car chase.

Steve McQueen. Yes.

Motor streets of San Francisco. Crazy Mustang and a fucking charger.

There's a movie with Anthony Hopkins and Alec Baldwin where Anthony Hopkins has to fight a bear. I think the whole movie's about them. Funny, dude. They actually, they used bart the bear from legends of the fall and whatever else. But it is the most. You watch it, you will be blown out of your seat because Anthony Hopkins is 10ft from a fucking grizzly bear. And then the tree, you can tell where they swap. If you watch it really closely, you could tell where they swap him out. And the trainer gets like hit with a paw. But this guy is wrestling with his pet bear. Yo, seriously, look at this, look at this, look at this. Look at that fucking bear. Look at, look at fucking Anthony Hopkins. The best.

How does he live this? How's that even possible? Because they just tear you apart.

Look at his face. Just trust me. Just. Jamie, go to like halfway, like halfway.

This video so ridiculous that bears like.

Barely chasing him go like halfway, halfway down this video.

Please get the fire.

No, no, no, no.

I don't need to see this. I'm gonna have a different opinion of it.

No, no, no, no, that's not the clip. There's a clip.

You see the revenant?

Yeah. Piss me off. Cartoon bear. Ah.

CGI bear.

And I love Tom Hardy and I love DiCaprio, but that, come on, that's CGI bear didn't get.

You know, that's based on a real story. Yeah, yeah. That's based on a guy really did get. He crawled like 20 miles.

My main takeaway from that movie is a lot of cold water. Cold water I just watched every time he fucking crawled in a cold, cold stream, I was just like, you know.

That incident didn't really take place in that environment, though. The actual incident took place on the planes. It wasn't the same environment as they just. Rainforest.

They just put it up.

They put them in. I think they filmed it. See, if they filmed the revenant in BC. I think they filmed it in the, like, the rainforest of BC. You know, BC is a lot like Seattle. Well, I think they filmed it in the, like a dense forested area. And I don't think the real incident took place in any sort of environment like that.

I remember positive of that. Winter deciduous forest, but not rainfall.

Waterfall scenes were filmed in Montana, but the wiki says it takes place in the Great Plains. Right, so. But where did they film all the forest scenes?

I think it was Canada.

I think it's BC because it just is way more dense than the Great Plains. It's nothing. It's not what they experienced. But this guy crawled. It's like he's crawling across the fucking plains. Like this guy got torn apart by a bear and crawled. Actually crawled. Initial plans were to film the final scenes in Canada, although the weather was ultimately too warm, so they had to go to Argentina where there was snow on the ground to shoot the ending. Argentina, that's the ending. What about the other stuff in the woods? Like when they get attacked by the Native Americans? I thought that was in BC. Either way, whatever it is, it's like very dense forest, which is not, what?

Not historically accurate. You got to do a little bit.

Of that, do you? It's about the planes.

Then there'd be no trees. Like, trees are central in that movie. Like the.

The stars kind of bullshit. Like, isn't there way.

Well, then every movie's bullshit.

Alberta. Yeah, there goes.

Okay. I mean, even, you know, Alberta's crazy thick. I mean, every movie then that you, like, you know, like every, like, historical movie, you go, how much of it is true?

Oh, yeah.

Like, I just watched, you know, I hate those movies, Ford versus Ferrari. And I was like, how much of this is true? And they're like, none of it. Did any of this really happen? No.

Okay, so the canon country and the spectacular scenery of Bow Valley in the Canadian Rockies west of Calgary, Alberta. Fucking beautiful up there, man. Yeah. So that's not like the real environment where that really went down, but all.

Yeah, I guess it would have a different feel if they were out on the plains and it was.

Yeah, and they get attacked by the Plains Indians and, you know, and that guy got fucked up by that bear out there. There's. There was bears out there, dude, that's what's nuts. Like, we killed them off. Like, California has a bear and it's state flag. It's a big old brown.

Used to be brown bears.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

They. They fucking killed all of them. They're like, get the fuck.

Yeah, they know. They know what year the last brown bear was killed in California, and they know when the last black bear was killed in Manhattan.

That's not.

Think about it.

Black bear, Manhattan. When was that?

When they bought it for like $15? It was just, it was just a fucking regular.

There's a town named after the guy who was the last guy to get killed by a brown bear in California. It's called Lavec.

Nice.

I think his name was Stephen Levitte back. And he got the last guy that got killed by a brown bear. I'm like, that's it. We're done. Kill them all.

Did you ever see that? Do you ever see the video where the guy, where the bear takes the guy's face off and he's still talking? Okay.

Yeah, I did.

That's.

Yeah, that's, yeah. He got his face as a rule, and they stitched it back together again.

They didn't do a bad job.

Not bad.

Not bad. Because that video, that was, again, one of those times where I'm an adult and I'm. I'm not okay.

That was, like, early days of Internet growth shit.

That was like Ebaum's world time where you could see everything.

It was the early days.

I was just trying to explain this to my mom. I was like, when they were doing the journalist beheadings, you could see it.

Yeah.

If I tried now, I don't know. I wouldn't even know where to go.

Reddit, really? Yeah, four chan, I don't think I've.

Ever been on Reddit.

You should go.

Yeah.

Become, like, much more rabbit. Red is very left wing, and Reddit has become very censored. Like, things get pulled down off of Reddit. Is there any chance still buck wild or Chan. Four chan. Four chan is where, like, all that QAnon craziness came from. There's a lot of nutty people out there. That's where the political frogs. Those frogs, peppy the frog that they use for memes. So it's all like, Internet culture ship posters.

Yeah.

People that are anonymously posting so they can just say the wildest things and there's no censorship.

Yeah, but I'm saying, is it? But what I want, you can find. I want the gods, Google. I want that thing where you go, I want to see people eaten. You know, who got eaten by a bear, or, you know how in the grizzly man, they don't show you the footage or the play of the audio? Like, I want that. Like, if I want to see it, I want to be able to see it.

I think Warren Herzog destroyed that audio, which is unfortunate.

Yeah.

But also, you know, his mind was like, it's kind of funny, right? Because his mind was like, this is be. Like. It'd be too damaging. It's too bad for. You don't want to hear it. You don't want other people to hear it.

I wouldn't want peek at it to hear me screaming in agony as I die.

Right, but your whole film is about blue balls. How stupid it is that this guy lives in the grizzly maze in a tent surrounded by bears. Then it's inevitable that one of them is gonna eat him.

So it'd kind of be like a comedic punchline to hearing him go, bro.

The movie's a comedy. It is a comedy.

It is a comedy.

It is. It is.

When he's like, bad bear, and he touches it, and the bear turns like, what the fuck? Did you just do?

The whole thing? It's. He was so nutty, and he was such a crazy.

He was nuts.

He was tiger king times 100.

But he also. There's, like, a moment where he transcends, and he's like, in the grass, and there's a fox on his tent, and you're like, dude, this is kind of cool.

Yeah, that was the fox relationship.

The fox was cool, but with the.

Bear stuff fox, I'm your friends, which is weird.

Yeah, foxes are cool.

Yeah. Like, you can just. You don't even have to have lived there a long time. You just hang out with them long enough, they'll have hang out with you.

Well, I found a fox den a few years ago, and so there's all these. The mom was out, and there's all these foxes, baby foxes, pups, sitting outside the hole. So I would creep up on them, I'd get into position, and I'd watch them come out, and they are the cutest little things in the world.

Yeah.

And they're all just standing around, and I was like, I want to raise a fox so bad.

People have done it. I know they have pet foxes.

Oh, I know. I wanted to do it so bad to go to the jungle in, like, a week, but I was like, mandy, if I wasn't going to wait, you.

Would have to feed those little fuckers and they want to kill things all the time.

Like, it'd be like having a really wild dog.

Yeah. It would be like having a coyote for a pet. Yeah, I would imagine. But they're really clever.

They're really clever. They're really beautiful. Yeah, I don't. And coyotes. I don't even need to have codies as pets. They're, like, behind in the Hudson Valley.

Oh, yeah. They're all over the place.

Everywhere.

Yeah, they're everywhere. They're in Manhattan.

I don't believe that.

True.

Really?

Yeah, yeah. In Central park.

In Central park.

Multiple coyote sightings. They've had them in the Bronx. Coyotes are in every city in North America, at least in the US.

It's a huge testament to how stealthy an animal can be.

Oh, yeah, man.

Because they live.

Look at that stop. Central park. Yeah. Yeah, man. They're all over the country. They're all over the country. And that's basically in the last hundred years, I think less than that. I think it's like, from the 1950s on, they've spread across the entire country. There's a great book called Coyote America.

I. It's on my list. I'm dying.

Coyote's been seen in Central park, in other parts of New York City since the 1930s.

Yeah.

The number of sightings has increased in recent years, especially in 2019.

Yeah. Incredibly addictive, adaptive. I mean, that's just the craziest.

They adapt and they expand the range. So whenever you kill one, the females have more pups and they expand their range, dude.

That's why they're everywhere now in the jungle. I was working with this british filmmaker, and he came out of the jungle one day, and his face was white, and he goes, I saw something. And I was like, if you say bigfoot, I'm gonna.

He's.

He goes. He goes, no, I saw. He goes, man. Because, Matt, he saw a white tailed deer. And I went, you didn't see a white tailed deer. We have red rocket deer, gray. You didn't see a white tailed deer. And I started really hammering on him. I was like, bro, you've been out here too long, man. Long story short, there is a vestigial population of white tailed deer that inhabit the western Amazon.

What?

So he thought he was insane. They come in from the andes, and they have, like, an island population down in the lowland jungle. He happened to see, and this is like, a guy that, you know, he's not bullshitting.

Whoa.

He was physically, you know, it's like you saw a giraffe.

That's ridiculous. That he would be that freaked out.

I think just because it didn't belong there. He was a real wildlife guy. I mean, if I saw, you know, a leopard in New Jersey, I'd be like, well, fuck, either I'm cracking up or something. As far as I know, this doesn't go here, right. You know?

Right.

So he came back and he was like, I don't know what to do. He's like, I saw something and I was like, well, did you get a shot of, of it? And he was like, no. I put my camera up and it ran and he was like, but I swear to God. And I was like, nah, you didn't see anything. He saw whitetail deer.

That's crazy. Have you seen the jaguar sightings in Arizona?

I did. I saw the camera trap water. That is super cool.

That is super cool.

We're doing something with these new edna packages where they, we can take water samples and it tests for all the different DNA in the water.

Oh, so all the different animals that are drinking water. Wow.

Bigfoot's either about to get found or go extinct.

He's gonna go extinct.

Yeah, I know.

Do you think they could find the giant sloth with that? So that's an interesting one.

That and the thylacine are the only cryptids that I'll entertain conversations about.

I entertain the sloth one because there's so many of these people in these deep, dense jungles in the Amazon that claim that they've seen them.

Yeah, I'll tell you something offline about that. I have a theory about where they are.

I can't wait to end this podcast.

I just, I just, there's gotta be, there's places people keep going. We've explored the whole world, just like people don't realize. And I'm telling you, after coming off of these expeditions where we travel for an entire week by land to get, because you get on a plane, get on a plane and be in Barcelona in a few hours, it's such a mindfuck, it doesn't make any sense. Whereas when you start walking or you start paddling, you go, this planet is huge.

Huge.

And we deceive ourselves into thinking like, oh, yeah, we figured it out, out. But if you fly in a Cessna over the Amazon and you look at a winding little golden river and you're looking out over a vast picture of football fields with this tiny little golden filament going through it, and the next one of those golden rivers, which, by the way, that river is like a hundred meters across, this giant water artery that's been flowing through the jungle. The next one, as you're in this cessna looking out over the jungle, the next one is barely in your peripheral vision over there. So you're talking about like 110 miles that way. As the next.

Dense, dense jungle.

Dense jungle. No trails, not even the tribes, nothing. No one there. Who the fuck has explored that? They don't know what's under there. No one's explored that. Not to mention 50% of the life in the rainforest. You forget it's a 3d environment. When you're on the planes, the animals are at eye level. When you're in the rainforest, you're under 160ft of canopy. So it's like being at the bottom of the ocean and we don't have access. Who can climb 160 foot tree that goes straight up like the World Trade center, right? Pretty much no one.

You're only going to see the tree tops if you do and you're only.

Going to see the tree tops. So scientists have had very limited access to the rainforest canopy, where 50% of the life in the rainforest is.

Wow.

So, so much of the planet has not been described or studied. And it's so funny when I watch people go, yeah, everything's been explored to like, bro, I could take you somewhere right now and show you the places where no one's been and they haven't flown over with Lidar yet. And there are things that we don't know. There's like, there's a lot of stuff that we don't know about and I've seen, because I've seen it with my own eye. I don't believe shit. That's why I have to touch the wet paint. Cause I don't believe shit unless I've seen it myself.

Well, listen, brother, I'm glad you're out there. It makes life more interesting.

I'm trying.

I appreciate everything you do and I appreciate you. And thank you for coming in here. It's a lot of fun. Tell everybody how they can get ahold of you and how they can see what you're up to.

Absolutely. Jungle keepers is growing. We're protecting more rainforests than ever. Junglekeepers.org dot we are bringing people to the rainforest, we're supporting the indigenous conservation efforts. We're crossing 100,000 acres. The more people that come in and help, we can actually find a way to protect the Amazon rainforest and stop feeling guilty about it. Also, Jamie, if you just, last thing, pull up that rhino transport picture. I'm taking people out into Africa with the experts at that place. Buffalo Kloof. And people can actually come with me to do some incredible front lines on the ground work with endangered rhinos in Africa. Like this type of shit.

Absolutely.

The people who are holding back the extinction of these animals, who are doing cutting edge research and work protecting these amazing animals, jungle keepers.org, comma, paulrosley.com, comma, Instagram, all that other shit. And we're doing some truly miraculous stuff. And a lot of it has to do, Joe, with the fact that you came in and told everybody about it.

My pleasure. I'm happy for you.

Wild out there. It is so much.

Thank you. My pleasure. All right, bye, everybody.