Transcript of #2208 - Brigham Buhler

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Train by day. Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. So tell me what it's like to testify in front of the Senate. What is that like, man?

It was pretty wild. It all transpired so fast. I got a call from Cali. Means we've become pretty good buddies. I know you're having him and his sister Kayce on the podcast. Brilliant folks that are just patient advocates. I mean, at the end of the day, they had the same experiences. I had. Callie, a little bit different walk of life. He was a lobbyist. Casey was a doctor, Stanford trained surgeon. Realized that she was in a system where they didn't really heal people. They just treated symptoms and profiteered off disease states. And she said, there's got to be a better way. So their voice rung so loud. And after, I think they did, Tucker, that it led to momentum. And then, because of you having me on the podcast, that's how I met RFK. And so Bobby's team had reached out to me maybe about a year and a half ago to come up to Dallas while he was doing a campaign there and sit down with him, and he was just asking 100 questions about what's going on. And what did you see on the pharmaceutical side, and what did you see owning pharmacies and billing insurance companies?

And so when they had an opportunity to put this team together to testify in front of the Senate, the goal was to create a nonpartisan group of individuals to take a new, fresh approach to what is going on with chronic disease in America, because the chronic disease crisis is at an all time high. I mean, we could go through all the statistics, and I know that Casey and Callie will when they're on here, so I don't want to steal their thunder, but it's staggering. I mean, close to anywhere between 1.7 to 1.9 million people are dying a year of chronic disease. We talk a lot about war. Since the dawn of this country, roughly estimated between 1.3 to 1.5 million people total have died in war. American lives. So in a year, we're losing more people to chronic disease than all the wars combined, and we're not talking about it. So, to me, I was excited when they said, hey, the Senate's willing to hear. And that's the beauty of a democracy. They did let us come in there and candidly take a dump on the Senate floor on what's going on with this health care system and really dig into the weeds.

Did anybody try to take this side of the pharmaceutical drug industry, did anybody question you or try to push back?

So prior you do a debrief? So we did do a roundtable prior to going into the communal roundtable in front of the public eye, which they had no idea what was coming. The Senate didn't expect it. We had assembled a grassroots effort to get the word out there, and over 2000 people took off from work. These are. This is a Senate hearing. Over 2000 hardworking Americans took time from their busy day, flew to DC, had to sit in an overflow room to listen to these testimonies. And the level of feedback from people, from, like, real humans, real world people, was staggering. I mean, people afterwards came up in tears, sharing their story of how the system had let them down or a loved one down. Misdiagnoses, like, all the different issues that they've dealt with trying to navigate this system. And to the senator's credit, behind closed doors, they did say, you probably don't want to go ultra hard after the food industry or ultra hard after the pharmaceutical industry, because it may limit our ability to get things done. But they did.

How did they phrase that?

They just said, you catch more flies with honey than you do vinegar. And me, Callie, and the other folks that said on this panel, our goal was to just share our stories and share what we saw. And so my testimony in particular was really more about the human side. There's so many staggering datas and statistics and numbers. Behind all that is a person like, that's all I wanted people to understand. These are human lives. You know, when jelly Roll testified, I think he said this equivalent to a 747 jet worth of people die of opioids a day. And that's insane. And that all started with the lapses in the FDA and the drug regulatory market. And we know that, you know, there's an argument out there. I know. Cali released the number of 50 plus percent of the FDA's funding comes from big pharma. When it comes to drugs alone, 75% of the drug funding comes from the pharmaceutical companies themselves. And so there's a big market there. And with big pharma spending over $8 billion a year advertising, that's more than the entire sum of the FDA's budget.

$8 billion a year just in advertisement. Imagine how much they're making so that they can afford $8 billion just in advertising.

Yeah, it's insane. But what I saw is, the truth is, my hope is that people listen and the american people fight. We can fight with our pocketbooks. We can fight through our choices as citizens. Do I have faith that the government's going to fix these problems overnight? I don't. But at least we're having the conversation. And to their credit, they let us speak freely. They didn't put a censor on us. They tried to give us some coaching, you know, to say, hey, if you go this route, just understand there's going to be blowback. And, you know, we're here to get progress on these topics, not, you know, burn the house down type deal. And then I did have some, and it was, it was a bipartisan effort. So some of the senators in the room had mentioned, well, the american people just want a pill. You know, they don't really want a solution that they're not. They're looking for an easy way out. And I pushed back. And it's funny because one of the moms that was there was like, oh, my God, I can't believe you were just dropping f bombs in that meeting.

But I'm like, I think you're fucking wrong. I mean, after being in healthcare since I was 20 years old, what I see is people struggling for answers. People are in the pit of despair.

Who was saying that the american people just want a pill?

I don't want to name any names, but one of the senators there was saying, in his experience, people are looking for the easy way out. And I don't think that's the case. I think people are looking for hope.

Well, here's the thing. If there was a real easy way out, like if there really was a pill with no side effects, it cured all your ales, sure, people would want that. This is the problem. The advertising that $8 billion a year, it leads you to believe that there is some sort of a solution in the bottom of a prescription bottle. And that's not real. That's the problem, is that they've been misled so long and for so far down the line, and here they are, chronically ill, suffering, and they're hoping it's the next pill.

And that was our hope, was to break down from the start of how do we process these foods? How do we grow, harvest, and what do we do with our soil, what do we do with our pesticides? How do we bring these products to market, how do we regulate our food industry? And that's all new to me. That's not my expertise. My expertise and my testimony was focused on what I saw as a drug rep. What I saw as a med device rep. What I saw billing insurance companies, and that was a part of the talk that we didn't even get to dive deep into. But the goal was to explain to the Senate, from the food processing, growing, harvesting, chemical treatments, to the packaging, to the ingredients we add into our food, to the hospital systems throughout the system, front to back, the american people are set up for failure. In the 1950s, the US had, the FDA had approved 700 different ingredients in our food products. That's it, 700. Today there are over 10,000 chemicals and petrochemicals in our food products in the United States, in Europe, still 700.

Jesus.

And what gets crazier is when food, baby, she's an influencer, right? And that that's been, you know, crapped on by the media.

Well, it's an unfortunate name, but she's.

An advocate and she's just a voice, a mother out there saying, hey, guys, what's wrong with this picture? Let me show you what's in fruit loops in America. And let me show you what's in fruit loops in Canada. The same manufacturer, Kellogg's, is selling one product to the american people and a safer, less ingredient, less chemical filled product outside the United States. They have the ability to sell it here, but they don't because they know they can sell more addictive, more colorful, vibrant, that attract kid food sources here in the US.

It's so dark.

And so we walked through all of that. It blew my mind on the food front. And we know you and I have talked, like, in the healthcare system. My main message was, we're here to talk about the boom in chronic disease. We know that food and our environment has a huge impact on that, but so does preventative care and so does building an ecosystem that allows clinicians to troubleshoot and diagnose and prevent chronic diseases from evolving in the first place. These are all metabolically related disease states. All the chronic diseases that are killing us can be traced back to diet, lifestyle and nutrition. But none of our clinicians are trained on diet.

Lifestyle, nutrition, that's the hard pill for people to swallow. Diet, lifestyle and nutrition. It's very hard for people who are addicted to shitty food, who are lazy, who don't have a history of exercise, and their lifestyle sucks and they get home from work and they like to drink. All those things are killing you.

You and I have talked about this with some of your comedy friends that have become my friends, too. To watch the evolution, you just got to give people momentum. We just got to get some wins on the board. We got to give them hope, and we've got to start by having the conversation. And that's what I was optimistic about. For the first time in my adult life, the Senate is willing to sit down with a group of individuals and have a deep conversation about where our food comes from, how our food is being processed, what ingredients are in our food, and how that could potentially lead to chronic disease. And it got labeled by some of the, I would say, hatchet job media outlets that have come out, and we can dive into that. Somebody called it the woo woo.

Yeah, I saw that. Let's dive into, first of all, fuck you, whoever wrote that. Cause there's nothing woo woo about anything you guys were saying. That's what's really crazy. To say that toxic chemicals that are illegal in other countries but are legal in the United States, and there's a reason why they're illegal. You could find all the different things that they do to the body, all the different damage they cause. To say that that's woo woo is so crazy. Like, what did they list as an example of woo woo?

What's hard is they went immediately at like, these are all entrepreneurs that have something to sell you. And I can tell you, sitting in the room with those people, all of us were scared. All of us were scared. It's scary. I'm not gonna make money off of this. If anything, I could lose money. I have businesses that are under the FDA's guidelines, are under the FDA's oversight. I don't want to upset the apple cart, but I also want to tell the truth, and I wanted to share what I saw. And that was my message, was, I'm not here to represent the left or the right. I'm here to represent humanity. This is not a republican issue. This is not a Democrat issue. This is a humanity issue. These are people's lives.

But it's just stunning that people are willing to whore themselves out to write a hit piece on someone trying to help human beings find healthier choices and realize the root cause of all the diseases that we're facing.

The woo woo article, she alludes to how we talked about nothing but metabolic disease. And what does metabolic disease have to do with cancer? Actually, I can tell you it is the number one risk factor. Obesity and metabolic disease is the number one risk factor to all forms of cancer other than smoking. So if you take smoking and age out of the equation, it's your number one risk factor. That's what it has to do with it.

Imagine that statement. What does metabolic health have to do with these diseases? That is so crazy.

And the people on that panel, too, to their credit, I was the least qualified of anyone to be in that room. And I was there to talk about my experiences as an industry insider. I am not telling you that I am an expert on metabolic disease. I can tell you that I'm an expert on fuckery because I've been in healthcare long enough to see what they're doing, and I know their equation, I know their offense. But other than me, you had Casey means, Stanford trained surgeon. You had Doctor Palmer, a psychiatrist from Harvard, who was breaking down metabolic disease and how it's astronomically impacting the mental health crisis in America. One of the stats he dropped on us in his testimony was, we are at an all time high in suicide and death of despair. Greater than during the Great Depression. More Americans are dying of suicide and death of despair. More than ever, more children are being diagnosed with metabolic disease, diabetes. Girls are starting periods six years younger. Like, this doesn't. I don't need a double blind study to tell you something's wrong. Just look at the data.

I'm hearing a lot of woo woo from you. I need some data.

It's like, as we get into that in the names, they just totally breezed over. And that article tried to make it sound like it's a bunch of influencers. And it's like, yes, there were some people who have social media presences, but there were also academics there.

But also, you can't just.

Harvard, Stanford, and Stedman Hawkins.

You can't dismiss someone who's giving out factual information because they're a so called influencer. Some people get into influencing for a good cause 100%, and they have real valid information and they collect that valid information and distribute it, and that's how they get a following.

And, you know, even Vonnie is the food babe. Vonnie, her battle has helped remove ingredients from certain states, stop chemicals in certain food sources. They're actually going to march to Kellogg on the 10th of next month to hand a petition signed by over 100,000 Americans coming out the tail end of that, asking them to remove dangerous chemicals that they don't put in food products in other countries and just match it. That's all they were asking. Hey, why don't we just match what you're doing outside the US and all these other countries where they've said these products aren't safe? Why are we allowing you a mulligan on the us population when it comes to food and they've never been studied? That's the other wild thing. The FDA doesn't have the bandwidth to study every time a new ingredient's added to a food source. So you and I have gone down the rabbit hole on the FDA's attempt to try and regulate and rein in big industry, like big pharma and big medical. And I know I've told your listeners before, over 90% of the products in the operating room have never been through an FDA human safety trial.

It was an entity built at a time to serve a purpose. And I just think they're drowning. And I think there's a lot of industry influence and spit being swapped that can skew decisions and viewpoints, and that's dangerous.

It is dangerous. It's dangerous. And it's spooky that you get pushback after that. So let's talk about the pushback, because it was immediately afterwards you started texting me like, dude, holy. Holy shit, these hit pieces are nuts, because you could see the machine moving against you. So you could see that someone saw this Senate hearing, realize that it could potentially have an impact, and tried to do their best to mitigate those potentially positive effects for the health of american people, but it could cost them money. So they started pumping money into these media outlets.

Absolutely. And this is what I've seen before, owning a compounding pharmacy. When I went on Jillian Michaels podcast, she was, she is very opinionated and passionate about this. And it took me ten minutes to explain to her that compounding pharmacies aren't bad guys. And because she had only heard the corporate media narrative of compounding pharmacies are dangerous. People are getting drugs from these compounding pharmacies that are in garages, and they're just willy nilly making compounds and shipping them into the marketplace. And I had to methodically walk her through. Compounding pharmacies fall under the FDA's jurisdiction. Compound. My pharmacy has been inspected three times in 18 months. Every single ingredient we buy is an FDA approved ingredient. Every single compound we compound, we send off to an independent third party lab to verify, okay? And I say all this just to lay the groundwork. We've treated over a million patient lives at waste. I mean, at our pharmacy, over a million patient lives nationwide. And what they do in that environment is the media will list any recall, any mistake a compounding pharmacy makes, but sweep under the rug that big pharmaceutical companies like Eli Lilly and Pfizer have moved most of their manufacturing overseas, where the FDA has to submit before they can come do an inspection, and has to give them two months notice because they're coming into a foreign country and they've got to get visas and approvals and all these things to come inspect those facilities.

They can't just walk in like they walk into my facility. And so Lilly, Eli Lilly in particular, one of the reasons they're struggling with backorders right now is their facilities have been popped for egregious action by the FDA. But none of that is in the public eye. You have to scour. I think Reuters is the only one that wrote an article, but little compounding pharmacy in Texas recalls 28 vials proactively for a mislabel. And the New York Post makes it national news. But you didn't cover Eli Lilly's nationwide issues on all these products. Or the fact that over 2000 manufacturing facilities owned by big Pharma haven't been inspected in five or more years. It's just not good journalism. Well, it's not. Just doesn't have integrity.

It's just $8 billion. That $8 billion has an effect. I'm sure these journalists aren't sitting there watching this Senate hearing going, you know what? I'm outraged. I feel like these people are full of shit. I'm going to help the american people and write this piece criticizing it. No, they're probably being instructed.

Well, she gave us that she sent us and said it was very vague. I get a voicemail, we want to write an article on your pharmacy. I find out at 03:00 I'm in meetings. We draft a response explaining all the things we do to go above and beyond and how our vision is to bring cost effective prescription drugs to the american people for pennies on the dollar, typically less than your co pay or deductible. What part of that? And in this article, at the end, I shit you not, the girl puts, and by the way, Eli Lilly slicing prices by 50% on their weight loss drug. That's how the article ends. And I'm like, how is this not an advertisement? And so I looked, and now that I've, I've seen it. When I was a drug rep, I saw it when I owned pharmacies and labs. I saw it as a device rep. But I went and looked and said, okay, who owns the New York Post? And when you peel back the layers to that onion, the New York Post majority holders of stock are vanguard, Blackrock, State street. Now let's go look at who are the majority owners into Eli Lilly.

Vanguard, Blackrock, State street. So the same folks who own the pharmaceutical companies who have the most to gain by keeping the narrative the same and driving America towards the chronic disease crisis and monetizing your chronic disease with all the things you and I have discussed before, whether pharmacy benefit managers, insurance companies, hospitals, pharmaceutical companies, front to back, top to bottom, we've lost our way. We really have lost our way, Joe. It's all about quarterly earnings and quarterly profits. And I'm not saying that they're intentionally poisoning the american people to set them up so that they can knock them down. I just think it's so siloed and so compartmentalized and everybody's fighting for that extra dollar that quarter, that day, that month, that they're just blocking and tackling and preventing the narrative from rising in their siloed bucket. But you have to, like in humans, we have to take a look out and go, hey, I'm not just treating your knee or your brain health or your heart health. The body is an organism that works together. We have to do a deeper dive to assess where the disease started, what caused it, and can we uncover the root cause and fix the root cause?

We have to do the same thing in our systems and our protocols and our procedures. We know that corporate capture is real. We know that corporate capture has somewhat happened with the FDA, somewhat happened with Congress and the Senate. You know, everyone's scared to fight these guys, and they can wreck your lives. It's scary, and it's hard to fight when they control the media. They control all the funding to the advertising on the news networks. I mean, good luck getting a story out there.

It's so weird that they've been able to do this for so long in such a shifty way. It really is. Because there should be laws against that. If there's laws against insider trading, how's there not laws against manipulating narratives in order to profit at the expense of people's health?

Yeah. And to even further highlight the level of corruption and corporate capture, I sent you and Jamie an article. I don't even remember the news outlet, but when you look who owns that news outlet? Okay, well, it says most of its funding comes from this PR firm. Then when we go to look at who owns the PR firm, it's Monsanto that owns the PR firm that got this other. And it's always layered. It's never abundantly clear, like, it's hard. The other one we talked about was the Atlantic. And as I peeled the layers back to the Atlantic, it was owned by Bradley, who made his money being a consultant for big pharma and pharmacy benefit managers. He sold a big chunk of his company off to Optum, which is one of the dirtiest pharmacy benefit managers out there. And we broke that down on your previous podcast. The pharmacy benefit managers, for those listeners that don't know, were established in the seventies and eighties with the goal of driving down the cost of prescription drug care for american, but it got captured by the insurance companies. So Cigna, Aetna, CV's, health, all of those companies now own these middlemen that are negotiating rebates.

So it's important to understand, because those rebate dollars are held at that company, and they're making billions off of chronic disease. Billions. So if you're on a GLP, one weight loss drug for the rest of your life, and they've negotiated rebates to the pharmacy benefit plans that they own. They're oftentimes holding 40% to 50% of their profitability in a shell company that's not disclosed to the american public or the us government. And when they establish a Medicare price point on a drug, they base it off of the average wholesale price in America. And that's important because they artificially inflated the fucking average wholesale price and they're giving themselves a rebate on the back end. But the government doesn't have line of sight into that. And they know it's happening now. It's been exposed. We talked about this again on your last fight, but it's like, I think it's. The state of Idaho uncovered 230 million in fraud in one year from the pbMs. One year. Now multiply that times all the states in the United States.

Oh, my God.

And think about how much money is being made off of keeping people on prescription drugs.

Did you see the article that I put on my instagram that they put in the Atlantic? Is it time to torch the constitution? Did you see that?

I did. It's scary.

Same people.

It's scary.

Same people. They're putting a narrative out there to the general public who are like, whoa, he makes a good point. Maybe we should just give up all our power to Satan. Yeah, literally. They're literally saying, should we torch the constitution?

It's crazy. It's scary.

The only thing that protects us.

And I say this, I feel like I woke up and became my grandpa. I remember him always bitching about politics, and I'm not.

He probably barely knew, right? You consider how much information was available to your grandpa? He just had a sort of a nagging suspicion that it's all corrupt and crooked.

And I'm an idealist. I want to believe that. Like, I want to believe that people are looking for the truth. I want to believe that. And I told you this. Even. Even with the DOJ and what I saw with enforcement bodies, when your data sets are corrupt and the only info you're receiving is from bad sources that are pushing agendas, but those sources also are your future employment. When you are out of government service, it just becomes a dangerous, dangerous, slippery slope. And there are often times where enforcement changes legislation through enforcement. Like right now, the DEA is reviewing if they're going to allow telemedicine companies to continue to prescribe testosterone. And that's crazy to me because it's like all these issues we have, all the chronic disease. There is not a testosterone crisis. This is not like the opioid crisis.

Right.

There's not a lot of divergence or.

Even the GLP one crisis.

It's. Yeah, I mean, the amount of people.

That are having side effects to that in comparison to the testosterone thing.

And that's where, you know, you and I disagree somewhat on the GLP ones. Jillian and I disagree on the. Callie and Casey and I disagree. It's okay to disagree. There's nothing wrong with having different lens.

I understand your perspective. Your perspective is for chronically obese, like, really morbidly obese people. We need to do something, and this is a very good step, and it does work and it can help people. It is a very good step. I'm the hardcore discipline guy. I'm like, what the fuck are you talking about? This is something that you can solve just by eating less. Something you can solve by cutting out sugar, cutting out sodas, cutting out, eating whole ingredient foods, eating fish and chicken and red meat and vegetables, and cutting out all the bullshit. Real. That's a real thing that you can do. However, if you're 600 pounds and if you've gone so far down the wrong road, you need a hand. You need some hand.

That's where I'm like, if I was pushing an agenda, I have a ton to gain by GLP ones going gangbusters. I'm not on that bandwagon. I literally sat there with the Senate meeting and said, this is crazy. If we government fund prescribing GLP ones to children, that's insanity.

We shouldn't.

We need to fix our food products in schools. We need to limit soft drinks and advertising to children. Like, there's a million things we could do that are way more logical and reasonable than starting to stick a kid with an injectable that they're going to take the rest of their life.

But it's not as profitable. Yeah, that's the real problem. And the advertisements about that, they seem to me, the same advertisement, it's the same feeling I get when I see advertising giving babies Covid vaccines. Like, what the fuck are you talking about? Like, you're just trying to make money. You're not trying to protect babies from COVID That's fucking nonsense. It's not a problem with them. It's just not. It's just statistically not an issue. It's certainly not an issue for you to be promoting this potentially dangerous, dangerous remedy.

Yeah. Another example of that is that, you know, we were a foster family growing up, so we had up to seven foster kids at a time in my house. And I remember the hep V vaccines that all those little kids had to get. And I didn't think about it at the time, but again, hearing some of my friends like Callie and Casey talk about it, the vaccine schedule is crazy because you're giving a child a brand new baby, essentially a hep B vaccine. The only two ways to contract hepatitis B is basically you're injecting drugs or sexual activity. An infant's not going to have that. So why expose them to the risk factor of a potential adverse event when we know autism rates are through the roof? All of these different health issues for children are climbing, and at some point, we have to assess what we're doing and say, isn't there a better way? But I know enough about how that system works and how things are negotiated on the back end in the lobby, and now it's established, and now it's hammered home. And then you assemble and you go have a meet with all the pediatricians nationwide, and you have people as spokesperson that push that agenda and get senators and congressmen and women on the hook to go, yes, we need these vaccines incorporated as part of our policy to protect these children.

And I don't think. It's not that it was. I don't think everyone's in on it. I think people are being duped and it's so siloed. That's one of the other things you and I have talked about historically with medicine. Medicine so siloed, they don't look at the full human body. They look at, I'm a knee guy and I'm gonna look at the knee, or I'm a mental health specialist and I'm gonna talk to this patient about their mental health. But your mental health is intertwined with your physical health, your mental health. And this is what Doctor Palmer from Harvard talks about. You know, if we have metabolic disease and all these metabolic crises, it's going to lead to mental health issues, no question.

Well, there's been proven studies that show that SSRI's aren't as effective as exercise by a large, measurable amount. Like exercise is more effective at curing depression and treating depression than SSRI's. That's a fact.

Yep.

But, you know, you can't make money off of someone running around this block unless you sell them sneakers.

Yeah.

You only sell one pair of sneakers, like, every six months.

Well, and we're in the. What scares me? And again, not. Not to shit on the GLP ones, because we prescribe GLP ones. We utilize GLP ones. They are a tool in the tool belt, and when utilized appropriately, they can help people. But a hammer can kill someone if used inappropriately. And so if we make it our frontline defense, and again, we go back to the chronic disease crisis in America, and we say, okay, the food system's broke, then the people end up chronically ill. Then we don't really assess people until our assessment tools in a primary care market are based off a sick patient population. If we base the demographic off the average American that is dying of chronic diseases and that is our measuring stick, then why are we shocked when we continue to have a boom in people dying of chronic diseases and being diagnosed with chronic diseases? Cancer, all time high. I think there's going to be 2 million new cases of cancer diagnosed this year. Every single chronic disease is through the roof. The system is not working.

I want to talk about you, because one of the things that's interesting about this is, like, you were unhealthy at one point in time, and you were overweight, and this is how you kind of started this journey. And maybe a lot of people aren't aware of that.

Yeah.

Like, you weren't. You. You had to learn all this stuff, and you had to learn all this stuff through your own personal health crisis.

Yeah, I was. What was I, 29, 30 years old, early thirties, and I was 25% body fat, pre diabetic, headed towards all the same chronic diseases that we're talking about.

What was your diet like?

My diet, I had. Well, originally my diet was terrible. It was a traditional american diet. Right. So I was a surgical rep, and I had to be in the OR by 07:00 a.m. and so I would go do crossfit every morning. Then I'd go to the OR. I'd be in cases all day. I would eat whatever I could. I would drink a Starbucks frappuccino, not realizing there's a 1800 calories of sugar and chemicals and no nutrients. I just didn't know. And I grew up in a family, again, a foster family, where we were middle class America. But in maybe it was the eighties, eating healthy was like eating wheat bread instead of white bread. It was eating low fat lays, potato chips, and a diet Coke. That's literally what my family thought was healthy, and that's a lot of Americans. They don't know. And you just stay with what you're indoctrinated into. So I started seeing a nutritionist in my thirties, and I did lean down, and I lost weight, and I was getting healthier, and I was headed the right direction, and I was still training, but he was like, if you're doing everything I'm saying.

And so let me take a step back. I would go to a primary care, and it would take three months to get in with a primary care. Then they would just pull a basic lipid panel, and then I would say, well, can we look at my hormones? No, no, we don't need to look at hormones. We're gonna look at your lipid panel. We're gonna do a wellness check. Well, that doesn't include hormones in this country. It's not a deep dive because they're scared to do that because the insurance companies control what they'll reimburse and not reimburse. And so clinicians in this country are terrified to do the deep dive, and they only have six minutes with you, so they got to get you in and out of there. Long story short, six months later, still fat, still trying to lose weight, working out every day, seeing a nutritionist. Nutritionist said, I want to refer to your urology buddy, doctor Larry Lipscholz, who's one of the godfathers of urology and hormone optimization in the United States. And when I went and met with Larry, he was shocked after he pulled my blood work, and was. We actually did it twice because he just didn't believe my readings, and my testosterone level after seeing him was 98.

Oh, my God.

It's insane. He's like a woman, but I know it was terrible. And so he's like, of course you're. He's like, I don't know if you're fat because I told this story before. I don't know if you're fat because you have low testosterone or if you have low testosterone because you're fat, but you are fat with low testosterone. And so that was my baseline. And through just what were you eating.

Then when you went to the nutritionist?

Then I was using the nutritionist, but then it was a question of, was the hole? Did I dig too big of a hole? And then I was in. The question is, are you over training and you're crashing what little hormones you have left, and your body's trying to get ramped up. So we ended up treating at the time with hcg and clomiphene.

Let me ask you this. What did nutritionists tell you to do?

Oh, we prioritize protein. 1 gram of protein per pound of lean muscle mass. We cleaned up my diet. If you make protein the basis of your diet, because you need a gram of protein per pound of lean muscle mass to maintain, if you're trying to gain lean muscle mass, you have to up that protein intake. And then based off diet and our lifestyle and activity level. And so we would prioritize my carbs through certain times of the day, we would keep me at a caloric deficit, and we'd prioritize protein in that caloric deficit. And what you'll find is mind blowing. You aren't as hungry. If I don't eat a muffin and a Starbucks coffee loaded with sugar, I don't have that insulin response that causes the hunger cravings. A few hours later, where I'm back to eating another unhealthy meal choice. If you eat protein first, eggs, hearty, heavy foods, dense, nutrient packed foods, your appetite is suppressed. It's a natural appetite. You can't overeat. It's really hard to overeat meat.

It is.

And so we prioritize proteins. Healthy proteins, like chickens, fish, all of those sources. And then healthy carbs get away from sugars, whites, starches. Prioritize healthy carbohydrate sources that are slower burning, that allow you to metabolize the protein that yours work.

Fruits and vegetables.

Yeah.

So how much weight did you lose that way?

I literally went, well, starting on diet, I probably lost about half of the weight that I was trying to get off. So I know body fat percentage, he got me from 25 down to about 15. And then when we added hormone optimization, not testosterone, at the time, it was HCG and clomiphene, which boost your natural testosterone levels. Being monitored by a clinician within physiological norms. Right. To try and make sure that we're optimizing my health, not trying to get jacked in. Tanzanite literally helped me go from 15 to. At the time, I think I dropped down to around 7%, and I did not change anything. I was working out the same way.

Eating the same 7% is very lean.

Yeah. And now I walk around twelve to 15. That's sustainable. And I think in my forties, that's, that's a level that makes sense to me. But I think the way to do that is you don't wait for people to get chronically ill. I should have never been at 25% body fat. If we were getting proactive and predictive, and we were truly doing deep dives into individuals and taking the time for our clinicians in this country to sit down and assess you at the biological level, then we can prevent these chronic diseases. And I'm not talking about through pharmaceutical intervention, we can prevent these through diet, lifestyle, nutrition, and helping teach the patient that there's a better way. And if we need to involve pharmaceutical intervention, it's there, there's options out there that can help patients kick start their, their health and wellness, especially people in their forties.

So when you did this, how much time did it take overall from the original nutrition intervention to hormone optimization? Like, how much time are we talking about?

It took about a year. And that's what gets crazy with the insurance model. So a lot of people don't know this. Like, most insurance carriers in the US don't practice preventative, so testosterone will be considered a lifestyle drug. The challenge with like, an issue like the DEA, if they really do over regulate testosterone and shut telemedicine companies down from prescribing it, it's going to limit accessibility for these patients because primary carers don't want to prescribe it. Right, and so they're going to pump them off to a urologist. Typically, for an insurance company to cover it, you've got to have two or more fasted blood tests of a testosterone below 250 nanograms per deciliter. So that's a chronically ill man. I mean, that's to come back twice. I mean, that's going to take you six months to get in with that urology. That's in the dream world. So just to get the insurance coverage, you're talking six months to a year, and by then, that patient has been chronically ill headed towards metabolic disease, diabetes. You know, we know that testosterone is important to insulating us from certain types of cancer. It's important to our metabolic health, our bone mineral density, our lean muscle mass.

All of these tie into health and longevity and health span in preventing chronic disease.

Do you think that the reason why they make it very difficult to get hormone optimization is because if more people get hormone optimization, more people are not on these medications?

I think somewhat, yes. But I also think if you just looked at the insurance model is an obstructionist model. Right. And so I can give you a different example. With the opioid crisis, you know, there were non addictive, non abusive pain creams. Okay? If somebody is going to be put on, they have an ACL surgery, they're in pain. I'm not here to say there's no need to ever have a pain pill, but in those instances, there were alternatives that are non abusive, non addictive.

What are the alternatives?

There were ketamine based pain creams that were topicals that could not be diverted or you couldn't extrapolate the ketamine out of it and abuse it. So nobody ever got high or stimulated from it because it's a cream that you can't extrapolate the ketamine out of. So you could not abuse it, you couldn't divert it if you wanted.

So it just works locally?

It just works locally to address that knee pain insurance, within twelve months, quit covering it, because those creams cost hundreds of dollars. Whereas an opioid is like, I think, $10 a month. Right. And then the other thing you'll find is the pharmacy benefit managers, who the insurance companies own, have reimbursement deals on certain drugs. So when you get a drug, it's not because it's the best drug or the most efficacious drug. It's because the PBM pharmacy benefit manager has negotiated a rebate and decided to place that drug on tier one or tier two based off their financial incentive in that drug. Testosterone's been on the market so long, it's compounded a million places. There is no rebate for the big pharmaceutical companies or the big insurance companies on testosterone. And so it's just an additional cost. And so the more they can obstruct things that cost money but don't pay dividends back to them, they'll put obstructions in the way. So another example is not only did they shut down alternatives to opioids during an opioid crisis, they also cut lab reimbursements on toxicology screenings. At the same time that we're on an opioid bender, as a nation, they got rid of the last safety net, which was if you come into a pain clinic asking for opioids, they're going to make you do a toxicology screen to make sure that you're not abusing other drugs, that you're not diverting the drug, that this medication is actually in your system.

All of those reimbursements used to be covered by insurance companies, but they got rid of that. And so as soon as they got rid of that, there was no checks and balances. And so it is layered. It's very nuanced. It's never as simple as yes or no. And I'm just. I'm telling you what I saw. I'm just trying to tell you what I saw. I'm not saying I have all the Lego.

You hedge your guts there. But I mean, that's all highlighted in that Netflix documentary that Peter Berg made about the Sackler family, which is not documentary, which called docudrama series. That fucking series is so enraging. And after that, you know, that one guy that they kept in a hotel room for like, two days? Who knows what they did for that guy to that guy? What the fuck did they do to him? They got him to approve that. They found that guy. That guy was in a small town in New Hampshire and they ostracized him. People were just. The sheriff was, like, trying to highlight how many people in the community had died of opioid overdose and how much blood was on his hands.

Well, he took a job with the Sacklers. He worked at the FDA approved that, took a job with sackers, which I know we beat that horse dead too. But 13 out of the 15. Last out of the last 15 heads of the FDA, 13 have gone to work for industry. You know, and that's tough. That puts everyone in a tough position. If we're going to allow people to work one place one month and then go work for the bad guys the following month, it's so dirty. Regular.

How is that legal?

A lot of people don't know the Sacklers. That was their second time creating a crisis in America in the seventies, they created the Valium crisis. They got all the women, I think it was one in three housewives were addicted to Valium in the seventies, including one in three. The Sacklers were. Congress went after the Sacklers then, and they ended up taking a settlement. And they paid their way out of it. Slap on the wrist. No criminal charges ever brought forward. And they rode off into the sunset after creating this valium crisis of the late seventies, early eighties.

Oh, my God. I. Jamie, pull up that tweet that I sent you from Jay Bhattacharya. So Michael Pollan, he's highlighted the dangers of pesticides. The USDA funded a PR organization that worked with agricultural interests to downplay the harms of pesticides in farming and to compile defamatory dossiers on opponents of pesticide use, including food writer Michael Pollan. Just imagine that the USDA spends money to defame people using your tax dollars. Spends money to defame people that are trying to tell you that there is poison in your food. Measurable amounts. Something along the lines of 90 plus percent of Americans have roundup in their system. They have glyphosate in their system from crops.

That's one of the things I learned to 5% of the human brain mass and weight is now made of is now plastics. We learned that in the hearing too. 5% blew my mind. Never heard that statistic. Terrifying.

Revealed the us government's funded private social network attacking pesticide critics. So what does it say about this? 2017, two United nations experts called for a treaty to strictly regulate dangerous pesticides, which they said were a global human rights concern, which, by the way, roundup is illegal in a lot of countries, citing scientific research showing pesticides can cause cancers, Parkinson's disease, Alzheimer's and other health problems. Publicly, the pesticide industry's lead trade association dubbed the recommendations unfounded and sensational assertions.

But what's crazy is this is Monsanto, which is also Bayer. And we talked about that. This is the company that knowingly infected people with HIV and shipped it to third world countries because they, their hemophilia drug had been contaminated and they knew they'd get busted if they shipped it in the US. So they shipped it to third world countries and knowingly infected thousands of people with HIV. And we're trusting these people?

Look what it says here. Publicly, the pesticide industry's lead trade association dubbed the recommendations unfounded assertions. And private industry advocates have gone further. Derogatory profiles of the two UN experts, Hilal Elver and Baska Tunkak Tankak Tunsok, are hosted on an online private portal for pesticide company employees and a range of influential allies. Members can access a wide range of personal information about hundreds of individuals from around the world deemed a threat to industry interests, including the us food writers Michael Pollan and Mark Brittman, the indian environmentalists Vandana Shiva and the nigerian activist. You say that one. How do you say that? How do you think you said that name?

Nima Basi. Nimamo ni namo bossi.

Neemomo. Nimamo Bossi. Many profiles include personal details such as the names of family members, phone numbers, home addresses, even house values. The profiling is part of an effort which is financed in part by us taxpayer dollars to downplay pesticide dangers, discredit opponents, and undermine international policy making. According to court records, emails and other documents obtained by the nonprofit newsroom Lighthouse reports it corroborated with the Guardian, the new lead, Le Monde Africa uncensored, and Australian Broadcast Corporation and other international media partners on the publication of this investigation. The efforts were spearheaded by a reputation management firm in Missouri called V Fluence. The company provides services that it describes as intelligence gathering, proprietary data mining and risk communications. The revelations demonstrate how industry advocates have established a private social network to counter resistance to pesticides and genetically modified crops in Africa, Europe and parts of the world, while also denigrating organic and other alternative farming methods. Wow. Wow.

I mean, it doesn't. It's just. I think it was Jason during the testimony, he said, and this resonated with me, do we need double blind studies to know that chemicals we spray on pesticides and chemicals we spray on fields that cause disruption in mitochondria of insects and destroy them at the cellular level might possibly. Can we at least say, might possibly create some sort of issue?

No, that's unfounded.

Other biological beings.

That's an unfounded assertion. More than 30 current government officials are on the membership list, most of whom are from the US Department of Agriculture. This is so crazy. It's so crazy that this is so blatant. And that gives me hope.

So they were willing to talk. That does give me hope, Joe. Like, the Senate, they took a risk, man. They took a risk. They allowed us to come in. They did say, hey, we recommend you don't go too hard in the paint. And everyone said, fuck that. And they just drop bombs like they.

Well, you have to.

They're insiders from their space, and they.

Know the only way it's gonna affect people is these viral video clips have to go online, and people have to share them on Facebook and Instagram and Twitter. Thank God they can, you know, because who knows if the government could clamp down on it the way they have in other countries. Other countries have severely clamped down. And there's been some real issues in America, but America still is the best place to distribute information. I mean, X is banned in Brazil right now, right? There's. There's a lot of shenanigans going on all throughout the world where people are trying to control narratives. And it's fucking spooky if we look at it.

If we really look at it. If it wasn't for you, I would have never met RFK. And if it wasn't for going on your show, I would have never got my message out there. If it wasn't for Tucker's podcast, Callie would have never got his message out there. And Casey, well, it wasn't for you.

You know how banged up I'd be. Dude, how many times you've helped me with stem cells? I talk about it all the time but I know there's a gentleman that I'm friends with that I've just been talking to who's going, he's about to go to a disk, he's getting his disks used and I'm like, jesus. Have you looked into other options, have you looked into stem cells? I mean, you could go to Tijuana and I know those guys at the CPI have treated many people, including my friend Shane Dorian, he had fantastic results. My friend Tom land in Utah as well, he went down there and got his spine injected. Fantastic.

I tell people all the time like I love CPI, I love all these guys. Like all ships rise and fall with the tide, we're in this together. Our battle is not each other, our battle is the federal government.

You're very, very good about that. I think that's very important to say that you're not like a competitor of these people. You feel like there's more than enough for everybody and you're more than happy that these people are around.

I'm just glad there's a voice because we've got to get the message out there that there are alternatives. And this, it's almost like a fairy tale that they've told the american people that hey, if it's an FDA approved product and it's in a hospital or your doctor tells you it's good as gold, it's science and it's not, a lot of, it's never been researched.

A lot of these doctors unfortunately are ignorant as to all these other remedies that are effective.

I can tell you working with primary cares, there's some of the hardest working, most patient focused folks out there and they're just tired, they're beat down, they're exhausted, they've got to see 40 people a day. Most of them are now employees of a hospital. And so the hospital doesn't really care about the primary market because it doesn't make money. The reason you have the primary care market is to control the referral network to the hospital system. And so they need those primaries, referring knees, shoulders, elbows, hearts, spine, you know, brain neurosurgeries, that's where their money is made, that's where they can really bill insurance companies and get big reimbursements.

But I think it's also what I was saying that a lot of these doctors aren't aware that this stuff works. I told you about my shoulder injury. When I went to the doctor, he told me, you are going to have to have surgery. You're going to have to bite the bullet one day and have surgery. And I was like, shit. He goes, you could try other things and it might help you for a little while, but you're going to have to have surgery. The only thing that gave him pause is when he did the strength tests with me where he pushed down my arm and did all that kind of shit. But I just think that's because the muscle around the damaged joint was strong. And so he was like, well, you know, you're pretty functional. He goes, MRI. You shouldn't be able to do all this stuff according to your MRI.

We still battle that, I can tell you. GSP, he's coming in again this week, and he's talked about us, I think on your pod, he's posted about us. He's the man. He's amazing. But he. When I met him, he was a skeptic. And he said, I know I'm talking to you cause of Joe, but like my doctor said, this is bullshit. I'm up in Canada. And he said that there's no such thing and that I have to have surgery to fix this shoulder. We fixed his shoulder. He's posted about it. He never had surgery. He went back in the doctor's like, I don't know what you're doing. And there are dozens of NFL athletes we've worked with. I don't think any of them, other than Aaron Rodgers has told their doctor that they're working with us, like big name athletes, but they're scared of the team doctor.

Yeah, well, I get to Aaron because the team, what doctor was trying to tell him to avoid all that stuff, including stem cells? It's just nuts. And I think the doctors aren't doing it because they're bad people. I think they don't know. I think they don't have time to do the deep dives. Most doctors, how much peer reviewed literature do you think most doctors who are in orthopedic surgeons who are in practice, how much are they absorbing? How much time do they have between malpractice insurance, between medical school bills that they're in debt with, between the overhead that they have run their practice? I mean, they have to get people in and out of the office quickly.

Well, and you also go back to who funds studies and who funds. When I worked at as a med device rep, I can tell you we funded studies, but those studies were going to be focused on and geared towards moving our products, of course. And so we didn't have a stem cell or biological product because we sold hardware and we wanted ACL surgery, shoulder surgeries, knee surgeries, because. Because that's how the company made its living. And so, again, it wasn't that we were against it or trying to destroy it. It was more of, if you can trivialize it and focus on what makes you your check, that's where everyone's at. And everyone's so compartmentalized, it's easy to almost have plausible deniability. So, like, somebody comes in to a primary care and they're overweight and they're diabetic, and they're anxious and they're not sleeping, the doctor's gonna write them five drugs and push them out the door. Not because they're a bad person, but because that is how we teach clinicians to practice medicine in this country.

Right.

That is the dogma of the situation we're in. They're taught, prescribe first, ask questions later, rather than deep dive understand the root cause of the disease. Let's understand, what is this person like, the question you asked me, what are you eating? How much sleep are you getting? Are you getting sunlight?

But are you stressed? This is the issue. If you want to move people in and out of the office, all this takes time. One of the things that you guys do at waste, well, is you do comprehensive blood analysis. You know, when I sit down with Denise, my eyes glaze over, and it's my body, you know, and I'm dealing. It's like, God, there's so many details to cover. Yeah, there's so many things. But by following those directions, I've noticed a giant difference in my overall health.

You know, it's amazing.

It is amazing. And it's just. It's unfortunate that this kind of resource is not available to more people where more people don't have access to a doctor that's going to look at them comprehensively, look at their whole body as an like. If you were going to take care of your yard, if you're trying to grow plants in your yard and you know your trees are all dying, your vegetables weren't growing. If you had the resources, you can go to a botanist, or you could go to someone who understands farming, someone who's a scientist, and you could say, what's wrong? And they could do soil analysis. And, you know, my friend Steve actually did this. He was trying to put a. Steve Renella was trying to put a garden in his house in Brooklyn. And they found that leaded gasoline from all those years, from, like, the 1960s, all those years where they used leaded gasoline in Brooklyn, you know, because it's polluted. All that shit had gotten so deep in the soil that it was. His backyard was contaminated with leaded gasoline. And so you have to do a detox on the backyard. So there's certain plants that you can plant that can help in that process.

There's certain treatments to the soil that can help in that process. Why aren't we doing that with the body?

Think about it. I can give you another example. Like, one of the tests we do, and I don't promote it. It's expensive, and it's because the lab we use is expensive, but it is amazing. And it's a cancer screening. And so we, in our healthcare system today, only screen for, essentially, proactively, five different types of cancer, tumor based cancers. Okay. Well, there's a blood test that can screen for over 200 tumor based cancers. And it can tell you when you're at a. When at level zero, right. Undistinguishable, because usually how they're diagnosing is through imaging. And so the challenge with imaging is pixelation, right? The image can't capture the cellular level. Blood work can. So at the cellular level, we can tell you when you're at stage zero on a cancer, up to seven years prior to you developing cancer on over 200 different types of cancer. Why would that not be implemented into our health care system or at minimal? What I argued with the senator about was, okay, let's just say we can't afford this for all Americans. Why in the hell wouldn't we at minimal be doing this for our firefighters, our military veterans?

We know that over 70% of firefighters and military veterans will develop cancer in their lifetimes. It's staggering. Because of dealing with ballistics and weapons and guns, and all those are carcinogens. Firefighters are dealing with smoke and smoke inhalation and all the different chemicals they come in contact with.

I never thought about that in terms of guns. Like shooting guns. Like what? When you shoot guns, like, if you go to a range and shoot guns, like, how much toxic chemicals are you absorbing?

Yeah, it's. Well, all that gets in your skin and gets absorbed through the skin. So there are. There's carcinogens in all of those things.

And it's especially indoors, right? Like an indoor range versus an outdoor range.

And it's disproportionate. Our first responders and our military personnel disproportionately have higher cancer rates, especially firefighters.

Yeah. Think about all the things that they breathe in that are on fire. I mean, look at how many veterans have suffered because of burn pits, which is an insane thing that they did. They said, oh, we have all this garbage. What's the most cost effective way to get rid of it? Let's make a massive fire that runs 24 hours a day and throw tires in it. Fucking plastic everything, whatever the fuck you got laying around, throw it in that burn pit. Oh, and when the wind blows and that shit goes straight through camp, that's what everybody's breathing. And who knows how many people develop cancer because of that? I know multiple people that I know personally that have developed severe illnesses and even died because of that.

Well, and you can even see when we talk about diet and food and environment, it's even happening.

Wasn't it Biden's son? Didn't he develop, I think he developed a disease that was theorized that it came from burn pits. Cv find that. I believe that's true. I believe he served.

Wasn't meth.

No, that was the other son. One son was the good guy. Biden addresses possible link between sons fatal brain cancer and toxic military burn pits. Isn't that insane? His own son, so crazy, so he couldn't even protect his own son. I mean, he's a powerful politician.

When that's own son. We tried to like, that was the message I wanted people to get. Yes, we were talking to senators, but the truth is we were talking to the american people and it was, guys, we don't have. My thing to the public is I'm not here to tell you that I have the answers to the test. I'm here to tell you I have the questions to the test. And I'm telling you what I saw, and I'm being honest and I'm trying my best. I am not fucking political. Left, right, different wings to the same bird. Like I will say right now, the right is talking about this because of Bobby Kennedy. And I know that Trump is wanting to meet next week as a health expo to dive in and try and understand from people in the industry what's going on behind the scenes and how we're headed towards this chronic disease crisis. But what gets scarier is if we don't get this under wraps. We've got a rapidly aging patient population, we have a rapid decline in the amount of primary cares. You know, I talked about this last time. We're going to have a 30% shortage in primary cares, and it already takes three months to get in with a primary care, we're headed over a cliff.

We have got to get chronic disease under control in this nation, and we got to do it fast.

And I want to say something, too. There's a lot of people that vehemently disagree with a lot of this stuff. And there's a lot of people online, like, the people that write the articles, the woo woo stuff, they just don't know. There's no way they actually knew what was going on in a comprehensive way and would still write those articles. You would have to be evil. I don't think those people that are writing those articles are evil. I think they're doing a job, and I think they're being directed and I think they're being directed by people that have a vested interest in this information. Just like we talked about with that USDA thing. They have a vested interest in this information being dismissed. And there's money behind it is a financial institution.

They try to say, if we can't agree on one topic, that we have to disagree on all topics. And that's the most frustrating thing to me. My neighbor's amazing. She's an amazing person. She sent me a message and was like, you know, Bobby Kennedy sold out and blah. I'm not. I don't care about the Maha movement. And I'm like, this isn't about Maha or Trump or any. This is about.

Because she's a hardcore liberal.

Yes, but I'm like, this isn't about people, though. And don't let them fool you.

Don't let them fool you.

I don't agree with the Republicans, Republicans on hatching.

The problem is Trump as a person. People just react to him in the, like, the most negative way.

Yeah.

And they are fully convinced that all of his negative character traits, all these negative things, are unbefitting to a president, and therefore he shouldn't be president. I think anybody who wants to be president is fucking insane. They're all insane. I think it's just like, kind of everybody else that's a leader in almost every industry. I think they're insane people. I don't think you get to the top of any heap unless you're out of your fucking mind. And you could be out of your mind in a vicious, sort of demeaning, attacking all your enemies way like Trump is. And it's still the same drive is what led that guy to deal with this shit for four years where they're trying to put him in jail so that he doesn't run again and still run again. And they try to kill him twice, and he's still running. It's like you.

I mean, I don't know. He's a way braver man than I am because I was Chiron in Iowa.

It's a different kind of human. And my point is, the only way you get someone who's not affected by that is you have to have an insane person. It's literally the best tool for the job because everybody else. All the different trial, the 34 counts, which were not felonies, which they upgraded from a misdemeanor, which passed the statute of limitations, all of them were bookkeeping errors or mislabeling things, which is illegal. They're minor offenses that would not get anybody prosecuted, much less put in fucking jail. Real potential for him being in jail. People want him to put him in jail. They want to put him in jail for a long fucking time. And it's crazy. You're doing it at the same time where Ice admits that. What are the numbers of murderers and convicted criminals that have made it into this country? It's something bananas. And this is just verified. This is verified data. Do you know what it is, Jamie? Cause I could find it. Cause somebody. Somebody sent it to me, and I literally couldn't believe it's real. So I'll send it to you, and you can find out if it is real, because if it's true, it's fucking bananas.

And just the sheer numbers, they're scary. These are scary numbers, man. It's like, no one thinks this is a problem. And, look, I am the product of immigration. My grandparents came here at a time where it was very easy to come here. And I just sent you a screenshot, see if you could find out if it's true. It was very easy to come here, and a lot of people came here were criminals, you know? Look, a lot of people in my family were criminals. You know, they were Italians in the 1920s. There's just a lot. My grandmother went to jail, you know, when I was a kid, my grandmother went to jail for a book.

Yeah, I know. When you watch the godfather, the original godfather, it's the ties to Italy and how intertwined all that is, is wild. And that's based on, like. Yeah, somewhat based on reality.

My grandmother's sister murdered her husband. Yeah, I grew up. These are wild people. These are people that came over on a fucking boat before YouTube. They didn't even know what it was like over here. They took a chance. They took a chance. So I am completely sympathetic to immigrants, but you can't let in fucking gang members. Okay? There gotta be some kind of screening. You wanna make it easier to get in for people that are hardworking, people that just want a better job. I'm with you. I'm with you. Just make it easier for them to get in. Make it easier for the people that have been here for 20 years to become citizens. Make. Yes, I know people. I know a kid who was. She's 28 now. She was born in America, but her. No, she was born in Mexico, but her parents brought her over here when she was a baby, so she doesn't speak Spanish. She has been in America her whole fucking life. And she's not an american citizen, so she can't vote. She's limited in the kind of jobs she can do. It's fucking weird. It's weird that we do that.

But yet my grandparents just came over on a boat and fucking. They write a piece of paper and they're in. It's nuts. Like we should have a screening process to keep evil people out. That's it. Everyone else, look, you imagine if you're born in Guatemala, wouldn't you want to come over here and get a job as a landscaper? Fuck, you could make $600 a week. $700 a week. Oh, my God. And then you live in a family, in a house with a bunch of people, which they're used to doing anyway, and then someone branches off and makes their own business and all of a sudden you're living the american dream, right? This is what we all want for everybody. That's. There's. There's enough for everybody. But you can't let in murderers.

Yeah, there's got to be a. This is crazy.

And you can't, like, let them in and ship them to swing states and then try. I mean, it's just so in your face. Ship them to swing states. And then there's all this talk now of amnesty for all the people that came in. Well, I'm all for amnesty for the people that have been here their whole life. Like this. This girl that I know who's 28 years old now. I'm all for that. Yeah, yeah. That makes no sense. She should be american. She's a fucking american. She pays sales tax and all this other tax, but, yeah, yeah, those people. But there should be some sort of a screening process, you know, if you're in fucking gangs that bring in fentanyl, hey, maybe we shouldn't let that guy in. And this is the whole idea of having borders in the first place. And what, it's shocking is if you try to come here legally. It's very difficult. I've had friends from Canada, like, comedians from Canada, that want to move to America. It's a long fucking process to become an american citizen. It's difficult. And you got to do homework. You got to fucking. You gotta.

You gotta answer tests, but if you just walk in, they'll give you money, they'll house you, they'll give you an EBT card. They'll give you food stamps. What the fuck are we doing? Well, we must be doing something. So it's either one of two things. Either we want cheap labor, and this is what Tim Dillon thinks. He thinks that the cheap labor market for construction and all these jobs that most people don't want to do anymore, it's falling off a cliff. And the best way to sustain those industries is to bring in cheap labor. And the best way to do that is to bring in migrant workers because they're willing to do jobs that a lot of people won't. And this is the positive side of, like, Springfield, Ohio, where people talk about the Haitians that moved there, the people that employ these Haitians say these people are hard workers. They're so happy to be here. They want the american dream. That's great. That's what we want. We want more of that. That's all good. But you can't make it insanely difficult for a college educated person from Norway to move here, because they want to do literally, like, when Chamath was on, he explained that when he was over here going through his visa process, they had to show that he was doing something that an American couldn't do.

You have to be someone of exceptional skill, a very difficult person to find. And then you could get a passport, and then, I mean, you can get a green card and eventually became a us citizen. But it's a long process and a difficult process, because every year where you go to get your visa renewed, you're at the whim of this person. Who knows? If they had a bad day, you know? Who knows? Their fucking wife just started fucking the mailman, and they found out about it, and she drained their bank account. And he's like, fuck you. Go back to Canada. You know, they can do that to you. They can do that to you at a whim. But if you walk in, you know, Nancy wants you to get ambassadors.

He's a wildlife photographer for Cabela's, and he's somewhere. That's a great job, somewhere over in Russia. But he. It literally took him years to get his citizenship and he would. He became friends with the girl who worked at the guy who approved his desk and would literally message her. And she'd be like, nope, not today. Nope, not today. And he waited for a day when the guy was having a great day and went and had his meeting, and he got his citizenship, but it took him years. And now he's working here for Cabela's, shooting, wildlife photography and living the dream. And he grew up reading in Russia, reading these books about the great west, and, like, he wanted to be a cowboy. And he tells these stories, but he is an example of somebody who believes in the american dream. That's where I go. It's difficult for them to acquire.

It's difficult. So let's see what it says here. Department of Homeland Security spokespost intern, Newsweek the data in this letter is being misinterpreted. The data goes back decades. It includes individuals who entered the country over the past 40 years or more, the vast majority of whose custody determination was made long before this administration. Okay, so. But you are still saying that those people are here. Noted that his letter, that ICE is bound by statutory requirements not to release certain non citizens from its custody during the pendency of removal proceedings. He added that most non citizens who are convicted of homicide are typically not eligible for. Typically not eligible for release from Ice custody. They're like, listen, if you fucking kill people, if you're an illegal alien, you sneak across the border and you kill Americans. How about nobody's eligible for release? How about that? Let's just start with that.

Well, I mean, think about it. If you're a felon in the United States, you're not allowed to vote. So wouldn't it make sense that we don't accept, you know, somebody with a criminal record into the United States like we have? You know, we have a lot of fights that we're already fighting and a lot of budgetary restraints as a society that we can't really dig ourselves out of the hole with right now.

Bill. We have so much money for Ukraine. It may be shocking to hear the Biden Harris administration is actively releasing tens of thousands of criminal, illegal aliens into our communities. But their own numbers can conclusively prove this to be the case. This defies all common sense. Read a statement. Newsweek has contacted the Harris campaign for comment via email. Outside of standard working hours. Uh huh. What does that mean? What is standard working hours? They can't. Oh, that's why they didn't get back to them. It was outside of standard working hours. The email arrived at 515. Put that back up again. Department of Homeland Security spokesperson told Newsweek the date in this letter is, this is the one that says so. This is a. Department of Homeland Security spokesperson says it's being misused. Scroll that down. Scroll that down a little bit further. See what it says there. Congressional Republicans voted against them twice. Democratic presidential candidate added, we took executive action to reduce unlawful border crossings. See, this is the thing that gets weird. It's like, you know, they say that Trump, the Biden administration is trying to say that Trump blocked some sort of border wall bill because he wanted it to be something that he could campaign against.

So he instructed the Republicans to vote against it. Is there so much that kind of fuckery? I don't know if that's true or not, but it's the possibility of that being on the table that. I'm not accusing anyone of doing that, but imagine a world where a person could conspire, and I'm not saying they did, but a person could conspire to make something happen because that would be something that they could campaign against. Look what you did. And that's how dirty this game is. That's why nobody wants to do it unless you're fucking crazy. Unless you're crazy like Trump. And he just waits. He sent Mark Cuban a letter when Mark Cuban's television show failed in like 2004, whatever the fuck it was. And someone posted it on instagram today. See if you could find it, Jamie. But it's so petty. It's so petty. And the fact that he signed it and sent it to him took time out of his day to tie or have someone draft a letter, probably didn't type it himself. Have someone draft the letter and send it to Mark Cuban in the mail.

Yeah.

But it takes that kind of a person to literally make their way through the system. The only way you get through all these attacks, and we've seen the full force of it, it's like we've seen all the orcs that were hiding in the forest. They all came out the level of.

Hell that those people go through. Like, this is the letter.

This is from 2004. Mister Mark Cuban. Dear Mark, I'm truly sorry to hear that your show has been canceled for lack of ratings. When I initially called you to congratulate you on the benefactor, little did you or I realize how disastrous and embarrassing it would be. It would turn out for you. If you ever decide to do another show, please call me and I'll be happy to lend a helping hand with best wishes. But what a crazy backhanded why? I mean, what beef? I don't. They must have some kind of beef.

They've had a long beef.

What is the beef about? The guy's hilarious. That is hilarious. It's hilarious that he takes time out of his day.

Yeah.

Not just, like, say, good fuck that guy. That show got canceled. Takes time out of his day to write, like, a conciliatory. I'm sorry. Sorry. What's happening, man? Yeah, you fucking loser. Writes it in there. The whole thing is wild.

But what's hard is people use those things to distract us and to divide us. And, like, even with my neighbor, I know we agree on 80% of the things. It's like, hey, I'm not against or for anyone. Like, I'm not against Kamala. I'm not against Trump. I'm. I'm for team humanity. I am for.

I am too.

Can we work together to solve the problem? And whoever wins, whether Trump or Kamala, I hope that we can continue the momentum in the dialog, and I hope that, you know, we can truly have an open conversation that gains traction. And what I love about it being public is it's forever memorialized in public record. I think there's no hiding it.

Yes. And I think it will, and especially in today's day with. I've seen so many videos sent me of your testimony, and I've had them recommended to me on instagram, too, from accounts that I don't even follow. So it's getting around. But I think what's also interesting is that social chaos, it unveils things. It unveils things about human beings. And that is one of the benefits of having a guy that you can decide is Hitler. Like, even though half the country loves him, half the country loves that dude. Maybe more than half the country. Now, there's a lot of silent loves that guy. People. Because they realize there's not a lot of other options out of this other than a fucking crazy person who would write Mike Cuban, Mark Cuban, a letter like that. You need to be insane to pull this off, and you might need to be insane in a way that you or I would find distasteful.

It is insanity because even at a smaller level, just testifying in front of the Senate, the level of hate and just, like, misrepresentations of truth. I don't even want to call it lies, but to me, it's lies. The level of misrepresentation and taking things out of context, and it just. It just doesn't seem genuine, and it doesn't seem like, people are really fighting for truth.

You were genuinely shook by it. But I told you, what I told you is the truth. Nobody cares. Don't read it. Nobody cares. Don't read anything about yourself, even good things. Nobody cares. People know what the fuck is going on. They get to hear you talk in forms like this. They get to hear you actually talk and lay it out. They know who the fuck you are. All this is all just noise. But the good thing about this kind of noise, this social chaos, is that it unveils all this corruption. It unveils the orcs that are hiding in the forest. You see it. And I am convinced if they know the efficacy of foreign countries using social media bots to attack people, they know that that works. They know that. That shift narratives, especially for people that are sitting on the fence, they know all that stuff works. If you don't think that there's companies in America that we're not aware of, that organize social media campaigns and have bots attack certain individuals like yourself for, you know, having a dangerous narrative, if you don't think that, you're crazy.

But what's insane to me, Joe, is what part of saying, hey, we need to better understand how we're growing our food, how we're processing our food, how we're preserving our food. Maybe leftover petrol, chemicals aren't the best way to preserve our food products in America. You're not allowing that in other nations. And we're looking at the data, the statistics and the numbers, and we're saying something's not right. The point of that conversation was to say, today's the day we start the dialog. You know, the journey of a thousand steps starts with one or. And I look at it and say, my message was, how do we fix this? Well, we start by acknowledging there's a fucking problem.

In the first place, they don't care. This is just about money and just about justifying the things that you're saying. The narratives that you're pushing to try to get that money. If they came out with an article, if someone did a peer reviewed study that showed that if you drink exactly 13 glasses of water a day, you never get sick and you never get cancer, there would be articles the next day saying, if everyone drinks 13 gallons of water or 13 glasses of water a day, there'll be no water for black people and people of color and indigenous people. The trans people would die of dehydration, and the wells would dry up, and then the crops. And we're not going to have food and there's a lot of impoverished people. You can't. You don't need 13 glasses of water a day. There would be, there would be some sort of a justification if you came up with some sort of a diet that you could follow, and everyone would live to be 150. There would be an article about how dangerous it is to tell people to stay healthy. Because if we all live to be.

100%, that's what's crazy. Literally, we're there saying, diet, lifestyle, nutrition, getting proactive, predictive, and personalized. That's the message.

It's a beautiful message.

System's waiting for you to get sick, and then they're giving you drugs rather than waiting to get sick and taking a drug. Let's get proactive and predictive. Let's look at you at the biological level. Let's stop the chronic disease from developing at its roots and prevent this crisis.

And don't you think there's a way that companies can do this and make money in an ethical way?

Absolutely.

There has to be.

And that's where I say, this is what's crazy. I'm not a philanthropist. We make money, and we're doing it for a fraction of the cost of the system. Today. We really are like the patients getting a deep dive into over 70 biomarkers an hour on the phone with a clinician. The only way I can scale this and make it better for people and more cost effective is AI and large language models, which is what I'm rapidly running towards, which even in that hatchet job article, she says, and he's illegally using AI to prescribe. I'm not prescribing medicine using AI.

She claimed that.

Yeah, she something of that nature. And Mike, we are using AI to assess blood work, and then it is reviewed by a board certified clinician that then re, like, asserts the AI's homework, and the AI is just there as an additional tool. Now, the vision of the future, and I think this will happen, is I think AI will replace a lot of primary cares in America.

It's going to replace a lot of things. And anybody denying the efficacy of AI at this point is ignorant. You have to be ignorant willfully. You have to be willfully ignorant because they have used AI right now to diagnose diseases that people miss. They believe that AI is going to allow to assess breast cancer in a much more effective way because it can do something with visuals that human beings can't see with the naked eye because you're detecting things. AI is going to be able to have a much, much higher percentage of a chance of catching that cash.

Even at a great cash pay clinic. I think waze dwells a phenomenal clinic. I think there's hundreds, if not thousands of phenomenal cash pay. Peter Attia's brilliant. In any of those practices. The clinician has to do a chart review before you come in to. That's going to take them at least 20 minutes. If they're doing a good job, then they're going to spend 45 minutes to an hour with you, walking you through everything in your chart. What they saw, family history, genetics, epigenetics. Cross reference that with blood work. That's a lot of work. AI can do it instantly. Instantly and at your own timeline and discretion so your blood work comes back. Joe, you're busy. You don't have time to get on the phone for 40 minutes with a provider, no problem. You log into the app and you ask Alan, Alan. Hey, remind me again, what was my blood work on? Testosterone. And then Alan's gonna tell you. And then you can ask this AI anything. And it is backed by all the peer reviewed journals, studies, white paper studies, all the data that we've loaded in that has been cross referenced by our clinical team, and we're guiding that.

It's not an open architecture, but we're allowing it to essentially help practice medicine in a way that we believe is the appropriate approach to medicine.

And how can that be bad?

I just think in the future, it's going to be the way of the future, and it'll allow us to get cost effective.

Crazy the world. Is that something that straightforward? The way you laid it out so brilliantly, someone could label that as bad or whoo or woo woo, because you.

Would know the AI. Imagine the world where in this and again, sword cuts both ways. Every tool can be good or bad, but what I'm envisioning is AI monitoring you 24/7 tying into your wearables. We know your REM sleep, your heart rate variability. You've gone through, and you've done a Dexa. I know how much lean muscle mass you have, how much visceral fat, how much subcutaneous fat. I have your epigenetics, your genetics all loaded in. I know your family history. We've done a cancer screening. I know that you have no forms of cancerous tumors in your body at this moment. From there now, we have a clean bill of health and a starting point. But we're tracking you. I know that Joe slept 5 hours on Saturday. I know that Joe got 1 hour of sleep on Saturday. And then we can accrue those data sets and begin to cross reference it. Like right now, we have over 60,000 patients at ways to, well, imagine when it's nationwide and we have millions or millions.

How are you monitoring their sleep?

We're not yet. This is the app that we're launching. We would tie, we want to be agnostic, so we want to tie into sleep apes, we want to tie into whoop any of them. If you'll give us access to that data, we'll know what date you started prescription care. You'll be able to refill your medicine straight through the pharmacy because it's vertically integrated. Here's the challenge with traditional medicine. Every software is based on how to get paid from the fucking insurance company. That's it. Pharmacy software is 30 years old. It is purely based on how do I get my money from CV's? How do I get my money from United? It's not meant to be a tool that helps drive health span and healthcare. But if we vertically integrate pharmacy software with the medical practices software, with the AI, the raribles, the REM sleep, it then knows what date, you know, Joe started glutathione or whatever the peptide or whatever it is, and we're going to see if we can track a marked improvement in heart rate variability, REM sleep and all those variables. And then at the end of a year, we reassess you proactively and personalized through a dexa and a Vo two max.

And we say, look, Joe, you gained one pound of lean muscle mass. You didn't put on any additional body fat. Your visceral body fat is at an all time low. Your chronic disease score is an a plus. We do not think you're headed towards a chronic disease. We are proactive. Not sitting back waiting for you to get cancer. We're going to roll our sleeves up and go to fucking work. And it's not hard. This does not cost a fortune. It is totally affordable. I hear all the time like, this is your body, this is the one. This is how I ended my speech to the Senate. And I believe this 400 trillion to 1400 trillion to one are the chances you are alive in this room today. What are we going to do with it? Are we going to let these bastards at big pharma and big medical profiteer off of our family members and profiteer off chronic disease? Or are we going to take sovereignty and accountability? Are we going to test ourselves and drive our health span and take ourselves out of their fucking shitty life raft that's going down. Like, it doesn't matter.

If you have a first Republican, Democrat, congratulations, you have a front row seat on the fucking Titanic. That's where we're headed. If we don't get proactive is not a left or right issue. This is an american issue. That's all I keep trying to hammer home. And thank God the Republicans are talking about it, and I hope the Democrats will start talking about it.

That's why it's so fascinating about ideal. That's what's so fascinating about ideological capture. That the thing that you would think would be one thing we could all agree on, we should all be healthy, that that would get attacked and that it would be more cost effective. You could use technology and you have a much more comprehensive understanding of your health, and that gets attacked. That's how upside down things are. And there's people that, if they think it helps their. Their career or it helps them in. In journalism, it helps them get more connect. They will be the attack dog. They'll be the attack dog and go after someone with about as straightforward a message as you can get.

Yeah, it's. It's. And one of the things that RFK said that I think it really did resonate with me. Washington, we have to stop. We have to start loving our kids more than we hate each other. And seeing, like, I won't name anything, but I know a little girl who struggles with her weight, and I look at that and I. This kid is doing all she can, and it's hard to tell. A little kid, like, your friends can eat that candy, but you can't. Everyone in school's drinking their soft drinks and all these things, and it's bad for all of them. It's just some kids are metabolically showing it sooner.

Yeah.

You know, but it isn't good for anyone who's consuming these things.

And they're insanely addictive, too.

And it's also creates an environment. Yeah. That this is an addiction issue now and then that leads to a mental health issue and low self esteem. And you're part of the problem of.

The addiction of food, too, is you have to eat food. You know, it's not like anything else. Addiction to gambling, it's like, you can stop going to the casino.

Yeah.

But addiction to food, it's like you have to eat food. So every day you're testing your will every day in a profound way that if you stay out of the casino, you're not, you know, like, he's not being tempted. But you have to imagine if you were a gambling addict, but you had to make three bets a day?

Yeah.

What, you're a food addict, but you have to eat three meals a day? That's fucking insane.

And that's where the GLP ones where I do say, like, morbidly obese, chronically ill, diabetic, pre diabetic patients headed over a cliff. It has been rebranded as a lifestyle drug. For any girl who's trying to lose weight for spring break.

Right.

That's dangerous. And it is dangerous to say that there is no risk reward to prescribe that in children. We don't know the long term ramifications. It's a little bit different risk analysis when we're talking about a chronically ill obese patient in their forties headed towards chronic disease crisis, that's going to kill them. That's a different risk profile and safety profile analysis than a twelve year old little girl who's overweight. That's a totally different talk track. So, you know, I have some differing viewpoints from the other folks on that committee, but that's the beauty of a democracy. We can disagree on topics, but agree on the issue of we've got a lot of work to do and some things to fix, but it's very straightforward.

You could disagree all day long, but what you're saying is so straightforward and so beneficial to everyone across the board. If there's anything that you would want in life, like, have you ever been sick? Real sick, and you're like, God damn, I can't wait to be better again. It doesn't matter if you're rich. It doesn't matter if you're happily married, you love your job. If you're fucking dying, you're in bed and you literally can barely get up to pee. And then you crushed and you lay back down in bed, you go, oh, what did I do to fuck this up? How did I get so sick? I am going to take care of myself. I am going to fucking get back on track 100%. A lot of people don't, but some people actually do. They actually do realize at that moment, like, I can't let this happen again. Like, whatever I did to my immune system, pulling all nighters, working at the job, fucking 16 hours a day, and then you get, like, a horrible flu, and you're bedridden for two weeks. During that time, the one thing you want more than anything is to be healthy.

You ask a healthy person what they want, they give you a thousand things. You ask a sick person what they want. They want to be well, they want to be well. If you told a person who's worth, like, bill Gates money, if you said to Bill Gates, hey, you know, you could have the flu for the rest of your life and keep all that money or give it all up, you're gonna have to start from scratch, but you'll be healthy. He would give it all up and start from scratch.

Is that. You're spot on. Like, you don't understand. I sit at dinners when I get the opportunity to be with my family, and I look around the table and I really do think, Joe, ever since losing my brother, I am so present in those moments, and I just want everyone to be healthy, and I want the good memories to last, and I want to be able to watch people live happy lives. And all the data and numbers and statistics, they're so overwhelming that people lull over. And that's why in front of the Senate, I brought it back to, I'm just going to talk about people. I didn't even talk about statistics because there were way smarter people out there than me, from Harvard, Stanford, all these academic types that are brilliant. And I'm like, but at the end of the day, guys, if the Senate doesn't understand, these are your children, your wives, your brothers, your sisters, your husbands, your wife. Like, this is, this is, these are family members. This is not just a number. These are real lives. 1.9 million people dying a year of chronic disease that doesn't even include deaths of despair, suicide, opioid abuse.

We are a chronically ill society, and those impacts destroy families, destroy them. The ramifications are so far beyond finances in numbers, but even finances and numbers, 24% of our federal budget, health care number one budget concern federally is health care number one concern for most states. Health care number one reason for bankruptcy in the United States. For an individual health care, it is a huge problem. But that's the dollars and cents of it. The real cost is paid in human lives and lost loved ones. And that's, that's all I wanted them to hear, is, don't sweep this under the rug. These are fucking people dying.

How much of an effort has been put forth after the whole Sackler family crisis and the opioid crisis to mitigate the amount of these things that are prescribed?

I think a tremendous amount. But the problem is then you swing that pendulum to over regulation and you've created a drug addict in the marketplace. And all those addicts turned to fentanyl and black market products because the addiction's already there now we've already addicted more people are dying of opioids today than ever before. And so the damage is prescribed less. Yeah, the damage has been done. And that's what's hard. I don't know how you put that genie back in the bottle. The question becomes, what is the next opioid crisis?

It's almost like thing a hoarder's house. Like, how do you even clean this up? You know? You ever see those hoarder shows? What the fuck do you do with all this? It's almost like us and the, the opioid crisis thing. The really scary thing is like we're propping up cartels. We're propping up, you know, really vicious people that are criminals. They have to be vicious. That's how you get ahead in that world. You know, there's no rules when you're an organized crime and you kill a lot of people. And that's what you prop up when you have drugs illegal. But now if you have drugs legal, if you just have, I mean, this is a dilemma as well, right? Because if you just had legal drugs, everything was legal. How long would it take for people figured out to not do cocaine? How would long, you know, if you could just get cocaine the same way you can get Coca Cola?

How weird would that be? I would even argue that the market we live in now is, is a pharmaceutical insurance cartel. You know, they are glorified drug dealers monetizing people's chronic disease. And they have such a stranglehold over academia. The universities, they fund, most of the studies, the NIH, I mean, we just systematically go down from the food system to the government regulatory bodies to the enforcement committees to everything they control. The media, like, as soon as somebody gets, you know, get a little mouthy, anything, they come and hammer you and try to discredit you and portray it crazy.

Also how transparent it is. Like, who owns the companies?

I know that's most people aren't going to spend the time to go like I looked because I'm like, who is this attacking me? I want to understand their viewpoint. It wasn't, oh, ha ha ha, gotcha. I'm going to bust these people. It was more of, let me try and understand the other side and try and see what we could have said that would have been so inflammatory. Because the message is hope. It was hope. It was unity. It was working together. It was dropped apart.

It's become healthy. Get America healthy. Anybody would be opposed to that. That's, I think, also a real problem with the liberals during this election. The concept of make America healthy again is so bipartisan and so universal and so clear in the fact that the Republicans are running with it. They're like, they're so mad. Like, that should have been something that Democrats, the Democrats used to be anti poison. The left used to be anti corporations dumping pollution in the waters. They were against big corporation. They were pro free speech, they were against censorship. I mean, they were pro reasonable discourse. They weren't about censoring people. And everything's just gone so topsy turvy to have the left be against a movement. Even what you should be saying is, yeah, fuck Trump, but this make America healthy again thing, it's a good idea, and we should probably do it too. We should probably just steal their idea. We should probably say, whatever you guys are going to do, we're going to do it too, but we're going to be a better president, so go with us. If they were smart, that's what they would do. People, oh, you stole that idea from Trump.

She said, yeah, I stole it. It's a good idea. I like good ideas. I'm not dogmatic. Show me a good idea, and that's where I go.

Who has the most to win by dividing us? It's not the Democrats. It's not the Republicans. Americans. It is the powers that be. And when we peel back the layers, Blackrock, Vanguard, that own the majority shares of these pharmaceutical companies that own the majority shares, and most the media outlets that own the left and the right, they push agendas, and they can control everything, essentially, except podcasts and free speech. And that's one of the things that Jordan Peterson said in a meeting the night before we testified was he implored us to stop trying to cater to the mainstream media because he said, it's a lost cause, it's a lost hope. I hate to say that to you guys, but the world has given up on them. Why are you guys wasting your time with them? Focus on podcasts, books, areas where you can truly, in a long, long form format, expose the truth and ask and respond to hard hitting questions. And we talked about you and your platform. And this is, you know, has been that people try to label it as misinformation at times. And I'm like, what part is? Anytime I've come on, I've cited all my references on the ways to, well, website.

I list reference after reference study after.

Most of the things that they labeled this misinformation during COVID turned out to be true.

100%.

I mean, especially, you know, what they did to Peter McCullough. Peter McCullough is the most published doctor in his field in human history. He's not quack. Jay Bhattacharya. He's a professor at Stanford. Right. And that. Where he is, what? These are the fucking actual experts. These are the real experts. Like, you guys are out of your fucking minds. And you're saying, this is misinformation. But the problem is, misinformation is like, you know, label it. Homophobe, transphobe, misogynist. Once they look racist, once they get you, they put that on you. Misinformation. You spread misinformation. You're like, what? What misinformation? Tell me. Tell me what wasn't true. Yeah.

And I'll even say. And again, I don't know. I don't want to be too conspiratorial. We had. I went to bed, and the. I was exhausted after that senate hearing. I posted it. I found a nobody I didn't expect. I went to bed, and I want to say I had 1.3 million views. And I posted a rebuttal about one of the periodicals that was misrepresentative. And I just posted, hey, not a fair assessment of what happened today. 2000 american people traveled from around the country to sit and hear an open dialog that was bipartisan, backed by some of the best and brightest minds in medicine. Harvard, Stanford, Steadman, Hawkins, all were present. This was not a bunch of influencers. Blah, blah, blah. Shame on you. That was all I posted. Didn't get into the weeds. Woke up the next day, and all the momentum was gone. It. We only. We still, I think, are sitting at 1.3 million. I don't believe. And then Casey got messaged. Hey, they'll de platform you be careful if you start naming specific news outlets. And I still believe that somehow we got de algorithm or deprioritized after we began to push back on the media for the stuff they were saying.

Most certainly, I'm sure. And you probably got attacked anyway once they realized that it was gaining momentum. It's very creepy. And I wonder, like, at what level they can manipulate things at Google and at YouTube. I mean, there's a level that they can actively suppress videos and they can actively suppress social media accounts and social media posts. You know, when my special was gonna go live on Instagram? Or on Netflix, rather, on Instagram, Cam Haynes put a thing in his store saying that it was gonna go live. And they said that he couldn't mention me. He wasn't allowed to mention me. He wasn't allowed to mention me?

Yeah.

I forget what the label was.

Your JRE experience. I don't know if they're affiliated with you or just a fan page. Jre experience. Instagram, he print screen and messaged me and it said, this video is not suitable for repost or something. My video from testifying in front of the.

They won't let you repost.

This was a Senate hearing. What are you talking about?

So someone has their clause in meta that's able to suppress information. Someone has their clause in YouTube. Someone has their claws. And, you know, you could use whatever label. You could say the advertisers don't want to advertise on this because it's controversial subject. And that's the problem. Okay, if that's all it is, but then it should still get a lot of views. So if it. If you want to withhold advertise but the views are substantial, that means that it's really being shared in a normal way with something so outrageous and something that gains that much momentum that quickly doesn't make sense that peters out that quick. It was too profound. It was too resident.

It resonated with people going crazy. And then I would see 100 new follow 100, like, whatever. And then the next morning, dead. Totally dead. Like literally right after we straight, we were all trading texts about that article and we're like, like, I just cannot believe they reacted with an article this fast. And it's a total misrepresentation of what occurred today.

That's all they needed.

And it tried to make it, tried to make it sound like it was a left or right wing political movement, like a right wing political ideology. And it's like everyone in that room. In fact, most of the people on the panel were Democrat backgrounds, registered democratic voters. Like, there were some Republicans on there, but it was a mixture. It was a melting pot. And we're all free thinkers. Like, don't take my ability to think critically away from me. I don't give a shit which party you're part of. I am here for team people. Let's talk about the issues and stop trying to make this left or right like, it's not.

But they're smart in that all they need is one or two articles in a respected publication to cite, to point towards the fact that this is misinformation. And someone from whatever organization would look at that and gloss over it. Oh, yeah, yeah, we'll suppress that.

That, yeah. And that's one step further. I feel like, I feel like, like, for example, the news New York Post article, I honestly, the way they worded that, they tried to make it sound like I'm just a regular on your podcast, and I come on here and just shit all over the FDA. And I'm like, I'm doing my best to be transparent and say they're, they're at a disadvantage, they're underfunded, they, you know, they didn't build this model. They were put in this model, right, and they're doing their best to navigate, but they're underfunded, understaffed and chronically corrupted by the environment itself. But I would tell you the same thing with academia, the same thing with hospital systems. Also not me picking on one person.

That work in the FDA. If you've been working the FDA for four years, how much of a dent do you think you could put in the momentum of the machine that's behind you? What are you gonna do? You get to stick your neck out, you're gonna get it chopped off. You're not gonna move up the corporate ladder. It's not set up that way. And that's just the reality of being a human being. And you go, hey, I do my best. Most of those people are like, most people, they're good people. Most people in all walks of life are good people. But sometimes good people do bad things because they can or because they have to.

The biggest thing I saw in healthcare was doctors were exhausted, whether orthopedic surgeons, neurosurgeons, you know, I mean, I told you this, my buddy, who is, he's a prominent sports medicine surgeon, he's a team doctor from multiple teams, you know, he's had highest positions at hospital systems even. He says, what am I gonna do, man? What am I fucking supposed to do? You know, I gotta, I need to do surgeries. I've got to do a certain amount of surgeries to make all the, all of this flow and work, and I've got to hold my team accountable for the amount of surgeries and their volumes. And you're never supposed to make it about volumes, but all of these hospital systems are incentivized off volume metrics that are based off cranking out the most amount of surgeries. And so there is a tremendous amount of pressure from the top down. And with insurance companies dwindling reimbursements and dwindling, like even primary care reimbursements, but also surgical reimbursements, you're not going to be able to innovate when it's a race to the bottom, right? A total joints paying less now it's going to take an 8% haircut every year, and it has for like, the last 15 years.

So nobody's going to go out and buy some brand new state of the art joint or even innovate a brand new state of the art joint, because it's all about commodity, commoditizing it and driving down the cost right now to make it affordable to even get a joint.

So it doesn't even incentivize innovation.

Correct.

That's crazy. Especially with something like replacement joints, which would, you would hope when they've gotten a lot better out there. How many people do you know that have had hip replacements? I know a bunch. I know a bunch. And it's like they're walking around, like, quick. Graham Hancock came in here six weeks after his hip replacement.

Yeah.

And, you know, he's 150,000 years old. According to his aging. Everything's older with him. No, I mean, he's. Graham's got to be in the seventies, right? And back then, I'm not sure how old he was. This was back when we were in LA, but he was walking around six weeks later, fine. No limp, nothing. I mean, it's extraordinary what they can do now. It's amazing. You would hope that they would continue to innovate in that way. You know what's going on in California right now with home insurance? Okay.

I do not.

There's a real crisis in California with home insurance. Pull up the home insurance crisis. Home insurance is sky high, and particularly in areas where they have wildfire because they lose so much. You know, where I used to live in California, I was evacuated three times.

That's crazy.

Yeah. And the last time my kids were real little, and we went in the middle of the night. We had to take off at 02:00 in the morning. The fire was coming over the hill that was maybe 200 yards from us.

Growing up in Houston, I was used to hurricanes. A fire would be terrifying.

Insurance keep dropping. California homeowners, changes are in the works, try to stop their cherry picking. So there's, there's a, you know, they don't want to insure houses that are likely gonna burn or gonna fall off of a fucking hill. Like, I remember I was watching this news special about Malibu, and there was a mudslide in Malibu. Like a landslide. So these people, they parked these fucking $5 million houses on stilts on the side of a hill. Like, hey, why do you think the side of the hill varies so much? Do you think maybe it moves? You think maybe over time, shit fucking goes down. It's not like a smooth skateboarding slope. No, it's an unpredictable mass of land that's affected by years and years of drought. So when you get drought, you don't have plant growth, you have no plant growth. You get more erosion because there's no root systems. And then chunks of this fucking hill were falling off. And these people were in the middle of the night. They heard cracking as their house was breaking apart. In the middle of the night, their house started breaking apart and falling down the hill.

And they got out just in time. It was crazy. The guy was like, I just heard cracking. I thought someone was breaking in. Then we got up and we didn't know what was going on. His house is cracking in half.

Is it? Are they having that many claims? Is that why the insurance is that?

There's a lot of claims with wildfires. There's not that many claims with landslides, but this is one that was like, there's like, California has some real natural disaster problems, and the big one happens every 2030 years and hasn't happened since 93. That was the earthquake thing. Yeah, that fucking thing that happens over there all the time where everything fucking shakes and houses fall down and, like, highways, pancake. I came the first time I ever came to Hollywood. I was doing this thing for MTV. And I came out here right after the earthquake in 93, and I was like, this is nuts, man. I remember driving by a highway that had collapsed on another highway. It was like, right afterwards.

I've only been in one earthquake and it was in Japan when we were. We were at Disney in Japan. And an earthquake hit recently. Yeah, we were with Philip, Franklin Lee and Margarita and Amanda and I were all there. And literally the hurt, the. Sorry, not the earthquake hithennae. I get a text and I look and all the japanese people are looking at their phones, too, and it's like. Like an amber alert. And I look and it says, seek shelter. Nine point, whatever, eight points. That was a huge one. I don't know earthquakes. I don't want to tell you the wrong. Whatever the giant one was that just happened, and every japanese person just dropped to the ground and covered their heads. And we were in a cave, like a man made cave at Disney. So Amanda looked at me and was like, fuck that, and just took off running and we, like, ran out of the cave. Everyone was just down on the ground. And then the tsunami warnings followed. And I was just thinking, like, I grew up with hurricanes and, you know, they're coming. You have like a week. The earthquake stuff is terrifying.

Terrifying.

Like, that is scary.

Japan gets some big and the earth.

Is literally throwing things and moving. That's way scarier to me than hurricanes.

The biggest one I've ever been in was a small one. It was like a 5.5. And they said it was actually an aftershock of the Northridge earthquake, but it was right after I moved to LA, so it was like 94. I was sitting in my apartment and all of a sudden my apartment moved like. Like a refrigerator box. You know, if you're a kid, you'd play like, someone got a new refrigerator. Your kids would play in the box and fuck around. Make a little hut out of it. Yeah, yeah. You know, carve little windows out of it and shit. It was like that. The whole apartment moved like that. It wasn't even any noise. It was just the shaking of the building. But it seems so flimsy. That's all I could remember. I remember being like, oh, my God. I thought you guys were tougher than this. Like, I thought the house was tougher. I thought I was in a building. I thought I was in an apartment building. It was a two store apartment compl. Two story apartment complex. It just went like this.

Yeah.

And then it stopped. And I remember going, I gotta get the fuck out of here. I can't live in this place. Like this is gonna happen.

When I got back to the hotel, the. There was a koi pond, and because it's Japan, beautiful koi pine. But it was up on, like, the 30th floor.

Oh, God.

All that water was just all over the lobby from the hotel swain.

Oh, my God.

Yeah.

Jesus.

And I was just like, this is scary. Like, scary.

Well, then tsunami's the real scary thing, man. Those videos of the Fukushima tsunami where people saw it coming and they're trying to get away? Yeah, those are all.

Birds came first, flying through.

Animals know. Somehow another animals know.

Yeah.

When tsunamis happen, all the animals go to seek high ground. Okay. What is that?

Yeah.

What is that?

It's crazy.

Someone should fucking study that. Yeah, there's. They're getting some kind of information.

Yeah.

Some message from the universe is telling them to go to high ground. How?

Yeah, I even saw it. Well, they have it. They have senses that I think we have, too, that we just don't have anymore. You know what I'm saying? Like, you and I talk about that when you go hunting. And by, like, day two or three, you almost feel like you're more aware, more in tune to every noise, every. You feel the temperature more that.

Oh, yeah.

Everything gets enhanced dude, you're so alive.

You're so alive in the mountains.

Yeah.

You know, I got a. I went to elk hunting, and I got successful on the second day, which you can't pass up. You know, it just was a perfect scenario, and I got successful, but I wanted to keep going. I wanted to stay out there. It was just, when you're out there, it's just the physical act of being in the woods is like a vitamin that you don't need. You don't know you need until you get it. You're like, oh, I need this vitamin. That's what I was saying. Like a wildlife photographer. That'd be the dopest job ever. You're just in the wilderness photographing wildlife.

What's crazy is he's a wildlife photographer. But when you talk to him, because he's been through shit living, he's worn out. But no, he's amazing because he's so optimistic. And he'll say, and I agree with him, this is the greatest country in the world. We are the greatest country in the world, but we have to fight for that.

No, we have to torch the constitution. Should we torch the constitution? The Atlantic thinks maybe we should torch the constitution.

Why?

Well, you know, it's all these interests, and I think the social chaos aspect of today. This is what I find interesting because I think it forces these kind of conversations. It forces people to deal with these problems. It forces it. Instead of, like, this healthcare issue being this insidious, never talked about things that slowly crept up and just became ingrained in society to the point where everybody just accepted it. Instead of that, you have this rebellion, and you do have this make America healthy again movement, which everyone should embrace, but yet it becomes ideologically captured by the right somehow. And if you are with that, if you think, hey, that's a great idea, those guys have. I know they suck when it comes to women's right to choose. They suck when it comes to whatever. Fill in the blanks. But I like what they're saying about this. We're so lost in this team thing that is ingrained in our fucking DNA, and they play us with it. They play us with it, because we have these undeniable tribal instincts. It's just like when you roll a ball of yarn past a kitten, they can't help it.

They gotta jump on it. They have these instincts.

We have it in your stand up bit. And it's. Is that that part where you talk about politics is that's 100% how I feel, and that's how almost everybody I know feels it's a lie that we all believe. The Republicans are the Democrats. We don't. We're all individuals and free thinkers, and every topic is different and nuanced. And it's not that easy.

It's not.

But it's hard to find a party that represents everything you believe in. And again, I'm not political, so I focus on health care because it's what I know. And I know I can debate anyone on this. On this topic. I fucking know it. You want to talk about the Ukraine? I'm a moron. I can't help you there. I don't know. But I know healthcare, and I know how broken it is.

The problem is ideologies. The real problem is tribal thinking, because everyone should just embrace this and think, this is really a good idea. But the fact that it's been attached to one political party, it makes it a problem for the people in the other political parties party. And that's what's nuts about us. Even things that are universally good, that everyone should strive for better health, that becomes. I've seen articles written that fucking people that go to the gym are more likely to be right wing. Yeah, like, what are you talking about? Go to yoga class?

The example I go to yoga is one of the bills that they are putting in place is to cover GLP ones for every american that wants it. That's $1,500 a month right now because of what. What the pharmaceutical and insurance companies have done to price, gouge, and market up shouldn't be that it should be under a couple hundred dollars a month. But it's not. And it's not going to be. And so I look at that and go, okay, for $1,500 a year, you could get the Dexa, the Vo two max. You could be monitored with AI 24/7 you could get at minimal blood work twice a year, comprehensive console, 1 hour deep dive into your biology, and we could treat the root cause of the issue. Because I said this on Jillian's podcast with GLP ones, I am not against them. I'm still a believer in them when utilized appropriately. But prescribing a GLP one, a weight loss drug, without talking about diet, lifestyle nutrition, is like brushing your teeth while eating fucking oreos. All this is true.

But what I'm saying is that just the concept of getting all these things out of our food supply, making people healthy, getting people off of all these prescription drugs, making people more metabolically healthy, we're so stupid with our tribal shit that just. That concept has been pushed into the realm of right wing. If you're that, you're a maga person, you're this. You're a fucking. You're a loon. Yeah, it's. It's so dumb. It's. And it's this. The thing about going to gyms being right wing. I've seen multiple articles written about going to gyms being right wing. Wing. Have you ever been to a fucking yoga class? Okay? Yoga is one of the hardest things to do. They're some of the most left wing motherfuckers on earth. They're nice, kind people who bust their ass in a 90 minutes hot yoga class. That's fucking hard to do. It challenges your character, okay? The idea that, like, the only people that exercise are right wing, that is so dumb, that's so limiting and so stupid and such a ridiculous way to think. You should want to be stronger. Everybody should want to be stronger. You know why? Because it's good.

I like that I can pick things up. I like that if someone in my house needs something open, they give it to me. And I could just open that motherfucker. Yeah, I like that. I like that I can carry things well.

What gives me hope is the Democrats were in that meeting, and there were Democrat senators that were interested. And I don't believe that it's the Democrats. I believe it's an agenda beyond the Democrats, and it's nothing. I just think people are trying to intentionally create that strife and that separation. And I don't believe it's the Democratic Party. I believe it's people attempting to hijack the democratic party and attempting to trivialize this message by portraying it as a political agenda rather than the facts of life, of where we're at as a nation.

That's for sure the root cause of it. But it is a thing now, and that's the problem. It's been effective. It's like many other things that's effective until people wake the fuck up. Up. Yeah, that's the thing. You know, there's not a lot of people going out getting Covid vaccines now. You got to be a true believer to go running out. It doesn't mean they're not still trying to sell it. I was watching the Beetlejuice movie the other day. So in the beginning of the Beetlejuice movie, they play all these fucking cool previews. Get, oh, what, though? That's coming out. That looks fun. And then they have a John Legend COVID vaccine commercial where he talks about how he's, I'll protect myself from COVID He's fucking playing the piano, and he, like, rolls down his sleeve to show you a fucking band aid. You're like, what did you do?

But the insanity of it is, Joe, let's even look at Covid. If we look at the people that died of COVID it was because of chronic disease and comorbidity, which goes back to when we talk about it. And one of the things that's built into the new ways, two well AI algorithm app that monitors your blood work is a calculation on your all cause mortality risk. The goal is to drive down all cause mortality risk. What people don't understand is if you're like you, a physically fit, lean muscle mass, low body fat, healthy individual, it reduces your risk of everything that could kill you. Everything. A car accident, which sounds crazy, but think your body is metabolically healthy and fit, your chances of surviving and recovering are higher.

Oh, for sure.

So somebody chronically ill and sick, it's not. You could throw a Diet coke and kill them. You know, it's not like they're. They're already at a deficit and they. We're trying to help people not be at a deficit. Let's get people back to normal.

We just have to change the way people think about things. We have to change this ridiculous idea that your healthcare provider knows everything. They fucking don't. Your general practitioner, he doesn't. There's no way. And this one of the things that Casey means talked about, like how little nutrition information she got in college, which is really nuts. But that's just the fact of the matter. That's just really what it is. And also, most of those people are also unhealthy themselves.

Yeah.

We just have to stop thinking about it as a right wing or a left wing thing. It's dumb and it's dangerous. It's bad for you. And I know it's hard to change. Your fucking people are like battleships. It's hard to change course. It's fucking hard.

It's also hard. Even in the system, when you're separate from politics, when you're in there, there's local politics, right? You're in a hospital system, you're a primary care, and you start writing a lot of testosterone and treating your patients, you're going to have the urology section of your hospital pissed off because they're going to go, what the hell is this primary care doing this? That's my spectrum. Send them over to me.

Right. I could be making money off.

Everything is siloed in a way that it makes it hard for these clinicians to practice medicine the way they would.

Want, which is why they're trying to stop telemedicine. It's not for you, it's not good, and it shouldn't be legal. And that's where I believe in government oversight. There should be like an actual government person who can never get a job with any of these organizations. Never get a job. It should be like, if you agree to take this job on, you'll be well compensated, but you will never be able to work for pharmaceutical drug companies, ever.

That should be a pretty simple, like, even with food, we could overcomplicate food. Okay, why not just say, if you don't ship it to Europe, don't ship it to Americans?

Yeah, duh.

How is that hard? If we don't want to do the double blind studies and the research? And I get it, and it's hard to do, and it's confusing, but at minimal, we can follow the guidance of countries who have better health standards than the US has today.

Just think about what you said about war, and think about what you said about the american people. How many die from chronic disease every year. And think about how much money we have spent on a war that we're not even in. I mean, what did, what was the overall, what's the latest? Didn't they just send another few billion? Little bit here, a little bit there. I mean, I wonder how much they set aside for those people in North Carolina and Tennessee from that hurricane, because those people are fucked. A lot of people are dead, man. I was reading this account, it was a horrific account of this. These people, grandparents and a child that were on a roof, and it was before the roof swept away, the building swept away, and they drowned. But there's a photograph of the last photograph of them on the roof, and they're terrified. And this little girl and her grandparents are on this roof, and the water is everywhere. I mean, it's. There's so many washed out streets and so many washed out bridges, and the roads are gone. Have you seen some of the aerial photographs?

I have. It's terrible.

It's terrible. Houses floating down the street in Asheville, North Carolina, just floating down the street. And how much relief are they gonna get? Is it gonna be like Maui, where you give them $700?

Yeah.

Which is the most. That's more insulting than giving them no money. A one time fee of dollar 700. You lost your house, and the most catastrophic wildfire in the history of North America. You're gonna give him $700 each? But you're gonna give Ukraine 170. Whatever billion.

Yeah. And I heard Tulsi on here talking and I'm like, God, man, when you look at, like, there's a lot to gain by those people not being able to afford to stay. Like, they're. That's where it's essentially homeless. And then they still got to pay their mortgages. They still have to pay these bills. They're not gonna give them long term mortgage relief.

That's very valuable land if everybody defaults. And not only that, but the governor, governor was on record give a speech, like right after the fire. And one of the things they talked about was the state taking that land, which is an insane thing to do. Right? Was it the mayor? Who was it that said that was the mayor or the governor? But it was just the fact that they said it out loud is so insane. In the wake of these people suffering this catastrophic loss, they didn't even know how many people were dead at that time. People were just missing, kids, missing, burnt alive. Who knows how many people died. I don't even think they have an accurate count right now of how many people died.

Well, we live in a world where things change so fast.

See if you can find that, because I want to know.

I don't know how people would get overwhelming because I try to follow it all, and that's why I stick to my niche of healthcare.

This is crazy. I know this is crazy that they're saying now think about allocating that kind of money towards healthcare. 102. The death toll from the deadliest wildfire in over century has risen to 102. Yeah, but what did the, what did the, what I asked you is what did the governor say about acquiring the land, not the death toll? Yeah, I don't think that. I think 102 is the current estimate, but I think there's a lot of people missing.

What do you know about the Ukraine? One of the things, and again, I don't know enough to. I mean, I'm curious because you, I know you're, you've interviewed a lot of smarter people than me. I was told that one of the leverage points for the Ukraine in order to get funding was to put up land as collateral through, like, their farmland is put up as collateral on the loans that are being provided. And those loans are essentially provided by.

Dave Smith was explaining it to me. I don't really know. I don't know. I haven't researched it, I haven't read anything about it. But yeah, that's what I've heard as well.

Well, because I always look and go, well, there's no such thing as everything's biased. No such thing as a free lunch. So what is the real agenda and who's funding and why? Is always my question, just from seeing other sectors and what happens?

Of course, always, there's always money behind it. Yeah. But there's also, Ukraine is one of the most mineral rich places on earth. Like, it's worth trillions of dollars in all sorts of different, like, groovy shit that we need to make stuff with.

Yeah.

What is. What did the governor say?

I'll just go with what I have right now.

Don't you put it up for me. Okay. So this is just the only one.

I've found so far.

I'm already looking for states to acquire a ways for states to acquire Lahaina. Go put that in a search engine.

I did. That's why I'm on Twitter. It wasn't coming up in a search engine.

So he said in his speech, that's crazy, too.

How quick stuff can be suppressed and disappear.

You got to look. I started using brave browser recently. I gave up on Duckduckgo. Duckduckgo seems to have gone the way of Google. It's very difficult to find things that are inconvenient, but brave seems to be uncensored and it doesn't seem to be curated. But after I say that, they probably get them, too. I don't know who to use. I don't know what to do anymore. Like, the whole thing is so all.

Of this gets so hard. It's like I want to believe there's truth in that. We have somewhere where we have still have integrity and honesty and transparency. It doesn't mean you always get it right in the articles. Doesn't happen.

It's only an independent journalism now. It's. You get that from Michael Schellenberger, Matt Taibbi, Glenn Greenwald. You get that from those type of people. You don't get that from anywhere else anymore. Anymore. And it's good that we have those type of people that they're there and they'll hold people accountable and tell you the real numbers of things and, you know, and give you the facts behind what caused conflicts. Not just report on the conflicts, but explain to you what happened.

So fact check. I found. I think this is what he said.

I'm already thinking about ways for the state to acquire that land so we could put it into workforce housing, to put it back into families or to make it open spaces in perpetuity as memorial to people who are lost. That is a crazy thing to say because as soon as you say state to acquire that land and we'll decide the awesome things to do with it, that's now you took very, very, very valuable land and you could say, hey, we're gonna sell it to a resort and the resort is gonna donate, it's all these wonderful funds. How many people are missing from the fire, Jamie? Because the problem with fire is like, you need like dental records and shit. You know, like when it gets down to someone dying and like, they're missing.

At this point, they're gone.

So I have a buddy of mine that was a firefighter and he told me some crazy. It's just going into a building with burning people in it is madness. Okay? It's a thousand people reported missing.

Whoa.

Yeah.

So this death toll way off.

Shut the fuck up. Yeah, it's more than five deaths were confirmed. But I think the problem is when they can say 102 deaths confirmed and they don't say, but yet there's 990 people missing. You can say that because it's very difficult to confirm who these people are. There's not much left. It's so scary. Fire is so fucking scary. And when you've been evacuated by fire. There was one time where I was coming home from the comedy store. Store. I got evacuated the same day. But as I was coming home from the comedy store, as I was driving to my house, the whole right side of the highway over the tops of the hills was in flame. Like all the hills. Like as you get, like woodland hills and shit in flames, just in flames. Like fire coming over hills. You're watching houses go up in flames. It's such a weird feeling because that's when you realize that we all have this very naive idea. And by the way, people working on wildfires and those firefighters who work twenty four seven and just fucking stayed alive on coffee and those people are fucking heroes, but there's not enough of them.

Okay? When this cop told me, this firefighter rather told me when we were doing fear factor, once he goes, one day, he goes, one day a fire is going to hit the right conditions with the right wind and it's going to burn through LA all the way to the ocean. We can't do anything to stop it. And I was like, really? He goes, yeah, when they get real big, there's nothing you can do. And I always thought that guy was just, that was hyperbole until I saw what happened in my fucking neighborhood.

Yeah.

And I was like, this is.

Do they? I don't know enough about. Do they do control burns and all that in California now to try and stop, like create stop gaps and all that for the fires? Or how does that. How do they even do that?

What is this, Jamie?

Updated.

Because this isn't updated though, from the.

First thing I found.

Which was it says November 18, 2023. Right.

The original thing we read that said a thousand was from September. So 60 days before this.

Oh, September. But I thought it was September of this year. No, no. So September 2022. So it says a hundred days after the Maui fires, four names remain on the missing list. So. So they found a bunch of those people, is that what you're saying?

Yeah, there's currently only two.

Oh, there's only two missing? Yeah, period.

As of right. I found the website that has their names listed.

Oh, so the other toll is 102?

Yeah.

So why did they say, so the death toll was elevated when they thought 1000 people were missing? Is that what it was? And then those people had a. There's only two people missing.

Here's what I looked up. I typed in Maui fire, people missing. When you click on the first thing that says how many people were missing in the Maui fire? That's what I clicked on, that.

You read the date on that thousand in 2018? September 18, 2023.

Right after.

And then in November, they had narrowed it down. Four people.

Yes.

Okay, go back. What's below that? Why are so many people still missing in Maui? That's September of 2023. What does it say?

3000?

They have an explanation, but I'm hoping maybe New York magazine has an explanation that makes more sense.

I'm not gonna be able to read it.

Oh, you sons of bitches. Did Maui officials released the 388 names of people unaccounted for in the Maui fire? Click on that.

Down to two. That's what's on the website, has two.

People listed, but what it says right here is more than a hundred within a day. August 25, I'm reading it, 388 names of people unaccounted for following the deadliest us wildfires in more than a century. More than 100 of them or their relatives came forward to say their safe. So this was in August. So a hundred of the 388 people. So that number of 1000 was just the initial number. So that was like crazy.

300 people.

I think it's just saying over a thousand were reported missing. There's over 3000, according to the other thing. Or initially reported missing, that means they could have found them the next day.

Right.

Two days later. Three days later.

Right. Or later, months later. Well, you get.

But it's also an island. It can't be that hard to find.

Yeah, but you probably don't report when you're staying with relatives in Honolulu because your house burnt down in Maui. You probably just go over there and stay there.

Cell coverage problems and all sorts of stuff. They couldn't contact people, maybe, you know, a lot of possibilities, I feel like.

So that's good that there was less people died, that's for sure. But it's still fucked that they're trying to take the land and that what they're doing is they're making it very difficult for these people to rebuild. And most of them haven't even started yet.

Well, and then I know, too. I mean, it's taking forever for people to get their insurance claims and their money. And that happens even here with hurricanes. It's a, you know, if you don't have the money to pay for stuff yourself, you're. You're stuck battling the insurance company. If you don't have the money to battle the insurance company, then you're really in a tough spot.

Right? Yeah. It's dark. It's.

I had a, I had a. During a hurricane in Houston, at our pharmacy, I had a tree damaged the roof, but then it wasn't covered by flood insurance because they said it was wind driven rain anyways, it was like $60,000 in damage that the insurance didn't cover.

Why?

Because they could say it's wind driven rain, not flood, not rising water.

And so water damage is very specific.

Yeah, they have different ways.

Driven rain is. Okay.

Loophole, you know, out of paying your coverage. And so for somebody who's. It's their house, you know, who maybe doesn't have the money to fight the insurance companies, they just put a tarp on the roof and live with it as long as they can until they can afford to fix it.

Oh, my God. So when you got water coverage, you thought you were getting coverage from shit like that?

Yeah, yeah, I had flood insurance, everything, and it doesn't cover it. So I got. I got left holding the bag.

Is there tree insurance? Can you get insurance for a tree? Drop it on your house?

Yeah, there is. Yeah, there is general insurance, but I don't know how it all works. Like, there's different deductibles and there's always a liability, there's always a loophole. Insurance is a racket. And then even in healthcare insurance, you know, like, what isn't a racket?

Is there a thing out there that's not a racket.

I know church, religion, everything's a racket.

Well, some church isn't a racket. Some church is great. Some church is very beneficial for people. I think that a lot more as I'm older. I think it's like a good. I think Zubi said this. I think he called. I think he called it like an immune system. It's a good immune system. Protect you from the bullshit in society. Yeah, I think. I think I'm paraphrasing him for sure, but I think that's accurate.

As great as we are, as humans, we are tribal, like you said. So we find reasons to see how we're different and where to argue and where to fight. And I think that allows corruption to creep in. And it's insidious. It spreads. It's in every aspect of life.

Soon as you let people have money doing a thing, and as soon as you can attach something to something that people are deeply opposed to, like, whatever Trump is for, you're against. You know, no matter what. It's just, it's. When you could find a thing like that, that's. The enemy believes it. People are so reluctant to look at real data. They're so reluctant. Even the people that don't want murderers and rapists and drug dealers sneaking across the border, they'll find a way to say, like, one of the things they like to say is migrants statistically commit less crimes than people live here. That's what they say. They love to say that one.

Yeah.

But you know what that is? You know what that's accounting for? Gang violence. People that are in prison. Like, you're looking at everybody.

Yeah.

Statistically, they commit less crimes. Yeah. There's a lot less of them.

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. And also we have a lot of crime. So what the fuck are you trying to say? It's not like the average person is out there committing all these crimes. No. It's a very small number of people that are career criminals.

Yeah.

They're poor people. They're fucking. They grew up in terrible environments. They started doing crime when they were young. They're criminals. They're career criminals. There's a small percentage of those. And they fucked the numbers up. So if you want to say that, like, migrants, statistically, like. Okay, okay, statistically. But statistically, that's not what we're talking about.

Yeah, there's talking about let.

There's no justification for letting in murderers.

Mark Twain. There's. There's lies. There's damn lies. And then there's statistics.

Right. I mean, how do they find those statistics when they say that migrants are less likely. First of all, they're not even arresting them in some places, like, were they treated as sanctuary cities? Like, people are dealing with that. In Aurora, Colorado, they're not even arresting people. They commit crimes. Cops will tell you they can't arrest them because it's a sanctuary.

They don't arrest if it's under $1,300 or something.

Oh, yeah.

They just let them walk out with tvs. They just make sure it's under, like.

Apparently San Francisco, according to some people that I know that are living there, there is getting better because of AI. So Chamath was saying that when the super nerds are running things, everything's great. But as soon as, like, the mid level people start taking over, they get through with ideology. They get through with, like, progressive virtue signaling, and that's how they get ahead, because they're mostly mediocre people. And so when they start to get a grip of the city, you're kind of fucked. But if the AI becomes the dominant force in the industry again, then the super nerds would be back in control again. And if the super nerds are in control, they'll fix all these things. They'll clean all, because it's logical. It's logical to not have people, like, camping on the streets and fucking shooting up in the middle of, you know, parks and stuff.

I wonder, even with AI, like, as we get down in that, like we were talking about, it's a way more complex conversation than today. But, like, what are they going to do with the massive displacements and jobs between AI and robotics and humanoid robots? I mean, there's ten companies out there that are launching robots, not just Elon, and those are backed by chat, GPT, and large language models that are rapidly approaching the level of human knowledge and intellect, that of the average human. And, like, it's there.

I walked by the Tesla store the other day at the domain. I was thinking of buying a robot.

Oh, they have them there.

They have a robot. I don't think you could buy it. They could buy it. I'd be like, I would probably buy that robot. I was talking to my kids, like, you guys think we should get a robot?

It'd be awesome.

Would you trust that fucker? You trust that fucker? Well, Russia could hack.

We already have. You know, everyone has Alexa in their house, and, you know, what was that one? Like, I told Alex, I made a joke about the government. I laughed. Alexa laughed. So did the FBI or whatever it is. Like, it's so entrenched in our world. I don't know. I don't know.

It is entrenched, but it's mostly illegal to use. Yeah, it's like, mostly illegal what they're doing. You know, if the FBI is really using your wifi to follow you around your house all day long, that's kind of a violation of your privacy. And that's a real technology that's available now, and it should be available if there's a situation where there's a fucking terrorist and he's in a house and he's got a suicide vest, and you can use Wifi to locate him and know exactly where he is, and you protect all these other people. So that's justification for having some kind of technology in the hands of some intelligence agents. Yeah, that makes great. But, you know, if you're using it to gather dirt on old Brigham, because Brigham's got a big old mouth and he's talking about the pharmaceutical drug, and, you know, you have a fucking group of people that are working to put together a dossier on you. Yeah, it's all nuts, man. It's. It's nuts. And it's like, right out in the open.

Well, with the AI and the way things are headed, too, though, like, when we talk about displacement of jobs, so many people think it's going to be like, trade workers. And I'm like, no, this is going to replace clinicians, this is going to replace doctors, lawyers, you know, a lot of.

Dude, a lot of things. We're gonna need universal basic income, according to most people who understand economics. I don't know if they're right, but it makes sense to me. Universal basic income scares me because incentive to taking, incentivizing people to not work scares me, you know, and giving people an excuse to not. It's bad for people. It just is. It's bad for kids. If you just give your kids everything they want and they never learn how to work hard, you're fucking them up. And the problem with just giving people a check, they're not going to want to. If you get enough to eat and you have recreation money and you have a roof over your head, and you don't have to work at all, like, and working for, like, a little bit more than that, and then you lose those benefits. Fuck that. I would rather, like, pare down my lifestyle.

I say this. You also need a purpose. Like in viktor frankel's a man's search for meaning. He survived that nazi concentration camp because he had a purpose, a higher calling. I can tell you, you, when I'm just eating shit sandwiches and getting my head stomped in right now, running these companies, over 300 employees, DeA, fdA, you know, fighting big pharma, all the things we battle. There are a lot of days I go to bed with anxiety and stress, but I go to bed feeling like I'm really on the right side of something positive. I really, truly do. When I was a device rep, I made good money, but I went to bed miserable every night, and I felt like I'm just kind of a pawn in a scheme, and we're not really making an impact. So I go back to, I think, people, humans, we need a purpose. And so that scares me the most, is a lot of people's purpose. If it's not being a mother or father or sibling. They find purpose in their trade, in their craft and their job and their cause. So what do we do when.

That's a really good question. If you wanted to look at it long term, if you're being objective and not taking into account human emotions and suffering and the disruption of lives that it's undeniably going to cause, if you just wanted to look at us objectively, you would say this is an inevitable transition, a very painful transition into a technological world. And human beings are going to have to adapt. And if this was available to them when they were babies, they would have adapted to exist in that world. They would have find things to do for a living that only humans can do, because they're very personal things that only humans can do. There's always going to be a market for handmade things. There's always going to be a market for. I like a painting that I know the guy who made it.

Yeah.

You know? You know, I mean, I love that. I love that I look at, like. Like that painting up there, you know? My friend Taylor made that. I know him, yeah, hung out with the dude.

That's great guy.

That's Mitzi.

Yeah.

But that is a big thing that Taylor made that, and he's my friend. I know it. That's a piece of art.

You have some of the coolest art in your studio and at the club. Like, I love art. Super cool art.

Art's amazing. I love it. It makes me feel different when I'm looking at something that someone made. It makes me feel better when I.

See your leg Overton stuff.

Oh, I love that.

It's like you're looking. It is insane. The detail and, like, incredible. It's crazy.

It's the only thing I'm allowed to have in my house, I'm not allowed to decorate my house. Cause it would look like a fucking. A baby's house. It was like a man baby. It would all be like toys everywhere. I'm not allowed to decorate my house, but I do have three Greg Overton paintings.

Yeah.

Everything else. My wife figured everything else out. I just go ahead, just give me. Give me a little space. Give me a little something. I got an elk head in the kitchen, in the dining table, over the dining table. First elk I shot with a bow. But it's not like the stuffed con. It's just the skull.

Yeah, you just do the european mouth.

That's what I like.

Do you have any taxider?

No, I don't. Taxidermies. That's dolls.

Yeah.

You know, that's what that is. My friend Tyler does it. You know, I love Tyler from archery country. Yeah, he makes taxidermies tax dermis an art.

I think they look like when you go to, you know, one of these lodges where they have, like, entire scenes. Like, I saw one, the guy on the second story of his house, like, has a kudu drinking out of water. And it's literally a crocodile coming up. I mean, it's wild.

Yeah. Especially in Texas. My friend told me that he went over this guy's house and the guy had a stuffed chimpanzee. And the chimpanzee, when you got near him, it was like, rigged where his. His, like, eyes would light up and his dick would pop up like they had it. You know how you walk by those haunted house things? You walk by him, his eyes light up and his dick pops up because of you.

We watched what was the chimp.

Oh, chimp crazy.

Oh, my God.

Oh, my God. I.

It's insane.

Insane. It's nuts. These people are out of their fucking mind.

And it's. But it's weird because it's the same as Tiger king in a way. Like, it's the same personality quirk. You know what I'm saying? Like.

Yep.

It's this weird personality quirk. When you watch it, you see some of the, like, I don't want to say mental health issues, but some of that's what you.

Or whatever they are, they're mentally ill people. Yeah, they're mentally ill. Crazy people who have giant primates that live in their house.

Everyone's face gets ripped off.

Oh, yeah. They all.

When you start.

Take their noses off.

Oh, my God.

Yeah. They rip their eyes out. Yeah, it's nuts. And they. For the first four or five years, the monkey gets to go everywhere. So the chimp gets to go to the pizza place. Everybody loves them. Chimp gets go here. But then they get a little older, and now they're in a cage all day.

Yeah.

So they used to be free. They used to go to the town. Everybody was their friend. Now sudden they're in a fucking cage. And when they get out of that cage, they fuck people up. Yeah, they're so.

And then they have that hormone dump. I think they were saying the male primates are like, five or six years old, so they become really hard to domesticate or keep as a pet because they get violent. I mean, there's way of communicating the castrate them.

That's why that lady's 15 year old. She can hang out with it and watch 2001. That's a castrated 15 year old chimpanzee. That's why it's so skinny too. It looks like Michael Jackson. Jackson? Yeah, skinny. The other ones look jacked. You know, they look like. It's like Mike Tyson is prime.

I haven't messaged Tony about it yet, but the Vince McMahon.

What do you mean?

They just dropped the Vince McMahon docu series on Netflix.

Oh, it's not about chimpanzees.

No, no, this was what it. No, no, this is a new Netflix one about Vince McMahon and the WWE. It's pretty intense.

No, speaking of muscles, some wild shit. Of course it was. I mean, when you're that jacked in your seventies, what are you on? Yeah, like, what do you want to be that jacked in your seventies?

Yeah.

Guys probably out of his fucking mind and partying. Did he really shit on someone's head? Is that really.

I'm still. I'm only on, like, the second episode, but they're getting into, like, there was a lot of. There was some weird stuff. Like, they even. They were even bringing in little kids, kind of like, going down that Epstein Path.

Oh, my God.

They talk about that like nothing kid. Teenage boys. Kids, though, 1516 year old kids working crews and stuff that were being utilized sexually and exploited. Yeah, there's a lot of sinister, sinister stuff in there. I don't know how much.

These are just allegations.

Yeah, they're all. It's all allegations and whistleblowers and, I mean, who knows that? You never know anymore.

Imagine how much liberty you have to take with the truth if you make up a story about someone shedding on your head. If you're like, you know what?

This.

Whatever happened, not bad enough. I want him, like, shit on my head. Let's like, say shit on my head. Yeah. To make that up, you'd have to be. That's such an insane thing. But when you look at Vince McMahon, you go, I bet he did that. Yeah, I bet he did it. He looks like he's insane. He's fucking jacked. And.

But you also live in that imaginary world where you've created this character and then at what point does the character become you and you, when you've done it for 30, 40 years, whatever it was, right. Grew up. His dad founded it and he was integral into the storylines and then became, like, his character was the pompous Vince McMahon.

Right.

Elitist. Like, that was his whole character. That was his shtick. So did that bleed into life? Does reality become.

Oh, it definitely does become reality. For sure. It must. It has to. I know it does with comedians. Yeah, comedians, like, become their character. Like Andrew Dice Clay used to be Andrew Silverstone. Dice was a character they used to do in his act and there just became him.

Yeah.

You know, and like, Sam Kinison, same thing. Like, Sam Kinison became the beast because that's what everybody wanted. He was, like, captured by it. He became that guy.

Yeah.

Yeah. If you're Vince McMahon and, like, your whole thing's fuck you. I run this game. You're all out of your fucking mind. I'm gonna shit in your head. Pushed it to the limit. Plus, you add in a lot of recreational substances.

Yeah.

Which I'm sure there was plenty of.

What did it say about that environment? They haven't gotten into that. I'm. By the second episode they are. They're talking about steroid use and they're definitely. I didn't know that. They indicted him for selling steroids to his athletes. I mean, a lot of crazy. They tried to indict him and he fought it. I think he got off.

Have you ever seen any of the more plates, more dates, videos about Tren?

No. From Derek. I've watched Derek.

Derek.

I love his coverage. He's so smart. He breaks stuff down so eloquently.

But there's so much talk about trend for whatever reason and sexual deviance. Like, guys who turn gay when they're doing trend. Like, just. These guys are taking crazy doses of this super powerful steroid.

Yeah.

And they're just doing wild fucking things. They get trend cough. They get, like a crazy cough and just fucking mind just. Just deviant.

That's crazy. It is. It's such a short term. There's so many bad things that can happen there. It is crazy to me.

But if you want a career in pro wrestling, and you want to be a fucking animal, and you want to get hit by a chair every night like, you're traveling across the country, probably good drug.

They are some of the most bang. Like, God, man, we've. We've had the opportunity to work with several big WWE wrestlers, and they have put their bodies through hell for, I mean, I would say, even more than jiu jitsu and MMA guys and NFL guys. Out of everybody we've worked with, the wrestlers are the most beat to shit.

You know who's not beat to shit? The rock.

Yeah.

Crazy. I mean, he's got his little injuries and shit like that. The guy looks like a fucking superhero. He's 50 years old.

Insane.

He's been through, like, how many years at WWE? Also played football, and look at him. He's fine. Yeah, it's nuts.

He's an anomaly, the most anomalous of.

Anomalies, because all those other guys that I met, Jake the snake, I mean, Hulk Hogan's fucked, man. His back's fucked. He's got to walk with a cane. He's all banged up, and you see him.

Well, his back, literally, they're shorter and smaller than they were from all the back and spine surgeries.

He's lost, like, four inches, so. Four inches of spine being compressed. It's so crazy, man. They just. And he said it was from that drop. He would do that all the time. Every time he did it, he's compressing his spine.

Yeah.

Just ruined his back doing that.

Yeah, it's scary.

Speaking of someone who looks like a champ, how about Brock Lesnar? When he flipped through the air and landed on his head?

Yeah.

Brock Lesnar look like a shaved chimp. Like, if you see a shaved chimp, like, that's. That's what you seen his dog, except he's too wide.

She's a wrestler, too. Like, a collegiate wrestler.

She's Jack Jeans. That's Viking Jeans. When that was in a boat. Yeah. Pulling into the harbor.

Can you imagine being back there, like, half starving, and Brock Lesnar gets off a boat, walking onto your land.

You're, like, barely alive anyway. And you see that guy get off a boat with a sword.

Yeah. That's what the viking thing is, that Shane Gillis joke.

Oh, yeah. That's a great joke. But, I mean, they, you know, they did do a lot of that, too. Yeah, they raped everybody.

Yeah.

The Vikings were unbelievably brutal, and they did a lot of drugs, too. Apparently, they were doing a lot of.

Psychedelics and human sacrifices and all sorts of stuff.

Yeah, they would sacrifice people. Did you ever see that show vikings?

Oh, loved it. Yeah. Ragnar Lothbrook and, like, great. Lagatha. Yeah.

So good. Yeah, great show. My wife get bailed on it after a while. She could deal with everybody getting hacked to death by swords. Like, after a while, like, okay, yeah, stop.

As you got in the la. I don't know how far you followed, but it went into Ivar the boneless and. But all these are historical figures.

Oh, yeah.

There's truth. Like, it's fictional. What is it? Fictional history or whatever it is. But it is. It is based in some truth, which is fascinating.

Oh, yeah. The actual things that they did. They really did.

Yeah.

Which is just. They were so, so nuts, man. But there's been so many instances like that in history of, like, groups of unbelievable savages that accomplished insane things just by pure barbarism and slaughter of innocent people, like the Mongols. I was watching something about Mongolia today. There was these guys who are fitness influencers went to go experience these mongolian wrestlers. Wrestlers. And these mongolian wrestlers, like, these giants of Mongolia, these fucking tanks, these dudes are throwing each other around and they got to, like, eat food with them and hang out with them and experience it like these. That's what's left over.

Did you ever watch Marco Polo?

No, I watched a little bit of it. I watched the beginning of it.

I don't know what happened. It didn't get. But it was really, really good at Genghis Khan. And I think you've talked about, it's like one 8th of the world's population, 10%.

Yeah, I think he was dealing with Genghis Khan's son. I think he was dealing to. With Genghis Khan's son. I think it was. The empire was already in decline by that time. You know, it's like, once Genghis Khan died, his sons took over, his family took over, and then it kind of fell apart after a while because you need a fucking psycho. You need a guy who's got DNA. And what was the number, Jamie, when we last looked at, like, what percentage of the population in Asia has Genghis Khan's DNA? It's something nuts. Like, 5% of everybody still has it. This fucking guy who lived in, what? 1200? When did Genghis Khan live? I think it was 1200. So all these years later, this dude has 5%.

Wasn't it? Was it you and I that we're talking about? If you go back to, like, ancient Mesopotamia, it's only, like, 50 something humans ago. If you base it off, people living to be 100.

Yeah.

It's not. It's nothing.

It's nothing. Okay. It's. It's more than that. It's 5% of the male. Excuse me? Zero point. Yeah. 5% of the male population worldwide. Half percent. Right. Not 5% worldwide, but what is it in Asia?

That is still crazy.

0.5% of the male population worldwide. But what is it in Asia? In Asia, I think it's nuts.

8% maybe?

Is that what it says? Okay, 8%. That's nuts. So 750 years of Genghis Khan's heritage, this mutation occurred in 8% of males in 16 different populations that were being studied. So one half of a percent of everyone on earth, 8% of people that live there.

That is insane.

So what was it like when he was alive? Was everybody fucking their cousin? Cause you, like, couldn't help it. Cause Genghis Khan fucked everybody. So he would, when they would conquer a town, he would take everyone's wife. They would just kill all the men, fuck all the ladies. They all became his wives.

Yeah.

And he just did that everywhere.

That was in. They did that in Ireland, too. The british royalty or aristocrats would impregnate the Irishman on the night of their wedding. They would impregnate their wives.

Oh, Jesus.

That was where. That's what Braveheart was about. He came back and I'm blanking out on his name, but fought for the Irish because they were basically raping their wives and making sure that they were raising british noble born instead of Irish.

Oh, my God.

I just listened to a book on this. That's one of the myths that come from that. Not that it didn't never, never happened, but they said that it didn't really happen.

Jamie's a party pooper. Y'all notice that?

That was. They were going this jacket, Jamie, it was a great. Courses on audible was going through all the.

Well, and if you look at, like, they didn't really get into in the movie, but we, when we did Europe, we, we did a tour where they were breaking down, like, how bad they tortured him and mutilated him in a public setting prior to killing him.

William Wallace.

Oh, my God. It's brutal.

Yeah, yeah. What, what's the myth aspect of it.

But that they, like, raped the peasants wives or whatever on their wedding days. Like, there might have been one king or a couple, like, aristocratic type people that might have been dickheads and did it, but it wasn't like a thing that happened regularly I was like, oh, yeah, yeah.

So it wasn't a pandemic of rape, right?

There was a lot of raping going.

Well, there was like, yeah, I mean, if you go back long enough, it's all rape.

Yeah.

You know, like, how far do you have to go back in human history? Like, was there any cave people that were like, male feminists? Right.

Just fucking.

It was. They were barbaric. They killed each other. They stole wives. I remember reading this book about Comanche where they're talking about this one Comanche warrior who wanted this other Comanche's wife. So he killed a guy and ate a piece of his heart and then took his wife. Like, that was humans. That's what humans.

I know you had him on, but empire of the summer moon, I'm so excited for that to come out as a. As a series. If he's.

If who's directing? Is that Taylor Sheridan?

Yeah. Sheridan.

And if they do it, Taylor's gonna do it by the book. Yeah, I know Taylor. He'll do it by the book. By the way, he's got a great steakhouse he just opened up in Vegas, the four sixes. Four six steakhouse. I think it's like a pop up right now, but we ate at it last time we were in Vegas. It's fucking great. It's all meat from his ranch. What a cool guy. Cool guy. Got his own ranch, makes a steakhouse, supplies the meat. It's fucking.

He's brilliant. And then he also leases the horses and the livestock and all of that to Paramount.

Oh, that's smart.

Yeah. And his ranch he leases to Paramount, which is brilliant because he is a real cowboy with real cowboys that he and I also love that he casts real cowboys into the subsidiary roles or the supporting roles of he's a cowboy.

At a ranch a friend of mine works at in California.

Oh, really?

Yeah, he like, did real cowboy work.

Oh, that's funny.

Before he ever made a watch on.

A horse, when he's doing all his crazy horse stuff, I mean, it's. It's wild how awesome his horses are that he's trained.

He's a great podcast guest, too. Very interesting guy. Super fucking smarteendeze. And those, those shows that all the Yellowstone shows are fucking incredible. And the new ones are the best ones. Like, if you go to like, from Yellowstone was great. And then there was. 1883 was great.

Yeah.

And then the last one, the 1923, the Harrison Ford one. That's fucking great. They're all great. They just get better. It was the most recent and that's my favorite. That's the one when they were. The family was making a cross.

Yeah. I love. Because it shows how. How it just shows the reality of how hard life was. It was brutal for everyone. For everyone there. Like, God, unbelievable times.

And so accurate, like, so accurate as to how people died and what they. What they dealt with and fuck, man. People falling off wagons, getting run over by the wheels like that kind of shit.

That's why if you've ever played Oregon trail in elementary school or that's what they had when I was in elementary school, and I would always die of syphilis or disentangle. I would never survive dysentery or. What was it? Dysentery and. Or you get killed by Indians or whatever it is. But you look at how statistically unlikely it is that we're all here, right? I got to believe it's for a reason. We got to be here for something, right? We got to be in. And I don't want us to squander.

The very least, if we're not here for something, the very least, we can maximize our time here. You know, one of the things. The reason why this is very important to me is everything I do, I need energy. Everything I do, I need a lot of energy. I need a lot of energy to stand up. I need a lot of energy to do jujitsu. I need a lot of energy to do archery. I need a lot of energy to do podcasts. I need a lot of energy to do UFC shows. If you're weak and tired, you won't be as good at anything you do. Anything you do. And the one thing that you have control over, if you're a person that takes care of your diet and exercise, the one thing that you're going to have control over is, is you will be able to give your vehicle more energy. That's real. If you. If you really do the right things in terms of with your health, you rest accordingly, eat the right foods, take vitamins, work out, plan it all.

That's why people say so often that, like eating healthy, working out, it's expensive. It takes time, but being chronically ill is way more expensive.

Way more expensive.

It takes way more time. And you. You have to choose your hard, but there is no path that's just gonna be a cakewalk.

You don't even need fucking gym. If you have a YouTube account and a laptop, you can watch yoga videos, and you can do them at home. If you get 135 pound Kettlebell, my friend Keith Weber, he's got this extreme Kettlebell cardio series, he's got a bunch of different ones that you could do, but there's a few of them that are online, and I did one the other day. Was fucking brutal. 35 pound kettlebell. It doesn't cost anything to get one of those things. How much is a 35 pound kettlebell? You get it once, you never have to buy another one. And me, after all the years of using kettlebell kettlebells, I still can get a fucking ass kicking workout with 135 pound kettlebell. And if you think you can't follow that YouTube video and try, just give it a try.

Even walking Casey has a stat she'll drop on you. I don't. I don't remember the number, so I won't even attempt. But just walking a few days a week, four days a week, it's insane. The difference in all cause mortality risk and reduction in chronic disease.

Yeah, you gotta move around.

Yeah.

Otherwise your body's feeble. If your body's feeble, it's not gonna be able to handle diseases, not gonna be able to handle injuries. How many people die by falling down because they're older? You know, this is something that Peter Attia talks about quite a lot, is that it's very important for older people to lift weights, you know, not for vanity, but to be able to protect yourself from falling. If you're falling and you're feeble, you can't do anything to stop the fall, you know?

Yeah. After the age. I think it's after the age of 65. One of your greatest risk factors is a fracture. If you fracture a hip or a vertebrae, you have between a 15 and 35% chance of. Of being dead within a year.

Oh, my God.

It's one of the greatest risk factors. And think about it. Cause your body has to recover and rebuild, and you don't have all the health and youth that you had in your earlier years, but surgery. Stay older people's rough muscle and keep bone mineral density and get proactive. And all the things we've talked about. If we start monitoring your bone mineral density in your twenties to your thirties to your forties, we know your family history, you're a petite girl. You're going to experience a decline in bone mineral density. We've got to get ahead of that. One of the things they did that ruined that for so many women was the women's health initiatives, scaring them out of hormone optimization for women. And it terrified women, telling them that it was going to cause cancer and all these things, which ends up being the opposite of what it does. And it did a huge disservice to women that created, indirectly, a rise in osteoporosis and osteopenia. But one of the companies that was funding that was Merck, and Merck sells an osteoporosis drug. They have a blockbuster osteoporosis drug called Fosamax that they printed money on during that timeframe.

Oh, my God.

And so it's hard because they do say, trust the science. And I'm not telling people, don't trust the science. Trust, but verify. Let's keep honest people honest.

But the problem is that science is very difficult to verify, especially science that's given to you by the pharmaceutical drug companies. Because when one of the things was it John Abramson that was telling, who's litigating, investigated these cases against pharmaceutical drug companies? One of the things that he was saying is that he was part of the Vioxx thing, that when you get the peer reviewed data, you don't get access to the data. You get access to the review of the data. So. And you also don't get access to all the studies they did that didn't show a positive. I'm sure you saw that Stephen Crowder thing where he caught that Covid czar guy.

Yes, yes.

When he was talking about video, when he's talking about monkeypox.

Yes.

The monkeypox drug.

That's not that he was intentionally saying that he was being funded to say those things.

Yes.

And mislead the public that they were.

Trying to sell more of those drugs and that the reality is most people aren't gonna get monkeypox. It's like, you have to get it from gay sex. Yeah, sorry.

When it makes total sense, because, again, not to say when you're in it, you think you're doing right. I don't think that people are out there trying to harm humanity. I don't. I really want to hope that's nothing the case. But when I was a drug rep at 22, and you bring in a thought leader from Harvard that tells me all the ways that they're using this brilliant mental health drug off label, and then you put tremendous pressure and give me an expense account and send me out to drinks with a doctor, and I'm sitting there and the doctor's like, where else can I use this drug? You're like, do I tell him what that guy from Harvard told me? Because I also signed a contract that said I wouldn't. But then the company taught me all that and put me in this environment. And it's like a wink, wink, nod, nod. And the pressure is to grow the patient population on a drug. That's why GLP ones went from being for diabetic, obese people to, now let's help people lose weight for spring break.

Real quick, fast, real quick.

And it got accepted fast. And that's what's scary.

And it got called the Kardashian drug, which was brilliant. Cause there's no evidence they took it.

Oh, really?

I don't. I never heard any evidence they took it. Yeah, but it's what you all you heard about. Like, I saw it on Twitter, the Kardashian drug. In the early days of these GlPDe, ozempic and wagovi, they were talking about it, and people were calling it the Kardashian drug, and they were saying, all these women in Hollywood are taking it. I don't even know if they took it, because I know they have trainers, you know, so they might have just worked out. It might be bullshit. Yeah, but everybody's like, oh, they're doing it, those bitches. Like, one of my wife's friends sent her an image of this woman, said, oh, my God, everyone is on ozempic these days. Days. Just because the woman was skinny. It's like, first of all, that lady's always been skinny. You can find pictures of her from 30 years ago. She was skinny. Like, what are you talking about? Everybody wants to like that bitch. She's on it. So. So we don't give anybody misinformation. We interrupted this podcast because Jamie found out at the end of the podcast that one of the Kardashians has her own GLP one daily pill.

It's the latest product capitalized on weight loss drug. This is Kourtney Kardashian, who's the thin. Like, she was always thin, which is odd. So just so people know. But the point was, at the beginning, everyone was calling it the Kardashian drug. Maybe they were right back to the show, but.

And that's what people do with everything, though. They want to think that it's the most eye opening thing. Having got behind the scenes and met you and then met Cam and met Aaron Rodgers and meth, the every person that you have introduced me to works their ass off. The level of dedication and commitment, and their schedules are crazy, and the pressure is crazy, and the stress is crazy, and they have kids and families, and they find a way. Cam's up at, what, three in the morning to go run 30 miles?

He doesn't have to do that anymore because he doesn't have a regular job anymore.

Okay, well, that's good.

Finally, I tried to talk that guy into quitting his job for, like, ten fucking years, from the moment I met him. Like, quit that job, dude, you can make more money doing this. I was, like, trying to convince him. Took forever.

It's inspiring to see, because you can sit on the outside and think, oh, that guy who's on top of the mountain, he didn't. He's lucky. They got lucky. What you don't realize is you didn't see all the steps that it took for that guy to get a girl to get to the top of the mountain.

Cam was running marathons in the morning before work. When he was working eight hour days, he would get up 330 in the morning, run a fucking marathon, and then take three days off of work, take his vacation time, and go run the Moab 240. Run 240 miles through the fucking mountains. That's a regular guy with a regular job. And if you don't get inspired by that and realize there's more in the tank than you think there is, and the people like that, the benefit of people like that is that through their discipline, you can learn that you could do these things, too. You can get inspired by. Not, maybe you can't run the Moab 240, but you will most certainly hold yourself to a higher standard when you know there's someone out there that's really busting their ass and trying to make things happen.

It's motivating. Like Philip Rowe. I know we've become really good friends. Philly, fresh from UFC.

Love that dude.

Dude. Working as a UPS guy, raising two kids, training MMA in his spare time, and, like, trying to get all his work in makes it into the UFC. I mean, that's insane.

How about Deontay Wilder? He was driving for, like, with Budweiser or Coca Cola or something like that. Remember who he was driving for? What was it? Coca Cola? Driving. Delivering trucks at like, 21, starts boxing at 23, wins a bronze medal in the fucking Olympics.

Crazy, crazy.

Budweiser.

Budweiser. Driving it. Delivering Budweiser. Yeah. So guys, just trying to take care of.

The reason I'm saying this is there is hope. People like, we can take care of.

His kid who had medical problems.

That's cool.

He did money to take care of his kid. So he just said, I'll become a pro boxer.

That is so crazy.

Crazy. And then has the gift, this one in a fucking hundred million gift of power that he had. Yeah, it's nuts. But people like that exist to inspire you to do more. And, you know, you could say, fuck her, she's on a zoom. Or maybe she's not. Maybe she's really healthy and she fucking works out every day. Maybe that. Maybe that, too. Maybe instead of going, oh, fuck that, she's on Olympic, good. What she doing? Yeah, what are you doing? And then maybe find out what she's doing. Maybe just realize you could do more yourself, and if you did everything that you could do to make yourself healthy, wouldn't even have the urge to look at someone else and say, oh, she's on ozempic. You wouldn't care.

Yeah, you would not see is people. Momentum creates momentum. And even individuals I know that have taken ozempic, a lot of those people are. They just needed wins on the board and needed to create momentum. And these really obese individuals, when they start seeing there's hope and the weight starts coming off, as crazy as it is, the diet, the lifestyle, the nutrition, all that starts to fall in line more and more, and then they get a win on the board, and now they're the guy who's going to the gym three days a week.

And that's our eyes, too, for some people. For some people. And for Ari, that was the benefit of him. He was really depressed. It was really bad, and I think it had something to do with taking DHT blockers. So he was taking whatever the fuck that stuff is for your hair. What's that stuff called?

Yeah, propecia.

He was taking.

That can really fuck up your horns.

Yeah, some people. And it wrecked him. It wrecked him. It got him very depressed. But the SSRi's helped him get over the hump, and he eventually got off of him. And when his life is doing better, what a shock. He feels better. He's happy. His career is doing great. He's fucking not depressed anymore. Oh, crazy. They're all related. People try to tell you that your life sucking has no bearing on the level of depression that you have. Well, that's crazy. Yeah, that's crazy. Because there are people whose lives are seemingly, on paper, amazing, and they're still depressed. But I guarantee you they probably have their priorities off, and I guarantee you they probably don't exercise. And if they do, it's some rare imbalance that some people do have, I can tell you.

I mean, running businesses, of course, everyone has stress and anxiety. If I didn't do an ice bath or go do muay Thai for if I take a week off, my anxiety is terrible. I mean, I would have almost crippling anxiety. But doing physical activity and doing hard things and doing the ice bath and doing the sauna and going through that method and that process, I mean, it helps me immensely.

100%. You're used to a certain level of adversity, and if you have no adversity, adversity is very difficult to handle. But if you give yourself voluntary adversity that far exceeds anything you're going to experience outside of that, you're way better at handling stuff. If your workouts are so fucking brutal, and I've seen you do muay Thai, it's fucking hard, man. It's hard. It's exhausting. And everything else seems easy, because when you're on, like, round five and it's a five minute round, and you're three and a half minutes in, and he's trying to get you to. He's trying to get you to do a switch kick over and over and over again. Your fucking heart is beating out of your chest. You got to finish the round strong. And when you're done, when that bell goes off, you're like, oh, my God. Like that feeling you don't get. You don't get that in the day.

And you feel so much better. And then after it's over, what's the feeling of.

Of being exhausted, pushing yourself? That struggle is so much more intense than anything you experience other than a life or death confrontation in your day.

Yeah. Just even conquering, going there. Like, there's so many days I'm driving, and I go, why the fuck am I doing?

Let's go to Starbucks, get one of them frappuccinos again.

Go back to my oldest fun, being fat. It was easy. This is not. I don't want to go get the shit beat out of me and work my ass off for an hour. But every time you leave, even, no matter what, I'm like, oh, thank God I did that.

Every time I get out of that stupid ice bath, I feel like that every time I go in, I don't want to do it. I know I'm gonna go in it, because there's two people in my head. There's the general, and there's the pussy. The pussy is like, don't do it. Don't make me do that for three minutes. Don't make me get in there.

Yeah.

And the general's like, shut the fuck up, bitch. You know you're gonna do it, so stop with all these thoughts. Just put. Put the lid up.

That one's one I still, to this day, I do it. I hate it every time. I still have not if there's never a day where I'm like, this is gonna be easy.

That's the good thing, though. That's your win. That's your win of the day that you did that. You need those little wins, just like we're talking about with those empic. You need to get one on the board.

Yeah.

You know? And getting one on the board any way you can, completing a workout, write it down, complete it. You got one on the board. You've got a win for the day. That's real. It seems like it's not, but it's real. That's why the belt system works in martial arts. Right? You get a blue belt. You're like, oh, I got a blue belt. Holy shit. I'm not a white belt anymore. I get a purple belt. It incentivizes you. Human beings are subject to that.

You're nailing it. This is my point with the AI. I want to gamify it, and I want healthcare to be fun.

Yes.

I want people to know that they're challenging their friends. We're rising together. Joe, you're a pussy. You only worked out 30 minutes today. Your Dexa's at this. My overall mortality risk is improving. Isn't like, how do we make it fun? And you can choose what to share. Kind of like what whoop does.

Well, what you do with. With Tim Kennedy and the what is that?

I watch his my zone. I watch what Tim does every day, and I'm like, if I can just get close to what Tim did, I will feel great about myself. So I try to beat his workouts, or Juan from on it gym has his on there, too. And I'll just try and beat those guys workouts on those days.

It's funny because people will say that that's an addictive thing, which is really interesting because one of the things that people talk about with the addictions that people are struggling with today, one of them is fitness apps.

Yeah.

Like, jeez, isn't that, like, the greatest addiction of all time? Like, yeah, you can go off the rails. You can get a little crazy. But isn't it the greatest?

Well, how many, I think in with addicts, they have them. One is finding religion in a higher calling and giving up to a higher power. But the other thing I've seen is because, candidly, a lot of times, they trade addiction and they get really big into crossfit or jiu jitsu. Yeah, or jiu jitsu. It's a healthy addiction. It is it's a better alternative than drowning your sorrows in a bottle.

Well, it's also the same pathways of the mind that lead you to negative addictions leads you to positive addictions. It's just about. It's about channeling that kind of energy into something positive. I am 100% anh addict, but I have figured out a way to be addicted to all things that are really good, that I love. That's the way to try to live your life. It's just try to funnel that, whatever that focus is that leads you to want to shoot heroin. And this is also works the other way, too. And there was a guy that I know that was a world championship caliber pool player and wouldn't drink, wouldn't smoke, just drank water. Super clean and healthy. And he was one of the top pool players in the world, and he was winning tournaments and gambling and winning a lot of money. He was, like, rock solid, this guy was. He was. He would hold down the cash, you know? Like, if you bet on that guy, you had a really good chance of winning. He would win by. He would not choke ever. Yeah, he got in a car accident, and he hurt his back.

And the same thing that got that guy addicted to pool got him addicted to pills. He couldn't stop taking pills. Man, that weird pathway. And my friend Tommy put it this way, he's like the same thing that got him addicted. Called it the same thing, got him addicted to pool, got him addicted to pills. It's like this obsession. So he found this thing that gave him relief from the pain, and then he became obsessed with getting more of them. And then one day died, you know, he died young. Yeah. And this was a guy. You would never have predicted that. And that's what's so insidious about what the Sackler family did. That's what's so insidious about the opioid crisis, is you can get good people, and everybody wants to say, that wouldn't happen to me. I'm too. I'm mentally strong. That's nonsense. I'm telling you. This guy was as mentally strong as you get. Some people just get got. It gets them. Especially if you're in pain. Especially if you're one of those people that doesn't tolerate pain very well. Some people just. I don't know if they feel it different. I think they feel it different.

I think it's the only thing I think just, like, hot sauce tastes different to some folks. I think some people feel pain different. And, you know, one of the reasons I saw this is my mom got an injection in her knee, and she didn't even flinch. They stuck this giant ass needle in my mom's knee and plunged it in there, and she didn't even flinch. And the doctor's like, that's crazy. This fucking 70 year old lady didn't flinch. And I was like, that's where I get it.

Like, pain threshold.

It has to be from. I think it's a genetic thing. Yeah, I think I used to think that it was from being martial arts.

When I owned a toxicology, I was in the toxicology lab and the non abusive stuff after my brother passed from opioids, and I was trying to educate clinicians on that. One of the things I did was hire an expert doctor, Bill Massey. And he came in and he said, on Obama's opioid abuse campaign committee, and was. He was helping guide me on what makes sense and how do we do this? But one of the things he shared with me that was wild was this study that he did for Obama with rhesus monkeys, where they gave one set of rhesus monkeys, basically a cage with metal and no warmth, no interaction with other monkeys. They got water and food, but at erratic times, there was no consistency in that monkey's life. Then they took another subset of rhesus monkeys, where they gave them warmth, shelter, let them stay with their family for the right amount of time till they reached maturity. And what they found is when they introduced drug, heroin and cocaine to these monkeys, disproportionately, the monkeys that were deprived died and od, whereas the monkeys that had that love and affection and warmth and comfort and essential needs met died at a much lower rate.

Most of them actually survived. And he was breaking down that if you grow up in an environment with minimal dopamine response, when you light up that dopamine, maybe it's a boxing match, right? You're a kid who's been poor, and you get in that boxing match, you knock a guy out, you're alive, hooked like, this is it. This is the best I've felt. Everyone's cheering me on. For some people, unfortunately, what they find first is a drug or an alcohol or a substance. But that same person could be the future. Albert Einstein, the future Muhammad Ali, the future, whatever it may be, insert here. They have that ability. It's just, can we give them a shot? Can we buy them the time and get them out? This, because I've seen a lot of people beat drug addiction, but I've unfortunately lost a lot of people to it too.

They did it with rats, too. They did a very similar thing. They did a rat park. And so they had the rats in the cage, and the rats, I think, was heroin that they used. See if you find what the rat part, what the rat park study was. Very similar type study. And they did another study where they had this enormous cage where the rats could run around. They had toys, things for them to do. And they didn't just do drugs until they died. They just went and had a party and lived like normal rats, which is like, just like all mammals, all humans, we have these reward systems that are built into us. Heroin or cocaine. Lace rat. Oh, here it is. Alexander's experience in the seventies had come to be called rat park. Researchers had already proved that when rats were placed in a cage all alone with no other community of rats, and offered two water bottles, one filled with water, the other filled with heroin or cocaine, cats would repetitively drink from the drug laced bottles until they overdosed and died, like pigeons pressing a pleasure lever. They were relentless until their bodies and brains were overcome and they died.

But Alexander wondered, is it about the drug, or it might be related to the setting that they were in? To test his hypothesis, he put in rat parks. Whoops. Fucking pop ups. He put in rat parks where they were among others and free to roam and play, socialize and to have sex. And they were given the same access to two types of drug laced bottles. When inhabiting a rat park, they, remarkably preferred the plain water. Even when they did imbibe from the drug filled bottle, they did so intermittently, not obsessively, and never overdosed. A social community beat the power of drugs, and you got to wonder if that would be the case with human beings. You know, if everyone. I mean, it's not possible right now in the world that we live in. But if everyone had a productive, happy, healthy life and was raised in a positive environment, how much less drug abuse and drug addiction would we have? It's a good question, because if it really is this horrible childhood that is causing a lot of people to seek these things out, but that's not my friend. My friend who got addicted, he wasn't.

It wasn't from abuse like that. He was talking about normal family. Everything was fine. Dealing with pain and back pain is some of the worst pain. It's fucking debilitating. I mean, I've known multiple friends who've had back surgeries when they're in pain. It's just like it takes over everything. Like, I've had knee surgery and you can kind of deal with knee pain. It's like, yeah, it sucks, but it's gonna get better. It'll be okay. But it's not your whole system. It's just your knee. The back feels like your whole being is hurt. It's a particular type of pain that people want relieved from.

My buddy's dad was in the. Has been in the hospital, in and out of the hospital. He's in his eighties now. And he used to go on the elk hunts with us and everything. He was a coach. They had him loaded up on pain meds, and everything was starting to fail. He had been in the hospital for months. They were about to move him to hospice. And my buddy said, we're done. I don't want any more pain meds. And he talked to his dad and he said, dad, can you survive without the pain meds? And he didn't think he could. And he battled, like, feeling terrible, everything. Long story short, he went from. They were gonna put him in hospice. Cause his kidneys and organs and all this were failing to. He drove a car last week, right? He's out of the hospital. He's in his eighties. He's driving his truck again.

Like, I don't know if I wanna be on the road with that guy.

Yeah, but it's all those pain meds were poisoning his brain, his body. Of course, his organs were shutting down because they were just pushing more and more and more, more. And I don't want to be too sinister, but there's a lot of money in keeping somebody in a hospital and billing that insurance company during those timeframes and then moving them over. You know, I stood in surgeries where I watched them do neurosurgeries on people they knew were going to die, but they could bill them $800,000 and collect the insurance payment. And so the hospital is going to do the surgery.

Oh, God, that's such a horrible thing to hear. Do a surgery on someone who you know is going die just to make the money off of it.

It's just because our incentive systems are flawed, like what you were talking about earlier, if dopamine wins, like reward systems. If we build a reward system based off money in numbers and finances, we shouldn't be shocked when we have killer earnings and really bad health outcomes.

It's the same with everything in the human race. Whenever it's incentivized by money, people don't go to what's best for people. They go to what's going to make them the most money. And that's the weird world that we find ourselves in with people defending that because their ideology opposes the opposite. It's nuts. It's a weird, weird, weird fucking time. But listen, brother, I'm glad I met you. I'm glad you're out there. I'm glad you can speak about these things the way you can with so much information. You're so knowledgeable about it and you could pull it up at any moment and it's a daunting task that you have. But I think your message has changed a lot of people's lives. I really do. I think there's a lot of people that recognize that between you and all these other people in the space, Peter, Tia and Andrew Huberman and all these people, Doctor Rhonda Patrick, all these people talking about health and what you can do to improve and studies and all these things that you could do to change the path that you're on. I think it's affected countless lives.

Thank you for giving me a voice. And thank you for having me on here. And also thank you to the US Senate for being brave enough to let us sit there and hammer the US government and critique them for their choices and power, to them for at least having the honesty and integrity to let us have an open yes.

So, yeah, let's hope they keep doing it and this make America healthy again. Ideas. One of the most promising political ideas I've heard in a long time. Because it's all. It's long overdue. Like it was. There was a long time where they were denying that cigarettes caused cancer. They denied it as long as they could and then eventually they couldn't deny it anymore. And I would hope that we would learn our lesson from all these other things they did, all these other things that they used to push and now they realize they're dangerous and they really regret that they did it. And people went along with it. Time has come. Time has come to change the way we approach food and health.

I agree. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Thank you.

My pleasure. Bye, everybody.