Transcript of Episode #113 Guest Appearance with Dr. Daniel Pompa FROM PAIN TO PURPOSE Show! New

Hi, I'm Dr. Justin Marchegiani. Every movement your body makes depends on energy at the cellular level. Many people think resilience, strength, and performance come from discipline or training alone, but that is simply not the case. They rest on a deeper biological foundation, your cellular energy system. At the center of that system are your mitochondria, the powerhouse of your cells. Every step you take, every weight you lift, and every muscle contraction depends on mitochondrial energy. Muscle cells are especially energy demanding and contain thousands of mitochondria. Without energy, muscle simply cannot perform. And that's why I recommend Timeline's Mitopure, a supplement containing urolithin A, which supports the cellular process mitophagy. Mitophagy helps the body remove damaged mitochondria and support healthier function. Mitopure may support cellular energy, muscle strength, recovery, and healthy aging, which are the keys to supporting mitochondrial health. Timeline's Mitopure is now available at a new lower price of only $79, but you have to visit timeline.com/dylanjameli. That's timeline.com/dylanjameli to save today. People always say, oh, you overcame this, overcame that. I caused it. I am an accountable person. I made myself into that situation and into that person. So there's one person to blame.

I had dyslexia as a kid, probably mostly for myself, because when you compare yourself to other kids and you can't read and you're in 7th grade, you're stupid in my mind. At that age, I didn't know that I had other superpowers because of the dyslexia.

I had a lot of money, a nice house, a beautiful wife, every car, and every night I'd go to bed, I'd look at her and I'd look around me and I'd be like, why I feel good? Like, why do I feel bad?

People focus on the love part of God, but they also forget his judgment. He's both.

Every single human, I don't care how glorious they make themselves look, I don't care how much money they have, I don't care, they all have issues.

Every hard thing that happened to me, I needed to happen. God is that good. Maximize your performance in every way. Peptides, SARMS, Exercise, nutrition, life in general. My next guest is going to bring it. Boy, you're going to get a lot out of this show. But I want to welcome Dylan Gummily.

Thanks, man. I appreciate you having me.

Absolutely. I can't wait for this conversation because I use peptides, I use SARMs, but one of the things I always say is, look, they're not all healthy. So we're going to talk about that, and maybe we even have some disagreements on which ones we think are healthier. I can't wait. No, my guests have been asking for more information on that topic, and so I'm really excited to bring that. You know a lot about hormones. Hormones. You know a lot about a lot of things because pain to purpose. That's right. Has been your life. And I can't wait to hear where it all started. You spent time in jail. I mean, all these amazing things. That's what makes people better. Every great person in the Bible spent time— I mean, it's crazy. And sometimes it's just mental jail, like David as he ran from Saul. But, you know, The fact is, is that, um, that's where your whole life changed. So I want to start there.

Yeah.

Yeah. I want to start there, man, because, and if you, if you want to go back even before that to set that up, you knock at it.

I love it. I like to talk about it, but let me just say this before I do that, because I, people always say, oh, you overcame this, overcame that. I caused it. I am an accountable person. I made myself into that situation and into that person. So yeah, I did overcome it, but I also, I caused it.

Yeah.

So there's one person to blame.

Yeah, that is, and that's true. You know, I wanna say this at the top of the show, reason why I don't want people to tune out. Part of your story was also an eating disorder.

Yeah.

And that is such hush-hush. People don't talk about it. When do you talk about that? When do you see that on social media?

Don't.

You're gonna talk about that, come clean on that today as well. So just setting people up because so many people are gonna wanna share this show. Yeah. Um, because to your point, you caused that too. Absolutely. Right. You know, and, and I don't say that in a bad way, but that is that taking responsibility. So I love that you started with that. Oh yeah.

No, I, I want to always be accountable first and foremost. It's a lost art anymore. And so it's just, it really bothers me. I'm, I'm, I'm not old, but I'm old school how I was raised. And so, all right, so you're not old.

How old are you?

43.

Oh yeah, you're not old. I'm 60. I guess I'm old. I don't know. Dang.

Yeah.

You know what though? I was on the, I was on a call. She's my prayer warrior in our, in our business, in our life. This woman's been a part of our life for many years. We call her our Black Grandma because she is. And, um, but she's our prayer warrior. We call her CPO, or, you know, Chief Prayer Officer.

I love that.

And, um, and she's 95, bro. Still no glasses, really, and still traveling around praying for people. Anyways, she said to me, she was like, Dr. Momo, you're 60 years old, you're in the prime of your life. Now, to her, that is true because she's thinking back 60 years, you know. But most people, 60 years, if the average age is 74, crap, prime of your life, you have 15 years left. You're almost— no, that's why you need to pay attention to this show.

That's right.

Okay, anyways, guys, sorry, I just had—

no, yeah, and then everything, my whole premise on how I operate is God first. And that's when my life really changed, when I went that route. But there's a trajectory there. So I was actually, you know, I'm a four-sport athlete in high school, and my whole life was sports. What's that?

First sport?

Four-sport athlete.

Four-sport athlete? Yeah, all blended together. Yeah, four sport.

So I played basketball, football, tennis, and baseball in school all through. Now, as you get to the end, you have to kind of condense that. It's too much.

Yeah, I was gonna say that.

So I went basketball. I played college basketball, and that's kind of where this started. So I got hurt twice, um, two different schools, two different scholarships, gone. And my mom wanted me to do modeling and acting. Now, for me, it was a little too feminine. I didn't want to do it, but I started to look into it, and I said, oh, women, money, like the, the way that they're dressing, because I did love fashion. And so I went ahead and did this audition, and they picked me. Like, they pick all kinds of people, and they take your money and train you for 6 months and then take you to this big competition. It's called IMTA. And then they, you know, they flood you with, oh, all of these famous people came through here. Well, at the time, I was partying heavy, and I was more concerned about that. So I really kind of blew off a lot of the training, didn't I'm gonna take it serious. Paid all this money. Once again, my parents charged everything to pay for it. And I got out there and there's 20, 30,000 people in this place, in this big auditorium.

And I'm going, what the hell am I doing here, man? I decided I'm gonna go all out, take this serious. Well, I ended up getting 4th place out of like 15, 20,000 people in my whole— it was called 4th Runner-Up.

So what, what do you think was it that caused you to take 4th place? 'Cause there was all these personalities and, uh, good-looking people, I'm sure. What, what, What was it? What made you stand out in your mind now?

In my mind back then, it's because I just thought I was so great and so, so good looking. Now I think it was, I think I was a little like charismatic and kind of things that have carried me with my show. And I, to decipher, you know, when you got a lot of people that are good looking, how do you decipher and distinguish? I think a lot of it's your character and how you present yourself. And you know, I, the reason I didn't get higher, I was told, is because I was too old because I was 24. And they were looking for people younger. I got a contract to go to Milan, which is like going from high school to the NBA. Well, I get out there and you're like around 250 of the best male models in the world. And I think I'm hot shit going out there and, you know, and just thought I was so great. And you quickly realize when you're out there that A, you're not, and B, you know, this lifestyle is not what you think. So here's my schedule. Attempt to get up early because you've been partying the whole night before, but do your best.

Get ready, get on the subway or the bus to get to your agency, get your call sheet, get around to maybe 3 or 4 auditions throughout an entire day, go back home, go to the gym, and then go party. And then the weekends, it's just minus the getting up and going to the agency, you know, so you got to sleep all day so you can party again. You don't pay for drinks when you're a model there. They know the models, you don't pay. They want you in there.

I tell you what, the, the addiction is all over that, right? I, I just recently interviewed Elle McPherson. These people my age, she was like, oh, McPherson. And I tell my kids, no, McPherson, who? Anyway, but she was an amazing interview. Her book is fabulous, by the way. You have to read it. But part of what we talked about is her addiction and got into alcohol, you know, and it was the scene that you just described.

Yeah.

And she was in New York and I mean, it was heyday fun. She talked about the Palladium. I was like, these were clubs that I knew back in the day. So that was a fun conversation. But anyways, yeah, to your point, that lifestyle leads to nothing but bad.

And you know what, man? Like, you do get addicted sometimes to the alcohol and the drugs, but you get addicted to the life.

Yeah.

You get addicted to the attention, who you feel like everybody around you is making you to be. Right. I was more addicted to that than the drugs or the alcohol or that. Yeah, there's You know, I never had a drug problem. I had a money problem and an addiction to like what people thought about me was my real problem.

Okay. So that, I mean, I, it sounds like we almost wanna go into this now because that led you most likely, I don't wanna put words in your mouth, your eating disorder, body morphism because of the pressure. I mean, is that how you ended up there? No.

No, it started way young and that, that's why I got into studying nutrition. So when I was really young, I, I wasn't like, I, I, you say obese, like people say we lost a bunch of weight. I was over overweight.

Okay.

You know, I was always around like the most popular kids, but you, you know, in the back of your head, if somebody wants ammo on you or whatever, they immediately, they're gonna be like, oh, you're fat. You know? And it was like, I'm friends with all of the like good looking or popular girls, but could never date any of 'em. 'Cause I, you know, and it got to me to the point where I'm playing all these sports, I'm overweight. So God bless my mom. I'm an only child, but she'd give me anything I wanted. Italian mom. So I ate crap all the time.

Italian family.

Yeah. You know? And so it got to the point where from 7th to 8th grade, I played tackle football and hit this growth spurt, like 5'8" to almost 6'1". So I lost like 25, 30 pounds. And then I went back to school the next year and it was like the whole world opened up for me. Yeah. Yeah. So beyond it making me better at sports, it got me way more attention, like with girls and everything I wanted, you know? And anyway, Eventually people were saying, oh, he's doing this, he's doing drugs, he's has, he's anorexic. I don't even know what half this crap means.

Yeah.

Well, it got back to my mom and dad, so then they start quizzing me and I'm sitting there going, I don't know what the hell, what just happened here. I don't even know what anorexia is. I don't know what some of these drugs are you're talking about. And it got to my head because of that. Then I started to get terrified. Well, what happens if I gain the weight back? Well, here's what I can do to keep it off. That's when I got the eating disorder, cuz then I started looking at myself in the mirror and I'd gain a pound. I didn't even look at that stuff. I didn't even care. All of this noise led me to develop this fear. I don't ever wanna feel that again.

I get that.

You know, don't want to go back to this again. Yeah. That's when the, the bulimia started. Like, well, I'm gonna just throw this up if, if, if it, if I feel like it's bad.

You know what that all that is, is identity issues, meaning that you had a false identity. We all have false identities because of things that people say about us. Yeah, a lot of people who care, some of these brothers, sisters, mothers, fathers, right? And let coaches, etc., or the random people, you know, if you start to get called fat, that identity takes you on and then it affects you.

It does.

And the fear of going back there is scary.

Yeah, yeah, you just don't want to feel it again because it's so painful. Yeah, and So that's when I started to read food nutrition labels though, at the same time. Now granted, and how old were we at that point? 11.

Okay.

But you know, the, the reading and interpretation of the labels was totally misguided because it was low-fat craze time.

I was just gonna say that I, I was doing the math in my head. Yeah, it was low-fat diets were all the rage, right? It's, yeah, like labels, low-fat, low-fat, low. You still see that honestly, but you know, It was the gluten-free of the day, dude. Mm-hmm.

So that's this. I feel like I'm such a mess because that developed the fear of fat that I dealt with until a year and a half ago that I finally beat that.

Yeah.

It took me 30 years.

I bet you so many viewers, especially my age, age, the sixties, you were, we're right there.

Right.

Um, still fear fat because of that day. Right. Like fat makes you fat.

Right.

I can't tell you how many things I've done. Fat doesn't make you fat. It's the inability to burn it. Duh. It's not as simple as you think. Right.

Anyway.

Yeah.

I'm gonna blow your mind in a little bit.

What I'll tell you.

But so we, we, I was at that level at that stage where my parents and especially my dad, cuz my dad was a hardcore sports guy and he was just, it, he wasn't sitting well.

That's the 4 sports.

Yeah. It was not sitting well with him that I was doing this and they didn't know how to handle it. He basically said, so hold on, back up.

So. Bulimia. Yeah. Okay. How did— usually people hide that very well.

I was trying.

Okay. But your father knew.

They both— my mom and dad.

Okay. All right. And how did they know, do you think?

I don't— I didn't hide it well, probably.

Yeah.

You know, there were— not cleaning it up well, disappearing after every time I ate. Okay.

You know, so they were privy enough to— yeah.

And other parents had mentioned it when I was at their house. And so he said, listen, you're either gonna weigh 150 pounds— and I had dropped to like 130-something at 6'1"— is very, very small.

That's true. Yeah.

You're either going to weigh 150 pounds by the time basketball starts or you're not playing. And he was dead serious. And I was like, okay, there's nothing more important to me than playing basketball. So that helped me get past it at that point. And it's, you know, at that point in time, it was like I really had kind of overcome it, but I was still looking at myself like You know, disparagingly for a little bit, but I went a good 4 or 5 years without it really overtaking me. And then when I got into the modeling and stuff, here it came, here it came back again. But, um, it was a nonstop thing then from there on out. And it wasn't even really the bulimia, it was more like, I'm not gonna eat as much. It transitioned. That's still been a part of it. And that's once I started to get in trouble and knew I was going to prison, that's when it kind of was like, I don't care. Yeah, I'm just gonna go back to it.

Wait, that'll bait people in right there.

Prison?

What, what does he mean? But I don't, let's not leave the conversation yet because what do you think the main causative factors of bulimia? How does somebody, I mean, your story's your story, but what do you think it is for most people? Is there, is there a common thread is what I'm asking?

Well, for what I would say, the difference between the anorexia and the bulimia is you're starving yourself as opposed to eating a lot and making yourself throw up.

Mm-hmm.

I think that people that, A, are addicted to food, uh, whether it be chocolates, candies, ice cream, whatever. It's an easy way to get it out. You know, you can do it and get rid of it. Or the people that can't, they just can't starve themselves. They just can't do that route because it's too difficult. Well, I'll just, I'll throw up some of it. I know.

So that's the, you're saying that's the difference between probably the same route, but that little nuance determines the bulimic versus the anorexic? I think so. Yeah, I think so.

Yeah. I mean, it's, I can't, I don't want to speak for others, but I can speak from people people that have— I've talked to.

Yeah. And you're more aware of this than I am, so, you know, you're more the expert here. But I would think that that would be the case.

Yeah.

So when we talk about the root of these, what do you think some of the common roots are to developing that? Yeah. Yeah.

I think that you— well, one is misguided information about the food you're eating, i.e., the low-fat diet. I mean, that alone put the fear into me. Anytime I had anything that I saw was more than 3 or 4 grams of fat, I was like, man, I just ate that, I got to get that out.

And people do the same thing with calories. Yeah. It's like, oh my gosh, I, I'm, you know, calorie, calorie, calorie. You know, that's why I, I believe that calorie counting, fat counting, all that can lead to an addiction that be—

can be end up in a, a bulimia or anorexia if you become too obsessive with the numbers. See, for me, the numbers now are, man, I'm not hitting these. I need to hit 'em so I can be— keep my weight and be healthy.

Is there a certain personality predisposed to that?

Type A, da da da, you know, I think Type A is very, very much, uh, it's predisposed to a lot of things, really.

Do you think it's— there's any wounds early on in childhood that predispose people? I think so, you know, meaning they end up with a body morphism or, you know, and then that brings that attention.

Yeah, happened to me. Yeah, you know, I think it could happen to a lot of people. I— one of the things that I've been learning because I've been studying the neuro side, because I was just a fitness and then a cardiology guy and a cellular guy, but I wasn't taking the account of the neuro side and the importance of like I'm, I'm in school for neuroscience now and because I'm connecting the mind and the body together and I'm realizing that there's so many aspects of our health that really are here and they're not even here.

Yeah. That, that's why I'm digging. Right. Because I, I think there's a lot of entry points, meaning causes. Right. And, you know, I mean, I wonder if, you know, any childhood trauma can, you know, end up there because of control.

Yes.

You know, I, I think of like the bizarreness of something like S&M, or, you know, this like, like how would someone get— they, they say— I know nothing about this— they say it's a control thing and they feel like they got abused and then they can control this, right? So I wonder if there's something, any type of trauma that can happen as a child, and then, hey, I can control this aspect of my life because I feel like there's out of control. Yeah.

You know, you know, a lot of that came to me and I was told, you, you need to be in control, you need to be in control. And then I was made to feel that way. But for me personally, that never— that was not it. I mean, I'll admit all day what I was doing and what was there. It wasn't a control thing, it was a fear. It was a damn fear.

Yeah, yeah. So I think it could be both.

Yeah, yeah, it can. Yeah, I think that people will— they, you know how it is, if they— if it's for one person, they try to antiquate that to every single person. Mine, I was convinced it was a control thing till I finally came to the realization, you're just scared. You're just scared.

And I get that because I, I have a great fear of going back to my illness, right? To the point where I have an abnormal fear of water, mold, you know, I mean toxins in general, right? Yeah. You know, it drives me to be better. It, it keeps me very on board, but there was a time where it can be too much. Yes.

And that fear can control you. Mm-hmm. That's where you lose control.

Yeah.

So I can see where you might say you need to gain control back because you've lost it. But I know for me personally, I'm not a control guy. I mean, I like to be in, I like to do my own work and everything and be the one that's accountable, but I'm not a like, yeah, I gotta be in control.

And then that links to a false identity.

Yes.

Right. You know, meaning, you know, how you look now depends on whether you are worth something, right? It's like identity, our true identity, meaning who God created us to be. There's no, you know, you have worth. Because you know where you're, you know, who you are, right? Who God created you to be. When you believe or get put on false identities, you don't know your worth. You think your worth is in this or the sport or— and so that leads to a lot of these fears.

You just made me realize something at this moment right now that I didn't put together till we started talking. And this is why, this is why God works this way. So you come to the realization. You know what? My hunger that got me in so much trouble for wanting to be the hotshot at everything I did, to spend all this money and blow all this money and do everything, was because of that. Because I, I felt like I didn't have it. And that's why I became that person that got in trouble and went to prison. I never put that together till right now.

Yeah, that's awesome, man. No, but you know, I, I can tell you that every— I have a thing, right? It's when you look at someone's level of success, not just financially, and 12 pillars of success and everything, health, blah, blah, blah, and happiness, it is proportional to how they're literally walk— how close they're walking to their true identity. And I always say that, man, I'm every year I get closer, right? Because I'm intentional about that. Meaning every year I get closer to walking to, you know, really functioning in who God created me to be. But that is a level up. I don't know that anyone's 100% there, right? You know, we're all still— I had dyslexia as a kid, and, um, I was labeled stupid, probably mostly from myself, because when you compare yourself to other kids and you can't read and you're in 7th grade, yeah, you're stupid, right? You know, in my mind, I, at that age, I didn't know that I had other superpowers because of the dyslexia, that I could read, you know, when I did learn to read, I could remember everything. It's like, I thought everyone could do that, right?

But anyways, but it led to— I always say every bad behavior I had later came out of my insecurity from that false identity, the fear of being— looking stupid, right? The fear, the fear of thinking I was stupid, the fear of going back. You know, that was— even if I read something aloud today, I'll get a pit in my stomach, and it's because it anchors back to that fear.

Yeah.

Anyways, yeah, so we have to look at those false identities, and then we— it really explains all the bad choices in our life.

Yeah. And that was probably why I've always been so worried about, well, I got to show this, I got to have this, I got to, I got to do this so that it gets the attention.

That's why you became in the modeling industry.

That's it.

I mean, honestly, it's why you became in the fitness industry. That's why. I mean, everything, you know, it's pain to purpose, man. It's like it gave you purpose. It wasn't a bad thing. It's like it ultimately leads you to purpose, especially when you pull God into the mix.

Well, I had to. And this is why I talk about the prison. I don't encourage people to go to prison to learn.

And yeah, but how did you get— Yeah, right. But it can have that positive effect.

Yeah.

How did you end up there? Tell us.

So when I was modeling, like I said, I realized, okay, this is not the life unless you have— unless you're like in the top 1, 2%, you're not going to make the proper money to live the lifestyle. So I quickly realized that was not me and I was spending 3 and 4 times what I was making. Charging stuff and, you know, doing whatever I could to get the money. Well, then I was like, okay, we gotta figure something out here. I came back and I started acting and I was getting, man, I was getting Days of Our Lives auditions, daytime soap opera auditions. And I was like, okay, we gotta, we gotta roll here. So, you know, I was doing cocaine and stuff on the side, nothing crazy, just at night. But then I was seeing, I'm very observant, right? And I've hustled my whole life. And I said, okay, I can make a ton of money real fast. And not only can I pay off everything I put myself in debt in, but I'm gonna be able to roll. And I rolled for several years. And I mean, I was making millions of dollars a year and it just was gone.

Mm-hmm.

I was, you know, I was hotshotting everything, buying everybody's drinks, buying cars, and still living in an apartment. Yeah. You know, with nothing, just wasting it all. Anyway, there's no longevity in that career. Yeah. Clearly. I ended up getting caught. I got a 15-year prison sentence when I was 27.

For the cocaine?

For the cocaine. Yes. Now, by the time—

Were you selling it?

Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Okay.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah. I was going to say 15 years for you, so.

Okay. No, 15 years is a large amount.

Yeah. Yeah.

I— that story's— that was documentary story stuff because that is like out of a movie. The depths of what I got into. I don't want to get into all that today, but it's scary.

But the cocaine was almost necessary for the life you were living.

Yeah.

Meaning there's no way you'd have energy to do this, to do that, still party, get up the next day, you know. I mean, it's like, that's why people get addicted to it. Well, it allows them the life that they're living.

And I clearly lost some of the eating disorder at that point because I never gained a pound because I didn't eat for 2 and 3 days at a time. So I could get away with eating whatever I wanted one day to catch up. Never, never even touched me. Not a healthy way to lose weight. Yeah. Um, but So my parents drained every credit card they had to pay for the best attorney. And you know, you don't understand at the time financially what you're doing. And I do now 'cause I, I, I'm, I'm my master's degree in finance. Mm-hmm. Um, so that's funny.

That's just kind of funny, right? Yeah. Yeah. Disaster financially. Master's degree in finance.

Yeah, exact. It's just, it, it all correlates.

Mm-hmm.

So I got a sweetheart deal. Which they give you a suspended sentence because I had no prior record. So what it means is I was convicted of a 15-year sentence suspended, and they can give you that sentence back if you violate your probation. 2 years probation. I violated the probation in the first month.

Oh God. Yeah.

I left the state without permission. They, they said, okay, we're gonna give you another break.

Mm-hmm.

Here's 2 weeks in jail. So 15 days I was in jail. You'd think that would've scared me and woke me up. Well, I did very well for about a year. I left literally one day to go to freaking Dairy Queen, came back home, was this close to home. I saw a cop tailing me the whole way home. Pulled me over right at front of my house.

Huh.

I wasn't doing anything.

He said, but you weren't supposed to leave.

Well, no, I could leave.

Oh.

But the problem was I had a little switchblade knife that I carried in my— that I bought at a, like, a swap meet. It wouldn't harm a fly. It was so dull.

So why was he following you?

He ran my plates and saw, you know, what I had— a very tinted out, very, very, very, you know, expensive car that I kept. Yeah. Didn't look good in Des Moines, Iowa. And so he ran my plates, probably saw my record.

Cause that too.

Cause that too.

We were driving that car.

Literally went to go get a small ice cream cone because I was smoking pot and I was hungry and left. Okay. Followed me home, said, I'm going to search your car. I said, for what? And I said no. And he said, I'm searching your car anyway, you know, and I can't record that at the time or whatever. And if you even get interaction with a police officer, you're in trouble. Well, then that knife was in there. It was a $25 switchblade.

Oh, geez.

But I can't carry that. So took me to jail.

But how could they prove, I mean, anyone could have left it in your car. They, I think they'd have to find it on your person.

No, it would, it's just in your possession, in your car. It doesn't matter. Oh, took me to jail. Then they kept me there, wouldn't let me out till I went to court, which was like 30-some days. And they worked out a deal. I was supposed to get time served, let me go. Well, the judge said no, didn't take the thing. He said, you don't get it. You're gonna stay in here.

He was right.

Yeah. I didn't get it. You're staying in here 3 more months and you're gonna get 2 more years probation. And at that point I was like, I don't care anymore. So when I got out, I got my ass on a plane, went to California, went up north, and I met with some people up there that ran weed farms and I started to like go back to what I was doing before.

My gosh. This is after 3 months in jail. Yeah. Yeah. And you just came back out and 6 months later I got caught. And by the way, this is, I'm like, sitting here going, but that's the norm. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

6 months later, I got in trouble with something petty again. Pulled over, interaction with the cop. That's it. They said, okay, you're done. You don't get it. And I, mind you, I'm chained up. Chains here and here. Chains on my legs. Walking in this courtroom, my mom and dad seeing me that way. Walking down a tunnel to get there and been given a 15-year prison sentence. 28 years old. Creatine, one of the most proven and studied compounds in existence, yet still one of the most confusing. Most people think creatine is only for muscle, but creatine is for energy, not caffeine-type energy, actual cellular energy, the kind that your body uses for strength, focus, and recovery. If your workouts feel flat, if your brain feels slower than it used to, and if your recovery is not where it should be, there's a high probability your energy system isn't supported, and creatine will help fix that. It essentially gives your body a reserve, so when your demand spikes, You don't crash. But here's where most people mess this up. They grab the cheapest creatine they can find and assume it's all the same, but it's not. If it doesn't dissolve well, if it's not supported by the right cofactors, and if your body can't actually use it efficiently, you're wasting your time and money.

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did you have any thought at that point? It's me. I have to change.

No, no. I'll tell you when it hit me. I'll explain that to you. So in Iowa, the laws are different. So your 15 years gets cut in half immediately because you get a day and a half for every day you're in there. So it was 7 and a half. Now, I got— I thought I was cursed with a mandatory minimum, meaning you have to serve this before you can see the parole board. That saved me. That got me out really early.

So what was that number that you had?

So it was supposed to be a third of your sentence, but that got cut in half. So after 18 months, I was able to see the parole board, and I'll explain how that saved me. So when I was in there, I got— you go from jail, which is horrible because you never get to go outside, to this holding facility. Well, guess what? They tell you you're in 20 hours. A day and you get 1 hour out, which was a complete lie. You got 30 minutes out. So I was in a cell with one other guy with nothing but a toilet and like, I don't even know, maybe 50 square feet on a mat this thick. And all you could do was lay on your back and stare at the ceiling all day and do nothing. The only books in there to read were from 1880 to 1905. So I read a book on Christopher Columbus that looked like my great-great-grandmother wrote it.

There's 5 pages missing for toilet paper. Yeah.

Well, here you could only shower 3 days a week and it was 5 minutes and they were yelling at you to get out and get back in your bunk. You ate at 6:30 in the morning, 10:30 and 3:00, and that was it. And you don't even want to know what I was given to eat.

Yeah.

So from there I went to the second facility and that was a little more open. You got to go outside once, once a day for 30 minutes and walk in this little circle with all these chains around you.

And oddly, that was probably like, wow, this is great. Yeah.

Great. Then I went to the regular prison. The first day I get in there— and mind you, I haven't talked to my mom for 3 weeks because they won't let you talk— the first thing I see when I go outside is a guy with a big swastika tattooed on his chest. And I'm going, uh, what the hell? Like, what is going on here? Thankfully, I went out to the basketball court. All I had were steel-toe boots, pair of jeans, and a pair of shirt. That's all you get when you first get in there. And I walked out on the basketball court and played in that, and ripped, ripped it up, and that got me respect like this. So thankfully that happened. Well, within 2 weeks I got sent to a minimum facility, and then the time really started. And 18 months later, because the counselor saw me every morning at 4 in the morning, I was outside, and they gave you a little area to go work out. I— 20 degrees below, rain, thunder, lightning, I was outside. Never missed one day in 18 The counselor went to bat for me. My mom happened to know somebody that worked with the parole board.

They ended up getting me out after my, my 18 months. I had 5 years parole. My parents had moved to Maui. 4th of July, 2011, I got out, went to Maui, and that's when I started my life over. And when I was in there, I had this call with my mom and I was telling her, that's so bad. It's this, this, and I did that all the time. And she goes, Dylan, you do this every day. And she said, do you ever think about the people that are worried about you, that invested all this time and all this effort and all this belief in you? Did you ever think about how that's affecting them? And I get chills when I talk about this. I sat there and I started to cry and I had to be careful because there's, you know, people walking around. I didn't want them to see me crying and I didn't know what to say. And she said, were me and your dad really that bad of parents? And I broke. I broke. Then it hit me right then at that moment. I remember where I was sitting. I remember the month.

I remember the year. I'll never forget it. And that, that moment, that time is when I said, okay, something's got to give. Something's got to give. I was reading my Bible every day and I was praying every day, but still not where I needed to be. I was trying.

Yeah.

But I realize now, you know, the effort was there. And I think that was the most important thing.

I was— God's word, man.

Yeah.

You start reading it, it's going to affect anyone.

Absolutely. I was raised Catholic, went through everything.

I was raised Catholic and ended up an agnostic. Really? Yeah, that's true. Yeah, because it was— I thought it was dos and don'ts, and I'm not going to do that. Yeah. And I got into an argument with someone about Christianity, religion, all of it, and he finally said, you never even read it, so you really are making— you don't even know what you're talking about. And so I decided to read, start reading it, and I asked someone where to start. They said the Book of John and go through. And I didn't even get— I was probably you know, half hour into this. And I was like, no one ever told me this. It has nothing to do with about being good enough. It has everything to do with just that we can't.

Yeah.

And it's the blood of Christ. I was floored. That led to my salvation anyway.

Oh, we're gonna get into that. Yeah. That's a great conversation. Yeah. When I got out, I went on this approach of, okay, what am I gonna do now? And how am I gonna fit? Because in, in there, I, I didn't have a set plan. I just knew you're gonna have to depend on yourself. Now you have two felonies. No one's gonna give you the time of day. So it's really up to you. Are you gonna come back here like everybody else? Are you gonna get some crap job that you weren't meant to do and not serve your purpose? Or are you gonna just figure this out? So eventually I got a job, which was very difficult, but you have to. And at night, every night, I, I started to study like exercise science, physiology, the body, um, everything to do with health and fitness. I was getting these emails about testosterone boosters and all this stuff. And I got so fascinated because I studied steroids a little bit because of baseball, because I was so fascinated. So in my 20s—

Pete Rose? Yes.

Well, I started to look into it but never really, you know, I was too busy doing what I was doing. Well, now I got into it and I got into these bodybuilding forums and I was learning. That's where I discovered—

you started taking steroids?

Not that— not yet. Yeah, I was learning about—

yeah, yeah.

And so I was in these forums and I got—

see, again, pointing to the body morphism. Yes, right. It never ends. Yeah, it never ends. Never next thing, next thing.

This, these guys found me that ran a big supplement company and they were seeing like how much I was posting, helping people, doing all this at night. They said, look, do you have any kind of personality or whatever on camera? That's what I did when I was partying and everything at night when I, when I'd get home late and I was using drugs, I would film this stuff for YouTube that was like new cuz I was obsessed with the sports debate show. So I was making my own stuff and putting it up there. Nobody saw it really. I said, I got some stuff, and I sent it to them. They were like, okay, you got the personality. Here's what we're going to do. We want you to get online, start talking about steroids, and we're going to introduce you to this underground stuff. It was called peptides and SARMs. And I said, hey man, wait, what year was this? 2012.

Yeah, that's way, way— yeah, yeah.

I said, I don't know anything about peptides and SARMs, and I'm still in the beginning phases of my real steroid knowledge. I said, I'm kind of BSing my way through a lot of the stuff you see. We don't care. We're gonna make you huge. We're gonna make you huge. And I said, okay, let me make sure this is legal for me to talk about. I just got outta trouble so I can, you can smart.

Yeah. One step smarter.

That's right. You can talk about it. I'm not selling it. You could talk about it. There were very, very, very, very few people on YouTube talking about any of this.

Oh yeah. Back then.

Oh my gosh.

Yeah.

I had 2 million subscribers in 2 years on YouTube.

Yeah, I believe it. Yeah. Talking about it, people, cuz people are always looking for an edge. Oh yeah. If this is healthier than steroids easier to get, people are going to flow to it.

Here's what happens. A very, very— like, the worst, most toxic environment is the bodybuilding and supplement-like industry.

Dude, it's so toxic. It, it's all very wounded people. It's bad, you know, it really is. And again, body morphism like at its max.

It's so bad. Well, then I became known as the SARMs guy because what I found was—

we better stop and explain what SARMs are. I would say most people understand peptides. Yeah, we'll still give that a little bit definition, but, but explain what a SARM is, cuz most people don't know that.

Yeah.

So I mean, I, there's a few SARMs that I think are actually healthy. There's some that are really bad because they hit your hormones hard. They're bad. Yeah. There's good and bad, but what is a SARM?

So selective androgen receptor modulator is what it stands for.

Yeah.

In simple terms, in the bodybuilding world, it's an alternative to steroids.

Yeah.

Because it's steroid-like benefits without the side effects.

Right.

So here's where the, here's where the good and the bad comes in. The good, I, well, I, I don't even wanna say the good, the good for me at the time. I finally tried prohormones first, which is basically a designer steroid. All that was, was a legal way to buy steroids and a few modifications that were actually worse for you than steroids. Yeah. And then they banned prohormones, like the government always bans everything, right? So the SARMs come into play. I use them and I'm like, whoa, okay, I just got all of these results.

You were probably using LDG.

I was using M— there were only 3 at the time you could get.

Okay.

MK-2866, which is known as Ostarine.

Yeah.

S-4 Andarine and MK-677 were the only 3 at the time that you could get.

MK-677 is the healthier one.

Well, it's not even a SARM.

Yeah.

It's old as SARMs. Basically it's the next closest thing to HGH you could Mk-677. It's a secretagogue, and it's really a peptide kind of thing more than a SARM.

Yeah, yeah. The other Mk is— it works— it's more—

works as it's a straight SARM. The thing was is the Mk-677 was like $350, $400 a bottle. Nobody used it, and nobody knew how to use it.

Yeah.

So really it was those two. So I ran those, and I was like, okay, I was so shredded. Yeah, like diced. And, uh, I remember laying there and my wife, who was my girlfriend at the time, took this picture of me laying on the bed. And I looked at the picture and my stomach— I had never seen anything like that. And so I was like, I'm on to something. So I became known as the SARMs guy because I started talking and discussing and learning and everything that you could read, I read. Well, there's a twofold problem there. One, everybody thought I was trying to sell them all the time, so I was getting hate that way. Two, the steroid guys hated it because I was going against the grain on everything. And who knows how much money I was costing them for whatever illegal stuff they were selling, and I was cutting into supplement companies for people going towards the SARMs route. So that got me a ton of hate. Anyway, they banned the prohormones. So then what happened? Well, two things. This is where SARMs got the bad name. One, people had millions of dollars of prohormone powders they couldn't sell anymore.

So what did they do? They had to sell those powders. Well, there was two things that happened. One, companies started to make SARMs and sell them as supplements, which you could not do. Two, they were selling What you, they said were SARMS and filling them with their prohormone powders. And so when people were getting hurt really badly and all of these terrible blood panels started coming out, it made me look dumb because I'm sitting here going, well, they're not as liver toxic. They're not this, they're not that. They were filling them with prohormone powders. So you were taking steroids thinking you were taking SARMS. So that was the two-prong approach.

Yeah, because I mean, again, SARMS, there's some bad ones, but it is definitely a different category than the prohormones. Yeah.

Well, and now, so they evolved. Now the SARMs, the new ones, they're basically steroids. They're so strong.

Yeah. Like I said, that LDG—

LGD.

Yeah. My son got on it and I was like, oh no. I'm like, I'm looking at it like, I'm like, Dad, it's not steroids. I start— that's what brought me into SARMs. I started reading about it and I'm like, oh no. Yeah, yeah, this is getting bad. And of course he came off it like a steroid. Your body, you know. Oh yeah. Thump and like you lose everything.

Yeah.

He learned very quickly. It was like, okay, that wasn't worth it because I lost everything. You know, he was teen, late teens.

Oh, geez.

Yeah. Late teens. Yeah. 20.

Well, because then— so I'll explain real quickly what happens. That causes testosterone suppression and the LGD. I don't know if he ran 33 or 3303 or 4033, but 3303 especially is like like just as if not stronger than a lot of harsh steroids.

Yeah, I think it was the other, the other one.

Okay, so what happens for people watching, if you don't know, is your, your luteinizing hormone and your follicle stimulating hormone crash, produces here. Yes.

And that kind of controls the downstream let go, you know.

Yeah.

How does testosterone—

well, when you start flooding your body like that and suppress your testosterone, your body forgets how to produce it, and then you have to try to kickstart it back to produce it, which is why people use Clomid or Novadex. Yeah, people think HCG does that. HCG suppressive, and a lot of people don't know that. And it increases estrogen, and it's made from women's urine.

Yeah, exactly. They— bodybuilders used it between cycles. Yeah, to try to keep their testosterone levels up. Yeah, HCG diets were huge in the '80s and '90s, you remember? Yeah, I mean, because it allowed people to calorie cut and still not lose muscle. And then so therefore, because you can't just cut calories, you lose weight in the beginning and then you stop and then you get skinny fat, the whole thing. Well, HCG, man, it was the answer. I call Ozempic today HCG of the, of the '80s and '90s.

Good comparison.

Because I said this is going to end bad. I was like, there's no way this can end well. Oh no, no. Everyone justified lower dose. The same thing we're seeing with Ozempic, lower dose, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It ended in a tragedy. Yeah.

It's one of those things that, another thing that made a lot of people angry with me was me going against the grain, talking about how bad HCG was.

Yeah.

But I, I am, that's why I am what I am today, which is similar to like you and our, uh, most of our acquaintances discuss the realities of things and, and really explaining what things actually are.

I think that's why, you know, you have such a following because you're very open about what you've been through, but what you've been through allows you to be an expert in these areas. Yeah. I mean, truly. You know, like, I don't know what you know. I, I know the surface area of SARMs, you know, you know, SR and GW, you know, those are the SARMs that I've used.

Yeah, they're not even SARMs.

They're not even SARMs.

Exactly.

Yeah, they're—

but they're more in line for what we would want because we're talking about increasing VO2 max. Yeah, metabolic.

They're actually arguably healthy. I, I mean, they don't damage anyone, you know.

Yeah, you know, but again, your body can become acclimated to them and they might not be as effective anymore.

Yeah, you have to kind of move on them, but they're— they don't cause any— they don't touch your hormones. No, no hormonal. No, you know, and you And again, I, yeah, it's, it's fun to, to try it, but there's people put 'em in the same category and it, and then they end up reaching for these other SARMS.

That's right.

And that's where they, that's where things go bad.

And that's where marketing comes into play. 'Cause they're sold and marketed as SARMS when in reality they're not. Yeah. But in fairness, there are some things SR can affect your circadian rhythm. Mm-hmm. And it can throw it off. Yeah, it certainly can. But what, what I learned over this time period was this is so toxic. There's so much hate no matter what you do or you teach. These people like I'm, I'm once again something I'm not, right? But I found a niche and I got popular and I got big and I was, listen, I was convincing myself.

You really, this is like the next addiction.

Well, listen to what I did. I convinced myself that I was doing something really good because what I was doing was I would teach people how to use steroids safely. Safely. They're still damaging. Yeah. They're still hurting people. I told myself, well, you're helping people, you know, live— still live longer when they use these and do this, when in reality I should have just been saying don't use them at all.

Yeah, ever.

Right. And I damaged myself in the process. Yeah, I didn't use them long, but I used them long enough to probably where I developed some of the heart condition I found on myself, and also putting myself on TRT needlessly. Yeah, you know. Yeah. And I'm not about— I'm living another life life once again that I'm not.

And again, the false identity. Yes. Yeah, you were still living, trying to figure out who God created you to be. See, again, that's why false identities lead to these problems, because you're trying to be something that God didn't create you to be. It's never— you're never going to be happy, fulfilled, or really function in your true purpose. That's right.

And still, still not anywhere near what I'm supposed to be. So my YouTube channel gets shut down because all these people are attacking me and trying to get it shut down. So I had to start from scratch again.

Oh man, 2 million plus followers, all— yeah.

And you know, anybody that runs YouTube, hey, you know how hard it is to get like 10,000 subscribers.

YouTube is harder than other channels.

Anything. And then I said, okay, I'm gonna regroup and I'm gonna restart this. It's like 2017, 3 years to 2020. We've started to rebuild. It got to about 100,000 again. What do you think happened again. I got shut down.

For what this time?

I wasn't talking anything COVID related. They were just doing sweeps of people that were pushing the envelope on other stuff.

Yeah, yeah.

Shut down again. So I once again, and dude, you know how much money you could make with a lot of subscribers. I was making damn near 6 figures a month. I was crippled at that point. I was like, man, I don't know what to do anymore. 'Cause I can't keep doing this.

This is too risky.

I have a family and I'm not really doing my purpose here.

So you got married somewhere along the road?

Yeah, in 2015. I, so when I met my wife, so when I got outta prison, I didn't date anybody or anything the whole year I was on parole. Well, they cut me off 4 years early cuz I just didn't do anything. I worked and I went to the beach on my days off and then I studied. That's all I did, man. And so my wife was a, a manager at Safeway and I went in there every day to try to get something healthy to eat for lunch when I was at work. Well then, while I saw her staring at me all the time and and you know, everything. Well, when I got off parole, I went to the florist and I said, hey, I want you to leave some flowers for that girl over there and send her this note. And that's how I met her. And from there, I mean, she was with me, brother, from— I had nothing. I was living in my mom's basement. So she's been with me the whole time, dedicated. And she was the polar opposite of me. Never did anything wrong. Never smoked, never drank, never did a thing.

You needed that balance.

I had to. That was God's gift to me. Me because I also opened her up and gave her things in her life she never had. She was from the Philippines. The story she'll tell me about, like, having to use the bathroom outside, having nothing. But she balanced me and fixed me and corrected me. That's all that she did. And so we got married in 2015. Now I've got her kids, or my kids, basically. They call me Dad. I love them. I take care of them. I got a family, man. And then my dad passed away in the midst of all this, and I'm an only child.

Child.

So I bring my mom and start taking care of her. I got a lot of responsibility, a lot of people relying on me, and I owe my mom. I—

you do.

I owe my— oh, your mom. Yeah. And I owe my dad.

Yeah, of course.

You know, to take care of her.

Yeah, they dump money on you, man. You know, well, you were a bad bet back then.

I was the worst bet known to man, but they never gave up, you know.

That's right.

So I started to build my Instagram in 2020, said, okay, I'm going different here. I, I'll make some YouTube videos. Let's do this route. Let's go this route. So I built my Instagram heavy. I mean, I got millions of followers now. I got invited to speak at the Mr. Olympia 50th anniversary or was 50th or 60th.

Was that 2004?

No, just, just now. It was 2 years ago. Uh, no, 20— what are we? We're in 2024.

Oh, okay. Yeah. Oh, oh, okay. 2024.

Yeah.

Right.

Well, that's when I got to speak there. Okay. So I go there. Well, initially I'm invited to speak, which already is huge for me cuz it's all people with 50 letters after their name and me. Yeah, right. So that alone, I was like, oh my—

but you were invited into the heart of dysmorphia.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, talk about, man, heart of insecurity.

But they want me to go there to speak about all the stuff I'm talking about now— nutrition, hormones, everything. And I'm like, oh my gosh, SARMs? No, no, SARMs. I, I'm trying to get away from that. But peptides. And, uh, I was on anti-aging panels and all reputable doctors and, you know, really big names. And then they said, well, we got another opportunity for you. Do you know who Monica Brandt is? She's a former Miss Olympia. I said, not really, but they wanted to intro me. So then I got invited to sit there and be her co-host on her podcast at a booth. Well, one, I tore the house down when I spoke, and the doc, like, the interactions, and I put the clips up, and man, it was was just, it was insanely beautiful. Well then on her podcast, she was being sponsored by a company called Stem Regen and they came and watched me.

Stem.

Stem.

There's a Stem Regen. Yeah.

Stem. Stem Regen.

It's for the stem cells. Stem cells. Yeah.

So Christian, the owner.

Hey Christian. Yeah. Yeah. He said, I, I, I'm gonna have to have him on.

Yeah. So he was there. Ryan Riley was there, his like CEO. They were watching me speak and, and check me out and I got really close with them. Well, I realized they're in this thing called biohacking. What the hell is this? When I got home, I was all pumped. I got all these contacts. I got, dude, I got stacks of cards and contacts to start working on. Dude, I got COVID right when I got home. It was probably from the event or the plane. I got, I went to the gym and I told my wife, I said, I'm, something's off. I went and got a COVID test. Boom. Next day I couldn't even move. And I'm sitting there going, okay, God. Normally I pout and I don't understand what's going on here. 'Cause this is right about the time I'm shifting to really being God first too. And I'm saying, okay, I'm gonna trust you for once in my life. 'Cause I never do. I think I'm so faithful, but I know faith and trust are two different things.

Yeah, exactly.

You can believe all day long.

Yep.

But when it, when the, when the shit hits the fan, do you trust?

Yeah. Trust is the real relationship.

Yes.

Trust is faith. Faith.

So for the first time, I'm gonna trust you. And I was laying in bed and I said, you know what? I got nothing else to do. I'm gonna start researching Stem Regen and biohacking. And within like 20 minutes I realized this is what I've been meant to do my whole life. Everything I stand for, everything I believe in, everything that I research that I love, it's right here.

So you went through, yeah. And, and now you're, it puts you into the healthy version of optimization.

Yes.

Hormone optimization. Optimizations, you know, physical optimization, aging optimization, you know. And that's how you ended up in this world.

That is it.

You did a great job of bringing us through that. But what I want to hear a little more about is your salvation, because, you know, coming to Christ, you know, is— that's a whole nother thing. I'm surprised it didn't happen in jail, although I think you said it started— it's— that's where it started, right? Because you did say that's where you started reading the word. But would you have called— did you, you know, would you have called yourself a believer at that moment? I mean, meaning, did you have a transformation in jail, after jail? When did all that happen?

I've been a believer my whole life, but have I been a God-first individual where that was my main priority, where my life was turned over to him and given to him and trusted?

Yeah, it's interesting because I was— I wasn't a believer. I was called myself an agnostic, right? And I always say though, looking back on my life, gosh, even when I hated him, he loved me.

It's like, it's true.

It's like— and I use the word hate because because there's a biblical reason I would say that. But anyway, the bottom line is, is that you, on the other hand, would have said you had belief, but you were living— again, true salvation Christianity isn't about dos and don'ts. However, when I became a Christian, and again, I would never become a Christian, even though my older sister would talk to me about that, and I would tell her, I'm not going to stop the boo boo boo boo boo boo. So therefore, I'm not a hypocrite, I'm not going to do it. And because in my mind, it was about dos and don'ts, That's why when I read it and I said, no one told me this, my sister should have said, first of all, no, no, no, it's about the truth, right? You know, he died for our sins. But when I became a Christian, all of a sudden the things that I said I would never give up, I didn't make one attempt of saying, okay, now I'm a Christian, I have to try to be different. It didn't happen like that for me. Yeah, he changed me.

Yes, I'm telling you, I swear he changed my heart. The very— my girlfriend and I— she's my wife now. She— we were living together at the time, okay? And I— we were having sex. I would have said sex was an addiction in my life, okay? And, um, we were having sex and living together, and all of a sudden I'm like, I can't do this anymore. I remember she sat there, she cried, because we knew it was a separation. She was already a believer like you, but, you know, I was I going in this direction now, going like, what are we doing? God changed my heart and changed my desires, right? And it's like, in a couple areas that I realized at that moment, it's not about trying to be good enough. He changes our hearts. Yes. Anyway, so I say all that to say this. So you were saying you're a believer, but yet your life wasn't changing.

No.

So I would be like, okay, you had a knowledge, but maybe you weren't truly converted.

Here's how bad it was. I would go, I, I was, I usually go to mass on Saturdays cuz I have a hard time getting up on Sundays. So I would go at 4:30 mass and I would always go up there and say my prayers after mass for a long time.

This is post-jail.

This is before, before jail. And I would sit there and do like a long in-detail prayer, but I didn't do it throughout the week like that. I would, I would do it there and I would leave mass and I would go directly to the grocery store. Get my bottle of vodka, go home, get my cocaine out to prep for the night, and start ironing clothes and getting ready. Like, that's how bad it was that I thought I was going there apologizing for sins and then literally leaving within 30 minutes.

Wow.

And going home and doing all that. And my mom was just—

let's see, as a Catholic, you know, you could justify that a bit in the sense that, well, you know, I'm going to, um, do this or that to cover the sins.

You, you, you can, but potentially make yourself believe that, but you're just lying to yourself. I know, of course.

Yeah.

But I mean, it was one of the things I, it's one of the misinterpretations and understandings that so many people have when it comes to anything religious.

Yeah, I agree.

I mean, so I was on vacation in Florida and I was sitting out, it was about 1:30 in the morning cuz I always have to have nighttime alone. My wife always goes to bed without me cuz I normally read or study at night. And I was sitting out on this like patio I had and I was sitting there and I don't know what happened right then and there. Something hit me different and I was kind of just gazing and I was kind of, I was listening to, cause I like Stone Temple Pilots and I was listening to them outside and I stopped and I was looking at the sky and some, and I, and I always pray a lot when I'm in the ocean. Like when I go on vacation, I kind of tend to say more prayers and something hit me right then and there. And, and I, I can't even explain to you what it was. And I was looking and something lit up a little bit brighter in the sky than it normally does. I did. And maybe I, you know, who knows when you say that. But I, uh, I said, what is, what is it?

What is it? What am I missing? And from that moment, everything started to click. Everything in my life changed where I, I started to get closer to God. I had a greater desire. I literally read the entire New Testament. I bought a study Bible. I read 6 months, I read the whole New Testament. After that, when I got home, I inundated.

So in that moment, the change Did you invite God into your heart differently? Did you confess something to him? Did you do something like what?

I don't know that I confessed anything. Something just said everything that you've had that was missing is now right. Because damn, man, like I had a lot of money, a nice house, a beautiful wife, every car. I collected Jordans. I had hundreds of pairs of Jordans, everything. I have an arcade machine in my— like all of this stuff. And every night I'd go to bed, I'd look at her. And I'd look around me and I'd be like, why don't I feel good? Like, why do I feel like bad? What? How could I feel bad? I feel like I have everything I want. And I just kept buying things and spending money on things. And then it hit me right then and there. This is why you feel bad. And you know what? I don't feel bad anymore. Sometimes I'm tired and stressed, but I never go to bed like something's wrong or missing because it's not. Because everything that I needed was right in front of my face waiting for me the whole time. Time.

So you then at this point started— then God was drawing you closer to him?

Absolutely.

And, uh, absolutely. Was your— was your mother a believer or father?

Oh, my mom is hardcore.

Yeah, okay, because it was her prayers, by the way. Yeah. And okay, so you start walking with the Lord closer because now he puts a desire in your heart to dig in. And so what happened then?

So that's when things started to open up for me, because then start— things started to come to the realization, this is kind of what you need to be doing. And things started falling into place for me. I was never this guy that was like, I have to find my purpose. But once I started to understand what the Holy Spirit really was, what discernment actually meant, and I could, like, in my mind, understand what I actually had inside of me, because I didn't understand. I never took the time to understand. When you hear something, you think you hear a voice in your head telling you it's good or bad or right or wrong. It's the Holy Spirit trying to tell you, dude, listen, listen. And every time that I would try to convince myself that, oh, this is okay, knowing in my heart it wasn't, something bad happened. Now, every single— it's kind of like when I used to gamble and I'd be like, that doesn't seem right, even though everybody's telling me to go that way, I'm going to go the other way. I'd lose every time. So I listened and I listened and I listened.

And now everything I do, everything that I do right now is Holy Spirit driven. I have turned down what people would call crazy amounts of money recently because something was telling me this is not, this is not good. He's given me everything I need. I know that I don't have to worry about it anymore.

See, now you're walking with him.

Yes.

Back then you were walking very against him.

Absolutely right. Absolutely right.

Yeah. I'm a prodigal son, if you will. I, yeah, meaning, you know, it's like, uh, this kid, you know, he had everything, he walked away, he was rebellious, and then he came back to the father.

Well, you know what, so I always say, oh well, if prison hadn't happened to me, then I wouldn't be here. And if this hadn't happened to me, it wouldn't be here. So in 2023, I did some work with a doctor, and he said, everybody that works with me, I have them go get a calcium score. He's like, you're in— I mean, I do 15 miles a day of cardio. I, I'm in the gym another hour and a half. I eat this certain way, which I'm going to talk to you about after this story. And I went to get a calcium score. Now my dad had a heart attack at 59 and my calcium score was 120. 'Cause he told me it would probably be zero and I panicked.

You mean it? So what should it be?

Zero.

Yeah.

At that age should be zero. Now calcium score won't show you soft plaque. So even if you have a zero score, potentially you could have soft plaque that it's not recognizing.

That's like, and calcium, they're not measuring your blood calcium. They're looking at calcium in the artery.

Yes. Calcified plaque. And so I panicked because I I got a little bit of an understanding. Well, I come to find out I had an elevated Lp(a), 300-some. You can't control that by diet and exercise. That's a genetic thing. So I dig and learn about that. Well, what happens is I study cardiology. Now I'm digging and talking to everybody I can get my hands on, and I'm talking to everybody, Dr. Gundry, regular doctors you never heard of, anybody that I can get in front of that'll listen to me. And so I made that one of my big topics of discussion and I figured out how to reverse plaque and do things. And then I ended up recently with a low ejection fraction. Well, I figured out how to fix this and do this and understanding what's causing it was likely steroid use, combination of steroid use, cocaine, things like that.

So you did a lot. Yes.

But understanding now that we can not only fix this, but teaching people how to do it. But I will argue the low-fat diet had something to do with all this too. Yeah, but I've been able to now. I've had several, like so many tests done. I got my, my ejection fraction up 7% in 4 months. I've been able to reverse so much plaque. LP little a dropped hundreds where they told me you can't drop it at all. My point in saying this is that these things happened to me and I caught 'em early enough so I could help people and teach them about all the nonsensical information. Right. But you understanding that those were actually gifts. To me because I needed those things to happen.

Every hard thing that happened to me, I needed to happen. Yes. God is that good.

When you understand that it was a gift, not a curse, absolutely everything adds up.

Our perception becomes our reality. If you're still living, it was a curse, and too bad for, you know, I— everything, everyone else's fault, not your fault, right? You started this whole show by saying, okay, first of all, I'm gonna take responsibility. Everything happened in my life, I caused. Yes. Yeah, okay. But you know, when there's people that are still blaming— listen, I only did it because of my father. I, um, one of my, um, past producers, him and his sister, she had drug problems, different addictions, etc., etc., different problems. If you asked her, how did you end up here? She blamed the father. Ah, him, he has all the success in his life, incredible human that I know. Uh, you know, so what was it, you know, what made you who you are, man? Because as I asked him the He's like, oh, my father, absolutely. He's like, but my sister would tell you the opposite. My point is that raised by the same father, same father, one blames him and one gives him credit for success. Our perceptions are our reality. He perceived his father, my father had some issues, however, he looked at the positive.

She looked at the negative.

That goes back to when my mom said, were me and your dad really that bad of parents? And I broke, but I didn't tell you what I said. I said, absolutely not. I made all these decisions myself. You couldn't have done any more for me than you possibly did. I said, don't you ever say that to me again. I try to never talk back to my mom, but I told her then, don't ever say that again or think that, you know. I want to see your face when I tell you this because I told this story to Ben Azadi, Dave Osprey, and Dave's face was like, I mean, he was like mortified, but then told me how great of what I ended up doing. So I told you kind of my training, obviously eating disorder, heavy training, overtraining, fit, 10 to 15 miles a day, 5 days a week. Then, then the gym, another, I don't know, hour, hour and a half of weightlifting. You would think and imagine that at that kind of output you need a lot of intake to keep up.

Yeah.

I was eating for about, after I got outta prison, this started, I was eating good days, 1,800 calories a day, bad days, 1,300. I'm supposed to be eating 3,500 to 4,000, terrified of fat. Here's what I ate all day. My wife would cook every single day about 15 servings of vegetables, peppers, onions, mushrooms, zucchinis, stuff that would make me feel full throughout the day, and I'd snack on it all day long. So I was eating that much per day. Greek yogurt, low fat, no fat, nonfat, nonfat protein powder, egg whites, no egg yolks ever. And if an egg yolk even dripped out of it, I'd panic and start scooping it out.

Oh my God.

No, it's just horrible. And oatmeal.

Didn't that ever cause you like, God created an egg perfectly the way. Yeah.

Yeah.

Okay.

Please.

Yeah, yeah. Nothing makes sense.

Don't make me depressed.

Yeah.

And then peanut butter was the only source of fat, or a Quest Bar, which had very, what, 5, 6 grams of fats. That is, that is the basis of what I ate.

Starving your brain that needs that fat, your cell membranes, your hormones.

It's how productive can you be, first of all, during the day?

Yeah. I mean, my gosh, amazing you didn't end up back on Coke just to get through a day.

30, every 30 minutes I'm kind of getting up and walking around. It's hard for me to even make content after several years of doing this.

But again, It's, it's the body morphism once again. Yeah. Right. It's, it's, you know, the fear of really the fear is not looking the way you think you should look because that's who you are. Yeah. That's what gives you all the, you know, attention. Yeah. You know, I mean, that's it.

You know, so you can imagine the pain and suffering my wife's going through. We never eat out. We, I don't, I don't eat alone. I don't eat with her ever, ever.

Um, I mean, how long did you do that? That 1,400, 1,800 calories on that? I mean, how long did that last before you—

almost 10, 12 years. What? Because when I first got out, like when we were in Maui, I was still eating chicken and like some fish and stuff and different things, tuna I was incorporating. Well, then I got to that point, and I swear to you, I started watching some people I highly respect, and I'm a nutritionist for 15 years, and I'm teaching people to eat fats and stuff and coaching about— you No, because I was different. Because if I did it, it wasn't gonna work cuz I was different.

Yeah. You knew your body.

Yeah. Oh yeah. I know my body. Mm-hmm. So I watched several people that you and I respect and I'm, I was listening to them and listening to how they were eating. And I, I, I finally, finally said, you know what? I, cuz I'm one of those snap my, if you knew me, I'll buy a car on the drop of a dime. I'll do this on a drop of a dime. I'll hop on a plane. Plain. I went into the kitchen one day and I said, babe, I said, okay, I need to talk to you. And so she knows when I say that normally it's something with work or money or something we're gonna go do. We're gonna try something new today. And I wouldn't touch any of the foods I'm about to rattle off to you. I said, I'm gonna make you a list. You and I are gonna go together, cuz she always wants my time and it's hard for me and I don't give her enough of that either. We're gonna go together, which she already, I could see lit up. We're gonna go to Whole Foods and here's a list of stuff that I'm gonna start eating.

'Cause in my head I said, you know what? I know how to lose weight. If, if I gain a bunch of weight, I'll lose it like this. I'll be fine. We're gonna buy.

So you were still not, I mean, you were still convinced that these foods could cause you to gain weight. Oh yeah. But what made you say you needed them?

I couldn't take it anymore. I knew at that point, if I'm gonna be productive with all these opportunities, something else has to change. 'Cause I can't get focused.

That's what I was gonna say. You, you had to have some type of symptom that you thought, you know, so You couldn't stay focused because the drain of the fat.

And to be honest with you, I, it was just God putting this in front of my face.

Okay.

You have to make a change. Mm-hmm. Because I just woke up one day and said, I'm, because I had been watching stuff for months about, you know, do this, do this.

So the reality of, yeah, okay. Yeah. I just woke up and said, I have to do what I'm telling other people to do. Yeah.

We're gonna go get, I'm gonna try grass-fed beef. We're gonna try salmon, which I hate.

I, eggs, full whole eggs, so forth.

Do I hate salmon or am I convinced I don't like it? Yeah.

Yeah. Avocados.

Am I convinced I don't like it. Didn't even taste it.

No, you hate the fatty idea of it.

Every single food that I eat to this day is like based around healthy fats.

Yeah, that's awesome.

You know how pissed off I am that I have not been cooking in grass-fed butter?

So what's your caloric intake today? All right, not today, you mean now?

On my good days, about 3,000.

Okay, that's normal.

Yeah, but I, I went from about 25 grams of fat to 135.

Yeah, that exactly right.

Yeah, over 200 grams of protein. I'm I'm not, I'm not Mr. Keto or low carb. I probably need more carbs. I do about 110, 150.

Well, see, I'm a guy, I teach diet variation, meaning, you know, move in and out. I go into keto periodically. I go into high carb, healthy diet. Yeah. That's good. There's purpose in it.

Yeah.

I try to mimic ancestral living. Yeah. Honestly, it's like they were moved in and out of different diets because there's a benefit to eating, you know, very high fat, low carb, and there's a benefit to eating high carbs, healthy carbs. That's right. So I appreciate that.

Well, with the term metabolic flexibility, how do you obtain flexibility if you're not flexible?

Absolutely. Yeah. And that's why diet variation, it also creates diversity in the microbiome. Yes. So there's a lot of reasons for that. I, I don't wanna hijack this story because there's so much learning here. Right. So, all right. So now how long have you been on this? So, you know, I really balanced eating.

I had to ease into it. So I, I, I'm a, I was weighing everything out real particular. So I was doing like 80 grams of, of course you are. Oh yeah, of course you are. 80 grams.

I know who you are, Ben. Of course you were doing that.

I started off at 80 grams of avocado. Okay. Which is not a lot. It's a very small, medium one. And I was like, okay, I'm gonna eat bread again. So I have to have Ezekiel toast, just the Ezekiel toast. And then, okay, I'm gonna have 6 egg whites.

You're probably looking at yourself in the mirror.

Am I gaining weight? Oh, I was. Yeah, I was. 6 egg whites, but I'm gonna have a couple whole eggs now. Okay. Woo. Couple.

Mm-hmm.

Let's try some salmon. I, I was always like, I eased in with cod first, low fat fish.

Yeah.

Yeah. Okay, I'm gonna try this salmon because I, I really, I really didn't care for the taste that much, but maybe it was because I thought I didn't.

Yeah.

And I ate one and I was like, geez, like, this is so good. Yeah.

After a few weeks, your brain starts coming on going, okay, okay, I'm gonna try a little bit of this grass-fed butter.

Then I met—

oh, butter.

Well, and I started—

you're fat there. Well, yeah, that was a big step.

The SCT oil as opposed to MCT, because I I was researching, okay, the CLA in this, it's going to help me get energy, burn fat, like acid helps you burn fat.

Yeah.

So I test this out and I was watching the calories then, okay, pretty, pretty tight, 22, 23, 24. And I'm going, I kept telling my wife, I said, um, have I, do I look different to you? Because I feel like I haven't been this cut since I used steroids and I haven't felt this good in a very long time. Let's kind of check my blood work though and see how that's looking. HDL is normally like 40 for me. It was up to 50-some.

Yeah. And you even 80 would be better, higher the better.

Well, I'm gonna get there.

Yeah.

I'm gonna get there. And I go, okay, I think I can eat more. Let's try a little more. And I kept testing it and testing it and testing it to now I'm eating like 200 grams of avocados, 4 whole eggs. I'm having at at least about 3/4 a pound of ground, like, grass-fed beef. Or then I started trying elk, I tried venison, I went down the line. Yeah, it had everything. And I was like, huh, ground pork, huh, huh. And I'm happy, like, I'm not fighting.

Brain's working better and I'm leaner. Oh dude.

Yeah, so I was at, like, when I travel, my wife packs me out.

By the way, you were getting skinny fat. Yeah, meaning you, you were losing muscle. Yeah, terrible. And that, and you had a, you know, your body was holding on to fat. That's why when you started feeding it started gaining muscle without even lifting, but I'm sure you were lifting. But, and then you started cutting into your fat.

Yes. And you know what else I realized? I was eating like nothing but carbs all day and nothing else. Yeah, nothing. It was like straight carbs. Exactly.

Yeah, because you're afraid.

Well, and I was having all that oatmeal, you know what I mean? And like just loading it with protein powder.

So you actually had higher insulin glucose levels.

Terrible.

Yeah. And you're avoiding all the things that were actually would have controlled your insulin glucose. And insulin glucose a faster way to age and a faster way to fat.

Not only that, but I was eating it late at night too because I was up so late, you know, studying. So I was eating 2 to 3 servings of oatmeal with peanut butter and protein powder at like 2 in the morning.

You know, I hope this show makes it to— there's so many of you out there. Yeah, you know, it's like there's so many, and I think social media even creates more of you. And you, you broke through this, and that's why I hope this show makes to people because people will identify with this. And Maverick, you better share the show because you know these people, right? They're very disciplined, right? You know, they're very disciplined people. They're the ones that are always at the gym, right? They're the ones that, you know, I mean, you can kind of spot them.

But we lie to ourselves.

Absolutely.

And I have been lying to myself for so long. The reason that I got the platform that I did was for me to get guests on that needed to be heard, and that's why it's grown so fast. But it was also for me to get out and get people closer to God and to understand all of these things that I've gone through. We— every single human, I don't care how glorious they make themselves look, I don't care how much money they have, I don't care, they all have issues.

Everybody has an issue, and we're all the same because everyone's functioning in false identities to some degree.

That's right.

The level of, you know, the level that you're functioning closest to your true identity identity, who God created you to be, is the level of, ah, life's pretty easy for them. You know, they, they're successful, they're happy, and everything works out. Their relationships work out. You're functioning pretty close to your true identity.

Yeah.

If that's you. But if you're lying to yourself and it's this and it's that and this is a, yeah, you're probably way off your true identity.

There's a lot of brilliant people out there that do podcasts, that do videos, that do this and do that. I am, I am brilliant because of who I associate myself with and who I learn from.

Well, you're also growing because of what you went through.

But, but I also understand that you can never know too much, you can always know too little, and I keep it as real. Look, you can't come to me and say that, oh, he's, he's on this side or that side or talks this or that. There is nobody out there— I will say this for myself— that you're going to get a realer story from or truth from, because I just don't care. I just do not care. All I care about is what God put me here to do and making the impact I was meant to make. Because I will tell you this, Dan, I have more value on time than anybody could ever imagine. I have lost time that I can't get back, but I value the time that I lost because it built me into who I am. But it took away from a lot of things.

It does. There's consequences, right? But ultimately, if you choose correctly— and I hope people are hearing this, right— if you choose correctly and take full responsibility, where we started this conversation, God will work with you at that point. Otherwise, he's going to keep letting you— another— we'll give you 2 more years in Yeah, we'll give you 3, 4, 5, because he loves you that much.

That's right.

But the moment you say, okay God, I'm going to do it your way, right? That's what David had to do in the Bible. It's what Saul never did, right? You know, he wanted to do it Saul's way.

Yeah.

And the moment we say, okay Lord, it's you now, now all of a sudden your life changes. And I hope people hear that. Well, but it is taking responsibility.

You know, in the Bible, most of the people that were chosen to do the best work were the ones that were the most wrong in what they were living and were making the most mistakes.

Yeah.

And those are the ones that were chosen for a reason.

Yeah, absolutely.

You know, and that's, that's one of the things that I also had to learn. See, the, the Bible is so misinterpreted because people take verbs, verbages, and words, and they, they take them for what they want. But when I was reading it first, I go, you know, I'm learning a lot, but it kind of always just goes back to love, and it goes back to love. And I'm like, okay, I need more love, but it's like when you watch a movie 10 times.

Yeah, but people focus on the love part of God, but they, they also forget his judgment. That's right. He's both. Yeah. A good father, a good father, it's— it loves, right? It's just a good father disciplines you, and that's how you ended up in jail, son. That's right.

But once you realize the depth of what's being written in there and you can look through and you read it 10 times and learn something 10 times differently and new— it's when you watch a movie 20 times, it's your favorite movie, go, how the hell did I miss when I read and then I think, just like today, something hit me talking to you for a reason. But you have to go back and you have to spend that time. It's like Michael Jordan didn't stop shooting shots. He, he practiced more. You have to reeducate yourself daily and you have to give yourself— you basically sacrifice some of yourself to God to get out what he wants you to get out. It's not sacrifice to me though. Just like today when I was driving here, here and I spent so much time in prayer and the last day or two I've been lacking and I wondered why I was such a dick yesterday. It was because I didn't pray enough yesterday. You know, that's the part of me that, that I need that to function and to deliver the message that I'm trying to like deliver with you and deliver to people.

I am, I might have a million followers. I might have a high this rated that or that. I am literally just another dude. You know what I mean? Just like we all are. That just wants to make a difference. I know a lot of different things that I help people with, but I think the most important is to give people inspiration, hope, and belief in like what they can do.

I agree, because people out there right now are in pain for different reasons. Maybe it's a relationship, maybe it's a health condition, maybe it's, you know, something, addiction, whatever. But the fact is, is inviting God into that, the purpose will come.

That's it. That's it. That's how you find your purpose.

That is. Yes, exactly. And that, that's why, look, I, I focus on the stories. I love the stories. I love to teach around the stories because in the stories is where the truth really is. We can sit here and talk about facts and nutrition and that, it's like, but really it's the stories that change our lives, the pain to the purpose, right? And, and people are in pain.

I know.

And it's like, and it's like I've been there in so many different ways in my life that I can tell you that I needed everyone we both said said that. All right, look, I promised this, uh, at the top of the show to talk about peptides a little bit. We talked about SARMs. Most people don't know about SARMs. Before we leave that and enter in the peptides, what are the healthy SARMs?

Okay.

And should anyone try any of them, or should you just not?

I know I was always a SARMs guy, and I did this whole thing, and I, I didn't—

most SARMs are really bad.

Yeah, I had, you know, I, I was paid to market and do stuff, so I, I did have an interest in it, and I wonder if that played a role in me, but I also go back to, man, I use these, these are great. In reality, over time, what I've come to really learn and understand is one, you may be getting a SARM from that says it's pure or not, but they've changed over time and how they're made and, and how they're tested. And I don't feel that any of them are truly safe at this point because you, you still have potential damage to the liver, not as extensive as a steroid. See, my whole thing when I'd say they were safe was it was in comparison to something that's very unsafe. If you take it and sit it down, like you and I both know, just one glass of alcohol is damaging, right? So one cycle of these is damaging. Is it irreversible? Not necessarily. But is it good? No.

Yeah. I mean, I would argue one glass of could be very damaging to someone who's had an alcoholic problem.

I agree.

Yeah, I'm very tempted. That's why they can't even go to a bar. Yeah, right. One glass to someone who's healthy. I mean, arguably, you know, hormesis, right?

Yeah.

They can actually deal with it, tolerate it, and it actually could potentially be good for them. And they're drinking wine. But to your point, though, okay, so SARMs, there's— they can be contaminated. There's problems with SARMs. What about something— because a lot of people take GWSR. I've tried them. And they're not really SARMs.

Yeah.

Are those okay?

Once again, so like the GW side, there's that cancer study that was done on rodents and there's some side that go, oh, the math is this. And the other side that, oh, the math is that. And you know how this works with studies and everything. Have I ever had a direct sense of does this actually cause cancer? No. But do I also have a sense that if you have, like, if you're prone to it or you have some cancer cells that it could elevate the growth potential of them?

Yeah. A lot of things could.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You're right. Yeah, certainly. Something to take into consideration with the SR. It, it, has it been studied long enough for, for what you and I would like? Probably not. Long-term, do I see a lot of good, good potential there? Sure I do. Because there's like, it's, so it was an, it was like an exercise mimetic. So you don't have to work out when you take it and still lose weight. Does it have potential benefits for your metabolism and flexibility? Yes. Can it increase your endurance?

Mitochondrial biogenesis. Yeah. You make more mitochondria.

Yes. So, but are there better ways?

Yeah, exactly. I mean, just exercise in general.

Right. But could you take urolithin A for mitochondria? Could you take other, you know, things that we know that are beneficial? I would much rather go that route. So, and I know this doesn't answer the question, it's going against the grain of what I used to teach for all these years, but I'm man enough to admit where I may have been wrong.

Yeah, exactly. I mean, I, I think that's a good answer. Okay, so let's move into peptides.

Yeah.

Yeah. So again, healthy ones, unhealthy ones. Let's start by explaining to newbies, uh, peptide.

I mean, it's just chain of amino acid. I mean, in all actuality, when I started in 2012 and I discovered these research chemical companies, which we can certainly dive into if you want me to explain that, but you could only select, I believe it was 8 or 9, and they're all like growth hormone, uh, growth hormone releasing peptides or releasing hormones. So the same ones you see now, ipamorelin, CJC-1295.

Yeah. Those are growth hormone, growth hormone.

Yes.

Yeah.

The GHRs, the GHRP-2 and 6.

I'm gonna be honest, I took, I, I tried those and I didn't really notice much. And for the expense, no, whatever.

I mean, all those are really, so GHRP-6 can help you eat a lot. So you could gain some size. Like for bodybuilders, they like that one. Those are really just helping you release growth hormone as opposed to taking exogenous growth hormone. Yeah.

It doesn't shut your body's own production.

No.

Right. No. Helps you produce more. So, I mean, I do think they're— those are relatively safe, but I don't know that it's worth it for the money. That's the money.

I, I think ipomirella and CJC, they have their place. So I used melanotan too, was the first one I ever used.

Oh yeah, my son used that. I could never use it, and I'll tell you why, because I get dark spots, right? And that makes dark spots dark spots. Yeah. So, but he took it, man, he was purple, bro.

I was living in Maui, and you were, you I was so embarrassed that I had to stay home cuz I got so dark.

Yeah.

Cuz back then you were told you take this, then you go out in the sun. And when I went out in the sun, then I was laying out an hour.

Okay.

Cuz I mean, I didn't have anything to do. That was my joy, you know? And, uh, it made me very nauseous every time I took it. Yeah. Even at very low doses, I would throw up a lot or be so sick to my stomach that, you know, now Now libido increase was very drastic, which was nice at the time, but I, I didn't care for it. But that was about it back then. Now there's thousands and it's something for everything.

Yeah, I know, you know. Yeah, I mean the peptides. Yeah, yeah, I, yeah, again, I, the ones that I still take, because people will want to know, I shall take BPC-157 if I have an injury. I've never, I just injected my daughter this morning. Uh, TB-500 is a very safe, it just helps your body recover. I've taken others. My brain's spinning right now on, on some of the, the other ones I've taken. But yeah, I mean, I, I think that there's a, there's some better ones and some bad. What are some bad ones that we should stay away from?

One thing I'll say is this: I can sit here and talk to you about hundreds of peptides that I'm versed on, but most people, you can only get like X amount actually prescribed legally, you know.

These are, by the way, SARMs peptides. They're in this gray zone.

Yeah, very gray.

Yeah, yeah. Like, meaning they're— it's not like illegal. You have to go to these websites that kind sell them for experimental animal, experimental only, right? It's like, but they allow you to get them. Yeah, because I think they like the feedback. Like, I think it's like a way of testing.

It is. Yeah, so they're, they're called research chemical sites, and they have to say not for human consumption because if they market it any other way, it's illegal. The problem is, is all these peptides we'll talk about right now, you can't really get them prescribed. You have to go that route.

I know. Yeah.

So you don't have a choice. Now I'm privy to the information on where to go and where to not go. Mm-hmm. Because there's like new ones popping up left and right.

Yeah.

And half of these places don't test 'em.

Yeah.

And anyway, so you asked some of the bad ones. I think the first way everybody's gonna go in terms of a bad one is to just go straight to GLP-1s. Now, are they bad?

That, yeah, that's a, it's a peptide. I hate it.

Very debatable topic on how bad they are. 'Cause you got one side of the fence that has the, no offense, but I'm sure I'm surprised you didn't get into GLP-1s.

You want.

I discuss them a lot, but I don't touch them.

Yeah, I mean, I'm— that's— yeah, you know, I could have—

he's not there anymore.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, but, you know, yeah, I— well, I guess it wasn't even popular when you were in your bad spell yet.

Yeah, I, I— when it was you to take it, one of the things that it was you to take, you know, but be honest with you, one of the things I've been pretty good about is not taking stuff to lose weight. I've always— I've been scared, uh, especially when I found out about my heart. So that was kind of the time they And he got fear drives you, man.

Yes, I know.

Right.

Maybe some, like everybody, but okay.

So let's, let's walk down the line here. So you got your first one was Ozempic semaglutide. That's like little brother, right? Yeah.

And what problems do you, I can tell you the problems that they already know, the problems I have with it, but what problems do you have with it?

Well, I mean, I just think it's crap all the way around. I think there's, I think there's so much misuse and people that don't understand how to use it. And I think there's so many negatives that go along with it. Is there potentially good benefit to using it?

Yeah, I, I, I am willing to say if someone's like, you know, obese, has massive glucose issues, they, they could die anytime from COVID and GLP could save their life. Yeah. Yeah.

So I'm not like saying there's never a use, you know, but it's, it's just like anything else, use it properly or don't use it.

Mm-hmm.

This wasn't even designed for weight loss.

You're right. Yeah.

Right.

Right. So yeah, that's— they say that. That's why all these lawsuits, you know, it's like there's blindness. They're like, hold on, wait, hold on a second. Yeah, we don't— we've never developed it.

Well, and that's it. Like, so I use Jardiance for my ejection fraction. It's not even— wasn't designed for that, but actually found that benefit with it. And it works well for me and I don't have to take the hardcore stuff. But back to the GLP-1s, these weren't designed for this purpose. They found this out later through like testing. And these are for people that have a diabetic issue. Right? So this one was the first one.

Mm-hmm.

So then what happens? Well, they develop something better, right? Sure, sure, sure. Zepatide, it's better. It's got less side effects, maybe more effective, but still problems. So now what we develop, retatrutide, which is still in their last phase of studies, but everybody uses it. It's by far the superior one. It's been, it's like we go through this phase of, okay, we found something, but it's all messed messed up. We're gonna fix it, make it a little better. Now we're going to make it really better. So Präteriturtide so far is showing to be a lot safer. Is it? I don't know, because I need more data and I need more like real— I have a lot. See, I'm a data guy, but I'm a data guy on what I see on the surface, not what studies tell me, because they're so manipulated and there's so many ways to manipulate them. And so I look at how— I'm, I'm talking to hundreds if not thousands of people on how are reacting to it. And that's where I draw my data. But you see, the problem with that is I don't know the quality of what they're getting.

So there's a, there's a different approach and problem when you're looking at these underground, you know, markers on people using them.

Are there some, uh, peptide labs that you like more than others?

Yeah, yeah. I mean, so there's one I've known now for 5 years. It's really the only one I'll associate my name with is called Umbrella Labs.

Yeah, Umbrella Labs. I, I just I just told, um, you know, um, uh, I have no names, but anyway, yeah, to get a SARM there. Yeah, it was the GW.

That's the spot.

Yeah, exactly. Because they, they at least, they tested it, so you're getting what you pay for.

It's got a million-dollar facility. Yeah, I went down there to meet him and, uh, I don't know, 2019 or '20, and went down there to see them where they're at and, and did a walkthrough because I was wanting to see a place that actually had a real facility and not making it in their bathtub at home, it's legit and he's a good dude. Mm-hmm. You know, like a really good guy. So that's the place I go.

Umra Labs. Yeah. That would be the one that, you know, yeah. Beat on the street is a, is a good one.

You, you brought up BPC and TB500. Mm-hmm. I talked about the bad ones. So these are the ones everybody really is behind. Yeah.

Okay.

So let's take it a step further. Those are the two most well-known in the healing realm.

Yeah.

So then they come out with this product called Glow.

Yeah. It's a combination TB, BPC, and GHK.

GHK-CU, right?

And, and that's, that's kind of a chaperone for copper.

Love GHK-CU.

Yeah. It heals. I've taken it. Yeah. And, and like I use, uh, women like it cuz it, their collagen.

I use it on my face. I, do you know Dr. Patel with Aura Oral Wellness?

Yeah.

I know he came on my show and he, and he let me try some of it.

Mm-hmm.

We love it. Me and my wife use it and I'm a big skincare care, obviously from modeling. I love GHK-CU. But then we take it a step further. This is the key to that whole combination. So now they come out with this thing called Klo with the K. That's where the KPV comes in.

Okay, so we had Glow and now we have Klo, which all four of them— KPV is a peptide that helps gut issues.

Yes, and that's why I love it so much.

Yeah, exactly.

I knew you would.

I have, uh, you know, told people to try to use KPV even the oral version. And I, I'm telling you, it, it, it, it works.

To me, that's the secret weapon to the 4, which really makes it like worthwhile. No, well, I shouldn't say worthwhile. I'll say make it its strongest. If you really want the ultimate healing stack, you get the 4.

So in review, TB500, BPC, um, uh, GHK, GHK, GHK, and then the, the copper peptide GHK-Cu. Yeah. And then what was the other one?

KPV.

KPV.

Oh, that's the one. Yeah. So I'm a big fan of that and I'm a big fan of MOTC.

Okay. Yeah. MOTC. I always say MOTC, right? MOTC.

You can say it either way.

We'll talk about MOTC in a minute. Yeah. So what those four, what would people expect if they got on this?

Well, like you said, with the gut, which is a major thing, we start having that type of possible gut healing or repair. 'Cause, 'cause BPC has that kind of benefit.

Yeah, yeah. No, BPC works in the gut.

Definitely.

But I've noticed the new oral versions actually in the gut can sometimes make a bigger difference.

Yes. And, and that's what it's good for.

Where's like, I inject BPC like my shoulder up, put it in there.

Well, and for people watching, if you take BPC orally, you're not gonna really experience like what you're getting in your shoulder nearly like it's, 'cause you're, you're site injecting to the, a site that needs the healing, which is what you're gonna want to do. I use a cream. It's a BPC-TB 500 cream and I love it.

Stable enough?

Yeah.

'Cause I know that oxidize these things damage usually.

Oh, it works. Now it's only BPC and TB 500. I just get sick of injecting all the time.

Oh dude, I know. I go through phases of this. You know, I like what it'll motivate me. Like I said, I, I had a, a tendon, a tendonitis, tendonitis. And so then that put me back into using, that's how I ended up back up on copper peptide. Yeah. And that's how BPC 500, I'm occasionally taking that stack. I love it.

It's good.

Then it took a little injury to get there because it's a pain in the butt and it's expensive. I mean, I'm, you know, it's just annoying.

And, and I've been on TRT injections forever now.

I, I just, we're gonna talk about that next.

Yeah. 'Cause I wanna talk to you about the oral form of that now that I'm gonna start. So yeah, that, that you will expect the healing obviously, but then the, the, the skin, the way that your skin will look, your hair, your skin, your nails, all of that. You're gonna know. It's like the full-fledged, full-blown stack. And, and I love these options because this is the alternative medicine of the future with the whole peptide genre. Yeah, there's so many options.

Yeah, there are. And, and again, I, I could— there's some— we talk about GLP-1s, right? They're bad peptides. There's other bad peptides out there. Yeah, sure. We're not making a, you know, a statement or, um, you know, all these peptides. Even the SARMs, I've taken GWSR. Yeah, self, So, but I do agree with you. It's like, you know, I mean, to spend the money. I mean, so, you know, I was talking to someone in the gym. They're like, yeah, but I like to be on them because that gets me to the gym. So I don't have that problem. I get to the gym anyway.

I believe in that. I believe in self-intrinsic motivation.

Yeah, exactly.

If you need something like that to take you to the gym, you should reflect.

So anyways, those are good for the hair, the skin, the joints, right? And all of that in the gut, right? Right. So that crosses a lot of boundaries. You, we, you focused on all my favorite ones, right? So, okay. Okay. Motes though. I've never taken motes. What is motes? I've heard of motes.

What? So, okay. It's really known to be an exercise mimetic.

Am I saying it wrong? You say it might be correctly. What did you have to—

maybe the way— motzi.

Motzi. Yeah. I'm saying motes. I don't know. I'm probably wrong.

I'm just like, you could say it.

I probably everything wrong.

It's, it's all the same. It's all good. Potato, potato, right? But anyway, it is known to be an exercise mimetic, meaning that you could take it, not really work out and have some fat loss.

I, so it's kinda like SR SARM.

Yeah. But it, it claim mitochondrial benefits.

Okay.

That's what I like about it.

Okay.

Helping mitochondrial health. Take that. That's where I like it because I'm a big mitochondria and cellular health guy. When I started to do my work with Timeline a year ago, I literally went to Harvard and studied cellular biology at night and understood mitochondria, became a cellular health coach. That's how serious I take my part.

Smart background.

Yeah. So like my least favorite subject my entire life was science and now my whole life revolves around it. And biology. That's why I just enrolled for neuroscience at ASU. So I have really focused on cellular and neuro piecing them together with, you know, my saying, you have to fix the cell to get well. Yeah.

That's my saying. Yeah.

I love it.

That goes with me in life.

I want to be known as a mind-body connector, but spirituality's part of that connection too. I don't, I have a three-prong approach.

Approach. Oh, I mean, I would, I would go into, by the way, I, I should have said this. I was going to earlier. Where do people find you? Because everyone's going, okay, I wanna follow this guy. Yeah. Tell 'em where to find you. I actually am finishing up dylanjameli.com and it is, well, you better spell the Jameli.

Yeah. G-E-M-E-L-L-I. Dylan Jameli Podcast. And then Instagram. Like if you go to me on TikTok, I got a ton of followers. I respond to no one cuz I hate TikTok. I despise it.

I don't even have it on my phone.

I, yeah, I only post there because I need to for partners, but otherwise I don't touch it. But yeah, those are my bread and butters. Instagram, you will get me. I don't have people respond for me. If you get a response, it's from me. Cool. I don't do that.

So follow them, follow them.

Yeah, please.

All right, anyways, um, yeah, so the Motes is a— that's a cool one. Oh yeah, I should try it.

Oh, you'd love it. I'll tell you how to use it because you have to— it's a little bit different dosing, so we'll go over it together on the side and I'll kind of show you because you want to make sure that you, you run it and get off.

My wife, my wife is she's been in menopause for many years. She's 58. She did it without hormones, you know, taking a hormone ever. Right. But I just started some peptides with her.

Really?

Yeah. Because, you know, they're worried about the skin in there, right? I mean, I'm not saying that in a negative way. It's not for every woman. And she doesn't do Botox, she doesn't do fillers, she doesn't do anything. Right. So we live very natural lives.

I love I love it.

But so that stack, she's, she's doing that. She's doing one other one. So what is it? Oh, uh, Semax. She's doing, it's more brain.

Semax and Selank are two of my favorites cuz they do brain and anxiety and everything.

Yeah.

They go together. They're very synergistic.

Semax is with an S, S-E-M-A-X.

S-E-M-A-X. And Selank is S-E-L-A-N-K.

I don't know that one.

They, they pair really nicely together. You do like one in the morning, one at night. At night. I can help you with all this stuff.

And then this one sounds more hormone, but it's not. It, it's Endotest.

Yeah.

And yeah, I can tell you it's helped her. I mean, like, you know, she like notices a difference, right?

So SS31 is another one that's gaining a lot of steam and that's got some like cardiovascular heart benefits. Really good one to, to look into. Multitudes of benefits that I, I, I am potentially going to start taking that one myself. So I'll let you know what I think of that one and the benefits there.

It's, it is it's fun, you know, experimenting with them. And again, I wouldn't do it if it wasn't safe. My health is in— to your point too, right? It's, it's prime. I mean, you know, I just, again, I, I just like it for the joint, the health of it, you know. At 60, I still play hard, you know. It's like, so I, you know, tendinitis and I can't like swing a golf club. No.

Yeah, I know, I know. My favorite, I'll tell you, my favorite is it's called Tamorlan.

Yeah, I, I haven't taken it, but you know, everyone tells me about it.

Oh, here's why I like it.

It sounds hormonish, but it's not, isn't it? Well, testosterone drugs—

no, no, no, no, no, no. It, it's, it's going to increase your growth hormone levels. But what I like about it is it's very good for cutting weight and preserving muscle, because cutting weight is not good if you're not preserving some muscle. And that's why I like it so much, because it carries that capability.

That's why Ozempic sucks. That's right, because you lose muscle, and it's like, which makes coming off of it almost impossible. Do you buy into the, the whole low dose thing? Right. It's like, I mean, I grant it, I would argue low dose is better than high dose, right? It's like, but I find that it just, you know, just takes a longer to get there, but you're still losing muscle slower.

You are. There's cognitive benefits to microdosing.

Oh yeah. Uh, because the, there's GLP-1 receptors on there. Yeah. But again, that's a microbiome issue.

That's right. It, look, it makes it easier to eat adequately at a microdose, but can you still do that? I don't know. Because it, the way that it functions on your brain and shuts things off, I can't speak to everybody. I, I, I can extrapolate data and it's kind of down the middle. Some people, oh, I can eat fine with it. Some people still struggle. Is it good to trick your body that long to just not eat? And then what happens? What happens?

I don't like it.

I don't either.

Yeah.

I hate it.

Don't like it.

I'm not anti-GLP-1, but I'm also very open about the facts.

And that's why I always make it clear. It's like, I, I think, again, you have to balance risk and reward here, right?

Yeah.

When you have the obese diabetic, uh, they could die like this from a heart attack, stroke, etc., etc. And that, that could literally save their life.

So are you robbing Peter to pay Paul? That's always— I am, right?

So, you know, I— there's a time and a place. There's time and place for many medications.

Yes.

You know, some medication I might say never, but I'm not telling anyone to do anything.

But you and I are the same. It's like, just because maybe we don't like it, we can still point out a little bit of purpose with it. But just be aware that this goes along with it, right? So absolutely, I never say anti, but I don't care for them.

Yeah, I agree. Okay, let's move in on that subject. Um, hormones. Okay. Yeah, look, I— again, I'm gonna state the same thing I just stated. I— there's a time and a place.

Yeah.

Okay, absolutely. But my issue with all of these people in our space jumping to bioidentical hormones, I think it's Mr. Directed. I, I think if someone's missing a gland or an organ, absolutely. You might, you know, need some hormone assistance. But I find that people are just running to this. My issue is the cellular problem. You know, hormones in the blood really doesn't mean what's actually happening in the cell. That's right. So we can make blood levels, your estrogen's low, your testosterone's low. We can make that look better, but what it's doing in the cell is not reflected by your your blood. Yeah. So it's not as crisp and clean as people think. And when you start taking a hormone, you slow and stop your body's own production. And one more point, and hormones go like this through the day with innate intelligence, meaning stress level goes up, your body will adjust. Your estrogen's going to be affected, your testosterone's being all in a balancing effect that you don't have to think about. So you're not going, oh, you know what? I know when I'm stressed, I need a little more testosterone. I need I'm going to live.

Okay. Your body does that for you. I know when you're taking these hormones, you're doing, you're doing this. And I think there's, there's a consequence to that. And again, with all that said, I recognize the time and the place too. So I'm not anti-hormone. I'm just more cautious. Okay. That's my stance.

No.

And I don't, you know, you're welcome to, you have your stance and I'm welcome to bring it.

Most people come to me me to fix them, right? So I get a lot of people that were either ex-steroid users that are completely just destroyed.

They don't have their testicles. No, you're probably gonna have to take testosterone. Yes.

I have shifted a lot of what I do to really help a lot of women. So I have a 50/50 audience now. I've worked really hard to get that because I do work with a lot of menopausal women and a lot of people that are struggling in a midlife sort of, I I hate the midlife crisis term, but I don't know how else to put it. Men and women. So one of the first things that I get is, oh, I'm tired, I need testosterone, oh, I'm run down, or oh, I can't lose weight, or oh, this. And my, my first response is no. Let me dig. Let me see if there's something here that's blocking your testosterone production, or if that even is the case, or blocking it from getting in the cell. That's right. So for instance, just one For example, if I look at a sex hormone binding globulin score and if that is too high, then you are bounding up free testosterone. Yeah. So we fix that problem, you may— boom, we don't need TRT.

And there's a lot of natural things that can help that.

That's exactly right. And that's just one small thing. But anyway, yes, but we go down a list of stuff to look at first before we even do that. Now one thing, and I, I just had a former American Gladiator on yesterday and she was talking about how testosterone Who was she? Uh, Ice, Lori Fetra.

Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

So, and she was talking about, and I see this all the time, women that are really struggling in menopause, they, they have this fear of testosterone, don't understand that they need it. Just like you and I need it.

Of course women need it.

You and I need estrogen, much lower extent, but women need testosterone. Yeah. That can just crush them. But they have a different balance cuz they have to look at progesterone, estrogen, and, and testosterone and the potential, where's it going?

Meaning yes. The body body, it could go down the wrong road. Yes. You know, it could end up going down a road and producing more estrone, and estrone can block estradiol.

That's right.

And your doctor's going, your estradiol levels are normal, you know, or they're making it normal, but it's being blocked. Exactly. So women's— a woman's taking estrogen going, I, I don't feel well anymore. It's because their estrone is rising up.

Yes. And then you're trying to take one thing to fix another to fix another before you're on 30 things.

Dude, that's my point, is it's a hard game to win.

You can't.

And I get— but women have, you know, look, if all of the cut— the chemicals that mimic hormones— women washing their clothes in regular laundry detergent has all these hormone disruptors. I know, it's like drink out of plastic, it's like they mimic hormones, like, you know, and then they, they, they're trying to balance that by taking hormones. Some women are going to notice a benefit in the beginning. But what I've noticed is there— it doesn't last. No, because now this is off, now this is off now. And then they go to the testosterone and then they feel good again. I have my sex drive again. And then that doesn't last. It's— this is what we're finding, Dylan.

It's a never-ending, non-stop thing instead of just addressing the problem. I know, right?

And listen, I am— if a woman's life— I mean, they can't function anymore, there's time that bioidentical hormone could be the answer, that, right? But while they're doing that, they better be taking out all these hormone mimics, all these, you know, chemicals that mimic estrogen, disrupt it, drive inflammation of cells, stopping the hormones. Like, I mean, it's like if you're not doing that, then you're just, you're on crutches your whole life.

That's right. You have to look, I can, it's just like I tell everybody else, I can put you on the best diet in the world. I can do this, I can do this. If you're not hormonally optimized and mentally optimized, it does not matter, right? There's nothing that is ever going to work. Yeah. It is just a bandaid to a wound that will fall off every day.

You know, I've had my testosterone measured multiple times. Sometimes it's 300s, sometimes it's 700s, sometimes it's 400s, and I feel the same. But what it tells me is, is it's moving around.

Time of day is everything. What time of day you ate, if you've been moving, you, you essentially to get the most, you know, if testosterone level 300, that could land me on testosterone. Oh, sure. Sure. You know, you're supposed to ideally fasted for 12 hours first thing in the morning is when you, you're gonna get the best reading thyroid hormones.

So very depends on when you take it.

But in fairness, certain things can affect that too.

Absolutely.

You should see, so I'm on TRT, that's my own doing from using steroids. My fault.

Now see, I agree you use steroids. Yeah, this is a little graphic, but you, you know, you're, you're not drink.

Thankfully it didn't happen to me, but it still shuts down your luteinizing hormones to the point where many ex-bodybuilders have no nuts left. Yeah, a lot of them don't.

But the point— because they're not being used. Yeah, but the point is, is your body shut it down.

Yes.

I would tell Dylan, you're, you're gonna need testosterone.

Well, yeah, you've, you've— I did answer myself.

I, I, I'm in agreement with you, uh, but you would be surprised.

Like, so I inject twice a week. Now, now testosterone injections have ester chains connected to them. So cypionate is ideal because it's a 7 to 8 day half-life.

Cypionate is a form of testosterone. Yeah. That is injectable.

So, so testosterone is testosterone and then they attach an ester chain, which allows a, a release point. Like testosterone propionate is like a 2.5, 3 days. You have to inject it every other day, otherwise the levels are all over the place. So cypionate's ideal for TRT because of the half-life. So you could inject once a week. Week, theoretically. The problem is, is you have what's called a peak and a trough. So if I inject like Tuesday, you take my testosterone level, it's shit. Depending on how much I take, it could be anywhere from 800 to 1,000.

Mm-hmm.

Then if you take it, like if I wait a week and you test it before I inject again, it's down to like 300 or 200. So you, you have this like imbalance of how you feel. That's why when I teach people, you have to do it twice week, you know, and, and that a lot of doctors don't understand how this works and they'll put people on these long esters and inject it once a month and these people never feel good because it's up and down. So yeah, I met, his name is Shailen Shaw and he's one of the founders of Kaisertrex and that's the oral form of testosterone that I'm gonna start that I just got her script because Dr. Betsy Yurth is the one that educated me on it, you know, a couple years ago and I wanted to wait to make sure the tests and everything. So I'm gonna give it a shot so I don't have to inject, 'cause it's supposed to alleviate rise in estrogen. It's supposed to allow your luteinizing hormone to kick back up. There's a lot of things it's supposed to do. You have to take it daily, but it's oral, so no more injections.

What about inclonidine? Some people take that. It stimulates from the pituitary luteinizing hormone, F-H, down, and it gets your testicles—

I, I worry about long-term use to benefit get that on, you know, dependency on it.

Yeah, I worry about long-term use of anything.

I do too.

Yeah, I didn't think— stop working too, you know.

And yeah, that's just it. I don't have enough data or comfort.

I mean, I think most people are taking that for, you know, post-hypo— uh, um, gonadism.

Yes. And then post-psychotherapy. I, I don't have a problem with it because you, you— that's another thing you think about. What do people use to come off steroids? They use Clomid and Novadex. So what are those? Yeah, well, Novadex is a breast cancer medication. Do you think that's smart to use a dude, and then Clomid is really— it's supposed to be a fertility drug for women.

Yeah.

Does that sound smart?

Well, clomiphene was from that family. Yeah, yeah, they used it for infertility actually. Start, you know, my memory there.

Yeah. But do any of those things sound like those are good things to use that they use?

Yeah.

Women— like a women's cancer medication? That was always my argument with people, but I don't, I don't have to play that argument anymore because I'm out of that world, you You know, but these are the troubling things that I've learned.

And again, I, I think it kind of brings our— with the advancements of peptides, it's a way more natural way to go.

Absolutely.

Without shutting down your own production. Yeah. Without trying to figure out the game of up and down. We both made the argument some people need it and you should do it right if you're going to do it.

Absolutely.

Even gave some great tips there on how to do it right. You know, I, I think that when we look at how many women estrogen, progesterone, you know, I, I know the whole thing, the black box warning, they took that off. And I, and I agree, it's not directly, it's not creating, you know, cancer. Indirectly, I think that you could still have problems because I've seen a lot of Dutch tests where women are taking estrogen and we see all these high estrogen metabolites like 4-hydroxyestrone that can lead to breast cancer. Yeah, cancer.

So dangerous.

But again, that's an indirect thing. It's, you know, so I don't think it would be fair to say that it causes it directly. Um, I, I, and again, there's, there's a time and a place. But what was my point going to be? My point was going to be that— oh, I know what it was going to be. So women are taking the estrogen and they seem to get this benefit in the beginning, but because they haven't really got to the cause of why, yeah, then they end up not having a lasting result.

That's right.

You know, and, and I think that's confusing for a lot of women. I know. You know, so the, the point is, if you're doing that, please be working on eliminating all the things that are disrupting hormones in your life. And follow my Instagram page because that's what I talk about. Yeah. And then the detox that I teach is getting rid of the— because a lot of these endocrine disruptors, they accumulate.

Yes.

Heavy metals accumulate. They don't leave the body in a lot of places, right? And they accumulate in the brain, even in the pituitary that runs your hormones. Yeah. You have mercury or aluminum in that area, which I did. You can't— all my hormones were disrupted. I spent years trying to balance my thyroid, my adrenals, my testosterone. I mean, it just doesn't work.

I just had a high aluminum score come back and I can't figure out why.

Dude, it's jet fuel. Has it— no, I'm not talking about chemtrails. I'm talking about to make— there's— they have jet fuel now to make— it's all about dollars and cents. This isn't conspiracy. You know, they're able to fly jets a lot farther on the modern day fuel. However, and that's why you see more chemtrails, by the way. There's more particles and they condensate, you know, and people call them chemtrails, they're contrails. So you see more condensation. But aluminum is coming out of the sky, man. I mean, it's like, and it's in our food supply, it's in our water. And then, you know, how much aluminum foil are people wrapping? We have a lot of aluminum exposures, antiperspirants, I mean, all these things. So aluminum is everywhere.

I was sitting in my backyard, um, and I was like doing prayers and sitting there and I, all of a sudden I yell, Queenie! at my wife.

I said, get out here!

And this, I saw this thing going across the sky and it was just dropping. And I said, what is that? It looked like a UFO. And we filmed it and it, you should see this stuff that was just coming down.

Be clear. And I always say that too. Do they do, do they spray at different times for different? They do. They, they have to get clearance. They do get clearance. They're doing it for different reasons. So this is like, you know, bioengineering has been around a long time, right? And it's used differently. But when you look at a commercial jet going over and you see that, well, that's not what that is. So that people confuse the two, right? So when they say like, you know, Mexico has outlawed, you know, bio— am I saying that bioengineering? What am I saying? Bio— what's the word? What's the word? Bioengineering? Maybe I'm saying it right. Okay. Dyslexia. Anyways, you still see chemtrails in Mexico. Matter. But the point is, though, is because what they outlawed is— and they did in Florida too— you're, you know, you're not allowed to use certain things and spraying certain things. And some of it was being experimental to control weather. I know all that goes on and went on. And, you know, most of it was a fail. But that's still not what you look up when you see the jet. No, I was going to get hate mail on that because people in our space love that topic.

And I spend so much time time like disproving it, you know. So, so I, I think there's chemtrails, but it's not that. That's the point, right? I went off. Okay, aluminum. Yeah, the point was I was making was, is that, you know, we really have to focus on, um, you know, the, the causative factors of, you know, where hormones are. I mean, we're out of time, bro. We just spoke for a long time.

I believe it.

Yeah, I know. So that was amazing. But, um, tell them one more time where to find you.

Yes, please. So dylanjameli.com. G-E-M-E-L-L-I. Instagram, Dylan Gemelli Podcast. We're tearing it up. You're gonna come on. We'll have another great conversation. I'll be there. But yeah, that— I am literally just doing God's work there. And I mean, we talk about everything. I do all aspects of everything from mind, body, spirit, and I do it all. So those are the best places to find me, man.

Yeah, find them. Share and like the show as always. Share the show, man. People need to hear that story right there. Share it.