Transcript of The Million-Dollar Podcast Guesting Framework with Lori Harder

Now, I'm not saying you're gonna make $1 million from one episode, but you can. You know our friend Samantha Skelly? Yes. 30 days after that show aired, she ended up making $100K. I get to come on for free. I get to sit and bring you my best ideas, and I essentially get to have a verbal sales page to your audience that you have now spent how many years? Because I've done Almost 1,700 episodes, a lot of those being interviews. And I will tell you that I've even sat with some of the most brilliant people, and I only have a handful, maybe 10-ish, that I can actually remember that were mind-blowing episodes.

How many pitches a day are you getting, and how, what are you looking for in those pitches to say yes or no?

People pitch themselves. I'm actually looking for you to pitch the conversation. It's a strategy. There is such a huge strategy behind this that people don't realize.

What's one of your favorite frameworks for teaching people how to be million-dollar guests? Because we're not just Playing small here.

One of the latest ones is I just had— she is a sales coach, DM sales closer. She came on and ended up doing $50K plus from the episode, from one episode.

I think you've become a permanent fixture on the podcast. You might as well be a co-host at this point.

I love it. Do you wanna co-host mine too? Seriously, wouldn't that be more fun?

Should we just combine the podcasts together?

Earn your, earn your boss, babe.

No, I love it. Um, but I'm really excited about this one because I feel like we're gonna just talk about stuff that I've actually not talked about on the podcast before. And I don't know about you, but what's really working for my podcast right now, people are like, how? Like, because I actually took almost an entire year off the podcast, which I thought was the biggest mistake, and I didn't give a shit. I was like, I'm gonna have a baby, I want to take my time.

Something's gotta give.

Yeah, I'll come back when I want to come back. And I thought, okay, well, I'm gonna prepare to start from zero. Turns out that's not been the case at all, and we're actually doing better But the thing that I've shifted is my episodes are now just around one topic and I'm going really deep on one topic. It's popping.

I love that. And it makes so much sense with everything else that's going on in the world too, because I think people wanna, they, they have the problem, you diagnose the problem really well. And I think that's what makes, you know, the, the people out there who are doing really well is they know how to diagnose the problem that the person believes that they have really well. And then you go deep on solving that problem. So it feels like the person has a tangible takeaway where sometimes You listen to a podcast and sometimes there's so much good information that you almost leave the podcast without doing anything.

Yeah.

Because it was just like a plethora and you don't know what you're getting from it, where it's like you just actually got a masterclass on one thing. So I love that. I think it's genius.

Yeah. Which is why I'm very excited about this because we're gonna talk about podcasting, but specifically being a guest on podcasts, which this is a medium I have never tapped into.

Mm-hmm.

Which is so ridiculous because I think I should actually be having this as part of my marketing mix. Every single month.

100% for you.

But I don't think I've really figured out how to be a great guest. And look, I'm not trying to be humble. I'm, I'm a good chitchat. I can go on a podcast, I can deliver a lot of value. I know I'm good at that. Where I'm not good is I don't feel like I— oh, I'm always happy to come on and talk about anything. So I'll tell— I can talk about this and that, and you know, we can go down any kind of rabbit hole and we can have a good chitchat. But I haven't necessarily dialed in. I come on, I have these stories, I speak in these soundbites, and I drive people to this one place. And from the many conversations we've had on this lately, this is what I feel inspired to do. So I'm kind of just treating this as a pick your brain session.

I love it.

So just firstly, for people that aren't aware, what is your stance on being a podcast guest?

Okay. So number one, I just wanna share, I love that you shared that because I think that's really important for people to hear is that even the people who they see dialed in out in the world, They are not dialed in on podcasts, and I will tell you why, and I'll tell you what my stance is on podcast guesting as well. But I, um, this last year we have an Elite Entrepreneur Mastermind. These are incredible people. These are 7-figure and up entrepreneurs. We have some 8-figure entrepreneurs in there, and I had offered a podcast guest spot to them as part of signing up. And what ended up happening is that when it came time to start, you know, planning their podcast, they were so lost. They didn't know what to talk about. Like you said, on what topics, you know, they didn't know what topics, what, what businesses, what portions of their business. They didn't know what they were an expert in. They didn't know how to pitch themselves, meaning even how to open up the podcast. When I say, tell me about yourself, they would get so lost, so confused. They'd say every single podcast they went on, they told a different story.

They, you know, talked about a different portion of their business and they felt like podcasting was just Really good for PR. And I had this realization when I started getting people coming to me telling me what they had produced from being on my podcast, which we'll get into. And some of these testimonials were that people without big names at the time had made $100 grand. Like, I've many of these that I'll tell you from one single episode of showing up on my podcast. We'll talk about what those differences are. But this goes into my stance on why I believe podcast guesting is genius is because Natalie, you and I both pay every single month to have a podcast. I pay anywhere between $5K to $10K depending on how much I want it produced and how much I wanna advertise on YouTube. So you're probably gonna fall for a higher produced show, especially in person, definitely $5K and above. Per month, most likely. And when you think about, you know, what happens when people just get to come on your show, I get to come and sit down in this chair today. I get to come on for free.

I get to sit and bring you my best ideas, and I essentially get to have a verbal sales page to your audience that you have now spent how many years?

Well, now that you say it like that,

but truly this is what we're doing for people.

Yeah.

And this is why we are getting insane testimonials of people coming on my show. And I had this moment where I was like, okay, I know that I've sold my stuff. I know that I've sold out masterminds. I know that I've done that, but what would happen if I went on other people's podcasts? If this girl who kind of didn't have a big business at the time at all, and nobody knew her name, made $100K, this one just made $50K, this one just made $25K, and I will tell you all of those stories and what those businesses are. But I believe this is the most underestimated sales channel that there is right now. And the craziest part is you and I are gonna be able to talk about why it's not hard to stand out because you are in a sea of bad pitches right now and you're in a sea of just okay podcasts because I've done almost 1,700 episodes, a lot of those being interviews. And I will tell you that I've even sat with some of the most brilliant people and I only have A handful, maybe 10-ish that I can actually remember that were mind-blowing episodes.

I can't remember most of them. In fact, right after, a lot of times on the episode, I'm like, I can't tell you fully what I walked away with from that person. And so this is why if you dial this in right now, it is like shooting fish in a barrel for being memorable, for being able to go get in front of other people's audiences and converting them into yours.

I could not agree more. And just, is it called breaking the fourth wall when you bring people behind the scenes? I think it is.

Break the fourth wall. I don't know.

I think it is. They say it on the Housewives. So if they say it on Housewives, it's real. Let me just tell you all what Laurie did there. She is making my life as a host very easy because you've just teed up the entire episode. You've told people why to keep listening, the things that they're gonna learn. You've just dropped so many open loops. As a podcast host, it's the most refreshing thing ever to have someone on the show that knows what they're doing because it makes my— I can like, I can just sit back and relax. Isn't that the best?

You've got this. I love that.

It is. And it's so interesting because I obviously, we get a lot of pictures, you and I. And, um, my, someone on my team, my head of content, brought me a bunch of pictures and we were going through them and she was like, you know what? I've pulled a bunch of these people. They have the most fascinating backgrounds. Mm-hmm. And I wanna put them in front of you. And she was showing me people that are so, so endlessly qualified. But my first question to her was, who else have they been on? Who else's show have they been on? And it wasn't that I was looking for like the top podcasts, but I needed to see how they performed on podcasts.

Mm-hmm.

Because what I find as a host is if someone doesn't know how to interview, it is exhausting to interview them. And so selfishly, I want to pick someone who has done the rounds on even small shows, who has actually got, um, evidence that they can speak, who has got evidence that they can interview. Because I find myself turning down those people, even though it's topics that I'm actually super interested in.

Mm-hmm.

Because I know I have to do, it sounds rude, but 80% of the work.

100%.

It's draining.

Mm-hmm.

What are you looking for when people, firstly, how many pitches a day are you getting and how, what are you looking for in those pitches to say yes or no?

We were just monitoring the inboxes because we get pitched in 3 different emails cuz they find you. They're like, I find you. Um, they find my personal email. We get the customer service emails. And so we think we're getting like 20 plus a day from all different, in different, all different emails.

Yeah.

So I've seen it all. You have seen it all.

And seen it all. It's like the Wild West out there.

And I, I don't want this to like distract you guys or, or make you like, you know, feel like you can't, it's not going to work when you pitch, when you hear this number. I delete within 5 seconds most often. 5 seconds. And so I think some of the most important things on there is you have to think, how can I make this person's job super easy? So I am always looking for exactly what you said. One of the first things I look for is let me hear them talk. Like, let me hear them talk. And who else have they, who do they have proximity to? Like whose show have they been on? Uh, what's their street cred? So if you have street cred, which we can talk about if you don't necessarily have it. There's a lot of other ways that you can stand out other than just street cred. But some of the podcast pitches that get my attention are, she just was on Today's Show or something like that. Yeah. Or was just featured on, you know, Natalie Ellis, Boss Babe. And so a lot of times what happens to a host is we can get kind of lazy, not in a bad way, we're just busy.

Okay. So it's like, if she was good enough for Natalie, she's good enough for me. Thank you. We assume that the other person did the vetting for us.

Yes, I do.

And this truly is, that's what, you know, that's, We talk a lot about this in my program in Million Dollar Guests because that is the trust transfer. There's so much about proximity that helps you skip the line. So if you have anything like that, if you've even been in someone's mastermind, like I can't tell you, I was in Lewis Howes' mastermind for 2 years and even just telling people that, because number one, it was like, oh, she invested and she invested in someone with a big name and she's learning from them. That gave me so much street cred that I did not. really understand until later, but it got me so many different opportunities. So what I'm looking for is some form of standout credibility. I want to be able to hear you speak. I want to know that you've done other podcasts because, Natalie, you and I have been in this game a long time. I did not start a podcast for 10 years and put, you know, 4 episodes a week and however much money that is, $5K times, you know, 10 years. To have a newbie on. It's just not the place to pitch early if you're brand new to podcasts.

And look, I know that you probably have a really incredible story because there's somebody right now going, but I have an amazing story. Okay, but here's the deal. Nellie and I don't want you to come on our podcast when you don't know how to tell it yet because it will be wasted and people will associate your name with not being prepared. And what will happen is you'll blow that opportunity. So go on 10 to 20 smaller shows, learn how to really tell that story so that when you come on a bigger show with a bigger opportunity, you're gonna crush it and you're gonna know exactly what to do with all of that attention. Because right now I can tell you, even though you have a good story, what are you gonna do with all that attention once you get it?

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yes,

I can— so this is being very truthful. I will delete without opening because I see a preview And when I see, hello, Natalie and Danielle, I'm like, my love, it's been 4 years. I don't know what to tell you, but if you haven't done research in 4 years, I'm not gonna have you on the show. Yeah. Like, not trying to be rude, but if you are pitching and, and then sometimes I'll open them and I, I will actually respond cuz they'll say, I'm an avid listener of your show. And I'll reply saying, if you were, you would've sent a different email.

Mm-hmm.

I'm just letting you know, if you're pitching yourself, please do a bit more research. Yeah. Because It's not going to work. And I want to give them that feedback. And I don't want to be a bitch about it. And at the same time, it's like applying for a job, right? And you apply to the wrong person's name, it's not going to work. You have to put the effort in and think about how you are actually approaching it. So I absolutely love that. And yes, agree on going on shows and don't kind of waste the opportunity because also we will tell you, not every episode makes it out. And that's hard. How do you handle that?

Oh, this is a hard one. 'Cause sometimes I'm like, maybe they just won't notice if I don't post it. Yeah. You know, I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be totally honest 'cause I have talked about this before. Sometimes I will say that the audio like did not work out or the audio got messed up, or once in a while it'll be like, hey, it's just maybe, I'm trying to even think back. I haven't actually said if it didn't resonate or it's not a great podcast. I haven't necessarily given that feedback. That one's tough for me. Um, and I haven't done it very often, so I will say it's usually like, I might tell you the audio got messed up, which is not a great thing. I'm just being honest.

Yeah. So if you, if you get that feedback from someone, read between the lines. You know what it is.

You know what it is. But I will say the other thing that I look for is, uh, people pitch themselves. I'm actually looking for you to pitch the conversation.

Ooh, say more.

So I wanna know what we're gonna talk about and what that interview is going to look like. I wanna know what the title is going to be, and I wanna know what some of the almost these mic drop moments are going to be? Do you have frameworks that we're going to be going through? How am I selling this to my audience? And also the other thing is, how are you going to put this out to your audience? Like, how are you going to get exposure for it? Because I relate this back to when I was in the fitness world, and a lot of people don't know, but I came from, um, back in the day, I used to be on fitness magazine covers. Well, what people don't know is that it took me 4 years to get— of pitching myself to get on those magazine covers. And so 4 years of promoting myself, pitching myself, doing new photo shoots, saying, hey, look at me, don't I look shredded in this? Like, hey, I'm your fitness girl. And what changed that finally got me to land on the covers is to understand that they're a business.

When I finally understood what the magazine wanted and that who the people were behind the, um, the, the powers that be to say yes. And so number one, they're people. They want relationships just like you and I. They want to work with people they like. They want to like have a good day on set shooting someone who's nice and fun and normal. And they also have a job to do. They have numbers to hit. They have interesting angles that they need to promote. And so I finally started going, what would make me An easy yes. Like what makes me the very interesting choice while helping them grow their business and making it easier for them, make, make their job easier.

Mm-hmm.

And so when you're thinking about a podcast, we are a business. Podcasting is a business. It's not just fun to do. Yes, we get great benefits out of it, but now that you are, you know, I do 4 episodes a week. It's a, it is a business for me. It's a huge sales channel in a way that I, um, bring people into my world. And so when you start pitching, I really wanna think about, you know, when I think about you, Natalie, I'm like, okay, well, I'm going to, uh, thank you so much for having me on this episode because, and, and how I'm gonna show my gratitude and also hope to get invited back again someday in the future. I'm gonna promote this episode. I'm probably gonna make some of my own reels. I might even air this on my own podcast. If you have a podcast after you air it first as etiquette of obviously letting you get all those views, then getting it over to my channel. Putting it on my YouTube, putting it in my email. And what I'm also gonna do is I'm gonna do stories. Look whose podcast I was just on.

Like, I am going to promote the crap out of this because I'm excited about it and because you gave me the opportunity. And it is a moment of, wow, thank you so much for, you know, from your perspective, thanks for getting my podcast out there, for making my life easier. This was a great guest. This helped the show grow. And also I prepped like crazy for this podcast so that I hope to beat a lot of your numbers so you remember me. I hope that this gets more downloads. And so when I'm pitching someone, I include things like that.

Mm-hmm.

So I love seeing that. I just had a girl pitch me and she said, here's all the ways I'm going to promote the show. And I talk about this in my media kit, uh, template that I can give you guys for free. It's milliondollarguest.com/media-kit. And I add this in there saying, how are you going to promote the show? Because people love to see that. So that one's really big for me too. Because I wanna know, is this gonna help me grow my show? Because at the end of the day, that's what we're all looking for.

Yeah. And just to echo that, you do not have to have a massive following.

No.

To do that.

Not at all.

We all know you can have a small niche following and they can be so engaged that your numbers will be so high. Yeah. Or you can be so good as a guest that your numbers will be so high. I don't see a correlation between follower count and podcast downloads. Yeah. Which is always really interesting. It's the quality of the episode, it's the title that we used, it's whether that person promoted it. Um, one of my most viral episodes was Seth Godin, and this blew up the show a couple years ago. And I was wondering, why did it do that? Well, it turns out, one, he's an incredible guest, absolutely incredible. Yeah. Two, he has a blog where he gets millions and millions a week of people that go there. He doesn't have his own YouTube channel, but on his blog, he links out to his name on YouTube. And so he drives a ton of traffic to his own name. And the way that was all set up just blew me away. And that episode, while yes, he's well known, he's not the biggest guest that I've had by far. That episode is still growing my show.

Mm-hmm. And I don't even feel like I need to know or that you have really big numbers.

Yeah.

So for me, I have had a lot of guests on that don't have big followings because they've pitched a really good conversation topic, and it could be a unique perspective on that or an opposing perspective of maybe what's trending right now. And for me, I really, really am for the most part booking the conversation. So anybody listening who's thinking, I don't have that big of a following, I don't think that's what hosts are always looking for at all. That is another reason why I think this is a really overlooked sales channel for people is because You don't have to be somebody who's out there already doing something really big. If you can communicate well, that's what we're looking for. Because how many times have you listened to a podcast with someone that you didn't even know who they were because you follow the host?

Yeah.

And there's somebody who you just met them, air quotes, that moment on the podcast, and all of a sudden you became a diehard fan.

And go buy all that product. And go over time.

Yeah. And you don't know if the following is big or not. You have no idea. You just followed the conversation, which made you follow the person.

Yeah, exactly. That happens all the time. Okay. So, and I say all of that too, we are being selective because our show is a job for us. Our show only does well if we are selective about who we bring on, the conversations that we have. You know, we take that trust really important. So we're gonna go and vet someone that comes on. I wanna know. Do you have a good reputation? You know, if I'm going to associate my name with yours, is that a good thing? I want to know all of that. And so I think it's really important that you do keep a clean online profile. And when I search your name, I can see some good stuff that then tells me, okay, you know what, this is a good person to have on. You're going to have a good conversation. Okay, so I have a bunch of questions, but first I really want to highlight the opportunity here because you've, you've, you've alluded to it, but like— Tell me a little bit more about what you're seeing as what kind of results people can drive as a guest. Because I actually, which is so funny because I've been in this industry for a long time too, I didn't know.

And you know what's going to be crazy is that when you start asking some people who have been on your podcast, because now you're going to want to ask like, hey, could you tell me some of the results that have happened? I cannot. They're like, oh yeah, let me actually tell you because some mind-blowing things have happened. So, you know, our friend Samantha Skelly.

Yes.

She came on the show about 8 years ago. So mind you, my show was smaller. She didn't have a big name yet at all. She, I think she probably, what, had in the 10,000-ish of, of Instagram followers. And I had gotten to, uh, connected to her through a friend. So I didn't know of her from the world. I knew of her from a mutual connection who introed her to me. They're like, hey, you know, she has this, uh, thing called Hungry for Happiness. I think you'd really love it. I was talking a lot about just health and wellness at the time. And she came on the show. We had a great conversation. Something that she did really well is she knew exactly who she was talking to.

Ooh, yes, yes, yes, yes.

When she came on the podcast, some of the first things that she started talking about were the pain points of her ideal client. And we didn't talk to everyone. We talked to the person who was struggling with food noise and food addiction. And we went so hard and deep on that. And the other thing that she did really well from the beginning was she mentioned from the top that she had the solution. So you are gonna stay and listen to the end because you know that she is planting seeds about the fact that she has the, the solution to your problem and that she gets you. You know, she gets you, she's been in your shoes. And the other thing is we had good chemistry. So the trust transfer from my audience of what I had built up for years to then go to Samantha was crazy, right? Because it's like, okay, Lori did the vetting, they have really good chemistry, Lori did a really great bio and kind of propped her up, and now let her run. And so, uh, 30 days after that show aired, she ended up making $100K. Through the show, all came through the show.

Can you imagine going on a podcast and not realizing like, hey, this would be cool if like a few people signed up, but because of all of those different things. And if you go back and you listen to the episode, you know what we talk about Million Dollar Guest all the time is there is an, there's a formula. You are following an entire, uh, journey on how to start the conversation. uh, create that credibility and then bring them all the way through and have them go exactly where you want them to go. It's a strategy. There is such a huge strategy behind this that people don't realize. So that's one version. Um, one of the latest ones is I just had, uh, a, a woman on named Jillian Murphy. She is a, like a, uh, sales coach, DM sales closer. Uh, she came on and ended up doing $50K. Wow. Plus from the episode, from one episode.

That's amazing.

Um, we have Natalia Benson who came on and she landed a $25K client. I have Leah Garvin who just came on and she, um, had someone reach out to join her $20K coaching. Uh, literally the list goes on and on. I had Jess Glazer come in and she, this was when she had, I think, less than 10K followers at the time. She came on the podcast and talked about a program where she was teaching people how to just launch an online course based off of, you know, a skillset that they have. And this again, I think was probably around 7 or 8 years ago. So smaller, smaller followings, nobody knew who she was. And for the most part came on and she had a $5K program that she was launching. Well, she ended up making $25K, I think it was. I believe it was like in a couple of days on the podcast.

Wow.

From going on the podcast. And I thought, okay, I've had to ask a lot of these people what happened. Imagine if I started going through my whole list. Yes. Asking what happened. And so I believe you just had Brooke.

Yeah.

On your podcast. So I had asked her what she had gotten and she gave me testimonials. She's like, well, honestly, using your podcast got me booked on other big podcasts. So thank you so much for that.

That's amazing.

And also sold a bunch of books and she gave me a whole spiel of what happened from the podcast. So Natalie, I can literally only imagine what's actually happened on your podcast. I feel like we need to like have some sort of like follow-up with guests after work to find out.

Yeah, I might add a follow-up into the sequence to just a month later email and just say, hey, was it good for you? Did it support? What did, what did we do that worked?

Yeah.

Just so we can do more of it. Also, what I was thinking too, as you was, you were naming all these names, knowing a bunch of these are your friends, which you've always talked about. Podcasting is such a great way to network and to actually make friends.

Yeah.

Because you are spending an hour sitting with someone, often in person, which is really nice, where you really get to know someone. And it's such a great— I, I know so many people I've connected with is because I did their show or they did mine. Mm-hmm. And after that 1 hour, you know if you like them or not.

I started podcasting because I was, I believed I was more of an introvert back in the day. I learned really quickly that when you're around people you really like, You're a little more extroverted.

Yeah.

So I think now I'm an introverted extrovert. But with that said, you know, I, I lived in Los Angeles and I didn't wanna have to go to all the networking events. And I thought, how can I get access to the people I would never normally have access to? And I know this is part of why you have a podcast as well.

Mm-hmm.

It's a great way to get access to people you wouldn't get access to. And I also wanted to bring them to me and meet all of these people. And essentially I selfishly wanted to get coached by incredible people.

Yes. It's the best.

For an hour. Like, I just asked them questions that I really wanted to know. And I think that that also authentically creates a really great podcast, like to create those conversations. But podcasting is incredible for that. And that goes for podcast guesting as well. You get to go sit for an hour with someone. And by the way, all of those people that I mentioned, a majority of them were not my friends before that. They actually became friends from those exact moments of dropping in. For an hour with someone. And in person is like nothing else. Like if you, if you can have the ability to book a podcast and fly in person to sit, really get to know them, feel the energy, but then also have the amazing podcast clips afterward that can live on forever, that you can create 100 pieces of content from. Like Natalie Maria Wendt came on my podcast and I think she has made 15 or 20 clips from our podcast.

Mm-hmm.

And, uh, they pretty much go viral every single one. And she asked me to collab on each one. I'm like, absolutely, because you are making these go viral. So let's do it. And that is a prime example of how to make one single episode just keep on going for you. And also that single episode that you could continue to recycle for 3 months, 6 months, a year. It also makes you look like you're on a million podcasts. You could literally have been on one podcast. I could go to your page and see it recycled over and over. And in my head, if those are good clips, I'm going to think that you're the expert in that arena from that.

It's so funny that you mentioned Maria because as you were saying that of flying in, literally I was thinking Maria because I remember talking to her and when it's, when I was recording in Austin, she actually flew in to record with me and I was like, listen, if it's easier, I will do virtual. I don't love doing virtual, but I know you'll be a good guest. And she'd said, no, I only do in person. It only pays off for me when I do it in person. And since that, I've now grown a really close friendship with her from meeting in person and doing that together. And same thing using the clips. Okay, so we're gonna get into it. I want the specifics. You've mentioned a few times now the media kit. I found out about media kit because, um, this was in 2019. I had someone on the podcast you might have heard of, Mel Robbins.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

So Mel was well known, but she wasn't as known as she is now.

Right.

Right. So she was well known-ish. I didn't know tons about her work, but I knew of her. She was coming on the show, and ahead of time she'd sent me a media kit. Now, embarrassingly, this was the first time that I'd seen one. I wasn't in the habit of booking a lot of professional guests. I was kind of just anyone that would be willing. So she sent me this media kit, and it was so brilliant. And so she had on here And this was 2019 too. Now we always, 7 years later, we hear speak in soundbites, do, we hear all of that, right? This was not talked about so much back then. She sent me this media kit and it had, here's the main stories that I think would resonate with your audience. Here's what I think will go viral. Here's what I think you should ask me. And it was so succinct. It was so well done. And it made my job as a host very easy because I just had this sheet and I'm like, okay, let me just read word for word. these questions. And so we published that episode, and within the first couple of weeks, I gained over 10,000 followers on YouTube.

The podcast went so mega viral. We actually used the hook she gave us to put on the COVID of the video. We clipped it. I mean, I couldn't believe how well this did.

Mm-hmm.

And that was my first introduction to a media kit. And you would think I learned my lesson to do my own, but it's so funny because I was on Amy Porterfield's Um, during a podcast during my book launch, and she was like, send me your media kit. I'm like, you know, you'd think by now that I would have one. I'm going to build this. And so I want you to help me with this. Mm-hmm. Because I really saw from Mel's, that was the, the difference between a great guest and just one you have to do a lot of work for.

Mm-hmm.

So for a newbie like me, what exactly is a media kit and what goes into a good one?

Okay. Your media kit is like a one-page audition. Essentially it is you. Just sending your life's work to someone, all of the most important pieces of work that you've done and the things that you know work for you. So for you, you would be a dream for me. Essentially, you should just let me do your media kit.

Yes, please.

I feel like it's easier when friends do it, and that's a great idea. Sit down with a friend and say, what do you know me for? But what I would do for you is I would say, what are your most viral pieces of content? So for example, Shelby Sapp came in and did a podcast with me. And she has an extremely viral piece of content that went viral for her first about overcoming 6 sales objections in 60 seconds.

I even know the piece that you're talking about.

You know exactly what I'm talking about. And so on every podcast she did after that, she did Jay Shetty's, she did mine, she did a couple other really big shows on this like flight out to Los Angeles. What clip do you think she recorded with all of us? Overcoming 6 Sales Objections in 60 Seconds. And when Shelby sat down in the chair, she said, this is the video that you should clip for Reels because it will go viral. Did I care that I knew it was gonna be on 4 other shows? Absolutely not. Do you know why I didn't care? It went viral. And so nobody was saying, I saw this.

Yeah.

50 other times. It went viral.

We put out a lot of content, Reels, carousels, YouTube, this podcast, and for every piece, Someone on my team is hunting for the right clip or image to go along with it. Now, Storyblocks has made that part really, really easy. It's actually a 100% human-made stock media library, which has footage, music, sound effects, templates, and images, all made by professional filmmakers and artists, never AI-generated, which is pretty rare right now. We can grab visuals that actually look on brand, and everything is already pre-licensed and ready to use, which makes it really, really easy. It's unlimited downloads under one subscription. So if you are creating content every week, you always have a library to actually pull from. You can head to storyblocks.com/bossbabe to access the human-made stock media library that is essential to my workflow. And for a limited time, they are offering 15% off any annual plan. And that discount is only available through my link. Again, that's storyblocks.com/bossbabe for 15% off annual plans. The seasons change and my body notices it before I do. The mornings get darker, the calendar gets fuller, and everything feels a bit slower to start. That's when I go back to the basics, and I do love AG1 every morning, first thing.

AG1 Next Gen has more than 75 ingredients— vitamins, minerals, pre- and probiotics, superfoods— and it's backed by 4 separate clinical trials. Key nutrient levels improved within 3 months of consistent use. It's also formulated to support immune defense, which is exactly what I need going into this time of year. It's peace of mind that I'm getting comprehensive nutrition while everything else speeds up. This season's going to change either way. I'd rather be ready for it. Go to drinkag1.com/bossbabe and for a limited time get a free immune support bundle including a bottle of omega-3 fish oil and a bottle of vitamin D3 K2 with your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro. That's drinkag1.com/bossbabe. That's drinkag1.com/bossbabe. That's— I just want to underline that because you can think a viral moment is a one-hit wonder, but if it's gone viral once, it's probably going to go viral again.

Yes.

Okay.

So what I would do for you, if you specifically, you know, you had mentioned at the, the top of the show that you are finding this like niche that works really well for your show of focusing on one topic. I would focus in on a topic you are excited about right now that has to do with something you are offering. And this is, this is a very important piece of a media kit. You might be known for something, but maybe you're not selling that thing right now. Maybe you've really pivoted in your offers. So for me, I was known for fitness for a long time. Does it look really good for me to say 10-time cover model, fitness world champion? Yeah, that looks good. But guess what? It's not really even in my media kit. Like, I'll use it a little bit, but no topics are going to be around that at all because that's not what I'm offering right now. So for you, I would say, what are you offering? What's the final destination that you want people at? Because we are going to work backwards from where you want your people to end up.

We're working backwards from where you want your people to end up from your media kit pitch, like literally from how we're building your credibility in your bio. So I'm going to find that offer that you want people to funnel into, and we're literally actually going to redo your bio around that. Like, what makes you credible now for this within your bio? And now we're going to talk about those topics and we are, uh, that have been going viral for you. And we're going to look at your most viral pieces of content that relate back to that offer. And we're going to create the topics from that. And then we're going to take it a step further and say, okay, what stories are you going to tell? What could we name the title of these so that that podcast host can really even see the title to the topics? Do you have any frameworks around this? Because we're also going to pepper that in and say, here's the frameworks they're going to learn. Here's what your, um, Your listeners are gonna walk away with. So we're gonna make you such an expert in those things, and we're gonna say, here's the viral reel clips that we can do, and you're gonna maybe put 3 in there and show that they went viral for you.

That is how you get an, like, an ultimate yes. Like, you'll get yeses. I, I'm so excited for you because you're gonna get yeses across the board because you're gonna build around that and show all of the credibility and how it's gonna help them do the same thing, go viral.

And do you think, so hearing that, that makes me think, you know what, I need to be now testing on social media a bunch of shorter form content to see what takes off and goes viral, which I also realize I've not been thinking this way and doing.

Mm-hmm. For sure. I think what you can do is you already have so many viral pieces of content. You have so many carousels. Your carousels alone could become topics and things that you're talking on. And I, I love this about the content world right now, and this really opened, uh, things up for me recently, is if you have a— because I, I like doing carousels. They feel a lot more easy to me than talking head or reaction videos. I'm learning, we're getting there. But with that, I'm like, okay, what am I gonna do for my talking head video? What am I gonna do for my reaction video? Well, what was I doing in my carousel? Now I'm just using that in a different format. Mm-hmm. So for you, what I would do is just take the things you're already so good at. In those, you know, your carousels, your quotes, and just turn those into the short form, like talking head pieces. So if it was a hook that really worked, you're going to open with those hooks and you're going to open with those topics. So that's why you are a dream, a dream person to make a media kit for and short form content for.

And these mic drop moments or soundbites is because you have your soundbites already written out. And so when you think of a soundbite, you guys, you know, Natalie had mentioned it as well. Speaking in soundbites is so important on podcasts. And opening with a soundbite or closing with a soundbite, you probably have those in quote form all over your pages.

Ooh, yeah, you're right.

That you're known for.

Yeah.

You just need to start speaking them too.

And I think just, I just needed to hear how to lay it all out as well and how it all fits in. And that probably goes for a lot of people listening, like they actually already have stuff they can use.

Yes.

But I think it's so easy for us to look at everyone else and think everyone else has got it all set up. I don't have what I need. And then when you reflect it back to me, I'm realizing, wait, I've already done a lot of this. It's just putting it together and piecing it together.

So for example, um, you know, cuz I want people to be able to put this together. Like you had said, one of my talking head videos that went, um, viral was about I pay to be around rich people. So one of the topics on my media kit is literally, um, the title I put is How Being Around Rich People Compressed 10 Years into 1 Year. And then the topic is why I pay to be around rich people, how getting in the right rooms changed everything for my business. That one piece of content informed an entire podcast episode that I could do. And that is what you're gonna start looking at is if you're like, man, what topics do I talk about? It's a lot easier than you think. Go look at your page or go look at someone who is in your, um, you know, a, a direct, uh, competitor and see what's working for them as well, because I guarantee If you guys are talking about the same thing, they have, you know, it's kind of your 10 by 10 rule.

Yeah.

Go and look at what's going viral for them. Can you create a conversation around that?

And I'm curious, you mentioned Shelby, who I, I feel like she did the rounds on so many big podcasts. What was it like interviewing someone like Shelby versus someone who maybe hasn't prepared as much? What did Shelby do that really blew you away and you thought, you know what, that really shows she's done her homework or knows what she's doing?

Shelby has frameworks for everything.

Ooh, okay.

And I feel like when people really come in with strong frameworks and when you ask a question, they have a specific way of solving it, our brains love that. So if you ask a question on overcoming objections, it's like she would say, I can't remember everything right now, but it's like, okay, oh, here's the framework for that, or here's how I first position it, or here's what you look at. And our brains love knowing that we are going to go down This very specific route of solving a problem. And so I used to get really overwhelmed with this because I'm not a linear person. And I was like, well, I don't have any frameworks. And so I, even when I was creating Million Dollar Guest, the accelerator that I'm doing, I didn't really have specific frameworks. I knew what I teach and I'm a great teacher, but it was the first time in my life that I sat and made a framework for every single week. And I felt like such a clear teacher. It felt good for me.

Yeah.

It felt great for me. And as you know, the, the people who were learning, I really watched the difference in how they were reacting compared to how I normally teach. And it's such a, they're able to walk away with something and something tangible and walk them through something. And then the worksheets and all the things, they got an actual result from these steps that you're starting here and we're gonna end here. And so, If you're feeling like, I don't have any frameworks, it doesn't take that long to go, you know, this is the way that I coach, this is what I do. And I'll tell you guys how to come up with, with frameworks if you don't. I mean, Claude is freaking amazing and, and so genius at this point that it helped me come up with these because like I said, I'm not very linear. So I sat and I Whisperflowed, which they should be sponsoring this episode. I know. I sat and I Whisperflowed and I said, I don't know what my framework is for this, but this is what I walk them through. This is how I teach. This is what this looks like.

Here's where they start. Here's all the things that I'm gonna say. Here's what I do. Can you help me come up with a framework for this? And so then I got very specific on what type of framework. I was like, I know a lot of times that you wanna create, you know, um, acronyms and things that rhyme, but I said, I want all my frameworks to be so easy that people can remember them, that I want them to be named, that if they read what the steps were, they knew exactly what they were supposed to do from that. name. Because you know how sometimes it can be like—

Too much.

I'm gonna teach pitch and it's gonna be P-I-T-C-H, but the words don't really make sense for teaching it.

Yeah, you're just like fitting the word in for the sake of it.

Fitting the words in. And so I got really clear on that and decided to just go with one of the frameworks that felt good for me. And I think that's the other thing is it's not gonna feel like, oh my God, this is groundbreaking genius. Just go with the framework that feels easiest and most clear for you if you were new to understand? And what happened is now I have this whole structure on how to teach and what I'm doing. And so guests who have frameworks, you'll start hearing it in podcasts. And we were talking about Daniel Priestley. That man has a framework for everything. Dan Martell, I asked him, cuz I have this theory on frameworks that I believe the people who are the most successful in the world have the most frameworks. I asked Dan Martell how many frameworks he has. He has over 700.

Yep. I believe it.

And he's like, I will not. He's like, I believe in framework. People love, your brain loves frameworks.

Yeah.

And so come up with a framework around what you do, even if you don't think that it exists. So that's what I think is different with a lot of guests is I sit down and I'm like, my brain just loves this cuz you just told me what I'm gonna learn. I can't wait to learn it and let's keep going.

I want everyone listening, even if you are not gonna be a podcast guest, I want you to listen to that because it is the one thing I always, always coach on too when I You know, I'll be helping a client put together a funnel, a webinar, something like that. And I say, okay, what's your framework? You should be teaching a framework in a webinar. This is your IP. People are going to buy from you because you have IP. They're not going to buy from you because you have knowledge. ChatGPT has knowledge. What is your IP? And when they don't have one, I say, well, I'm not helping you sell this till you go figure out your framework, come back to me, then we'll put it together. But the framework is going to be the thing that decides whether it succeeds or not. And for me personally, you know, I've been on a journey the last few years learning how to speak on stage, I used to have this recurring dream that I'd get on stage and I had no words and I'd just stand there in silence. And what I've learned is if I go onto stage with a framework, I'm never worried I won't know what to say because I have a framework.

Mm-hmm.

You could gimme a whiteboard, I can scribble it out and I can teach a framework and you can make that framework last 5 minutes or an hour.

Yes.

But a framework gives you a structure to put all of your knowledge in. And you are right, any guests that I have that I absolutely love and learn so much from and connect with, they have a framework, they've done research, they bring up, oh, when I looked at this, this is what we found, or here's the 4-step process I walk people through. You lean into that. Mm-hmm. You really want that. So putting you on the spot here, what's one of your favorite frameworks for teaching people how to be million-dollar guests? Because we're not just playing small here. You believe, and correct me if I'm wrong, you believe you can build a million-dollar business being a guest, right?

Yes. Yes, for sure. I mean, we, we've, we've seen it. Okay. We've, uh, you know, you actually brought the case study to me of Daniel Priestley.

Yes.

And he talks about how he went on Diary of a CEO, like the first time that he went on, that man was extremely prepared. If you go and you listen to that episode, he taught a lot of frameworks and he made a million dollars from one episode. Now, I'm not saying you're gonna make a million dollars from one episode, but you can. But what I am saying is that if you do this and you do this for a year or 2 years or 3 years, this is of course going to add up to probably some really good cash for you, depending on how good of a guest that you become. Because Natalie, what do you want for your show? A great guest. Yeah. And there aren't a ton of great guests out there. And I, that is the not easy to say, but also it's the truth. And while they're amazing people, they're brilliant in what they do, they're not great guests. So, I have a framework $4 million guest, which is how you are going to position yourself on show from— on the show from, um, beginning to end. And that is position, prepare, profit, perform, presence, and then putting yourself on a podcast tour.

So we want a repeatable process after that. And what's really interesting is when you start going down this path, especially on the first one in prepare, You realize how much of your business is not yet structured to scale.

Ooh, okay. Say more about that and walk me through the process, 'cause I already— yes, there's ahas going off.

So what happens when somebody comes into the program is we look at their messaging. What are we talking about and what are we selling and what do you want to be known for on that podcast episode? And what happens is they realize they don't have their messaging intact for anything in their business. They're like, well, I have this over here. I have this program. I have this offer. Sometimes I say I'm this and talk over here. Sometimes I say that I'm this and talk over here. And what we end up having to do is just pick one so that we can cut through the noise because we know that when you talk to everybody, you talk to nobody. So right away, when you're positioning yourself from the top for a podcast, you realize your business is kind of a little bit messy right now. And it's probably why a lot of things aren't working. Positioning also really goes into What are you going to offer while you're on there? And we talk more about that in Profit, but you have to know what that plan is from the very, very top. And they're like, well, I could offer this, I could offer that.

And I'm like, no, no, no, we can't offer 4 things. We have to go on and be known for one thing. The message has to be clear and we have to be driving towards one thing. So positioning shows in your business, where are you totally disjointed? Where are you talking all over the place? And so one of the testimonials that we keep getting back is that it's the most clear that they've ever felt everywhere in their business. They're nailing sales calls. They're doing great in their email marketing because now they understand who they are out in the world and what they should be talking about. So I think that that's the big thing that I see all the time is in week 1, people are getting some of the biggest ahas around positioning because they find that their social media is not positioned for it either. Their bio's totally unclear. They just pitched one topic to a podcast, and when the host goes and looks at their bio, they're not even talking about it. They have no content about it. So it's all very related.

I love this so much. I could not agree more. It is such a beautiful exercise in just dialing in across the board.

And

also as a podcast host, I love it. I, every time I sit down with a guest, I say, okay, what are we pushing to at the end? I want to know, how do I help you? You know, you're giving me your time, you're pouring into my audience. I want to know. know that there's a place that people can go. But if they don't know, or they give me loads of different ones, I sometimes feel confused as to, well, how do I tee that up for you? We love clear. Like, I want people to come on here and get tons of clients. I want them to get tons of sales. So I love that. Okay, what's next?

So prepare. This is where you were talking about what Mel Robbins did for you so well. And what we do is we put together a little package of what you're going to send the host after you get the yes.

Okay.

This is your topics. This is your questions that you are going to be your zone of genius at answering. This is really important because, Natalie, I— if I have you on my show, I want to get the very best out of you, not only for you, but for the best chances of my show doing really well. And so I don't want to just guess at what Natalie wants to talk about. I don't wanna just scroll through your Instagram and be like, I'll create questions off of what she's been talking about recently. It doesn't mean that I am gonna word for word ask every single question, but if you send me questions that will absolutely get the best out of you, like I wanna know what your frameworks are for going viral. And if I don't know how to get your zone of genius of what I believe actually the audience will want the most, then I'm kind of, we're just, we're just guessing over here and the show's not gonna be that great. So people are like, oh, I don't know. I, you know, I don't know if I should send questions. I don't know if that's a good thing.

I think host etiquette, you can say, hey, I wanted to send you the questions that will put me in my zone of genius to share my best work. Feel free to ask anything outside of this as well, but I wanted to give you a guide.

Yeah.

So we give you this sheet that's not long. But what we do is we position it in a way that helps you get into your absolute zone of genius. And what we've done is that week we work backwards from your offer and what you wanna be known for. So if you're gonna go on the show and you have something right now, let's just use me for example. I wanna teach people how to profit off of other people's podcasts. So I'm talking about what I'm talking about with you. I have positioned it and I've sent you questions that will get me into my zone of genius around this topic. And so what we do is we work backwards and we say, what questions will help you, uh, tell the stories that are going to make you credible? Because we need a story, like a credibility story. We need a story that helps overcome objections. We need a story that lets the listener know that you get them. So we need that like same story, and we want some testimonials. And so what you guys didn't realize is this, through this whole podcast, we've given you almost all of those stories at this point where if you had any questions in your head around, does she get me?

Wait, is this a real like opportunity right now? Okay, who's done it? Okay, how is this done? And then thinking of any other objections, I, we're, we're covering pretty much the whole gamut. So that's in week 2, prepare. And we are just essentially working backwards from your offer and creating those stories.

We put out a lot of content, reels, carousels, YouTube, this podcast, and for every piece, someone on my team is hunting for the right clip or image to go along with it. Now, Storyblocks has made that part really, really easy. It's actually a 100% human-made stock media library, which has footage, music, sound effects, templates, and images all made by professional filmmakers and artists. Never AI generated, which is pretty rare right now. We can grab visuals that actually look on brand and everything is already pre-licensed and ready to use, which makes it really, really easy. It's unlimited downloads under one subscription. So if you are creating content every week, you always have a library to actually pull from. You can head to storyblocks.com/bossbabe to access the human-made stock media library that is essential to my workflow. And for a limited time, they are offering 15% off any annual plan, and that discount is only available through my link. Again, that's storyblocks.com/boss babe for 15% off annual plans. The seasons change and my body notices it before I do. The mornings get darker, the calendar gets fuller, and everything feels a bit slower to start. That's when I go back to the basics.

And I do love AG1 every morning first thing. AG1 Next Gen has more than 75 ingredients— vitamins, minerals, pre- and probiotics, superfoods— and it's backed by 4 separate clinical trials. Key nutrient levels improved within 3 months of consistent use. It's also formulated to support immune defense, which is exactly what I need going into this time of year. It's peace of mind that I'm getting comprehensive nutrition while everything else speeds up. This season's going to change either way. I'd rather be ready for it. Go to drinkag1.com/bossbabe and for a limited time get a free immune support bundle including a bottle of omega-3 fish oil and a bottle of vitamin D3 K2 with your first subscription order of AG1 Next Gen or AG1 Pro. That's drinkag1.com/bossbabe. That's drinkag1.com/bossbabe. Yeah. And on the host side, I just wanna say we also love when people send over questions. It never feels micromanagey. It's like, great, send me anything you've got. And then often I will then send them a prep sheet too. They can look over it. Everyone can feel prepped. You'll have a conversation beforehand. Everyone feels clear. Clear is kind.

Clear is kind. I love it so much.

What's next?

So then we go into profit, which most people don't have this one at all, which is shocking to me. I guess not shocking cuz I didn't have it either, so I don't know what I'm talking about.

I, I don't have it either, but I'm going to, I'm going to learn from you and I'm gonna do all the things cuz you're exposing me. I feel like you're doing an exposé right now.

I love it. I love that. I will have it. I can't wait to watch the testimonial afterward. I'm like, it's gonna be so crazy with you. Okay, so profit. What, how are you going to lead people into your world to be able to profit? And from that conversation, what is the best place for that person to go first in order for you to profit. Now, here's the thing. There's a million different paths to profit, especially for someone like you. And, you know, some people, you know, the, the testimonials that I shared, a lot of them were straight to DM to a high ticket.

Interesting.

I know.

Wow.

So you do a good enough job of being able to really speak to the pain point of the person. And do a great job of showing them exactly how you're gonna solve that problem, which you do so beautifully on social media.

Yeah.

Um, I heard recently, which, uh, really, really helped me understand how to even position myself, and this is what you do beautifully, and this will help with the offer, is the more that you can show kind of these frameworks and show yourself in action of what you do, the more likely they are to say yes to you. So instead of just like talking about the thing, like actually show yourself in action. Like, how do you solve it? What are the frameworks? Give me the frameworks that your likelihood of that person wanting to follow is a lot, or even join your, your, um, product is a lot bigger. So you do that beautifully. So within your offer, what you're gonna do through that, um, through, through the profit conversation is you just kind of have to pick for the one conversation. Where you're going to send them. Now, here's where, uh, going and doing a lot of podcasts is super helpful because for you, maybe you do a low-ticket offer and you go on a big podcast and you're like, that really didn't produce a lot for me, or I didn't really like how they came into my world.

I think a better way for them would be this. So testing, changing the conversation a bit and where you want to send them is going to be huge. So for me, You know, with this podcast, we're talking a lot about pitching. We're talking about getting on podcasts. I'm sending people to my media kit and from there I can nurture them. So that's kind of my goal right now. And I want to just pull fully back the curtain for people right now to say, you know, we had a conversation, where do we send them? Because my program is not evergreen at this time. It's a live accelerator because I'm still getting data from the program, which by the way, you guys, Natalie helped me so much with this program. We'll break that down another time. Yeah. Um,

I'll come on your show and break it down.

Yes, let's do that. We'll do that soon. So we'll do that as a follow-up for you guys. So we said, okay, it's not evergreen. Let's send them to the media kit so I can nurture them for a while and then send them to the training that's coming up to the accelerator. So for me right now around the conversation, we're kind of really guiding you into the free media kit because it does, it will crush for you guys, which is very exciting. So for you, we just have to figure out what you want to send them to just test it. And what you're gonna find is the more podcasts you go on, you're gonna find what offer is gonna work the best for podcasts. And by the way, might be different for different shows. And so you really have to think about whose show are you going on? Who do you think that audience is? What do you think is the easiest thing to sell them on? Because if you, your CEO Mama program.

Yeah, I mean, I even know what I would sell. I would, exactly. I would be pitching Freedom Year for everyone. But I just wanna share something that you told me a while back that just shifted my mindset on it because it showed me a massive mistake that I've been making. When I get invited on podcasts, I'll go on if I, you know, like the podcast, whatever, I'll go on. It's never been part of my strategy at all.

Mm-hmm.

And so I do the thing that you've said is really annoying where I'm like, I just wanna be of service. I just want, just ask me anything. I'm not pitching anything. Just let me know how I can support your audience the most. And you are like, that is so annoying to hear because we want something specific.

Mm-hmm.

So in my mind, I've just been trying to be helpful, but actually I've probably been unhelpful in doing that.

Mm-hmm.

So I actually, I went on for the book, which was great. I had a very specific thing, but now I'm declining podcasts. I just got invited on a really big podcast last week and I declined it because after our conversation I realized I'm not ready.

Mm-hmm.

I know exactly what program I'd send people to, but I haven't done the work to really reverse engineer how I would structure a conversation to then, and then sell. Yeah. Because I'm so used to just going on and saying, ask me anything. I'll talk about social media, business growth systems. Like, I love business, just ask me anything. And so you've reframed that for me a lot. And so I'm going to pull back, which I think it's worth pulling back, saying no, doing the work to then go on. And like you say, not waste an opportunity, but I think that's just helpful for some people to hear that might feel bad for like coming on and selling, which I know is like, listen, we, I've made a lot of money selling and I'm still like, I might feel bad pitching.

Okay. But let's talk about the etiquette with that as, because I want to know from you too, as a host. So, this was a, a really big question asked in my accelerators. They're like, are we allowed to pitch? The answer is, it depends on the person.

Yeah.

If you have a relationship, you know, you open the door, you're like, let's talk, let's, you know, let's get some people like involved in this. But I knew that you had opened the door for me to talk about this program a little more openly than maybe I would be talking about it on a lot of other programs, right? Like being able to send people Somewhere a couple times. But what I never mind is when someone comes on, gives a lot of value, maybe they have an added extra freebie of value where I know within the topic they say that they are going to teach their 7-step framework on the podcast. What they do really well is they say, today we're going to focus on the first 3 of these steps. This is what the podcast is going to be out about. Now, because there's not a lot of time on this podcast, I'm gonna give you the other 4 steps in this freebie at blankety blank blank blank. You can go grab it there, but let's get back to this and really focus on the 3. I never care when they do that. I know that they just converted my people into their email list to then nurture, to then sell.

Yeah.

But I don't mind because they added so much value from this framework. And also, of course, the people are gonna want the rest of the framework. That's how you do it in a way that is not salesy. And so you keep referring back as you're doing the steps. You say, okay, well, that's step 4. We're not gonna do that one today, but again, that's in this. So that's what we call seeding. Yeah. You're gonna want to learn how to do that in a way that is not salesy at all. That's one of the best possible ways that you can do it. But you know, even when, um, Samantha came on and did the $100K within the 30 days, I, um, allowed her, she had asked if she could share the link. You can just ask, say, am I allowed to, you know, share the link with your people if they want to find more or whatever that looks like?

Yeah.

I was like, sure, no problem, because I don't have a competing product. You do want to look out for that. If you have a very competing product and you're coming on and selling that really hard, they may not love it. But I think the etiquette is I would ask, do you mind if I share the link at the end, um, for what I have going on? Some people mind, some people don't. Some people will be really clear with you and say, nope, we're not going to share anything on the podcast. Or a lot of people are super generous and just say, yeah, we'll add it into show notes or whatever that looks like.

Yeah. I don't care. Even if someone's my direct competitor, I'm like, go for it, sell. But what I really don't love as a host is when I ask someone a question and they say, oh, well, that's what I talk about in my program. And they will not answer my question. I'm like, why bother coming on if you're not gonna give value to my audience and they have to buy from you to get value? I never mind if you say, here's the outline, or here's what I teach, or here's something I teach inside my program. Great. I always trust that the right— that there's going to be some people that want to pay to play. There's always going to be some people that want to pay to learn. They're going to go find you.

Yeah.

But if you're coming on a show to give no value and to just pitch the entire time, that as a host just feels like icky. And so there's, like you say, there is a fine line and a way of doing it. And doing it this way where you've got a freebie, you've got a next step. We all know what a freebie leads to. We all know what a next step leads to. Most of us, when we sign up for something, we hope that it, it's followed by something.

Exactly.

We sign up hoping, okay, I would love to work with this person one day. Let me sign up. Let me get started. Like for you, I know I need to get going on the media kit. I'm like, great, I'm gonna sign up for the media kit. When you open the accelerator, great. At least I can get some pre-work done and see, am I gonna stick with this? Am I actually gonna do the work?

Mm-hmm.

We love to be sold to if it's the right thing.

Mm-hmm. 100%. I, I, I always say as a guest, I think give your best stuff away on the podcast. Yeah. Because no one's gonna go and integrate all of that. They need, I know that people need the accelerator. You know, right now I'm doing your Viral Quotes program. You could sit and talk to me about it all day. I'm reading all your stuff on it. I'm listening to all your stuff on it. I need to sit down for an hour or 2 with these modules.

Yeah.

And like really integrate it into what I'm doing. Yeah. Which I'm doing right now, which is amazing, but you give it You essentially talk about it for free every single day, but you need these places where you go and you get to sit and really learn and focus on it in that, you know, for that time that you have set aside to do it.

Yeah.

And so I really believe the more that you can show people exactly how you work, the more like, I get it. I love the teaching style. That makes sense to me. Let me work with them more.

Yeah. I love this so much. Okay. I mean, I'm sold. I know I need to do this and it's great because I talk a lot about the, the different ways in which you and drive traffic. When you've got your— my framework that I always outline, it's super simple. You pick your one thing, you build an offer, you then build a funnel, and you drive traffic consistently. That's it. That's the— that's it. If you want to build a business, it's the only 4 things you got to do. It's very simple. Not everyone wants to build their own audience. Not everyone wants their own podcast. Not everyone wants to do the social media thing. And I don't think there's a one-size-fits-all.

Mm-hmm.

I was just teaching recently and I was mentioning your name. I was saying, I never thought about this as such an avenue. And if I was starting from scratch, I would pick this as one of my avenues personally, because, and I'll tell you why, it is very repeatable. I don't love a traffic strategy that is not repeatable because I'm a consistent girl. I want to know how much money I'm making day in, day out. I like my money to be consistent. And this is a very consistent channel. There are some channels that are not consistent, one of them being affiliate. It can be if you do it very well and very professionally, but often you are hoping someone will say yes to continue affiliating for you every time. You're going to hope that they'll put their best foot forward and put you out in front of that audience. You kind of have to say a prayer with it. So I promote it, but I always say do it alongside something else. This, like paid ads and like organic traffic, is more predictable because if I was doing it and it was my strategy, what I would do is I'd say every month I'm going to get on X amount of podcasts that reach X amount of people, because I know I would have my funnel dialed, and I do, that if I reach X amount of people, then Y amount of people will sign up for the program at the end of the funnel.

And it's that simple. Yeah. And so my goal every month would be getting booked on those podcasts. And so when I break that down, and I like to just break it down, what are we doing every single day? Because random acts of marketing will kill your spirit and kill your business. Drive revenue every day, what does that mean? Well, every day I'd be pitching, every day I'd be making sure I'm locking that in. I'd be looking for the next 3 months to make sure I've Got it. And so I share that to say, you can have, you can have a really defined one thing, you can have an amazing offer, you can have a funnel that is popping, but if you don't have the traffic, none of those other things matter. And I really do think that, and that's why I want you to come on. I really do think this is an avenue people get to take seriously, and I think it's going to be one of those avenues that continues to grow because I do think fewer and fewer people are going to start podcasts, which might be a hot take. But the people that stay in podcasting, they're going to keep growing and deepening their, their audience.

I think getting to step onto those podcasts is going to be really interesting. So I personally am very excited about it for 2027 to build into my strategy. And I think it's genius that you're teaching this. I really do. Because it's such a massive value add and also genius to teach something that you get massive ROI testimonials on. It's such a great flywheel.

And that's what we teach at the end. We teach the podcasting flywheel, which is how do we make this a repeatable sales process for you so that you do know what you're getting. And so I think that's the most exciting part is already seeing people pitching and getting yeses. And these are people without, you know, some have large audience, some of my friends are doing it. Then I have some people with very small audiences, some people who've never been on podcasts before are getting on podcasts. And I just want to give people hope to know, like, no matter where you're at right now, this is very learnable.

Yeah.

And it's easier to stand out than you think. And I will say, As someone who might appear decent at social media, I have really struggled with social and how to continue to stay on top of it and get attention. And don't get me wrong, I will continue to do it and to grow and to learn and to do all the things. But for me, I've always felt a little bit like a long-form contextual girly living in a short-form world. And now I think this is exciting for people who are like, man, I really feel like I have some things to say. I just need to practice it, dial it in. And what's so cool is that you potentially could even get paid for practicing on small podcasts. So, you know, none of this is for naught, meaning even if you go on small podcasts for your first 20, you have learned skills that I believe the most successful, influential people in the world are there because they learned communication. And so go on the podcast. Yeah. Listen to yourself back. See if you are, you know, there are so many, um, incredible ways to learn how to communicate.

You know, just even listening to how you communicate through social. Million Dollar Guests, we teach you so much about communication and how to tell stories and what that looks like to really reach your guest and to be able to tell succinctly that goes from pitch to offer. This is so learnable. It's so learnable. And it's easy to stand out in a sea of people that we just said in 5 seconds. We look past everyone because they're not doing these things in their pitches. It's, it's easy things that you can learn and do to stand out.

I mean, Shelby getting Jay Shetty, that's huge. Absolutely huge. Because she had these things dialed in.

Dialed in. The soundbites, I'm sure he could see exactly what that podcast was gonna look like. She had so many clips of herself on other podcasts too that I'm sure he was able to, to look at quickly and be like, yeah, Yep. She's good. She's a good speaker.

Yeah.

Soundbites. She goes viral. This is great.

Yeah, it's a, it's a dream. Okay. I'm gonna put the link below for the media kit. I feel like I've really got my homework. What's one step someone listening who's getting excited about this being a potential opportunity for them? What's one step they can take? Obviously get the media kit.

Mm-hmm.

What else?

I would say thinking about where you want your people to go and what do you want to be known for? 'Cause those are gonna be the 2 main things that you're really gonna need to dig in on. You're gonna need to know what your message is. And where you wanna go. And from there, we can fill in anything from any story that you have.

I love it. Thank you for this. I'm, I've been really looking forward to this episode. Like I've said, every time we talk about it, I'm like, Laurie, you make me realize how many mistakes I've made in this. Mm-hmm. And listen, I don't feel bad about it. I'm ready to change that up. I love a learning opportunity, but you've really opened my eyes to this and that's, I've been really excited for this episode. I've told you because I think it's gonna be a huge, huge channel for people next year. So thank you. This was amazing.

You're so welcome. And next we'll dial you in on storytelling and soundbites and all the fun things too.

Let's get it.

Thank you so much for having me. This was a blast.

Yay.

Yay!