Transcript of Funny Money with Comedian Josh Johnson: Senators Smooching, Lifestyle Creep and the Mental Gymnastics of Financial Goals

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As far as the NFTs go, they could have got me. All they would have needed was like a nice Space Jam NFT, and I probably would have been in a bad way. I'd probably be on money rehab for a totally different reason. You have me on the couch crying right now talking about how I owe somebody named Dexter online $1,800 still to this day.

One of my favorite ways to think critically about money is to laugh about it. This is Josh Johnson's superpower. Josh is a writer, stand-up comedian, and weekly host on The Daily Show. He talks about what it's like to grow up with no money.

When I was at my brokest, it's like you don't even make decisions. Like, if you're not in the pool, everything that a drowning person does looks wild to you because you're not drowning. So you're like, why aren't they just swimming? Why are they flailing like that? Or when someone comes to help them, why are they pushing that person's head down? And it's like, well, it's out of panic and they don't know how to swim.

And I get his takes on some bizarre money stories.

I think that tax dollars are a lot like if someone's ever owed you money and then you saw like an Insta post of them partying, right? And you're like, what money did you buy the drinks? Because some of that gotta be my money. And so then when you see your government doing things that, forget disagree with, things that you are actively like horrified by, you're like, oh, I paid for— oh, that's insane. And so not only am I a little bit broker because I had to pay the taxes, but you're not even using it for a thing that like benefits me directly. You're like, oh, this is devastating me twice. Because one, one. You made me count, which is also crazy. You know how much I owe. Tell me how much I owe.

I'm Nicole Lapin, the only financial expert you don't need a dictionary to understand. It's time for some Money Rehab. Okay, Josh Johnson, welcome back. Thanks to Money Rehab. I know, I feel like we should have— what do they do on SNL? The jackets. You're on 2 now.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So how many do you need to do to get the jacket? 5? Is 5?

5.

Okay, so we got—

I'll do 10. I'll come see you anytime, you just let me know. How have you been?

Yeah, what the fuck?

No, no, you, you know, you have way more news than I have because I had a baby. Yes, that's new people, new people. Yeah. Yeah, you've, you've like, I mean, a whole person. Yeah, you made a whole person and you have like a new life from the last time that I saw you. And I am doing more of the same, more of the same the last time and cooler and, and bigger and better. And that's very kind, but it is more of the same. True. Yeah.

Yeah. So you didn't make a human that you know of?

No, no, no. Oof. Ooh. I can only imagine like the, the way that My friends who have kids have— it's like more synapses fire in your brain for so many different things, but especially for things that could go wrong. For sure.

Yeah.

I mean, like, but not even with your kid. You'll just see me like leaning against something that looks precarious and be like, you could fall. And that is— that's a thing that I've noticed. Every one of my friends who has a kid, they end up being more gentle. Yes, yes, yes. They'll be like, oh, oh, don't spill, don't spill. And you're gonna tell your kid— so I— this is gonna happen regardless with time because things change. Teach us about the world. You now have a person that you can tell, that used to be a CVS. Like that. Like, like when my, when my dad would do that to me, I'd be like, what is a Woolworth's? You know what I mean? But then my dad would just— I'd be in the car by then and he just pointed what stuff used to be, and I was like, Oh, okay. I guess everything will just stay like this from now on. And now when my friends visit New York, that's the closest I get to being like, that used to be a Walgreens and now they made it a table tennis place. Yeah.

Back in my day.

Back in my day, 10 years ago.

'90s is back. '90s shit is becoming cool.

What do you think about that sort of wave towards ownership though? 'Cause I think that's one of the reasons it's coming back. It's like whether you're a gamer or you like movies or anything, thing. It's like all these things exist digitally now in a way where you don't really own it.

But do we own anything? What do we even own in this world anyway? Like, do we own wealth? Do we own—

Yeah, I guess, I guess that's—

No, no. Are we just borrowing it?

That's very Zen of you.

Are we getting deep?

I guess so. I mean, I, I'm more meant towards like, it probably is worth it to have physical copies of the things that you like. So then that way the people who technically sold them to you can't just like take them back one day.

But then your house burns down.

But then your house burns down and then you realize that you don't own anything.

Yeah. I, yeah. Or, or like, yes, you, that could happen. Mm-hmm. That could fucking suck.

Mm-hmm.

Uh, or just God. Yeah. Just owns.

Will be like, you actually owe nothing. God does the same thing to you that your parents do. Like when you get an attitude at home and your parents are like, you don't even own anything here. I bought everything. Yeah. And then God'll do it to you on like a metaphysical level.

And that's my relationship with the divine.

Yeah. It's just like, what are you gonna take it away?

It's true. Like, you owe nothing. Yeah. It's a humbling experience.

Yeah. But in the meantime, you do accrue wealth. You do like, you know, give people tips on how to have stuff.

Yeah. I think, you know, growing stuff is more important than just having stuff. But like in all aspects.

Yeah, I think if you grow something, you, one, you get the journey, you get the memories, right? And then two, you then get to, especially in the case of like farming, uh, sustain yourself in a quite literal sense. Yeah, yeah. Because I, I can be honest with you right now, I don't know how to grow anything. So I would actually be useless with enough land. I don't know what to do. Like, if there's not a store in any direction, they tag Yeah, I'm like, oh well, I guess I'll eat whenever I see a person with food.

You, you grow a lot of things. I'm, I hope that you've grown your money.

I've, since the last time you've seen me, yes, I've, I've learned some things and been able to apply them. I feel like based off the thing you were saying before, it's like you never actually have enough money to feel, uh, safe, which is also, I think, why even billionaires are like stressed out. Like, like you, you'll look at people who have ridiculous money, like money on a level that you're, that you're like, oh, this seems like you could stop if you wanted to. You could do nothing. And they are still like grinding, grinding in a way that I don't— like if you were watching the movie about their life, you would then be like, I don't know if this is sad now. Do you have me? Like there's, there's something to the idea of building something and maybe wanting to leave some sort sort of legacy or be that sort of captain of industry that helps propel all of us forward, like all of the ideas that we have of what people who amass large amounts of capital are supposed to do or that they believe in. But then you actually see it in practice and you're like, oh no, it kind of just seems like you don't like being at home.

So I have a hot take on this. Okay. I think in in order to feel safe with money, you have to define what safe means and stop changing the definition constantly on yourself. Because that's what I think ends up happening. Yes. Is that once you get to that definition of safe or having it all, you all of a sudden, like mid-game— I'm not gonna do well with any sports analogies here, just let the record show— like you, you move the goalpost mid-game or the goal thingy mid-game. And that's how people never get to the other side of feeling safe or feeling happy or feeling like they have it all or enough.

I mean, as far as analogies go, you actually did really well. Thank you so much. You actually did really, really well. I thought you were gonna be like, you know, sometimes you swing the bat as hard as you can to get that touchdown. And then before you know it, there's a goal.

Wow. Way to beat low expectations.

No, you crushed it. Because I, when you said no sports analogy, I was like, okay, we're, we're gonna be on a ride, but you just moved the goalpost. And that was, that was perfect.

Thank you so much. Yeah. So what's your definition of feeling safe with money? Have you Have you come up with that for yourself?

I've, I've started to try. I think that the best advice I was given was how much money do you need to live? Like whatever that number is for you. And maybe it's a lifestyle question or whatever, but like how much exactly do you need to maintain just to like keep the lights on and stay fed with you and your people or your family, right? And then when you come up with that number, Um, that's actually the most money you need.

Mm.

So they're like, the least amount that you need once everything's taken care of is actually the most that you need, because by your own definition, everything's taken care of. Mm-hmm. And so I think that now I feel relatively safe. I think that there's, you know, Strait of Hormuz or not, or like, you know, impending war or more war or ceasefire or not. Like, I think that there's, um, there are some external factors that I can't control that would obviously shift how far money goes or what I'd be able to, to do as far as touring or anything like that. But I think that knowing that my number for safety hasn't changed in like 2 or 3 years, so it doesn't really matter whether I've made more or less money, I think is a general success.

Yeah, no lifestyle creep.

Yeah. I mean, I feel like there's been a little bit in the way of Ubers. Ubers will do me in. And then I have admittedly started buying more comic books. I've significantly more comic books since the last time you saw me.

Wow. Like, as an investment?

No, no, no. I'm not a collector. I feel like that thing to me is a trap. I'd be interested in what you think about this. There are some things that are like, whether it's a collection or it's, it's almost like— Fetish. Yeah. Like almost has that NFT-ness to it, you know? And those things hold value for just the specific people in that niche, but it's never going to maintain enough value to be like valuable to anyone outside of it. Le Booboos. Le Booboos. Or there are some old comics, like let's say I was a collector. There are some comics you can buy of Spider-Man from back in the day. Like whatever, '70s Spider-Man, $10,000. It's like, what is the likelihood that you find someone with both $10,000 that also likes Spider-Man this much for this price?

I don't know.

And so I don't really get into the— the collection is for me.

I think some people use it as an excuse. Like, oh, I buy sneakers as a, as a collection. Yeah. Or as a collectible item or something like that.

Sure. And then you outside of— yeah, outside of, like you said, some sort of fetish. Nobody wants your pre-worn Nikes.

I mean, I have a lot of stories about people who have wanted to buy my shoes when I was broke. I, I sold my old stinky shoes on eBay.

Mm-hmm.

And somebody offered me $100 extra for a photo of my foot in the shoe.

That— I, I'm being honest with you, that seems so particular. I know it's not really. I know that feet is a thing. There's like, what, like Footpedia or something like that? Like Wikipedia for feet?

We were talking about this right before you came.

Oh, okay.

It is called WikiFeet.

WikiFeet.

And I am aware that I am on it. You're on it? Who? Not only am I on it, Josh, we were recently informed somebody DM'd us and said that I have a 5-star rating. Is it 5 stars? It's 5 out of 5.

Wow.

Did you know?

I didn't know. I didn't know there was a system.

There's, there's a backup plan, basically. Yeah. For my life. If all this fails.

Crushing it. I mean, I look, I don't think all this is going to fail. I think you are.

Thanks, Josh.

Far and away, away from the, you know, the feet stuff. But it's nice to know that you have a fallback plan. It's like, yeah, I don't even know if it's B. It seems like a, like, plan, like, like B+, G-, I feel like you have a lot of—

it's like, where are we going in this?

No, I feel you're an author. You've got a lot going on.

Dreams of X-Men.

Outside of—

yeah, I don't need that one either. You didn't even ask me if I sent the photo.

Did you?

What do you think?

I think, I don't know, if you had one laying around, it wouldn't have hurt to throw it in there, I guess.

But this was so long ago. This was like pre-iPhone days, everything.

Oh, you would have had to like grab a Polaroid.

Yeah. Oh, or like a disposable, or like a digital.

Yeah, you know.

Okay. The Tumblr days.

Did you?

No, I didn't. I was too scared.

You're already getting the shoes.

It was $100 though, and it was a lot of money, so I'm I'm telling you, it was like a moral dilemma. And so I just, I sent the shoes, stinky and all, like no questions.

See, I have never had that through a means of like opportunity. I've always had it like— Yet.

It can happen.

The thing that has always gotten me is I'll be so broke. Like there was this pizza, you know those door knockers that they put on your doorknob and stuff like that in my apartment building? I was living with my roommates. And I just did not have— I didn't have money. And so they put one on and my friends and I saw it and it was 3 $5 pizzas for— yeah, it was like $15. They were all medium-sized though. So we could all each like just have our own. And we did it. We put our money together. We got the pizzas and we got so sick. We got like ridiculously sick. Like all— everyone was poisoned. And. I knew I was broke because I was like, it was probably a pizza. I'mma eat a little bit more and I'mma throw it away. All right. Like that next day came around. I was like, in case it wasn't the pizza, just to be sure, just to be sure it is a meal. And so I'm—

Yeah, I gotta get my money's worth.

Yeah. Which I guess, you know, it was the pizza. It was the pizza. It was, it was 100% the pizza. I was so sick.

Oh, well, in one of your shows you compare being broke to the time you almost drowned.

Sure, sure.

Can you explain?

That is what it feels like.

I love that analogy.

Yeah, I think it— well, no, I just, I think that, I think that when I was at my brokest, it's like you don't even make decisions. Like if you're not in the pool, everything that a drowning person does looks wild to you because you're not drowning. So you're like, why aren't they just swimming? Why are they flailing like that? Or like, or when someone comes to help them, why are they pushing that person's head down? And it's like, well, it's out of panic. And they don't know how to swim. Right. And they're try— they would love to not be drowning. I've, every time I've seen a drowning person on TV, like in a TV show, they would love to not be in that situation. And that's what being broke is the most like, is, is just even the decisions that you have in front of you, that you don't necessarily always have the opportunity to make the best possible choice. Like, like those good choices and good advice sometimes come at the, um, at the rate of making a sacrifice that you can't really expect anyone to be able to do over a long period of time.

Like, you know, maybe there's saving a portion of your income if you just don't eat or if you just don't pay a bill or something like that. It's like if you're, if you're stripped down to your absolute barest, I think that, yeah, you might, you might do something that seems insane to someone who is in your situation, like buy a lottery ticket. It's like, all right, this is at least a chance at not being in this situation. And you see some of the same stuff when people are drowning, they're just like punching the water and you're like, well, swimming is kind of like that, but with a little bit more grace. And it's like when you're in dire straits, you don't really have the time to think about things from a perspective of, of what the next smartest possible move is.

So when you felt like you were broke or you needed money rehab, people were just like, duh, Josh, make money.

Mm-hmm. Duh. Obviously that was some of it. There was, there was like, we had a district manager that was talking to us, like just chilling. And this is rare because she was in charge of like 5 different stores. This is when I worked at a grocery store. So she was always going to like each part of her district to oversee something or meet with someone or something like that. And she was giving us all of this money advice, which is like in one sense, very kind of her in the way of no one has to like impart knowledge to you really, you know, like you could keep all of your ideas and everything to yourself. But she was also so clearly coming from the perspective of someone making six figures because she was literally telling us— she gave us like this, this like hierarchy thing that she used of like how you should break down your paycheck and everything. And we were like, oh, this sounds fantastic. This is, this is, this is definitely for someone making money. Like, as soon as I'm making money, I'll do all these things. But like, I don't know if you know what you pay us.

And that, and that's where you have to make those adjustments even in, even in how you relay the information. It's like, okay, is this person making $12 an hour? Then they probably, especially in a city like Chicago, they might not be able to afford to set aside like like, you know, 30% of their income for investments or something like that. Like she was giving good advice, don't get me wrong, but it was like, it wasn't for you. Yeah. At the time.

Yeah. So you grew up in Louisiana, you moved to Chicago, you landed in New York. Besides eating some sketchy pizza, what's the wildest thing you did to save money?

To save money. Okay. I did this. This is, yeah. I know you won't judge me, judge me, but you—

I'll lowkey judge you.

Yeah. Whenever people— you tell people certain things, they do look at you differently after it. There was a time where we were like pinched for enough pennies that my roommate and I were like, all right, we're just going to wear all of our clothes. We stretched it out. To the point where we were basically didn't have money for the laundry downstairs. And so we were like, all right, we're just gonna wear all of our clothes, um, as many times as we can. We won't stink. But like, we did get down to like our actual suits. Like, it was like, it was like, we're gonna wear everything that we can to hold off this $1.25 for as long as possible. And what usually would've been us doing the laundry every once in a while, we stretched it out for a couple weeks longer. 'Cause we were like, oh yeah, I never wear this shirt and I never wear these pants. And our outfits didn't make sense. Nothing matched, forget matching outright. And then finally, we were like, okay, it's time. And we start washing our clothes. And then we realized that we had saved nothing because now we had more clothes, we had more clothes to wash.

So it was like, all right, we made it through one payday, so we have the money. But like, it was one of those things where I was like, oh yeah, I don't know if I should move back to Louisiana.

I mean, my question on that is, who was the judge? Who was the arbiter of stink?

We were each other's We were like each other's monitor. Wow. Yeah. And so luckily we made it through. All guys. Yeah.

Yeah.

Oh, I know, I know. So it does seem— it seems like the barrier would be too low, but it was actually pretty high because we were really trying to do each other a favor. And so there were a couple of times where I had to be like, don't.

I thought what you were going to say was you put on all your clothes So you didn't have to check a bag, which is actually on my way to New York. What my husband did kind of is put his backpack underneath his jacket and then brought another carry-on so that we didn't have to pay for— yes, check another thing.

So you've done that too? Easily, easily. That I— okay. Yeah. Now, now, yeah. Now it's all out there. I've also— the first winter I had in Chicago, I did just wear 3 layers top and bottom to not buy the coat yet because I didn't have the money for like a nice winter coat. Yeah. So I did triple up on layers and then I've tripled up on layers for the flight. Like what you're talking about there. I feel like as far as layers go, I've done it all.

Now that you have made more money, you're not— you're able to operate the laundry at your leisure, order delicious pizza, I assume.

Sure.

Yeah. So what's your relationship with money now?

I think that now I, I understand the tool side of it a bit more. I think that, you know, so much about money in the way that people have a relationship with it before you feel like you've caught up or you can at least take a breath is so much more about survival. It's like, you know, to me it's very much in the same category as like water. If there are people who are dying of thirst, they don't think of water as a tool the way that they use dams to power things and stuff like that. It's like water can be this tool. You know, but you can only picture it as one thing when you're, when you're so thirsty. And I think that when I was, once again, like when I was like really broke, I didn't see how money could be anything other than just like a vehicle to literally just survive. And now I think I have a better understanding of the ways that, that people use money to improve their life for their future and everything like that. But I also think I have a much deeper understanding of how money has corrupted some people and how, and how so much of greed is unnecessary.

And I think that those things to me were kind of apparent when I was broke. And I'd look at people who, who had a lot and weren't willing to part with any of it or felt like they needed so much more. But it's only like now that I get a real appreciation and understanding of what, of what like greed actually is.. And so I do everything in my power to not let myself become greedy and to, even if I see it somewhere, to try to hopefully address that underlying issue that is the cause of someone's greed. I think that it's so easy to be like, oh, if you have a lot of money, you must have cheated, or you must be doing something that you're not supposed to be doing, or you must not be paying people well, or whatever the things are. And some of those things definitely exist, but I also think that so much of our education around money, some things get taught as just good business sense and not greed, or just good business and not exploitation, you know, at our absolute most pragmatic of what would get us from point A to point B, which is, let's say we have a startup and we want this billion-dollar company.

Well, the things that would, within some reasonable distance of what is legal, the things that will help us double down on all of our efforts and get to that money the quickest are going to be some form of exploitation. It is going to be some form of getting people to sign contracts that maybe if you read a little closer, it takes advantage of their efforts instead of fairly compensates them and everything. And then when you see that out in the world, you'll actually see a lot of people defend it as just pragmatic business or just good business. But we've also seen whether it's from other countries or other points in our own history as a country where companies have been able to work in a way that really did benefit themselves, the workers at large. I don't think that this consolidated effort around one individual's goals is the way it has to be. And I think that now I'm I've made enough money to be able to take that deep breath, not just be surviving, look around, look at the way things are and just see that, yeah, that thing right there is just greed.

Or this thing is like, all right, the optics don't look great, but I see how they landed here. Or these people are actually doing the best they can with what they have.

To continue your analogy, you're now satiated. You're not thirsty and dying for water. So what's your hydroelectric dam?

The equivalent? I think, I think like food insecurity is probably one of the wildest things to have as a problem in a nation like the United States. I think that whether it's food deserts or it's just people not having access to healthy food, those things to me are like medieval-level problems considering the technology that we have and the the way that we're able to live on a, on a certain tier, like there's, there's people who, whether you want to call them like the top 10% of earners or whatever in the US, it's like the way that, that they can live where they have so many choices around their food and so many choices of how their food is even sourced. I think that those things could very well become something that's accessible for way more people than than there are right now. And I think that a good example is you look at a sort of McDonald's, right? And McDonald's will say, they'll send out a spokesperson to say, well, look, you know, people have choices when it comes to food. We don't make anybody eat our food. And we also provide some healthy choices.

It's just that these are the things that people like. And it's like on an even enough playing field, all that is completely fair. All that's like, yes, true.

Free will.

But—

Love that for us.

What ends up happening is you see when McDonald's goes in these places that are the sort of like food deserts or how there is competition and not just competition from a business standpoint, but there are people who don't want McDonald's in a school. They're like, look, I understand. The kids can make their choices, blah, blah, blah. But you're McDonald's and you also market to kids and you also, you should, you shouldn't be in the school. If the kids want you that bad, then they can ask for some McDonald's when I pick them up from school. But you being alone with, with my kid in school and my kid choosing you every day is like, that's a choice that you shouldn't lay, lay at a kid's feet. Right. And so now there's going to be people who want the McDonald's out of the school. McDonald's wants to stay in the school. And so if I'm saying my goal is to give everyone as much access to healthy food as possible, it's like I'm going to at some point butt heads with McDonald's, probably. And look, maybe not. Maybe I'm completely wrong about this. And McDonald's will be like, oh, we had no idea the cholesterol in our— oh, we'll back off.

That's our bad. But I think that I I look at food as a thing that is like, it's a, yeah, it seems like an insurmountable thing to tackle, but I think that it's possible with the right efforts. And yeah, I would hopefully be able to contribute to that. It's not as if people aren't already out there doing the work all the time. It's just, I would like to figure out something that maybe hasn't been done yet and apply that.

Well, Josh, I love— and probably I messed up this analogy, but the hydroelectric dam for me was like, what would you buy? Like, what's the fanciest thing you would buy? And you were like, oh God, I'm gonna fix food insecurity. You are a good dude. You're a good man, Josh Johnson.

I do my best. I mean, I'll say this, okay? If I had to buy a thing, let's see, I moved into a new apartment and bought furniture.

No, not furniture.

I'm saying, yeah, I mean, like, I, who knows. Some of it was actually—

it got you in some trouble.

My girlfriend actually saved us a ton of money because, uh, she got, she got a couch for, for free. Like a new, a new couch. Yeah, yeah. She— no, she's incredible. She's always getting the deals, which is also part of why I don't end up spending crazy money. There's probably things that would be very juicy on the list, but she probably— I don't know, she probably got it for free. So then I love her. Yeah, she's great. Oh yeah. No, she's amazing.

Well, I've heard you say, and you've quoted your friend's joke saying that you just want enough money so that two senators would kiss.

Oh yeah. To make two senators kiss.

Do you believe that? Um, is that what you want?

I don't even know how much that is. You know, it's, it's a little disappointing cuz I feel like that's a much cheaper number than people would be imagining.

Like how much is it and who are the senators?

I haven't picked yet.

Hmm.

Well, I think maybe time is now. Maybe. Okay, you gotta have Fetterman in there. Maybe Fetterman and Lindsey Graham. Wow. Yeah, yeah, they'd have the height difference. They have the Beauty and the Beast thing going. That'd be incredible.

But how much would that go for, do you think?

I don't know, probably $20,000. I have no idea. Truly, I don't know. You look at some, look, maybe some people's convictions genuinely just change over time, but I think that whenever people are becoming advocates for everything that they actually ran against within their term, there has to be some sort of lobbying or some sort of money involved. And so I look at a Kyrsten Sinema or something and I'm I'm like, all right, you changed a lot pretty quickly. And it doesn't seem like, I don't know her finances or anything, maybe she's doing very well, but it seems like all she got out of it were those outfits. I feel like for the most part, American house reps and senators are incredibly cheap to buy. It's like you look at Eric Adams, Eric Adams was probably one of the easiest people. You just needed tickets to Turkey and you could get Eric Adams to do you a solid. It like, if you're an elected official, you should be so hard to bribe. Moral convictions aside, you should be like, no, I'm giving you real— at least with, uh, what was it, was it, uh, Menendez or who, who was it in Illinois who got like gold bars?

That's what they caught him with, was gold bars. Like, actual Looney Tunes corruption is a, is a type of corruption you need to be on if you are an elected official.

Have you been surprised, like, when you've seen And you don't have to go into it, or we could bleep it out or whatever you want to say. Like, when you've seen, like, one of these big juicy TV money wires hit, mm-hmm, have you been like, damn?

Honestly, no. It's like, you know what's funny about it is that you— luckily, I've been blessed enough to be writing for long enough that honestly, even getting that step up and increase in pay, it was like an adjustment I felt ready to make because it was happening at the same time as other things were coming in. So it wasn't like there was just one big check that changed my life or anything like that. I also feel like if anything, you know, I didn't really start investing and didn't have the money to invest until I was about 29.. And so I still feel relatively new and fresh to like a lot of the tools and everything. So I'm fingers crossed. I'm just getting started as far as that, that stuff goes. But if anything, what, what made me, what gave me that reaction more so than any like one check was actually getting the returns on a structured note. 'cause that's when I was like, oh geez, I don't know if this— y'all, I don't know if this is good.

He just pulled out structured note.

Yeah, but this is the thing about structured note is that I think if more people knew what it was, I think more people would be upset more than just want one. Do you know what I mean? Like, I understand that there's still risk with a structured note, but like the upside is so high that if you are investing and you don't have enough money for a structured note, like let's say I'm 25 again and I just have my poison pizza and, and like $18 extra. I don't have structured note like access.

Okay, so let's just pause for one moment. So first of all, starting at 29 is awesome to start investing. Second of all, you have a friend that you can call at literally any time. Third of all, structured notes are basically principal protected. Products. There's all sorts of varieties of them. You get your principal protected. There's a downside cap and an upside cap.

Continue. But the— I guess the issue is that when you are a regular investor, retail investor, or whatever, you are in a position where you can't protect your principal. And I think that more people, if they, if they were aware of what a structured note was, would be furious about the idea that people who already have this chunk get to protect their chunk and participate. And then people who have anything less than that chunk are like more on the hook for how the market behaves. And so I think just, just from a place of more so fairness than from a place of like incredible gains, I was like really shocked.

I think the analogy for me on that one is like the more famous you get, the more stuff you get for free.

Sure, sure.

So you have to pay for stuff and then when you can afford the stuff, you get it for free. Yeah.

Which is— I would—

upsetting to the people who—

that's, that's very fair money to pay for that product. That's very, very fair. I mean, right now I'm at a level where The only things I really get for free are fries and napkins. If I, if I go somewhere and somebody recognizes me—

They go together.

They go together. Exactly.

I tell my husband all the time, they're important to go together.

But when I tell you what, I'm out with friends and we got to wait in a long line and they're like, tell them who you are. I'm like, I don't think they know. I also already spoke to them. So that was their moment to notice if they were going to know.

You got a napkin?

I get a napkin too. Extra couple napkins with a, with a wink too, which means that's how I know they're giving me the napkins because it's me. And I'm like, oh, thanks.

Well, you're killing the game. So structured notes.

Awesome. Okay.

Hell yeah. I will say, to be fair, I'll just put a small asterisk here for anyone listening who's confused about structured notes. We don't get into them often in the show. They're a little bit more advanced, but they're similar to what somebody can buy as a bond or a treasury or CD, and those are accessible. Yeah, yeah.

No, that's fair. That, that's very fair. I, I feel like as far as like the actual financial instruments go, I'm like just dipping my, my toes in. And then I try not to be— I mean, you're very good about not being doom and gloom. Like sometimes I'll see something and then you'll have a post about that is like either the reason not to panic or the actual upside. But that being said, I'm— I don't know. Oh yeah, 100%. But I don't know what to think of this whole SpaceX thing. It does make me very nervous.

Why?

Because I think that there is a large amount of speculation to the point of like fraud. Like we are doing NFTs again, but now with AI in a way where a company that was about to have a ton of layoffs because they did some overhiring and it's that seasonal thing of they bulk up for winter and then they get lean in the summer or whatever. They now get to do that with at least the intentional misdirection of doing it because they're leaner because of AI, which isn't really the reason they did it. Like they are laying people off, that they lay people off seasonally. You can look back 10 years and it's like every year Microsoft does a little shedding, but now they get to be like, oh, we're just leaner because we replaced all these people with AI. And it's like, okay, maybe that's true, but there's a high likelihood for a lot of companies doing it that it's not. Then they also have these, these products that they use. There's like a, there's like a self-imposed in the markets and in, and in a lot of industries a thing of like, we use our AI tools even if they aren't working and even if our current staff have to work around the bugs in the system.

So what is being offered isn't actually better and it's not improving lives just yet. I'm not saying it's not gonna get better, but just like for what it is right now. So to invest off of that, like that's the reason to me that so many people are comparing this to the sort of dot-com bubble, not dot-com in that we stopped using the internet. Obviously the internet got bigger. We use it more than ever. But, you know, was it pets.com was not like viable because it just because they put .com, things that are AI aren't viable just because they're, they say AI, like you see what happened with, was it Allbirds or Flybird or whatever? And they went from a shoe company to like, now they're like, oh, we're an AI company. And then their stock went up and it's like that type of, that type of thing is dangerous to me.

So I think that there are bubble-like qualities within the space for sure. So it's yes and like it technology that's going to be transformative. Yes. And are there bubble qualities? Yes. And are there crazy SPVs and all sorts of charlatans that are coming out of the woodwork? Yes. So I think both things can be true with AI. So it sounds like you're not buying any of these IPOs right now.

Yeah, I mean, I, I feel like You know, I don't think I would buy just because I'm okay, you know, to what we talked about before, I'm okay making a little bit less money if I can understand it. You know, like I don't know if I should jump in the water with a thing that is a trend that's making a lot of people a lot of money. Because I also won't know when to get out of the pool. Like I won't know when the drain has been pulled and like, you know, now people are getting sucked to the bottom and drowning or whatever. Like I personally feel like, okay, maybe I don't get why Gemini makes sense, but, you know, maybe I, maybe I won't invest. And that's okay because I didn't get it anyway. And so I think that this is an important lesson.

If you don't understand it, don't put your money in it.

Yeah. Because I think anything I'm missing out on, it's like, am I missing out? Because I wouldn't even understand why I got the money. Yeah. Like, like if I invested and then the IPO just like skyrocketed. I think I'd be like, all right, that's good, I think. And then I— then whether or not I stayed in would be according to some, like, sunken cost or, or some belief that it was going to go even higher, but not anything connected to like a tangible understanding of what I'm investing in. So I don't know that that's why it makes me nervous. And I'm also nervous it would pull a lot of the market down with it.

You're nervous about a lot of things. I was going to say, by the way, I have a lot of issues.

Original definition.

To me about whether or not you're safe with your money, you start talking about the Strait of Hormuz and like, oh yeah. And by the way, like, no offense, Josh, I love you. I've loved you a long time. If something happens, if there's a war, you're not the only one whose tour is going to be affected. Oh, 100%. No offense. Like, I think it's going to—

No, no. By the time they get— by the time I'm affected, we're all in a bad way. I guess I'm just more thinking about like, what would I do? Because I don't know how to grow food. So like, what would I do next?

Seamless.

Seamless.

Yes. So I loved that the first time you were on the show, you really broke down the business of comedy. We're going to link that in the show notes so you could see, you know, where you're making money, where you're not making money. If somebody is an aspiring comedian, we do a segment called Funny Money on the show with comedians. So I'm going to be the money part. I'm going to give you some headlines.

Okay.

And you as the funny expert are going to give me your take. Are you ready? Okay. Man went viral after asking his date for a refund after their unsuccessful first meetup. He paid for her drinks on their first date, and a few days later he asked to go on a second date and she declined. In response, he asked her if she could Venmo him back for the payment for her drinks. Whose side are you on?

I'm definitely on the, the woman's side because I've seen a thing like this happen before. My friend once went out with a guy and it wasn't working out, and after like 2-3 weeks she was like, hey, I don't think we're meant to be. And he was like, well, you owe me $4,562.

What?

And then she was like, what?

And did she counter? No, no, she was like, well, you owe me $300 for my everything, hair, all that stuff.

She didn't even get there because she didn't know where this number came from. But this number came from him getting her breakfast burritos, and he had counted up, he had tallied the breakfast burritos. And it was like, in my head I was like, all right, but what if y'all have been together longer? Jeremy, like, is he just— is he just has so little faith in his own relationship that he tallied every day in case 6 months from now she's like, it's not working out, well, you owe me $1,265. Wow. So yeah, no, I, I feel like in those cases You gotta just understand that, uh, you know, when you go out on a date, you're making this investment in the person that you're on the date with. And sometimes investment has no return, kind of like an AI IPO. I don't know, I don't even know what I'm saying is right.

Okay, a woman says she cut over $15,000 in grocery costs in 2 years by going on frequent dates and letting her partners cover the What do you think of this strategy, and is this how we close the wage gap?

I mean, this would actually be phenomenal if the first person met up with the second person like that. Wow, you gotta bring people together. Um, okay, $15,000 is a lot, a lot of money, and I don't know So even expensive dates— I'm not that good with math, but even at dates that are like $150 or even like, how much are you— unless they're taking you to the actual grocery store, how many times are you going out to— because you gotta be going out to eat quite a while, because even over 2 years, $15,000, $7,500 a year. Yeah, I guess my thing is $7,500 a year But you're only counting them taking care of your portion though. Mm, like she's not, she's not saying that the whole date was this much.

She's saying her part of it was this much that she saved on her grocery costs. Yeah, you're like, I, I need more receipts.

It's a lot of dates and it's like, that to me is like, just, just dates? Like it didn't work out with anybody? Do you have me like, I don't know, I feel like there's probably some therapy that would help you have that 75% covered by one person.

If she went out with dude number one, she would have to—

that was a loan. Oh, he would sue. He's so— 100%.

Victoria's Secret stock soared nearly 48% after swapping its ticker from VS CO to VS XY. With that case study When OpenAI IPOs, what should their ticker symbol be?

I don't know. I feel like whenever I see stuff like this, I'm like, I mentioned have money. That, that to me is like the idea. Yeah, yeah. Just like, oh wow, this— I bet you this one's good. You know, it's like things like this and NFTs was what I was like, oh yeah, like Never mind closing any sort of wage gap on some sort of moral standard or just an understanding of what people's labor is worth, like job for job, effort for effort, but also just like, this is what we do. As guys, I'm like the NFTs and then stuff like this, 'cause I guarantee you it's like 12,000 dudes that were like, one of the IP, one says sexy. I've always heard that sex sells, and so we should probably put thousands of dollars into that. Meanwhile, it's the same company. Nothing has changed but the letters. And it— oh Lord. Okay, uh, open—

that's also like the stuff that goes into Tesla with all those nerds that are like, yeah, here's the fart mechanism and here's the whatever.

No, 100%. I think OpenAI mode— yeah, yeah. Now look, Mad Max mode, you will get a couple extra people who are like, this is awesome, I'm going out. Um, I think OpenAI should be nerd. O-A dollar sign dollar sign.

No, no, you can't do dollar signs.

But if you were able to do dollar sign dollar sign, would they— that would, that would get all the money. They'd be like, there's literally a dollar sign in this one, I have to go with this one. The market says so. Yeah. What were you thinking, like N-E-R-D? Any R&D would work.

I like yours.

I mean, if you— whatever the first IPO is to get a dollar sign in it, it's gonna crush. We're already like barely serious anymore as a market. Yeah, as a society. So like, why would we not just let the dollar sign slip in?

Totally agree. I— that's the best idea I've heard.

Really?

Take it to the SEC. Let's fucking go. Um, okay, a woman was scammed out of $80,000 after being catfished by someone who used AI deepfakes of soap opera actor Steve Burton. Have you ever fallen for a deepfake scam or a scam?

I've definitely fallen for scams before, um, but as far as an AI deepfake scam, I don't know if I interact with enough people that I buy things from to, to have that that happen. Like, I'm sure that I— one of the reasons I don't argue online, like, I don't— like, if, if we want to have a, like, a conversation in person, happy to, to talk something out. Or even, even if people are mad at me, happy to have a conversation. But one of the reasons I don't engage with, like, a lot of, um, uh, keyboard warriors— you, you now don't know if they're real. So it's like, obviously people get upset about things, and if enough people are upset then clearly real people are upset about this thing. But then if it's like when someone's just trying to straight up pick a fight, you don't know if that's a real person. And so I try to avoid some of the deepfakes by not engaging in like, um, um, like too much of an argument. But that also probably means I've been swayed by a couple deepfakes now that I think about it. If someone has something nice to say, I'll hear them out.

And that probably has led me to be— there's probably a couple deepfakes out there that are like, "I think you're hilarious." And I'm like, "Wow, I'm gonna take that to the moon." I think the issue with this thing especially is they target a lot of older people.

I know, there's a special place in hell for people who scam the elderly.

Yeah, it's like— Fuck those people. Especially the soap opera, 'cause that's one That's just when soap operas come on, everybody's at work. When soap operas come on, like, like when you— when a soap opera is playing, you are doing your job, whether you are working in an office or you're like a stay-at-home mom or something like that. Everybody's working when the soap operas come on. So the only people who really have the time to notice who— what's his name?

Oh my God, hold on.

Steve Burton. Okay, the only like Steve Burton stans are a bit, are a bit older, and they're watching to follow the plot line.

That's a great point. Okay, 54% of Gen Z taxpayers said filing taxes has either brought them to tears in the past or expect it to next year. Have taxes ever made you cry?

Easily. 100 years of joy, I think. Okay, you know what taxes feel like, and, and this is, this And that's in part why I do understand when people are so obviously passionate about how their tax dollars get spent. It's your money. But I think that tax dollars are a lot like if you've ever owed somebody money or no, sorry, if someone's ever owed you money and then you saw an Insta post of them partying. Right. And you're like, what money did you buy the drinks? Because some of that got to be my money. Money. And so then when you see your government doing things that— forget disagree with— things that you are actively horrified by, you're like, oh, I paid for— oh, that's insane. And so not only am I a little bit broker because I had to pay the taxes, but you're not even using it for a thing that benefits me directly. If it was like if you named each pothole in New York after the person whose taxes paid for it, then you would see the thing. You would be like, oh, Thank you so much, this person, for a smooth road.

But because you don't see any of that, and especially on a federal level, you just see whatever the next insane project is, you're like, oh, this is devastating me twice. Because one, you made me count, which is also crazy. You know how much I owe. Tell me how much I owe. Yeah, that makes me so bad. Like, the fact that we don't have to live like this.

We don't.

They could just send us the bill. Everyone else sends a bill. The doctor will send you a bill. Your lawyer sends you a bill.

Like, you figure it out. Yeah, how much was that clavicle? Yeah, surgery.

Imagine if your doctor was like, I don't know, how hard do you think I work? Maybe you should decide how much I get paid, and maybe if the number's wrong, I'll call the police. Like, that, that's, that's what it is. It's so infuriating. So it's like you made me do the work and then you checked my work, which means you had the number the whole time. Then you used the money to then do something insane. And I don't get a say in that thing because I elected the people who did the insane thing through a totally different process where they said they wouldn't do any of the insane things. And so I feel like whether, no matter which administration you're talking about, no matter which time period you're talking about, there is a there is a, a level of heartbreak when you are doing all the math yourself.

Yeah.

Heartbreaking. Yeah. I mean, many tears. That's actually a lower number than I thought it would be. Like 54% means that some Gen Z— that, you know, what's probably happening as well is that with, with so many companies leaning towards AI, a lot of them probably don't have to to really file. They probably just need to file to get their refund or something.

Yeah, who are these 46%?

I mean, probably recent graduates. Like, did you see the thing where the CEOs that were giving the commencement speeches were getting booed because they were saying that AI is the future? And it's like, you— I've never seen somebody read a room worse than, than like a CEO whose company is like, just paid how much for your brain? You just paid all this money and you're graduating This is the party to celebrate you graduate. And it's like, y'all, y'all have nothing.

Turn on the light.

You'll never have anything. AI's taken everything. I win, you lose. Like they were getting booed so hard.

The Trump administration is reportedly pushing a prototype of a $250 bill featuring President Trump's face.

Yeah.

Would you want your face on any currency?

No, no. I especially don't want want the— like, Trump's face on any currency is already insane, but the face that they chose of him making is worse. Like, did you see the bill, the proposed bill?

Yeah. And it's also the first living—

think I—

president.

It's the one where he's like, um, do you know what I mean? Like, that's his— you, you signature look. Yeah, now it is, but he used to have that big old smile. Remember that, that first term he had that big old smile like he was He just got 2 scoops of ice cream and now he's got the steak eye because he's a felon and now he's over here, oh. And that to me is gross.

So you're like, it's fine, but just bring back the ice cream picture.

No, no, I hate that one too. I don't know if I've made it clear, but I really do hate Donald Trump with a passion and everything that he does. But I also think that it's weird that we got Donald Trump on money before Harriet Tubman. Remember those Harriet Tubman $20s that everybody was pitching? When I saw the picture, I was like, oh, this is a joke. And then I—

Like, this is a deepfake.

Yeah. Yeah. And then I saw Scott Bessett holding it and I was like, oh, maybe this isn't a joke. And then I heard about the news and I was like, it's sad that this isn't a joke.

Kentucky has piloted a big relocation package to recruit new workers. Workers. Many offer $5,000 cash along with perks such as discounts on child care and a free monthly delivery of eggs. How many free eggs would it take for you, Josh, to move to Kentucky?

Um, carry the one. Okay, so look, I think Eggs are not gonna be enough. I'm sorry. I just, I've been to Kentucky. I've known—

I worked in Kentucky.

I've known wonderful people from Kentucky, but to get me to move there, I don't think eggs is gonna cut it. I also don't think, like, here's the thing, $5,000 is a lot of money to help along with a relocation, but if it's a one-time thing, I don't know.

That's a no for you.

Yeah. Yeah. There's no amount of eggs. Yeah. What, how many eggs would it take you?

I mean, it would take some like, like eggs, like fertility eggs for me. Like it would take a whole other—

Sure, sure.

For me to get—

But still like 6 figures worth of eggs.

Oh yeah. Yeah. I did my Kentucky time. I'm good.

That's fair. I've put in my time. What part did you live in?

In Lexington.

Oh, okay.

WKYT. Yeah. 27 News First. Was that the tagline?

I remember I saw one of your, one of your old, like, reports from it. Oh my God. As part of a, like, it was like a part of a compilation thing that you made.

No.

Yeah. It was adorable.

Thank you so much. I was like 18 years old.

That's very impressive.

Running around trying to make it in this world, you know?

Why are you, why are you saying, oh no, it's, it was adorable.

Thank you.

Yeah.

Thank you.

The station was on Manowar.

They were— all the streets were named after horses. I didn't—

anyway, but yeah, they got a whole derby.

They got a whole thing.

Yeah, horses make sense there.

They totally make sense there. Josh, since you're a veteran of Money Rehab, okay, uh, you know that we end all of our episodes by asking our guests for one final money tip they can take straight to the bank. So what's one lesson that you've learned about money that you can share with our listeners?

Because of what it takes to sort of like make it in, in the US, a lot of people have turned all their efforts into like, oh, I'm building a brand or I'm building like I'm treating myself like a business and everything. And I think that one of the most important things you can do is that while all that stuff may be happening on like some sort of external level, that may be how people perceive you. I think it's very important that you yourself remember that you are a person and that you need your days off and you need your time off and everything like that. And that you also don't look at every opportunity that comes for just the money and don't get swept up in, in crazes. I think that that once again, it's very easy to see the money that was made in like 2022 with NFTs or with certain cryptos and feel like you're missing out. Like as an example, I definitely felt like I was missing out at the time. And now I look back and I'm like, well, I didn't— FOMO. I didn't understand it.

Yeah. The joy of missing out.

Yeah. And then also where's all that stuff now? Like all of it. 'Cause a lot of those JPEGs don't work anymore. Like a ton of 'em don't work anymore. And people pay thousands of dollars. And some of 'em just that broken link with the little, you know, the little like house and the green and the blue in it and stuff like that with a question mark. That's as much as your money is worth now. And so yeah, I think engaging in some more joy of missing out because I think that some of these crazes are, you know, people's money grabs and to miss out on it completely. There's nothing like missing out on a scam. I don't know if you've— I don't know if you've ever had somebody scam next to you.

Not once.

Not ever. Whew. It's— to be like, oh, I didn't fall for that thing. Not even because I'm smarter. I'm very scammable. Like, I've done many things where I'm like, wait, I didn't even know it was bad. I'm sorry. Like, I've— Please believe me. I— that's why sometimes I'm not even outside like that, because I'm like, I don't want to get involved in anything. But I genuinely, uh, take the fact that I missed out on a lot of that stuff as a lesson for how I'm gonna move moving forward.

Um, and a badge of honor.

Yeah, to a degree. Like, I don't do any bragging about it because Brag now. They almost got me. As far as the NFTs go, they could have got me. All they would have needed was like, like a nice Space Jam NFT, and I probably would have been in a bad way. Like, I'd probably be on money rehab for a totally different reason. You have me on the couch crying right now talking about how I owe somebody named Dexter Online $1,800 still to this day. Hey, like, no, no, I don't. I badge of honor. I'm, I pass that off to the people who just knew it was dumb from the beginning. I was more like, oh, I don't get it. And I think that that's a different thing than being too smart to be taken with it. Cause whoo, they almost got me. They really did. I think if you, if you had had like the Looney Tunes as the, the Spartans from 300, that's the NFT I would've bought. I'm such a nerd. Immediately I would've bought. I'd be in trouble right now. Nobody would be able to get me outta this hole. It'd be very bad.

So yeah, yeah, I'm doing my best to just be content. I guess that's the other thing. Sorry, I know you're only supposed to have one, but if I could cheat real quick, I think the best money tip is like practicing being content because once again, all the money that you need to survive is the most money that you need. Meat. But also, if they had— if they had made an NFT with like Bugs Bunny as Batman, had the ears coming out where Batman's ears come out and everything, he'd be done.

Problems.