Transcript of Carol Burnett New

Welcome, everyone, to another episode of Good Hang. This is a very special one for me. We have Comedy legend, Carol Burnet. Carol, the star, creator, benevolent captain of the Carol Burnet show, an incredible sketch show that changed comedy as we know it and influenced so many of us. An incredible actor in films such as the Four Seasons or the star turned as Ms. Hanigan and Annie. You may have seen Carol in Better Call Saul or Palm Royale, which is out right now. There's so many things that Carol has done, and I discovered Carol from my living room watching her show with my mom, and we're going to talk about so many things today. You know what? Don't worry about what we're going to talk about. It's going to be so good. It's Carol. It's Carol Burnet. She's here, and we can't believe it. Before we get started, we always like to talk to someone who is a friend or a fan of our guest. When you start in sketch comedy and you're a woman of a certain age, you have learned everything from Carol. Today, we have someone who is a super fan of Carol Burnet, and I think a legend in her own right, sketch comedy.

That is friend of our pod, one of my many wives, The great, Rachel Dratch. Rachel? How are your headphones doing? This episode of Good Hang is presented by Uber Eats. Big news, Aldi is now on Uber Eats, and you get 20% off your first grocery order with code new Aldi 26. So whether your fridge is empty and you're too tired to shop, or you just ran out of essential ingredients in the middle of meal prep, don't worry. Fill your fridge in just a few taps and get 20% off your first Aldi order on Uber Eats. For orders over $60, you can save up to $20. Ends February 28th, 2026. Terms apply. See App for details. Rachel. I want to show you.

I I'm going to show you how far I've come, Amy. What the lessons learned, the improvements made.

Listeners, Rachel Dratch is holding up her untangled headphones. Well, I see a little tangle.

There's a tiny kink. There we go.

But you've always been into a tiny kink.

Anyway, here you go. Changes have been made, and I'm ready to go.

You look great, Dratch. Dratch. Thank you.

I put on a little lipstick for you.

You know I love you in a blue. I love my baby. Those baby blues in a baby blue.

There you go.

Dratch. You know, genuinely, when I was like, who can I talk to about the genius that is Carol Burnet. I thought about us because we grew up on Carol. She feels so influential. Whether she knows it or not, and I to tell her today, it feels like she just influenced us so much.

Yeah. I mean, when you said, Will you ask a question of Carol Burnet? I got a little paralyzed because I was like, She's such an icon that my brain got tongue-tied. I'm like, What do you ask someone that's had such an influence, a pillar of comedy?

I actually like to talk to you before I talked to Carol because I actually have been stressed about that. How do I talk an icon. Do you remember when you first saw a Carol?

My first exposure was the Carol Burnet show. So I just remembered that merry band of players cracking each other up, which, of course, we did later on in her own way. But just that joy that they all seem to be having together. And also the way she would talk to the audience afterwards, there was no putting on airs about her. It seemed like it She is who she seems, just a fun regular person. No, a woman shouldn't be doing this. We always get asked about women in comedy, and we always hate if we get asked that way, because I think when we were little, We just saw a funny person, and we weren't thinking, And it's a girl. It was just subliminal, whatever. Unconscious. You're seeing Gild around her, and you're seeing John Beluche, and you're not thinking, But she's a woman doing this. You're just getting this role model. You're getting the mother bird imprint on the baby bird. So Carole Burnet was definitely like that. Just the silliness, the joy in being silly, the joy in making faces that make you look like you're not a lady. Acting like you're not a lady.

That all was just so joyous and so good for girls to see. But again, I don't want to get all free to be you and me because it was who she was.

A reference that probably nobody remembered. But they should. But they should. Look how free to be you and me. Children, you should know. You didn't know you were getting the message you were getting, free to be you. But it was like, Boys could have dolls, okay? Boys could have dolls. Yeah. Carol's show at times, as the '70s came on to the scene, Carol's show was like, Oh, that wasn't edgy enough, or something. Maybe someone could say, Oh, it didn't have an edge. But Now, with distance and time, I'm like, I think that's why I was so drawn to that show, exactly what you just said. It looked like everyone was having fun. I don't think when we were growing up, at times, I thought that comedy was actually going to be fun. I know that sounds stupid, but it felt like it had to have drama attached to it. She was such an example of like, Comedy could be fun. And you could be a nice person doing it. I don't know. Does that make sense?

Yeah. And just like full tilt clowns, like clowning around. Like when she did once upon a mattress.

Okay, let's talk about that.

It seems like that might have been, what the hell do I know talking about this time period? But it seems like it might have been really freeing and groundbreaking to have this woman getting to add all this physical comedy into this part that I'm sure you're adding in so much physical comedy into that part.

Physical comedy feels until Carol that it was owned by the boys. Yeah. Did Carol feel like at the time there were other people, other women doing physical comedy like her? Get the answer, Kholwa.

Get the answer on that scoop. Also, you two have to compare notes. I'm sure, have you told her that you also played Winifred in Burlington High Is she aware?

Thank you for bringing that up for people that didn't listen to the very highly popular Rachel Dratch episode. Dratch, I got to tell you something. That episode was gangbusters. Are you getting a lot of good feedback?

I'm getting a lot of good feedback about that, yes. Every time I hook in with you, I go viral.

And that doesn't mean that you get sick with a fever. That doesn't mean I get a virus.

I'm not going to avoid the obvious. I'm going to make this joke here. But yeah. We don't need more of that. Every time I hook my wagon to you, things happen for the best.

Well, thank you for hooking again. But for people who didn't, for the, I don't know, one or two people that didn't listen to that episode. Where have you been? No kidding. Living under a rock. Check it out. And then what you'll find is that Rachel Dratch and I talk about how we were both in productions of Once Upon a Mattress when we were young people in our schools. Carol Burnet originated the part of Wina Frid on Broadway. I got to play that part in my high school. Rachel played the more- I played the boring part of Lady Larkin.

Right.

Who in the musical is pregnant, but when Rachel did it because they were so young, they had to take that part out.

And then I had nothing to play. So then it got even more boring. But I know this is about Carol Burnet, but I've got to work through this. When we did our episode of Good Hang, a lot of people commented on our obvious love for each other and friendship that was so obvious because we left our way through the whole thing. But I was wondering, since I'm talking to you, about her female friendships, does she have friends that are her true blues from before showbiz that she relies on? Or even now, first of all, her non-showbiz friends or her showbiz friends. Who has been there along the way that is part of her journey that she has the little support group with or something.

I love that because when I was lucky enough to do something for her 90th birthday celebration, she watched the entire celebration holding hands with Julie Andrews. They sat next to each other and held hands. They call each other, and I believe they call each other Chum. And I'll find out. But I want to ask her about Julie because they have been friends since the '60s.

Wow. And I mean, talk about our age, powerhouse, like Sound of Music, Mary Poppins, Carol Burnet, and their friends.

Come on, chums.

I've always said that you are my Julie Andrews. The other friendship that I want to talk to her about is her and Lucile Ball. Yes. They were buddies. Lucile was a mentor to her. She was probably in her 40s when she met Carol in her 20s, but came backstage after a performance of Once Upon a Mattress and said, You got it, kid. Wow. I know. I feel like there's a direct line between a lot of the women I know who I worked with who love Carol, like Kristen Wig, who works with Carol on Pamriale and talked about on this podcast that she burst into tears when she met her. You, me, Maya, Tina. We all, Anna, we all, Molly, we all feel like we just watched Carol.

Well, Amy, you're so good at talking to people. You've met her, too, but I always admire how good you are at talking to the the idles and icons.

Well, I'm talking to one right now. I'm talking I'm the one right now.

You're doing a great job.

All right, Rachael Dratch, I know you're busy. What are you having for dinner tonight before I let you go? Oh, I don't even know. Well, I know you've got some Broadway plans tonight. Enjoy your night in the town. New York City, Rachel is out and about. Yes, she is.

Yes, she is.

With a new haircut, looking great. All right, bud. Thank you. Thank you for doing this, Dratchy. All right. See you. Love you. Bye. This episode is brought to you by Subaru. For me, going the extra mile means taking the long way home. If you're going to grab snacks and the 10-minute trip turns into a two-hour journey, suddenly you're on a new street, then your ice cream is melted in the back, and we've solved the meaning of life. But luckily, Actually, in my Subaru Hybrid, that's right, I have one and I love it, that extra mile is built right in with longer range and better fuel efficiency than ever before. The Subaru Forester Hybrid and the Subaru Cross-S Track Hybrid. Great cars. I have them both. Love goes the extra mile. Visit subaru. Com/hybrid to learn more. Hi, Carol. Love you. Love you. First of all, you look wonderful.

Back at you, honey.

I'm so happy to see you. I mean, I got the chance to see you in person maybe longer than I'd like to admit, maybe like a year or two ago. I don't think I've seen you since. Well, I thank you.

I gave you an award. Was it at the 90th? At the 90th.

At the 90th.

Then we did it when you presented me with an award.

I got to say nice things about you, which is the best. Yes, you did. Thank you. I just want to get this out of the way, Carol. You are everything to me. You're the reason why I'm in comedy, and you are a living legend, and it is really very emotional for me to get to talk to you. I'm thrilled that you're here, and it means a lot to me. So thank you. You know what?

If I had never been born, you'd be doing what you're doing.

Well, we'll never know. We'll never know. The fact that I get to call you a friend and know you is amazing. It's definitely one of those things where sometimes you feel like your life is a dream. I think you and I talked about this one time that life does feel like a dream. I know that there's moments in your life where you look back at your life and say...

You remember the movie It's a Wonderful Life? Jimmy Stewart has this angel named Clarence. Clarence. There are things that have happened to me where I feel I've got Clarence on my shoulder. From the very early on in life, I remember I I lived with my grandmother in one room, a block north of Hollywood Boulevard, and we were poor. Our rent was a dollar a day, $30 a month, and sometimes we could hardly manage that. I graduated from Hollywood High, and I desperately wanted to go to UCLA. My grandmother said, Forget it. We can't afford the tuition. There's no way. Guess what? The tuition was UCLA in 1951.

A yearly tuition?

Yeah. Well, for a semester.

Okay, for a semester. A thousand dollars?

Forty-three dollars. And we couldn't afford it. We lived in this apartment building right in our room, faced the lobby Every morning, I would check. There was a pigeon hole mailboxes for all the apartments, and I would look out and see if we had a little letter or something in our slot. Then there's a letter in this slot this one morning. I came out and I opened it up in our room. My name was typewritten on the envelope, and there was a $50 bill. I do not, to this day, where that came from. Nobody in the neighborhood that money had that. That was my tuition. That was Clarence. I got to go to UCLA. Then I got a catalog that said Theater Arts, and I looked through that, and there was a one called Theater Arts English. I entered the Theater Arts Department. But also at that time, if you were a freshman, no matter what, if you wanted a Theater Arts, Film, Theater Arts, Theater Arts, English, you had to take an acting course.

Do you remember the first thing you did in your acting class then? Yes.

I was terrified. I'd never done anything. I'd never performed or anything. I thought, Oh, my God. I came in late, actually, and all the other kids were teamed up, and so I was the oddball. The teacher gave me a couple of monologs to choose from, one from the country girl and one from A play called The Mad Woman of Shio. I picked The Mad Woman because it was shorter. I got up and it didn't even occur to me to read the play. All I did was memorize it, and I said, I'm doing a scene from the Mad Woman of Chalet. I didn't know how to pronounce it. And she gave me a D minus. And she said, The only reason I'm not failing you is because you memorize I just didn't.

Sounds like a great teacher.

Well, she was right. She was right. And then I got into a one act that one of the students had written where I played a hillbilly woman. And of course, we're from Arkansas and Texas. All I remember is that there was one scene where I came out and I'm this over-the-hill, hillbilly woman, and I just said, I'm back, and everybody cracked up and laughed.

Was that your first laugh you remember getting? Performing?

Yeah. From then on, and then some of the other students would come up and some of the two said, Would you be in another one act? Would you be in... All of a sudden, I thought, I like this. Yeah.

When I was talking to Kristen Wig, who was here doing this, who I know you love. She said that she burst into tears when she met you.

I hate it when people look at me and cry. Why am I scaring them?

What am I When they point at you and cry. But what I was going to say is, Kristen talked about how important it was to meet you. You talk about how luck played a big part in many moments in your life. But as you know, luck only gets you so far. You have to nail it.

You know which door to go through.

Yes. And you have to deliver. What I love about your work, which continues even to this very moment, this very day, because you are working nonstop, is you are this beautiful combination of luck meets opportunity meets gratitude meets flexibility meets collaboration. I've watched and watched you and your career since I was a young person and how you welcome all of those things at once. You're never taking anything for granted.

No, you don't.

You can't. But people do.

Then they're wrong.

Yeah.

They don't.

But you also are so confident and skilled in what you know you can do, you show up for those lucky moments. I want to talk about all of that stuff today. But I think sometimes I'm lucky to know a lot of nonagenarians, like the '90s or the '80s, babe.

I like that.

I just want to talk about the present moment for a second, because you are What does work feel like to you right now, today? How is work feeling?

It feels the same. I'm 105 years old, but it's still like when We are doing Paul Morial and all that. I'm just as excited as I was when I came on and said, I'm back. It's the same thing. Another thing, I I was thrilled about Paul Morial was when Abe Sylvia called me, he was the creator and director and showrunner, all of that, two, three years ago, I guess it was, and said, We're going to do this show. We'd love you to be a part of it. I said, What's it about who's it? And then he told me who was going to be in it. Kristen Wig, Allison Janney, Laura Dern. I said, I'm in. Don't even bother sending me a script. I want to work with these ladies. I want to lock eyeballs with them, get in the sandbox and play. It was really, of course, the first few episodes, I was in a coma.

Yeah, I know. You have it in your contract that you need to be able to sleep on set. Exactly.

Get up at 5: 00 in the morning, go get made up, go right back to bed.

But those women that you talk about have become your I feel grateful for this, too, is that you're a living example of... It's just like, if one's lucky enough, they keep meeting new people and new friends.

Absolutely. I felt that way. I was very lucky to do Better Call Saul. That was just before Paul Muriel. I was a big fan of Breaking Bad and Vince Gilligan, and I watched Bob Oden Kirk and all. Vince Gilligan said, We'd love you to come on. I said, I'm there no matter what. It was a wonderful time for me, too.

You're one of those people that you've gone back and forth in your life between New York and LA, and I want to talk about both. I bet that each block or section of the city holds a memory. What was Hollywood like when you were there? How would you describe it?

You didn't even have to lock your doors. Every morning when I would go out getting ready to go to school, I'd look up and there was a Hollywood sign. We used to climb the Hollywood sign. Wow. The neighborhood kids and I, now you can't get near it. Sure. But we would fly kites or roller skate, and they would say, Yeah, I'm bored. Let's go climb the sign. It was rickety then. They'd fixed it up now. There were splinters, and I would climb up. I'd get splinters. It's a wonder we didn't break our neck. Then the O's were my favorite. I would just hang over the O's and say, Hello, Hollywood. Hello. Then we do the Tarzan yell and all of that. Also, growing up like that, we played. We went out and played until it was time to go in for supper. No one knew where you were. I hear my grandma's like, Carol, come on. We'd come in. I say, I'm going out and play now after school.

Then you spoke about your grandmother who was instrumental in your life and how you would go to the movies together. Yeah. Take us to that. What were you watching? Who were you seeing on the screen?

Well, we would go to the second run just because they were cheaper than going If you went to a first run, it was a lot more money, like a quarter. The second runs, and there would be double features. We would see, we would go, one, two, three, four, maybe six movies a week.

Wow.

That was in the '40s. Betty Grable and Mickey Rooney and Judy Garland and Tyrone Power and all of those, which maybe none of the people listening know those people anyway. They were my favorites. Linda Darnell was a beautiful woman. She's not as well known today as- You know what?

I don't know Linda Darnell.

I have to tell you. My grandmother Mother and I, we would go and hang over the ropes when there would be a premiere on Hollywood Boulevard and to watch the movie stars come in, right? I'm nine years old and Nanny is standing there and the ropes are holding all of us back. Coming walking up by us was Linda Darnell.

I got to look her up while you talk about her. I do. Okay.

My grandmother grabbed her by the sleeve. She said, Linda, give this little girl your autograph. She just loves you. Linda Darnell was so sweet. I'm looking at her and she said, Okay, dear. I gave her my book and I was shaking. She said, What's your name? I told her, and I'm looking at this gorgeous. I realized her nostrils didn't match. Why? What happened? It was just like a off. That was the only flaw.

Suddenly, you realized nothing is what it seems.

Let me see your nostrils. Our faces are different when you put They're different.

Symmetry is not my strong point.

I don't think it is for anybody. But I remember that so clearly.

You remembered that so clearly.

Oh, my gosh.

Who else did you have in that autograph book?

Oh, gosh. I remember I had Betty Grable. Oh, wow.

Linda is so pretty. I'm looking her up right now. She proves my theory that the more far apart your eyes are. Her eyes are very far apart.

Oh, you're looking at it.

Yeah. She proves my I can hear you that if your eyes are far apart, you're very beautiful.

Especially if they don't cross. I remember we would go to the grandma's Chinese, where they have the courtyard with of everybody's handprints and footprints and so forth. I remember putting my handprints into Betty Grable's handprint. Just a few months ago, I got my handprints after all these years after you. I remember putting mine in, and I'm wondering, will somebody someday put their handprints on mine? Wouldn't that be wild? Yeah. But I go. So cool. Also, I I feel I did have a fairy godmother, Claire. Yeah, Clarence. Betty Grable was one of my first guests on my show.

Whoa. Did you tell her the story? Oh, yeah. What was she like?

Adorable. Very funny. Betty was on the show as a guest, and so was Martha Ray, who was one of the funniestest women ever. She was very bawdy and loud. She and Betty had worked together, and they were good friends. It was for me, my God, I'd grown up watching Betty going, We're watching Martha Ray. I was all through. Now we're rehearsing. Now, Betty had a thing about Coca-Cola. She had to drink Coca-Cola all the time. What would happen was she would be going, constantly, and go, I mean, really loud. She just loved Coca-Cola. We're in the wings ready, and we're doing the show, and Betty Betty and Martha and I are ready for our queue to go out, and Betty took one and did blah again. Martha Ray said, Oh, for God's sakes, Betty, why don't you just fart and save your teeth?

I thought I was going to die.

And then we had to go out and do the finale. I was just hysterical.

Betty, I want to talk to you because you talk a lot about people coming through your show, the Carol Burnet show. When you host a show, I know that from SNL and in some ways from Parks, when you host a show and people come through, you're the host. You're hosting the show, but you're also hosting the guests, and you're watching all the different ways that people work.

But it was a joy. Yeah. In fact, in 11 years, we didn't have one a rotten person that we dealt with at all. Everybody was happy to be on. Another thing that I always loved doing was giving... If we had Chita Rivera or Juliet Proust or dancers and singers on the show, we also would try to put them in a sketch. Because if they went on the other shows, they would just do their bit, and that would be it. Or they may be in a finale also. But we would put Gwen in a sketch. I even did a sketch with Ray Charles.

Wow. What was the sketch?

It was a piano bar, and I was a lady who was a little bit in her cups, very sad about herself because it was her birthday and nobody cared. Now I'm talking to Ray, who was at the piano, and we have this lovely little scene about the fact that I'm so sad and he then talks is very sweet, encourages me, and he says, Come over here and sit down. And then we sang together. He said, I just love it. He said, Nobody has ever asked me to do lines before. Wow. He Really, he really loved it. Wow.

When you were in your 20s in New York, first of all, what was it like being in New York? Was it late? It was the '50s? '50s. Did Mad Men get it right?

Was What was it like? I lived at the Rehearsal Club.

Yeah. Talk about the Rehearsal Club.

I got a chance to go to New York. A benefactor let me the money to go. I had never been any further east in Texas or California. I remember my grandma mother saying, You can't go to... She said, Your blood's too thin. You'll be dead in a week. So much for that. Good. Thank you. Anyway, I said, I'm going to I have this money. I was so stupid and naive. How old were you? I was 21.

21? Yeah.

I didn't know where I was going to stay.

Right. You just showed up and said, We'll figure it out.

It's like the movies. With the suitcase. Now I'm in a Broadway show. I'm on the airplane and I see an ad for the Algonquin Hotel. I said, Well, I think I'll go there. I had something like $300-some-od dollars left. It was raining. I had a cardboard suitcase and got up to the Algonquin. I checked in and he said, That would be $9. I said, For the week? He said, No, for the night, $9 for? Okay. I gave it $9 and I went up to this room, and I'm there, and I called Nanny, my grandmother, and she said, Come home. I said, I just got here. Anyway, I hung I thought, What am I going to do? I'm in New York. The next morning, I had one phone number that I could call, and it was a girl who had gone to UCLA and was ahead of me. She came to New York, and she left her phone number with a bunch of us in case we ever got to New York to give her a call. That was the one number I had, and I called her. Her name was Eleanor Eby, and the phone rang, and I said, Hello.

I said, Is Eleanor Eby there? They Wait a minute. Ellie. Ellie. And I'm hearing all this noise going on, people singing and stuff. And she gets on the phone. Hello. I said, Ellie, it's Carol. You're here. Where are you? I said, The Algonquin. She said, Get out of it. Are you crazy? She said, Come up here. Gave me the address. I left. I got bing bong. It's a Brownstone, four stories. I had no idea, but I rang the doorbell. Some gal opened the door. She said, I'm here to see Eleanor Eby. Oh, Ellie. I go in and there's a parlor and a bunch of stairs going up to the various floors. People are dancing and singing and playing the piano.

And all women?

All women. It was called the Rehearsal Club. Maybe about 25 women live there. Ellie said, Maybe we can get you a way to stay here. She said, I'll introduce you to the house mother, Ms. Carleton, and Ms. Carlton came, she said, Well, you're in luck. We have one cot available, and it was $18 a week, room and board. It was sponsored by a lot of rich New York ladies, which made it possible for that to be so inexpensive. How cool. She said, This is a transit room, so it's the biggest. It's where we put new people. You'll have four roommates. There'll be five of you. She said, There are rules. No men be on the parlor, and they can't stay past 10 o'clock or midnight on weekends. You cannot spend the night. You have to be in. It was very strict. You have to be pursuing a career in the theater. You are allowed to take a part-time job to help pay for the rent. But you must not go on auditions. And so forth and so on. It was very- It's making me think of the Lucille Ball movie Stagedoor. That's what it was written about.

Stagedoor was about the rehearsal club.

That was it. I was just going to... Absolutely. How funny. That was it. Also, it's the first time I had a bed. I slept on the couch for 21 years. My grandmother slept on the Murphy bed, so I have a bed.

Carol, it makes me want to ask you, was there Was there ever a job that made you feel secure, financially secure?

Only when I got on the Gary More Show and Once Upon a Mattress.

Okay, because Once Upon a Mattress felt like a secure... Okay, I've got a gig every week, and I'm going to be okay, and I'm going to be able to take care of my family. Were you taking care of your family then? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.

Once Upon a Mattress is a Broadway show that you open. You opened that show. You were the original Winifred. Right. Yeah. Okay. We've talked about it on this podcast, that particular show, and I know I've shared this with you because I got to be Winifred in my high school production of Once Upon a Mattress. I love it. Listen to your cast recording to try to learn the part. Rachel Dratch, the great Rachel Dratch from SNL, also was in Once Upon a Matress. She jokes that she was the boring part, the lady Larkin part. I spoke to her earlier today about you. Give her my then. I will. We talked about how influential you were to us. But when you were doing Once Upon a Mattress, you were getting, like finally Getting paid to be an actor.

$80 a week. Well, what happened, actually, again, Clarence. I had been auditioning before I got mattress. When I left UCLA to go to New York. My friend said, What are you going to do? I said, I'm going to go to New York and I'm going to be in a show directed by George Abbott. Now, George Abbott was Mr. Broadway. He directed Pajama Game, Jam, Yegges. He was the musical director of all time. I said that, I'm going to be in it.

But that's what I'm talking about. That's not Clarence, that's Carol.

Hold on, though.

Wait, this is weird. But that's manifesting.

You put it out there in the universe. That's right. What happened was I was in New for a while, and then I got a chance to audition for a re... They were going to redo a show called Babes in Arms that Rodgers and Hammerstein and Her Heart wrote, and they were going to open it in Florida and bring it to Broadway. I auditioned, and it looked like I was going to get the part of the girl who sings Johnny One Note. I was so excited and everything. The director wanted me. But then they said, Carol, we're going to for someone who's got a name. I went, Oh. So I hung up the phone. Swear to God. I hung up the phone. Two minutes later, the phone rang, and it was Jean Eckart, who was producing a show called Once Upon a Mattress. She said, Can you come down now to the Phoenix Theater and audition for George Abbott?

Wow. Rejection is God's protection, Carol.

I took the subway down. I what I had to do.

Do you remember what you sang? Do you remember your audition song?

I sang Everybody Loves to Take a Bow. It's from a show called Hazel Flag. I got back, the phone was ringing. They said, You got the part? Had I gotten Babes in Arms, which never left Florida, I wouldn't have had mattress.

Isn't it weird how when you look at life and you think if just the slightest thing moved here and the slightest thing moved here- Some of the best things happen when you're disappointed at first. That's right.

You look back and say, You know, if that hadn't happened, this would...

That's right. When you were doing Once upon a Mattress, we spoke, we mentioned Lucie, Lucile Ball. But can you tell everyone that story? I know you've told it before, but to me, you were very kind to talk and always talk about Lucy whenever you get a chance you were very kind to talk about her in a documentary that I did. You told this story, which I think is not only so indicative of how wonderful and supportive person she was, but how she saw in you something very, very special that we all eventually came to know.

I remember we opened in May of 1959, and got great reviews. I was like, wow, I was thrilled. The second night, there was a buzz backstage and everything, and I said, What is it? Lucy's in the audience. I was more frightened.

Oh, yeah.

Then I was opening night.

What year was this?

1959. I remember I was stupid. I peaked through and I saw this orange hair in the second row, and I went, Oh, my God. Anyway, I got through the show and she wanted to come backstage. It was off-Broadway Theater, and it was really funky. I had a couch where the coil was sticking up. Anyway, it was Lucy O'Ball, Come in. She headed for the couch and I said, Oh, look. She said, No, I see it. She sat on the right end of the couch, and well, God, 20, 25 minutes. She She called me Kid. She was 22 years older. As she was leaving, she said, Kid, if you ever need me for anything, you give me a call. Wow. Actually, for About four years later, I was working and doing stuff, and CBS wanted me to do an hour-long variety special if I could get a major guest star. So the producer said, You got to call Lucy. I said, I don't want to bother her. All she can do is say, I'd love to, kid, but I'm busy. I got up the nerve and I called her. Hey, kid, you're doing great. What's happening?

I went, I'm doing a show, and I know you're busy. She said, Hold on. When do you want me?

She's such a badass, Lucy.

She did the show, and we did it together.

I mean, I think about Lucy a lot when she was very ahead of her time. Also, we talked about this when we talked about her together. She was producing and running shows, even though she wasn't getting the credit, just like you were producing your show. She was so ahead of her time.

Well, there's a story. When she did my show, we had a lot of fun together and we were had a dinner break. We went across the way to the Farmer's Market, and she's knocking back a couple of whiskey sours. She says, You know, kid, because my husband at the time, Joe, was producing our show. He just did it. She said, You're very four. You got Joe to do it for you. She said, Because when I was married to the Cuban, she said, She said, Desi did everything. Yeah. He invented the three camera system.

A lot of people don't know.

He said, he took care of the scripts, he took care of the costumes, he took care of the lighting. All I had to do was come in and be silly Lucy on Monday and do the show. Then we got a divorce. She said, now I know I have to be like Desi. I got to kill him. She said, I didn't know what... They had a script reading of the new Lucy show, and she said, It was terrible. It was terrible. And I thought, Desi wasn't here to fix it. She said, I got called lunch. She said, and I went back and I figured I I have to be strong. I have to be confrontive, but still not afraid. So she went back and she said, and I told them in no uncertain terms what they had to do, how to fix it. I was It was really tough. And then she took another little drink. She said, And kid, that's when they put the S on the end of my last name. Every birthday on my birthday, she would send me flowers. Happy birthday, kid. This one morning I got up. It was my birthday, and she had died that day on my birthday.

I got the that afternoon. Happy birthday, kid.

Do you believe in ghosts or spirits?

I don't not believe in them. Yeah.

Do you feel like you've ever been visited by- Lucy? Yeah, by Lucy. Don't you feel like she'd be a funny ghost?

Hello. Lucy, if you're here. Lucy, if you're here.

We just get our Ouija board out. But yeah, and Carol, you're like that for so many people. I mean, I feel like you're a mentor to so many women. Like you said, you got things handed to you and you hand it down. You pass it on. You have to. The spirit of that felt like it was embedded in the Carol Burnet show. You were skipping a lot, but obviously, you go to a New York, you're on Broadway, you're Gary Mork. Do you feel like... I mean, you were physical in a way then and away now. I mean, first of all, you look terrific. Well, thank you. You're 92?

Yeah.

I mean, you're just...

Well, thank you.

I mean, physically, your body has been so good to you. You have a command of your body and always have. I guess one of the questions that Rachel Dratch and I, Rachel had that we were talking about is this idea of physical comedy, which was- I love doing it. Yeah. When you would do show, would you do warmups, like physical warmups? Would you stretch? Before the show was about to start.

No, I was very athletic as a kid. I would roller skate. I would do all kinds. I would climb the sign. Yeah. I could run like the wind. It was very fast.

You have those legs, Carol.

They're the last things to go.

Babe, you got it. I mean, what I would give for long legs, you have the best legs. Thank you. You probably could have been a long distance runner.

When I was in junior high school, my physical teacher, because I could run, she sent a letter home to my grandmother saying, Could Carol stay after school? I could be coaching her. My grandmother said, No. Running Running is bad for the heart. Whatever that means.

That was definitely back then when everyone was a little scared of everything. Of everything. Running is bad for the heart.

Yeah, like she said, when I went to New York. You'll be dead in a week. Your blood's too thin.

Yeah, so physically. Also, Carol, do you feel like you have a thing that happens because you've done a lot of live stuff, where when there's something that's a little wrong, when something's going a little wrong, there's a little fun electricity where you get excited.

Okay, now what am I going to do?

Oh, yeah. You've always had that.

I love that. We were accused a lot of breaking up.

At So on your show, there would be people, you guys would laugh.

Yeah, but out of 270 so much shows, I can't... In fact, I looked at stuff because it was usually Conway who was after Harvey to break him up. I don't think we more than 15 times out of 200, but people remember that because it was so delicious. It But then people say, Well, they shouldn't have done that.

That fun, goof around thing. I mean, that just goes to show, I think, what I felt watching even from- It was a family. It was a family. Yeah. It was 10 years that you made that show together? Eleven. Eleven.

I decided I wanted to quit after eleven.

Do you remember the last moment of the last show?

Well, yeah, it was when I sat on the bucket as the Char Woman, and then I just talked about how we were going to not come back. Yeah, I cried. It was bittersweet, but it was time.

Yeah. The last thing I'll say about how important that show was to me is you And I know you've spoken about how it was a section that at first you thought, I'm not sure why I'm doing this, but do you watch your old stuff?

Do you watch clips of yourself? I'm not like Norma Desmond. You don't?

You're not in your bedroom? I'm not in your bedroom. I'm not all day watching a clips of yourself?

We have spaces then.

But you must every once in a while stumble across something that comes. Your phone must know who you are.

Oh, yeah. Well, actually, when I wrote my last book was about doing the show. So I had to watch a lot. I went fast through some of them, and some of the sketches, oh, God, they were terrible. Some were wonderful, but I hadn't remembered a lot.

Yeah. Do you watch comedy now? I asked my guests. Not really. Yeah. Do you watch anything now that you're liking?

I watch TCM. Turner Classic Movies. I go and visit all the people that I loved when I was growing up.

Who did you... Comedically, who did you love growing up? Who made you laugh?

Oh, growing up comedically.

Who would you visit right now if you could on TCM?

Carol Lombard. That's who my mother named me after, actually. She was a beautiful comedic actress and could really, with a turn of it to this. That's the movies. Comedically, I fashioned my show not only after Gary, but after Sid Caesar.

Sunny and Cher were in the same studio as you, right?

They were next door.

Do you and Cher hang out?

No.

I'd like to. Did you guys ever hang out? Not really.

No, but we know each other's friends.

Yeah. Did you watch their show when it was-Oh, yeah. You snuck over there?

For sure. Many times, our studios were joined by the Ladies Room in in the men's room. If there was a break or I had to go through the ladies' room and watch them rehearse something. Sometimes, like she and Sunny, and even separately, sometimes, just walk on while I was doing questions and answers. Oh, fun. We'd get around. It's great fun. Oh, it's so fun.

She's lovely. She is lovely. I mean, I don't know her.

We just run around in the same circle.

She just seems cool.

She's cool.

Cher, if you're listening, we love you.

She should come on this show.

You heard it here first, Sher. Yeah. Carol says, I'd love to have her on. What's your sign, Carol? What's your sign?

A torus.

Of course. Earth sign.

What does that mean? I'm lying on a bull.

You're bull. But you're an Earth I'm a Virgo. Tina's a Taurus. Somebody's got to get this stuff done. Somebody's got to get stuffed on. Torrance. Again, I know nothing about astrology. Yeah.

You know who else is Taurus? Is Shirley McClane and Barbra Streisand. They have the same birthday.

You heard it here. Carol thinks you guys should come on this podcast, too.

I think so.

One of the most special moments of doing your wonderful special that you and Brian produced for your birthday a couple of years ago. Number one, it was the first time I had been out since COVID. I was like, Hey. But also, you and Julie Andrews were together, and you held hands during a lot of that and sat next to each other. My chum. Tell us when you first met Julie and how important a friend she is to you.

I was doing mattress, and she was in Camelot. She was a queen and I was a princess. Some mutual friends said, You two ought to meet because there's a similarity there. Then you'd be... And later on, Julie and I even talked about, Oh, come on. It's like a blind date. You ought to meet to see him. Anyway, she had Sunday night off from Camelot, and we worked on Sunday night. She came with her friend, I had my friend there, the two gentlemen, just friends, and she watched Mattress, and we went out to a Chinese restaurant afterwards, and we never stopped talking to each other. The There are guys who were with us. They just sat there and listened. It was as if we were joined at the hip from the beginning. Always. She taught me some dirty words.

You would think I was- Because you're not a big... You don't love to swear. Occasionally.

Yeah. Occasionally. If I stub my toe, you know what comes out.

What friend is Julie?

My chum, we love each other. We're sisters. She, unfortunately... I'm not unfortunate, but for me, she lives on the East Coast. Yeah. So you got- Yeah. It was so sweet of her to come to to the 90th to be with me.

Where were you when The Sound of Music came out? Did you go to the premiere? Do you remember the movie?

Yeah. No, I didn't go to the premiere, but I remember she used to send me Dirty Limericks when she was filming. I wish I could remember it or even tell it. I think about she did a whole parody on these are a few of my favorite things. I mean, brilliant. So from it. So good.

So good. Okay. Then you've worked with amazing people. You have had an amazing life where you've gotten to play around with people who are at the beginning of their careers, at the end of their careers. Was there anyone that you met as a young actor? I love to ask people this. You met them and it was maybe their first job, and you saw something and you said, Oh, they're going to be very successful and famous. Vicky. Vicky Lawrence.

She wrote me a fan letter, and we were going to do the show. We knew we were going to do something with Harvey and me where I'd be raising my kid's sister and we'd be a married couple. I'm reading my fan mail this one night, and this was in December of '66, and we were going to go on in the fall of '67. I'm opening up this letter, and it's from this 17-year-old girl, Vicky Lawrence, who's very nice letter saying, People say that I remind them of you, a young you. Then she enclosed a newspaper article that had her picture in it. She looked so much like me when I was 17. I thought, Oh, that's interesting. Then in the article, they said she was going to be in a contest called Ms. Fireball of Inglewood with eight other girls. The local paper was doing a bit on each one of those girls. This was her article. Then I look at the date. The contest is tonight. The letter had been sent three weeks ago, and it got to me from CBS. It's tonight. My husband's coming downstairs and I said, Don't get too comfortable.

We're going to the Ms. Fireball Contest tonight. He said, What? I showed him the article. I said, But should you... Yeah, okay, but shouldn't you try to tell Don't make her nervous. I said, You're right. So her father's name was listed in the article, Howard Lawrence. So I called the operator and I said, Got the phone number. And so it rings and this lady answers, Hello. I said, Hi. I said, Is Vicky Lawrence there? And she said, This is her mother who's calling. And I said, Is Carol... Vicky. Vicky comes in. I hear footsteps. Vicky comes up to, Yeah, hi, Marsha. I said, It's not Marsha. It's Carol. I got it. Would you be okay if we come to the... Okay. So we went. She did the guitar, she played the gazoo, she did a couple of jokes, and she sang, and she won the contest.

She was like you in piquing out and seeing, just like you saw Lucy, she's piquing out seeing Carol. Exactly.

I was in touch with her. I said, We're going to be doing a little... Well, I'll be in touch with you.

We're going to be doing a little very famous show that's going to change comedy.

We called her that summer, and she came and read. There was another girl who had a lot of experience. Vicky was raw, but saw something.

You saw something.

And today, no network would let us do that. Hire an 18-year-old girl with no experience.

That's right. They wouldn't allow it. I mean, Carol, we could talk forever about the biz because the biz has changed so much. Yeah. I know.

You can't be happy being 92, but I'm glad I'm 92 because none of this would have happened today for me. Something might have happened, but it wouldn't be... There's no way we could do what we did before. 28-piece orchestra, 65 to 70 costumes a week, two guest stars, a major rep company. Yeah. And also, CBS left us alone.

Right. I remember you telling me that they really didn't give you any notes.

They just said- There was one note in 11 years.

Sorry, I'm laughing.

I was doing a sketch where I was a nudist, and I'm behind a fence that says, Keep out. And so I'm hanging the fence, bare-shoulded, and then my legs are bare with high-top tennis shoes. And Harvey's voiceover. He's interviewing me, and it's a bunch of jokes about a nudist calling me. I mean, it's no big deal. One of the lines was, So what do you nudists do for entertainment? I said, Well, we have dances every Saturday night. He said, Oh, and how do you nudas dance? I said, Very carefully. Well, the network, that was too blue. You have to change that line.

Sometimes the change is even dirtier. Hello.

What do you do? Well, we have dances every Saturday night. Well, how do you dance? I had cheek to cheek.

Incredible. So much better. And they loved it. And they were like, That's it. That's better. That's good. Also, I don't have really any questions other than Annie. That's all, Carol. Annie was so important. Annie remained so important, but was very important to Gen X women. I've talked about it with Rachel Dratch and a bunch of people in this, how big Annie was as a musical. It was all parts for it. We were that age. Then when the movie came out, we thought, Okay, here comes the movie. When you were Ms. Hanigan, it was like I saw that character for the first time. I really understood her.

Well, I went to John Houston at the beginning, and I said, I think she should drink. It wasn't in the original, that she should have a little bit because it would only make sense that this woman… That's a good idea, dear. That's the way he talk. Now, this is my favorite story about Annie. Tim Curry, Bernadette and I, the villains. Easy Street was going to be this big number. Being a Hollywood movie, they decided to change it from the original, where it's just the three in the orphanage, to this big, huge thing where they had this street open up. They had 400 dancers, singers, this people hanging out. I even had a monkey grinder with a monkey. And Tim and Bernadette, it takes away from the number. They're just big Hollywood production. Huge. Took a week to film, and at that time, a million dollars or so. Okay, all right. So we wrapped. I flew back. I was at the time living in Honolulu. Bernadette flew back to New York, Tim, London. And I had always wanted more of a chin. I had a weak chin. Now, there was an oral surgeon in Honolulu who said, I can just give it a little more.

I said, I don't want to be Kirk Douglas. I love when it rains, I'd like to feel it. I said, Just like two or three millimeters. Just so I have a little more of a chin. Yeah. Okay. So no big deal. He fixed it and a little more of a chin. Okay, so about a month later, I get a call, and it's Ray Start, who's a producer. He said, We're going to reshoot the Easy Street number with just the three of you. I said, Thank goodness. That's great. Now, Tim and Bernadette and I are in her office, Hannah goes on, and Mr. Houston says, Well, what I think we'll do is we'll do it from when Carol I ran into the closet to find Annie's locket. We'll pick it up when she comes out with the locket. Mr. Houston, call me John, dear. John. Two months ago, when I ran into the closet, I didn't have a chin. Now I'm coming out of the closet with a chin. He thought for a minute. He's like, Well, dear, just come out looking determined.

Great direction. That's my favorite Annie story. I mean, I guess I want to end, Carol, by asking you, what is the best part about being in your '90s?

That you're not 105.

Yeah, that's yet to come. You're a kid. Yeah. Do you feel like a kid?

A few years ago, a bunch of us were sitting around the on the table and said, How do you really feel inside? I said, 11. I remember, maybe that's because that's when I would climb the sign, when I would roller skate, when I would put my handprints with Betty Grable. I don't know. But something about being 11. Go figure.

Well, I loved you when I was 11. When I'm with you, I feel 11, too. It's really nice. I knew I was going to cry. I knew I was going to cry. And Janna said, When I cry, then she would start saying, Cry, cry, cry.

But I knew I would cry.

But, Carol, that is that sense of play. That sense of play. Especially young girls, they're really magical at 11. They haven't quite become self-conscious.

Maybe that's it. They're not too smart alega yet. That's why we're not talking about teenagers good luck. Yeah, 11 is still very sweet. When they're teenagers, you are so stupid. You have no idea what life is about because you're too old.

Totally. But there's that tender moment before you become self-conscious when you can still do your thing and not really worry about.

I remember when my daughter, Carrie, who we lost a few years ago when she was five years old, we her in a fib, and I said, That's not good. So you have your dinner and you go up to bed, and you can't stay up. You just go. And then I went in afterwards, and she was upset. And I sat on her bed, and I'm looking at her and I said, Sweetheart, we love you very much. But if you tell a little fib, then later on, it might become bigger and people don't want to be a liar. She is looking at me like, I'm thinking, I'm going to get a medal as a mother of the year. I could hear violins. I was so perfect. She's looking at me, and finally I stopped and I said, Are you okay, sweetheart? You want to say anything? She said, What, darling? She said, How many teeth do you have? I Okay. Perfect, Carol.

Perfect. Yes. When we all get back to that innocent time. Thank you so much for doing this. It means so much that you're here. I love you, Carol. Thank you for coming. Thank you. Thank you so much for coming. Well, thank you so much, Carol Burnet. I cried. And Look, I don't want this to become a thing, okay? I don't love crying, but if anyone's going to get me there, it's Carol Burnet. I'm now technically using the good hang tissues that I have mocked other people for using. And now, well, it got me. So karma is a bitch. But for this Polar Plunge, I guess just... Thank you, Carol. You are a legend, and you mean so much to me. Thank you for doing the show. And it It just also makes me think about all the women that we talked about in this interview, Lucile Ball, Betty Grable, Linda Darnell, Phyllis Diller, Elaine May. All all these different actresses, do yourself a favor and check them out. Type them in your phone or ask your computer. Ask your computer to bring up a picture of them. Or whisper into your robot's ear that you want to see some of their highlights because it's just a reminder of all the good performances.

Also, watch that great film Stage Door, which is a great film about what Carol was talking about, about women living in a house trying to be actresses. Anyway, I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm crying. I've cried. It's over. I've lost all credibility. Thank you so much for listening, and we'll see you soon. Bye. You've been listening to Good Hang. The executive producers for this show are Bill Simmons, Jenna Weis-Burman, and me, Amy Poehler. The show is produced by The Ringer and Paperkite. For The Ringer, production by Jack Wilson, Kat Spillane, Kaya MacMullen, and Elea Zanaras. For Paperkite, production by Sam Green, Joel Lovelle, and Jenna Weis-Burman. Original music by Amy Miles. All I ever wanted was a really good hang.