Transcript of Talking Dateline: Missing Ana New

Hi, everyone. I'm Blaine Alexander, and this is Talking Dateline. And today I am so excited to be joined by the one, the only, the incredible José Díaz-Balart. José, thank you so much for joining me today.

What a treat, what a privilege, and what a pleasure it is.

This is so much fun. So, José, we're gonna be talking about your Dateline debut episode entitled "Missing Ana," about the disappearance of Ana María Knezević, a South Florida businesswoman who moved to Miami moved to Madrid, hoping to start a new chapter after separating from her husband. But just months later after making that move, she vanished. And what followed was an international investigation that ultimately led authorities to focus on Ana's estranged husband, David Knezevich. And as of today, Ana has still never been found. Now, if you haven't seen this episode yet, you need to go back, watch it. You can stream it on Peacock or listen in the Dateline podcast feed, and then come right back here. And then later, we'll have an extra clip from Ana's friends speaking with Jose about their memories of her And of course, we'll answer some of your questions on social media. All right, Jose, let's talk Dateline.

Let's talk Dateline.

So number one, just congratulations. The storytelling was beautiful. Your questions were just so— I mean, they have the heart that I know that you have, Jose. That's, that's who you are. And it came through in your episode. So it was, it was really a pleasure to watch.

No, thanks. You know, it was also going back to me, home in many ways. I grew up in Madrid, close to where Ana spent her, her last months of life. And so returning to a city that is so much part of my life. And so to be able to go back to a city that has opened its arms to immigrants for generations and see that Ana was starting a new life there. And she— boy, I mean, the fact that she was able to move and live anywhere in the world, and that she decided Madrid was the place. And then meeting her friends.

Yeah.

You know, Blaine, her friends are just like— this story is about Ana. It's also the story about women who loved Ana and refused to accept that she could disappear.

That was what struck me about this, is that this story of friendship, the story of the persistence of her friends. But let's first talk about Madrid, because so often in Dateline, we talk about the fact that the cities, the locations where we go to report these stories, are so often a character in and of themselves. And that's really what we saw with Madrid. I thought that you did a fantastic job of just describing it, of bringing the city to life. We had the Spanish guitar woven in there. I mean, you really got a sense of the city as you were watching this episode.

Yeah, you know, there's a saying in Madrid, "De Madrid al cielo." From Madrid to heaven.

Hmm.

Sad that in this case, Madrid to heaven for Ana meant one thing, but Madrid is— its cobblestone streets that have seen so much.

Yes.

And its culture, its history, its vibrancy, is very much a part of this story.

It is a city that makes you feel alive. I wanna say that. I've had the pleasure of going to Madrid. I spent some time there. And I have to say, this is kind of a random, small-known Blaine fact, that. That was the one place and the one time in my life where I had a very strong impulse to get a tattoo. Because I was so moved by the city that I was—

Blaine Alexander, I want to hear about this.

Tell me. Okay, I have no tattoos. Got piercings and whatever, but I don't have any tattoos. And for whatever reason, I don't know, the spirit just got in me. And I was like—

But what, what, I mean, what spirit got into you to tell you, Blaine Alexander, you don't have any tattoos, but this is the place to get your Madrid-centric tattoo?

Here's the thing. I did not get said tattoo. But I was like, this city makes me feel so alive. And like, I was running around the streets. And I was going to get some sort of saying in Spanish. Mind you, I do not speak Spanish, as you and I have discussed. Yes. But I was like, I want to get some sort of something about like life and vibrancy translated into Spanish. Then my kind of like analytical investigative mind was like, wait, do I know what the health regulations are here? Is this the best place to do it? Should I do— and then I was like, maybe the language barrier. I might get something I don't want. So then my kind of like rational mind took over, and the dreamy Blaine went away. So the urge was stopped. But that's the closest I've ever been to getting a tattoo, was when I was enjoying and living in the streets of Madrid.

So I thought—

That's so interesting because it, it does have an impact and an influence on everyone. And it's a place where you can immediately feel at home and at the same time realize that there is so much history there to be found.

Yes.

Even if you don't put on a tattoo. It's still moving.

It's still moving.

I was moved.

I was very moved. And I think that's why when you said in your episode that this is the place where Ana chose to basically start anew after divorcing her husband, one, I thought it was such a brave act on her part because it can be difficult, I would imagine, to live a life, build a life with somebody in a city, and then end that marriage and stay in that same city. Because it would have to be that every place, everywhere you go, everywhere you turn, you're reminded of that person and that life that you're now walking out of. And so, to step into a new country, it just told me so much about her, just hearing that she did that.

Yeah, they did keep in contact. I mean, things seem amicable from the beginning. But she had Sana, who is a friend that lives in South Florida, and they traveled throughout Europe together. And she— then she had Elisa Romero, the friend, a Colombian, uh, young lady who she met in Madrid, and they become fast friends in no time. As a matter of fact, when Ana first got to Madrid, she lived with Elisa for some weeks until she found that apartment on the 6th floor in Salamanca. And that kind of tight-knit, small group really covered her with confidence and with love and gave her the confidence to start a new life. And you could feel that.

I mean, there really was was this sisterhood that formed amongst these ladies, to the point that— I mean, we see this in so many Dateline episodes, Jose— is that somebody thinks they can kind of, in some way, use technology to throw someone off of the scent of their trail, right? Like, OK, if I send these text messages or, you know, post on Facebook, right, that people will not be wise to the fact that this person's gone missing. And I love that her friends immediately looked and said, this— doesn't sound like the way Anna and I text. This does not sound like her at all.

Yeah. You know, I keep this. I keep this. This is the text communication that Anna had with Sanne.

Wow.

I love that— I don't know if you could see.

I can, yeah.

Just the background that the two ladies chose. There's bicycles, and there's hearts, and there's BFFs.

Yeah.

And then that text, which, you know, just a day after she disappeared. Immediately, Sanaa said, "This doesn't sound— This is not how she speaks. This is not how we speak." And then when Eliza said, "I was speaking, I was texting with Ana 15 minutes before she disappeared." And then she actually— And, you know, in the episode, you can see how painful it is for Eliza to think back that on that night, Anna was asking her, "Let's go out. Let's do something." And that 3 times Elisa said, "Not tonight. Not tonight. I'm not feeling good." Yeah. And then she disappeared. And for Elisa, knowing that, you know, there are always the question marks. What if I had said yes? What if Anna had come out and we had gone to dinner? And, you know, she wouldn't have been home. What if?

Yeah.

"What if?" are the questions that I guess remain with so many people affected by this.

Of course.

Tragic. Of course, of course. When we get back, we'll have an extra clip from friends of Ana talking about how special she was. The detective here, Detective Rodriguez, he— you mentioned that he was going through so many different small— clues and pieces of evidence. Let's talk about some of that. First, the spray painting on the cameras. One, I've got to say that there are a few things to me more chilling than watching somebody spray paint or manipulate a surveillance camera, right? Because you know that they're coming there for a nefarious purpose.

No doubt. And the fact that there were so many pieces of video that had to be strung together. But that initial spray of the camera that's in the, you know, hallway right by the elevator, and then to see how even when he spray-painted, Detective Montilla and others were able to see through that drying paint. Right. Evidence that tied David directly to the crime.

It was striking because, as you went through the investigation, it was very clear that David had thought this through. I mean, David really—

Oh, yeah.

I mean, you would think, thought of everything. The fact that he switched license plates, switched it again, switched it again. I mean, he really thought all of this through.

He put in so much planning, you know, when he, you know, wrote the text and then had his Colombian friend—

That was wild.

—in Colombia translate the exact text to Colombian Spanish to send to Anna's Spanish-speaking friends.

Quick question.

Colombian Spanish, that's different than Spanish. There's a distinction. Yes.

What's that? So in a way, You know, every Latin American country has a different accent. And I'm just thinking, you could think of, for example, you know, British English to American English. It's the same language, but there are certain differences in accents and even in words.

Sure.

So David, who had spent time in South Florida, and South Florida is such a mix of all cultures and languages, knew that Spanish has different accents. And so he reaches out to his Colombian friend, Ana being Colombian American, and says, "Hey, can you translate this for a friend of mine that's working on a project in Colombian Spanish?" Mm-hmm. And then the fact that he— thought of, "How do I get from Serbia to Spain when there are—" He knows borders, right? Uh, and cameras and license tag readers. In Spain, every other block almost has a license plate reader. Uh, and I don't know if he knew that, but he knew that he had to go through at least 5 countries.

Sure.

How do I do that undetected? And he got a burner phone, then stole these license plates, Tinted the rental car.

He's thinking, "There's gotta be toes along the way." He even put down the sun visor. When he was going through that.

Even put down—

That one really got me.

Even put down the sun visor. Yep. But David thought of all of these steps.

It's really striking. It really, really is striking. I have to ask, I mean, this is your first time doing a Dateline. I would assume that this is your first time really kind of like diving in and following an investigator with such detail as they go through a case, right? You interview law enforcement all the time, but this, it's different when you do it for Dateline. Did this kind of give you a different perspective or a different insight when you look into the work that detectives do on these cases?

Absolutely. I've gotta tell you, uh, 42 years, uh, as a journalist, and, uh, this first opportunity to work with Dateline gave me a completely new perspective, understanding, and respect. Mm-hmm. Uh, for not only law enforcement, but also for the work that we do. Blaine, that you do, that every single person does on Dateline.

You know, I think— here's why I get so excited talking to you, José, among many reasons. But I've never spoken to anybody doing their first Dateline episode. It was always the questions directed at me. And so, to hear this coming from you, it's so exciting. It's so interesting to hear your perspective of what it was like doing this for the first time. And, and, and, Yes, that was one of the things that shocked me as well, is just how in-depth we're able to go in these stories, right? And how much we're able to learn. Like, you have this now knowledge of this case that you never would've had before. You know so much about it, right? And you feel so much about it too.

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, in these 42 years, for me, there are just countless people that remain with me as I have covered them. And to shine a light where there is darkness, to listen to those who are often silent or silenced.

Mm-hmm.

And to see that those life experiences and life lessons can be helpful to others is extraordinary. So let me ask you, what has been in your process the most satisfying and maybe the most surprising thing you have learned from and through this?

I'm smiling so big because this is— this is classic José, by the way. Mind you, I am the interviewer, and here you are asking me questions. Now you have flipped it and you have turned this thing on its head. I will— you know, I think that the— the most gratifying thing for me is the fact that we're able to have such long conversations. I think that, you know, in my days of doing Nightly News, Today Show, MSNBC, like all of those things where it's like we're doing interviews, but there's a deadline. Deadline that's right there. And so you go in, we can maybe have a 15, 20-minute snippet of a conversation, and then it's kind of like, "Okay, gotta get it, gotta, you know, cut it for air." In this position, you're able to let the conversations breathe, and you're able to really go where people want to go with the discussions, and you're able to let the emotions come out, right? Because these are people who have gone through something horrible. And now we're in this place where they're able to talk about it and sit down across from somebody who will listen for 2 hours, 3 hours, sometimes more about this.

And so, I just love living in those interviews. It gives me chills even talking about it.

And going back to Ana, I, you know, she stays with you. You know, for Sana and for her friend, Elisa, and so many others, But this is something that is a permanent scar that they need to heal.

Yeah. Let's talk about David. I'm curious, as you were reporting this story, as you were talking to the detectives, what did you learn about David, about the type of individual this person was?

A driven, crazed, "I have to succeed, I have to make money, my American dream is to be wealthy. And as Sana says in our chat, you know, David felt as though he was in control of the car he was driving and that he could be the only driver of the car of life. And Anna was just a passenger in the back seat. And that's how a lot of his friends describe him too.

Let's talk about David's demise, dying by suicide there in his jail cell. I mean, I think that it really speaks to just everything you've said about his personality, right? This, "I have to win. I have to be— I'm driven. Everything will be perfect. Everything will go my way." And then when it doesn't— I love the question that you asked.

You said, "Was that his confession?" Because he was a coward, as Sanaa said. Because he was a coward. There is no other explanation for it?

I think that when someone goes through a tragedy like this, when something like this happens to their loved one, there is, of course, the pain of losing a person. But there is this added, indescribable pain that people have to carry when they don't know where their loved one is. When a body is not found. When you know that they're dead, but you only know that because you have to assume. I mean, And we've done stories like this. One that comes to mind for me is Bring Ajay Home. I remember speaking with Jaylee's mom, and she said every time she drove a stretch of road, she almost broke down because she just imagined her baby out there lying somewhere, right? And this was for more than 2 years. So I cannot imagine the pain that Ana's family, her incredible friends, are dealing with, not only not knowing where she is, but it's such a wide area that she could be. I mean, she could be somewhere in Spain. She could be on the road back to Serbia. Like, there are just so many— questions that they really just have to carry with them every day. And that's so terrible.

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, and all of the people, all of them that I spoke with, say that they will continue searching for Anna in every way that they can. This is a 1,600-plus-mile journey. Distant trek where David could have left her. And then there are some questions. I have my theory. There are theories by her friends and by officials. I'm brought back, dear Blaine—

Mm-hmm.

—to this text, the text that he wrote and sent to her friends. "I met someone wonderful. He has a summer house about 2 hours from Madrid. We're going there. Signal is spotty." Hmm. Why would you, as the killer, mention a summer house 2 hours from Madrid with no signal? And if, by chance, "you leave the body 2 hours from Madrid." Maybe that would get authorities on a whole different—

You know, who was it that said, "The best lies have some hint of truth in them," right?

That makes a lot of sense.

Yeah. Yeah, why mention a house 2 hours from Madrid? If you're not going to have a reason to mention it. You know, he thought of a lot of things through. And I don't— certainly detectives aren't taking this as being the only place, but they have searched the area 2 hours around Madrid. They've searched into Italy. They've gone through France. They've gone through that entire 1,600-mile— Right. Look at this. Here's— I love that you have to show it out. But look at this thing. I mean, look at where it goes through. It's— you got to go through different countries. But then Italy and France up there in the Italian area, those are— that's very close to the mountainous areas. And then, you know, France, obviously into Spain, that's really mountainous stuff. So Along the way, and they've actually gone searching through mountainous areas of Italy and through the areas there of the border with Spain. But it's difficult to put your mind in the mind of someone who has lost his daughter.

José, I have to say that you have many talents, my friend.

Thanks, guys.

But clearly being a detective is one of them because that is such good insight. And also the fact that you have these printed out pieces of evidence here, the visual aids. Is striking. You jumped into this case yourself. It's very, very clear.

I do think about her a lot, and I know you do. All of the people that we are privileged to speak with that have gone through very difficult moments, one keeps them in one's heart and in one's memory.

Well, to that point, let's close this by hearing a little bit more about who Ana was. I know that you spoke with some of her friends. There were some beautiful remembrances of her, stories about her that didn't make it into the episode, but let's listen to a little bit of that now.

Ana was a very nice person and a very good friend, and she was very kind, and you can talk to her, and she was never judging you. So I remember the first time we met, we just met up for a local happy hour, and we immediately started talking about travel memories and discovered that we had the same interests, same likes and dislikes. On destinations where we had been and where we wanted to go. I remember she told me about a trip that she had planned already to Colombia, where she is from, after a couple of weeks. And I remember thinking to myself, maybe I can come and join her, and said, maybe she thinks it is too early for me to suggest that, but she did not. So after a few weeks after meeting, we went to Bogotá together. She even said to me, she said, Oh no, you do not have to get a hotel. I have a bigger room, and you know, you can stay with me. I remember our conversations, our jokes. We have very deep conversations. She is a very bubbly person, great smile. You know, you could tell she's adventurous.

She was a sweetheart.

You know, I think one can hope to go through life and have friends as good as the friends Ana had. I mean, friendships that rich. You know?

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, it's interesting that that one moment that Eliza shares with us, her— she keeps all of the texts and the voice recordings that Ana sent her. And the one of Ana laughing—

Yes.

—for one entire minute. Was so representative of what Elisa says their friendship was based on. And Anna, who, you know, loved to learn new dances and cumbias and merengues and even flamenco when she got to Spain, and her laughter and her joie de vivre and her determination to make a life that wasn't based on money, but rather on love.

Well, it was— it is a tragic story, but you told it beautifully and with such heart and compassion. So, José, it was just a joy to talk Dateline with you on this, your first Dateline episode. I can't wait for more.

Blayna, I am— Can I just tell you, I am so touched and privileged to be able to share this with you, whom I so admire. So, thank you.

The feeling is absolutely mutual, my friend. And up next, we'll answer your questions from social media.

And we're back, and I'm joined by wonderful producer, the wonderful producer of this episode, Alex Loray, to answer some of your questions from social media. Itzar Harpaz, who is also our producer on this hour, uh, has been extraordinary as well. Alex, how are you?

I'm good, Jose. I'm actually at the Miami courthouse today covering another case. How are you?

Great. And just looking forward to answering some of the questions that we were sent. And this one by Francis Mpu says, does the FBI call the shots or is it the local authorities in this case?

Yeah, good question. So this story was a little bit different just because there was a lot of local authorities that were working together. So at first, Ana's case was taken by the local Salamanca police, which was the jurisdiction she lived in, which is the smaller sort of municipality. So they took it over, and then it was handed over to the Spanish National Police, which is Ramon's team and Emilio's team. And then once the FBI sort of gets involved, that's when the family contacts the FBI, lets them know that there's an American citizen that's been missing in Madrid. For a few days, and that's when the FBI sort of gets involved. But initially, it's the local police who's doing all the legwork.

So this one is from Felicious1908. So were the security cameras not being watched in real time? Security cameras in an apartment, to me, are only gonna be useful if they are viewed in real time.

Yeah. No, not in this case. The Ramos team actually only watched the cameras 10 days after Ana went missing. In Spanish law, um, you know, the person can't be declared as a missing person unless 10 days have passed. So the surveillance footage was only viewed by his team after that.

Another one from Felicia's 1908. It takes bravery and a sense of adventure to so— to go solo abroad.

Totally. I mean, her and Sana— I think Ana and Sana's relationship was so special because they had this love for travel, you know. And, and Sana talks to us a little bit about that in the episode. And they love to travel together as solo female travelers. That's what she loved to do.

Yeah, I mean, Bobby G62 says she was so lucky to have such a friend to go look for her. I think that this is really a story of extraordinary women and extraordinary friendships.

Yeah, definitely. I mean, Sanna was planning on seeing her, so she just says, "You know what?

I'm gonna jump on this plane earlier than I was anticipating on going to see what's going on with my friend." Yeah, and that joint effort with Sana and Elisa in Madrid, that's something that, as we say in the episode, they were acting like detectives.

Totally. A lot of that legwork that they were doing in the beginning was helpful to investigators later on.

Yeah. Let's highlight a little bit Agent Alex Montilla. She's a 30-year vet of the FBI. This was her last case before she retired. And she put everything into this, Alex.

Oh, yeah. No, we were actually lucky. The reason we got to interview her was because she was retired. So we got, you know, if she was still working on the case, we might not have been able to speak with her. But yeah, she put everything into this.

All right. So, Alex, we asked a question from our Dateline account on Friday, which is, if you could live anywhere in the world, where would you go? Alex Loray, where would you go?

I think I would actually move to Madrid, to be honest with you. I lived there before for about a year, right after I graduated college, and it's just, It's my favorite city in the whole world. So it would, it would be Madrid, honestly, for me.

You're very madrileña in many ways, I've gotta tell you.

Thank you. And you live there as well, I know.

I did. I, we grew up there. We were exiled there for some time. My parents who, you know, Cubans, uh, we were exiled, uh, in 1959 and ended up spending pretty much my entire childhood in, in Madrid. And I too, I think, After Miami, I'm a guy who, if I could live anywhere in the world, I'd live exactly where I live, Miami. But Madrid is a very close number 2. So what about this story, Alex, left you? What are some of the things that this story left in you?

I mean, I learned about Ana's case right away, sort of right when she went missing. I remember hearing a lot of the stories. I'm from Miami, so Originally, I heard about the case through our affiliate down here, NBC6. And I think what was striking to me initially was that, again, this is a woman going to Spain, a place that I've been to many times, a place that I loved, a place that I moved. So I think I saw a lot of myself in her in that way. And throughout learning about the investigation and the incredible steps the police made, you know, to come to David, it was just— it's incredible.

Alex, just in— it was in April? Uh, that the FBI, uh, came up and upped the ante to $25,000 for information—

Mm-hmm.

—leading to the remains of Ana.

Yeah.

Is there any way to think that they could find her body?

Remo says that he's never gonna stop looking, you know? And I really believe that he feels strongly that he will. You know, he wants to give Ana's family closure, and they're gonna continue putting resources into looking. Alex Lorre, thank you.

Thank you so much.

Yeah, thank you, Jose. It was a pleasure talking to you.

Likewise. And that's it for Talking Dateline this week, and thank you for listening. Remember, if you have any questions about our stories, you can DM us your audio or video on our socials @DatelineNBC. You can also leave us a voicemail at 212-413-5252 for a chance to be featured right here. And you can watch the video version of Talking Dateline on Peacock or YouTube, or subscribe to the NBC News app. And before we go, be sure to check out Keith's new original podcast series, Five Miles from Home, the story of the murder of a high school track star in a small desert town. The first four episodes are available now, or you can subscribe to Dateline Premium to binge the of the entire series ad-free. We'll see you Friday for an all-new Dateline on NBC, and you can catch Dateline en Español whenever you'd like at Peacock. And on Telemundo, thank you for the privilege of your time. Thank you.