Transcript of Ros Atkins On: Are North Korean troops fighting in Ukraine? | BBC News

Ukraine says North Korea has entered its war with Russia in a fully fledged manner. The US says upwards of 12,000 North Korean troops have been deployed, primarily in Russia's Kursk region, where Ukraine has seized territory.

Based upon what they've been trained on and the way that they've been integrated into the Russian formations, I fully expect to see them engaged in combat soon.

The BBC has verified footage from inside Russia showing soldiers speaking Korean. Ukraine also, says Russia, is using North Korean missiles. There are many questions about North Korea's alleged involvement in this war. This is what we know. The conflict is primarily being fought in Eastern Ukraine. Over 6,000 kilometers away is North Korea. It's one of the most secretive and repressive countries on Earth. And in June, Vladimir Putin visited. He and Kim Jong Un signed a mutual defense treaty. Each country promised to help the other if needed. The relevance to Ukraine was clear. Even before this deal, in January, Ukraine released images which it said showed debris from a North Korean missile fired by Russia. Then in October, Ukrainian sources briefed Western media that North Korean troops were in Russia. The Kremlin responded, This seems like yet another fake news story, it said. A North Korean official called the report's Groundless Stereotype Rumors. But later in October, Putin gave a different response at a summit in Russia, saying, We have never doubted in the least that the North Korean leadership takes our agreement seriously, but what we do within the framework of this article is our business, he said.

But we're starting to get glimpses of what that business might be. Bbc Verifiers looked at a number of videos on this. Several appear to be from a military facility in Segevka, just over 200 kilometers from the North Korean border. This post shares a video which it claims was filmed there on the 15th of October. We can't confirm the location or the date. But in the video, we see men receiving kit and signing forms. Bbc Russia says the kit is consistent with Russian uniform and a North Korean accent can be heard. The next video was definitely filmed in Segevka at the same facility. It's filmed by Russian soldiers who describe the men we see as new reinforcements. We don't know if they're North Korean, but we are sure of the location. This is how.

Whenever we're looking at images, we are looking for tiny clues. You can see the badge right here? We think that's the Eastern military badge, the Russian Army. Look at the layout here. We can see a big open space, pathways, one-story buildings. I think we're going to be looking at Tsagivka and down in this corner where we can see those open spaces and pathways. What's more, at this point, you can see a large building, white and green in the background. We know from this press release on a Russian military news website, this is the main building at in Kyivka.

Our next focus is a factory in a place called Hamhung in North Korea. This is the only facility known to produce North Korea's KN-23 ballistic missile. Here's a satellite image of that facility in October. It's from the satellite company Planet Labs. Reuters analyzed satellite images such as these and reported that this building is under construction and appears to be for assembling missiles. Then this is a second image also from Planet Labs. Reuters says shows a suspected construction of new worker housing around 600 meters from the first construction site. Now, Ukraine claims Russia has fired 60 KN-23 missiles this year. The BBC can't confirm this, but if that is the case, an increase in production, as suggested by those satellite images, may well be needed. There isn't, though, a lot of clear-cut evidence of North Korean troops and weapons being deployed by Russia. Some analysts say that's to be expected.

It's not strange that we have a limited amount of evidence of North Korean troops in the field because those North Korean troops are limited geographically to the Kersk region of Russia, as far as we know. They haven't been used in combat inside Ukraine, and if they were, we would expect to have a bit more visual evidence of that deployment.

The Kursk region of Russia being where Ukraine has seized territory and where the US, Ukraine, and South Korea say North Korean troops troops are being deployed. If that is the case, why would North Korea be willing to get involved in a war many miles away? Well, there are a number of benefits.

It could be fuel, it could be food, supplies that North Korea desperately needs after years of self-imposed isolation and international sanctions. But the concern is whether it's also weapons or some advanced technology that Kim Jong Un wants to escalate and elevate his nuclear weapons program to the next level.

We don't know exactly what North Korea may get it in return, but there are multiple claims this isn't a one-way arrangement. In the last few days, South Korea has claimed that Russia is providing North Korea with an air defense missile system. And then there's Russian oil. This satellite image, shared with the BBC by the research group Open Source Center, shows a North Korean tanker in a Russian port. The UK government has told the BBC Russia is using oil as payment for troops and weapons. There are several reasons why becoming involved in the war may work for North Korea. For Russia, well, first and foremost, this may be about troop numbers. Bbc Russia has confirmed that over 78,000 Russian soldiers have been killed since the war began, and that the recent rate of losses is higher than at any point in the war. For its part, North Korea has over 1.2 million soldiers, something Vladimir Putin will be well aware of.

I think in terms of Russian desperation, look, this batch of 10,000 North Korean soldiers, they're not going to make a big difference if this is the single batch. But if this becomes a robust pipeline through which the Russians can get 15 or 20,000 troops per month, that would take care of up to a third or two-thirds of Russia's losses and be a substantial way to keep the Russians fighting this war for a long time.

But let's look at the map once more because there's another country in this equation, China. It's an ally and a neighbor of North Korea. It's also an ally of Russia's. This is President Xi and President Putin meeting recently in Russia. On the issue of North Korea's involvement in the war, the US has made this demand.

But if China is serious about its desire for de-escalation, it should be asking Russia some hard questions at this point.

If China is asking questions, it's not doing so publicly. This US attempt to pressure China is another reminder that while this war is between Ukraine and Russia, a long list of other countries are deeply involved. There's growing evidence that list includes North Korea.