Transcript of US and Iran Trade Strikes After Brief Pause, Fauci Pleads The Fifth, New Asylum Rule

Happy Thursday. I have something I'd like to share with you, and it's actually from a listener like you. Michael from St. Louis says, "I listen to Up First every morning. I think it is important to have detailed and factual information that is not owned by corporations, but is instead supported by people like me." And it's true. NPR has no corporate owners, no shareholders. We serve you, the public.

And that means that public media needs supporters to continue its mission of creating a more informed public. Our July fundraiser ends tomorrow, so help us Let's end this month strong. Head to donate.npr.org and give today. And thank you. The U.S. launched a wave of airstrikes on Iran overnight.

It's in retaliation to a foiled surprise attack on U.S. bases in Jordan. Do the attacks and counterattacks mean a return to all-out war?

I'm Michelle Martin. That's Leila Fadel. And this is Up First from NPR News. Republican Senator Rand Paul wants to hold Dr. Anthony Fauci in contempt. Fauci repeatedly invoked the Fifth Amendment during a contentious Senate hearing. Why did he refuse to answer any questions?

And a new Trump administration rule is making it even harder to seek asylum.

What you're really seeing is a concerted attack on asylum from all fronts by the administration.

Asylum cases can now be sent without interviewing applicants to immigration court, where asylum approval rates are at their lowest in 20 years. Stay with us. We've got the news you need to start your day. More attacks between the U.S. and Iran are increasing fears of a return to all-out war.

U.S. Central Command says it launched a wave of airstrikes overnight while U.S. bases in Jordan came under Iranian attack. Saudi Arabia joined Americans' attacks in Iraq on Wednesday.

NPR's Jane Arraf joins us now to talk about this from Amman, Jordan. Good morning, Jane.

Good morning, Leila.

So just a few days ago, it looked as if the U.S. and Iran were pausing attacks to give diplomacy a try, and now we're back to attacks. What happened?

CENTCOM says it launched a heavy wave of strikes against Iran overnight. It said the targets included military command centers and missile facilities. That's in retaliation for what the U.S. military called a surprise Iranian attack on Wednesday at the Muafaq al-Salti Air Base in the Jordanian desert, where the U.S. has a major military presence. It's also where 3 U.S. soldiers were killed in an Iranian attack this month. Iran itself launched more missiles at U.S. forces in Jordan on Thursday. The U.S. and Jordan said they were shot down. A lot of analysts see this as Iran testing the U.S. under a harder-line regime that succeeded Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei, who was killed by the U.S. at the beginning of the war.

Yeah, and then the U.S. and Saudi Arabia, which has not been publicly involved before, attacked Iraq. Tell us what's happening there.

Yeah, Saudi Arabia has blamed Iran-backed militias in Iraq for damaging attacks on one of its major oil refineries, but the Iraqi government says Saudi Arabia has never provided any evidence. In retaliation, the U.S. and Saudi on Wednesday launched a wave of airstrikes against at least 7 militia bases, killing at least people. And the key thing is, you know, Layla, these are militias fostered and supported by Iran that flourished after the US invasion of Iraq. Some of them are now officially part of government forces. So that puts the new Iraqi Prime Minister, Ali al-Zaidi, in a huge bind. He promised President Trump in a Washington meeting that he would bring those militias fully under government control. But given how powerful they are, both in security and politics, it's proved impossible for previous governments and could be equally difficult for him.

So the conflict is widening even further, it seems. What happens now with Iraq?

Well, there's definitely heightened tension. The Iraqi Prime Minister held an emergency security meeting yesterday. Iraq has rejected attacks on its sovereignty, which is a reference to US and Saudi strikes, and they've noted that US forces have already withdrawn from Iraqi bases at the Iraqi request. They are, of course, though, still in the Kurdistan region of Iraq, back. Fighters and Iranian security advisers who were killed in those strikes were buried yesterday. Here's a bit of what that sounded like. That funeral procession in Baghdad included chants of "Death to Saudi rulers" and "Death to America." The chief of staff of paramilitary groups attached to the Iraqi defense ministry said no one can disarm them. And the Iran-backed militias themselves, who call themselves the Resistance, gave the Iraqi government a deadline of next Thursday to respond to the U.S.-Saudi attacks. That deadline is a day after a hugely significant Shia religious commemoration already underway. It's where millions of people gather in Karbala, the holy city of Karbala. It's a month-long event where religious sentiment is particularly high, commemorating the Battle of Karbala and the killing of Imam Hussein 1,400 years ago. Many Shias believe what's happening now continues what they see as a historical injustice.

That's NPR's Jane Arraf in Amman, Jordan. Thank you, Jane.

Thank you.

Senator Rand Paul is threatening to hold the government's former top infectious disease expert, Dr. Anthony Fauci, in contempt of Congress.

That After yesterday on Capitol Hill, Paul and other Republican lawmakers asked Fauci about the origins of the COVID pandemic and berated him about the government's response. Fauci invoked the Fifth Amendment over 100 times and didn't answer.

We have NPR's Ari Daniel with the latest. Good morning, Ari.

Good morning.

So what exactly was this hearing about?

Well, Senator Paul subpoenaed Fauci to appear before the Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs. Paul has argued for years that the SARS-CoV-2 virus came from a lab in China and says that Fauci Fauci, who helped lead the federal COVID-19 response, concealed this. Fauci strongly denies the accusation. He says the scientific evidence suggests the virus spilled over naturally from an animal into a human, and many virologists agree.

Okay, and how did yesterday's hearing unfold?

As expected, Paul's opening statement accused Fauci of funding the very research that may have helped engineer the virus. He encouraged Fauci to make a public apology.

I hope today Dr.

Fauci will come clean, admit it was a mistake to fund dangerous research in China.

In his opening statement, Fauci said he believes Paul has a, quote, unhinged obsession with him.

The sole reason he is calling me before this committee is to get me to say something, anything, that could vindicate his repeated public pledges that I end up, in his words, quote, behind bars.

After that opening statement, Fauci didn't say anything else besides invoking the Fifth Amendment to every question, even the most benign, like what color tie he was wearing.

Oh, wow. Fauci has testified a lot about these issues in the past. Why invoke his right against self-incrimination now?

Before President Biden left office, he granted Fauci a blanket pardon covering him from 2014 through early 2025. But legal experts say Fauci could still be accused of perjury if, say, he said something at yesterday's hearing that contradicted what he said in the past under oath. It's worth noting that invoking the Fifth Amendment is not an admission of wrongdoing. Jennifer Mason McElward is a law professor at the University of Notre Dame.

Saying that you are protected by the Constitution is just something you're entitled to do as a citizen of the United States.

What happens next?

Uh, Paul has already said he plans to hold a vote next week on whether Fauci should be held in contempt of Congress. An affirmative vote could eventually lead to a fine, jail time, or both.

And what kind of longer-term impacts might this hearing have?

Right, so Georges Benjamin, the head of the American Public Health Association, told me that a hearing like this, combined with recent cuts to federal agencies, it all adds up to undermining public health in the U.S.

We've seen it every day, right? The inability to respond effectively to hantavirus, measles, cyclospora.

Benjamin says the need for educated and evidence-based health policy is more urgent than ever. Democratic Senator Andrew Kim said at yesterday's hearing it may be harder to find people to do those things.

These firing, these cuts, they're creating a chilling effect, honestly, a chilling effect for the next generation of people who might consider stepping up to serve our nation.

Especially, he says, if they fear attacks like this.

That's NPR's Ari Daniel. Thank you, Ari.

Thank you, Leila.

A new Trump administration rule says asylum officers can send certain cases directly to immigration court.

The goal is to reduce the backlog of asylum applications, but NPR's analysis shows this is one more way the government has chipped away at a program that thousands of people people rely on to escape violence and persecution.

NPR immigration policy correspondent Jimena Bustillo is with me now. Good morning.

Good morning.

So what is this change?

There are two ways that people can get asylum, which is a legal status. One is for people who the administration is trying to deport in a Department of Justice immigration court, where immigrants can argue that they should not be deported. The other is by applying directly with a branch of Homeland Security called the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services. An asylum officer would usually interview them to hear directly about their cases and either let them advance or they could be referred to one of those immigration courts. The new rule from USCIS this week says that asylum officers can send asylum seekers directly to immigration court without that interview.

What are the standards for asylum?

Immigrants can only claim asylum if they're already physically present in the U.S. and typically within a year of arriving. Asylees need to prove a fear of returning to their home country based on one of 5 protected characteristics: race, religion, nationality, membership citizenship of a particular social group or political opinion. Now, there are over 3 million cases waiting for a decision.

How does this latest policy fit into the administration's other changes to the asylum process?

On Trump's first day in office, he shut down the application immigrants could use to schedule appointments to begin that asylum process. Asylum applicants at every stage of this system since then, from interviews with asylum officers, after hearings in immigration court, or just while waiting for their next scheduled appointment have been at risk of being detained, and there have been delays and denials. At one point last year, the administration paused the review of all asylum applications. I spoke with lawyers like Ruby Powers, who say that they're seeing more cases denied.

We normally have a lot of approvals, and we're not seeing that with the same quality of case types. It's as if the rubric, the analysis, the evaluation of the case has changed because an asylum case approval is a rarity now.

And I analyzed immigration court data that shows asylum approvals are at their lowest rate in two decades. The White House has declined to respond to this, but in April it promoted record low asylum approvals at immigration courts. In that statement, the White House said that they have replaced activist judges who, quote, slow-walked deportations and granted asylum at sky-high rates. Here's Matt Joseph, a former asylum officer who now works for the advocacy group The Center for Gender and Refugee Studies.

What you're really seeing is a concerted attack on asylum from all fronts by the administration. They're really trying to keep people out of the asylum process to begin with, and if they are already in it, they are trying to find a way to take people out of it.

So as these opportunities narrow, what happens to those who are waiting or even granted asylum?

For those who have already been approved, their lives have changed. New policies make asylees ineligible for some safety net programs for food and healthcare and small business loans, for example. For those still waiting on an approval or even a denial, new rules could mean delays in receiving work permits, and they're also at risk of getting deported since an application itself is not legal status. Immigration advocates say despite the policies, many may still try to stay because going back to their home countries could put them in danger from what they're trying to claim asylum from.

That's NPR correspondent Ximena Bustillo. Thank you, Ximena.

Thank you.

And that's Up First for Thursday, July 30th. I'm Michelle Martin.

And I'm Leila Fadel. Today's episode of Up First was edited by Miguel Macías, Amina Khan, Anna Yukonanov, H.J. Mai, and Alice Wolfley. It was produced by Ziad Butch and Nia Dumas. Our director is Christopher Thomas. We get engineering support from Misha Haines. Our technical director is Carly Strange, and our deputy executive producer is Kelly Dickens. Join us again tomorrow.