Transcript of RFK Jr. Grilled, Europeans Pledge Troops to Ukraine, DC Sues Trump Admin

Health and Human Services Secretary, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Defended his position on vaccines in a contentious Senate hearing. Now, parents who decide that they do want their children back.

You're just making stuff up, Senator. I'm not making stuff up.

You're just making stuff up. So what do you have to say about who can get vaccines?

I'm Michelle Martin. That's A. Martinez, and this is Up First from NPR News. European countries have finalized a commitment to provide postwar security guarantees for Ukraine, including troops on the ground, in the sea, and in the air. Now, the plan heads the US.

You could see the US providing capabilities that European do not have.

Will President Trump give it his support?

And the attorney general for the district of Columbia suing the Trump administration over its deployment of the National Guard of the City, calling it a military occupation. Stay with us. We've got all the news you need to start your day. Hey, it's Robin Hilton from NPR Music with some big news for everyone who loves The Tiny Desk. We're giving away a trip to DC to see a Tiny Desk concert in person, hotel and flights included. Learn more and enter for free at npr. Org/tinydeskgiveaway. No purchase or donation required for entry must be 18 years or older to enter. Links to the entry page and official rules can be found at npr. Org/tinydeskgiveaway.

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For decades, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. Built his reputation and fortune as an anti-vaccine activist.

That concerned many senators who were considering his nomination to serve as Health and Human Services Secretary. So he made promises not to prevent people who want them from getting vaccines. Since he's gotten the job, many of those senators have come to believe he's taken actions that, taken together, have broken that promise. So in a Senate hearing on Thursday, they demanded that he explain himself.

Npr's Selena Simmons-Duffin watched the hearing yesterday, and it's here to explain. So that was some must-see TV, Selena. What questions did the senators have for Kennedy about vaccines?

Well, fall is coming, winter is coming, right? And for a lot of people, that means the flu shot and the COVID-19 booster to protect against the respiratory viruses that start getting passed around. So this year, the Food and Drug Administration approved the COVID booster with a catch. It is not approved for everybody, just people with certain conditions and people over 65. And there's already a huge amount of confusion about what that means in real life for doctors, patients, insurance companies. But yesterday in the hearing, Secretary Kennedy insisted that anybody who wants the shot can get it, and he got really angry when he was pressed about it. Here's one example. It was in exchange with Senator Maggie Hassan, Democrat of New Hampshire, who was asking about the COVID-19 booster for kids.

Now, parents who decide that they do want their children down. You're just making stuff up, Senator. I'm not making stuff up. You're just making stuff up. Sometimes when you make an accusation, it's a confession, Mr. Kennedy.

Wow. So who's right, Senator Hassan or Secretary Kennedy?

Hassan is right that parents of kids without certain conditions are probably going to face barriers getting the booster shot this year. This approval, only for certain groups, means that just wanting the vaccine, making the personal choice to get one, might not be enough this year. And a big question mark is what the centers for Disease Control and Prevention Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices is going to do. You remember, this is the group that Kennedy said he wouldn't touch. And then he fired all 17 members and replaced them with his pics, many of whom have a history, like him, of anti-vaccine activism.

Now, all this isn't just only about COVID-19 vaccines.

Yeah, that's right. The panel who's meeting later this month is also set to consider routine childhood vaccines, like the one for measles, mumps, and rubella, and hepatitis B. Senator Michael Bennett, Democrat of Colorado, asked Kennedy if that meant schools and parents in his state should be prepared for more measles outbreaks.

I do not anticipate a change in the MMR vaccine. Azip is an independent panel. Well, it's a panel you just put those folks on, far from what You said there are people with ideas that are completely outside the mainstream. You mean out of the pharmaceutical paradigm?

Let me just say- Yeah, that was one of several times in the hearing that Kennedy equated scientific consensus that vaccines are safe and effective and save lives, with researchers somehow being compromised by drug companies. There was a memorable moment when Senator Sanders, independent of Vermont, picked up on that.

Everybody is corrupt, but you? It's Is that what we're looking at? I don't think so. And I think the issue now- I don't even know what you're talking about. Well, I think you do know what you're talking about.

I don't know what you're talking about. When pressed by Sanders, Kennedy said, yes, he does think mainstream medical organizations like the American Academy of Pediatrics can't be trusted because they're, quote, gravely conflicted and claiming their top contributors are vaccine makers.

Did those organizations have a response to those accusations?

Yeah, the AAP put out a statement right away that said that was false, and it's financial information is public and industry sources represent less than 4% of their revenue, and they concluded, quote, pediatricians recommend vaccines for one reason only. They are proven safe and among the most effective tools we have to protect children's health and stop the spread of disease in our communities.

That's NPR Selena Simmons-Duffin. Thanks a lot.

You're welcome. Europe has must finalize a strategy to guarantee peace and security in Ukraine once the war comes to an end.

The plan which would include troops on the ground was announced Thursday at a summit in Paris. It has yet to be guaranteed by the US, but already early this morning, Russian President Vladimir Putin has offered his reaction.

Npr's Eleanor Beardsley is in Paris. Eleanor, what did the Europeans announced?

Well, A, 35 countries got together physically here and by video link. Not only European, the group is known as the Coalition of the Willing. It includes Australia, New Zealand, Japan, and Canada. They say they are ready to commit to Ukraine's security and have concrete plans for it. Here's French President Emmanuel Macron, who spoke after the meeting, standing alongside Ukrainian President Vladimir Zelenskyy. Let's listen.

He said, We have 26 countries formally committed to deploying a reassurance force of troops in Ukraine to be physically present on land, air, or sea to guarantee peace the day it is declared.

Now, Macron said he could not give any details, but he said they would be ready. For anyone who thinks this is just more talk, Macron reminded everyone of how far this group has come. They first came together last February in despair, really, when it became very clear that the US under President Trump was going to be completely different on Ukraine than the Biden administration. Back then, Macron said only two countries were ready to commit troops.

What about the United States? Will it play a role in this coalition?

Well, hopefully, yes. Macron and Zelensky also spoke with President Trump after the meeting. They said they spoke to him for an hour and a half, and they said the US role would be determined in the coming days. Europeans definitely are counting on the US to be there. Macron claimed the US is fully on board and special on Steve Whitkoff was in Paris at the meeting, but clearly there are doubts how the US will contribute or even if. I spoke with Martin Cuncey, who is the Director of the Paris Office of the German Marshall Fund of the United States. He says it's hard to see a US backstop providing major guarantees.

Now, the backstop could be at least some intelligence and logistical support. There you could see the US participating in providing capabilities that European do not have without without, obviously, sending any troops to Ukraine or officially guaranteeing the security of those European troops.

Okay, but how has President Putin reacted to the announcement?

Well, President Putin has been in China over recent days, joining huge celebrations on the end of World War II with allies China and North Korea. This is the new multipolar world on display that's against US dominance. This morning, Putin said that, Any foreign troops in Ukraine would be a legitimate target for Russian forces. It's not surprising. It's why Macron said that the main pillar of Ukraine's postwar security is actually a strong Ukrainian army. He said they will not accept any restrictions on the size and shape of Ukraine's forces in the future.

What if Vladimir Putin, Eleanor, just does not agree to a peace deal?

Exactly. That's what we've been seeing. Macron admitted that Putin thinks he's winning, so he doesn't want to stop the war. But he emphasized that Russia has suffered more than one million casualties for barely 20% of Ukrainian territory. Macron said there will be new economic sanctions in coordination with the US if Russia continues to refuse to end its war. President Trump also spoke about that. He didn't mention sanctions, but he said that the Europeans need to stop buying any Russian oil.

All right, that's NPR's Eleanor Beardsley in Paris. Thank you.

You're welcome.

The attorney general for the district of Columbia has filed a lawsuit against the Trump administration.

The lawsuit calls the use of the National Guard in the district a quote, illegal deployment. National Guard troops have been patrolling certain streets in Washington, DC for the past three weeks since the President declared what he calls a crime emergency in the city.

Alex Koma covers DC politics for member station WAMU. He joins us now. Alex, what is the lawsuit alleging?

Yeah, DC attorney general Brian Schwalb is basically calling this unconstitutional, saying that this is an improper use of the military on home soil here in the US. He's drawing out this point that normally DC, while it doesn't have control of its National Guard, can request it, and only in cases of a natural disaster, a riot, some emergency. They haven't done that here. Instead, you've got National Guard troops who aren't trained in policing, patrolling the streets here in DC. But the white House pushed back. They released a statement basically saying that the President was well within his lawful authority to deploy the Guard here and called Schwab's lawsuit an attempt to undermine the President's operation.

I'm going to be in DC next week, Alex, so I'm interested to see what the city it looks like. But remind us why National Guard troops were deployed to DC in the first place.

Yeah, well, this is all part of Trump's emphasis on crime in the city. Basically, his claim that crime is out of control here, even though the numbers, of course, show Otherwise, that many violent crimes are actually at historic lows. As I said before, he's the one who controls the guard. Dc is not a state, so there's no governor to control it. It's solely in the President's authority. Whether or not people here it's needed, he's got the power to send them in. He has done so, along with guards from other states, about 2,300 of them, all part of this broader surge of federal law enforcement officers into the city, whether it's FBI, ICE, DEA, the whole alphabet soup. Many people here aren't really thrilled to see them. Many feel that it's unsettling to see uniform troops on the Metro. It's unsettled people, but that hasn't changed the fact that guard officials are saying they should probably be here until at least the end of November, if not longer.

Okay, so has their presence helped reduce crime?

Well, Trump, of course, said that the city's crime free now, but we know that's not true. The DC Police Department has found that crime overall has decreased police, but I'd still add that the troops themselves, they're not authorized to make arrests. They can merely notify police if they see a crime or in some instances, simply call 911. It's difficult to draw any direct correlation when a lot of times they're doing things like spreading mulch and cleaning up parks.

President Trump, though, has said he wants to send troops to other cities. What could this lawsuit mean for the guards' deployment in other cities and the deployment in DC?

Yeah, well, federal court will hash this out. It could send the guard home entirely, but a complicating factor is that House Republicans are even trying to get rid of DC's elected independent attorney general. It's worth mentioning that a federal judge ruled that Trump's actions in California were illegal. For people in places like Chicago or Baltimore, where Trump has also threatened to send the guard in, this is something they'll be watching very closely.

That's WAMU's Alex Koma. Thanks a lot.

My pleasure.

That's a first for Friday, September fifth, W. Artido's.

And I'm Michelle Martin. This Sunday on Up First, America's thirst for oil has left a graveyard of unplugged wells all across the landscape. Most hardly produce any oil at all.

These piddly little wells that are just drip, drabing out a little bit of profit while polluting on the other end, they're not worth it.

This week on the Sunday story from Up First, a look at why so many wells across the country remain unplugged and abandoned despite the real threat of long-term pollution. Grass didn't grow. The pine trees kept dying. There was another tree that sat there and it died. Stripper wells, orphan wells, and the legacy of America's love affair for black gold. Listen to the Sunday story right here in the Up First podcast.

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