Transcript of #262 Aliia Roza - Russian Sex Spy on Seduction Perfumes, Sexpionage and Honeypot Tradecraft

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Alles past, then sound, then drive, then T Rock rocked, then neue T Rock.

Aaliyah. Rosa, welcome to the show.

Thank you so much, Sean. Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.

Well, thank you for being here. A real world honey pot. Well, former honey pot. Former.

Yes, thank you, audience. You know, I would be like, who knows what will happen tomorrow?

No, I've been so, I've been really excited about this interview. Thanks. I'm, I'm glad we were able to make it work. I knew we had to reschedule. But you know what caught my. I saw you on. You popped up on my Instagram feed and you were talking about, I believe you're talking about spies in Silicon Valley. And so that caught my attention because I've been interviewing a lot of tech giants from Silicon Valley, startups and very established and you know, I had breakfast or lunch or dinner a lot of times with the guests off camera. And a handful of these guys were talking about Russian and Chinese. Ukrainian honey pots. Yeah, spies that are going in there and you know, they meet these tech guys that probably, there's probably a handful of them that have never been with a woman and then a beautiful woman comes and then there goes all the secrets back to Russia, China, Ukraine, where.

Wherever Russia also has a strong secret intelligence.

I figured. And so, you know, and so we would have these conversations and I would. I was. I was a GRS contractor for the Central Intelligence Agency. And through a lot of my deployments, one thing that I noticed is I didn't see any Russian ones, but I saw a lot of Chinese broth that were being set up all over Iraq, all over Afghanistan, all over the Middle East. Pretty much anywhere that Americans are working outside of the U.S. and probably, well, actually, definitely inside the U.S. they have brothels where they're trying to lure in State Department intelligence professionals, anybody that they can kind of get their hands on. So. So it was an interesting dialog every single time. And then. And I wasn't surprised, but I was like, oh, like, you guys are very aware of this kind of stuff. And then about a month later, you popped up and I was like, I gotta. We have to do this. So thank you.

Thank you so much. No, I really appreciate it. You know, I appreciate it so much for being inviting to your interview. Because usually press, when I give interview or something, usually press, they either exaggerate everything, either they write more and they call me like these crazy names like, you know, the Sex Spy Reveals the Confession, or like the Sex Spy Manipulator Tells the Whole Truth and all this. So I understand they need to sell it, but I mainly gave an interview about how to prevent manipulation, especially for those men who work in tech companies who are super busy. They don't have time to go and socialize, you know, and meet women who are devoted to their work. And hence when they meet someone online, like virtually, sometimes because of their kindness or maybe because they're naive, sort of, they don't have even think that behind this account may be a fake account of a professional, mature male, intelligent officer who pretends to be this cute, nice young female, you know, girl wearing like bikinis or whatever on the beach and love bombing his account through the social platforms like LinkedIn and, you know, could be Instagram, Facebook, wherever.

And this poor man, because they don't have female attention during the day, they buy it. And because they go too into this relationship, they've been manipulated. And it's really sad because, you know, when I gave an interview, I was actually in New York Times post, I was actually giving some techniques how to prevent manipulation, how to see through this manipulation, and how to understand what are the red flags not just for men, but for women too. There's so many online scammers, right? And we know so many who actually, you know, love bombing you in order to get some money out of you and like hack your account or like bank accounts or whatever. So the Times article went out like the 22nd of October, and in the Times magazine it said that according to the commission of the theft of the American intellectual property, the theft on the trade secrets cost over $600 billion to American taxpayers annually.

$600 billion. $600 billion.

Yes.

So you can go and.

Yes, yes, it's in the article and it's the whole investigation. Actually. There is an expert, James Malvinon, if I'm, you know, pronounce it correctly. He is actually for 30 years investigating espionage in corporations such as, like, you know, corporations in Silicon Valley. And that's exactly what he says that he even, I mean he looks like about like 60 years old guy. He said, like, I've been targeted and I've been contacted by so many Chinese beautiful, pretty accounts in LinkedIn where I understand probably they are spies or like fake accounts, you see. So that's what's going on and that's why we would like to bring awareness, me particular to this man, to be very careful when they have these messages online from these pretty, beautiful young girls. Why would they find you? How would they find you? Why would you think that they want to kind of like date you and whatever just because you're cute? I mean, like, think about like, where do you work?

What kind of, let's be honest, a lot of them aren't cute.

So.

You know, but it's. So we'll get to all that and I think that's very important. But you know, I, I just thought the, I thought the interview would be fascinating and it's going to be even more fascinating than I thought because, you know, originally when I, I just saw the clip, you know, and so I was like, we, we have to get her and, and then going through the outline and, and you know, as we've, as the team's been talking to you about the outline, I mean, so you were basically, you were basically trafficked and this is, this is a lot, this is a lot different than what I was thinking. So in, in, in, in the. It sounds like you, you were trying to take down basically trafficking networks, traffickers, am I correct?

Yes.

And there's a lot of trauma involved in that and a lot of recovery.

Yes, a lot of. I still, I still work with the therapist every week.

Really?

Yeah, for, for 17 years.

Seventeen years, yeah.

And I still have PTSD's and anxiety and it's, it's a big challenge.

Oh that.

It is very. Like sometimes, like there are some Days that it's just. Even my spy techniques don't really help that. I mean, of course they do help, but still, sometimes, like, I find myself that I just cannot go through the day and it's really hard. So.

Yeah, well, everybody starts off with an introduction here. So here we go. Aaliyah Rosa, a former secret agent turned woman empowerment coach, public speaker and influencer. Born in the former Soviet Union into a Kazakh Tatar family of high ranking Soviet military officers. Your grandfather was a national hero who fought the Nazis during World War II. At 18, you became a Russian FSB trained seduction agent where you dedicated yourself to combating drug and human trafficking. And then you defected from Russia, writing a book that reveals spy secret spy techniques based on the KGB program. And there's a documentary being produced about your life. And then we pulled a quote that I thought was pretty interesting from you. At the end of the day, when I saved someone's life, I felt good about it, but I never asked myself how I felt being in a body that was constantly abused and raped by random men. One former FBI agent said I was broke. I was a broken toy, that I was sex trafficked myself. But all my classmates, we didn't feel this way. We felt patriotic. We were ready to sacrifice and do anything for our government.

That's how I felt. It's a pretty powerful statement.

Thank you.

Yeah, that's a pretty powerful statement. So. So like I was saying, you know, before, before we started rolling the cameras here, I would like to do a, a life story on you. And then toward the end of it, talk about some trade craft and manipulation techniques, how to avoid it and, and all that kind of good stuff and who knows what kind of rabbit holes will go down after that. But before we do, everybody gets a gift.

Oh, thank you.

Vigilance Elite Gummy bears.

Wow. Thank you. Can I try it?

Of course you can try it.

Here.

You can try it right here.

I'm so excited. I've seen it. I just, I was like wondering what is the taste of this Gummies. So curious. By the way, while I'm unpacking it quickly. So we are working on documentary. It's not, it's not produ. I mean, it's not produced yet. We just like in the beginning of the beginning, I just signed a deal with Fox Studios, but we didn't even start filming it, so. Yeah, it's not.

Oh, really?

Yeah.

Do you have any idea when it will be out?

Probably next year. But I think like the book will come out earlier than the documentary because you Know everything. Like basically coming from the book, they're looking for the ip, blah, blah, blah. And then you know how it is.

Are you going to be in it?

Are they in a documentary? Yes, but TV show? No TV show. Somebody else will film.

Right on.

Let's hide it here.

What's that?

So I'll just hide this things. Okay, so. All right, so I'm ready to try. They're so cute.

All right, let's see what you think.

Oh, my God.

Not bad, huh?

Very, very good.

Right on.

Wow.

Right on.

I actually save it to my son. He loves it. He loves gummy bears. Mmm. Really nice dish.

Thank you. We'll give you an extra bag for your son.

Thank you.

You're welcome.

Wow. I appreciate it.

And then one more thing to knock out. So I have a Patreon account. It's a subscription account. These folks have been with us since the very beginning and they're the reason that I get to sit down here with you today. And so one of the things we do is we give them the opportunity to ask every guest a question. So this is from Stephen Casey. What is the percentage you think of compromised of compromised US government actors by honeypots across all three branches of government.

Wow.

We know there's Eric Swalwell, right, Who was sleeping with the Chinese spy. He's still in there, by the way.

I mean, I don't know this information but. Well, percentage, that's actually really hard too. Estimate.

How common do you think it is? Do you have any insight on that?

I know that it's very common actually in the podcast To Die for, when Neil did the whole investigation and all that. We have one lady who was. Who lives in New York right now. So she's Ukrainian based, I mean Ukrainian born. And she was a model scout. So she said in the interview that she was bringing Russian and Ukrainian beauties working for the secret intelligence to America, especially to Washington and New York, to target particular politicians and ministers to get closer, to establish relationship, maybe to get married. So it's quite common than you even think. Maybe. I'm not saying that every single Russian or Ukrainian or wherever, like Slovakian looking woman is a potential threat and potential spy. No, but men should be aware of this.

I mean, I think of it like this. It's pretty fucking simple, right? If you are a man or a woman in a position of power, if you hold the keys to new technology, if you are a decision maker in government, if you are in intelligence and know shit about our government and what we're doing in Areas of the world that maybe we shouldn't be in. And all of a sudden young, attractive foreign women or men are all around you and you're not used to that happening. There's probably something fucking going on. You're not that good looking, you don't have that good a game. You're just a fucking government employee or elected official who knows shit that our adversaries want. So get with the fucking program.

Yes, but Sean, you do understand, you work in the military before you understand the psychology of human beings, right? Show me any man who doesn't want to believe that he's been loved because he's cute. Show me anyone, if I or any woman would come to the guy, even like not like best looking, and would tell him, I find you very cute. I like you. I like your beautiful eyes. You're so intelligent. You're so amazing. Wouldn't he resist? Wouldn't he say no to me or to another woman?

Well, I mean, look, I get it's hard, I totally understand that. But I mean, you know, you have to look at the position that you're in, right? And, and, and if some, if something out of the, out of the normal starts to happen and you have the keys to new technology or, or, you know what I mean? Then like, I don't know, I just, I would think that you would be able to put it together a little bit better than these guys are.

Okay, so let me please share one example from the history. So the scientist, the famous scientist, the genius, Albert Einstein was targeted by a female Soviet Union spy when after he was very close to Oppenheimer and had evening gatherings and dinners together. So this beautiful young female attracted Einstein where he was invited to New York for a sculpture exhibition or something. So she met him over there, yet she was married to a sculpture artist. And then she kind of like relocated herself to Albert and Stein and they established love relationships. Then Albert started to take her to Oppenheimer house where she established very good friendship with Oppenheimer's wife and where slowly through the wife and through France and, and Stein, the Soviet spy. Her name I think was Margarita, if I'm not mistaken. So she was taking all this information and report this information, this data to Soviet government where actually Soviets invented the nuclear bomb during two years instead of four just because they stole this data. And here is a genius, very smart man, Albert Einstein, who actually was trapped under this honey trap techniques. So I don't know if this guy was trapped.

Like, how about other guys, you know, So I don't, I Don't know what.

Kind of a timeline are we talking here?

So when open Manhattan Project. When it was Manhattan Project. So it was after, I think Lichtenstein was that time.

I mean, I mean how, how long was the relationship between, well, the spy.

I don't really know this information, but this information is actually in the history and in the, in Russian history also like in here you can Google it, you can actually check facts and everything, but they actually establish relationship. They live together like husband and wife. So Albert completely trusted this margarita. So that's why he was bringing her to all this. You know, family, sort of like friends, evenings and gatherings.

Interesting. So I mean, okay, that's a little bit different of a scenario than what I was, than what I was trying to describe is. I mean, that sounds like a well crafted.

Operation, like social engineering.

Yes. Some of the stuff that I'm talking about is just your regular everyday hook up at the bar. And it's like, why don't talk about the secrets after the first and second night?

I mean, you know, okay, so as a former honey trap agent, I can tell you that men are the most vulnerable during intercourse. And if you are quite experienced agent, you can ask certain questions during or after the intercourse, like straight after the ejaculation. Sorry for, but I don't know another word to explain. So when man is in bliss and when he's sort of like in unconscious, like condition and when he doesn't really understand everything clearly, and if an agent ask questions like, the answer should be yes or no. So it's simple question, have you met this guy? Oh, by the way? Have you met that guy? Oh, by the way. Do you know, is it like this or like this? How many? Like that much or like that much? So just a little like two, three simple questions. Most likely he would tell you because like just before ejaculation or just after this, is that, you know, prudent of that very vulnerable moment. So here you go. She got the information, she'll pass it to the commander.

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Foreign to stay up to date on all things srs. You bet your ass you do. Our newsletter brings you the latest SRS news and critical updates. Get instant alerts on the newest episodes. Never miss a beat. Exclusive intel briefs from counterterrorism expert Sarah Adams. You've seen her many times on the show. She's going to give unfiltered insights on global terrorist activity for Patreon exclusives. You're going to get epic range days with me and damn near every guest that's come in the studio. You're also going to get behind the scenes content and guest updates. You're going to get first dibs on new merch drops and limited edition items that will never be sold again. Plus exclusive offers from our partners you won't find anywhere else. So subscribe to the Vigilance Elite newsletter right now. I mean, it makes, I, it makes sense and I know it's happening. But you know, if, if it was me and somebody was asking if I knew another man that was prominent right after I ejaculated, I'd probably be wondering why we're thinking about other men. But I am, but we're going to.

Get into this but about like the work. So you kind of like, oh, you know, my love, you work so hard. You, you're so busy. Everything is on your shoulders. I want to help you. Let me do massage for you. How was your day today? La la la. Okay. So do you do this project by yourself or you work like I work with like David, let's say. Oh, like does he help you? Like, oh, what does he do exactly? You know, this sort of conversation, like a female nurturing conversation with the man and she wants to support him and just please him and all that. That's what I mean. You know, it's a female kind of like energy and female perspective.

What do you think? I mean, since we're on the. This top. I mean, we're talking about getting secrets and all this other stuff, but what about. What do you think about the Epstein stuff? I'm very curious about your thoughts on that. The blackmail operation, supposed blackmail operation. What do you think that was?

Okay, so my personal opinion on everything I see in the media and in the news, when I didn't see it myself and I didn't see the facts and evidences, I cannot give my opinion just based on someone's thoughts or someone's statements. I do not trust none of the media or wherever. Wherever I hear or I listen, I always do my own investigation. So I haven't been there. I haven't seen it. So that's why I would. I wouldn't say my own opinion about that. And I don't want to repeat someone's opinion on that, because it could be all this, you know, like, every single story has two sides. Like a coin on one side. It could be set up. It's always a setup. When a powerful, wealthy man trying to get more power or more money and somebody else doesn't want him to do, and they, like, compete, blah, blah, blah. And that's why the competitor would set him up. And we see this all the time. It's called. Actually, in the spy world, it calls compromat. Compromising materials. Compromising someone in order for him or for this target to lose the power. Perhaps this was a compromise.

I don't know. I wasn't there. If I would be one of these girls, I would tell you, yes, I was one of the victims, and that's what happened. I don't know. On another hand, because there's so many victims and because there's so many evidences, yeah, we kind of, like, we can say yes, but again, you know, everything what is presented in media, everything what we see in Internet, like I said, like, I'm grateful to be here because now you give me an opportunity to speak out from my own, like, Persona, from myself, rather than some journalists write about me, calling me, like, different names or editing or, you know, writing about me in their own way. So I think, like, every single person in this world should have his own opinion and should not be under this influence of anyone's thoughts. So make your own opinion, have your own research, do your own investigation, and make an opinion yourself.

It's a good way to be. It's a good way to be. All right, you ready to get into the life story?

Yeah, of course.

All right. Where'd you grow up?

Okay, so I was born in 1984 I was born in Soviet Union. It's sad at the same time to say that this country doesn't exist anymore. But at the same time I was born in, in the country which had the stability where my grandmother would say tomorrow would be the same day as today. And it would be amazing because you don't need to worry about like where would you have money, would you be fired or whatever. Everybody would have the same amount of things in the house, like same amount of money coming every month, same salary. Everybody would wear the same clothes, so everything would be the same. It's kind of boring, but at the same time. And it's maybe utopia, but at the same time it gives people this stable kind of like foundation where they know that everything is similar and tomorrow will be the same day. So it's, it's the beauty of it. And in 1991, so I kind of like probably would say I have this amazing experience to live on the border of two countries. When in 1991, USSR fall and perestroika began. It's sort of like it was sort of revolution, almost like a civil war.

Because that time in 91, you know, civilians went to the sort of like the government house, the White House and they started to bomb to the White House. It was, it was a mess, it was a chaos. Of course people lost the stability, they lost all the hopes, they lost all the beliefs. You know, like that ideology that you were raised with that this is your country, you fought for your country in the second war. They lost over 20 million soldiers in the second war. And they, they fought for the house, for the homeland and everything. And then at one point in one day it just collapsed. Where I spoke with some American friends and they said that, oh, Gorbachev is like the best. Americans love Gorbachev, whereas like Russians, they hate corporate. I mean like they don't maybe hate, but they definitely judge Gorbachev because was the one who actually signed this, this low end uses of all. So anyway, so I saw this by my eyes where like, you know, you have the stability and happy kind of like people living same day for the, you know, during like their life. And then another day, everything just collapsed.

And what happened? I remember that time I was a little girl and we would be. We would stand with my mom, my little sister, like she was a newborn. We would stand under the rain, under the wind and the, the snow for like five, six, sometimes seven hours in order to get some food from the store because there were no food. So you would come to the store. There's no food. You can't buy anything. So you're basically starving. So you would need to bring your members of the family to the store to show like, okay, I'm like, you know, adult and I have two kids. Please give me like three pieces of bread and like three sausages and three eggs. And like lines were like insane. And it was, it was like, actually it was happening for quite long time. I. I do believe, like, it was for like six months at least. I don't remember exactly like for how long, but it was really bad.

And you were like seven.

I was like, yes, seven, right.

84 to 91. Seven years old.

Yes, yes. So it was. I mean, that was my childhood. That's what I remember. And it was like, wow. So it created this sort of like lack of food and lack of stability and lack of like belief what would happen tomorrow. You know, when you're a kid and you are growing with like seeing all that, you understand that everything is so shady and it's like unpredictable and you cannot trust like anything really. Neither your government. Right. Then my father, that time, he couldn't help my mom because he was constantly at his work where he was not get paid. So he was that time an officer working in the military. He went to the military because of his father, because as you mentioned, like my grandfather was a hero of the country, you know, fighting Nazi. And I mean, it's a big pride of our family. It's a heritage. So I was raised with these beliefs, like, you know, you also need to go and protect your country. You also need to be, you know, you need to be proud of your roots. So my father was preparing me, preparing me slowly to this military Korea, which I didn't know at that time.

But every day he would teach me, he would come back home, we would have a dinner, and he would teach me at least one hour a day about all the psychological techniques which I didn't understand the time, like different scenarios in life. So he would like give me a test. So this is the situation in life. What would you do? Abc? So I would pick up an answer and then he would explain me why this would work and why this wouldn't work. So when I was kind of like ready enough, then he taught me the extreme driving, the gun shooting. And of course I had to do physical activities. Actually was I won like some competitions between like oblast which are states, you know, like here are states in Russia, they have oblasts. So it's like a few cities together. So it's like, similar. So I won some competitions in like gun shooting. I was the best gun shooter. And you asked me like, shall we do the gunshooting? I'm like, I kind of like miss it. But for me this is like ptsd, you know, so try to stay away from guns and all that.

So I stand for peace. And so he told me a lot when I was a teenager. So he was preparing me for my future career yet. So I finished my high school with like best grades. Like I was, you know, I was so nerdish. I was so like this, you know, like this bullied girl. First of all, I was only one Asian looking girl in the whole Russian school with like all these kids, blue eyes, blonde. So of course I was bullied, which is normal. Second, I was such a nerd. So nobody would do like homework as normal in high schools. Everybody would be like, you know, going to like dates and all this. I would be the one who would do my homework and reading books at night, you know, like Dostoevsky, like Pushkin. So students, my pupils, like, they hated me because I was a nerd. So I always would know, I always would do my homework and teachers would like, okay, so nobody knows. Okay, come on, you know, give us the answer. So of course they hated me. And then at some point I. I also felt myself like ugly duckling.

So I was not allowed to go out. I was not allowed to, you know, have friends. So I would come after school back home and, you know, be home and prepare my homework and help my mom with the, you know, house and all this. So my father was very, very strict, so I couldn't say no. Also like that they are coming, they are coming from Muslim background. I'm actually not, I baptized eventually. But anyway, it's another story. So we are coming from Muslim background where a woman doesn't have really the right to say no. So as a woman you cannot really speak out about your ideas or desires or opinion.

So you grew up Muslim?

Yes. Okay, so Kazakh and Tatarstan, they are Muslim, so they believe in Allah. And my grandmother would read Quran. They didn't really speak that language. Just because in Soviet Union you had to like sort of like speak Russian. Everybody, like in every school it would be like Russian. So I kind of like lost my own language and my parents didn't speak with me this language. And also in Soviet Union you were not really allowed to have your own religion. So people who were Christians, Orthodox, they were not really allowed to wear crosses. They were not allowed to go to churches. I mean, that Was crazy. Like, imagine one of the biggest amazing churches, the biggest one in Moscow, in the center's beautiful. Durik. So communists, they actually destroy it and they created a swimming pool instead of the church. Can you believe that?

No.

That's the way it was. So they completely tried to demolish and destroy the belief into God in Russian population. So they were trying to.

Why do they do that?

Dictatorship of the Soviet Unions, like Stalin dictatorship, Lenin and all that. Of course, because like, this is the only one religion you should believe. Stalin, this is your father, this is your Tsar, this is your God, everything. So again, propaganda.

Well, what was the population doing when they were.

The population? You mean like in Soviet Union? I don't know. I mean, I was a little girl when I was in. When I was raised in. In Soviet Union. But my grandmother, with whom I was very close. So she would say it was. I don't know, but she would say this was the best time just because they would know what would happen tomorrow. Everybody had the same. Yeah, okay, so that government people, they live like stars or whatever, like kings. But it's just like a small percentage where the 99% of population, they work. They. They would. Worked. They would. Sorry. They would work, they would raise the kids, they would have the same salary. They would have the, you know, stability in life. So everybody, everything was the same. So it's gotcha. I don't know. Stability, I guess.

Gotcha. When did. So you're a Christian now?

So I baptized when I was. So straight after the military, I decided to come to the gut because I lost belief in everything that moment. And, you know, you need to have your inner support. So I came to the God at quite like, you know, big age because I understood, I mean, like adult age. So. Because I understood that I want to have this belief in God and I want to like, you know, I don't even know how to say, but I just like felt like I needed. You know, like, I felt like this may help me and save me from like doing bad things because I tried to suicide. I tried to drug myself. I mean, I was doing like really bad things to my body, to myself. It's really embarrassing to speak about it, but I. I just. I just lost belief.

Okay, we'll get there. So at 18, am I correct?

At 18, yes.

Is when it all kind of started for you?

Well, yeah, I mean.

I mean, actually it started from you earlier because you didn't realize it, but your dad.

No, I didn't. Yeah, so I realized it after.

So what, what happened? I Mean, how did you get recruited into being a seductive intelligence operative?

Yeah, it's a whole different. So basically. Okay, so let me start from the beginning. So I turn 18, right? I told my dad I want to work in fashion. So I remember his answer. He said, like, what is fashion? You have one skirt, one shoes, one blouse. This is your fashion. This is enough. You're going to, you know, this department because I have my friend there who is, you know, who already spoke with him. He can, you know, enroll you at being an agent. That time it was in the department operative investigation. So I have actually all the certificate, archives, documents to show what year I started to work there. So he brought me to this department, I met my future commander, and I work there as an intern. And then when they approve you and everything, they send you to the academy to study. So because everybody, when they just enter, they have to know like at least how to shoot from the gun, right? So you need to go through the education. So they're like a. Special courses. When you come, you are supposed to study like, you know, like gun shooting, like civil law, like admin law.

Like that time for. So everybody would be divided. Like, different departments would have different subjects. For example, in my department, we would need to study, of course, like martial arts. So how to arrest a criminal, how to read the psychological profile of the criminal. You know, his tattoos, for example, like his ink on the body. What does it mean? What's his, you know, weakness? Like, what about him? Like his psychological portrait. So you need to kind of like get into there. Then of course, martial arts, like, you know, jiu jitsu and samba and all that. So for example, you would be in the situation where you have to arrest someone. So you need to protect yourself every day. We would like shoot from gone of the pistolet. Makarov. The gun. The Makarov gun. And we would also do how to call it. I'm so sorry, you may cut it, but I forgot the. So it's a subject where you learn how to open the lock.

Oh, okay. Breaching maybe.

Yeah. So I. I don't really know how to call it in English. Well, but yeah, this sort of like subject where you actually. Can you learn about technologies for agents.

Okay.

So when I came to the academy, we were about like over 300 students.

For like 300 students.

Yes.

How old are. Is everybody young? Is everybody.

Everybody's young? Yes, Everybody young from 18 and like, you know, 20, 25, I think, like before, like 30. Ish.

Men and women?

Men and women. Of course, the percentage. Percentage of women would be obviously much less. So let's say like 10% female, the rest male. And they would have a separate dorm. Like male would be like living in a separate dorm. But what happened so literally in the first day when we had the first like line when we lined up in front of our teachers, I noticed that the main teacher, like the. The commander of the like the main teacher of the school, the director, let's say he looked at me and he picked up like me and another few girls. And then we were invited to his office. And then we were announced that we are chosen for a special program. And so we are very privileged. They would never call it sex espionage. They would never call it honey trap. I understood it only after. But they said that's a special program which will help you to target those criminals or people whom will be your task. So you need to study the subjects, you need to learn psychology. And then after you will be given tasks, this will give you more benefits because you would have better salary, you would have better like promotion.

You may have like additional vacations. And which is was like, wow, that time you would given, you know that Russians before also they had. And especially in Soviet Union they had like really big problem to travel abroad because of the Iron Curtain. So you couldn't literally get any visa. So now it's actually happening the same story. So that time also like it was really hard to travel abroad. So you couldn't just go to the embassy and get a visa and travel to America? Like no, I mean maybe if you would have a special diplomatic passport or connection. So whatever. So when you actually go as this agent, they you may be able to fly abroad for special missions. And it's sort of like cool because it sounds like in the movie James Bond. Wow, I will go abroad, I'll have like this special missions and I'll sit the world blah blah, blah. You know, for like 18 years old. It sounds like fascinating sort of. So when they announce me that I am chosen for this program, I was like, okay, cool. You know, I'm happy to study that. And we were like five girls in this special program.

So we would go to our main classes. So 6am would be the first lineup up. Like you know, the, the morning. Then jogging, physical activities, blah blah, blah. Breakfast, 8am you have to be in the class. So from 8 to 4, 5pm Depends from like, you know, if you would have like physical activities more or whatever, whatever you would be done. Then us five girls, you know, we would go to this special classes for another two Hours and then we would catch up with our homework for the next day and then that's it, we would go. So then again also like either it would be a physical activity, whatever, like jogging or something, then dinner and then you go and sleep to the dorm. So that was our kind of like schedule for the day. So every day for a few hours we would study these subjects such as psychological techniques. So for example, manipulation techniques, seduction techniques, influence persuasion techniques, how to read and scan people, how to spot the lie, you know, how to set up a strategy for your target, like this social engineering thing, like how to do it, how to work in the team, how to estimate your target's weaknesses and desires and needs.

How to recruit someone, how to make friends, how to attract people, how to make someone to be your informer again through manipulation. How to threaten people, your targets particular so they would want or they have to give you information you need. And of course additional martial arts, of course additional sex techniques. So we would study some of the sex techniques in terms of like the pleasure for men, I would say like not particularly your pleasure, but you know, how to please the man. But also which I find really fascinating. And that's what I give to my students a lot. And I think this is a foundation and I think this really changed me to who I am right now. So when I entered I was like really ugly duckling. I was shy and completely unconfident. So we actually, I didn't understand that before, but now I really get it. So we've started the self confidence techniques to raise your self love. So you become so freaking confident to go to any mission that you don't even have any doubt that you may fail. So even now, wherever I go, like public speaking in the Vatican City, like public speaking in United Nations, I was, you know, I told you the story, we were driving here and I had this thought and then I'm like, oh come on, you know, like I always, you know, I, I know that I, I, I can do it.

It's just, it's amazing how they taught us how to program your brain for a success. Even though it's so hard and you want to give up and it help. When I went to the war and I went to the really bad dangerous missions and I was thinking, that's it, this is right now, this is the end. But just because of these techniques, I always had this thought like, no, I know that I can go through that. I know I can do it, I know I'll do it. Like this is the belief which I didn't have before. And it was like placed and planted into my brain. And I believe that this is the foundation of everything.

How long is this school?

Okay, so six months. This is the first initial, most important foundational classes. Then you go back to your department, wherever you were, like, you know, you're supposed to work, then you work like you kind of like do the practice then going to, when you go to. When you're getting another rank, for example, high rank, you're supposed to come back and you would be given more subjects, more techniques. Like you kind of like have to be qualified for bigger job. For bigger. For high rank, you go back again six months. Sometimes you can do it a year. Other universities, like for example in Moscow 1 and in St. Petersburg actually. Yeah, where Vladimir Putin started. So there are particular academies where you actually go and you study there as a college for like three, four years. But because I was already enrolled to the International Law University, so I was doing sort of like two universities, like two educational at the same time, so studying international law at my university and also was doing this and also after I was working. So yeah.

Wow. So quite a lot of work.

I mean, a lot of education as well.

What point did you realize that sex may be involved?

Sex?

Yeah.

When I was first firstly raped, I was virgin. I came to the part where I was raped.

So this didn't. The going through the course and talking about seduction and pleasuring a man and all this kind of stuff, you didn't realize that. It didn't. It didn't occur to you that sex would be involved in. In the job description?

Okay, so about sex. So as I mentioned, my dad was really strict, so I was not allowed to go out. When I was living with my family till 18 years old, I didn't even kiss any boy. I didn't even speak with anyone. I was so shy. Like I thought, like, I'm so ugly and all that. So I was. I don't know, it was like ugly duckling. So 18 years old. My dad bring. Brought me to this department literally in a few weeks, like two weeks. My commander colleague calls. That time we didn't have cell phones, so he calls to my home phone. My dad obviously picks up as he always did. And it was about like 8pm so it was evening. And my colleague said, oh, we have alarm. Somebody's killed. Something happened in the city. So she has to come ASAP to our department because we need her to work. And that time I already was enrolled as an intern.

Okay.

So I had to come. So my dad said, like, get ready, go. So I come to my department and I see my colleague being already drunk, you know, something shady going on. He closed the door, he takes the case and he literally starts to beat me and rape me.

And so this is, this is two.

Weeks after I was enrolled. Yes, to this department. Yet he knew and he saw my father, who was that time high ranking officer bringing me to the commander, where commander like approves me as a future agent. He saw that, right? So he didn't care about this. He said, if you will tell your dad, you know, like, your whole family will be fucked. The whole reputation will be fucked. Like you'd rather not to tell that. Like, because, like they will blame you because this is your fault. You see, like the manipulation. You seduce me. This is your fault. I didn't do shit. Like. Like, this is your fault. Number two, I was virgin. I told him like, I have never done it before, like I can, like, it doesn't matter. Three, you are going to the military academy anyway. You supposed to disattach your body from your emotions. This is part of the training. That's what they do. Your body belongs to the state, your body belongs to the government. You with your like, you know, feelings and emotions, like just. It doesn't exist. The soul doesn't exist. Wow, okay, so all these things and then they literally make you to become sort of like robotic.

Where even now, unfortunately. But like I cannot do anything about it still now. Like my body lives completely separate from my emotions. So for example, if I have an intercourse, it doesn't mean that I have any feelings towards this man. So I still can have an orgasm and all that, but. And it's all good, but like I don't have any attachment and I cannot, you know, create it because I was trained to remove these feelings and emotions from my body. So my body was just a tool in the mission. Wow, it does make sense.

And you never told your dad?

I never told my dad because, I mean, what would I tell him? He brought me there and then what he would blame all his life that he did it to him? I mean, like, he did it to me. I don't want him to blame himself, you know, I never told him. I think he kind of like understands that there's something there. And you worked in Navy and you know the statistics that about 20% and this is what we know, 20% annually, 20% of female and also male are targeted for sexual abuse. And they 20% are raped in the military. And this is the statistic, like you know, just open ChatGPT or Internet and like it. It's clearly there and it's only in the U.S. imagine how what's the percentage in Russian, like, you know, this country, countries like Russia or you know, Belarusia or like Ukraine or wherever. Like countries which don't really, where the law doesn't really work that much like in America, like probably it's like, you know, 50%. And when I came to the academy, when I saw that every single female are being sexually abused and basically raped. All of them, all of them.

Like, they basically use them as, as a meat. Like, so all teachers, they were male. Of course, only two were females who actually taught us all the psychological and sex and seduction techniques. So the rest were males. And the thing is, in the podcast To Die for, actually there is a CAA former CA agent, he gave an interview, he actually said that, you know, they, they just sex trafficked their own agents for their own needs. Not just for the government needs, but also for their own needs. Like for example, this teacher's mail, right? They knew that they have the power over us, so they could easily just use you for they only for wherever. And obviously, like, you know, I was stuck there. I didn't know what to do. I was 18 years old. I was just raped. Then I come to this academy targeted by this Cornell, the main teacher. And I mean, we had like the whole story and all that. So he literally like had me every, any, every other day. And I couldn't do anything about, you know, like, because like he was also manipulating me. He's like, oh, if you won't do what I say, then you would be kicked out.

You would like have a very big problems. You have problem with your dad. You know, you cannot, like, you would never be able to work anywhere in Russia because I will write the bad report that you like, you know, did whatever, like illegal things or something or something. So I mean, that was cruel. And as a woman, as a female in the military, you couldn't say no.

So you're, you're being raped throughout the entire duration of the school. And so are all the other women.

Yes.

Are you guys talking about this with each other?

We talked about that when we were there and really sadly to say, but some of them, they had to participate in orgies. Like, I definitely didn't want to do it. I was like, first of all, first of all, these male teachers, they were over 50 years old. I'm not like saying that like 50 is like whatever, but okay, when 50 years old, man doesn't Take care about himself. Doesn't do gym and like, workout and doesn't really. And he looks gross and he like, so abusive and telling you, aggressively telling you, like, you have to do this. You know, when I came to the, to the office first time to my. This main teacher, the Cornell, the first thing he said, do the blowjob. I'm like, I'm thinking, I've never done it before. I have no idea how to do it. And this was when he told me this was part of the program. So you have to. This is practice. Like, you have to learn now you know how to do it. Like, so I'll teach you. Was it like part of re. Was it like really part of the program or was it his own, you know, just needs for his own pleasure?

Who knows? I think it was like second rather than first, because I want, I don't want to believe that, but maybe both. I don't know.

Wow.

But I, I do. I mean, like, you probably have seen or heard similar stories in military in the United States. I watched that documentary, the Invisible War, and there's so many cases like that. So it's happening everywhere. It's not just in the military, but it's in any corporation in any industry where they're like more male rather than females. It's really hard to, you know, work. And if you're also like more or less like younger than them and pretty and all that. So sometimes your appearance and your beauty is a curse rather than, Rather than a blessing. Yes. Because, like, look, they particularly chose those, the most pretty, the most youngest girls. And they were like, special parameters for this special program, like sex plan, as we call it right now. But the first thing, everybody has to be about like 5, 6ft tall. Second, they would run us through the intellectual, like, sort of like IQ test. Then psychologist. So we spoke with the psychologist. So we had to be mentally strong and prepared. What if something happens? Like, are we strong enough to be in unpredictable, difficult, like, extreme situations? We were checked by gynecologist in order, like, to see, like, are we like, you know, healthy?

And then if you tick all the boxes, then you go to this program.

What did they tell you their program was?

They didn't say anything. Like, they didn't say, oh, it's a honey shop or whatever. They said, like, it's a special program. You will be learning special techniques which you're not allowed to share with anyone. Everything in this, you know, walls staying here. That's it. So just a few of you, A few of you, because you're chosen. They don't call you spas, you know, swallows or sparrows or, you know, like spies. They don't call that, but they say, like, this is a special, you know, subject for you to learn, so it will be helpful for your future missions. That's it.

Wow, interesting.

I do believe that, to be honest, I do believe that every single military academy or any educational center potential. Not like. But I do believe that they have that sort of programs, you know, like, they just. They scout these future agents for this sort of mission. So they scout them through students, through students in the good universities or maybe somebody who already established, like, you know, there's so many examples of the sex Spanish from like, you know, actresses and famous singers and famous beautiful women.

Do you have some examples?

I do have some examples which I definitely know I cannot reveal their names because they're very public and you definitely know them. But they, they work with the Russian government and at the same time they are very recognizable women in the public eye.

How do you know this?

Because I, I've seen them there. I know, I know, but like, I would never, you know, I would never let down. They, they cover. I would never do that because, like, you know, it's. Some people ask me like, oh, why don't you say no? But like, guys, I just want to explain how does it work? It's not like you willingly want to do it. Sometimes you are put into these situations where you know this, let's say people, government people would tell you, if you will not do this task, if you will not do this mission, then either your family will have some problems or your kids or your beloved ones, they may be having a car accident or they may go to jail. So you feel like I'd rather sacrifice myself than put on risk my family. So these people which I just mentioned, without names, I know they're doing this not willingly. They have to do it because of their family living in Russia.

Where's your citizenship?

Great. So that's also like. I have to be also very careful with what I'm saying. And it's a big risk for me also to. Well, it's a few things I will explain now. So my citizenship still Russian. Thank God. And thank to America and God bless America. I received my green card for about 15 years. I lived in Europe. After last Russian mission, I lived in Europe. I lived in Switzerland, Greece, Italy, France, England. In London six years. So check this.

All those places.

Yes. So check this out. The moment the government, the UK government probably find out about my background, the Moment when I was invited to the Buckingham palace, where I met King Charles and Queen Elizabeth. That time he was Prince. Literally, in a few months, my lawyer received a letter stating that I have to leave the uk like, during two weeks period of time. So I was literally deported from the uk, still having my residency there. So I couldn't go back to Russia because of so many reasons. The only one visa I had that time was United States. So I come to United States, I speak with many, many good lawyers, with a lot of lawyers, and they all advise me the same thing. They tell me that I should, because of United States, I should reveal my identity publicly. Because also that time Ukrainian war starts straight after, like, Covid, right? So it was Covid then this, you know, crazy time. Everything is closed and blocked and, you know, it's a mess. Then Ukraine war. So I'm in this situation and my lawyer said, well, you have to reveal your identity. Just, you know, not to be deported.

Like it was in 2010, I believe, when 10 active agents from Russia were deported, including Anna Chapman. So if you don't want to be deported, if you want to be like, you know, legal in America, it's better for you, for your insurance, for your protection, to reveal your identity publicly. This is number one. Number two, I also had to cut tails coming from Russia because, I mean, I know it sounds like crazy maybe, but I actually one Russian girl was sent to me from Moscow when Ukrainian war started and everything to convince me to go back to Russia and. Or if I don't want to go, trying to convince me to work with them again. Then I have received a former colleague call just before the Ukrainian war started, asking the same thing. Not asking, but kind of like, you should consider working with the Russian government. And then it was another call from more like government sort of person with the same request. So I honestly will tell you this. I want to leave without fear because I'm exhausted to leave for so many years, hiding myself, hiding my son, moving from one country to another.

I am exhausted, like, physically, mentally, morally, everything. I'm so done. I don't want to play all these games anymore. I want to do fashion things like I always wanted and I always dream. And finally I'm doing this for myself, for my son as well. So I don't want to be attached, I don't want to be connected. I don't want to do anything with this, you know, garment stuff anymore. And I decided to go public to kind of like reveal my identity. Yet Alia Rosa is not my real ID name Obviously because of, again, the security reasons. But at least these calls and these requests from Russian government, from Russian government people have stopped since I started to go public. At least I have received my freedom to live in United States sort of like freely without, like, you know, being like, there and here. I. I'm so done with that. And I don't want to do this and I don't want to be used anymore. I don't want to be manipulated anymore. Even though, like, I do have fears for my members of the family who, who are there. And of course I have fears for my son's future.

Yes, I understand it's a big risk, but they say, like, you choose less evil when it's like, too evil. So I'd rather, you know, reveal my identity and tell the truth here in America to American people rather than work for the Russian government and being again, like this. And God knows what would happen with me after. And my son, like, especially like during the Ukrainian war and it's still on and it's super crazy and it's just such a mess.

Where is your son?

My son is always with me, like, everywhere. He's. He's a. He's a traveler like me. He's always. He's in. He's at home.

Okay.

I mean, he goes to the school, but he's at home.

How did they contact you to try to get you to come back?

All the apps, like WhatsApp, they didn't have my American telephone. But I have a very old WhatsApp up because I didn't change it, I kept it. I kept the number. So what's up? Emails. I changed.

Who do they say?

Oh, well, the main request is live here, but report us everything you see and everything you know, go to Washington, live in Washington on at least New York and try to establish this relationship with politicians, ministers and so on. That's why I honestly stay away from Washington as. As further as I can. That's why I kind of like chose to be in la, because Los Angeles is entertainment Hollywood, you know, it's all like movies, scripted, scripted fashion especially. It's all blah, blah, blah, social media influencing and all that. So I'm trying to stay away as far as I can from politics.

Yeah, good thinking.

I mean, what can I do? I try to do my best in this. Like, I balance.

Let's take a quick break and then we'll get into some air missions.

Okay.

Sound good?

Yeah.

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All right, Aaliyah, we're back from the break, and so we're getting ready to get into the. What happens once you get in the unit? So we kind of went through your training, your schooling and all that kind of stuff. And. And so what is it. What is it like when you actually check into the unit as a trained operative? Well, what is the unit called?

So the unit. The first. So I was in two units.

Okay.

In Russia. So one unit precisely would be called operative investigation department. I don't know what's the similarity in the U.S. the second one, it's sort of like DEA. Okay, so it's a drug enforcement department.

Okay.

Okay. Yeah. So it's the first one. I don't know. What's the.

Probably like the FBI sounds like an investigative unit.

It is investigation, but it was locally in the city or sometimes in the country, but also internationally. For example, when we were working on the cases on, you know, the two countries between Afghanistan and Russia. So, for example, this was the international. Or by that time, when I was already working, it was Russia separated from all these post Soviet countries.

Gotcha.

So again, it was international, but there were so many left, like connections with that countries, and so much crime was going on between these countries. And then again, don't forget, it was prehistorical revolution. Then after, it was the time when all this criminal world just blossomed at some point because there were no very strong political.

Repercussions.

Right. So there were so many criminals, let's say that time, who were privatizing the Russian assets for a very small amount of money, like, let's say 50 bucks for a factory or 50 bucks for a huge piece of Land. And eventually, after some time, when Vladimir Putin became the president, those criminals would legalize the businesses and would become oligarchs. Right. So some oligarchs would be quite friendly working with Vladimir Putin. I will not get into these details because you can read the book which was written by so many former agents, including Litvinenko, and some of them would disappear forever, killed or just flee the country and hide themselves. So.

Wow. So how, how so sorry, I'm just trying to wrap my head around this. So if you went through the training.

Yeah.

At the schoolhouse. Now, was the training at the schoolhouse specifically for the, the Operative Investigations Unit, or was it for the DEA one? Or is this, is this kind of a. They mold you and then whatever agency needs you, picks you up?

Yes, that's correct. Yes. So it was basically they teach you all the stick. Okay. So you, you have ordinary basic instructions and subjects you study like gun shooting, martial arts and you know, laws. With these knowledges, you enter your department and then you just have your mission and practice it. However, us, we received additional education for additional missions which were classified, so they were not really open for any agents. Like some agents would be picked up for particular mission.

Gotcha. Yes, gotcha. So this is just a, this is a pipeline into the, into the federal government. So, so let me. So here in the US for example, you go, if you're going to go to the nsa, you're going to go be trained by the nsa. If you're going to go CIA, you're going to be trained and go to the CIA schools. If you're going to go to the FBI, you're going to be trained by the FBI and go to the FBI schools. So in Russia it's an intelligence school and then whatever agency needs you will pick you up.

It is same as in United States. Right. However, this particular programs which, you know, I don't know how many in Russia are they, but like that's what I studied that would particular for your department or perhaps another department would do a particular mission and then they would require some female agents for these missions. So for example, us as let's say da agents, we would work together with some other agents from another department because they would provide us some security, let's say, you know, in transportation or like they would be like SWAT agents. But. But it doesn't call swot. But I'm saying like those with whom we would work in actually in going to arrest those targets. So it's kind of like mixed sort of, but we would still. So if like my Commander would allocate me for another mission, I would need to go there to another department. That's actually how I move from one department to another department because they actually required me to come there.

Okay, so you're actually. You are attached. Okay. You're. You. You're on a special unit that's just farmed out to whoever is dating you at the time.

So, you know, like Putin that time in 2002. Exact. Exactly. The year was working there, established FSKN. So FSKN it was. You can also Google it and check it online. So fskn, it was a special department, sort of da, but fighting against drug trafficking, coming particularly from Afghanistan, because that time it was like a huge transportation. But then a few years later, Putin dissolved it. I don't know why, but just like basically restructured. And then this of a scan was under the fsb, which is the.

You mean in Russia, when a government agency does its job and doesn't need to do anything else, they just dissolve it and it goes away and then the funding gets reallocated to.

It was existing for 10 years, approximately. I don't know why. Dissolve it. You see, I don't know this kind of things. But there was so many restructures since 1991. It was KGB, right. And the day KGB, etc. Then it was renamed to VR, which is external investigation. Right. And then FSB, which is local. So then under FSB there would be different other departments which were particularly doing some other missions or like some other jobs or like some other cases. But if there is a big case omission going on, they would allocate particular agents for this mission. Doesn't matter from what department you are. Especially with females. There are not so many females agents working in the, you know, in the departments, maybe like 10%. But as a bait, you need a female. They would invite you and. Yeah.

So I'm getting a little ahead of myself here. But so you. If the. So your job is not to necessarily sleep with criminals and arrest them. You're. It is a tool that they have taught you how to use.

I think I was a bait, basically. So let me just kind of like picture my. One of my missions, for example. So I come in the morning to the lineup meeting for the first meeting with our commander in the department.

This is your first mission?

No, not first mission. Let's say one of the missions. So we come to the department in the morning for the lineup meeting. They give you mission and they allocate particular agents for this mission. So you. You you, you have this mission, then you go with the head of the. Of this little team of your team. You go and you brainstorm the strategy, how you're supposed to infiltrate certain group of criminals or whoever, like, how to spy on them, how to get informers, how to send someone there, or how to recruit them. Mostly of them, of course, were men. Obviously, using me as a bait to get closer would be the perfect ideal scenario. We would go together, let's say with one or two, my team member, spy on the mission. So we would literally sit down in the car, or we would be somewhere outside, not too close, so he wouldn't notice us, but we would, like in the beginning, just see what's his inner circle. Right. Do pictures, basically, like the whole thing, like the whole spying. Then we would gather information about our target and then we would install.

What kind of information?

Everything. Like, how many sugar does he put into his coffee? Like, like everything from A to B. Like, what time does he wake up, where does he go, what does he. Whom does he meet, what do they do, what they talk about? Of course, you put all the bugs and everything as much as you can. You try to listen what they're talking about. Like, basically everything.

Like, how long would you do this for?

Depends from the target. So the. The last target, for example, we were establishing the social engineering for about three months before I actually was introduced to him.

Before you made an approach before?

Yes, the first approach, it was like three months of, like, intense work. Yes, but we had to create the whole setup for him. So, for example, I mean, it sounds like a movie plot, but it's kind of cool what secret intelligence can do, actually, or like anyone can do. Do you remember the movie? Have you seen the movie the Game with Michael Douglas? No, it's an old movie. Another movie also, which is closest, so it's easy to explain. Focus with Margot Robbie and Will Smith.

What's it called?

Focus.

I don't think I've seen that.

Okay, so I mean, if you're guys like your audience know this movie, they will, like, understand or they can go and watch this movie. So basically, how does it work? So my target, let's say, let's go to Vladimir. Vladimir target. So what we needed to, you know, find out about him, first of all, what are his weaknesses, what his needs, what his desires, apart from, like being the leader of the criminal group, having power, money and blah, blah, blah. What is his personality? About what, what is he seeking for? What, like, what is his goal? You know, like, what's his psychological Portrait. So we would go back to his childhood when he was a teenager. We find out that he was in love. He had a relationship with his sweetheart, a girl from Uzbekistan, which is.

How are you finding this information out?

Easy.

Social media.

No, no, no. That time social media didn't really exist. It was 2004. So we hardly had smart. No, we didn't have smartphones. I remember had Motorola, you know, like that little telephone. So how you basically. It's actually really easy. You just basically find out what school did he study? And then you just pretend that you. One of the relatives, like, trying to find him or whatever. You just like, get information from this old Ish ladies working there, let's say former teachers, and just like, get information. It's. It's quite easy if you go and ask people about someone. I still do that when I need to find out information about someone. I just go and speak with people. What do you think about this person? Do you know him? How do you know him? Like, did you.

Would it have bothered you if any of those people reached out to the target and said, hey, squirrel. Aaliyah, she's running around her.

Well, first of all, you don't say your name. Second, it wouldn't be me if I would, like, if I was the main bait, if I was the main, you know, face in this mission, it was. It wouldn't be me. It actually was my colleague who like, was. Young guy. Oh, I lost my army friend. I don't live here. I just want to find out where is he? What does. Where does he live? Like, what's happening with him? We, like, we lost each other for so many years. Like, I, you know, I want to see him. We, like, we've been through, like, you know, the whole, like, army time, blah, blah, blah, you know, and you bring like some chocolates or some cake to this old teacher from the school. Of course she would tell you everything. Let's drink tea. Let's speak about, like that time, blah, blah, blah. So you find out that this target, Vladimir, had relationship with his sweetheart, that girl from Uzbekistan, apparently. But she didn't wait for him because, as you know, in Russia it's compulsory. Every male have to go to the army for two years from 18 years old.

So he went to the army, but she didn't wait for him. She got married. So when he came back, she already married to another guy. So he was sort of like heartbroken. So he sort of gave up on this dream to have a loving wife and potentially a family with her, you know, and he kind of like became like this rough sort of like aggressive guy who would just use women for sex and just be very. Not like, you know, like sort of like alpha male, but just having this women for a pleasure, nothing serious, no attachment, no, no emotional attachment because he was like, you know, hurt before. But somewhere deep inside every human beings wants to believe that there is a possibility in mutual love, that every human being wants to be loved not because of something, but just like literally to be loved by who he is. So what we did, when we gathered all the information very slowly, very, very subtly, wherever this target was walking out from the gym, going into the restaurant, or like walking in the street or whatever, we would place a few separate couples. One couple, young, nice looking guy, sort of looking like Vladimir, tall, you know, it's all Russians, more or less like, you know, tall, blue eyes, good looking like, you know, wearing military uniform, same as let's say Vladimir would wore many years ago when he was in the army together, holding hand with the girl, more or less looking like his sweetheart from the past.

So they would be just like, you know, walking around kissing each other. Da, da, da. Even though Vladimir wouldn't look precisely at this couple, but peripheral vision, his backside vision would register that. So your brain register everything what's going on around you, even though you don't notice, but your brain does. So this is very subtle installation and manipulation. And basically when you plant something into someone's head, then another day, another story, another place, again, another couple. The guy, another guy would wore the military uniform with another girl, but same sort of looking like his sweetheart. She would be pregnant, so they would hold hands, kissing each other, blah, blah, blah, like you know, like love is in the air. Then again, another day, another setup, another place, there would be similar guy, but another one wearing the uniform with another girl, but looking like his first sweetheart. They would carry, they would have like a courage with the little baby, with the newborn baby and again, same story, like love is in the air. They kiss each other holding hands and like, you know, happy family. Again, Vladimir wouldn't look at them like, oh, like whatever, but he still, his brain would register that.

And when the time was right, when my colleague, that time, who was already undercover, so he pretended to be one of the drug dealers, so he would basically get the drugs from the Vladimir's criminal gang, distribute it, sort of distribute it, bring the money, right? And then he would get to know Vladimir, he would establish trust with him and he would slowly introduce him to sort of like this easygoing girls in the Club, not prostitutes particular, but kind of like, oh, you know, she's a student, she's lonely, she's like, you know, this and this and like, you know, you're such a powerful guy, maybe like you can hang out with her, like this sort of thing, you know, like love girls. So he would introduce him to some girls, but less good looking, you know, because we would know more or less his style, like Vladimir's taste. And by that time I already had a sort of like image of his sweetheart style. Yes. Like what, what did she wear before? So she was wearing particularly like, like white socks and short skirts and like braids and all that. So when I would meet him, I would do exactly the same look, appearance.

So when my colleague introduced me to Vladimir, it was already like in his brain would be like, what if she looks exactly like that, you know, girl? What if there is a possibility I may be loved by her really and she would stay loyal to me? What if I may have a chance with her and have a family with her? What if instead of just like, hi, my name is so and so let's go to the room. You know, everything has to be very subtle, like a little game and you don't even understand that you are in the game, but you still. Yeah, it's a beautiful setup. It takes time, but anyone can be, can be influenced.

Can we talk about your first mission?

Yes.

Do you remember it?

Yes.

What was it?

So it was one of the kind of like foreign but not so it's basically post Soviet country government person who had some information and so the first mission were actually. So I was sharing this in the podcast. So I, I had to place an envelope without him knowing who exactly placed it. He may would have some ideas or doubts or whatever, but he that time should know that it was particularly me placing the envelope. So I literally had to pretend that I was a prostitute in the bar in the hotel where he was staying that time and I had to seduce him, get into the room.

And how did you seduce him?

How should I recreate the whole scene? Oh God.

What was in the envelope?

I could not open and. Okay, so it was filled, right? It was. How do you call it in English? Like fill?

Yeah, filled. Sealed.

Sealed, yes, something like that. So the envelope was sealed. I couldn't open it. And yet if I would open it and know it, I wouldn't be able to share it, you know, just for my, my own like security for my life. So. So I had to give him the envelope. The only one way how I could place it was in the private place. So obviously it has to be in his, his room where nobody would distract him or wherever. So I couldn't be, I wouldn't be able to do it, let's say in the bar or wherever, you know, because like again, many people, you know, many eyes and all this. So how did I seduce him?

Very simple because he had, he had never seen you before and so you're showing up undercover with the COVID of a prost. Is a prostitute.

Okay.

How many women are in the bar?

Not so many. You do we all do understand when man comes to the bar with friends or alone to have a drink, most likely he's open for a conversation with the beautiful female. Right. Otherwise if you don't want to, you wouldn't come. Right. If you're tired or whatever, you go sleep to your room. So you obviously want some adventures. 2 When the mission is like that, when you don't need to establish trust, when you don't need to establish love. Long term relationship, one night stand. It's very easy to organize from woman perspective. Show me any man who would say no to one night stand. Any nobody would say no. I mean unless it's a very ugly person. But we're talking about, you know, spies agent so they supposed to take care about themselves and look presentable. So number three, he was there for a few days. I already knew. I was given information that he was recently married and recently had a newborn. Obviously a man who just have a little baby at home. It's a big work. You know how it is. Those who have kids understand. So the wife is busy with the kid, you know, the little kid is crying.

You know, it's not the same like it was before. So for him it was easier to just like have some sort of like adventurous and relaxed time for himself because he's on the business meeting. But at the same time, why not to have like some romantic emotions just for one night. Who would know? No one. Right. So that's why it's an easy target.

What about the other women at the bar that time? How do you know that you're going to be the one that walks out of that bar?

So yeah. So first of all there weren't so many, I think like, well, as much as I remember there were like couple of women. Second, I was the most beautiful. I was the first of all. I was that time I was already skilled. Second obviously that time I was the youngest one. And third, I was wearing the most revealing clothes I could possibly wear. So.

So how did you Approach him very.

Easy about the drink. It's like one of the common thing. You actually can approach any man if you want to meet someone. You start with the, from the drink. What are you drinking? Like what would you recommend to drink here? Like how often do you come here? Like, do you like this bar? There's so many questions you can ask. So many. And you can from one. Oh, you're not here. Like, oh, it's your first time here? Oh, like aren't you from here? Like where are you traveling from? Like where do you live? And then you go on and like you start the whole conversation and then it's easy. Hahahihe. Like, yeah, why don't we go like. And then after a couple drinks it's easy to say yes, dress to a pretty girl. And like, and then you always can find an excuse. Oh, I really want to go to the toilet. But like, you know, like I need to do it in private. Can I go to your room? Oh, I need to change something. Or like, oh, you can spill something on yourself and say like, oh my God, my dress is dirty. Can I please, can you, can I please like go and wash my dress in your room?

Or there's so many things you can get into the room of the man if you really need.

So you, you get them in the room.

Yes.

When do you find the time?

Okay, so when he was in the toilet, when he was in the shower, that's it. So the suitcase that time, I mean now probably it would be much harder, but that time suitcases were not with the, you know, like special lockers or whatever. So it's quite, it was quite easy to open it, place it. It was just like a little clickers, click, open, put the envelope, you know, through all these papers and then close it and that's it. Voila. You didn't do anything.

Did you have, did you sleep with him?

With him? Actually I didn't.

You didn't?

No, I didn't because I, it was my first mission. I was scared and I, I didn't want to. I just, I don't know, like, it's just like I wasn't ready. Okay. I wasn't ready and I just, and he was sort of like gross to me. I didn't want to. He was overweight so I sort of like manipulated him on his family. So he physically couldn't get hard. Sorry to say. He maybe wanted to, but he couldn't because I constantly was talking about his wife and his kid particular because his kid was a newborn girl, baby Baby girl. And of course he loves her. Of course, like it's his first experience. And when you mix together kids, feeling together with the sexual desire and all that, the sexual desire would be kind of like, you know, won't work that much if you wouldn't talk about kids, you know, it's sort of like bringing kid into the sexual conversation. So we had a really nice conversation though. He was really nice guy, you know, he even gave me some money, some cash. I made a profit.

It's generally how it works with prostitution, so I'm told.

But at least I didn't, you know, at least I didn't compromise my cover. So maybe when he find out this envelope, he wouldn't even think about me. I don't know. So we had a really nice conversation though. And as much as I remember, he was really nice and kind guy and we were constantly talking about his family. And then in the end he said actually we didn't have a lot of time, which was good. We only had like about maybe like, like 40 minutes or an hour because he had to like wake up for like meeting or whatever early. And he told me like, I don't have a lot of time. So I was like pushing into conversation. And then he said, thank you so much for this conversation. It was so important, you know, like I. I wanted to speak out with someone, but I. I can't, right, Because I. I couldn't tell these things to my wife or like, you know, to anyone. So it was so nice to speak with you because I was a random person and he would share with me all his thoughts. See also vulnerability.

What were you targeting him for?

For giving this envelope that said that was only my task.

Dude, you don't know what he. Why was he a criminal?

No, no, he wasn't a criminal. It was. So I was in the academy at that time. It was my first task from my teacher. I don't know. So I don't know exactly why she sent me there. I would. I would think she sent me there to make me fail. Because that time she had relationship with the colonel and it was a love triangle, sort of. It was never love for me, but the coronal when he sexually raped me. And the first one who said, like when I entered his office, he said to me, do a blowjob. He was the one who actually over time fell in love and protected me from me having sex with the rest of teachers and actually with the rest of the whoever, like colleagues or whatever. So he was my shield that time where I used him to protect me. But then things went wrong when he approached me with the engagement ring.

This is while you're in school or after school?

This is already after.

This is after school. So the relationship with him continued.

So the relationship went on. Yes. And. So basically I share all the story in To Die for. But like, I'm just trying to make it short for your audience to understand.

So we don't need to make it short.

Oh, really? I mean, okay, okay, so. But I'll try to make it short. I mean, it's 17 episodes. Like I was talking for 20 hours. I don't think we have 20 hours here. Okay, so. So when he took advantage from me first, I decided that I'd rather use him as my shield because I didn't want to be used by other men in the academy because I've seen and I've heard so many stories of my classmates. So I said like, no way I'm doing that. So I was like, okay, because he has the highest rank, because he has the highest respect, and he is the boss, sort of. I decided that I will play along and I will learn all the seduction techniques and use the seduction techniques on him in order for him to sort of like fall in love, be more interested, but also protect me. Because I knew that he.

He wants you. You wanted him to want you all to himself so that you didn't have to correct.

So he wouldn't want to share me, my body with anyone else. So I decided to play, you know, these cards. And it did work because he also had other sexual relationship with other class, like in other students, and also with this female teacher who sent me to this first mission. And after some time, he established this trust because he. He told me he loved me. And he decided to get divorced and marry me. Where it was not my plan. My plan was to have this cover of his name as much as I could in order not to be used by anyone else or not to be sent to a really bad missions. Because what happened when I said no to his marriage? I literally didn't say no, but. But he understood that I wasn't really happy about that because like, first of all, obviously I didn't love him. Second, he was the first abuser and manipulator. And three, he was like 30 years older married guy that time. So like, what the heck, right? Yeah. Okay. I had to play along because I didn't have any other choice but going like this into serious relationship.

Imagine if I would be stuck with him for all these years. I mean, it would be Terrible. So he understood. I. My answer was negative. I didn't really say like, no, what he does, what he did, he sends me to another department, to his sort of friend, just like to say before, he actually tried to pass me to his friend in order to have a revenge. So that man, my future commander, actually was the one who was very corrupted. And knowing all this situation with Vladimir, he still did it. He sent me over there knowing that eventually he would give up my name, because he actually was already working with Vladimir's colleague and army friend, who was the one who was bringing. He had all connections because of the Afghanistan war and all that. He was fighting there before. So he had all the connections. He was the one who would bring all the heroin to Russia through the Vladimir's gang, and then distribute it to Russia and Europe. So that commander actually wanted to rid of Vladimir because Vladimir eventually wanted to be. He wanted to legalize himself, he wanted to become a businessman, he wanted to get rid of the drug business because he had money enough, he had power enough.

So he wanted to do more like legalized business and become sort of like oligarch. Whereas my, that commander, he still wanted some black cash, some corruption, like, you know, bribery money. Not through Vladimir, because he doesn't want it. So he decided to remove or get rid of or terminate or wherever Vladimir, in order to place this guy, his protege, who was bringing drugs from Afghanistan to his position and make him a new drug lord, the leader of the criminal gang. So in any way, it was a setup. For me, if you look through my eyes, onto my story, my commander didn't really care about that. I would be killed, I wouldn't be killed. I would survive, or something may happen with me, it doesn't matter, because it still was a setup and it was a successful setup. Because eventually when Vladimir find out that I was a mole and all that, yes, he saved me, yes, he sacrificed his life. But eventually the commander won. He placed this guy into Vladimir's position and they were continuing going on. Eventually, after certain years, I find out in the news that this commander got caught and he went to jail.

So eventually the justice, thank God.

Caught up with him.

Yes, eventually, but it took years.

How long was Vladimir a target of yours?

About eight months.

Eight months.

Of the relationship? Yeah.

Is this who you fell in love with?

You see press, they all say I fell in love with you. Didn't fall in love, honestly, like Sean. Like, I even doubt I can actually I have ever been in love, to be honest. Like, I. I don't know if I can actually experience this feeling to a man. Unfortunately, I don't think I can because, like, I'm looking at myself, like over these years, I'm like, you know, this one was target, this one was target. I had to do this. I had to do this. Like, have I ever choose any man just for myself? You know.

There'S always an ulterior motive.

Well, now, when I'm out of. I mean, like, I'm in America right now. Yes. So I'm out of all this missions and whatever. I'm by myself all these years. I don't know, what is it? Maybe it's my problem with trust. Maybe I have a trust issues. Maybe because I find. Sorry. I find man when I meet them, quite boring. I mean, like, they're really nice man. And there's so many amazing men, and I just don't know. It's just. It doesn't work for me. Or maybe I haven't met the right man who would be. Who would understand my vision and the way I think and what I understand, because more or less, especially in America. And that's why I do understand why all this kind and quite naive tech CEO and executive in Silicon Valley are so easily targeted by female spies. Because they're just very sweet and very nice, and they are. They are really naive. And that's true. But. But when you're naive, at the same time, you kind of like, for me, it's not the challenge. It's not. I want, like, brain stimulation, you know, apart from just like, physical activities. You want to speak with the person about something.

Right. And when I don't have to speak about or like, share my vision or, like my thoughts, like, I don't find it interesting. And then, you know, like the poet said, Amar Khayyam said, it's better to be by yourself rather than with anyone else. So I decided for now to just focus on my work and do my best. And then we'll see.

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That's R O-K-A dot com. Do you, do you enjoy sucks now?

Yeah, of course you do.

So then you do enjoy being with a man?

Every single time I have sex, I have intercourse, I receive my orgasm.

You do?

Always. Every single time. I will explain why. This is also part of the program of the training. So as you know, I, I studied in Kinsey Institute. That's where I find out that 80% of females in the world actually do not experience orgasm with their partners during intercourse. Which means that they don't know their body. And I have a lot of female students, they all come and they say the same, like, I'm not happy in my marriage, like whatever, I don't experience organs, I have to pretend. So that's what happening when female pretending that she has an orgasm. Obviously man, if he's not that stupid or dumb, he can feel it and he can see that he may not say or whatever, but over time that would be a problem between the couple, right? So what we've been taught, I hope some female audience understand me, but female orgasm is a female responsibility. No man, know your body or what you really like. You have to know your body yourself. You have to know, what do you like? What's your erogenous like zones? What gives you pleasure? Where are you like this erogenous, like sensual spots and everything.

So, and then when you study your body, you know, what do you like? You show it to your partner and you tell him, I like this, I like that. Let's try this, let's try that. So together you have this amazing journey to experience, you know, female pleasure and hence for male pleasure. Because it's the highest pleasure for a man to give an organ to a woman. Am I right? So in our program, obviously when we came, you were. I was virgin. I didn't have any like understanding what is sex? So we've studied. Actually I give you one crazy technique, but please don't judge me. So we've studied this. One of the effective technique for self confidence, esteem, to believe in yourself and look at yourself as you are the most beautiful for yourself, of course, like you're the most beautiful, you're the goddess. You believe in yourself, you are the best and accept your body. Because you know, we're all human beings, we don't like this, we don't like that. Or like here we have overeat, here we have cellulite or whatever. This is normal. But we need to program our brain only on positive beautiful features of our bodies and face.

So what do we do as a females? Maybe it can work for men too, I don't know. So you need to stand in front of the big mirror so you can see yourself fully. Ideally you would need to, you know, make yourself comfortable. So maybe play some nice music, put like scented candle. Maybe you should dance or whatever, maybe have a bath, you know, like, just please yourself in terms of like make yourself comfortable. So nobody also should disturb you and distract you. Then depends. You can use sex toys, you can use your fingers, whatever is comfortable. You start to please yourself. And the moment you bring yourself to this peak of the orgasm, you need to anchor your brain. So basically program your brain. What do you do? You look into your mirror. And that's very important. Like you're naked or you're not naked, doesn't matter. So you basically experience the highest peak of the orgasm right that moment. So that moment is the most effective. You should first of all anchor yourself on the word. Choose one word, maybe two, but something short. For example, I'm the queen, I'm the best. Or like you can say like you are the best.

Whatever, you can say even mango, whatever. Like choose your word and say it out loud so your brain remembers that. Then if you wanted to make it more effective, touch your, like find a spot on your body and touch it. So it could be anything. For example, it could be like a little finger on your right hand. It could be like, you know, shoulder, neck, like this. Or maybe like here, whatever, wherever you choose, find a physical anchor on your body. So this is another anchor. Plus, if you want a particular man and you want to seduce him, and you know exactly that this is your, let's say, target, ideally you should place his photo on that mirror on the wall wherever, like so you can see him and when you experience an orgasm, you look at this image and better to say his word, I mean his name, this word. So you kind of like create this bridge between this image and your brain. So what will happen when you will see next time this target? Your brain will automatically release endorphin, hormones and pheromones. Pheromones is the, you know, the scent which everybody can create.

Plus of course you can use a special perfume which actually like KGB used to have this special indigrance in the perfume which contains like some like grass and all that which actually attracts attention. So your brain instantly creates this impulses in your body. So your cheeks are blushing, your ass sparkling. So you kind of like getting into the mood of pre orgasmic mood. So your target, this guy, obviously he sees that, he noticed that. I mean isn't it amazing? You see like a woman who's like looking at you like with this, I want you on right now, here, you know. So but this is like for seducing a mission, I mean the target. So but when you do it for yourself, anchoring yourself and you do it a few times, the moment you feel anxiety, the moment you feel shy, or the moment you feel like uncertain or like in doubts or you're stressed, you touch yourself into this anchor where you placed on your body. And you tell yourself the same anchor word. I'm the best. Again same story. The brain will create this pheromone impulses, this enderphone, hormones, the happiness hormones, this state of confidence and the state of bliss that you are the best.

And you walk into the room with this, you know, random people or you walk wherever you go, like pitching for the new business or whatever, or like for a date. And you have already this posture, you have already this presence, you have this vibrations, this aura and this energy try does work to me. Ah, so yes. About orgasms, the sex. Yes. So with this technique, since I learned this technique every single time and every single my ex sex partners I had intercourse with, I have experienced orgasms. So it's not really about the man, dear ladies, it's about your own body and awareness of your own body and knowing how to give yourself pleasure. It's not about even the size or like even techniques like the. The movement of the. Of the man of your partner. No, it's all about your body. If you're comfortable with your body, if you know your body, you will adapt yourself towards these movements. Like your, you know, the angle of your body, the angle of your hips or maybe positions. Everybody's body is different and Unique. But all of us, we have our like own sensible spots in the body so we can adjust our body towards our partner's body and it will be much easier.

Rather than blame your partner and tell like, you are bad in sex.

Interesting. So you're, you're attracted to men and you can receive pleasure from men, but you mentally, you have no emotional attachment.

Mentally, I'm not attracted. Oh my God. Yeah, I think so. No, I. Don't get me wrong, I really want to fall in love. I want to experience that.

You wait, you don't find men attractive?

I don't. So I find them attractive physically, but when I start to speak with them, I'm bored. If it does make sense, I'm sorry, does it make sense? Like I've seen so much and I've been through so much that sometimes when I hear them, I'm like, oh my God. It's like speaking with my son, like teenagers sort of thing, you know. And I try like 60 years old, and I try even 70 years old, same story. It's not about the age, believe me. It's about experience. It's really about experience. Funny enough, just recently I was at the conference and I met, I cannot say his name obviously because he has a quite high position, but he's the one who is investigating espionage. So obviously we like have a lot of things to discuss. And funny enough, I caught myself on that. I am mentally stimulated by man, finally. So I find him attractive because of his brain, where I probably wouldn't find him attractive with his physical appearance. But in my case, again, as a former agent trained in this field, it doesn't matter how the man looks like, like, like to me particularly, like I don't really care what's his physical appearance and what's the size of his whatever.

Like, seriously. So it's all about like now at this point, I'm all about like mental stimulation. Does make sense.

Makes perfect sense. Makes perfect sense. So let's go back to Vladimir. So we kind of went through how you targeted him, I believe. And, and so, and then we talked about your first mission where you, you seduced a man. It's a one night stand and you're out. How are you? How are you? Main, I have a lot of questions. How are you? Have you ever, have you ever worked multiple targets at the same time?

Well, if.

Have you ever had two missions or worked two different assets at the same time? No, it's always been one at a time.

I mean, I don't even understand how like, if you're a double agent. Maybe you can do that.

Well, a double agent would be, you know, a Russian working for the Russians and also.

And at the same time giving the information to like CIA maybe.

Yeah, yeah. So basically what I'm saying is if you, if you have two operations going on at the same time, maybe you, maybe you're targeting Vladimir, who is a drug dealer, and then, and then you have, I don't know, Benjamin over here and he's a sex trafficker. Are you ever working two different. Do you see what I'm saying? Are you ever. Are you ever simultaneously?

That would be a great plot for the movie. We need to write a book about it.

So.

No. No.

Okay.

No.

So it's single. Single.

Actually, that would be really hard to do. I mean, like, you would have to have a lot of like, like knowledgeable people around you. Like you the part, you know, your team members. And that would be really hard in the end, with Vladimir mission when my colleague was killed.

Hold on, we didn't. Sorry. I don't even know any of this.

Sorry.

So with Vladimir, how long were you, how long was he a target?

So for eight, eight months you said? Yes.

And how long?

Relationship.

Okay.

Like proper loving, dating relationship.

Okay, so what is, what is, what is daily life like? Are you a hundred percent? I mean, is he. Because there's no on and off time. If you're a true operative, you're with them all the time, right? Correct.

Exactly.

Is that how it works over there?

Yes, but I pretended that I studied in the university. So when I would sort of go to my lessons, I would meet with one of my team member and pass him the whole information. So the next day, whatever it is, they would send this sort of SWAT team and arrest, you know, criminals distributing, you know, heroin.

So you're able to. I was pass on intelligence damn near every single day.

Not every single day. Like they, they were not selling like big quantity of heroin every single day, but like once a week, once in two weeks, there would be some activities going on. So I would hear the information from Vladimir because, yes, I would sleep with him, I would eat with him, I would even cook for him and for his brothers. That's the way they call each other, like you know, criminals, colleagues. They would call each other brothers. So with cook for brothers basically get like, listen, you know, who's saying what getting into these events. Like, you know, they would go to clubs almost every day. So just hanging out with them, like picking up everything, like also establishing relationship with their girlfriend. They all had like, you Know females, like girlfriends or like, somebody they spend time, so also, like, hanging out with them, finding out, like, oh, where was Alex yesterday? Like, I didn't see him in the club. Oh, he was at this, like, oh, I don't know. But, like, I heard he was speaking on the phone about, like, he went there and here they were, like, doing something and then, like, this happened.

So this kind of things, you know.

Mm. So eight, eight months. So how did he get killed? Oh, and this. So this was a long story.

Yes.

This is heroin coming out of Afghanistan. Is there any. Is there any human trafficking?

Yes, but particular, Vladimir was not. I mean, his gang was involved into this business because, of course, you know that drug and human trafficking are very connected. But Vladimir, particular, he was not. So as I said, he wanted to legalize himself, so he was not the one who was giving the decisions about human trafficking. Yet when I told him, when I sort of, like, confront him a little bit about that, I'm like, have you, like, seen this? Do you know this? Or like, you know, do you know how many, like, girls were kidnapped and all this? He. I don't know, maybe he lied to me or whatever. But as much as I could read him that time, he didn't know. So I suppose because it's a criminal gang, of course, there are a lot of members, and every single team of the gang would bring money for upshock, you know, upshock, it's like money for. It's kind of like donations from each member or wherever. Like. So, for example, you do the criminal activity, you get money, so you give 10% to each, let's say, member, and then you have money allocated for the sort of bank.

So it's bank of the criminal gang it calls opjak. So every single criminal, whatever team, when they would do some activities, they would bring money to upshock to the bank. And sometimes they probably wouldn't tell where this money come from. From selling drugs, guns, humans. But it's still the same because again, who is covering them, the whole activity, the government.

Wow. Did you. Were you ever in a situation where you thought you were compromised?

Yes, in the end. In the end, where I understood that I was just a bait, that my commander used me just to get rid of Vladimir in any way. Like, it didn't really matter how he would rid of him. Like this way, another way, it doesn't matter. I mean, it didn't matter to him, but he was the one who actually gave up my name to criminal brothers to criminal group. And Vladimir, that time, he didn't know. So he found out this from his criminal brother. When they called, like, when he called me, I didn't pick up the phone like I told you. Like it's, you know, today it remind me a little bit this ptsd. So the criminal gang were giving this information that I'm the mole from my own commander, from that commander who wanted to exchange Vladimir to his protege. As always, the driver, this sort of security driver guy of Vladimir would wait for me downstairs to pick me up for dinner. That was our normal routine. So we'd go home, change, do my homework from the university, and then coming downstairs for a dinner to have like dinner with Vladimir and then go and sleep with him in his house.

As always, I come downstairs, but instead of only one driver, they're like car full of guys who called me sister. And they put the bag into my head. They, you know, beat me, like in the car. Then we come to the forest before that, when I told you, like, they took my bag with the, you know, my bag with Motorola, so I couldn't receive any call. I mean, like, I couldn't pick up the phone when Vladimir was calling and everything. So the time they brought me to the forest, this commander protege was the one who orchestrated the whole thing. Showing to criminals. Look, she is the mall. Vladimir suck because he fell in love into the molecule. He cannot be the leader because he's stupid, because he was trapped by this bitch. And I will show you how we should do revenge on these smalls, on these rats. They would call these agents who would be undercover rats. Here in English they call it mole, but in Russia they call it rats. So she's a rat. And I will show you in front of you guys how we should do a revenge. So first of all, he raped me in front of everybody on this, on the land, on the soil.

And then that was not the worst. So they. When they were beating me up. So then I had to do some.

How many of them?

Born about 10 people. Because it was like two cars. I was in one car, there was another car. They bit the shit out of me that I had to restore my bone over here. I still have a scar. That's why I'm kind of like covering it and all that. Vladimir, that time, was expecting me for a dinner. As always, they didn't tell him yet, so he was calling me. And then I didn't pick up the phone. So he started to call to the driver. Then this guy who just raped me told him that, oh, she is a rat, She's a Mole. So we are, you know, we are killing her right now. Like, literally we are in our spot, which is the forest. Who knows where. Then you. They. What they do, they basically dig in the hole, put you in the hole, and like, finito. And then nobody will ever find you. So Vladimir gave him order to bring me to him because. And they didn't want to, but Vladimir said, like, I will finish her. Let me as a leader, let me kill her, because this is my responsibility. I need to do it.

Eventually they were like, okay, so he wants to finish her. All right, let's do it. So the time they brought me to Vladimir to his house, I was all bleeding, I was all fucked up and sorry. So, so, so difficult to remember this thing. I'm so sorry.

Are you okay?

Yes, it's just getting back there, it's really hard, like every single. So I try not to. Sorry. I apologize.

It's okay.

So anyway, Vladimir listened to whole my story. I think he. Maybe I want to kind of like romanticize him or whatever, but I think that time, I think that he understood where I'm coming from, that everything I was doing, I wasn't doing this willingly or because I wanted to, because I had to. So I told him the whole story with the Cornell and how I entered the. The military academy and everything, and how I ended up there. So he gave me some also information he knew about his friend, the army friend. And then it's sort of like we had like all these puzzles. We put it together, like all these, you know, little details. We put it into one big picture where we both. That time I didn't know, but we both understood that my commander just wanted to get rid of Vladimir in order to take. To put this his protege, his like Vladimir's friend, to just like get more money. So Vladimir created this plan which I followed. So basically he. That night. So he didn't kill me, obviously he knew, I think, that he would be killed. But I think he. And I told him, like, you're risking your life if you're staying here.

Why don't you go with me? Because he gave me telephone numbers with all the foreign friends in Turkey and Greece. So that's actually how it like, you know, this contact these people. His former friends helped me to move and actually like relocate myself there. I asked him, why don't you go with me? I don't know. Was it love from my side? I don't know. But I asked him, why don't you want to go with me? He said that he cannot leave everything he created all these people who relied on him. All these people he have been trained and raised. You know, he would take all this, you know, under privilege, underage kids build gyms, like work out places where these homeless kids could come and have food and roof under their hat. Because as I said, after like this revolution after 1991, there were so many kids, like homeless kids and they didn't have family because parents either like would, you know, become druggists or alcoholic or die or whatever would happen. All these kids were like on the streets. So these kids were sort of adopted by Vladimir and he created all these gyms, facilities for them where they can actually leave.

And after some time, maybe it was his purpose also to raise an army for himself for the future activities of his. Because after when, you know, when they would grow up to late 18, sort of like 16, they would participate into his gang, who knows? But at least he didn't let them to die. I don't know. So he said, I cannot leave them like this. I have to do something. I have to find another leader in order to like, you know, take care about this business, take care about them. And of course I think he wanted to revenge with this corrupted commander of mine. So that night he placed me into the car with the driver, whom he know, but he wasn't the criminal, he was his friend from the childhood, from like the school or whatever. He drove me to another city, to a safe house. And then literally after two months, Vladimir was killed by his own. I mean, they don't say who and how. And all this just shot. It's actually an article in Internet, so people can look online and search and see it. So he'd been shot and that's the end of the story.

I mean, his story.

Were you sad?

You know what I lost that time when I. So that night when I realized that my commander set me up because of whatever money, because of the money in power, because of the revenge, because of many things. Because I also said to him no when he wanted to fuck me, you know, it was like male ego, revenge, money, corruption and all this together. When I realized that I lost, you know, like hope and belief in any kind of like romanticized feeling of the patriotism that I sacrifice myself for the country, for people to save them. And then like my job, myself being used for some, someone's purposes for like just gaining money or wherever. And I'm just like a little tool which is not that important. And you just like can, you know, through like people like that. Because like, as I said, like one of my colleague was killed during the separation and like nobody would care. I think I lost any belief or hope, I don't know, I just lost it.

Believer, hope in men. Believer, hope in humanity.

I didn't lose the belief in human beings, of course. There's so many amazing people I met during these years. As I said, I don't have any negativity towards men, of course not, but I was raised in, in a very, with very patriotic feelings. Like, you know, your grandfather is a hero, your father has all these medals. Like your father has such a name, you know, it's such a, it's amazing feeling when you go and sometimes difficult to dangerous missions. But you feel like your job is so important, even though it's hidden for public. But your job is so important because this allow civilians like normal people sleep peacefully in the warm beds at night while you are in this, during this night in the freezing cold air, like doing something or like, you know, doing your job and you like, you know what I'm saying? And even though it's like really hard and you haven't eaten, you haven't slept, you exhausted physically. But the only one hope which actually keeps you like focused and keeps you like this, you know, like positive is because you know that you believe in the mission. You believe in the mission, you believe that you saving someone's life.

It's the only one big belief. And this was betrayed by my own commanders, by my own government. Like, how could I live with that? It's life, I guess.

I mean, under completely different circumstances. There's a lot of veterans and former intelligence personnel that feel the exact same way about this country.

I, I can understand.

You did feel an emotional attachment to Vladimir, didn't you?

I felt that, you know, I. One of my dreams actually is very connected to his and I think he inspired me to do that. I see exactly myself in five years where I will. I want to see myself where I'm, you know, I work for that where like I see myself in 10 years and 20 years. And I see myself when I will be like before I will be that where I want to see myself and I want to see myself ideally in the island with a big, big house where orphanage orphan kids from all around the world would live there and be raised there as a family, disregarding to the fact what nationality they are, what race they are, what background they are, educate them and raise them as a sisterhood and brotherhood and just give them this chance and possibility of having the roof and family. And I think this dream was inspired by Vladimir because that's exactly what he was doing. Maybe I had attachment with him. I don't know, maybe. Maybe that's why I cannot, you know, have another attachment to anybody else. Maybe. But look from another hand. It's such a beautiful sacrifice, sacrifaction right of man.

He sacrificed his life for a female he loved. Beautiful, very noble. Even though he was a criminal, but still it's a beautiful, you know, action for a woman, for love. I appreciate that and I really respect and I think that one of the reasons why I shared the story is because to bring this awareness also that this man exists, you know, that men can do such noble things for women if they really care about women and they love them, you know, so it's something really big, beautiful can happen if you really love someone.

How often do you think about him?

About him? Only when somebody asks me. I don't really think about him in a normal routine. I'm constantly so busy and my brain is always occupied with so many projects and things. So I. One of the technique also not to go to the part because it can ruin you completely. And I. So I learn also there is another technique. So I learned how to block your past so you don't. You know the worst thing when you compare what if, what if he wouldn't be that and we would meet each other in Greece and happily live and have three kids and blah blah, blah. What actually brings you nothing. You're just basically depriving yourself and it's a virtual world which doesn't exist. Right. You need to focus on the present moment. And I always do this technique. Maybe you heard that when I go to this negative thoughts what if or my past or like, you know, I got a little bit emotional because maybe it's a really like a few times in my life when I went back to that moment when I was raped and beaten up almost to death. I don't allow myself to remember that because if I would, I would never get over that dark emotions and then this can lead me to a really bad things.

Like for example, I don't drink alcohol. I choose not to because in the past if I would drink my brain slowly but my, my, my shield, my guard would, you know, drop and I would remember that memories and that experience and I would go into darkness as I don't consume any drugs because it can also bring me the same problem, you know. So I self regulate myself and I self control myself because I choose healthy lifestyle. I choose to achieve my goals rather than memorizing and remembering that past. That past made me who I am today. And I choose to be strong. Right, and move on rather than to live in the past. And I strongly advise people not to believe in the past and remembering the past, but move on because the life is beautiful. There's so many amazing things in the world. You can do so. So many great things for others, for human progress, for our planet, for our home. It's amazing.

You know, the thing is, is that it does keep coming up for you.

It does keep coming back.

It keeps coming back. It keeps coming back when you drink. It keeps coming back.

So that's why I don't drink.

So it's coming back right now. So what I want to ask you is, would you rather. Would you rather process it and come to an understanding and move past it or keep blocking it?

Okay, great question. Thank you so much. I feel like I'm with my therapist now, so I work with therapists for 17 years. Right. As I said, I don't know. I don't know. Because if I. Okay, I will be honest. I don't think I'm powerful enough to process that. Really. I think it will, you know, it will really destroy me. You know what I'm saying? I'd rather keep it over there for now because at the moment, I still do not feel stable, you know, due to certain circumstances in my life. I still don't feel like, okay, I am safe. I'm like, I have my security. I don't feel it yet. I am working on that right now. I want to achieve it once I will do it, maybe it would be enough power, enough energy to go back and process that. But right now, I'm in a kind of, like, vulnerable position right now. Still being here in US for, like, five years, I'm still in a very vulnerable situation. I don't want to go there so dark and work on it. I have not, you know, I don't have power enough to do this.

Have you ever heard of psychedelic therapy?

I've heard. And again, I am scared to do this. Like, you know, especially in Los Angeles, they're all about, like, ayahuasca and like this, like, ketamine therapy, right? I am scared. I'm scared to do that. I'm scared that I will not come back. You know, mentally.

I've done it.

Did it help? I don't know, Sean. Like, I'm scared.

See, the thing with it is, I talk a lot about that on this show. And, you know, most. The majority of the people that I talk about it with are former special ops guys that have done just horrific stuff. And you know, the general consensus is that it's very healing. And you know that for me too, I mean that when I did, I came off booze up to be almost four years since I've had a drink this February.

Congratulations.

Thank you.

Big achievement. I know that it's hard.

Actually. It was easy for me. I did psychedelics and really it was done.

No, it's hard for me. Sometimes I just want to.

But what I'm saying is it'll throw you back in those situations. But you're able to, you're able to observe it from a different perspective where you're not necessarily emotionally attached and you process it.

Do you think that I block this memories?

Yeah.

So do you think like if I would go back and process it would actually give me sort of like reveal? Yeah. Only maybe I think you would be.

Able to think about it and move past it from an unemotional. Like this happened to me. It doesn't define who I am and it's okay.

Well, I almost came to the state that it's okay. Like I'm grateful to my experience. If not this, I wouldn't be sitting here. Right. So I'm. I'm grateful and I'm blessed. But maybe with the right specialist. As I said, like, I have a trust issue, obviously. So even with a therapist, I'm very careful about what I'm saying or whatever because of. You never know. So obviously like when you are in such a vulnerable state, I under psychedelics, you need to really have people who you trust 100%. Unfortunately, I cannot say that right now in my life I have these people. Maybe because it's my problem. Oh, okay. I trust my son 100%. I do trust some of my friends, so people I work with. But to do psychedelic rhythm therapy? No. Does make sense.

Makes perfect sense.

Okay.

I'm just. I'm just planting a seed and maybe I'll look into it. And if you do and you need some context, let me know.

Okay.

But you know, so you know, going back to Vladimir, I mean, I think it's very obvious that you had some sort of connection, feelings for him. I'm just curious, if you did have the opportunity to talk to him again, what would you tell him?

If I would. If I would speak with him, I would tell him, thank you. Of course. Thank you for giving me a chance to live this life and being here right now in front of you. Just big, big thank you from the bottom of my heart. That's it? I mean, I would, I would of course apologize, but I did apologize that night. I think he understood that sometimes we are in these life circumstances that people. You don't need to even say that you apologize because people know that you are. It's different. But being grateful 100%.

Let's take a break.

Okay.

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The division I partnered with this production company called Ironclad and we're doing an eight part audio series on Psyops on why foreign countries, governments, maybe even our own government would conduct a SCOP on its own people. And I just think that, that this series is going to be extremely important because it's going to open the eyes of people on why these things happen. You can head over to scopshow.com order it today because you're going to get a lot out of this. Who's pulling the strings? Who's pulling them?

You know, some people say that, oh, so her like, you know, basically the story about her being a spy, it's a cover to cover her real identity. She's still spy because she goes to all this like here she goes there, she has this Life. So she's definitely a spy. I'm like, oh my God, these people.

Well, everybody thinks I'm a spy too.

Really? They do?

Yeah, they all, they don't all think that, but a lot of people think.

Okay, so this is kind of normal when you speak about this kind of thing. So people think you are a spy. So in America it's kind of normal because I will explain. I don't know, like you can totally recall that. So what I was surprised when I moved to America. You see, I lived in Europe for 15 years, right? When I told some people about my just like my very close people. So for example, I was dating Lord, a British lord who was very close to real family. So I told him like about, you know, my past. So we still have a really good friendship and all that. That. He told me, sweetheart, please do not share this to anyone in this country. Like, just don't. I'm like, okay, so I didn't. I come here and it was sort of like a necessary thing to do. But when I shared that, what I didn't expect that press will go viral. Like, viral as it became like viral like different other countries, including even India or like Asia, Greece and all like Slovakia, Slovenia, Australia, like, I mean like they all were writing about like, so it's, it's ongoing press.

Like the New York Post, it was recent one, but before that it was much bigger mainstream. So my team did an estimation. It was over 500 million viewers on just like some articles, which is crazy, but everything came from America. So American press presented me. So I kind of like told them what I did. But in my perspective, this is operative work. What I was doing. I would never call it like spy work. Yet we did spy on our targets, you know, when we had to gather information, you know, we need to do research, blah, blah. But yes, so the press calls like, oh, she is a sex spy and all this. And it went just viral. And we're like, wow. Like, so I was even like, oh my God, like, this is crazy. So I think especially in America because of the Cold War situation and because I'm coming from ussr, it's just like became so big and so viral just because of like, you know, people ask these questions like, okay, so if you spy, it must be like in the movie Red Sparrow. So you must seduce this American ministers, politicians, ambassadors, you know, like, so this is the belief, like, oh my God.

So this, the imagination is crazy. Especially in America. Like why?

Oh yeah. Americans are notorious for over sensationalizing news stories and over embellishing pretty much everything. So.

But conspiracy theories with some of them. I. I cannot disagree. I agree, but the whole, like, spy thing, I mean, yes, of course it does exist, but only in this country. It's just so much interest.

Everybody thinks I'm still a spy. Actually, I was never a spy. I was a.

But anyways, have you ever spy on someone? Like, on your targets, like, to get some information?

Yeah, okay. I guess I was a spy.

So, see, that's. So if you were doing that, even for one target, they call you spy. Yet, like, in Russia, they would never call each other, hey, spy, come here. Like, hey, spy, you have to call. We don't.

Yeah, it doesn't happen here.

Right. They don't do it in the military. They call you, like, according to your rank or according to your. Your job status. Like, for example, operative, blah, blah, blah. Your mission is so and so. Or like, they would say agent so and so. Right.

What do they accuse you of being a spy for?

That's.

What's your. What's your current mission? Wait, are you talking about press or are we talking about people, or what do we talk?

I don't know. I just noticed that.

I see it in the comments.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. In America, people still think that. That I am a spy. So I came to this country in order to spy for Russians. I'm like, people, please try to hear me out, Please. I'm sitting here in front of Sean Ryan and actually giving my whole. My whole story away. Like, telling the whole thing about myself. If I would be a spy, an active spy, would I want to do that? I mean, what for? It's. It's so weird even to think.

See, they're gonna say that. That's the COVID Yeah, exactly.

That's what they say. This is the car.

She was told to say that they're probably spying together. Now there'll be a whole narrative out there crafted that we're a team. I don't know if we're working for Russia or the u. S. I don't know. But what. They're gonna come.

So a Russian spy and American spy got together at the podcast and do a podcast. Oh, my God, it's hilarious. But yes.

And then there'll be the other people that, like, see, they have to tell you what they're gonna do before they do it. This is. Yeah, this is what this is.

Yeah.

And then, like this, welcome to the Internet. But anyways, yeah, we talk about this all the time. All the time.

Okay, so.

But I Am curious. I have, I have a question.

Okay.

Have you ever worked in Silicon Valley?

Oh my God, yes.

No.

Sorry. Yes, I did. Okay. So then got. This is like a short and then the garment. She just.

Here it is.

She just. Yeah, she just said yes. Okay. So I was actually invited to Silicon Valley, San Diego based company, a very big company, to actually give a public speaking in front of CEOs and executives to talk about spy techniques, how to prevent manipulation, how to spot lie, how to reach people and how to increase sales using spy techniques.

Nice.

So yes, actually I was invited by ABC and Hulu. They want to do the same. They want to kind of like film me giving a lecture about how to prevent manipulation for executives in Silicon Valley using this spy techniques from female spies. Just funny.

That's a real problem over there.

Why? Ah, you mean like because of the.

That is a big problem. Especially with the AI race going on with China right now. That is a big problem.

Yeah.

So what do you tell them? How do they, what do you tell them? What are they looking out for? How do you avoid espionage in Silicon Valley?

As you said, like we just discussed that. So number one, be very cautious. Be aware of this sort of potential fake female accounts. When they love bombing you love bombing how? Like, yeah, like how did they find you? Why do they text you? Okay, we know what they want. Oh, like I just want to meet you. I think you're cute. How you like possibly can see in this little picture like how the, the person looks like. Right. Mostly of like accounts are private, especially in LinkedIn, there are not so many pictures. This Silicon Valley tech executives, they definitely don't have Instagrams, probably not even Facebook's.

So as James, here's a good rule to live by. This is just a good rule for everybody to live by. If you've Never had a 10 come up to you and want to you and all of a sudden they're coming around, it's probably because they want your money or your tech.

Yeah.

Or like you didn't turn into a 10 overnight. So. Yes, especially when you just be honest with yourself.

Yeah, but it's really hard for people, especially for men, to be honest. Like really? I spoke with one person who is in Silicon Valley and CEO of a very big company cannot say his name and the company name because it's quite big. So he knows who I am, we spoke, we know each other through friends and he goes, you know what? So I'm sitting in a, in a restaurant like for the lunch break, and this beautiful, gorgeous Slovakian looking hot girl comes and she's like, you know, pampering me with compliments and like blah, blah, blah and all this. And she wanted me to go with her to have sex like straight away. But he told me I didn't know. He said I was wisely, like I was wise enough. I understood that she probably was a spy. So I'm so good I didn't go with her even though it was so hard to resist. Do you think she was a spy? I'm like, oh my God, dude. And then another comments also from Silicon Valley guys, also quite big, you know, corporations, big status executives and all that. They said, so what? At least I will be by gorgeous girl.

Why not? Wow. I'm telling you that it's, it's crazy, but that, that's what, that, that's, you know, comments I receive.

Wow.

Yeah.

How many? I'm, I'm just, I am curious, I mean, how many is this common knowledge in Silicon Valley? Does everybody know?

I think now it is because of the Times article, but before, I don't think so. You know how many actually Slovakian women go there to target potential future husbands? Like unbelievable. I know the story.

Hundreds of thousands.

Yeah, I know a lot of stories. Actually I don't even. Do you remember like 10, 20 years ago it was very popular, these websites, dating websites, they would call it like Russian wife or like bring Russian wife or like Russian date or whatever.

So mail order brides, right?

So this American Silicon Valley based man would go online to find Russian or whatever like Slovakian looking woman, speak with them online before seeing them, make for them bride visa. So they could come from Russia or Ukraine or whatever countries to America to meet with them for like, I think the visa was for six months and they decide if they want to marry them. Like this woman, then she would stay under the marriage visa, like the, you know, green card, marriage residency, or she would go back home. But most likely, of course these women would do everything, everything to, to show like the best behavior obviously in every possible way. So this man would end up marrying them. And surprisingly, I know a lot of females having this situation. So they would particular target American men from California, from Silicon Valley in order to move to America, get married, have kids with them and then who knows, maybe still deliver some information to the government. And I spoke with one of them and you know what she said? We spoke about this and there was like some sort of like conflicts between different women. One woman would say, how can you actually create a family and raise kids with your target?

Another One would say, yes, but if you do that for the government, why would you do it for government? Right? But another one said, imagine the situation. What if your parents in Ukraine or Russia, Belarus or whatever, what if they are threatened or they would be put on risk if you would reject this task from the government. So.

Man, how many spies do you think are over there?

A lot.

How many countries?

How many countries? Like, from, like, from different. Definite. Okay. So I spoke with one person I mentioned before, mostly China, because Chinese are particular targeting the ip intellectual. Intellectual property from the American companies. Corporate. Corporate companies. Russians, not so much. Mossad, British. They said, that's not in a good shape right now. The. Sorry, but it is what it is. I mean, I spoke with the pro. That's a very classified information, but it's actually truth. So you see, the point is that the Chinese secret intelligence and Russian, they don't really have human rights law as high as in America. So for them, using humans, it's quite common and normal. Okay. And besides, they don't have that much money to use technology, so it's easier to use humans.

Are you, Are you still in contact with any of your family?

Yes, of course.

Your father?

Yes, we just speak. We speak time to. I mean, like, not every day, of course, but we speak like once a week or two weeks just to check on them. We cannot speak anything about the war, political situation, anything like that. We usually speak about, like, you know, about the house, how do they feel, and, you know, what's going on in their life. And I just speak about my job and that's it.

Have you and your dad ever had a conversation about your previous career?

Yes. And you know what my dad said? Even like two years ago, he said, maybe you should come back to Russia and, you know, reinstall yourself in the, in the military and continue working. So at that point, I understood that I love my dad. I love my family, of course, but it's, It's. He doesn't get it. You know, how, like, it's just. He doesn't understand. He doesn't see what I see. And it's impossible to teach him or trying to explain him because I did try to explain when the war started, but it went to the argument. So my mom said, please don't speak with him about this stuff. Just, like, just don't.

Wow.

When I actually, he doesn't know the whole story about Vladimir, but when I actually, like, moved out from Russia, even though, like, I was still in Russia, he actually stopped talking to me because I, I. What I Said to him, the way I presented it, I said, I quit and I left. So my dad didn't speak with me for over a year because I betrayed his plans and his goals on my future and sort of the family. I kind of like, let him down, if you understand what I mean, because he was portraying me and believing that I would be, you know, having this, like, high rank and maybe, like, you know, he would be proud of me and all that. I went to a completely different path. I don't understand if he. I mean, I think he doesn't understand that and he doesn't approve that. But at the moment, it is what it is. Of course he would want to have for me different future.

Man, that is tough. I mean, how. How would you. How would you go back to Russia and work an intelligence unit anyways? I mean, you've abandoned.

I could if I wouldn't go public, like I'm. I'm doing right now. I definitely could if you didn't go.

Public, but you are public.

Well, that's why I decided to go public, because I'm like, I'm so done. I don't want anyone contact me. I don't want anyone to be sent. I don't want to be attached.

Oh, this conversation with your dad was before you went public.

Okay, yeah, yeah. So now. Now when I'm like, public and all this. So the good thing, they don't have social media because it's banned in Russia. Like, you know, Spotify is banned. WhatsApp is banned. Every single platform are banned in Russia. Sometimes they don't have Internet. Some days they don't. Like, they literally don't have Internet. So they cannot really go and see. The only one platform they can check is my Instagram, but my Instagram is all about fashion. So when I moved to London at 30, I finally was like, okay, so finally I can do something for myself. And my dream was to work in fashion. So I was enrolled into top fashion university in London. I got my master degree and I started to work in fashion. And I was super happy because I was working for a really big publishing house, like Condones in the UK for Walk and Tatler and Vanity Fair magazine. So for me, it was very, like, you know, big and prestigious. So I created my fashion blog in Instagram. So everything is about fashion. So I go to fashion weeks, Milan, Paris. I promote fashion brands, I get paid.

So Instagram is my, you know, my revenue, but as a fashion blogger. So I became an influencer in fashion much earlier than I revealed my identity. Being A secret agent. And sometimes people, they don't understand because they don't scroll down the Instagram to, like, you know, to my past. And they say, oh, she revealed her story about being spy because she just wanted to become an influencer. I'm like, where is the logic here? Like, why don't you just scroll down to my Instagram? Why don't you see that? I got 1 million followers much earlier than I revealed my identity being a spy, you know, and it was like I was living in Europe mostly of the time. So my dad and my family, they don't really. And besides, they don't speak English, so they don't really understand this kind of things. They just see my Instagram. Oh, like, she's wearing this nice dress. She's on the red carpet here. She's on the red carpet, like, in Cannes and Venice. So whatever. So, okay, you know, that's it. So what's going on, like, with the Spotify and, you know, YouTube? They don't have access.

Gotcha, Gotcha.

Thank God.

Well, your fashion career has gone. How long have you been in fashion?

10 years.

10 years?

Yeah. I'm 14 now, so I've been there 10 years. I started from 13.

You're in everything. I mean, I'll probably misspeak here, but I want that when I went through. I mean, it's like Vogue, glamor, vanity, like, everything.

Thank you.

During everything.

Thank you. Well, I love fashion. I was born in Soviet Union. There was no fashion at all. So I was, you know, stitching and tailoring clothes for dolls and then for myself and then for my friends. So fashion, I always, like, love fashion. I wanted to. To kind of like, have my own style and all that. So if you really like, you know, implement yourself and all that, of course you. You can achieve everything you want as long as you work hard on that and, you know, you're moving on. So that's what I'm doing. And I'm, you know, I'm very happy that my son just recently signed a deal with the top four model agencies in the world.

Congratulations.

He has. Thank you. He has really good physics parameters. The only one thing I need to manage him because, you know, how fashion industries, it's, you know, entertainment and all that, so he has to be very careful. So I would be the one who would guide him, introduce him to designers, be there as his manager and just help him to go through. So, yeah, I'm very excited about that.

Right on. Congratulations.

Thanks. Do you.

Do you use your seduction techniques to get what you Want today, Always today. Today?

No, today. I mean like, first of all, you're a married guy.

Well, I don't mean to me, I.

Just mean in anything high audience. Do you like me?

Any, any, any. I mean to advance your fashion career, to get, to get anything that you want. I mean, do you use those techniques?

In my normal life, yes. And I would say this is my DNA always, but in a good way. You see, you can use spy techniques for good. Like for example, you want to motivate or inspire your colleagues. That's why Congratulations, your top one podcast in YouTube and in Spotify. Why? Because you inspire your team. You bring them together, you motivate them. Because alone we can't do all this job. We need like, right, good team next to us doing, you know, this mission together. Like, you know, like in the military, you cannot do the mission by yourself. You have to have the right team with you, right? So how to motivate people, how to inspire them? Giving, right, compliments, programming them as well through anchors, but in the right way. Or for example, wife can inspire and motivate and program her husband in order to kind of like push him a little bit to be more successful, to have a desire to make more money, to do something, to kind of like create more things, you know, so spy techniques can be used for good. Also spy techniques can be used for spotting the lie. What if you receive all these offers from potential business partnerships, but they actually trying to lie to you, taking advantage from you?

What if you can actually it's not just like gut feeling, but it's also understanding the body language, the eye contact, like analyze the words words, right. Observe the behavior, the character, like what they say, how they say. It's a lot of little details. But what if you can understand that and learn how to do all this in order to protect yourself from giving away something in the business which is not beneficial for you? So same in the relationship, right? Like we just discussed, like, what if man would understand that this woman, potential gold digger, this woman is potential spy, you know, trying to get something out of you. Or like they look into your wallet rather than you and how to maybe not like even maybe, but how to place the right boundaries. Because we all treat people according to the way how they present themselves. If you present yourself as a weak man, as dependent and emotional and kind of like, yeah, like, you know, weak. Most likely there would be a woman who would come and try to abuse you to. In order to get something out of you, right? So you need to place your boundaries first.

You need to have and raise your self esteem, your self confidence and that when you are, when you are confident, most likely nobody will be able to manipulate you or use you or take something from you. You. We're talking about like healthy partnership. But healthy partnership starts from yourself, right? So spy techniques can use for good. And that's what I teach to people and that's what I'm, you know, writing in the book. And I want to share this to people where spy techniques can use for the dark psychology for the manipulation as well. But that's my responsibility not to share this techniques to public, to audience so they, they won't use it on each other.

How do you tell if somebody's lying?

Many things. Now you know what? Now I went to the thing, the kind of like maybe special skill. I noticed it wasn't like this before. Before I would like you know, analyze according to the theory. Now I can actually without even body language or like, you know, the whole presentation. I can smell the lie, which is so funny. But I think it's over time, practice and wisdom. So number one for just people to understand. Number one, how to spot the lie. When somebody tries to push whatever they want and they try to push you in a way that hurry up, hurry up. Like we need to do it now. Like today is the day. Like now is that. Like is the time. We need to do it now. Let's do now. Come on, come on. Like when somebody's rushing you like this and another person for example would distract you with talks or other like activities or whatever, this is a big red flag. So you need to kind of like guys, give me some time. Let me think. This is a really important to remember. So never take make any decisions when you are in this like rush situation.

Second the lie. Yeah, of course, body language. But we all know that, right? So like people say, well I wouldn't say that this is actually work. Like when people look like, you know, up left or up right. Usually like left they're saying like this is. It doesn't work like that because that.

Could be a confidence problem.

Yeah. Sometimes we remember something, sometimes we think about something. Or sometimes like I can like go like this and like thinking like, you know, looking at your beautiful picture over there, for example. Like, like, you know, like there could be so many thoughts. Like I wouldn't stress particular on the eye position, but body language. Yes. So when somebody's hiding something, they usually hide themselves. Right? Usually like women, usually women, they sit either like this. Like you know, it's a very close Position or they put the back on the knees. Also, like closing position. Or again, like when you covering your mouth or like you covering your eyes or like you kind of. So you try to. Whatever you say, but you, you know, distract.

You're looking for something to do.

Yeah. Like at the same time, like you kind of like hiding something. You feel it. Right. So check the. The whole posture. Like, how is it? Some very skilled liars, they would take care, but they would control their body language, of course, so you wouldn't even notice on the body language. But then it's so important to understand what they're like asking from you. Obviously, if a random person comes to you with an offer and pushing you or placing you in the situation, you cannot say no. That's definitely a manipulation. And you should like just withdraw yourself and just get out from this and take time to think. And also like, important thing, you know, check the person. Of course. Like, check the social media. Check like, you know, people ask people if they know this person, if he's legit, if he's not legit, what has he done? Who does he know him, like, what kind of like, you know, relationship he has. It could be about women and men. Doesn't matter. You need to check. You know, now we live in the Internet world where you can check everything about anyone. There is a great website.

I checked one person recently. You just pay like couple bucks and it gives you the whole thing, especially in America, which is like fascinating. You get like the address, you know, partners, marriages and all that. Why not? So check people before you are getting yourself into some situations where you will.

Regret after, would you say, be aware of people that don't give you the opportunity to talk. Fast talkers. Overabundance of talking is an avoidance of questioning.

Yeah, destruction. They destructive with their talk. So you, you're kind of like, you're lost. So you cannot like even hear your thought process because you're like distracted with the conversation.

This was a fascinating conversation.

Thank you.

What should we cover? Or is this the end and.

I don't know, you tell me. I'm like, we went from like crying to love.

I think we covered it. Okay, I'd love to get you back. You're gonna come back?

Yeah, after I will do psychedelic therapy. And then after, like, okay, now I am connected with my. My Zen and I'm ready. I'm ready to go through that again and like, you know, tell you the whole thing.

I hope you look into it. I mean, they could do a lot of good for you.

Maybe Next year. So this year almost gone. Next year when the book will be out, hopefully I'll get like, I will be sort out with my citizenship and everything and then we'll see. I mean, maybe, yes, maybe I'll have the power enough. But again, like it's all about like the time also the right time. You see, like when you travel, when you're committed to so many projects, you just simply don't have time to yourself. And that's also important. Like I need to have time for myself. And I'm so happy this Christmas break is coming because everybody will be busy or like with family. So I can finally sleep and I can finally rest. Finally I can like sleep in my bed for at least eight hours.

Nice.

Yeah, this is my dream.

Last question. If you could, if you could recommend three guests for this podcast, who would they be?

Three guests. You know what? So I listen a lot of your episodes and I scroll down the whole YouTube. It's amazing. Very interesting topics and all that. I actually really fascinated. I won't go to this, you know, conversations, but it doesn't matter. But like some of the guests, they were just amazing, like wow and very inspiring. But I noticed that there are not so many female guests, you know. So I think if you would bring more female guests, especially therapists. So for example, you talk about mental healing and ptsd, maybe great. Would it would be great to bring somebody like expert or therapist on that, but female from female perspective.

Okay.

I would also invite a relationship female coach. So for example, or like I'm happy to talk about what women want from men on the first date or like in like, in terms of like long relationship because it's such a, like men obviously have completely different psychology from women. Women also have different psychology from men. But like when women more kind of like educated in this way because women want to. Women have a precise time limit. Men, they don't. So it's very important for female to have everything during like a specific time zone. Like, you know, marrying kids, raising kids, you know, also making career and all that. So it's very limited time.

What do women want from men? I'll ask you.

Okay, good question. Women want from men only one thing. Women want stability. That's it. Stability. That's it. Guys, it's, it's wherever you, you would hear, oh, she wants this size or she wants that size of a wallet. Rubbish. They want stability. I can tell you this. And as a woman and I, I work with women, even if a guy doesn't make that much, you know, Revenue yet. But he is stable. Meaning that he's self regulated, he's self disciplined. He committed to his work, he committed to his project, he committed to their relationship. So he doesn't lie, he doesn't cheat on. Not just like physical cheating, but like cheating, like lying. Oh, like maybe this is water, maybe this is wine, maybe this is black, maybe this is white. Like, you know, like this kind of like, because this is not stability. When women spot that man is lying somewhere, the trust is gone. And then women think like, how can I actually have kids with this man if he lies to me in these small things? And then like after, like having kids, like what, what if he will leave me? What if like he'll, he'll just let me down in something or whatever.

Right? So women seeking for stability. Even though, as I said, the guy is not like maybe successful yet, but he's very committed to everything he does. And he says, tomorrow I will do this. And he does it like I go to gym, let's say every day for one hour and he does it, whatever, but he is committed to everything he's doing. Then woman has this, this understanding that, okay, I can trust him, he's stable because during the time I can see that he didn't mess up in anything. So I can trust this guy. So I am okay to go ahead with him and build life together. So stability. But of course, they're like small, not like small details, but they're like other details. Like of course women are looking for attention, physical attention, compliments, moral attention and support, of course. Otherwise, you know, I strongly believe, and that's what I say to my students. As I said, women, they have limit with time. And for a woman, it's very important to choose the target wisely. Sorry, I just. Okay, let's call a potential partner, the right partner at target. So if a woman goes into relationship with the cute guy and she just likes him, but he's unstable and he mess up like in different things, but she forgives him and she goes ahead.

It may be like, you know, a lot of time, like years sometimes, and she's still, you know, waiting for something. Most likely this guy will never offer you and propose you. And most likely this guy would never be committed to you because like, he's like, he doesn't even know what does he want. So why would you waste your precious time on this person? Because we cannot change people unless they want to change themselves. So if you think that you will change, man, this is not going to happen. So instead, why don't you choose the right man who is also willing to work with you on building something together. But the thing is, it's very difficult. Of course, it's hard to find the right target, but it's possible because in the beginning also, you need to have your boundaries, and you need to tell the man, what are you looking for? As, like, he needs also to tell you what does he want? Because, like, you may be in, like, you know, playing these games, but in fact, like, he just wants to have easy, simple sex, and you want to build a family with him and have kids.

Like, you are in, like, in different, you know, dimensions. Exactly. So, of course it's not going to work, and you'll just waste your time. And then what would happen? You will have a broken heart, ptsd. You lose time and energy, and you use. How many examples of, like, the stories do we have? Do we know?

Millions.

So that's why women need to know what do they want? And they need to stay in the beginning of relationship. What do they want? In a nice way, of course not like, okay, I want this, this, this. But you know, the funny thing is, I have one of my students who actually, so that time, she was 38 years old, working in the bank, beautiful girl. And she was like, you know what? I want to. I've done my career, blah, blah, blah. I have, like, income, good, stable income. I have some savings. So I want to have family. I want to have kids. I want the right man. And what she did, she just basically went online, and every single evening, she would meet with new men, but she would stay tuned. Dude, I want to get married. I'm 38 years old. I'm planning and a little bit about herself. I'm so and so and so, so even in dating website like sort of like Tinder or wherever. But she was able to find the right guy for herself, and now they're happily married with two kids, and it's been already, like, what, over six years?

So it's possible. But you need to know, what do you want?

Good advice.

Well, I hope it helps.

Great advice. Well, Aaliyah, I just want to say thank you for coming. I'd love to get you back here.

Thank you.

Sean, fascinating conversation.

Thank you so much. I really, really appreciate it.

My pleasure. Best of luck. Thank you. No matter where you're watching Shawn Ryan show from, if you get anything out of this, please like, comment, subscribe, and most importantly, share this everywhere you possibly can. And if you're feeling extra generous, please leave us. Review on Apple and Spotify podcasts.