Transcript of Live from Charlotte: The Ramsey Show on Tour New

How much should I expect my boyfriend to be paying on an engagement ring?

Oh! I'm a little irritated.

Why, Ken Coleman?

Hannah, relax. Single people stand up for a second. You two stay up. If you want to go out, Ramsey Solutions will pay for your first date.

I feel like he makes purchases that from my perspective are excessive.

What set expenses?

Colone. He gets it.

Yeah.

If I wanted to get her, say, a luxury handbag—

What kind of bag? What kind of price?

$3,000 to $4,000.

Ooh, yikes. Y'all are bringing the fastballs tonight.

How can I manage burnout and help my partner understand why becoming debt-free matters so much to me?

Why does he hate me?

He thinks it's a cult.

There we go.

I don't want this to be a point of tension for you guys. I want you to feel validated in your decisions.

Normal is broken. Common sense is weird. So we're here to help you transform your life. From the Ramsey Network, brought to you by the Fairwinds Credit Union, live from Charlotte, North Carolina, this is The Ramsey Show. Yes!

Beautiful.

Wow.

Ladies and gentlemen, alongside my esteemed colleagues George Campbell and the lovely Rachel Cruz, I'm Ken Coleman, and we're so thrilled to be with you here in the Queen City, Charlotte. And we're gonna have some fun tonight. This is the Ramsey Show, but it's live, so we're taking your questions tonight. And I got good news and bad news. The good news is there's no dump button. We can't hang up on you. But George, tell them the bad news.

Bad news is it's your personal brand on the line. So just know we can't stop you from being you.

That's exactly right. So, so fun. So as you can see, we got our mic back here and we're gonna start it off with Christopher. Christopher, come on down. Give Christopher some love. There we go. Where are you from?

Hey guys, Greenville, South Carolina.

Nice.

So my question is, my wife and I are in Baby Steps 4, 5, and 6, and I would like to get her something, to quote Cousin Eddie, really nice. And I'm wondering if I wanted to get her, say, a luxury handbag, uh, for instance, does that fit in? And steps 4, 5, and 6, obviously pay cash. But I, I just want to get y'all's thoughts, judgments on that.

No judgment here, pal. That's called good husband.

You know which one she wants? You have one in mind? Yes, cuz there's a range of handbags.

Tell us for fun.

She here?

No.

Okay, good.

I mean, she knows I'm here, but Well, I hope so.

I just didn't want to ruin the surprise. So what are you talking about? What kind of bag? What kind of price?

Uh, $3,000 to $4,000.

It's a nice bag.

What is it?

Uh, it's a Louis. Louis? Louis Vuitton bag.

I gotta tell you, nothing makes a woman happier than a Louis. Oh, good to hear. I speak from experience. I surprised Stacy. I walked her by the Louis store one day, and I was just kind of hemming and hawing. I go, let's just go in here and look. And she did the whole, we're not gonna get a bag. I go, I know, but let's just go look. And I got her the bag.

Nice, nice.

All right, George, you're nerding out here, I can feel you right now. What are your numbers? George wants to run through the numbers.

Do you have the money?

Yes.

Okay, and that's outside of an emergency fund? Correct. Obviously. And is this a large part of your world or net worth?

It would not be, no sir.

You could burn 3 grand on the table? And you'd be like, all right, that stinks, but I'm going to be just fine.

It would stink, but we would be okay.

I mean, that's, that's about as far as I need to go to give you the green light.

Okay, get the bag.

Rachel, what do you think?

What do I think?

You're a bad guy.

Christopher, Christopher, what do you think I think?

Send it, buy it, get it, do it.

Oh, for sure, for sure. And she'll have it for a long time and it's going to be wonderful. 'Cause you guys have worked hard. I mean, honestly, a lot of people, when they get to Baby Steps 4 through 6, it's really hard for them to spend money. And so, understanding of living life with an open hand and actually enjoying your money, that's a gift. Like, that is fun. And so, some people, again, may roll their eyes at a bag, or they may roll their eyes at what you spend on a vacation, or they'll roll their eyes at whatever it may be. One of the things I roll my eyes at, if I'm being honest, is like, kid birthday parties. Like 2-year-olds where it looks like a wedding reception. I roll my eyes, but it's not a values, it's not a right or wrong, right? If you have the money for it, some people will not understand why you would ever buy a bag that expensive, but that's what she values and that's great. It's not a moral issue. You have the money, do it. Louis.

Cool. Thank you guys.

Love it.

Yes.

Great job.

And I would say this, like, do it in your way, but like don't just show up with it. Put a little effort into it. You know what I mean? Whatever that is.

Rachel's got an idea.

Oh yes. Yes.

Okay.

I love planning a surprise. I'm gonna see where this goes.

'Cause a designer bag that nice, it's gonna have beautiful packaging. Okay? So you're, you're, the bag is gonna be huge and then the box that it comes in is gonna be fantastic. And then it comes in another sack. It comes in a whole cloth. Let her, let her, don't just take it out of all that and give it to her. She needs to do the whole experience. If it's a gift, like let her open it, open that box. Oh, it's just like an Apple product on steroids.

Can I yes and this?

It's not an iPhone, it's a Louie, can I yes and this?

Because I think that's great. Everything she said. I'm going to add one thing. Is there something like very household functional, a little bit bigger? Maybe it's, maybe it's something, an antique or something she's been looking at or something that would be like in a large nondescript bag or box that maybe she wants that you guys have been talking about. We need to get like a fridge for the garage or, you know what I'm saying? Do you see where I'm going?

Yes, sir.

All right. So the idea is it's a misdirection.

I like that.

And you do everything that Rachel said, except that it's like, let's say you were talking about a garage freezer, just because I gotta give you something tactical. And so you're like, babe, you're not gonna believe this. I went to the Scratch and Dent and I found a garage freezer for $70. And she goes, oh, get it. And you're like, I'm bringing it. You gotta look at this thing. It's unbelievable. She's like, I don't need to open the— I said, babe, you gotta check this freezer out. It's unbelievable. She opens what she thinks is a freezer box and it's a Louie box. Louie box.

Gotcha.

Misdirection makes the surprise better.

I have a tactical question. How are you gonna spend that money without her knowing?

So we've talked about it and it's, it's more of like a, I mean, cuz we do, the finances are combined, so she would know. So it's more of a, hey, don't look at it this week, I guess.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Does she check the savings? Is she like, Very much aware of what's in savings on a constant basis?

Yes, but she's more of a weekly checker. She doesn't obsess over it.

Perfect. So she doesn't get an alert, right?

No.

Okay, here's my point. You don't, just get it and write home.

Oh, I had an idea. Boom, boom. Can I pitch my idea? You got a Fairwinds Credit Union account yet?

I don't.

Okay, here's my idea.

Nice product placement, George.

Just open the Smart Bundle. Here it is though, you open the Smart Bundle, transfer the money there and use that Ramsey debit card to purchase it. And then hopefully she doesn't even know the savings moved temporarily. Ah, wow.

Open a secret account.

Big brain thinking. Great, George.

I like my approach better.

Mine gets you massive hugs and kisses and, hey babe, don't look at the account. Yeah, it works.

No, no, no, he doesn't have to say don't look at the account because she's not going to look at it that day. So she's not going to look at it. Go buy it.

He goes straight to Louie. He's already got the fridge box and the whole thing planned. It's all seamless. She doesn't even know what hit her.

Just let us know how it goes.

People want to know.

Hey, listen to me. I know how to do this. Do it that way. Hey, give me some love. Great questions, guys. Way to go. All right, next up is Hannah. Where is Hannah? Give Hannah— she gets down to the mic. Where's Hannah?

Oh, she's coming from the front. She's coming from the front. Make your way up, everyone.

Hannah, round of applause.

Good job, Hannah.

Hannah, where are you from?

I'm from Raleigh, North Carolina.

Fantastic. Thanks for coming. What's your question?

My question is, how much should I expect my boyfriend to be paying on an engagement ring?

Ooh, yikes. Y'all are bringing the fastballs tonight.

My boyfriend is here, so you can be generous.

Is this him right here? Oh my goodness. Oh!

I think we need him on the mic too, don't you?

Yeah, we can—

yeah.

I'll do it. I'll do it. I'm a man of the people. I'm going to come down here.

Well, I don't know if you wanted to join her up there.

Do you want to go with her? I think you should go up there. Yeah.

Yes!

This is fantastic.

This is what we need.

Okay, Hannah, Hannah, on the mic real quick. Did he know you were gonna do this?

Uh, I did, yeah.

Oh, so you're willingly participating.

Hey, you got a nice watch there.

Y'all communicate so well.

Didn't expect to be on the mic, but I was willing for her to ask the question.

Okay, I gotta know what kind of watch you're wearing there.

Uh, it's a Tissot.

What's that cost?

It was about a grand.

Oh, okay, just give me a good baseline. Give me a good baseline.

And are you aware that she's expecting a ring, I hope?

Yeah, we've definitely discussed it.

Okay, and have you been planning for this financially?

Yes.

Okay, are you willing to tell us right here and now how much you've been planning to spend? Or would you like to keep that private?

Oh yeah.

I've been told kind of like 2 to 3 months' salary.

Who told you?

Who told you that?

Parents.

Every kiss begins with K?

No.

Okay.

Just friends and parents, I would say.

De Beers?

Yeah, well, that's a lot of marketing.

That's a lot. 2 to 3 months.

That's a lot.

Yeah, what do you—

I think that's the average, that is what they say.

I'm in tech sales.

Oh, you're gonna get a nice ring, sweetheart.

Yeah, well, do you have any debt?

No, debt-free.

He has a family friend who works for Diamonds Direct as well.

So you're getting a deal?

Debt-free and Diamonds Direct connection.

Okay, and have you— She's teeing it up.

Yes, she is.

Have you two talked about a price? You have?

Uh, I bet not.

She's talked about the size of the ring that she wants.

So Hannah, are you aware of what said size costs?

Nope.

Let's be honest, do you really think he would give you a ring that you'd be disappointed with?

No.

I think it's a moot point then.

All right, well, I want to dig a little more. This is too juicy. Uh, what is your name, sir?

Uh, Jeff.

Jeff, uh, have you—

Y'all are adorable, by the way.

I'm rooting for this couple already.

They're fantastic. I am too. You guys are a handsome couple. Uh, have you went and looked at the size ring that she wants and priced it?

Uh, we've went and looked, but I haven't really priced it now.

I think you should price it.

Yeah.

And then, George, after he prices it, we don't know what we're dealing with, and we're trying to keep a little bit of mystery here, although Hannah has put this poor boy on the spot.

Yeah, it's a little too late. I mean, he has to put a ring on.

Oh my gosh. I would price it I would price it, and I don't know, George, if I like that 2 to 3 months salary business. That feels artificial.

That's a very—

well, we got a call on the Ramsey Show. This guy wanted to spend $80,000 on a ring. So there is a level where it's like out of control.

Okay, back to our values thing, y'all. If he made $15 million a year, who cares? I mean, do you know what I'm saying? That's why the salary of what you make per month is a good gage of it.

My heart says I'm not gonna make $15 million.

Trust your instincts. A month salary is plenty.

Yeah. Well, here's— I think we may have varying opinions. I'll vote and say I think you need to go price it and price it multiple times. Talk to your buddy, say, here's the situation. Hannah's amazing. This is what she wants. This is what I feel comfortable with. Because I think you know in your mind what a comfortable number is, don't you? You're a responsible young man.

I would say so.

All right. I would— if you can't get her what she wants, you get her something close and we have a fine conversation about it. And Hannah, You want to marry this man, do you not?

Yes.

All right, are you going to be happy with what beautiful ring he gets you?

Yes.

All right, then that's it.

Right now?

No, no, you gotta wait, Hannah. Let this man come up with a plan.

The simplest answer is, how much should you spend? How much you can afford at the time you want to propose. That's it.

And then you—

that's it.

And then factor in, depending on your situation, if you guys have to pay for the wedding, the honeymoon, do you want a down payment on a house? I mean, you know, like, the— at the money at At that point, all is put into a big bowl and saying, how do we want to divvy this up? And you guys need to talk about that, to say, what are our values? What are our goals?

What's the priority?

Yeah, what's the priority?

I gotta tell you, I'm a little irritated.

Why, Ken Coleman?

I think there needs to be more mystery among this young generation. Why are we even talking about this?

You're the one that told him to go up to the mic!

Because she asked the question in front of everybody! I don't want you two talking about this! Hannah, relax!

I'm with Rachel. Like, I think you need to put it all in a bucket and then divvy it out. And I would much rather be on a beautiful diamond than maybe a wedding venue or a dress or other things.

We'll see.

Okay.

A mortgage that would take priority.

All right. All I'm saying, I'm having fun. I'm, I'm truly not irritated, but I'm slightly irritated because I do think there needs to be mystery. And I think the young man should get a little information from you and then you just need to go about your life and let him come up with a plan. Let him buy a nice ring. We got too much planning going on. Where's the romance?

How old are you guys? How old are you?

I'm 26.

Yeah, 27.

Yeah.

Okay.

What does that have to do with it?

Because they're hardworking, late 20s. They know what they want in life so they can have grown-up conversations of where we want our money to go as a couple.

I didn't say that. I was talking about the mystery around the engagement.

The way the engagement happens can be the mystery.

That's the mystery. But to decide of how much—

That's what I'm talking about.

But how much money we want to spend on a ring, that can be talked about. Okay. I'm okay with that.

As long as you pay cash.

That's my thing. And in 2 years, it's— you're gonna be fine. You know what I mean? Or, Hannah, you may be slightly disappointed with the size, I don't know, but then in 10 years, you can upgrade a ring, or in 20 years, right? Like, it doesn't— it's great. So, it's fine. But I do like the month. I like basing it on what you make per year. I like that. I like that model. Blame it on Kay's, but I don't like it.

Who's with me, who'd like to see a little more mystery? Woo!

He's trying to rally everyone to get on his side now.

Leave the poor couple alone. This is going out to the YouTube millions. I want a good message out there amongst the crowd. Loud and clear. Hey, you guys are fun sports. I'm having a little bit of fun, but kind of serious. Give them a big hand. Congratulations, you guys.

Good job.

Wow.

That was fun.

We need a little dissension up here every once in a while so we cover it from every angle.

Yeah, I don't think any of us agreed on exactly what to do there, but I think we got there.

I think we got there. It was lovely.

We left them confused and in love.

That's it. That's it.

As it should be.

Okay, our next question is Nora. Where is Nora? Give her some love as she gets to the mic. There she is.

Nora!

Hi, Nora.

Hello.

Where are you from?

Raleigh, North Carolina.

Nice.

I'm a nurse feeling burnt out from working so much overtime, even though I'm trying to stay focused on paying my remaining 76 "Student loans. I've already paid $83,000, but I'm exhausted. How can I manage burnout, stay motivated, and help my partner understand why becoming debt-free matters so much to me?" Wow, good for you.

First of all, this is a nurse who's working absolutely herself to the bone to get out of debt. Let's give her some much-needed love. That's great. So, what's your expected payoff date? If you continue at the pace you're on right now, when would you be debt-free?

December of next year.

Okay. And how much have you paid off so far?

$83,000.

Amazing. Is there tension with your partner relationally because you're always working? Is that why you brought this up? Kind of like, how do I help my partner? Give me more on that deal.

What don't they understand?

Yeah, I pay obviously a lot towards my student loans. Like, my whole check goes towards it. And he doesn't understand why not just pay the minimum and just save the rest.

Have you walked him through the why behind the baby steps? Blame it on Ramsey and all of us. Oh, you rolled your eyes. That's not good. What happened there?

Why does he hate me?

Be honest.

He thinks it's a cult.

There we go.

You know, it's interesting, I've never heard that before. Yeah, well, I get it. And it's not our fault, it's the way you people act. No, I'm kidding, that's terrible, I'm kidding. Okay, well, you're not married, so he doesn't get a vote. You know, we teach separate finances, so that's a relational issue. And I think as you continue to get free, hopefully he begins to catch a vision for it. I think the thing that you have to do, and I want them to weigh in, I would just quickly say, I love the payoff date. I love the goal. I love the Gazelle intensity. But you have to listen to your heart and you have to listen to your mind and you have to listen to your body. And you aren't all of a sudden a bad, lazy, fake Gazelle intense person who's not worthy of the Baby Steps. And you're not working if you have to dial it back a little bit. You know what I mean? Like, it is— it is not about the length of time that we preach. It is about the intentionality that we preach. And I, we've done so many debt-free screens where people have taken 6 and 7 years.

So I think if you're starting to get to a place of physical and emotional and maybe spiritual and relationship exhaustion, dial it back a little bit, you know, until you can get back up on your feet. I, I'm curious to know what you all think. Yeah.

Well, it's amazing what 2 months would do if you're like, okay, I'm not gonna work extra for 2 months and give myself breathing room and then press play again. Right. And you're kind of this off and on, if that's helpful. Or when you get to a certain dollar amount of debt payoff to say, okay, once I reach this, once I reach $50,000 left, I'm gonna take a breather, and I'm gonna not work extra for 30 days, 60 days, and that's okay. And then you press play again, right? 'Cause there's a level of a marathon. You know, we always say the average person pays off their consumer debt in 12 to 18 months, is what we have found in all of our research. But again, that plugs in people that pay off their consumer debt in 8 years, and that's people that just find us randomly, and they have the money to pay off their debt, and they're done within 30 minutes, right? So, that span is really big. So, the people on the more marathon side, to Ken's point, It's okay to take a step back and just have a breather and still continue on your plan.

But if you kind of put some of those rest periods in for you, for some people, they're like, "Oh gosh, I need a nice dinner out." And that's like a relief, whatever that looks like for you to have that. And then the relational side is, yes, ideally he would see that and be on board, but I want you to feel validated in your decisions. And so I don't want this to be a point of tension for you guys because you feel like you are working your butt off and no one sees you in it, right? When you have a relationship and you have a man in your life that could look at you and be cheering you on. So that's more of my problem. I'd wish value-wise he lined up with you, but more of how he treats you in the process, I hope is great. That's my prayer for you.

I mean, you guys nailed it. The one thing I would do is just calculate and go, okay, I'm gonna pay it off April of '28 instead of December of '27 if I slow this down. And I think that'll help you realize, okay, it's an extra few months until I'm debt-free. We're still gonna celebrate you just as much. Hard no matter what when you come do your debt-free scream. So I think release whatever pressure you've put on yourself to hit the self-imposed deadline. And that's coming from a guy who's probably the nerdiest and most intense. So you're doing amazing. Keep it up.

Way to go, Nora. Good job.

Well done. Well done.

All right, so, uh, this is fun. We've got a write-in question, and this came in from Dwayne. This is Dwayne's question: At what point in our lives after 65 years of age Do we become self-insured?

Okay, so let's cover what they're talking about here for those that aren't aware, or those watching at home. When we talk about term life insurance, it's to replace your income if something were to happen to you for those that rely on your income. So that's a spouse, kids. So what we talk about is getting 15 or 20 years in a term life policy so that after those 20 years are done, you've been following the Baby Steps, you've paid off your house, you've been investing for 2 decades, you have enough in your nest egg and savings where you're self-insured, meaning the policy could end and you have enough to cover your family if something were to happen. So that's the simplest answer. At what point in your lives are you self-insured? When you could drop the policy, and if you were to croak today, God forbid, your family would be just fine living off of your retirement accounts and savings.

All right, I love it. And so Zander, by the way, great place for people to go. We had a young guy in the pre-show was asking about—

he's 34 years of age, Yeah, you're saying I'm single, do I need term life?

I'm single, do I need insurance?

So, and I told them go get a quote online, 'cause you'll find it's much cheaper when you're young and healthy. Yeah. And a lot of you know that as you get older and there's health conditions, it becomes more difficult and more expensive. And so this is something really affordable, especially compared to a trash insurance we call whole life, permanent life insurance. Term life is a fraction of the cost. You wanna aim for 10 to 12 times your annual income. And then your spouse, aim for 10 to 12 times their income. And if they're a stay-at-home spouse, you need at least a half million dollar policy. 'Cause you gotta hire Mary Poppins to run the house. To replace everything they do.

Yes, I would say even more for stay-at-home spouses. We say half a million, but depending on the age of your kids— That's the baseline. Yeah, that's the baseline.

And your household expenses.

That's right, absolutely. So, and Zander is great because they go and shop multiple companies. You're not just looking at one. And so, that's the one Winston and I use. But it's great 'cause they price it out. You get to see the prices of everything. You get to pick it, and it's wonderful. So, it is so inexpensive. It's some of the saddest calls that we get on Ramsey Show if someone has passed away, a spouse has, and they call in and that spouse me, you know, even if it was a stay-at-home parent, stay-at-home mom, and she has to go back into the workforce because they have nothing, and she, the kids, and it's just heartbreaking.

So, it's really hard to help people. And some people have it through their employer, and they go, "Well, I don't need it on my own." And I go, "How much is through your employer?" They go, "$50,000." I go, "Well, that'll cover 'em for a year if they're lucky. You need 10 to 12 times your income, and it needs to be outside of your employer 'cause your employment can change." So, zander.com is the place to go.

Yeah, that's with a Z. For all of you, and been around over 99 years. We've been with them for 30 years at Ramsey. Fantastic people. Tell them we sent you. They'll take great care of you.

While we're here in Charlotte, I thought I'd get some fresh air and hit the streets to find out how people are handling their money. What does financial success look like for you?

Not paying attention to the price of things.

You look at the steak first, price second. Maybe I'll skip the appetizer and cocktail, just stick to the ribeye.

Never skip the appetizer. You've got enough saved for retirement, you've got an emergency fund. Yeah, short-term focus, but also having like the long-term vision of you don't want to You want to be able to not work for the rest of your life. Having peace of mind. Having a retirement fund that will allow me and my family to have some fun at the end of the day and to kind of pass on generational wealth. No debt, except for maybe the only debt I think you should probably carry is your mortgage.

Are you there?

Yes.

How long you been consumer debt-free?

20 years.

Yeah.

To be able to have free time not based on my effort.

So without you doing anything—

Yes.

Free time.

You got all the time in the world.

Yes.

Having enough to feed my family. I don't want to eat myself at the end of the month.

So just satiated. So low expectations, that's the key to financial success for you.

Expectations on the floor, yeah.

Wow, okay.

Yeah.

How about you?

You have to pretend that money isn't real. It's pretty impossible to live by yourself, but I think that success to me is being able to live on your own.

Being able to travel when you want and, you know, being able to raise a family. I think those are two things that I value right now.

The freedom to take a day off and not have to worry about, you know, do I have enough PTO, do I have enough saved up that I don't need to worry about anything. Can I go get my nails done? Can I have breakfast? That kind of thing.

So live your life, take the day off and not go, I can't miss that paycheck.

Yes.

I want to know how many single people are in here.

Oh, that's fun. Whoa!

Shut up. Okay, okay, now I didn't expect this. Single people stand up for a second. Oh!

By the way, oh my goodness! They're looking around.

Look around.

What is happening here? Hold still. Well, I didn't say sit down. Right here. Do you two know each other? Just met tonight. Just met tonight? Can I ask you a question, sir? How old are you? Yeah, it was a very clear question. 58. 58. You look fantastic, by the way. Ma'am, I would never normally do this, but how old are you? 56.

That's serendipitous.

What else would you all like to ask them?

That's it.

No, I—

What baby step are you on? You gotta—

you know what, the rest of you can sit down. Everybody else sit down. You two stay up. This is exciting. Oh boy!

All right, are you a Baby Steps millionaire?

Just hang with us. Are you in Baby Steps 7? You're in 7? Oh my gosh!

Here's what that means. They don't need each other's money.

They don't need each other just long—

No gold diggers. This is what we call an even playing ground. How would you— I'm just— this is getting to the next level. This is exciting. How would you describe your personality? Be brief. Fun and energetic and yeah, easygoing.

Yeah.

Excuse me. How would you describe your personality?

Type A, boring, seductive.

Opposites attract. Yes.

Yes.

I like that.

I like it.

It's gonna work. Are you okay if I do just a couple more fun prying questions? How long have you been single? Quite a while. How long have you been single?

About 20 years.

Oh my gosh. Okay, here's what I'm going to do. I'll stop because I'm getting— I've been married 28 years, so I'm feeling something here and I need to obey it. If you guys want to go out, if you want to, I'm not even going to make you say anything more, but if you guys You know, talk amongst yourselves during the show. If you want to go out, Ramsey Solutions will pay for your first date. Love it. All right, you can be seated.

This is great.

Well done.

Yeah.

Okay, so, uh, you all are asking us questions throughout the night, and we love that, but we thought it would be fun— we were talking with the team, we were talking amongst ourselves— we thought, what if we flew flip the script a little bit and we ask you all some questions. So this is like, you know, we're going to see what you all think about some stuff. You guys up for that? Yeah. Okay. Now this is for the brave people, right? We're looking for the big personalities who are willing to share some stuff with us. Okay.

So, and you want to just yell it out from your seat.

They don't need to go up to the mics. So we're going to have to be patient with each other as you yell out.

So raise your hand, we'll call on you.

So we're going to start with a fun one. What's the dumbest thing you have ever done with money? Who wants to share a dumb thing?

Kind of a stupid thing.

Right here is half. Sir, stand up and project. No, no, no, no, no, stay there. You're not coming up here. We have security. You'll get tased. No, just, you're going to yell it out.

You saw a tweaker approach.

All right, go ahead.

Snapple.

Snap.

Snap-on tools. I thought he said Snapple.

So did I. I was like, that's a rather refreshing beverage.

How much money did you blow on Snapple?

Snap-on. What was dumb about Snap-on? Start now, obviously I had no tools starting out when I was 16, and from 16 to now I had probably $50,000 in debt. How old are you now?

22. So 16 to 22, you dropped 50 grand on these Snap-on tools, and you're still in debt?

I'm close to being paid off.

Nice, close to being paid off.

Love to hear that. Thank you, sir, for sharing your dumb, but you're about to pay the tools off. And are you making good money with said tools? Uh, yeah. How much? I'm $31 an hour right now. $31 an hour?

It's like $64,000 or so.

$64,000. And what do you do?

Uh, diesel mechanic.

Diesel mechanic. Diesel mechanic. Are you single? Girlfriend. Girlfriend.

Ah, there she is.

Taken, ladies.

He's taken. All right. Okay, thank you, sir.

That's good.

Who else has got a— do we want another one of those? We got several.

Yeah, I'll take one. We got one up front.

I was debt-free, and then last year I went into $22,000 worth of debt for an ex-boyfriend because, yeah, it's just dumb.

For an ex-boyfriend?

Houses that he was trying to—

We need a story.

This feels like a Mike situation.

Go to the mic. This requires follow-up right here, ma'am. He's coming to you. We're going to—

we'll figure it out.

Bring it to you.

Oh, such service.

Do you all mind passing the mic? Okay, so let me set this up. She was debt-free. And then she gets with a deadbeat guy.

I probably got emotional like 3 times since being here, 'cause I'm just thinking about how like, I don't know, talking to a therapist, they're like, "I made a mistake, it was an expensive one, you move forward." But long story short, debt-free. Boyfriend last year had a really good job making like $15,000 a month, then lost my job, and it was because of our relationship, and took out $22,000 for debt. To help him. I mean, I remember the first thing was like he needed me to buy a refrigerator for one of his homes.

And like—

One of his homes, plural. But he was too broke to afford it.

3 of them. And because he has a real bad addiction problem and—

Aw.

And I was just trying to help him. Well, not help him with the thing, but help him through the addiction because he made so much money. He would make like $14,000, $20,000 a week and just spend it between like drugs, gambling.

Oh my God.

I'm so sorry. I'm glad you're not with him.

Yeah, so it's over. Yeah, it's over, and I'm just like—

Are you working to pay off the debt, or do you still have it?

So, because, so I worked at the casino. I hadn't worked in 6 months, and I still been knocking out debt and stuff like that. And so hopefully I just talked to my old managers, and hopefully for the summer, the kids, when the kids get out of school, I go back. That's my goal, just to get back on track.

Go girl, we're cheering you on.

Can I tell you something?

Yeah.

You've done it before.

How much debt did you pay off the first time? The first time?

I paid off $20,000.

Okay, so what's $2,000 more? You got this.

It's just like you said, guilt and shame and the baggage of it.

Disappoint—

yeah, because I'm like, wow, I was just right there and just ready to just—

it's okay.

And I was making, I, I think like decent amount of money and I loved my job. And so it's just like, hey, listen, no more shame tonight.

So hey, look at me, no more shame, no more shame. You're a good person who loved a guy and you got sucked into a tough situation and you've learned from it. You paid off 22 of 20 before. You can pay off the 22. Everybody in this room is completely behind you. Are you guys behind her? Thank you. Yeah, you got this. Good job. Thank you. All right, do we have another fun question, George? Do you have a flip the script question?

Yeah, I want, there's some crazy people out here. So here's what I wanna know. What is the craziest thing you've done to pay off debt? The thing that you would tell someone and they're like, I'm sorry, you did what now?

Now keep it family friendly. We're a family show.

We gotta, be able to air this on YouTube.

Yeah, that's it.

But I want to know what's something you did that other people would kind of have a head tilt at. Anyone sell a horse? Could you sell the horse?

Yeah, it could be what you sold, what you did lifestyle-wise, maybe side hustle, something, sacrifice.

Raise your hand right back here, sir.

We have a—

stand up and just stand up and give us real loud, like big old voice. I took care of somebody else's horses before and after work. Yeah, let's go!

So you were a horse babysitter?

That's amazing. All right, that's okay. That's pretty good. Anybody, any crazy, like wacky stories of getting out of debt? You did something to pay off debt?

There was a girl we talked to and she would do all of her, she would blow dry her hair in her apartment hallway so she didn't have to pay for utilities.

Plug it into the hallway.

Like things like that. Anything crazy.

Making your own soaps.

Yeah.

Okay, I got one. We need a little, we need to introduce a little more tension into this room. Oh boy. What's an argument that you had about money with your spouse or your partner? Anybody got the— what's the last argument you had over money? Look at everybody clamming up. Anybody? Right here, we got one. Oh, I like— I see that hand, sir.

Is the spouse here?

Yeah, hold on, we're getting the mic. I got a feeling. Are you guys together? Are you guys together there? What was the argument?

Combining finances.

And did you want to or not to, sir?

I'm wanting to.

Uh-oh.

Wanting.

Oh, that's current.

That's present.

Sounds like the argument hasn't been settled, or maybe it has been settled. But ma'am, go ahead. Stands to be corrected. Ma'am, what's the story? Ma'am, I see you.

You know we can see you, right?

She thinks that the post is hiding her. I'm going to step out here. Go ahead. Go ahead, put the mic over there. She said no. No to the mic.

Yeah.

That is your right, ma'am.

Thank you very much.

All right. Well, sir, based on that response, I don't like your situation. You're gonna have to keep casting vision. Okay, so let's bring this back. We get this call a lot on the show. And we're having a little fun with you, ma'am. You're a great sport. But this is a real tension we get the call all the time. Let's talk about the dynamic. What's going on? We don't need to know their situation, but we kind of know what's going on. This is a big deal, George. George, Rachel, why— what's happening here?

I found there's several reasons for it, and usually the person who wants to combine hasn't done a good enough job asking questions to dig into those reasons for them to feel seen and heard, to go, oh, I actually understand why you feel that way. The way you grew up, it was scarcity, or there was trauma, or there was a divorce, and my parent or friend wasn't safe because they had combined finances and it put them in a precarious situation. The more you can ask questions and dig, the more we can get to some empathy and understanding. And then they need to be asking you about why are you wanting to combine finances? What is the upside here? And there's a give and take there. It's a dance, and it usually takes people a while to get there. It's not a single conversation.

And I think what's hard too is when people hear combined finances, they're thinking just the numbers, the tactical side of, oh, we're gonna combine accounts and do a budget together and that's it. And they miss the real benefit of it. Like when you really do, when you combine finances, is you are combining on so much of your life. You are saying, ultimately, I am yielding with this person that I've chosen to spend my life with, and I'm going to choose to do this part of my life that kind of feels vulnerable. And especially if you get married later, which I understand that you're used to paying bills the way you pay them, you do your budget the way you do it. I mean, it's just you are— you have your thing. And then this other person comes in and it's so different. It's so hard. You're like, gosh, it would just be easier if we just were still on two separate tracks. And I still love you and it's fine. But what you miss is that connection point that happens from a vulnerable standpoint to say, no, I really am combining every part of me in this, this place that feels so scary.

I'm actually going to say, yeah, we are going to become one. And it's amazing to me how many, especially debt-free couples we get, and they say constantly how their marriage is better. They're like, you know, you saved our marriage. And we're thinking, we didn't teach a marriage class, right? Like, this wasn't what we were talking about. We're talking about money, but money is a very, very vulnerable place and it's a very revealing place in our lives. Like even when you look through Scripture, you know what the Bible says about it. I mean, it speaks so much to who you are as a person. So not only do you miss out on knowing that part of your spouse when you don't combine money, but also you miss actually grafting together a life where you're like, yeah, this is our household and we're going to run it together. You miss that when you're, when you're running two separate lanes.

Tactically, it's a wealth multiplier. Better when you combine finances and you're going in the same direction instead of going, well, that's her money and I don't know what she's got going on, that's her business. Well, that's where a lot of this financial infidelity happens versus the transparency which causes you to feel more connected, which causes you to build trust, which is the foundation of a relationship. And so I would encourage anyone to try it, unless you have good reason not to, and we've had those calls.

Uh, addiction, seriously addiction. Yeah, addiction, keep it separate. Yes, there are some some big red flags in a relationship that it is not safe for you to, and we totally understand that. But for the other run-of-the-mill couples, yeah, do it.

I'm reminded about how much fun it is to be in the room with people. When we're in the show and in the studio in Nashville, we don't get to see— and this is so much fun. I just want to take a quick moment. We can't do The Ramsey Show Live tour without our friends at Fairwinds Credit Union. They're so awesome, such a great partner for The Ramsey Show. So I just want to say thanks. To whatever nameless executive gave us the green light for this. We're very thankful for that. So give them some love. Love Fairwinds, they're awesome organization. Up next, Roxanne and Luke are coming to the mic. There they are. So hi folks, how are you?

We're doing great.

We're from Concord, North Carolina, just north of here, the home of NASCAR. That's right.

I know these things. Rachel, did you know that?

I did not, Ken.

Thank you. You know what else she didn't know? Did you know that Charlotte's the Queen City? I had to tell her that too.

Ken is like our old man. He always, on the Ramsey Show, he's like, "From the Motor City, Detroit, we've got Alan calling. From the Big Apple, Jason's calling." He loves it.

So he's like, "The Queen City." I do, I do love a little historical reference.

Sorry, we're going off.

We're off track. We are here for you. Back to our friends from Concord. What's your question?

All right, so this is my 18-year-old son, Luke. He'll be graduating high school in just about 6 weeks.

All right, Luke! Woo-hoo! Yeah!

And my question is, as a parent, how do you steward your growing children well without micromanaging their disposable income? And just a tiny bit of context, we are huge Ramsey fans. Luke has been working since he he was 14, and our rule from paycheck one was you save 50%, you can spend 40%, and you give 10%. So he has a lot of disposable income, and I feel like he makes purchases that, from my perspective, are excessive. And yet I don't want to micromanage him as his mom.

Yeah, well, you kind of sort of answered your question in that last statement. Uh, you are a mature, successful adult adult who happens to be his mom. He is an 18-year-old boy with— God bless you, your frontal lobe is still developing.

Yeah.

And he appreciates that. So I, I think that from my perspective is the part where you're gonna have to release a little bit. Now I, I'm going to tell you how I— I've got 3. I've got a 20-year-old in college in Chicago who literally can't keep money in his account longer than 17 seconds. And then I've got a middle son who has 3 grand in his account and won't spend it on anything. And then I have a daughter who's 17 who's just like the 20-year-old. So one of the things that I've had to, just as a dad, to learn is I can teach, I can show and model, and then I can console when they're broke. And, and so my, my oldest and my youngest, I— and this is not my wife's natural path. She wants to do what you're doing. How can I help control and do all this kind of stuff? And it's really wonderful. But I have found that my 20-year-old is beginning to learn the value of money because of the allocated money he gets versus his job, his part-time job. And when he's broke and he calls me, I just go, man, that stinks, buddy.

And now it's kind of a joke, and at first it made him mad, now he kind of gets it, and now the calls aren't even coming in. And he is finding a way. And so I think in some ways you've done a wonderful job, and you got to let that young man figure it out. And I think the best teacher in life is failure.

Luke, I'm curious, what set expenses purchases are you buying that your mom would say is excessive?

Like an iPad or cologne, headphones, pens, anything.

Is that within the 40% that's kind of allocated here? Step up to the mic.

Can you get closer to the mic, Luke? Yeah, that's in the 40%. Yes. Mom, what do you want him to do with the— instead of the iPad and the cologne? Those don't seem outrageous to me.

No, the iPad—

He gets it.

Yeah.

Ken loves a cologne.

I like to smell good. I'm not going to lie to you.

Yeah, well, it's like I would not spend as much on perfume or cologne as he did. And it brought him great joy. But I was thinking, oh, that's a lot of money. And we had different upbringings. I grew up with very, very little. And I've done pretty well for him. I think the deeper concern I have is I don't want him to be purchasing those items to impress others. And what I sometimes hear, and he's such a great kid, is, hey, I just got this cologne and here's how much it cost, as he's talking to his friends. And I'm like, if you love it and you want it, then purchase it, but not for the praise or the affirmation from others.

And I think that's very fair because that is a, that is a contentment loop that That only though can be broken by you, Luke. Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

I mean, honestly, it— that's something that can't be learned up here. That's something that's gonna have to happen. So, I'm a spender like you, so I feel ya. So, a question I ask myself a lot is, before I make this purchase, I think, if nobody sees this purchase, do I still want it? So, the idea of how much of my motivation is for others or for affirmation, whatever the thing is. But if nobody was to see it, how much of this is just for me? Because back to our point of like rolling the eyes of like the kid's birthday party or whatever it may be, right? People are gonna value different things and people are gonna say, oh my gosh, I would never spend X on a car. I would never spend X on per— like, and that's, it's not immoral, but that's people, what they value. And that's not necessarily wrong. But if there is a belief that this thing is going to make me happy or what I get from it, if I impress someone with the price tag, right? With that example she just used, issues, yeah, you'll be a rat in a wheel for the rest of your life running and getting nowhere.

And if the newness of stuff is what funds your happiness, again, there will be deep discontentment for the rest of your life and you'll be chasing the wrong thing and the finish line keeps moving. You think, if I just could have this, I can get that, or if it moves this way, you know, I gotta, I gotta catch up to this. So that's something though that I think is learned through life experience. I hate to say it, but I think that's a spiritual exercise. Wise more than anything. But the math side, George, of the investment side, right, if you actually invested some of this money, what that turns into is, is pretty astronomical. And I know you're already saving a lot, Luke, which is great.

Where are you saving exactly? All right, is it in a savings account?

Savings account.

Okay, what is your— what's your, uh, your end game here? Are you wanting to, to build wealth and have some autonomy and freedom as a young man?

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely.

And do you see investing as a path to get there?

Yes, absolutely.

Well, let's crunch the numbers for you here. You're a young man, 18. You got all the time in the world on your side, and you have time to fail, you got time to make the mistakes, but if you just went, hey, you know what, what if I, instead of buying that next doodad, I instead put that in a Roth IRA, 'cause you're earning income, have you done that before?

I have not, no.

Alright, I'm gonna show you using our investment calculator.

Can we do his real numbers?

I'm gonna use your real numbers, if you're willing to give it to me.

Me?

Like savings or what?

Yes, you have nothing in retirement now, no investment accounts. How much can you put away a month into investing?

I don't know the exact number on that.

Can you put $500 away?

Yeah, absolutely.

That seemed like a low number to you. You were like, absolutely, that's nothing.

Well, hold on a second. Hold up, Mom is kind of going, um, I'm not sure.

Well, well, what I would say is the, the big purchase that will be coming soon is a car, and we're going to do 50/50. And we've talked about it won't be a brand new car, and there's, you know, there's reason because he, he He has $15,000 saved.

Wow.

He's not, yes.

Yeah.

But he's not getting a $30,000 car to start. So I think he would need to, I think probably about $200 to $300 a month would be good because it would be coming from his disposable income because he's also going to be going to college.

Yeah, he's got short-term goals too.

So George, split the difference, $250.

We're gonna go $250 from age 18 to age, let's say 60. All right, that's like an early retirement for most of America. 18 to 60, you put $250 away into a Roth IRA and make that an on auto to where you never saw the money, it left your account when that paycheck hit, you don't have time to spend it. Here's what you'd have, almost $2 million in that one account at 60. If you just did that, that's if you never got a raise, never put in more than that, and that's tax-free withdrawals if it's in a Roth side, 'cause you used after-tax income to invest it. Invested. So that's like take-home pay. Think about it that way. That's a pretty good life at 60 without really doing much. You sort of had it on auto, and $250 for you is a drop in the bucket with the money you're already making at 18.

Think about how good you're going to smell then. Oh, yeah.

You could have your own cologne company by then.

Yeah, just rub money all over your face.

I think you got to think about the opportunity cost a little bit. And again, you're 18. I spent every one of my paychecks at 18. 2017, so he's doing astronomically well. So I think it's less about his spending issues. Yes, we need to dig into the motive and contentment, but I think, Mom, there's some control issues. There's some scarcity stuff that you might need to unpack too. So I think there's work on both of your parts to sort of get to the consensus that he's fine. He's doing better than most adults in America. I'm much less worried about him.

And Mom, you have done a great job with this young man. Give them some love. Absolutely.

You guys are awesome.

Great job.

All right. Up next, we've got Bailey. Let's welcome Bailey to the mic. Hi Bailey.

Hi.

Where you from?

Charlotte.

Charlotte. All right, what's your question?

Um, my question is, do you think it's good to invest in real estate now, or should I wait until it goes down further?

Till it goes down further?

Yeah, like if, like, like if the market goes down further.

What, what, uh, evidence are you seeing that that's going to happen.

Um, I'm not—

I'm just wondering your opinion.

Yeah, no, no, and I'm not— yeah, I'm not trying to hang you up on that. I just wanted to know if like you were reading something or what you're sourcing to feel that way. I don't think that that's going to happen, you know. You might have some bubbles in certain areas, but by and large— how old are you?

Um, I'm like student age.

Great, that's a range.

I love that.

You should run for Congress with that answer. I'll vote for you. Thank you.

Somewhere between 7 and 22.

I'm student age. Okay. George, what do you think? Rachel, what do you think?

I was gonna ask Bailey.

Your husband is Mr. Real Estate.

Yeah, I wanna know from you, where have you heard this that you think, oh, this is a really good plan and I need to do this? My parents and some of my teachers in school.

Interesting.

Are you college or high school? High school. High school, okay.

Great.

Good for you.

So where's the urgency coming from for you to own real estate?

Real estate? No, I'm just trying to like, I'm just curious about the topic and I'm trying to plan ahead. Okay, I love that. So, some learning. Okay, so we always say to invest in real estate when you're on Baby Step 7, which means you are completely debt-free, including your primary residence, completely debt-free. You're investing into retirement, 401(k)s, Roth IRAs, you're being smart about retirement from that perspective, 15%. And then above that, you can be investing more in Baby Step 7. And some people choose to invest more in the market. They'll have like a brokerage account index fund or a mutual fund that they'll put their money in. Some people put their money in real estate. And so, the key about real estate investing specifically, so there's the flip side, and then there's the buy and hold. And the buy and hold strategy is that you wanna buy low, so you'd find a short sale or a foreclosure, put some cash in it, all with cash. So, we are all cash at this point. And then you hold it, and you hold it for 20+ years, and then when your kids kids are graduating high school and going to college.

You gotta fund college. That's when some people cash out. They take that equity, fund their life, do what they want with it, or they keep it generationally, whatever that looks like. And then there's the flip side, and the flip side is, again, you buy something really inexpensive, uh, that's really inexpensive, and you put some cash into it, fix it up, sell it for a little bit more. That's a little bit more of a job, I would say. That's more of a part-time job people have versus the holding and the hold strategy, if you will. So there's kind of two ways to do it, but that would be after, yes, I would say after you're out of, if you're going to college or trade school, after all that's paid for, after you have a primary home for yourself and that's paid off and all of it. But it is a great strategy. It is later in the steps for us, but it's a great question.

Please ignore all of the social media trends that are like, you need to own 19 properties by the time you're 25, and here's why, and here's a course to sell you on it. You want to avoid all of that noise out there.

And the noise that it's just passive income. You don't have to do anything. It's not a big deal. You just do it and then you get money. No, you don't. You deal with people. You deal with renters. You deal with contract. You are in it. It's not just passive. And honestly, you don't make as much as quick as you would sometimes even in the market. The real estate market and the stock market sometimes are at odds with each other. So sometimes you can make as much just investing and not doing anything versus putting all your effort into real estate. But I come from a real estate family. My husband loves it, my dad loves it, so I am— I love— I do love real estate, but sometimes could just be easier just to invest, to be honest. That's what George loves.

George loves plans on owning investment property. No thank you. I can't be a landlord. Look at me, who's gonna take me seriously?

You're certainly not going to be able to kick anybody out of their house, that's for sure.

They could take me in But it's a great question. I love that you're thinking about this stuff.

Well done, Bailey.

The future's bright. Thank you. Our next question is brought to you by our friends at Y Refi. If any of you out there are watching, uh, on YouTube and listening, uh, if you've lost control of your private student loan payments, your financial progress has stalled out, we get it. But this is where Y Refi comes in. We love our partnership with them because they help borrowers borrowers explore refinancing options with payments built around their real-life situations. Learn more at yrefy.com/ramsey. George, how do we spell it?

That's the letter Y, yrefy.com/ramsey.

May not be available in all states. How about that? George Kamel, everybody.

Ladies and gentlemen, it's an alley-oop.

There it is. They don't even want to clap for you, they're so used to you doing it. They're impressed that I can spell a 5-letter word. Yeah, cheap applause, cheap Up next, our next question is brought to you by Y Refi. Where's Megan? Let's welcome Megan to the mic. There we go. Hi Megan.

Hey.

Where you from?

I'm from Shelby, North Carolina.

Shelby, North Carolina. What's your question?

So I have an opportunity to pay off $30,000 in debt by working 2 jobs for like 10 to 12 months and I can get it all paid off, but I am a single mother of 2 boys, so I'm trying to weigh if it's worth it to pay it off in that short of a span of time, or if I should try to spread it out.

What is your concern? Is it the boys and being with them?

Yes.

How old are they?

8 and 11.

Who would watch them when you're working and hustling?

My mama.

Your mama?

Yes.

Yes.

So they would be in tremendous care, yes or no?

Yes.

Extra grandma time?

Yes. They're, they're not concerned with it, but I'm cons— I'm, I'm concerned that they won't express that it's bothering them that I'm not around.

Yeah. Have you explained to them that you're in a journey to pay off debt? Have you had that conversation? Obviously in context with an 8-year-old and an 11-year-old.

Yes, I have, but I don't really think they understand the gravity of it.

Yeah. Well, if you're not around as much, they might start to pay attention. To it.

Yes.

I'm going to say it's your call. But if it were me, I think there's an awesome story in it. And I think if those 8-year-old boy, that 8-year-old boy and 11-year-old boy see Mama working so hard and they begin to see that Mama's tired. Mama, why are you working so hard? For you.

Yes.

Explain what I'm doing. And it may not all completely stick, but I think that that intense timeline will take you to another level as a single mom because you're a hero. And I say go for it. The boys are going to be fine. They don't appreciate time like you do. And I do think your mama heart is going to be the hardest part of it and being bone tired. But I'd vote for do it for the story. You know what I mean? It's like the— the things that we press through and the things that shape us are the things that are really hard. And, but I think you're, I think whatever you decide to do, you know, I'm in favor of. That's my, that's my thought. What do y'all think? Rachel, what do you think?

Come on, mama.

Yeah, I mean, I would say number one, you, Ken said it, but you're incredible. Any single parents that do this, it's, that is unbelievable what you do day in and day out. So hear us say that it is such a feat to raise kids. And at those ages, those are exactly, I have kids the exact ages. Nice. And it's just so, I'm exhausted. You know what I mean? And, and to do it day in and day out by yourself, you're incredible. Absolutely incredible. So, they're seeing that, yes, give a round of applause, honestly, it's—

I think there's a much higher chance the story they tell when they're older is, my mom worked her tail off for our family, and not, my mom wasn't around when we were kids.

Yeah, and I would say it's gonna affect you, you already said it, you said it yourself, it's gonna affect you more than it affects them. I mean, honestly, I mean, my dad, which I know is a different situation, But I mean, he was gone a lot. I mean, up until I was probably middle school, building and doing and teaching and traveling and working. I mean, it was constant. And I remember to a point that he set us all down 'cause he was going on a book tour for the first book. And I remember he set us down and it was this big family meeting and it was so heavy. And he was like, I'm gonna be gone. I think it was like close to 45 days to do a big book tour. And I'll be honest, I remember thinking, "Okay." Like, "Okay." So, it's not that they don't care about you, but genuinely, I think if they're with someone that they love, it's gonna just, it's gonna be harder, it's gonna be hardest on you. So, I think if you can get through it, I would. For 10 months, if you were saying 10 years, I'd be like, "No." For 10 months, I think you can do anything.

And forever, ever, amen, the weight of debt, those chains, it's gone. The chains, it's gone completely. And you have changed your family tree. When we talk about changing your family tree, that's it. They're not only watching it, but they're gonna experience a freedom from their mom that you're about to give them. And it's gonna completely affect their life. And I think there's something about that intensity and you just knock it out in 10 months. I would say do it, but I also say with, as a mom, you make the best call for you in that.

Okay.

Megan, we got a fun little award for you.

Okay.

Okay, so you come on down. I'm going to tell the audience what we're giving you. We're giving you the Rice and Beans Award right here. It's real. This is a glass Tupperware, real rice, real beans, haven't been cooked yet. So you just, you just give those to the boys and you explain what you're doing. It's your favorite?

Rice and beans is my favorite.

You were made for this.

I had no idea. Hey, this is a single mama bear who's crushing it. Let her know how we feel about her. Let's go. Yeah, how about that? That's so good. Who knew that the Rice and Beans Award was going to go to her?

And she—

I wish I had something better, something more bougie for you, girl.

Well, now I wish I had cooked them.

I know, so she would have to cook them.

I didn't cook them. So fun. Okay, next, uh, next question Next question is from Raquel. Raquel, where are you? Come on down. Oh, right over here. Give her some love while she gets to the mic.

I gotta say, the ladies are leading the charge tonight.

Where are the men? Where are the men asking questions? By the way, another reminder, are there any couples that need this esteemed panel of judges to get in the middle of something? Go see Katie, she's waiting. Raquel, hi.

Hi.

How are you?

I'm good, thank you.

Where are you from?

Hi, so me and my fiancé are recently engaged, and we just moved up from West Palm Beach, Florida here to Charlotte.

Okay, fantastic. What's your question?

So my question is, in this new journey that we have together, moving together, being engaged, the conversation of finances have definitely come up. So we grew up drastically different, opposites definitely attract, and my relationship with money just in in regards to what my family is like is very drastic than what his family's like and what he's used to and was exposed to. And I think that a lot of people that I talk to in my day-to-day life have the same type of reservations when it comes to money and that talk in general. So I guess my question is layered. What would you say would be something that we can actively do to align our thoughts about money? And what would you give as in, advice to new couples trying to start their life together.

Okay, so let me ask, what's— how did he grow up? Can you paint me a picture of him and then you so we can kind of see what we're working with?

Yes, so my family, I come from an immigrant household. I grew up in Florida, and you know, my mom was very good with money, with what she had. She was very good with budgeting. But on the other side, I had a grandma and a family on my dad's side who made a lot of lot of money, but did not do well managing it. So I had really opposite sides of the spectrum when it came to how they handled their finances, and a lot of misguidance. I'm not gonna lie. Um, his family, however, they grew up in Columbus, Georgia. Um, stay-at-home mom with a hard-working dad. And, um, he— from what I understand, their family, um, saved a lot of money, always had something in the emergency fund, budgeted really hard, hard, but still gave themselves like those little luxuries of like Thanksgiving vacation and things like that. So, but they were always financially conscious.

Okay, so what's the tension point then? What do you feel like is, is that point of tension?

Yeah, there's no tension per se. It's just, it's just like a mindset thing for me. Like I, I guess I had scarcity, would you say, for you? Yes, yes, that's exactly what it is.

Yes, more scarcity. He's more abundant. Abundance. You're more probably— no, I don't want to say stressed. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but you're very aware, know what's going on, and he's like, it's going to be okay, we're fine.

No.

Okay, so tell me, so give me more.

He has a scarcity mindset. And that's exactly— so because of the way that I grew up, I guess I don't really know like what's a good point, like how much is too much frugality and how much is like too much overspending. So I'm still in my personal finance journey trying to figure out what a happy medium is.

So you're kind of an agnostic and then he— you're just kind of like, I'm not sure about this whole money thing.

Yeah.

And he's just like tight, so tight he squeaks.

Yes, he is.

Ah, it's very different, our dynamic. Like I want to give ourselves a little luxuries in life, but he would definitely squeal over the $2 Chipotle guac. Oh yeah, guac, that's all I want.

Boy, I feel like we gotta bring the tightest person I know in the conversation, George Campbell.

Welcome to the party, my man.

This guy won't pay $2 for anything.

I just think it's a ripoff. I'd rather go make guacamole at home.

Oh, boo. That was a flex. You just wanted everybody to know that you know how to make guac.

I don't, but I could if I wanted to.

So, okay, so speaking Speak to her from his perspective, 'cause you get that.

Yeah, my wife to this day is like, hey man, can we not do this frugal game right now to save a buck? But it's just, I find it enjoyable for me, so I don't bring her into it. It's none of her business. She's saving money, she should be happy. But I do think there's a level of this is their personality style, and that part won't change. And then there's an alignment on the values and goals. And that's the part you guys need to focus on, not the minutia of, "Hey, he wants to be frugal in this area." Now, the more it affects you, and the more it's detached from the reality of your financial situation, if you guys are multimillionaires, and he's like, "We can't afford this," that's a different situation than, "Hey, I'd rather not spend money on that. That's not a priority for me, but you can get the guac." That's where I'm going, okay, that's where we need to get to as you guys step into marriage, is being aligned on the values and the goals, and over time, time, you will be doing better financially. So right now he may have good reason to have a scarcity mindset because he doesn't have his family's money, right?

Right. He's starting a new chapter for— on his own.

Here's what I'm feeling. I just want to throw this in there. So I think because you're— we called you in a fun way an agnostic, because you're just kind of figuring out what is my money values.

Yeah.

Because you love him, because you guys are going to do life together, I think it'd be great to lean into him a little bit for a while.

Yeah.

And kind of go, okay, and And then the easiest way— and George, I want you to weigh in, and Rachel too— but I'm sitting here listening going, I think it would be great if you really got serious about budgeting, because the more clear and disciplined your budget is, if you want the $2 guac and he goes— because of how he's wired and the environment that he grew up in, which is all real and totally okay.

Yes.

Then you have a budget. You can remind him, hey, It's totally in there. Am I right?

What's financial? Yeah, I was gonna say, yes, absolutely. 'Cause I think there's the high-level tactical, which may just take care of itself, honestly. So, since you guys are engaged, I would open up a checking account together, and I would put some money in for the wedding, some expenses coming up, and you guys start to practice, what does this feel like to start doing money together? And do a mock budget of both of your salaries. You know what you make, and you guys are gonna, so be like, hey, Hey, let's just for fun, let's make a household budget, what this is gonna look like. Here's mine, here's yours, and like play a game, bring 'em both together and be like, how close are we with this? Because that's gonna say, that's gonna, from a high level, honestly may actually eliminate some of this when you guys are working together on a plan and you're being very specific about where the income's going. So that's big. And then number 2, I would say, 'cause opposites attract, and I know this in my marriage, Ken, same with you and Whitney, I have learned to lean into Winston's strengths and he's learned to lean into mine.

So you're both a gift. You both bring something to the table that the other person needs. So I always say with Winston, if it weren't for Winston, we, I would probably be broke because he is, he's so big on the saving and Excel sheets. But honestly, I look at that now as a wife and I'm so thankful. I feel taken care of honestly that I'm like, thank you for taking care of that side of me. Stuff, because it does, it gives me a level of peace. And then if it weren't for me, he would have no fun in life. Exactly. I bring the fun.

That's what I'm saying.

You know what I mean? I bring the fun. And so, I feel like we're a lot alike.

As a token of friendship to my new friend over here, I have an award for him if you want.

I have an award for her.

This is perfect.

Oh my gosh.

Okay, ladies first.

Ladies first. Go ahead, Rachel.

Okay, I'm gonna give you my award. You're a free spirit. You're like me.

Oh, thank you.

Is this what you want?

Yes, yes, it is.

I want to give you a little a little bottle of champs, a little champagne bottle.

And we're gonna give it to her for both of them. So George, you give her the same one for both.

Alright, I have for your fiancée the Frugal Camel Award. I got this from Goodwill, so just so you know, I didn't even spend full price on this. So give this to him.

Have you a glass tonight?

As a reminder that it's okay to be a little bit, you know, resourceful with your money, as I say.

I like how you glammed cheap up.

I just thought I wanted people to know.

I like— I appreciate that.

I wouldn't have bought that on my own volition.

I know you would not.

Oh, he would have never paid good money for that.

He would have A) tried to barter for it and then asked Ramsey Solutions to pay for it. That's how that went down.

Thank you again.

Yeah, you're awesome. Give her some love. That's good for sharing. Congrats.

Now I think we have a couple, Ken, by the way.

Well, I'm excited, but before we go to our next question, I— one of my favorite things in a I like to scan the crowd, just get a feel what's happening. And I noticed that our single friend next to you, sir, has left her seat. Oh. Oh, she's up to ask a question. Rachel's helping me out. I thought, what did you do?

Did you like swing an arm around and it got uncomfortable?

I mean, I practically set the table for you. So, okay, things are good. There she is. It's Grace, our single friend from the front row. Grace!

Thank you guys for coming to Charlotte to come to us so that we can ask the questions.

You're such a good sport, by the way.

Oh, thank you. My question is how to let the gazelle rest. I started this journey back in 2016 on— when Dave was here for a Smart Money tour. I was one of the volunteers, and that's when I got really sucked into the cult. I drank the Kool-Aid. So I was gazelle intense for about 5 to 6 years, Finally got out of debt, so I got to zero. I was not in the negative anymore. I finally got to zero. I switched careers and cash flowed an electrical degree. And then, now that I am working and having so much fun with what I do as my career, the gazelle is still running. I do not spend money, and I look for coupons. If I go to a 7-Eleven and the soda pop is $1.09, I won't pay for it, 'cause I won't pay more than 99 cents. I've gone too far that way.

Wish I had an extra frugal camel for you back here.

Just came one question too late. So let me dig on that. So let's just, for everybody to know, what's your future look like financially? Your retirement, you're all set, you look beautiful, don't have anything to worry about, is that correct?

Yes, I'm retired military, so that's always there.

By the way, thank you for your service. You're a great American.

And then I have— I'm back to work, 'cause I just love it so much. But it all goes, 100% goes into the 401(k), 457(b), HSA, IRA.

What are you worried about? What are you worried about from your past financially that worries you? Because I think at the source of this is fear.

It is.

I know. What is it? What are you afraid that's gonna happen? Be as specific as you can, and there's zero judgment on what you're about to say. Just let it rip.

That I will end up as my mother.

Ah, there it is. Describe how your mom ended up.

We grew up on a farm, you know, 3 channels, no cable, so we thought we were very poor. But then in the '80s and '90s, the advent of housing developments, we kind of realized that we weren't poor. Mom just liked to sew, she liked to cook from scratch. But after my mom and dad divorced, she didn't have a lot of money, but she didn't aspire to a lot either. She was a very simple woman. But when she got cancer, you don't want to send anybody to a facility that takes Medicaid. So I moved in with her to be her caregiver.

So you don't want to end up as a financial burden to somebody.

—exactly.

I don't want to end up like that. What would have to be true based on your financial situation right now? What would have to happen for you to be a financial burden in your old age? What would have to happen for me to be a financial burden? You're not right now. You're not gonna be. So I'm saying, what would have to happen for you to have no money money to take care of yourself and someone else, what would you have to do?

I'd have to crypto.

Yeah, what are the— and, and sure, that's great. And what else, what else would you have to do? Gamble. Gamble. I like that.

Deplete all of your investment accounts completely. Yeah, you'd have to do that, right?

That's what it's called. It's not a trick I'm, I'm, I'm painting you into a corner to see that it's a 0% chance of you squandering what you have saved. True or false? True. So you're free.

There's a much higher chance when you pass, you will have millions and millions sitting there. Yeah. That you can't take with you. That's the goal. That's what I'm saying. I, I think we need to readjust our priorities. Our goal here. Uh, and there's— now, now, how do you— obviously you're single. Do you have any family right now?

She is. Someone's going, hey, I'm doing my best part, I'll tell you that right now. He's trying.

So yeah, are there any people in your life that you would even leave the money to?

I would leave it to organizations like for disabled veterans.

Wow, um, that's beautiful.

Do you mind sharing? Do you mind sharing right now what you have in retirement. What do you have? What's your nest egg right now?

So for 5 years I've managed $275,000. That's fantastic.

Way to go. And you have zero debt? No, zero. And you're crushing it. Is your— is your— are you an electrician? Building inspector. Building inspector. Okay, good for you. So you're doing very well. We're always going to need building inspectors. You know who can't do building inspections? AI. Come on, let's go. Amen. Amen to that.

So you're in great How old are you, can I ask? 56. That's right, we do. Okay, so 50, okay, so do you have a specific dollar amount in mind that you're wanting to get to for retirement? No. You don't, okay, so I would have somewhat of a goal, 'cause you have $200, what'd you say, $75,000? $275,000. That's great, okay, but also you're gonna want more for retirement, so I would plan out, sit down with a financial advisor, and just say, hey, what's a number I need to shoot for? Shoot for. And all that is, is a goal. Okay? This isn't an identity thing. It's just an idea of, hey, I have to get to this place. So that's going to give you some healthy motivation to know, am I being cheap here or there? I don't know. But you have something you're actually shooting for. And then the second thing is, once you start to get to that place, you know, money is so funny. It can be such a part of bondage for so many people. And on one end, people spend, they go deeply in debt, and money money becomes an idol to them because it's just like, oh my gosh, it's all they think about because they're stressed on one end because they've made bad decisions with money.

And then you have people on the other end of the spectrum where money takes up as much mental calories as people over here, but they have it and it's actually stolen their freedom. You're not free. That's what it feels like. Even though mathematically you are. So that's the piece from an emotional standpoint. Point I would want to start working on of what is causing that fear. I know you said your mom and all of that, but, but, but really like from day in, day out, what is going on in me that's causing me to live life like this? Because from a spiritual perspective, there's a level of bondage there that has to be broken. And so that I think a goal is going to help you genuinely. I think, I think shooting for something where you feel safe of like a number of like, okay, I know this feels, this feels good as you get to. But then there's an emotional piece too, because if you're not careful, that number you're going to get you're gonna be like, "Eh, it's not enough. I need some more." And that finish line moves and you stay in that for the rest of your life.

So, so I, yeah, I would be, I would be thinking about that and asking yourself some of those questions of what can cause me to be free to live life with an open hand? 'Cause some people that are not, I'm not saying this is you 'cause you're a very generous person the way you've served in your life and your actions. So I don't wanna paint you in this corner, but some people that live life like this, they're not, they tend not to be generous people. They have a harder time giving. As well. So that open hand mentality is so important with money, but I don't think you have that problem because of everything you just laid about your life story.

It's amazing. And you have a paid-for house? Yes. Oh yeah. What's the house worth? 3, maybe, out in the county. You're going to be fine because 56 in my book is young, you know what I'm saying? So you're in great shape. And you know what, I want to do something for Grace. We got a little something. We never know what we're going to give. How much stuff do you guys have? I got a lot of stuff back there. I got a lot of stuff. Sir on the front row, pay attention to what I'm doing. Grace, come on down. We have some flowers for you. You're so sweet. You're awesome. Give it up for Grace one more time. Okay, James, can I call an audible? Do you trust me? Trust me. Okay.

Can Rachel call it?

Well, let's be honest, Rachel's been—

Rachel can do what she wants.

Rachel, why don't you tell everybody what you were telling me in my ear?

I like this because we love a settled debate. It's one of our favorites. And so I saw a couple's hand over here that said they would volunteer for a couples debate. Is this true? Yes. Okay. Where are they? They're right here in the front.

Stand up and head to the mic. Head to the mic.

We're about to settle a debate.

Yes, it's what we want. Thank you, James, our fearless leader. What we want. This is what we have come here for.

This is our favorite.

I don't know why you all are here. I know why we're here. It's to settle a debate. No, I kid. Okay, this is fun. We want to know your names. Let's start with, uh, ma'am, your name? Jessica. Jessica. And Joel.

And what? Joel or Joel.

Joel. Yeah, I'll go with Joel because I'll butcher the other one, you know what I mean? Okay, and where are you guys Where are you guys from? Mexico. Mexico, no way. Thanks for coming. Okay, somebody set it up. What is the debate that you want this esteemed panel of judges to weigh in on?

So we have sort of combined our finance since we came here to the US, but there's some money that was before or things that Jess had, like a house and yes, some savings or some stocks that we haven't combined. So we were last week in Cozumel and we were having just like some tension and discussions about it.

So I don't know. Who wants to do what? Let's give us the two positions.

Yes, so I would like to know how can I better Show her that, that she trusts me, maybe. Oh, so what do you—

so what do you want to do, sir? What is— what is the position? What do you want to do that you would like her to trust you with?

Just fully combined finance and everything. Just not finance, but everything.

Everything. Everything is ours. Love your heart. Okay.

Okay. So Jessica, I mean, the guy is emotional. What a heart. Jessica, what are you concerned about? And by the way, not judging you. What are you concerned about? What are your fears or disagreements on this?

So my I'm not sure like, or what's the best way to bring that money here in the relationship because we are thinking maybe to buy a house, but I have like around $150K and we could bring that money into the house, but I'm not sure if that's good for the relationship.

Why? Okay, let's stop right there. What do you think that money and combining things, how would it harm your relationship?

Because probably he will feel like the house is mine or something like that. All right, pause.

Sir, Joel, will you feel that way?

No. I mean, I think it's, Whenever we have these discussions, I hear that she wants to take care of her parents or help them. And this is where I think at some point, I don't know if she feels that I'm not supportive to help her parents. We come from different backgrounds. My parents are retired. They have no, they don't need any help, but on her end, more like, a scarcity background, and I think this is also like how we get emotional.

Is he on target in that your fear is if we combine money, I will lose control of my desire to help my mom and dad? Yep. Okay. What do you need to hear from him tonight to alleviate that fear?

Like he will be supportive with my desire to help them and we can make a plan or something like that.

Okay, Joel, what have you not told her or what do you want to reemphasize to her right now about that concern?

I would say that as for now, we have maybe supported them the best we knew before before, just with money. But now I think we can support them with a plan, with experiences, or even saving some that we can manage for us and for them that in the future can help with the diseases that they might have or they are not planning and we are foreseeing it. But I think writing a plan and really aligning that will be helpful. And then in 10, 15 years or whenever the money's needed, we have it and it's better managed than if we just give it to them. And then my fear is that they might not use it in the best way and we can help better with experiences.

Jessica, do you understand his concern on that piece?

I get it at some point, but also I'm not sure if maybe just like not like a big amount, but something smaller that we can give them now and then. Okay.

Are they in need, Jessica, right now financially? Mm, yes and no. Are they asking for money from you? No. Okay, so what's causing you to say we have to give some money? I need to be helping them now. What is that?

I think it's more because I would like them to have like experiences or comfort that I have now and they don't have.

So you feel guilty because of everything they've done for you and yet you're living a better life than them and so you want to sort of pay it back, paid forward in that sense.

Are you guys ready to settle the debate? Yeah. Yes, I know that I am, but I want to make sure. Are you? I am.

So I'm ready to be a judge. Get the gavel out.

Hold on a second. Oh my, oh my Lord. Oh my Lord. What is our prop budget? This is wild.

It's not powdered. Alright, am I going first or last?

I feel like you have to go first now.

I feel like— You brought the wig. I feel like I have so much credibility with this and this that it might sway your decision, but I'll go first.

We have different definitions of credibility, but continue.

I did notice that both Jessica and Joel went from crying to laughing, so I think it did its job. Okay, I think it's very simple. I heard his heart. Heart immediately. He wants you to trust him that he's for you. And if he's for you, he's for your parents. I hear your concern as well, but I also hear that Joel's saying, I'm not sure that my in-laws, your parents, are the best ones to handle a large sum of money. And so if we commit, and he's committed to writing a plan out to take care of them, but you use the money, it's your money, and you support them. I think it's a great plan. I think his heart's even better than his plan. So I rule in favor of Joel. Really? That's all I get?

Can I have the gavel? Oh yes, yes.

Thank you. Okay, you want the wig?

I think— no, no, you don't.

She's good, she's good. I'm fine, I'm fine. Burn that.

Um, my vote is is I would combine everything, shocker, I know, but I would, I would combine everything. I think he needs to hear from you that you choose him over your parents because you've chosen to get married. And that man loves you a lot, loves you a lot, and he's gonna take good care of you. You guys are together gonna make a really great team. And I think out of the teamwork, we get to build a life together. And that looks like whatever you guys want. That's the beauty about being adults is you get to make decisions. So, together, do we want to buy a home? Together, do we want to take her parents on a trip every year with us and include them and fly them where they need to be for the kids? If you guys have kids in the future, like, what does that all look like with the money that we have together? So, on that basis, I think I'm more in favor with Joel. Wow.

All right. Oh no, sorry, Keith.

Hold on, it's not real, it's not real.

George, George, I want to make sure you're seeing. The object is to hit this with that.

What? Ah, I missed it. Okay, I'll, I'll end with this. I definitely agree with what they've said, but I think that the heart of this— Joel is, he's rightfully so worried that this is going to turn into entitlement from your parents and even enabling, and he truly wants to help to help them. He loves these people, and I think he wants a plan to make them independent, not because he doesn't wanna support them, but because he actually believes in their autonomy to live their lives without needing you. And I think that is a noble goal. So I do think you should combine finances, but I think you should create boundaries around what this looks like to support your parents, maybe even a deadline. And not just a forever we're gonna write checks to them, and that's gonna be the priority of our relationship. 'Cause at the heart of this, the lack of combining finances has created a chasm in your marriage. There is a gap right now where you guys can't be fully together, and it's not a money thing, it's an emotional thing, it's an intimacy thing. And I think that supersedes the help to your parents.

And I think he— you guys are an amazing couple. You will figure out the boundaries and how to do this the right way, but I think combining those finances will actually free you just more than you think. So I rule in favor. Of Joel.

But, but hey, hold on. Oh, a parting gift. I like the gifts. Come on down. We got a nice bottle of Josh Sobreira. You two need to crack this bottle tonight and start the written plan. All right, there it is. There you go. You guys are awesome. Thank you guys, you're great.

What's the dumbest thing you've ever done with money?

Bought I bought a car I probably shouldn't have.

What car was that?

It was a Chevrolet Camaro. Whenever I first started investing, I definitely just threw money at like some meme stocks that didn't pay off, so I learned pretty quick. Bought a car and then, um, the car went bad. I got frustrated and sold it, and then me and my wife were with one car for 7 years.

If you had to cover a $1,000 emergency, how would you do it right now? Credit card.

I would pull it out of savings or phone a friend.

Okay, so you have the money in savings. That's good.

Get money out of my emergency fund.

You have one? Yeah. Okay, how many months of expenses do you have stored away? 3 months of expenses.

Honestly, I have a really good village, so I can lean on that if I don't have it.

Speaking of drinks, you guys know a little something about drinks. Smart Money Happier. Yeah, right.

Rachel created a whole show where she gets to drink on the clock.

Pretty genius. No! Smart Money Happy Hour was created because I was like, wouldn't it be fun if me and George got to sit down and chat like we do as friends, have a cocktail, talk about things going on? It's great. But part of Smart Money Happy Hour, one of our partners there is Fairwinds Credit Union. So, we're gonna give them another shout out because they are amazing. And I know we've talked about them tonight, but Fairwinds is such a great partner with Ramsey because when you are using your money and you are having to interact with banks and banking institutions, having someone on the other side of that that is so helpful, that knows, that you know they are for you in your journey with the Baby Steps, that's everything. Absolutely.

And I mentioned that Smart Bundle earlier. It's got a fee-free checking account, high-yield savings account, that Ramsey-branded Debt Is Normal, Be Weird debit card, and you can have up to 10 savings accounts. They created this just for our fans because we know that y'all are nerdy and you like to have sinking funds for for the trip and for the car and for all these different things. So they actually change their product to serve you guys better, and that's why we've loved this partnership. They even cut international transaction fees on their cards. Well, that happened— After they saw one of my videos where I said, "Make sure your debit card doesn't do this." So they said, "Let's adjust everything to serve the Ramsey fans in an incredible way." So if you want to check that out, just go to fairwinds.org/ramsey to open up that smart bundle and start to introduce this new bank to the mix, and I think you'll quickly find you want to start doing more and more with them.

Yeah, their app is easy to use. Their interface is easy. Their customer service is incredible. When you open it, they call you the next day on the phone just to make sure everything's— I mean, it really is, they are incredible people and they have an incredible product when it comes to us that you have to use your debit card every single day. And so, having Fairwinds on your side is so huge. So, again, go to fairwinds.org/ramsey, insured by the NCUA.

I love it. By the way, real quick question. How's my hair look after having the wig on? Is it all right? It looks good, so yeah, you're all right.

Okay, just wanna make sure.

I don't wanna be distracted. I'll remain silent. Thank you, George. This is really, really fun. George, you got your calculator ready?

Why do you assume that I have my calculator ready?

And yes, I do, because we talked about it earlier. It's ready. Yes, I do. It's ready. So here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna have a fun group debt-free scream. How does that sound? Does that sound fun? But we're gonna do something kind of, kind of, kind of neat. So here's what we want you to do. If you have become debt-free in the last 12 months, would you stand?

Just stand wherever you are. That's consumer debt-free. If you did the mortgage too, that's great.

That's fine, but it does not have to be the house, right, George?

Yeah, exactly.

So they're standing up there. That's exciting. We got a few more. Okay. Yes, yes, yes. Everybody stand. I want to make sure everybody's up because this is a key part of the thing. Is everybody up?

Oh, look at them. They keep coming. Okay, great.

They keep coming. Okay, now here's what we're going to do. So I'm going to assist George, and I'm going to start on the right side of the room and work my way over. And what I want you to do is yell out how much you paid off. George is going to add it all up, and we're gonna see what has happened collectively to pay off debt in the last 12 months, and then we'll do a group debt-free scream. Love it. All right? I'm at the ready. Let's start up here, 'cause I saw— ma'am, how much? $265,000. $265,000. Strong start. Strong start.

That's just the numbers right there.

Strong start. Wow. Amazing. Anybody else up there? Yes, sir. $175,000. $175,000. It's our man again. Okay, fantastic. And after you give me your number, You can sit down if you want, but we're going to ask you to stand back up. But you can rest. Right here with the Clemson shirt on. Yes. $1,500. $1,500. That's great.

We love it. We love it. Okay.

Right here. $27,000. $27,000. Nice job. I tell you what we're going to do. Let's hold applause so we can move a little quicker. I love your spirit, but we got to move quickly. I want to get— $12,000. $12,000. Okay, great. $290,000. In the back, right here, the couple right here. $250,000. Behind them. $150,000? Okay, excellent. Ma'am all the way in the back row. How much? $3,000. I love it. Okay, are you all 3 together? Just you 2? Okay, yell it out. 380-ish. Okay. George, I don't know how you're going to calculate that.

My phone can handle it. Okay.

Next to, next to them. Yes, ma'am. 233,000. Okay. And anybody on this? Okay. Now this couple right back here. Yes, sir. What? 66,000. Right here. 75,000. Right here. Right here? 150,000. Right here? 168,000. And? 39,000. Did I miss anybody? Okay, all those people stand back up.

Ken, can I add?

You can. Before we do that, let's get a total. George, what do you have?

About $2.3 million. Wow!

Oh gosh. Okay, and you got a fun idea? Yes.

That's a lot of hard work. Okay, I want everyone who is debt-free, consumer debt or mortgage, regardless of when you paid it off, to stand up so you can be part of this. You join this amazing group. If you are debt-free in the room, look at this, stand up.

Everybody up. Okay, this is fun.

Amazing.

George, would you like to do the honors to count them down? It would be an honor. You guys know what we're doing. George will count you down. Count them down, and I mean, this is from your guts, because you worked hard, and we're so proud to be in the room with all of you. You all are heroes. You've changed your family tree. George, count them down. Let's hear a group debt-free scream.

All right, we've got $2.3 million paid off in the last 12 months in this room alone in Charlotte, North Carolina, and dozens more have become debt-free standing up following this plan. Count it down, guys.

Let's hear a debt-free scream.

3, 2, 1.

Yeah!

That is incredible. That'll put a little pep in your step.

And we don't have time to go around and get everybody else's amount, but $2.3 million is just a drop in the bucket. It's just in the years. So great. Hey, listen, y'all are great. Before we sign off, I just want my colleagues a word of encouragement. What would you share with people no matter what baby step they're in? They're here for a reason tonight. They're here to be intentional. George, what would you share?

Well, you know, I see a lot of headlines. I see a lot of scary stuff. I see a lot of doom and gloom out there. And yet in this room, there is just a beacon of hope. And you guys are not immune to it. You've lived through it. You've sacrificed. You've had trials and tribulations. Conditions, and yet you're on the other side of it. And that, I think, is one of the most inspiring stories America needs to hear right now, and you guys are living it, and I'm so proud of all of you. So, thank you for being here.

So good. Amen, amen, George. Yeah, I would say, regardless of where you are in the Baby Steps, and some of you are maybe starting Baby Step 1, right, in all of this, and then you just saw everyone who's paid off debt, and the numbers are just outstanding of those of you that just stood up. But I would say regardless of where you are, the secret is you. And I think you know that. And you know what? What you want different in your life, you get to make decisions to change that. What you don't like about your life, you get to make decisions to change that. And I feel like we're in a room of people who are willing to do that and willing to face one of the hardest subjects in life, which is money from a tactical side and emotional side, a spiritual side. And you guys are so engaged and you are not letting this topic ruin your life. You're getting ahead of it and you're saying, you know what, I'm gonna be in control and we're gonna change the things we need to change. And that takes a lot of courage. So we love you guys so much.

We love doing this show and we love being able to see the faces tonight of those of you that listen. So we love y'all.

Yeah, that's so good. I'll just dovetail off of Rachel. I think she said it. You all did it. You know, we talk about controlling the controllables, and I'm looking at a room full of people, no matter what their story, no matter what their circumstances, no matter what their background, no matter what their environment was, at some point you made a decision to control what only you could control, and you changed your life. Some of you are in the process of changing your life. Changing your life, and you are the answer. We aren't the answer. We're just cheerleading you on, coaching you up, but you are the difference. And I want to share that no matter what happens later tonight or in the days or years ahead, whatever comes your way, you've won in a major area, and you control what you can control. Don't worry about D.C. Don't worry about your governor's office. Don't worry about what your neighbors are doing. You live the life. Life that you want to live, and you can because you've done it to this point. So we're so honored to be with you all. Uh, I do want to do one thing.

I do want you all to join me. We have an incredible crew that came from Nashville, our headquarters, an amazing team from James Childs to our live event team to our Ramsey Network leadership, Ramsey Network crew. If you're on the crew, would you stand up for just a second? Because I would love— we can't do this, it's going to change so many lives, and we can't do this without them. So would you all join us in thanking them? Hey, you guys are great. On behalf of our entire team, Dave Ramsey, George Campbell, Rachel Cruz, thank you all for being with us. We love you so much. Good night, Charlotte. Thanks, guys.

Have a great night.