Transcript of Who Will Rule the 2026 U.S. Open?

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Hi everyone, it's Natalie Kitroff. If you're not yet a Times subscriber, we have some news for you. You can enjoy full access to The New York Times without a paywall for 30 days. All you have to do is download the app to get your first month completely free. And if you're already a Times subscriber, You're the best. Thank you. Okay, here's today's show. From The New York Times, I'm Natalie Kitroweff. This is The Daily on Sunday. Right now, here in New York City, the greatest tennis players in the world are gearing up for the last and arguably biggest event of the year, the US Open. The tournament is played in Billie Jean King National Tennis Center.

Billie Jean is the winner.

Which is home of the biggest tennis arena on Earth, Arthur Ashe Stadium.

Here goes Arthur Ashe now, leading off with the first serve.

It's where Pete Sampras ended his career in an epic match with Andre Agassi. Where Venus and Serena Williams first faced off in a major championship final.

Venus just chirping her sister from center court.

John McEnroe and Bjorn Borg, Steffi Graf and Monica Seles, Novak Djokovic and everybody.

Another winner just flat-footed Nadal.

Some of tennis's most iconic rivalries played out at the US Open, and that's happening again, but in a new era with new stars jockeying for their place in history.

Carlos Alcaraz wins his first major. Sabalenka has now won the US Open. It is the first title of the year for Coco Gauff.

So on today's show, I'm talking with Matthew Futterman, who covers tennis for The Athletic, a sports publication owned by The Times, and is the author of the new book, The Cruelest Game: Chasing Greatness in Professional Tennis. We're gonna talk about those new stars chasing greatness, their stories, their struggles, their friendships and rivalries. Everything that makes tennis maybe the most compelling and dramatic one-on-one competition anywhere in the world. It's Sunday, August 30th. Matt, welcome to The Sunday Daily. Thanks for being here in studio, taking time away from the grueling US Open schedule.

Oh, it's great to be here. Thanks for having me.

So I want to start off with a bang. What, to you, is the greatest rivalry in tennis history?

Hands down, Chris Evert and Martina Navratilova.

All she can think about is beating Chris Evert for the second time in 3 weeks.

They played 80 times.

We've seen back-to-back defeats for Chrissy there.

60 of those times that they played were in finals.

Wow.

Martina trying to defend her title, and Chris trying to win the title for the 7th time.

Respect each other's games. They both have great respect for each other.

They were such a contrast in styles. Martina made a smart play, came right in as she's been doing. Navratilova, Eastern European.

When I want and where I want, and I didn't get this chance while being under the Czech government.

Chris Evert, sort of, I will put this in quotes, that all-American girl next door. Are you getting hit on all the time as well? From men, or do you just scare the pants off them?

Yeah, not that much. I mean, I really don't see a lot of men around the circuit, to tell you the truth.

This is a rivalry that had everything, including an incredible personal relationship between the two of them.

They were friends? They were incredible friends.

They were doubles partners. partners. And then that was too hard for Chris Evert to be doubles partners with her big rival.

Because I wasn't the kind of player that really liked to play my friends or my sister, people that I cared about.

So—

And she stopped playing doubles with her. And that was like a real personal hurt to Martina. She had just defected to America. She was all alone. And she really felt like her friend had broken up with her.

I wanted to be friends with the people that I played against. I preferred that.

Also, then Martina started beating Chris, like, all the time, and that became very hard. Then Chris kind of fought back. But also, they both have had cancer together and gone through treatment together.

You know, she was in the trenches with me, and she was comforting me at very important times.

We were always there for each other.

Yeah, it was pretty cool.

It's not only a completely fascinating sports rivalry, it's a fascinating personal relationship, an amazing friendship.

Okay. This is precisely what I want to talk about today: the beautiful human drama of tennis. I think a lot of people who love tennis love it because of the characters. I fell in love with watching this sport in the Serena Williams era, the Roger Federer, Rafael Nadal era. Those players were so important to me. You fall in love with these people. You do. You're up when they're up. You're crushed when they're crushed. But Matt, I have to admit that this time I'm going into the US Open being like, who exactly am I supposed to be obsessed with here? I don't totally know. And so that's what I have you here for. I'm hoping you'll tell me, help me.

Well, it's a little like music. They say that the music you fall in love with for the rest of your life is the music you hear when you're a teenager. And so—

The Backstreet Boys?

I think I was a little more fortunate with Springsteen being around when I was a teenager. I think it's the same way about tennis. You know, you sort of fall in love with that first era, for me, it was, you know, Borg, McEnroe, Connors, Vilas.

Right.

Having said that, I would say you're in a little bit of a moment of transition, although the transition has kind of already happened, but it hasn't quite sorted itself out yet into what the new world order is.

What do you mean by that?

You have these giants of the game that had dominated the sport for the last 20 years. And, you know, Novak Djokovic—

Novak Djokovic! What are you doing?

Roger Federer.

Federer turns it up to 11.

Rafael Nadal.

This is phenomenal!

Serena Williams. Incredible touch by Serena Williams. To an extent, her sister Venus Williams.

Venus Williams is the champion once again for the 5th time in a row.

So, you know, you have these, you know, lions and lionesses of the sport who are kind of exiting the stage Rather slowly. Kicking and screaming, in some cases. Yeah, a little bit kicking and screaming. But they still loom large. They still suck up a huge amount of oxygen in the tennis conversation. But then you have these— this whole generation of incredibly talented new players who have come along. Jannik Sinner, Carlos Alcaraz, Coco Gauff. Aryna Sabalenka, Iga Świątek. And so there's this whole new generation of terrific young players who are not only trying to win tennis matches, but also thrive for 15, 20 years.

Because it's incredibly grueling, right? The schedule that these players maintain over the course of a year.

It's grueling both mentally and physically.

They're playing, what, 7 months a year? 8 months?

How—

11.

That is crazy.

Yeah. I mean, an NFL player, yeah, it's a pretty tough sport. They do get 6 months of vacation.

Right. And we should say, though these players are playing most of the year, most viewers tune in to these 4 big tournaments, what we call the Grand Slam tournaments. This is one of 4 times when these players get in front of a global audience for the biggest prize in their sport.

Yeah, those are— the slams, as they're referred to, starts in Australia in January, then French Open, Wimbledon, and then the US Open. It all finishes up. They kind of drag themselves to New York. And a lot of them are pretty banged up by the time they get here, which is one of the reasons it makes it sort of the most unpredictable of The Grand Slams.

Yeah. Say what's special about this tournament, the US Open.

I mean, well, I mean, it starts with just the New York of it all.

This is where barrier breakers meet dream chasers.

It's noisy. It's chaotic.

I mean, it is intense. You can feel it when you're there, but I think you can feel it watching it on TV. The atmosphere, it feels different.

Oh, come on!

And you can be there and take in everything that New York has to offer. And also, and I really highly recommend you don't miss this part of it, there are these people doing what I would argue is just about the hardest sport in the world, a sport that requires the lungs of a marathoner, the speed and quickness of a world-class sprinter. ridiculous hand-eye coordination. They're sweating, they're out there, it's hot. They're giving everything they have with their heart and soul to try and win that last point.

Hmm.

In a sport that reveals everything about them, their personalities, and there's just no place to hide in this sport. It is human drama playing out in, you know, the most incredibly compelling form with balls Balls and rackets and a lot of athleticism.

All right. So given that, what I think we should do today is spend some time diving into those people who are gonna be doing that amazing thing, the characters that we're gonna be following at this US Open. Sound good?

That sounds great.

Perfect.

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Okay, Matt, let's start with the women's draw. Who should we be talking about? New faces, new era. I'm ready.

Well, not so fast, because I think we probably need to talk about A rather familiar name, Serena Williams. You might have heard of her.

I love her so much.

She's rather a good tennis player, it turns out.

One of the biggest tennis tournaments now set to feature defending champion Carlos Alcaraz and the GOAT, Serena Williams.

Serena announced a couple weeks ago that she was gonna come back, and she was gonna play mixed doubles with Carlos Alcaraz, which is one of the biggest things I would say that has happened in tennis this The surprise announcement coming months into Williams' comeback campaign, including— Sort of left reluctantly in 2022 because she wanted to have a second child and really felt like she couldn't do that and also continue to play tennis.

It's been the most incredible ride and journey I've ever been on. I mean, in my life.

And just really missed the sport.

It's interesting though, 'cause I've done it literally my entire life. And so when you stop something that you've done since, honestly, I can remember, I don't even remember a start date. When you— I think you kind of take it for granted. And so now it's like—

She has been very open about her use of the GLP-1 drugs that have helped her lose weight post-childbirth. It has really changed her life, she said. As she has put it, it has given her her body back.

Hmm. 6-time US Open singles champion Serena Williams.

She played on Tuesday. The mixed doubles happens before the singles tournament now at the US Open. And it was quite the scene. I mean, you're witnessing a 44-year-old mother of 2 play in a way that I think nobody really thought was possible.

Love, 15.

Second point of that match, there's like a floater that comes to her, and she rears back to to, you know, stuff this overhead. And I'm sitting, like, 20 rows up, and I swear if I'd had my eyes closed, I would've been able to say, oh, that's Serena Williams hitting a tennis ball.

It's just classic.

It makes your skin tingle. You hear the thump of the ball coming off the strings. That sound is different than when it's coming off any other player's racket. And it's just an amazing spectacle to watch. They lost their next match, unfortunately, but it was one of those moments where she was just, like, so back.

We are just so lucky that we still get to see Serena Williams play tennis. I think it is one of life's great joys. to watch this person play this sport, and we should all treasure it. And it's not over, right? That wasn't the end of Serena Williams in this thing.

No, it wasn't. She is coming back for another go at it. She announced a couple of days ago that she is going to play doubles with her sister Venus. They've won a lot before, and who knows? We'll see what they can do.

Okay.

So we still get to do this for a little bit longer, at least. Who else should I be keeping an eye on, Matt? And if you say Martina Navratilova is coming back or something, I'm gonna have to ask you to leave.

Navratilova is not coming back. I kind of think you should probably keep your eye on Coco Gauff.

Look at that! That's what Gauff can do!

The great American hope.

Well, I'd say at this point she's more than a hope. I mean, you know, she's the real thing. She won her First Grand Slam title at this US Open 3 years ago.

Get up, Coco Gauff! You've just won the US Open!

Last year she won the French Open.

Coco has conquered the clay!

She's one of these people that is an athlete who could do just about anything. She probably has world-class sprinter speed, just about. You can't hit the ball past her. She's that fast.

Tremendous get, Lindsay, and then such control.

You know, but the funny thing about tennis is God doesn't give anybody everything.

Hmm.

She has a very active mind, and, you know, she can get in her head sometimes. And the last couple years, she has really struggled with the most important shot in the game.

Which is?

Which is her serve.

Ball!

Every other shot you make, Someone's hit a ball at you. The serve is yours. You— it should be in some ways the easiest shot in the game, and in most cases it's the hardest.

And the easiest to get in your head about.

And the easiest to get in your head about.

Yeah, she's already had 2 double faults in this opening game.

And it's gotten into her head. It also can be her biggest strength. When Coco's serve is firing, as it has been the last month, she ...is probably just about the most dangerous player on the planet.

2 fantastic serves from Coco Gauff. It's so important to watch her toss.

She is, on top of that, the belle of this ball.

It's her— it's her tournament to win or lose, it sounds like.

Well, it's not only her tournament, it's her party. Okay? I mean, you walk around the grounds of the US Open, and Coco is everywhere. You know, you walk around this city, you know, over the next few weeks, Coco is everywhere. She is everywhere. There are billboards, there's posters. She's the most popular player certainly in tennis in America right now.

Okay, well, I wouldn't want to play her on these courts.

I don't think we want to play Coco on any courts, you and I. I think that would be— I think that would be for the best.

Fair enough. Yeah. Who is standing in her way? Like, who's her biggest competition?

Probably Aryna Sabalenka.

Game, Sabalenka.

Wow.

What a performance.

What a stunt from Aryna Sabalenka.

They played each other in the finals 3 years ago. Sabalenka crumbled.

Really starting to get under the skin of Sabalenka.

They played each other in the finals of the French Open last year. Sabalenka crumbled. I was just looking at the unforced error count because they were accumulating quite a bit from Sabalenka, and there weren't even that many long points, long rallies there. It was just coming so— Aryna Sabalenka, world number 1.

She's wanted this so badly for so long, and Aryna Sabalenka Aryna Sabalenka has now won the US Open.

From Belarus, superstar, 6 feet tall, huge power, incredible fire. Again, greatest strength, also greatest weakness. So is that incredible fire— sometimes she loses control of it.

Hmm.

She's had a rough couple of months. She's lost a lot of close matches a lot earlier in tournaments than we would've anticipated. And tennis is a sport where you bring everything you have onto a tennis court. You're out there alone. You are your whole self. And compartmentalization can be difficult sometimes.

Something about Sabalenka that feels resonant for me watching her is that she is seemingly Completely open about her emotions. Just wanna quit tennis right now, but we'll see. We'll see in a few days. Hopefully I'll get back on track mentally. I mean, they are all on the court. You watch her crumble when she crumbles, and you see her hype herself up when she's hyping herself up. There's something very accessible about the kind of waves that she rides?

I definitely feel that way. I honestly find watching Aryna Sabalenka a kind of a painful experience.

Oh, why?

Well, because of those waves. You know, there are some players where you feel like you're the copilot with them. They kind of strap you in for the ride. And Sabalenka sometimes, you know, she brings you in to the car with her. But sometimes that can be a kind of bumpy and uncomfortable ride, and you don't necessarily want to be in the car with her.

Uh-huh.

Aryna Sabalenka, when she is losing and she is on the ropes, you can feel that in a very visceral way.

Okay, so lots emotionally at stake with both Coco Gauff and Aryna Sabalenka.

Who else?

Who else could contend?

Iga Świątek. Best player of the last 5 years, 7 Grand Slam titles, incredible talent.

And when the forehand is cooking, it's so dangerous. She can hit it hard down the line or roll it deep cross-court or short.

Brittle mentally.

A very, very tough opening match for Iga Świątek, and you can see what it's taken out of her. She's visibly emotional.

Feels her feelings, self-consciousness and self-awareness. sometimes are not great things in sports.

Yeah.

Better to be the robot, better to be the goldfish. She's not the goldfish.

That was scary for Iga Świątek.

Mira Andreeva, 19 years old.

A teenage dream has come true.

From Russia. Huge new talent. Broke through with her first Grand Slam title at the French Open earlier this year.

It's Mira's moment!

She's a kid though, still.

Very young.

She's a young woman, 19 years old, but she is a kid. Her coach the last couple years, Conchita Martínez, is essentially Obi-Wan Kenobi. She's Luke Skywalker. That's the relationship here. Sometimes it works, sometimes Mira can hold it together. Sometimes she's a teenager on the court.

What a remarkable recovery from this 21-year-old.

Linda Nosková, Wimbledon champion, huge talent, only going to get better. She is the latest vanguard of this Czech women's tennis machine. This is a country of 11 million people. They have like 9 players in the top 50.

What an advert for Czech tennis. What an advert for women's tennis.

I mean, there was—

Yeah, kind of an incredible thing. So keep an eye on her.

Okay, not that I needed more excitement, but you have persuaded me that the women's side of this tournament is very exciting. Let's take a quick break and we'll come back and talk about the men. Matt, the men. feel a little more clear to me because there's a proven star in the mix, Carlos Alcaraz, who just played mixed doubles with Serena. Just tell me about him, where he's at right now, how he arrived here, and where we encounter him in this moment.

Carlos is the golden child of this tennis generation.

Carlos Alcaraz wins his first major, and in doing so, becomes the youngest World number 1.

And for the most part, Carlos is just about the most joyful tennis player. People, since he came on the scene 5 years ago, they love to watch him.

Oh, no way!

But they love to watch him love how much he loves to play.

Still celebrating.

You know, he pulls off these shots that it seems like he's just sort of the ultimate jazz musician who's improvising and riffing and doing things that he didn't even know he was capable of.

Well, the ball was behind him, and he's still somehow been able to find the winner. It looked as though he completely overran this ball.

You know, one of the fun things about being a sportswriter is There are some athletes that you meet when they're pretty young, and you sort of get to see them evolve. And I remember in 2021, I went to one of his early matches, his first match in a singles Grand Slam draw. After that match, I sort of went for a little walk with him around the Australian Open, and no one has any idea who he is.

Or who he's gonna become.

And who he's going to become. And In many ways, he is still that kid on the tennis court.

Hmm.

I mean, he's— yeah, life is gonna take its toll on him. It probably already has in terms of he's been suffering from a wrist injury, probably the most serious injury a tennis player can have. But for the most part, he is, you know, that kid who is still full of joy. And I hope for his sake and for all of our sakes, That's who he always is on the tennis court because it's a beautiful thing to watch.

Beautiful rainbow from Carlito.

You know, so much of the conversation around men's tennis has orbited, it feels like, around Carlos Alcaraz and his main rival, Jannik Sinner from Italy. But Sinner is not playing at the US Open because of an injury. So my question is, who is Alcaraz's big competition here?

Well, I think if you're asking about his competitors, the first one you have to talk about is Novak Djokovic.

Djokovic.

The GOAT.

He still is tennis's nearest version to Superman.

Still around and still hoping that it might all come together and he can find a way to a 25th Grand Slam title.

He's back in business.

Djokovic.

Racket aloft.

He is 39 years old. He is still right just about at the top of the sport, which is just an astounding thing to consider given that he's 39 years old.

Yeah.

Can you explain it? Like, how is it that we are still seeing him compete at this level when Carlos Alcaraz is 23?

So a few years ago, I had dinner with Novak Djokovic right before the US Open. And It's 2 big salmon steaks, 2 big sweet potatoes, some rice, some gluten-free pasta with vegetables, and a fruit cup. There's no sauce on the salmon. There's no butter on the sweet potatoes. The only thing on the pasta is olive oil. And he's drinking water.

Poor guy.

Well, yeah. I mean, so that gives you an idea of how he is living. He gets out of bed every morning and he stretches for 45 minutes. I mean, I'm painting the picture of a monk, but he takes real joy in this lifestyle. He's really into wellness. You know, he treats his body like a Formula 1 race car.

Hmm.

Every little screw, every drop of oil that is in that car is thought about. He doesn't just accidentally be 39 years old and still be at the top of his game.

So he is intent on continuing to compete at this level. And it sounds like he has a real shot at still potentially winning it all.

Maybe if his body can hold up. You know, you have to win 7 of these matches in order to win the tournament. He's come close. He's won 6, plus 1 set. He had Carlos Alcaraz on the ropes in January at the Australian Open.

Djokovic a couple of sets away from number 25.

So it is potentially possible. It's at least intellectually possible. Never count Novak Djokovic out. I've been burned too many times for doing that. I will never do it again. He's still there. He's still doing it in real time.

Okay, I have to confess that I really wanted your answer to that question to be an American, because there are many American men in this tournament. Can we—

And it is the US Open.

And it is the US Open. Can we talk about them? Like, who, if you're rooting for an American, should you be getting excited about?

Well, there's a lot of them to get excited about. The 2 players people get most excited about these days who are Americans are probably Ben Shelton and Francis Tiafoe.

Ben Shelton! Resets the world. He takes out his fellow American, Francis Tiafoe.

Ben Shelton He's the best athlete I've ever seen on a tennis court.

Oh, brilliant! What a forehand!

There's this age-old question in American tennis, because America has so many sports that compete for the best young athletes. You know, football, baseball, basketball. So we've always wondered, what would've happened if Michael Jordan had a tennis racket in his hand when he was 8 years old? What about Steph Curry? What about Patrick Mahomes? In Ben Shelton, you kind of have somebody who may have been one of those people. He was a really good teenage quarterback. I've seen him on this big grass field at Indian Wells throwing 60-yard passes to—

Wow.

To his fitness trainer. So he could have done that thing. But instead, Ben realized pretty early on that he could miss more school. He didn't really like school very much. That he could miss, like, Mondays and Fridays if he was a good tennis player, because he would be able to travel to some tournaments.

Hmm.

So he decided when he was 14 years old that he would get serious about tennis and try and play tennis for his father, who was the coach of the University of Florida. And so in some sense, Ben Shelton is the opportunity to see the answer to that experiment of when this great athletic specimen ends up with a tennis racket in his hand.

Oh, no! That is ridiculous!

Now unfortunately, he got that tennis racket in his hand a little late. He's probably about 8 years behind Carlos Alcaraz in terms of how much practice he's had. Carlos Alcaraz got serious at 6.

Yeah.

You know? I tried to do, like, a rough calculation. It's probably on the order of, like, 10 to 15 million balls.

Meaning Carlos Alcaraz has hit 10 to 15 million more balls than Shelton has.

Probably.

Wild.

Something like that. Having said that, in addition, you know, Shelton is one of those players where all the emotions are on his sleeve.

And he's come up with a winner. He loves that. The crowd love it too.

Lots of noise, very rowdy, very in your face. He has brought that onto the tour. Ruffled some feathers early on for doing that.

Oh, that's magnificent!

But if there's a place that eats that up, it's in New York at the US Open.

He has, like, great celebrations, right? A huge serve. He's really fun to watch.

Yeah, he hits the ball 150 miles an hour. His arm nearly fell out of his shoulder socket last year at the US Open. Fortunately, it wasn't too serious of an injury.

It's worth Saying there's a lot riding on the possibility of an American victory because an American man hasn't won a Grand Slam, one of those Big Four tournaments, since 2003 when Andy Roddick did it. So we have been waiting for a while.

Right. It looked like it was gonna happen in 2022 when Frances Tiafoe, another great talent, terrific athlete, who's an American, got really close.

Francis Tiafoe says, it's my time!

He's the son of African immigrants, and his father was the maintenance guy at a tennis center.

Wow.

I had no idea.

Yeah. And his mother would sometimes work nights, and so sometimes he and his brother would sleep at the tennis center. And when they were really little, you know, to busy themselves, they would grab a racket and hit balls against the wall. So the tennis pros noticed that the maintenance guys' kids were pretty good at tennis, and that's how Frances got his start in the game.

Frances Tiafoe hunting every ball down.

Fast forward to 2022, the US Open. He beats Nadal in the 4th round, and people are like, wow, an American is really going places, and this draw is pretty open.

The times, they are a-changin'.

Problem is, he faced off against Carlos Alcaraz, who was just about 2 days away from becoming the Carlos Alcaraz that we know today. But yeah, I mean, Tiafoe is just one of those players that he has what I would call tennis charisma.

Tiafoe putting on a show.

You want to feel like you're the copilot in a tennis match? Go watch Frances Tiafoe play. You will be there with him. And, you know, he is there for the show.

That's extraordinary! He volleyed it from how far back?

Okay. Anybody else that we need to know about that we should be talking about here?

Yeah, well, certainly Alexander Zverev.

The white shirt, Alexander Zverev.

A German player who's been the best Grand Slam player this nearly beat Alcaraz at the Australian Open, won the French Open, and then he lost in the final to Jannik Sinner at Wimbledon.

He's had some off-court problems.

Yeah, there were allegations of domestic abuse with former girlfriends. There have been lots of issues around Alexander Zverev. There's also Arthur Fils, who is a French player, absolutely a rising star. Won his first big tournament last week in Cincinnati. He's a similar athletic specimen to Ben Shelton. Not quite as tall, but seriously powerful. Only issue is he's had this stress fracture in his back the last year or so, and even he doesn't know when it might crop up again.

You know, It seems as though there are ifs hanging over all of them. And I'm wondering, you have studied this sport so closely for so long, Matt. What do you think makes the difference? What determines how you get from that question mark to actually achieving the kind of victory that you need to be an enduring figure in this sport?

That's a great question. Of course, if we knew the answer to it, you know, you and I would be Grand Slam champions, probably.

That's why I'm asking, actually.

Look, you never know, right? You never know. So, you know, in talking to these players, especially the great ones, there's a couple of key factors. One of them is understanding that your results are not your identity, and that you—

Words to live by.

Yeah, right?

For all of us, honestly.

Yeah, for all of us. Like, you are so much more of a person than you are on the tennis court. I mean, that's an incredibly hard thing to do when it's the only thing you've done since you're 8 years old. And then you wake up and you're 22, and you wonder, wait a minute, I haven't really done anything else. Like, who am I? How did I get here? What do I want to do with the rest of my life? So yeah, results and identity can't be the same thing. There has to be a great focus on what's coming next. The shot you just hit is over.

Mm-hmm.

If you're still thinking about it, you're gonna miss the next ball. There's always another ball coming at you. There's always another point to play. There's always another set to play. A match, like another tournament next week. You have to have this incredible focus on what comes next. We talked about— Aryna Sabalenka crumbling like that and her emotion getting the best of her. What she's gotten really good at in the last couple years is breathing. And I think that's one thing to watch when you're watching the US Open, is watch what these players do in between points. Do they turn around and yell at their box and kick themselves? Or do they close their mouth and breathe quietly through their nose?

Hmm.

Because that's the whole key to the sport. Like, in some ways, that's the key to all of our lives. The only thing that really should matter is what you do next. Because the thing that just happened, it's gone.

You can't change it.

You can't change it. And that is never more true than on a tennis court. So, you know, what I really believe in and what I see from the great players and what they tell me, what they've told me that they've tried to do, is to commit themselves to intentions, commit themselves to showing up as a certain kind of person on the tennis court, and to— understand that you're gonna lose half the points, or nearly half the points. And you just gotta win the right ones and win enough of them to win the match and move on to the next one.

Well, I do think there is something in there for all of us in quieting the ifs. I had a tennis coach growing up who always used to say, when any of us got in our heads to just smile and remember, tennis is fun. So, I am gonna be watching this tennis. Matt, thank you so much for coming on the show.

Thanks so much for having me. It's really great to be here.

This episode was produced by Alex Barron, with help from Tina Antolini and Lena Richards. It was edited by Wendy Doerr. Production assistance and fact-checking from Dahlia Haddad. And original music by Dan Powell and Marian Lozano. It was engineered by Rowan Nemestow. That's it for The Sunday Daily. I'm Natalie Kitroweff. See you tomorrow. This week on The Wirecutter Show. We hate to break it to you, but you've probably been using your hair conditioner wrong. So don't glop it onto your scalp.

Uh-oh.

That's not what you're supposed to be doing.

Oh.

Wait, okay. I'm so sorry. Say that one more time. Don't put it on your scalp. Don't put it on your scalp. Find out what conditioner is really for and how to apply it the right way. Tune in to The Wirecutter Show on the New York Times app or wherever you like to listen.