Transcript of Guilt Trips

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Lemon Nara.

We don't always see eye to eye with the people we love. Sometimes they're right, and sometimes we're right. And figuring out who has the high ground, that can be tricky. I'm Lupita Nyong'o, and this is Mind Your Own.

There's a custom flow, mind your own. There's a custom flower Find your own. Take all that feeling I know. There's a custom to find your own. Make them and follow us home. It's the life I saw. Find your own. Find your own. It's the cat we grow. Find your own. Find your own.

A few years ago, my family, we took a trip to Puerto Rico.

We decided to do some touring, and what better place to start than in San Juan at El Morro. You can go and walk the grounds.

It's right by the ocean.

The waves actually hit onto the walls of the castle.

There's little towers and there's big... The walls are big and fat. The walls are full roads, really, in terms of how thick they are. And so we go up there and we're looking in this, the expanse of water underneath. And I decided to hoist myself up onto the wall because I want to see it from up there. I wanted to get some pictures. And mind you, I'm afraid of heights. So I am staying on the inner side of the wall. And my mother is like, Amundi, get off that wall. And I say, mommy, it's really thick. Just come see. No, I don't want to see. Get off that wall. My mom is famously afraid of heights. Mommy, relax. Relax. I swear to God, I'm fine. Amundi, stop talking. Get off that wall. Mommy, please think for a moment. I am afraid of heights, too. You don't have to worry. My mother got angrier and angrier. So she's now recruiting my sisters to say, get her off that wall. And I'm like, but I just want to take a... If we stop arguing about me getting off the wall, I will have finished what I came up here to do.

I'm laughing. I'm like, mommy, it's fine. I understand. You love me a lot. I get it, but I am fine. This wall is so thick. And my mother out of nowhere, stops talking and walks off crying. And I'm like, oh my God. Mommy, you're crying now? Because I won't get off the wall? And she's not speaking. Now I've lost the support of my sisters going after my mom. And now I'm pissed because I'm like, Why are you making this about you? And now she's leaving. She's saying she's leaving the castle. And I'm just like, Wow, mommy, wow. Talk about melodrama. It wasn't even that serious. So I get off the wall, but I'm upset, and I go and try and talk to her. She's not having it. She's not talking to me. I never really experienced my mom that obstinate about something, and that hurt as well. I'm also confused because I'm like, Why is this hurting you so much? I apologize, but my apology was not a good apology. It was an apology laced with, If that's what you want, right? Why does it have to be about the fear that you possess? Because I'm working with my own fear, right?

And now here I having to cater to your fear. Somehow we found some peace, and the holiday went on, and it was fine. But I never really got closure to that experience. Fast forward, 2022. A very, very dear friend of mine is about to do an interview with a person who does plane stunts. It's going to be a race. They do flips and twirls and all sorts of things, and then they land. He's going to go and commentate this race. And then he says to me, Oh, and I'm also going to take a ride. I'm like, Is it going to be a simulated ride? No, it's going to be a real ride. I'm going to be in this plane, and it's going to do all these things. It's going to be amazing. You know what? That's great. I won't stop you doing that, but under no circumstances do I want to see it. Don't tell me when it's happening. Just let me know that you're alive once it's done. And so I'm minding my own business, going about my own life. And then I receive a link that I faithfully just press on without thinking.

And now I find myself watching this dear friend of mine in this plane doing all these daring things. And of course, now I've started watching. I can't stop because I'm invested in his safety. They take off and almost like at 90 degrees, they go up into the air, and then they do all sorts of turns in the air. And before and long, they're dipping straight down to the ground at a speed that I can't even fathom. Then the pilot levels out right at the ground, right above the ground. If any small, small mistake, one of the wings is going to crash in the ground and everything's over. I think it was like two and a half minutes of hell for me. Okay? I am in inferno. My hands were cold and sweaty. My heart was beating so fast. I sent him a voice note and said, That was too much for me.

I'm happy you're happy that you had a great time, but that is the level of risk-picking that I cannot stomach. So please, no more for me. And in that moment, Aha. This This is a lot like what my mom was going through.

Her love for me could not handle the risk I was taking. I realized that, yes, that moment is about her. She gave birth to me. She put me on this Earth. And just to stand there and watch me do this dangerous thing hurt her so much. I called her. I called her, and I reminded her about Puerto Rico, and I apologized profusely without the undertones. This time, it was heartfelt. I'm telling my own story, but I'm always a part of my mother's because I'm from her. And that's just a very different relationship. Just considering having children of my own is making me understand her in a different way.

More mind your own after this quick break. Stay tuned.

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Welcome back. You're listening to Mind Your Own. Mothers and daughters, we're going to keep exploring that. Today on Mind Your Own, Our power struggle between two parents and their fiercely independent child takes us to three continents. We start in Canada with that child, Evelyn Kumson, a young Ghanaian girl who's asking questions and insisting on her own answers. I hope you're listening.

It started at the age of five. In school, I remember during Christmas, they're like, Let's write a letter to Santa Claus. Everybody would be so excited to give it back to their teachers. I'm like, No, if there's a Santa Claus, I want to find the Santa Claus on my own. I left the school grounds because I knew my mom would pick me up, and I didn't want her to stop me. It took me a while to get there. It was a far journey. I don't just make one stop. I detour. I don't know what I was looking for, but yes, at five o'clock, I reached the post office, and they're like, What do you want? I'm like, Hey, I need to give a letter to Santa Claus. Can you give it to him? I heard he lives in the North Pole. The paper was really scratched up, but they still accepted my letter. So at six o'clock, got home. My mom was crying. My dad was crying. They're like, Where did this girl go? And all I had to say was I had to go to Santa Claus. They're like, We called the police. We had a search.

While you were searching, I was searching for Santa Claus. So my parents, You do not know what you are doing yet. You want to cause problems in this house. Why? Why? And then I'll be like, What do you mean why?

Evelyn was so headstrong for such a little girl. She moved a mile a minute and changed direction constantly. In the classroom, she was almost too smart for her own good.

I was always in trouble as a kid. I don't know if it was necessary because I had strong features or already because I was a wanderer and they couldn't control me naturally or I was misunderstood. The teachers are like, We no longer want a hyper person. We no longer want someone's going to distract other kids. They used to say, She talks too much. And then they called my parents and said how I am misbehaving believing, and they felt embarrassed that, Why am I like this? Why am I so rebellious?

The more they tried to get through to Evelyn, the more she resisted. There was only one person in that house who could actually persuade her to slow down. Her brother, Fred.

I remember I would go on his desk, and all I would see is numbers and words. And so me as a sister, it would always be, I academic talks. It would always be like, You have to focus in school.

And he could get her to focus. When he explained things, they just clicked.

He was more like a teacher to me, and I felt like every time I spoke to him, it was like a teacher talking student. In a sense, he was a light to my life.

But when Evelyn was just nine years old, she lost her big brother in a car accident.

My brother passed away on October 10, 1999, and it changed the entire family's history.

I think throughout this whole time, the family was moaning because it was sudden and he was young. He passed away in a way where it was not not spoken about much, and nobody really spoke to us or said, Oh, are you okay? Or, How are you doing? It was more so like, Yeah, we understand there's a passing of a relative, but then nothing else with us.

I stopped paying attention in class. I wanted to disconnect with the classroom because my brother was the one who made me love learning, but he was gone. So if I'm not interested in this, why am I still in the environment? And I think that's where my parents are like, We're moving.

The family moved to a quieter part of Canada in the hopes that it would help Evelyn Evelyn settled down. But in this new town, Evelyn was bored out of her mind, so she started wandering about again. One day, Evelyn was out on her bike and and hit a car. It wasn't a serious accident.

In my head, I'm like, Okay, great. I get away with hitting someone's car, and I don't have to pay for the damages, is what I was thinking.

But Evelyn's mom took it as a sign that she needed to get strict.

My mom's like, You should have never, ever allowed that to pass. I just didn't want to hear the repercussions of what I've done. And my mom is someone that she will make a scene. There was a lot of tension between me and my mom. When I was younger, I didn't really get along with her. There was a lot of fights where I'll argue with her and misunderstanding. I just remember just being... I wasn't connecting with her.

When the school year ended, Evan's mom took her to Ghana to see her grandparents. She wasn't particularly excited about traveling with her mom, but she soon adjusted.

I got introduced to new friends. We would explore, go play games, video games, and it still felt like we were in Canada, but the difference was We had to, let's say, build our own community.

But as the summer wrapped up, a bombshell was dropped on Evelyn. Her mom would be going back to Canada alone. Evelyn would be staying in Ghana.

I was upset because I needed some time to at least say goodbye to my friends.

Evelyn stayed in Ghana for a few years. She made friends and found her way, but never felt at home. And her mom's betrayal lingered. So when that same mother summoned her back to Canada, the now teenage Evelyn, wasn't interested in being the obedient and studious girl that her mom expected she had become. She had other plans.

When it hits for second break lunch, everyone was coming to our parties and jams. It just started from word of mouth, letting people know that when it's lunch period, it's time to come party, come have fun. We have the best sound system. Through that, we started to create our own vibe during lunch period.

But kids can't keep a secret, right? And teachers notice when the loudest voice in the room is missing.

My parents got concerned because they're like, How is she missing class? We are getting calls. So I'm like, Okay, so I have to find a different way so that my parents don't get information on these parties. I call the school answering machine. Hello.

Good afternoon.

I bless you. My name is Obaya. My daughter is Evelyn Coomson. She will not be coming to class tomorrow due to personal reasons. Please don't call back. We are going to be calling you when she'll be coming back to class. Please have a blessed day. God bless you.

Bye. My friend, you're a fraud fan.

How do you mimic your mother and everything? I told her, I'm like, These are the accents we keep inside where we don't bring them out. I'm a true African.

So, of course, when your kid is organizing house parties during the lunch hour, impersonating your voice, and is altogether ungovernable, the only course of action for good Ghanaian parents, the most rational choice is to send your child to Sweden for Christmas.

My Auntie told me that I was going to Sweden for Christmas I was super, super excited in the sense where I had never been to Sweden, but I've heard so much about Sweden.

Okay, Evan did have an aunt in Sweden who called Austin to chat.

On Christmas Day, the next day, my dad's like, Oh, okay, so we're going to go see our family in Sweden. Say bye to your aunties. I'm like, Why would I say bye to them? I'm coming to see them back again. Why would I do that?

During this Christmas trip, my mom wasn't around. She was in Ghana. I had to go to Sweden with my dad. It was a little suspicious for me because wouldn't it be my mom taking me to her sister? But in my mind, I'm like, This is the great opportunity to build a bond with my dad.

The two went to Amsterdam. When they touched down, her dad said, Hey, we've got an eight-hour layover to Sweden. Let's stretch our legs a bit.

I remember pushing the car with my hand luggage and just wondering, why are we walking aimlessly and not going towards our flight?

We'll be back in a quick second. Stay tuned.

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You're listening to Mind Your Own. Let's get back into it.

So we would walk around and come back every so often towards the gate. That's how the car, the flight was going to Ghana. I remember asking my dad, I'm like, Why do we keep coming back to this gate when we're trying to go on to Sweden? And then he explained to me that maybe Sweden's flight may be delayed, so the best option is to keep these options open.

And when it came time to get on the plane to Stockholm...

He made us miss the flight to Sweden.

Instead...

He finally decided that we should get into the line that's going towards Ghana. I think at that very moment, I felt like so many emotions running through my mind all at once, saying that everything I had was just crumbling down. I would maybe not see my friends, and they will have so much fun without me. I felt like maybe I wouldn't be cool again. I was talking to myself a lot, saying, Why wasn't I smart enough to see this coming.

She was stunned, to say the least. But what could she do? She was still just a teenager traveling with her father. She was fuming at him for tricking her and so disappointed that her Auntie had gone along with the Sweden story. But deep down, she knew that this plan had her mother's fingerprints all over it.

I remember seeing the aircraft in which we were landing in and looking out the windows and saying, Wow, we're back to Ghana. When we got off the plane, the first thing I felt it was the hot air in Ghana. When you walk through the airport, it says, Welcome, Aqaba. And I looked at that, I'm like, Wow, this is the welcome I get. My uncle came to pick us up, and while we were driving to the house. I was listening to the old school songs, and I remember listening to the music like, I don't want to be here. This is not how I want to be treated. This is not how I want to be back. And then when we arrived, I remember they opened the gates to the house, and then I saw my cousins who were supposed to be sleeping in their pajamas, and they come out like, Oh, you're back. It was like, What are you doing here? And they were excited, but I wasn't excited to see them. I was talking to myself a lot, saying, So I'm here. I'm back here again. How am I going to get out of this situation?

She moped around the house, refusing to engage with her cousins. When her mom finally showed up, she gave her the evil eye. And at dinnertime, time, she declared a hunger strike.

And I remember one of my uncles were like, Why don't you tell your dad that you don't want to be here? Don't tell your mom because we know your mom doesn't feel that way about you. But tell your dad your heart. At first I was a bit hesitant, but then I knew I had to do something at that very moment to convince my dad to bring me back. In my mind, I'm like, Okay, my dad now sees that I'm not eating. I'm not doing anything. So I feel like there's a soft part of him that will hear me out because I've been in scenarios like that before where I apologize to my dad, and my dad will forgive me.

Evelyn's mom was indeed unbothered. But her dad did seem concerned about his daughter.

I do remember he would be like, Evelyn, do you mind coming to eat? Because if you don't eat, you're going to get sick. At that very time, he was not happy. You could tell he felt bad.

Evelyn decided she had nothing to lose. Two weeks after she arrived in Ghana on a day that her mom went out to run some errands, she came out of her bedroom, found her father, and made her case.

When my mom was out, then I went to my dad and said, Dad, look at this. I don't want to be here. I have accepted my mistakes. If you could help me to go back, I will not disappoint you. So when I told him, he's like, You know what? I will listen. Tomorrow, we're going to go to the KLM, and I'm going to book you a one-way flight back to Canada. I was blown away. He's like, make sure that nobody knows about this decision. Make sure that your mom does not hear about this, and that we would go to KLM in the morning, and I would go the same exact day. So that night, I remember packing my stuff and then getting ready for the next day. My dad's like, Oh, your mom's going to go out, so be on standby. The morning comes and then my mom leaves and then it's me and my dad. He's like, Okay, let's get going. I showered, got ready. I was excited. He's like, Let's take your bags. We took our car and my dad is like, Okay, I have to get you stuff to bring back to your Auntie who's staying at our place in Canada.

So he's like, Let's just go to the market. It's called Makula. Makula is one of the biggest markets in Ghana. And so we went there and got dry fish. It was stuff that when you're going back to Canada, you bring. I knew In my head, I'm like, Yes, I get to go back. So we got those stuff, and then we went to book a one-way flight to Canada. And my dad paid almost $2,000 just for this flight back. When we did that, I was excited. I'm like, okay, I get to go home. I get to go see my friends. I get to be back. So we get to the airport. Just as I was about to take out my luggage from the car, my mom appears, and my mom is like, How can you do this to me, your wife, for this Bonsam.

Bonsam means devil. How can you deceive me and go behind my back and basically take our kid back to Canada in my eyes over my dead body?

My name is Ya Ousunseya, and my daughter is Evelyn Kunaedukunsen. Before then, then, the way you were in the Papadina. I had been suspicious for a while. Because of the close relations she had with her father. I felt like they were talking behind me. Whenever they were together, I could tell that the atmosphere had changed because of my presence. And so, one time, I got home from town and I saw packed bags, and I felt something in me say, Just go to the airport and see what happens. And that was how I found out. It was just a mother's instinct.

She walked over to our car, and then I remember being in front of the airport and everyone looking at us like, What's going on? What's happening right I said, Me, did not. Me, no more.

I created a huge scene. Oh, my God. I followed them all over the place, even to the KLM office.

I was thinking to myself, Why is she trying to stop me. At that very moment, I'm like, Okay, should I just walk behind her and go?

I was literally that persistent for three hours saying no.

But then I realized that she took my luggage.

She's not going to get on the plane.

No way.

It was clear who was going to win this showdown. Evelyn and her dad took that walk of shame back to the car.

I remember the car ride home, my mom just talking throughout and my dad just being silent and not having anything to say. And I just was in my emotions, yelling my thoughts in my head like, How did she do this?

Over the Christmas break, her parents' plans for her started to unfold. They were going to enroll her in a boarding school in Ghana and leave her there while they returned to Canada.

Third day or fourth day, my uncle and a bunch of masculine men came to drag me out because I said I wouldn't go to boarding school, and they packed me in my parents' car On the drive, I remember people were like, What is going on? Why is she chained up? My uncle was driving the car. He's like, Oh, don't mind it. She doesn't want to go to school. Everybody was like, Yes, take her. When we got to the school, I remember the four masculine men took me out of the car and they dropped me on the floor. And then all of a sudden, the school secretary came out and said, What are you guys doing? What's going on? They're like, Oh, she doesn't want to come to school. He's like, If someone doesn't want to come to school, you don't drag the person to school. Let me take you to the director.

While we were walking to the director's office, I was telling myself, I'm like, This is going to be an opportunity for me to tell the director, to tell my parents to take me back without a fight.

The director of the school gracefully welcomes me as a queen He's like, How are you? 'Ohima. 'Ohima means queen.

Things were falling off of my hair because he's like, What happened?

I told my story that I came from Canada, and this is my second time being in Ghana. I was deceived, and now I don't want to go to this school. Then he asked me where my parents are from. I told him who I was. He's like, Maybe I need to investigate who your parents are. The director of the school Well, he invited my parents to the school the next day.

He gave me a nice place to stay.

Then when my parents came the next day, he asked my mom, specifically, who she is, who she is. My mom starts to explain where she's from, the director is like, Wait, then you're my sister. That means Evelyn is my niece. Then I realized that the director of the school was my uncle.

So it's my great grandmother's sister's son, basically.

In case you weren't tracking that either, the point is, Evelyn's mom and the school director were related. It took a moment for everyone to wrap their minds around that family tree revelation. Once they did, the school director offered Evelyn something she was almost totally unfamiliar with. A choice.

My uncle wanted me to stay with him for some time to see if I liked it or not. He gave me an option. You can stay with me, see how it goes, and if you don't like it, then we could always take you back. I knew in my head, I'm like, Canada, it would be great. But then I didn't want to deal with my parents.

After a hunger strike, a crushing defeat at the airport, and literally getting dragged to school, Evelyn sat in that office that day and thought about what to do. Surprisingly, she felt calm.

The decision just flowed.

Although she had found herself in the same situation again, tricked by her parents, back in Ghana, and on her way to school, this wasn't deja vu.

That was It was more gentle. It was more genuine. I was at peace, and it was more like, I will not be treated the way I was when I first came to Ghana. It was meant for me to be there. She could call him an uncle.

She could live at his place and hang out with his children. She started sobering up and listening to his advice as well. And he was very supportive. Calming her down and telling her, This is for your own good. And that started to make things get better between myself and her.

I just knew I'll flourish where I was because there was a lot of resources that were going to keep me happy and keep me away from that struggling period in my life.

I'm just thankful to God for how everything ended.

Where is she? Come on, are you good?

They were doing everything to protect me from any outcome that would cause them distress or cause them to lose me. So I think Me going to Ghana in a tender way made me come back in a great way as a queen. When I graduated from school, my mom's like, I think now you're okay.

A parent cannot parent by themselves.

You raise your child, but so does the environment they are in. And there is only so much you can do about that. That's real. I was just with my nephews and nieces, and the things coming out their mouths was just... I just didn't recognize this version of a child. They were singing a song, a rhyme about Jeff Bezos.

Everything is going to be all right, Jeff Bezos. I don't remember the words.

I just remember, I don't know why these kids know Jeff Bezos and why they're singing about him.

That's crazy. No, but I was just saying, that's wild. And so if my child starts to sing about Jeff Bezos, I might take them home. I I might take them to Kenya. I might just do that.

Thank you to Evelyn Coomson and her mother, Ya Osu N'cian, for bringing this tale to us. Evelyn is now an actress, host model, and vlogger who split her time between Ghana and Canada. To find her latest videos and projects, please check out the show notes. Thanks for listening. It's been good to have you. I enjoyed going with to the airport destination, Stockholm. We ordered our complimentary drinks, took a nap, and awoke as we landed among the palm trees of a Ha. Damn, they got us again. We'll see you the next time, you mind your own. Until then, here's a song from the continent, Rolling Loud by So Madina. African girl with the energy, full force by all my enemies.

You don't really want that side of me. You don't really want that side of me. African girl with the energy, full force by all my enemies. Mind Your Own is hosted and produced by me, Lupita Nyong'o.

This is a production of Snap Studios at KQED with sales and distribution by Lemonada Media. The executive producers are Glenn Washington and Mark Ristich. Our managing editor is Regina Beddiako. Our director of production is Marissa Dodge. Original music in my story, Up in the Air, was by Lauren Newsen. The story, Who's Bad, was produced by Jessica Carissa. Translation by Oral O'Furi. Voiceover by A Queer, Edu Ose Al-Hassan. Original music by Laleen St. Just. Our mind your own producers are David Exame and Priscilla Alaby. Our story scouts are Ashley Oquosa, Fiona Nyong'o, Jessica Carissa and Lesedi Olucomoche. Our editors are Nancy Lopes and Anna Sussmann. Our story consultant is John Fisiel. Engineering by Miles Lassie. Our music Supervisor is Sandra Lawson-Ndu, also known as Sandhu Ndu. She also created the Mind Your Own theme song with Peach Curls, featuring vocals from Ehirobo. Graphic design by Jemimah Eke. Original artwork by Mateos Sitole. Special thanks to Alan Coy, Jake Kleinberg, Samara Still, Sara Yu, Warner Music Group, and Afropods. Make sure to follow Mind Your Own and listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you get your podcasts. There's even more to love with Lemonada premium.

Subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content from across the network for only 4.99 a month. Subscribe now on Apple Podcasts. Now, go out, get together, and mind your own.

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