Transcript of True Crime Vault: Highway Hunter New

The Hulu original series Furious is coming to Hulu and Hulu on Disney+ July 27th. There are 3 victims we know of. The suspect is female, white, late 20s. Female serial killers kill for power, control. I believe there is a deeper motivation here.

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What happened to your daughter Tiffany? She was murdered. She'd just gotten married 3 months before that. The entire community was in fear. Yes, there's a killer on the loose.

All 4 of the girls, they were doing ordinary things. Laura Smith was jogging down the road. If you can remember anything, please contact the police department. Kelly Cox was going to school. Tiffany Johnson was was washing her car at a car wash. Jessica Cambridge was having dinner with some friends.

This is just snatching girls up in broad daylight. And they just happened to cross the path of a serial killer. We could be the next one. There's nothing in this world more powerful or compelling than you want to find your child. This case has been cold for so long, and there's finally an answer.

One they got from a stunning tape seen in public for the very first time tonight. As you relax and let go, you will drift into hypnosis. He was pretty much a one-man crime spree. He started driving until he found someone. Constantly hunting.

He was a predator on the prowl. Sounds like a monster.

4 young women disappear in 1997. It's a mystery that baffles investigators and fuels their families' quest for answers for almost 25 years. The first to vanish is Laura Smither, just 12 years old. What was Laura like? Uh, she was a joy.

She was so sweet and so caring and so loyal, fiercely loyal to all her girlfriends. She was one of my best friends. We spent a lot of time together. Everybody loved Laura. She was just one of those people, I always say she was touched by light, because everybody loved her.

She was the friend that would come over to your house and make you look bad because she would help put away the dishes after dinner.

Anora wasn't perfect. She was a normal kid, but she was very smart, wickedly smart. She could have done anything. She would have turned 13. She'd been counting down the days for 87 days.

About to become a teenager. She was so excited to become a teenager.

In 1997, Friendswood was just a very quiet, small town. So we're about halfway between the city of Houston and Galveston. In '97, we had been voted one of the top 10 safest cities in America.

Laura lived near the creek, and their house was kind of magical because I would go there and they would always have the computers going, and we could go outside and explore and climb trees. There wasn't a lot of development in the area. It was a quiet country road. Laura lived on Wearderry at the end, and so if we were in the kitchen, You could see right to the end of the road from inside the house.

Laura wanted to be a professional ballerina. She had just gotten accepted into the Houston Ballet Academy.

Ballet was probably the most important part of her life besides her family.

She loved to dance. She was always choreographing little pieces, and she'd put on little plays for us.

She started when she was 6. She did ballet, tap, and jazz. Wow, for 6 years. But she just really loved ballet more than anything.

Take me back to April 3rd, 1997. What are you doing that morning here?

It was a Thursday, and because I'd been out of town, I said, okay, we'll do pancakes with bacon, which was Laura's favorite. She'd just finished reading a book and it was all about running and exercise and building your endurance. She felt that if she did that, she could hold her arabesque longer and it would make her stronger for ballet. And her dad was a runner, he ran every day, so I granted her permission to go running while we fixed breakfast. And of course she didn't come back.

We knew immediately that something was wrong. Immediately. And we called the police within an hour of that happening. But our top story tonight, she's only 12 years old, and at this hour, she's missing. It made the news that first day.

While police concentrate the search near the girl's home, her parents wait and hope. It's just been concentrated here around the house, as far as I know. There are some open fields that she might have run by. And they've, you know, searched those areas very thoroughly. She is a very good girl.

She— something very unusual has happened that she would have been home. Someone had to have taken her. The search continues this morning for a missing 12-year-old Friendswood girl. Do you travel on this road at this time of day? Did you see anything unusual at this time yesterday?

Yesterday, no. Not at all. Nothing? Did you see my daughter? I ended up running the ground search, and I was drinking from a fire hose.

Hundreds of people flooded to come help us search, and then it just exploded.

Overnight, family, friends blanketed the neighborhood with flyers. At daylight, a small army of searchers fanned out.

Lori's dad went out with the first wave of volunteers, grateful for all the support. Someone encouraged by the turnout this morning. I've been overwhelmed by the community support and the police. What was it like for you and your family last night? Don't ask me.

Laura was a 12-year-old little girl, and it just touched people.

The community of Friendswood is very close, and they felt that Laura was one of their own. I'm going home. I'm gonna hug my kids and kind of regroup a little bit, and I'll be ready to run in the morning. People from all over Houston put their lives on hold. The best came out in some people.

We offer it to you and pray that you would watch over Laura wherever she is. People of different denominations, different faiths, all showing up together to pray for this child, hoping that maybe that will have some power. I just want to let her know that we are going to find you, and we're not going to stop until we do find you. Ah. Please keep her in your prayers.

The FBI has been called in on this search. Now police are calling it an abduction. Their parents grow more frantic by the hour. Volunteers trudged through swamps and dodged snakes, but by day's end, there was nothing to report. It was a tough search for anyone involved in being out there.

They had— that went on for days. They covered over 75 square miles. They plan to do the same thing again until Laura is found.

There is a maximum commitment to find you and do everything the law permits to bring you to justice.

Just about every police agency in the area was involved in the search. You have a 12-year-old girl who goes jogging at 9 o'clock in the morning, and for whatever reason, no one saw anything. She was here one second and gone the next. We were worried that whoever took her was still out there and that we could be the next one. And our top story this morning, what could be a nightmare comes true.

It was like déjà vu. Somebody had to have taken her. It's like she just disappeared. It has almost picture-perfect ties to the Smither case. The entire community was in fear.

Yes. There's a killer on the loose. Yes, exactly.

The search goes on for 12-year-old Laura Kate Smither. There's no sign of 12-year-old girl. The ground search is swelling into its 6th day. Whoever has Laura, we would like you to bring her home now.

3 weeks after she disappears, there's a town hall meeting. Just remember sitting there feeling numb. This was for my child. You need to allow the chief and the FBI some time to analyze some of the information. It was a couple of hours later before the police chief made it here to tell us that indeed a body had been found.

And it was like a dark blanket just swallowed us. The household, we just were silent. Nobody spoke. The police left. And we just all stayed in this room all night.

Based on our knowledge of the case and evidence recovered at the scene, I am prepared to say that the young lady found is, in fact, Laura Kate Smither.

She had a ring that she would wear that had her initials, and she was wearing her socks. It's a— it's a hole. It's just a void that exists for a long time. And even now. The city was heartbroken.

People, I think, felt like that could have been their child. And so Laura was everybody's child.

Once Laura was found, I think it was understood at that point that this was not an accident. This was an intentional abduction and homicide of a 12-year-old.

We were worried that whoever took her was still out there and that we could be the next one.

3 months later and 300 miles north, those worries prove true when another woman goes missing. 20-Year-old Kelli Cox heads out for the day and is never seen alive again. What was Kelli Cox like growing up?

Growing up, she was always very independent, even as a little child. I mean, one time I told her, "Don't put your fingers on that again." So she reached over with her toes.

Kelly had a really good sense of humor. Kelly Cox is also a mom to her own independent daughter, Alexis. Say hi to the camera. Say hi to the red light. Hi.

Hi. Kelly was a young mom. She had big plans and big dreams. Give Mommy some sugar. How old was she when she had Alexis?

She was 19, just— Barely 19. Did she like motherhood? She said it was the happiest day of her life. Listen here, Miss Thing, you need to laugh, laugh, laugh. The day that Alexis was born, and she said that any number of times, happiest day of my life, Mom.

Do you have memories of your mom, Kelly? I always knew I was loved. Well, it's beautiful the way she giggles with me and the way I giggle back as a baby.

She was an excellent student and very focused. She delivered Alexis, and a week later she took her finals at the community college, made all A's. Kelly breezes through community college.

And then heads to the University of North Texas studying psychology and criminal justice with plans to be a therapist. I'm like, wow, you're really on track. She had a plan and she was sticking to it. Oh, I mean, I think she would have been a phenomenal mother.

Bettering her future so she could better our future. She said, Mom, I need to support Alexis and me. And that's one reason she insisted on summer school classes, because she wanted to graduate in May of '98. She would have been a phenomenal role model as well, but sometimes that's not the way that things go.

Tell us about that morning. It's like it just happened yesterday. She was leaning back in her bed, her hair up on top of her head. I said, "Have a good day. I love you.

I'll see you this afternoon." On July 15th, 1997, Kelly was touring the city of Denton jail for her criminal justice class.

So she comes out of the building, and what happens? She tried to get into her car. She couldn't get into it. Couldn't open the door? Couldn't open the door.

She, you know, the key would not work. So she walks to a nearby convenience store to call her boyfriend for help. But by the time he arrives here, Kelly is nowhere to be found. When he got there, her car was there in the parking lot, but of course she was nowhere to be seen.

He opened the car, sat in there. She never showed up. So he left a note saying, "Hey, it got hot. Call me." Kelly's seen on surveillance video. She was seen doing the tour of the jail.

They didn't have cameras on the outside. There was no cameras or anything over there at the gas station, no cameras in the immediate vicinity. They confirmed that Kelly did go inside the gas station, so they knew that she was there. But no one saw where she went. She just disappeared.

The police station's on one end of the road, and where Kelly was at is on the other end of the road, but it was within probably 200 yards of the police station. It's pretty bold to kidnap a young woman next to a police station. It was real scary because you just don't know. And it was so unlike her. She wouldn't just leave her car and abandon it.

And it was at 4 o'clock on that day that Lawrence called me— the boyfriend called me and asked me if I had heard from Kelly. And then when 5:30 finally rolled around, I knew without a doubt something Mm-hmm. That was wrong, because that's when she was supposed to pick Alexis up from the babysitter. She wouldn't have just left her. So that's when her mom knew she's missing.

Something serious has gone wrong. It's like she was there one minute, and then she was gone. Right from the get-go, I'm thinking somebody had to have taken her. It makes you wonder how many times the person who kidnapped her had done this. He knew the exact right moment approach a victim.

Young mother is missing. Kelly Cox disappeared without a trace. I have to remain optimistic that we're gonna find her. I couldn't see her, couldn't find her. I had a bad feeling.

Investigators questioned Lawrence Harris yesterday for 4 hours. Whenever you're dealing with missing persons or any type of homicide investigation, more often than not, it's someone that you know. There's rarely a situation where it's just a true whodunit. It was natural at that time to look into the boyfriend. We all want the same thing.

We want her to come home safe. He had been seen in that parking lot. He was sitting there for an extended period of time. They have questioned the boyfriend, and he has passed a lie detector test. He wasn't a good suspect in the case.

There are no witnesses. Her boyfriend passes the polygraph, and leads are going nowhere. They really did everything that they possibly could to generate a lead. Even the leads that were coming in, they weren't really fruitful, but no clear-cut concrete evidence about what happened to her. The case eventually went cold.

So the days turned into weeks, the weeks into months, and the months into years. Yes. We always tried to keep the story out there. I wanted people to know it was not a solved case and Kelly was not home. There's nothing in this world more powerful or compelling than you want to find your child.

11 days after Kelli Cox went missing, another young woman vanished.

Her name was Tiffany Johnston. She was in Oklahoma, about 3 hours north of Denton. Where was Tiffany born and raised? She was born in Chickasaw, but she was raised in Anadarko. Anadarko is a little town in, uh, Southwestern Oklahoma, everybody knows everybody.

Everybody grows up together, goes to school together, goes to church together. Tiffany was so energetic and daring. Tiffany was my shadow. Everywhere I went, Tiffany went with me. Oh, that's not an idea, honey.

That's a fact. Wherever Mama was, Tiffany was going to be there learning how to do something or helping. We went to junior high and high school together. I didn't have friends, and I think she saw that and decided that she was going to be my friend. She just loved life, loved life, and nothing could stop her.

Ryan and her dated for about a year. She just had this sixth sense about people. So if she had decided at 19 that he was the one, like, He was the one. She wanted a big wedding. Big wedding, yes.

Cost a lot of money. Yeah, I took a job.

Yep. And I made enough to pay for it.

It was July 26, 1997, the day Tiffany Johnston disappeared from the Sunshine Car Wash here in Bethany, Oklahoma. That night, she had plans to celebrate her 3-month wedding anniversary with her husband. And she stopped at a car wash along the way, and she went missing. It was late at night. Was it normal for people to be washing their cars here that late?

Those were the summer months. And yes, this was a very popular car wash. What happened? What did you see? So about 11:30 PM. I was heading to another call, and I drove by the car wash.

There's several occupants still in the car wash washing. I also observed a white Dodge Neon in the far west bay.

I continued on to my call, came back about 45 minutes later, and that car was still there, no one around it, and it was the only car still there.

When they arrived the second time, they noticed some floor mats were hanging up on the rack like someone would wash them. The car was unlocked. The keys were in the ignition. There was money in the console. Payroll check was in the console.

So it didn't appear to be a robbery. It just appeared to be whoever drove the car just wasn't there. We did find a phone number to Kathy Dobry, which was Tiffany's mother.

And then after midnight, you get a phone call. It was the Bethany Police Department wanting to know if I knew who Tiffany Dobre was.

And I said, "Yes, I'm her mother." And they said, "Well, we found her car is sitting abandoned." Police also contact Ryan. Who rushes to the car wash. The husband didn't have any idea where she was and was very concerned. Did you try to call her? Yes, and she didn't answer, and that was something really unusual.

Her pager was in the car, everything, and that was really when I really got really scared because she didn't go anywhere without it. In this kind of case, you don't have any physical evidence to go with, and typically you look at the spouse first.

They interviewed him. They checked his alibi. He was at work at 11:00 that night. Ryan's work punch card rules him out as a suspect. The thing about this particular crime scene, it didn't appear to be a struggle.

It's just that Tiffany wasn't there. We're not sure exactly what happened, but we had concerns that something bad might have happened to Tiffany. The very next day, Tiffany's partially clothed body is found in a tall patch of grass here near the interstate. She had been raped and strangled to death.

It was hard to just digest that someone would want to murder her because everybody that met her liked her. Why would somebody want to murder Tiff? I just lost it because I'm 19. At 19, these things don't happen. I still believed that the world is good and people are good.

This particular case, it's really tough that there's no particular witness. There were swabs that came from Tiffany Johnson that the medical examiner had collected. Those swabs were taken for DNA analysis. And those results were inconclusive at the time. And at that point, we were The case went cold.

Now there are 3 cases— Laura and Tiffany found murdered and Kelly still missing, handled by 3 different police departments along the interstate. There's no sense that these cases are linked. Then, 4 weeks later, a nightmare comes true for some Tiki Island parents. Their 17-year-old daughter has been missing for more than 24 hours. And police say this is no runaway.

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It's the summer of 1997 and 3 young women have mysteriously vanished. There was Laura Smither, just 12 years old, out for a jog near her home in Friendswood, Texas. Then there was a college student and young mother, Kelly Cox, taken near a police station in North Texas. And finally, up in Bethany, Oklahoma, 19-year-old newlywed Tiffany Johnston was last seen at a car wash.. And now August brings more heartache back in Texas.

Our top story this morning, what could be a nightmare comes true for some Tiki Island parents. Their 17-year-old daughter has been missing for more than 24 hours, and police say this is no runaway. If you have my daughter and you're through with her, I promise you, I I pray will that you would return her because her daddy and I still want her. 17-Year-old recent high school graduate Jessica Cain is the only child of Susie and C.H. Cain.

What did she mean to you, Jessica? Oh, well, she meant everything in the world. You know, you could lose a limb, an arm, or something, and it'd be easier than doing without your child. Right in the face! She was a parent's dream.

She was just as good a child as you could ever want. Say hello to Mr. Rodney, everybody! She did plays in elementary, junior high, high school, and so she'd been at the drama house for 2 or 3 years playing different events. And what were her dreams? What did she want to do?

Jessica wanted to study criminology. Her immediate plans were to go to college. Did she get to attend one college class? No, she was starting the next week. Tell us about August 1997 and the play she was acting in.

She was in a musical Song for the Peoples. And when we sat down in the audience, she grabbed me by the arm and pulled me out of the chair, and we jitterbugged down the aisle to her stage. And what do you remember about her performance that night? How pretty she looked, how excited she was.

I went up to tell her how proud I was of her, and the last thing she said to me was, "I love you, Daddy." After the play was over with, the cast members went to have dinner at Bennigan's Restaurant. She was driving her dad's white Ford pickup truck. Jessica, they saw her going down the entrance ramp to the freeway. And that was the last anybody saw of Jessica Kay.

I had stayed up in the recliner and was waiting up for her, and I dozed off to sleep. And it was about 2:30, I guess, when I woke up and I realized she wasn't here. And that's when I immediately began to panic.

She woke me up, and I just jumped out of bed and hit the road looking for her. About 2 and a half hours after I left the house, I found the truck on the side of the road. It was empty.

It was the most horrible feeling you could imagine, of emptiness and hurt, because I knew that something tragically had happened.

There were reports, probably 50, 60 sightings of a white pickup truck being chased by the vehicle at high speed down the freeway. It was so close to the bumper, it was like it was being towed. We beg you, please, if you know anything, if you can help us in any way, help us find our daughter. Anybody that can spare a little time, we would appreciate your coming out and helping us. Any way that you possibly can.

What did the search for Jessica look like?

At one time, I think I was told there were 6,000 responses, and people walking the fields looking for her. It's all salt grass filled with cottonmouths and rattlesnakes, and beating their way through the brush piles and thick areas around the coast. It was like déjà vu. I mean, thousands of people joined in the search for Jessica Cain. Incredibly, Laura Smither's parents, still grieving from the loss of their own daughter, joined the search.

She must never give up her hope. There was no question that we had to go help. You said we had to do that. We didn't have to. For us, we had to.

We had to give back what people had been so kind to us, and there was no question we had to go find Jessica. It's a nightmare relived. Um, it's, it's very painful. What did Bob and Gay give you? They gave us their hearts and their love and their support and the knowledge that they'd already been there.

Yeah. They'd already been through it. But as the boxes were boxed and the supplies were shipped out, volunteers could only fight back tears because Jessica is still missing. This is kind of a letdown, but we're going to keep searching. We're going to keep— we're going to find her.

In Jessica's case, there was nothing. No leads at all.

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. I think after Jessica came up missing, that's when people started believing there was a serial killer involved. We were so scared because the thing that we had been afraid of all along, that there was this monster. Jessica Cain is now the fourth young woman who had gone missing, three in Texas, one in Oklahoma. But what authorities investigating those cases at the time did not know was that there was a 5th young woman taken who escaped.

Somebody just came in and said that someone was abducted and they jumped out of the car. Police take the unprecedented step of hypnotizing her. Do you have any French? French?

And hopes that she recalls any details before this man strikes again.

The desperate search for a 12-year-old girl in Friendswood is on this afternoon. Kelly Cox disappeared without a trace. Here in the Lamar, Tiki Island area, searchers will be searching for 17-year-old Jessica Cain. Families and investigators are puzzled. 4 young women have gone missing in Texas and Oklahoma, including 12-year-old Laura Smither, who dreamed of of being a ballerina.

She went running one morning and was found dead 3 weeks later. But based on our knowledge of the case and evidence recovered at the scene, I am prepared to say that the young lady found is in fact Laura Kate Smither. At the time, it was terrifying for all of us, for the whole community. While the murder of little Laura dominated the local news, there the fifth girl who was taken. But this kidnapping had not received much media attention at the time.

On May 17th, 1997, just weeks after Laura Smither's body is found, a 19-year-old woman is kidnapped in Webster, Texas, mere miles from Friendswood. Sandra Seipol was in a neighboring city in Webster, which is immediately adjacent to the city of Friendswood. On the I-45, it's a small city on the I-45 corridor between Houston and Galveston. It's about 1:30 in the morning when 19-year-old Sandra Sapa stops at that convenience store behind me. She's using a payphone outside calling a friend when she notices a strange man parked nearby staring at her.

She tells her friend to meet her at this Waffle House across the street, but as she starts driving And there she notices she's got a flat tire.

As she pulled into the back of the Waffle House, the unknown person who was watching her across the street at the stop-and-go had followed her across the street.

This individual pulls up beside her and tells her she's got a flat tire and asks her if she would like for him to change it. He looks like a good Samaritan trying to help. Yeah, so like a— in her words, just a normal cowboy, you know. He opens the hood of his truck and asks her to go to his front seat and get a rag, which she does. He comes up behind her with a large hunting knife and puts it to her neck and tells her to get into the truck or he's going to kill her.

I'm going to kill her. She gets in the truck. He starts driving north on I-45. He's driving at a high rate of speed. He was holding her down, told her to take off her pants.

So it was clear to her that he was going to sexually assault her. She then said, I can't take my pants off because my shoes are on. I have to take my shoes off. So he lets go of her leg, and as soon as he did that, she opened the truck door. She felt like that was her only chance, that she was going to be killed one way or the other, and this was her only chance to possibly get away.

So she made the decision to jump out of the moving vehicle.

Webster 911.

Somebody just came in and said that someone was abducted and they jumped out of the car and they're bleeding. Call came over the radio as an aggravated kidnapping. American Route to Waffle House. Female jumped out of a white dually. Unknown LP.

Last seen headed 45 northbound. She needs an ambulance. She can't walk. As I arrived on scene, I just started gathering as much information as possible. Sandra Sapaugh had been critically injured.

But in spite of that trauma, she was able to recall that her kidnapper was driving a white Ford Dually truck, and she provided a very basic physical description of the driver. White male in his 30s, blonde hair with a beard. Sandra Sapa is transported to a local hospital where she remains for several days. Had road rash from head to toe, so severe injury to her her head that I remember. Her clothes were ripped and torn.

Among the evidence collected, the left front tire from the young woman's vehicle. The tire had been punctured, and police note that the puncture looked like it was made with a knife. There was interviews done, but there wasn't anything concrete linking her abduction to any individual. Fearing that there could be a serial rapist on the loose, Investigators bring in a police officer who's trained in hypnosis. It was the very first time this unconventional tool was used by the Webster Police Department.

She was so traumatized, there was very little she could recall. As you relax and let go, in the very process of relaxing, you will gradually drift into hypnosis. For more than 2 hours, they painstakingly go through every detail of the crime.

During her hypnosis, I asked her to describe the inside of the vehicle.

She was able to recall some details through the hypnosis and gave a description of the vehicle and the suspect. Incredibly, with the help from the hypnotist, police narrowed their search to one man. He was a predator on the prowl, constantly hunting. The predator remains at large, but the hypnosis session proves crucial in a race against time. Police flip the script.

The hunter is now the hunted. Okay, now, wow, boys, get in the truck. Get in the truck.

He was a predator on the prowl, constantly hunting. He started driving until he found someone. Sounds like a monster. We were worried we could be the next one. The entire community was in fear.

Yes. There's a killer on the loose. There's a feeding frenzy on this case. The press is all over it. All over it.

What keeps you going? What allows you to move forward? Catching who did it. There's nothing in this world more powerful or compelling than you want to find your child. But one victim escaped and helped find the killer under hypnosis.

Just relax. This case has been cold for so long, and there's finally an answer.

He just put his hand over something. All four of them. Wow. So that was one of those, oh geez, you know. What a moment.

It was their fault. They did something wrong to annoy him. Okay, if y'all would get shoulder to shoulder. You have said you could feel the evil in the room. I want you to repeat after me in a loud, clear voice.

Do not scream. Do not scream. Do not scream. Do not scream.

Laura Smither, just 12 years old, goes missing on April 3rd, 1997. She's found murdered 17 days later. That July, two other young women go missing farther north Kelly Cox in Denton, outside of Dallas, and Tiffany Johnston in a suburb of Oklahoma City. Then in August, Jessica Cain disappears off I-45 just north of Galveston. And it's that very same roadway, I-45, that connects these disappearances.

In each case, authorities have very little to go on, but they are not giving up. Laura is no longer just a name in Friendswood. It's a battle cry, a battle cry to find a killer. What the public doesn't know is that investigators working on Laura Smither's murder quickly have someone in their sights.

Very early on, there was a suspect that was developed right from the start, right from the start. His name was William Reese. William Reese was kind of a jack of all trades. He was a truck driver.

He operated heavy equipment. He shooed horses. William Reese had a history of kidnapping people. William Reese had been convicted in Oklahoma in the '80s of kidnapping and sexual assault. He was supposed to serve a 25-year sentence.

He ended up getting out after 9 and a half years of that sentence. On an appeal. William Louis Reese was released October 18, 1996, from Oklahoma Department of Corrections. He was working at a construction site next door, essentially, to where Laura's house was. That morning, he was dismissed early from the construction site because the ground was too wet.

It had been raining. And drove down the same road that Laura had been out for a jog on. It would have taken William Reese in direct path with Laura Smither the morning of April 3rd. Well, as soon as they found out that he had kidnapped a female in Oklahoma and sexually assaulted her, you know, that kind of opens your eyes up pretty quickly. And they talked to him, did an interview.

Early on? Early on. He consented to a search of his vehicle. They took photographs of the inside of the vehicle. Collected fingerprint evidence.

They collected fibers from floor mats and seats. The FBI conducted a polygraph test, which was inconclusive. There were other people on the radar earlier that were being looked at closer for a while, but he was the primary suspect.

There was reasons not to announce it.

Still, behind the scenes, the Friendswood authorities heading up the Smither investigation are willing to discuss their suspect. And that's how a fateful connection between Laura Smither's case and the Sandra Saypock kidnapping is made in October, when Sue Dietrich Nance, the detective who had hypnotized Sandra, stops by the Friendswood Police Department. I spoke with the chief there, and he told me about, you know, who they suspected. And I left his office, went home, and about 3 o'clock in the morning, I woke up and I thought, oh my God, that's who Sandra Sapaugh described was William Reese. The suspect was a thin cowboy who wore a cowboy hat.

He drove a large white duty pickup truck. There was a notepad or what she thought was some type of notepad or calendar on the dashboard. Sue Dietrich-Nance immediately connects investigators from Friendswood and the neighboring town of Webster, where Sandra was taken. Friendswood Police Department had already processed William Reese's vehicle, so they were able to confirm that his vehicle was consistent with what Sandra St. Paul had described being the vehicle that had abducted her. They brought Reese in as part of a live lineup.

There's a one-way mirror where they come in, where Sandra is sitting on the opposite side of the glass. OK, if y'all would, get shoulder to shoulder. One after the other after the other, the investigator had each person say phrases that the suspect might have used. Face the glass, and I want you to repeat after me in a loud, clear voice. Do not scream.

Do not scream. OK, now loud voice. Get in the chair. In the truck. In the truck.

In a loud voice, I'll kill you, bitch. I'll kill you, bitch. Sandra was able to pick Reese out of a lineup. She recognized him, recognized his voice. Webster Police arrested Reese at his home on Fauna Street Thursday.

Detectives say that arrest has almost picture-perfect ties to the Smither case. Just after his arrest for Sandra's kidnapping, Friendswood authorities publicly named Reese as the prime suspect in Laura Smither's murder. We are confident that over the weeks ahead, that evidence will link him to our case and lead to what we have all been aiming for— a successful prosecution and conviction. Ultimately, testing does link Reese to Laura's body. There are fibers on her socks that match the floor mats of his truck and a blanket found in his apartment.

Unfortunately, the evidence was not enough to convince the Harris County District Attorney's Office to file charges in the death of Laura Smither. Were you hopeful that he would be charged? Very hopeful. Laura's murder. Yeah.

And then he wasn't. I was angry. I was very angry at that time. But because he was prosecuted for Sandra Seipach, I was very glad about that. There's a feeding frenzy on this case.

The press is all over it. Reese was a huge case. The seriousness of him also being a possible suspect with Laura Smithers was very high profile. I think you're being unfairly treated, Mr. Reese. Yeah, I do.

How so? By the press. They're pulling it all out of the porch. I didn't do nothing. I ain't know what friends would know.

Reese's whole attitude was so cocky.

He's clause number 76688. State of Texas versus William James Reese. Gaye Smither attended the trial involving Sandra Sapot. She wanted to see this, this man face to face. That was the only thing I could do to try and hold him accountable.

Reese's lawyer is trying to prove that Reese became a suspect in this kidnapping case only after it was revealed he was a suspect in an unrelated murder case, the murder of Laura Smither. Has been is that he's being framed. In the end, the jury takes little more than 7 hours to decide Reese's fate. The verdict has just come in. William Reese has been sentenced to 60 years behind bars.

Reese said he didn't expect such a long sentence. Sir, 60 years. Did that surprise you? Oh, yeah. Yeah, it did.

What did you expect? More leniency. No, I really didn't expect him to be convicted. Really. He's found guilty, and he's sentenced to 60 years in prison.

Did it provide some solace to you? It did, because then we knew he couldn't hurt anyone else. Is he charged for Laura's murder? No. We became resigned to accepting that he was never going to be held accountable for Laura.

And what about the other girls' families? Well, it turns out one of them in Oklahoma knew William Reese. Now, you had a relationship with his mother?

Yes. 3 decades ago, a young woman named Angie Dodge is found brutally murdered in her bedroom in Idaho Falls. It was probably the worst case I've ever seen. It is the one that sticks with me. Police zero in on a suspect and put a man behind bars.

I don't know what the hell you guys want. Do you think we'd be wasting our time and wasting your time if we didn't think you're involved? But as the years pass, doubts emerge about whether the real killer was ever caught. That's when Angie's own mother embarks on a decades-long mission to uncover the truth. 23 years I've been trying to put this puzzle together, and the center's missing.

I've always been told the truth will come out. You can't hide the truth. Listen to The Snare, a new series from ABC Audio. Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or your favorite podcast app, and ad-free on Amazon Music.

Hello, designers. Fridays. We are full of surprises this season. Project Runway is back. Time Time starts now!

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What in the strut was happening? I would wear that. It's fantastic. This is the type of thing that gets you sent home. The world is watching.

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What happened to your daughter Tiffany? She was murdered. She had just gotten married 3 months before that. It was quite a surprise when they told us that she was missing. Toughest night of your life.

It's something that a parent never should have to go through. And for years you didn't know Who did it? Nope.

What keeps you going? What makes you— allows you to move forward? Catching who did it.

Kathy Dobry, she would not stop pushing investigators. I told Tiffany I would get who murdered her. That was my promise to her. We were able to actually get the case reopened and, uh, and get OSBI looking at it again.

So when I got this case, there was 3 or 4 boxes full of reports, full of information, full of notes that I basically just worked my way through them.

It turns out there had been a potential suspect. William Reese. Several months after Tiffany was taken from the Sunshine Car Wash and raped and murdered, investigators in Oklahoma had gotten a tip from Texas authorities. When Reese was arrested for kidnapping Sandra Seipaw, the woman who got away, he claimed that police were not only trying to frame him for Laura Smither's death, but that they were also trying to pin Tiffany's murder on him. Without that phone call, William Reese wouldn't even been on our radar screen.

That's not a name that the investigators at the time had even heard of.

Detectives in Texas also say they can place Reese in Oklahoma the night Tiffany disappeared.

Investigators early on developed a timeline with William Reese using his phone records. Mm-hmm. His gas receipts showing what days he traveled up and down I-45 from Houston to Oklahoma.

A phone call had been made from a payphone the night that Tiffany came up missing. And it was from the Yukon area, which is just west of where Tiffany was reported missing and just east of where her body was located. William Reese immediately becomes a person of interest. But that's the closest investigators could put him to the crime scene. The car wash owner recognized him as being a customer there at the car wash.

But that particular day, there wasn't anyone that could put him there. To be truthful with you, I had no idea what I was going to do with the case.

The only hope I had— there was one item of evidence that with new DNA technology that might be able to be tested. There were some swabs left from the original analysis. That particular evidence had been tested previously, and no DNA profile was able to be developed then. And with our current technologies, which are more sensitive, there was— hope that we could develop a DNA profile. A partial male DNA profile was obtained from the swabs from Tiffany's body.

The partial profile is a huge step forward but has its limitations. You have to match it to specific samples. I had to basically go and eliminate everyone who might have known Tiffany. While OSBI agents are gathering samples in Oklahoma, They reach out to Texas authorities to get a sample from William Reese, and that request gets the attention of investigators in Friendswood who are starting a cold case review of Laura Smither's murder. So in 2014, I was tasked with, uh, looking into the Laura Smither case.

That's when Josh and I started working together. There was two plans. One, and see if we could develop enough evidence to file charges on William Reese.

The second plan was to help Oklahoma develop a strong enough case where their district attorney would file capital murder charges on William Reese, which would be an incentive for him maybe to, uh, give up some information in exchange for a life sentence versus the death penalty. Armed with that timeline of Reese's movements Reese's whereabouts, Friendswood investigators start working together with law enforcement investigating cold cases in places where Reese had visited. In all three cases, uh, Kelly, Jessica, and Tiffany, they were able to find gas receipts, calling cards that put him nearby these locations where the women went missing.

Meanwhile, OSBI has tested and eliminated all the other DNA samples they took in Tiffany's case against their partial DNA profile. It was not any of them. So I'm looking at a table full of numbers, and each location where the evidence has results, the partial profile was consistent with Reese and nobody else. It's exciting. This case has been cold for so long, and there's finally an answer.

In a cruel coincidence, Tiffany Johnston's mother Kathy knew William Reese personally. His parents lived across the street from them in Anadarko. Now, you had a relationship with his mother? Yes, his mother did my laundry for me while I was working. She pressed the clothes that we were going to bury Tiffany in.

Do you know if Tiffany knew William Reese? I don't believe Tiffany ever met William Reese. The evidence now suggests that somehow Reese encountered Tiffany at the Sunshine Car Wash. That's really when things started moving a lot faster. The amount of information in the partial profile was enough for the DA to file charges, but we purposely waited because we knew that William Reese was not going to get out of prison. The game plan was to allow Texas an opportunity to run their cases.

We're all comparing notes, and there wasn't anything missed. There was no new evidence. What it was going to come down to was us making a run at William Reese. State your full name. William Louis Reese.

I'm Detective Doug Baker. So at this point in time, we decided to come up with a plan and lay everything out on the table. To make an offer and make an offer. I didn't know what to do. I thought, man, they ain't gonna believe me.

William Reese is behind bars in Texas serving 60 years for kidnapping Sandra Seipol. Now, with the threat of a death penalty case for Tiffany Johnston's murder in Oklahoma Oklahoma looming over him, law enforcement in Texas decide to approach Reese to see if he will cooperate with their cases on Laura Smither, Kelly Cox, and Jessica Cain. My experience with suspects is if you can make them a good offer or a better offer than what they're about to receive, they usually take it. There may be consideration if he's willing to give up the locations. Of the remaining, uh, girls.

Originally, I always felt I was going to do the interview, right? The issue we had in all of that— William Reese hated Friendswood Police Department, right? So we had to come up with something else. Doug Bacon and I discussed who we'd like to use to make a run at William Reese. Reese was a cowboy, right?

We felt that he could relate to another cowboy, which there's no more of a cowboy in Texas than a Texas Ranger. Jim Holland, the Texas Rangers, February 9th, 2016, at the Ellis Unit, Huntsville, Texas. Time is now 2:46. We knew Jim Holland was a very good interviewer, so we recruited him to come on board. Bill?

Yes, sir. What do you think this is about? It's probably about some murder cases. Yeah. What would Which ones?

Any clue? I have no idea. Oklahoma's got enough case, and we've got you on stickers. Okay, but it doesn't have to be all bad. All right, Ranger Holland's explaining to him that if he was willing to cooperate, now would be the time.

At the end of the day, I would like your help. That's my goal. I'm not going to promise you things, but for at least a little bit of time, if you help me, you can get treated like a rock star. I think I think they tried to make him feel like he was one of the boys. You know, "Hey, we want your help with this." This is a very unique opportunity for you, and there is a thing called consideration, and there's things that, you know, you can even get guarantees in advance, all right?

Holland interviewed him for 5.5 hours. I think at the end of the day that Bill's gonna make a decision based on what's best for Bill. Okay, well, we know. But there's a clock ticking. All right.

We provided Jim Holland with photographs of all of those girls. At some point in time, he had laid the pictures of Jessica Cain, Laura Smither, Kelly Cox, and Tiffany Johnson. What do you want me to say? Tell me. I mean, do you want me to go to the DA and broach it and get you a guarantee?

Tell you what, give me until Monday. All right. If you come back Monday, I'll tell you either we're going to do this Or I? OK. What did he talk about on all this? All 4.

He just put his hand over and said, all 4 of them. Wow. So that was one of those, oh, geez, you know? He has given some indication that he was responsible for the murders of all 4 of these girls. Susie had been praying that exact thing just previously.

All the families, we all talked to law enforcement. Bringing those two girls home was very important to us. We'd taken the death penalty off the table. We okayed that. I said, if in fact he takes you to where he buried Kelly and we can get her remains, that's fine.

When Ranger Holland returns to meet Rhys as agreed, Oklahoma isn't making any promises. They had not made a decision one way or the other whether they would or they wouldn't pursue the death penalty. Although Reese is initially reluctant, he still agrees to give up the location of one of the missing women as a first step. At the end of the day, you don't have one chip. You've got two chips.

Right. OK. So— You want one of them? Yeah. How can you want them? William Reese was released into Friendswood Police Department's custody.

We first drove him where he said he buried Kelli Cox. This is the site out in Brazoria County off of 288 and County Road 51. Why did he choose this spot to bury her? There was a stolen bulldozer on site, so he had already had a bulldozer staged here that he was hiding out until he could sell it. That's correct.

As investigators begin to dig where Reese directs them, he settles into his own cell at the Friendswood Jail. So you get him to open up to you by appearing to be friendly with him, correct? As an investigator, you have to play a role, right? But you always knew what he did, but your intention was to get information from him. That was my intention.

Within 3 days, and he was telling me about the murders of the 4 girls. Over the course of several taped interviews, Reese shares details on how he murdered each young woman, starting with 12-year-old Laura Smither, who was out jogging.

And, uh, I heard this loud noise. I hit something. I thought it was some mailboxes, but my mirror slung up against the side of my truck. It broke. So I stopped.

This one— seen her in the ditch.

I didn't know what to do. I thought, man, they ain't gonna believe me. According to him, it was an accident. I flew upside the building. Reese says he ran into that young mother, Kelly Cox, at the convenience store near the Denton police station.

She bumped into him walking out the store with the Coke in her hand and called him a drunk. We got into it there and she hit me with that Coke. It was just a plastic bottle. It was on. When I hit her, she hit her head.

And with Jessica Cain, she was coming out of Benedictines getting her car, and she bumped his car door, and he yelled at her, and she flipped him off. He left that parking lot driving down south toward Galveston, and Jessica Cain just happened to be driving behind him. So he said he pulls off the side of the highway. She just pulls right up behind me for no reason. She shouldn't have got going, but she did.

She was yelling at me.

And I lost it. I just got up and walked over there and hit her. Right there on the interstate. Cars were going by and everything. So I asked Reese if he would be willing to give me a statement concerning the Tiffany Johnson case, and he agreed.

He said he was at a car wash with his horse trailer. I sprang in between the truck and the trailer.

Next thing I know, this girl was yelling at me that I sprayed her. I don't think I sprayed her, but she was cussing and everything. We started getting into verbal words back and forth. He threw her in a horse trailer where, after more physical confrontation, he wrapped a rope around her neck and strangled her to death. I remember her being on top of me, and I told her to get off because it was too hot in there.

I couldn't do it. And she hit me in the back of the head with that horseshoe. Okay, let's back up just a little bit because I just lost me. He claimed that he grabbed her, was beating on her, and suddenly she wants to have sex with him. The part that's hard to believe, yeah, is that you guys start out with a fight, right?

And suddenly she wants to have sex with you. I ain't saying she was doing it voluntarily. William Reeves never Never admitted to being in the wrong. He always had an excuse for what he did. It wasn't his fault.

It was their fault. And I don't think normal people like you and I can even begin to understand the mindset of somebody like that. You know he's not telling the truth. You know he's lying to you. But you don't want to push him too hard because you don't want to lose his cooperation.

After days of digging, investigators are starting to doubt his word, especially his story about where he buried Kelly Cox. We dug for 7 days and did not locate anything. We let him know that folks are starting to lose confidence in what he's telling us. I could see the concern on his face because his life depended on it, right? I'm telling I mean, she's got to be out here somewhere.

Eventually, Reese will take police to a second location where he says he buried the other missing woman. I still don't understand why we can't find her.

With the threat of the death penalty hanging over his head and 7 days of digging without finding Kelly Cox, William Reese assures investigators he can bring them to where he buried Jessica Cain. You telling us the truth about burying her out there? Yes, sir. 100%. Reese said, hey, I'll take you directly to Jessica Cain's location because I know where I buried her because it's It was right by a pipeline.

Reese had drawn by hand a map for these investigators of where he buried the body. We start digging with shovels, and that quickly turned into some excavation equipment that we start getting when we realize that we're not going to find the remains immediately. 13 Eyewitness News was first on scene and captured this exclusive video of William Reese. He's still in police custody. Is in custody but has been brought out to the site to help find Jessica Cain.

He had handcuffs, just calmly walking around. He would speak with investigators. He would point at the ground.

Two massive excavators have been moving all day, digging more than 6 feet into the ground. Investigators are keeping a close eye on the dirt falling from the buckets. Looking for anything out of the ordinary. All of these agencies had kind of descended on this strip of land. This has now become an enormous operation.

Time, money, manpower. The activity has not slowed down more than one week into the digging process. Some days it'd be cold, mosquitoes, a lot of snakes. Really pretty miserable. But everybody that was there knew that they were there to find Jessica.

I prayed for this child for years and years and just hoping that upon hope that this is it. There were friends who had come up to the dig site. They had tied ribbons around the fence.

Everyone was really just hoping that after all of this time time there would be some answers. But this land, of course, has changed over the years. He thought that he had buried her over here. Yeah. But he had his fence lines confused.

He thought he had buried her along this fence line, but he actually had buried her along this fence line. Correct.

After a total of 3 weeks digging at this remote site, investigators discovered human remains. Investigators believe those remains belonged to 17-year-old Jessica Cade. Once we saw the bones, we took pictures of that and sent it to an anthropologist to confirm that that was human remains.

There was a lot of emotions with everyone that had been involved, the weight that was on everyone's shoulders. The initial shock at first of her not coming home and anticipating that any moment she is going to walk through the door. I think those years were harder. As it went on, I think we had accepted whatever God had in store for us. For thine is the kingdom and the power.

Because our faith had grown stronger. You learn so much through trials. And that's why I think the closure, when it came, was a little harder on everybody else maybe than us because we'd already accepted whatever God's answer was.

Reese immediately said, "Now that everyone knows that I'm serious, we need to go back to Brazoria County and find the other one." Kelly Cox, the mother of a 1-year-old, went missing in 1997. We were out there for several days. The area just past the trees is ground zero for digging operations. What these grounds hold is still a mystery. They were raising the bucket up and there was just a little cylindrical piece of something.

So we just said, stop.

And it was a small bone fragment. And I was down in the trench on my hands and knees. So I kind of dig a little bit more, and I see something metallic. It looks like gold. And I remember Jan telling me about a chain that Kelly wore, and I knew then that this was Kelly.

She always wore it. She never took it off. She just left it on. And they brought it to you? Yes, they brought it to the house.

It's very important to me.

It still kind of gives me goosebumps thinking about it because that was Alexis's mom. It felt cathartic to look at the ground and say, I'm so sorry, but we found you. She did not deserve to be there in the ground where she was found.

There was a sense of relief knowing that we had found her for the family.

Almost 20 years. Yep. Yeah. I had nightmares for years that she was in some sort of sex trafficking ring or something, being harmed every day. When we did have answers, it was comforting for me to know that she wasn't being harmed.

She, uh, she'd been in God's arms since July 15th, 1997. Now that Jessica and Kelly have been found, Reese is extradited back to Oklahoma to stand trial for the murder of Tiffany Johnston. State of Oklahoma versus William Louis Reese. You have said you could feel the evil— Yeah. —In the room.

I would have loved to just get up and just whalay him. Has the jury reached a verdict?

It had been nearly 25 years since Tiffany Johnston went missing went missing at a car wash in Oklahoma, her body found strangled to death the next day.

You have said you never thought William Reese would be brought to justice. Why not? We just— we didn't have any really any hope.

But the long wait is finally over. In May 2021, William Reese goes on trial for the murder of Tiffany Johnston. And then finally you see him in court. What was that like? Well, they made me promise to behave, but I was angry.

I would have loved to just get up and just whalay him, and I would have felt a lot better, but I'd get kicked out of the courtroom, and I didn't want to get kicked out because I'd waited 2 Long to get there. Reese is on trial for Tiffany Johnston's murder, but family and friends of all the victims come to court to witness what they hope will finally be long-awaited justice. To walk with Laura through Tiffany, that was important to me. It's, it's all I had left.

You have said you could feel the evil. Yeah, in the room. Absolutely. And that's exactly how it was. It was like a presence of its own.

It was eerie, almost. What was his demeanor like? Stoic. Didn't show any emotion. Among the witnesses, Reese's previous victims, including Sandra Seipol, the 19-year-old woman he kidnapped at a Waffle House who escaped by jumping out of his moving truck.

A whole bunch of victims were paraded before the jury telling their story of what he did to them. They were extremely courageous young women getting up and testifying. What impact did they have, their testimony? Huge impact. The prosecution brings up that partial DNA link to Tiffany Tiffany and also plays for the jury hours of taped interviews with Reese, allowing them to hear in his own words what he said happened not only to Tiffany Johnston but also to Laura Smither, Kelly Cox, and Jessica Cain.

I'm not gonna lie to you, it's just— it's over with. I want this to be over with. The defense argued that those statements weren't confessions because he was telling detectives what they wanted to hear in an effort to take the death penalty off the table. That's it? That's all I have?

Hang on one second. I'm gonna be right back. Okay. The prosecution counters that Reese was well aware that there was no deal with Oklahoma, playing an audio interview recorded during a search for Kelly Cox, which they said proved Reese knew that there was no deal. If they say they don't want a deal, fuck it.

Let them give me the name. So look, man, I don't got no family left, so it really don't bother me now.

After 8 days of testimony, it took the jury less than 1 hour to arrive at a verdict. We the jury do upon our oaths find as follows: the defendant is guilty.

What happened there was extraordinary in in many ways, because I think that trial was also a trial for all of the girls. That conviction in that trial was really for all the girls.

5 days after the guilty verdict, William Reese is back in court for sentencing. We are We are on the record. State of Oklahoma versus William Lewis Reese. A death sentence is not something to be celebrated. It is not something to be taken lightly, and it is not something to be utilized on a whim.

You have been solidly behind giving William Reese the death penalty. Why does he deserve the death penalty? According to the Bible, it's I for 9. And I believe that.

I wanted to see him get sentenced. And I wanted to make sure that the judge didn't— you know, you have all these nightmares. Can they change the sentence and pull it away and not do it? And I wanted to hear those words. There's an old saying in the law, "Justice delayed is justice denied." Justice will be served.

Not be delayed any longer in this case. I sentence you to death.

He's a monster, and he's a sex offender, and he's a liar, and he's a murderer.

Now a convicted murderer sentenced to death. But what about his other victims? Would those families ever get their day in court and justice for their own losses?

State of Oklahoma versus William Lewis Reese.

Mr. Reese, I sentence you to death. William Reese is currently in a Texas prison. He was sentenced to 60 years for Sandra Sapo's kidnapping and the death penalty in Oklahoma for killing Tiffany Johnston. How do you plead, guilty or not guilty? Guilty.

Reese pleads guilty to 3 separate counts of murder, life for each case, and the murders of Laura Smither, Jessica Cain, and Kelly Cox. Here in When Rhys pleaded guilty, I knew what it meant to the families. He indicated in a courtroom in front of the judge and the families that he was responsible for their death. I told him in my victim impact statement that I forgave him. I was in a prison that I placed myself in because I was so angry at him, and I had to find my way out of that prison of anger.

By forgiving him. As much as we'd like to rely on our justice system, you can't rely on the justice system for peace.

I had a picture of Kelly and Alexis that we held up the entire time for him to look at. I wanted him to see that he had not ruined or destroyed our family, that I still had a great my childhood, and I still grew up happy, and I was still raised really well, you know. This is the statue. This is it. Kelly holding Alexis.

And we did a big balloon release at her life celebration, so we put balloons with it. If I could say anything to you personally, it would be stay aware, stay safe, and God bless.

Kelli. I miss you.

I think about you every day.

Every day. It gives me peace for coming out. It's my peaceful place. It's no confusion or Anything. It's just being here with Tiff by myself.

If you could talk to her, what would you tell her? That I love her and I miss her and she should be here with us.

It's been almost 27 years. Mm-hmm. How often do you think of her? Every day.

When you love, that love doesn't doesn't just die after you've buried your child. That love stays with you. It'll be with you. It is our life sentence. We will carry that with us always.

Jessica Cain's parents hold on to memories of happier times. On a dead snot out, I took her into Baytown to a movie, and on the way home home, they played a song that I love, and it was by The Platters, Only You. Only you.

And so I just pulled off on the side of the highway, Interstate 10, and it was dark, no traffic, and she put her feet on my toes and we just danced around everywhere.

What a beautiful memory. Yes, it is. What's the moral of the story? Teach your children well. And dance when you can dance well.

And dance when you can dance.

The families we spoke with telling us, David, they're sharing their pain and their memories as a warning to try to protect others from experiencing the same heartbreak. That is our program for tonight. Thanks for watching. I'm David Muir. And I'm Deborah Roberts.

From all of us here at 20/20 and ABC News, good night.

You've been listening to the 20/20 True Crime Vault, Friday nights at 9 on ABC. You can also find all new broadcast episodes of 20/20. Thanks for listening.