Transcript of Rams Dominate Darnold with NINE Sacks, McCarthy and Cowboys Divorce

From the 39 of LA, third down and eighth. Ramsey on defense, protected a shutdown lead. Donald against the rush. Blitz coming. He's hit. Ball down. Scooped up. Byron Young. Beard got it. Jerriff first has it down the right sideline with walkers. 10, 5. A leap in the end zone.

The defensive rookie of the year with a scoop and scores on wild card weekend.

And it's Akela Witherspoon to jar it loose.

Our friends J. B. Log and MJD with the great call of the great Jared Verce. No one was catching him. I mean, what was his 40-time? My God, gets into the end zone for a scoop and score on a night when the Rams defense had Sam Darnold, Sea & Ghost. The Rams win 27 to 9 to cap Wild Card Weekend. In a crazy game in Phoenix, Glendale, Arizona. I'm here back in Los Angeles. It's not as smoky as it was a couple of nights ago, nick Shook. And for that, we have a lot of thanks to give. And a lot of Rams fans around the Southland, around Los Angeles, and the ones who got up early this morning to take all those busses that were going from Sofi to bring them to Glendale are happy tonight because it was over after that breakdown. It was a party for this Ram's defense. What a night.

Yeah, what a night indeed. What a night for less Sneed. Drafted Jared Verce. Braden Fisk making a play. That defensive front that he rebuilt after the departure of Aaron Donald coming through in a defense that just played phenomenally and absolutely shut down the explosive Vikings and really made quite a statement with this win. That verse, fumbal recovery in return for a countdown, it made it what, 17 to three? It felt like the final blow right then and there. They were never going to recover from that. That was how good of a game they played defensively, and what a resounding win for these Rams.

Yeah, it was another rough one for Sam Darnold, and we'll get into that. But the defensive performance was amazing, and the way the Rams offense came out to start this game and set the tone with a shutdown drive, just like they did against the Vikings the first time around in Sofye and then get another score to go up two scores, 10-0 in the blink of an eye. And Sam Darnold wasn't really ready for it, wasn't ready for that moment. And before we get into the whys of it all, I do think about everything that's happened this week here, and we've chronicled it on NFL Daily some. And I think about this Rams team who, one year after the pandemic, when people are just getting back to normal and you're just getting used to Sofi Stadium even being a thing that fans can go to, they go win a Super Bowl title and stamp themselves, this city's football team in a way that I don't think they had been since they had returned from St. Louis. And fast forward to now, both them and the Chargers are in the playoffs this year, but they get affected.

Their practice gets affected last week. They go to Glendale, and it's this season where they were one and four and they make it to the playoffs. And you don't know how many more years Stafford and McVay are going to have together. And this is actually their first win since that Super Bowl title. And I do think about NFL seasons. Not everyone can win the Super Bowl, and it's going to be disappointing whenever this Ram season ends for them unless they win it. And yet sometimes I do think one win can make it all worth it. And maybe that can be a regular season win, but usually it's a playoff win. And even if the road ends in Philadelphia, I really do think this is a win that Ram's fans will treasure and remember forever. And Stafford will as well when they're thinking about it in 20 years, even if they don't go on that. Hey, we got another one a few years after that Super Bowl, and it was that week. When we faced a lot of challenges, and we faced challenges that season, and it showed what they were all about as this next generation of Ram's young players go on.

Yeah, they're going to be sitting around the Thanksgiving table or just the dinner table or maybe a reunion of old teammates years from now and think back to you. Remember that time we had to go out to Glendale because there were wildfires around and we couldn't practice and we couldn't play in our home stadium when we had earned the right to host a playoff game? You remember how the Cardinals organization bent over backward to make sure that it felt as close to home as it could be? They got the same color paint to paint the field that we would use and everything else. Remember all those fans who came out to Arizona to support us? And then we went out and played inspired football. That was the thing that really stood out to me from the opening drive. The Rams played with a purpose that exceeded the playoffs. This was about more than just winning a payoff game that was a home game away from home. This is about playing for the entire city and the entire Los Angeles area, and they represented them so well. And there's no way, considering all that has happened, that people won't look back on this 5, 10, 15, 20 years from now.

I mean, I still hear about the games from the '80s in Cleveland with the Browns. It was nothing like this. It was nothing like this. This is going to be.

Well, those were pretty great times, too.

But amid tragedy? No. Yes.

Ram's fans are hopeful that they don't go in such a dry spell that those games stand out as much. But yeah, this one won't be forgotten. And I'm glad you mentioned the energy. That's really a smart way to think about it because the Vikings are coming off a disappointing loss. They had to play last week, Sunday night football. Rams got to rest their starters, and the Rams came out and just yank this thing from them right away. First drive of the game, Vikings blitzed. Guess what their blitz percentage was on the first drive of the game?

It was 100 %.

It was A hundred %, every single play. And you know how many times they pressured Matthew Stafford? One. One time. And I just thought, Stafford and McVay, the combination, it's like they knew what was coming, and he got rid of the ball so quickly. Puco with a huge gainer on the first play. Basically, every play was successful. Tyler Higby had a bunch of them, and it was easy. Then you think about the first defensive drive, first play on defense, Byron Young, tackle for loss. Next play, Byron Young, I believe, him and Kobe Turner. Then the third down play actually stands out to me, where Darnal just dumps it off to pick up seven or eight yards on a third and 15. And literally, five guys tackled the ball carrier at the same time. And you're like, oh, man, this team is swarming. And the second half, the offense didn't need to do much, and they didn't do much, but it didn't matter because the defense kept it going the whole time.

Yeah, it was a phenomenal defensive game plan from the beginning. There was a comparison between man and zone coverage, and Darnal struggled significantly against man coverage. He didn't know where to go. The picture was complicated to him. He was hesitant, and they feasted on it. What really stood out to me in the way that they got after him was the number of different guys that got involved. Eight different Rams contributed to either at least a half sack, if not more, over the course of this game, a number of different guys getting pressures. Two of those sacs came from defensive backs. The one on the strip sac that led to the Jared versus fubble recovery in return for a shutdown. That was a Kelo Witherspoon coming off the edge, and he just realized, Oh, wait, Darnold's holding onto the ball. I'm here. Forget my assignment, maybe this tight end leaking out. I'm going after him. And he capitalized. They were playing with their hair on fire. They were playing with intent that, again, exceeded the limitations or the expectations of a playoff football game. That's just what was so impressive about this game.

Yeah, let's listen to that first shutdown to Kyren Williams from Stafford.

From a loaded set with Nakuha, the only receiver. They'll play faith, boot out to the left side. Matthew Flips his head, fires middle. Hold on at the goal line. His tailback, Kyron Williams. Touchdown, LA.

Seven plays, 70 yards.

The Ram strike first on this Wild Card Monday.

Yeah, that was such a great play call because the initial read as he's rolling out is taken away, but they have Kyren Williams, who's become a great player in the passing game, open. And Stafford, still looking junky. He could still flip those hips. And he was sharp as hell in the first half. He was fine in the second. They played pretty conservative, but he ends up 19 for 27, 200. And what did he end up with? Nine yards and a couple of touch downs, pass a rating over 111. What did you think, in general, I guess, of Stafford and the offensive performance? One section, and you could talk about this, to me, that stood out was the last two-minute drive after they got the ball late in the first half. We can say that it ended at 17: 03, and yet it really felt over after that drive.

Yeah, Stafford came into this game with only one pass and countdown since week 15. That was after a run where he posted a 10 to zero touch-to-interception ratio over the previous, I believe it was the last three or four games. People were worried about him. He was averaging 153 passing yards per game over those last three games coming into Monday night. He looked like the guy we expected to see two years ago. Not Not the guy that we expected to see after the last three weeks. He was sharp, he was dialed, he was completely in sync with Sean McVay's game plan. They executed that nearly flawlessly, that opening drive. But you're right, that last two-minute drive was the one that really stood out to me, too, because of how he played with so much conviction. Even the shutdown pass that he throws, he drops back, plants his foot, boom, bullet to his tight end, tight end runs it in for a shutdown, made it look easy because this is a guy who's been there before, and he still trusts his physical tools. When the play design is working for him and he understands where to go, even on that Kyron Williams throw, the flow is to the left, and yet he finds a way to throw it back toward the inside where Kyron finds the soft spot in the zone to score the countdown.

They were just completely in sync throughout that entire first half. I thought that reminded me that, Hey, a lot of people are ready to close the curtain on the Matt Stafford era in Los Angeles. Not so fast, okay? He can still ball, and he played really well in this first half.

I know. It would be really hard to replace him, and we'll see because he has these highs. Sometimes the game does come down to the quarterback, and the difference tonight was so stark. And I think the end of the first half sequence really spells that out. Koc decides to go for it on fourth and 2 at the 50 with a couple of minutes left to go. Actually, it was 132 left to go in the first half. Now, earlier in the first half, he decided to take a field goal on a fourth and 2 inside the red zone. I didn't hate that decision at the time because it just didn't feel like Vikings were executing well enough to have confidence that they're going to make the fourth and 2, that Darnold would take a sack or something. But he decides to roll the dice a little bit at the 50, call his shot right there, where if we don't pick this up, we're going to go down three scores, but let's show some confidence in Darnold. And what does he do? He holds onto the ball for like six seconds, and he takes an 11-yard sack.

And then Stafford gets the ball. It takes a few plays to get going, but he hits Pukka on a play that probably ended with what? About 35 seconds to go. And I'm thinking they're going to take a time out there.

And they don't.

And they decide not to. And it was really a veteran move. First of all, they had enough time to run a handful of plays left. But more than anything, with the way Floris runs defense, they're a good hurry-up offense, and they can mix in tempo really well. And they did tonight, especially earlier in the game. And they hurry up on the ball and they snap it quick, before ESPN gets out of their replay, basically. And he's got a wide open Davis Allen, their rookie tight, or second year tight end over the middle. Shout out to Jordan Rodriegue. Cash it in her Davis Allen stock at the last moment. Good job by her. He gets the touch on it. That's veteran game management versus Sam Darnold, who had no game management tonight.

Yeah, and I actually thought that signs of this being potential outcome showed up in that Lion's game. I don't think that Lions game was an anomaly and just a one-off. You could find clues that this could be an issue for them. My biggest issue with them in that game was the fact that when they had a down-and-distance situation where you needed to get five 8 yards. You treat a third and relatively long with two plays because you know you're going to go for it on fourth down, they're not running anything short for him. That has been my big issue with their offense for a lot of this season is... Now, Sam has stepped up in a lot of these moments and ripped a pass down the seam through three defenders defenders for a big first down in some of these games they've won. But last week, I saw him not able to do that because they're playing better defenses, because the pressure is on. The same thing was true again in that scenario, which leads to them. It's fourth and two, and you take such a long sack, you give the Rams great field position, and they capitalize.

That was a big concerning sign for me with them going into this game. Unfortunately for the Vikings, it proved to carry over and be true again.

Yeah, you hit the nail on the head. I think it's more that Darnold doesn't take the options or make the quick decision.

Yeah, that could be very true, too.

To get to the check down. But I think you're absolutely right that they don't build in enough for him. Jordan Rodriegue, who I just mentioned, was at the game and said the exact same thing, that they need to build in more short stuff for Sam, and it's not there. But the sacs that he took, and he took nine of them, took me a long time to get to this, added up to the most sac yards in a game, 82, in the history of in the NFL Playoffs. It's the most sac yardage in any game in the NFL for a decade. Cam Newton took more sack yardage in a game, in a November game a decade ago. But the most sac yards ever. Here are the sack yards because a lot of times you take a three, four-yard sack or you get up 10, 7, 12, 8, 7, 11, 13, 8, 9 to close out the game there. Those are massive sacs. One of those double-digit sack numbers came in the second half when they had a third and eight in field goal range in theory, but really, they needed to just get touch downs. They were down, I think, three scores at the time, what, 19 points or something?

And he took, I think, that 13-yard sack, and they decided to punt on fourth and 21, which to me was a surrender punt. I know you don't want to punt there, but the game is over if you to hunt it. The fourth quarter was very strange to me, but I think KOC was so exasperated by Darnold taking the sack there after he held it for six seconds. The Rams only had five quick pressures all night. None of their defenders had more than one quick pressure. So more of these sacs than not were on the delayed blitzes, which they did a great job doing that confused them, and Darnold just holding on to the in freezing a little bit. Let's listen to Kevin O'Neill talking about Darnold after the game.

The other phase of it for Sam is acknowledging the things that made him a winning quarterback this year and the consistency at the times he had it throughout the year and what that meant for our team, because I think that can stay with him moving forward as he goes back to work. I'm proud of him. I'm proud of really everybody in that locker room. But Sam and the journey him and I went on this year will always be something that's a special place in my heart for sure. That's a good way to spin it, but that's a wistful tone at the end of what's a disappointing finish in a season that had so much promise. You talk about that third and eight. I just went and looked at the tape real quick because I thought about this in real-time when it happened. He's so locked on at Jalen Naylor going across the field looking for the deep play again. He's got CJ Ham open about six yards away from the line to gain with a little bit of room to run when he breaks the pocket. Just dump it off once. It's right there for you.

Take the gain. You can get a fourth and short. But again, that typified the entire night for him. Hunting the big play, hesitant, pays the price.

Yeah, they had 3. 3, I think, adjusted yards per dropback, which is one of the lowest totals in any playoff game for years. I actually did a stat. This is going to be a next Greg stat. I don't know if this is official. I don't know.

Can you count? That is NGS. That still counts. Okay.

So he officially went He had 9 for 17, I believe, for 84 yards when under pressure, when he did throw the ball. So that's an average about a little under five yards per throw, which is not good. We had an interception in there, a couple of close ones. But then he took those nine sacks for all the passing yards, all the negative yards. So 84 minus 82, that's a total of two yards. Divide that by the total plays there, his passes and his sacs, that's 26 They averaged 0. 07 yards per play when Sam Darnold was pressured. That's pretty good. That's a pretty good debut of next Greg's stats, 0. 07 yards per play when Sam Darnold was pressured. They're not bringing him back. He's talking wistfully because Sam Darnold's done in that town.

He gone. He's definitely gone. Hey, my middle name, by the way, is Gregory, so we're going to stick with the next Greg stat here. Really? I never knew that.

How did I not know that?

Well, now you learn something new. The NGS are my initials, so we'll just It's like with it here.

Yeah. Now, I'm not Gregory. That's what the third G, 60 % G, that closes that.

Just stops it, Greg, just like my name stops it, nick. It's not Nicholas, it's just nick.

It just stops it right there. And I'm joking around, and I've been a darn doubter until I had to be convinced that just by his excellent play, and he did play excellent for most of this season. But I do think the way these two games played out in in the biggest of spots for him to completely revert back and have two of the worst games by any quarterback all season? At least by a competent quarterback, these were two of the worst games, and certainly in the biggest of spots. For them to be this bad in this spot, they're not going to give him the franchise tag. I just assume they would if he maintained his level of play. I think if he had even normal bad games, they still would have thought about it, but I don't think they're going to do it now. I actually do think there's a chance he returns to Minnesota. If Only because a two-year, let's say, $30 million contract from Minnesota to be a 1B, basically a backup plus until JJ is healthy, might be the best offer he I just don't know. Maybe he will get a better offer elsewhere, and maybe he's comfortable with that.

He's going to have a really difficult decision, but he cost himself a lot of money, obviously.

Yeah, these last two games were damning evidence in the case against paying him, paying him relatively significantly. He's not getting a Daniel Jones contract, and even that contract, as we know now, was bad. All right, so this is a guy in Sam Darnold who notoriously held onto the ball a long time to significant success this season, right? So he averaged He averaged 3. 08 seconds per dropback this season. It was the third longest time to throw on average in the NFL behind Lamar Jackson and Jalen Hertz, two very different quarterbacks from him, right? Could you guess off the top of your head what his average time to throw was tonight?

It had to be... Well, does that count sacks? I don't even know. Or is it before you throw? Fifty dropbacks. I'll just guess four just to give a big fact.

3. 21, which is still significantly higher than 3. 08. That would have been the longest, I believe, in the league.

Yeah, All right, here's the thing. If you counted the sack numbers, which you don't because it's average time to throw. I mean, wake up, Greg. It's literally in the title of that stat. Next Greg stat. So of course, that doesn't count. But I don't know how it ended up, but our friend Bill Smith at our research department pointed out with the six first half sacks, which broke a record in terms of first half playoff sacs, no surprise, none were under 3. 2 seconds, none. And four of the six were over four seconds. And I can in my head, at least of two of the sacs in the second half that were over four seconds, too. So that's just holding it forever. And you could hear the frustration dripping in Troy Akeman's voice that these really were more on the quarterback. Yes, they lost Brian O'Neill about halfway through this game. But there was one play where he took the sack, and Troy Akeman was like, he's got a clean pocket in front of him. Just step up. And that's it. It's the not being aware pressure. It's maybe the reason why I've always been so down on Darnold, maybe even more than the numbers would say, is because that's my number one trait, is your feel versus pressure.

It's probably why I've overrated a couple of quarterbacks over the yours, because to me, I think that's what I want in a quarterback. He doesn't have that, and we don't need to spend the whole podcast on Sam Darnold. We'll talk about him in the offseason, but you do feel for him. He made it to Qby Island, but I I don't know, man. We might have to call an emergency meeting or something here.

Yeah, I think he's getting voted off if the complicated process allows for that to happen. I actually caught a brief glimpse of the Manning cast during this game because I'm like, what did Eli and and think about Darnold's performance so far? They were just groaning. He threw a ball to, I think it was Addison, who came back to the ball and made a catch between two defenders. Eli was just like, wait till they show the receiver when he gets rid of the ball. He's not open at all. Somehow he the play. They were just absolutely dismayed at the performance, understandably so. Rough, rough ending to what was a nice year for him.

Yeah, that's the thing, too. The last couple of weeks, he let his mental issues get in the way of the throws that he made, even when there wasn't any pressure. He dirted a couple of screen passes. Espn actually tracks ESPN stats and info of off-target passes, and His Lion's game, he set his season high, and it was one of the highest by any quarterback all season. And this game was the second highest. So it wasn't just that he was taking these sacs. He was missing some throws that were there Man. Okay, enough about Arnold. That's a downer. There's a lot of fun in this game. One of the fun things was actually Paul Allen's call of one of the biggest plays in this game. It was early. It was 10 to 3, Rams. And for a second, it looked like it was 10 to 10 because there was a sack fumble, breakdown for the Vikings. We're actually going to take a quick break, but on the other side of the break, we'll start with that call by Paul Allen, who obviously did not love how it all finished out. First and 10 for Matthew Stafford, the He's got the former Georgia Bulldog back to pass.

He's back. He dropped it, and it's picked up by Blake Cashman. Cash money in the playoffs. It's a 23-yard scoop and score. Now, the Ram's offense is staying on the field. I don't know if they're going to rule this an incomplete or...

Ain't no incomplete. No, no, that's a fumble. The rolling on the field is a fumble. They're covered by the defense. Touchdown. Yeah, there we go. That was a complete breakdown on their offense.

Number 17 was in the area.

Therefore, it's a nickel-grued pass.

How's that a pass? How are you kidding me? He didn't even have his hands.

He set the game off for 14, 14.

Wow. Wow. Oh, man. For the last time this season, Paul Allen and Pete Bershch on KFA And that was a huge play, I guess a heads-up play by Matthew Stafford, even though his head was down. From the original angle, you thought, no way was that a pass. But then when you saw the replay, I actually think it was the right call, but just not a smart move by Stafford. It shouldn't have been an intentional grounding, so it wasn't the right call. They should have called intentional grounding, but it was not a fumble.

When I saw the replay from the front side, I was like, Yeah, you shouldn't let go of the ball It wasn't until his arm extended from behind that you saw that he was trying to get rid of the football. Now, it saves them the sack yardage, right? But ultimately, take the sack. There's no reason to do that. But luckily for the Rams, they locked out and got the call in their favor.

Yes.

Oh, can we clip, by the way? Can we clip the, Are you kidding me? Because that was just great.

That was amazing. That's a funny thing is if you look at the box score of this game, because the Rams didn't do much in the second half, they only hit two third downs all game, for instance. The Vikings were much better on third down. Success rate for the two teams running were both mediocre. They were slightly below average. It wasn't a great running game for the Rams. Pukina Kua gets 44 yards on nine targets, five catches. Cooper Cup has one catch. Tyler Higby, unfortunately, left this game with a chest injury and had to go to the hospital, and they say he's in stable condition, which is worrisome. I don't know if that was a breathing problem for him, but Sean McVeigh did say that it looks like he's going to be okay, which is really good news. It is one of those games you have to watch because even Arnold's stat line, if you don't see the stacks, to really understand the story. Maybe that does speak to the point that there was something a little more going on. It's one of the reasons why we love football, right, Shuk? Not just because you can get inspired, just that if you watch that game, you understood it in a way that you can't from looking at the numbers, and a lot of it was from the energy of the game.

And shout out to those fans that showed up there for both teams. Everyone there from ESPN said it was an incredible atmosphere. It was like a college atmosphere. You have the fans behind the team they support, like a college game, and they were really loud. And I'm sure they weren't showing it nationally, but the local news was all over this story. And they had, I don't know how many busses it was, but it was a ton on the busses. They showed the lines of people that were there at Sofi taking the busses all in Ram's gear that the Staffords and the Rams paid for, and they left before dawn. It was dark out at that point. And so they showed up in big ways. And the Vikings who revel so well and had such a great season, you feel for them. They showed up big time, too, for what was ultimately a funeral. But a cool, a memorable atmosphere making the best of a bad situation there.

Yeah, a lot of details that will not show in the pro football reference box score that we googled 10 to 15 years from now, like people like me like to do. But those who watched it will remember, and those who access the replay, which you can find on NFL Plus, will go back and revel in the uniqueness of this game, which went in technically the home team's favor as they advanced to Philadelphia.

Yeah, and good job by the Ram's Back 7. Anytime you hold an opponent in single digits, which I believe they've now done Is that for a month straight? When was the last time the Ram's defense gave up a big point total? Their starters. The 49ers, they beat 12 to 6.

The Bills game.

The Jets, they beat 19 to 9. The Cardinals, they beat 13 to 9. And then this game, they win 27 to 9. That's incredible. I know the backups gave up 30 to the Seahawks, but I'm not counting that game. So it was the Bills game, and that's amazing. Chris Shula getting it done with those delayed pressures, the secondary with guys you haven't heard about. Kobe Durant had a sack kill of Witherspoon has played well. There's been injuries, and yes, that four-man front versus special. Once O'Neill went out, especially versus just he had a good time with their backup. It was a real team victory for the Rams. Let's actually listen after the game to Kobe Turner. This is two people, and you won't hear Bridget here, but two people that have been a big part of NFL Daily, Bridget Condon, a regular guest, interviewing Kobe Turner, who got the NFL Daily bump as a guest back in training camp.

We had the city on our back this week, and I'm glad we were able to go out and pick up a dub. Mcvay has been talking to us all week about the fact that we're built for this.

Everything that we've gone through from this season up till now has prepared us for this exact moment, prepared us to go take victory like we just did.

The next journey is on the way. We head up to Philly, and we're excited for that, too, as well. But But we're built for this, man. All the trials, all the tribulations, all the ups and downs. We've weathered the storm. You figure out the true testament of a team, how they react in a storm. We started in a storm, and now we're up here. So I'm just excited to keep going with these guys.

Start in the storm. Right. Spitting bars. We started in the storm. Eric Roberts, behind the glass, doing a great job all week, all season. Tells me there was 30 busses. I was going to say it. It seemed like they were lined up. So that was a big crew that took the ride, and that's a six-hour bus ride. I think they must have got there very early because they were leaving. I don't know why they were getting there that early, but I guess you got to make sure.

As somebody who has moved to LA, back to Ohio, to LA, and back to Ohio and done the drive across the country four times. Usually when you get to Arizona, you're like, All right, now here's the home stretch. But it's still pretty long. You get stuck out near Barstow at night and you're like, Where am I? They rode those busses as the sun was rising to come watch this team play for them.

Yeah, it's It's badass. And Sean McVay, going to be proud after the game. Like I mentioned, first win since the Super Bowl, which I think he's going to feel really good. They obviously made the playoffs last year and lost a really close game to a good team the of the lions. Nothing to be ashamed of there, but big to get a playoff win. In four of his eight seasons, Shook, he has won a playoff game. In six of his eight seasons, they've made the playoffs. He very evenly distributes everything. In two of those seasons, he went to the Super Bowl. In one of those seasons, he won the Super Bowl. It's like he's almost mathematically doing what you would expect every time he makes the playoffs. He's done every little bit of it. A lot of love for KOC and Dan Campbell and all these coaches coaches, and McVeigh didn't get a lot of love for Coach of the Year this year, but there aren't many guys you would rather want, I think, running your organization.

Which of us had him on the top five? The latter was me.

Good job.

Was it me?

Oh, I think it was. I'm glad neither of us. Did you have Kevin O'Kunal first after week 8? We did after week 17, so you were stuck in a tough spot.

Maybe, yeah. It was a weird spot at the time. Look, this Ram's team started one and four. They're now 10 and three in their last 13. All those games have come after their buy. That's a hell of a job by Sean O'Kannell.

And one of them, they didn't try to win. And they almost did win with Jimmy Garoppolo. There it is. You know what? I had this theory that they wanted this matchup. They wanted the Vikings. It was just a theory I had because they were trying to lose that game when they could have I've tried to play against the commanders. It was a familiar opponent. They got it done a lot to worry about, to think about for the Vikings. I'm going to talk about the Vikings a little more on our next show. Ollie Connolly is going to join me, and we're going to spin around a lot of the coaching situations, the GM situations, just the other teams that aren't in the playoffs. And I do want to talk about the Vikings because I think there's some interesting things going on with their front office and Darnold and what's going to happen next for them. Obviously, KOC has nothing to worry about one of the best coaches in the league, even if it's a disappointing ending. They are the first team, by the way, since the championed Patriots, I think in 14, to only lose to two teams in a season.

They only lost to the Rams and the Lions this season. They went 0 and 4 against the Lions and the Rams this season. They're also the first team that won 14 games in a season to end with back-to-back losses. And those back-to-back losses were by a combined 40 points. They weren't close. It's just a weird way to end. But I don't think it eliminates everything, but it maybe simplifies how they view their team, that maybe they still are a little further away than the record showed.

Yeah, I feel like they overachieve this year, considering where we thought they were when we analyzed their roster going into the season. We also didn't think Sam McDonald was going to have this type of season. Nobody did. We thought JJ McCarthy was going to be the quarterback of this team, and he wasn't. But I am curious. I don't know if Minnesota is as tough on their coaches as some other markets looking at you, Pittsburgh, with Kevin O'Knowl, because he's now 0-2 in playoff games in which they were expecting to perform one.

Oh, come on. They will because there's a crazy segment of the fan base that gets mad at the coach no matter what.

Oh, yeah, burn it all down.

After every playoff loss. But give me a break. I mean, give me a break.

I agree. I'm curious, though.

With what he got out of this team. All right, let's switch gears before we go for the night. We often do a big news rundown. We're not going to do that today, but we did get one big item that I do want to that I don't want to save for our next show. And that's Mike McCarthy no longer being the coach of the Dallas Cowboys. How would you word it, nick Shook? Because one thing you can't say about Jerry Jones is that he fires his coaches. He doesn't do that. He just lets their contract run out and then lets them twist in the wind. So if you're writing the article, how do you even phrase this conscious uncoupling?

Conscious uncoupling is a great way to do it.

Sorry, I stole your answer.

It's better than mine. I would just say parted ways like the Patriots did with Bill Belichick. Moving on from a coach by letting his contract expire. It's common in other industries, not so much in the coaching industry. It is It's questionable, though, that they would deny the bears a chance to interview him if they want to depart with him. But then again, the cowboys do things a little bit differently. And now all the intrigue builds because they are the cowboys. Who are they going to hire? We've already heard some names floated out there, including one guy who once played for them. It's going to be very fascinating to see how they proceed after deciding, You know what? Wasn't as good as we wanted it to be, and we're just going to let that contract expire and go for greener pastures. We'll see if they find one.

Yeah. You're referring to Deion Sanders. Ian Rappaport did indicate, among other insiders across the country, that Deon Sanders is a possibility that they probably will talk Someone dug up an old Michael Irvin tweet from November where he said he hung out with Deon, I believe, on Saturday night after hanging out with Jerry Jones on Friday night, and that he's praying for something that we can guess what, and that he's praying, essentially, for those two men to come together, and basically said he is trying to make that happen. So if Michael Irvin is brokering head coaching hirings in the year 2025, that would be amazing. I don't doubt that Jerry Jones would milk this story to get as much attention as possible. I don't doubt he would do it because it would be so box office, but I don't know if he would want to really hand over the keys to someone who has more juice than he does. He seems a little indecisive. I watched a really good segment with Ian and Tom Pelacero and Jane Slater, and there was a lot in there that I'd like to get to. But one of the things that Jane said was people around Jerry Jones said he really was indecisive over the last week.

That seems obvious because if you read the statement that Jerry Jones made, he said that he spoke with Mike over a number of days and spent considerable time discussing the road forward. They were thorough and received an appropriate amount of time. Prior to reaching the point of contract negotiations, it became mutually clear it would be better to each of us and head in a different direction. They spoke for multiple days. It appeared there was mutual interest in potentially continuing the partnership. Then, according to our insiders, maybe they never really negotiated, but before they even got to that point, the agent was involved, and it was clear that Jerry Jones was not going to give him a long contract, and that Mike McCarthy only wanted to do it if it was a long contract, that it was going to probably It would be like one or two years, or that would have been the negotiation, and that was a nonstarter for McCarthy. And on some level, it was almost McCarthy walking away from being like, No, I'm not putting up with your Yes. It's just like mismanagement. It's all bad. If you're a Cowboys fan, you got to be so sick of it.

It's been a rough 12 months of mismanagement for the Cowboys. Started with that offseason in which they said they were all in and then did very little of anything. They placed high expectations on a team that lacked weapons offensively. I thought it was very telling, Mike McCarthy's tone after their Week 18 loss to the commanders in the final seconds of that game, that when asked about his job status and his security and the way he felt about it, he just stood his ground and was like, I'm a winner. I've won. I want a championship in this building. It's almost as if he took that same approach into those talks and then got the response that you just described and said, To hell with this. I'm going to go find something better for me not coach at all because I'm not dealing with this anymore, just like you said.

Which is crazy because it sounds like he wants to coach, but that this has worn on him. And this is what I got out of that conversation. So I'm paraphrasing our insiders. It's not my information. But that he was getting really tired of this situation with the Cowboys. It's pretty rare to be on the last year of your contract as a coach and all the things that comes with it, and not necessarily having all the power to really even run his offense or bring in the players that he wants. And that's just how it works if you're the Cowboys' coach, in that maybe he's made enough money. So if another coaching job doesn't come around this year or even a head coaching job ever again, that it's enough for him, and it's tough for the coaches under him, but they didn't want to be living in that uncertainty either. Just while we're on McCarthy quickly, he was the Saints offensive coordinator, and people forget this, for at least four years to start this century. And Mickey Loomis was there with the Saints at the time. And all three of those insiders pointed out that they have a close relationship and that there really could be a connection there.

And Loomis could see McCarthy as a guy that helps him out. If his job is at all, Hey, I can still get a winning coach like this to come on board. And McCarthy might look at it as a situation where he'd have a lot of power relatively for a head coach, and it's just something to keep an eye on. He also is going to interview with the Chicago Bear, so he has two interviews. He's a wanted man, Mike McCarthy.

He is a winner, I guess. You got to think about situation and you think about motivation. If he wants to go to a place where he is familiar with the person in charge of personnel, then it's the Saints. A place where he feels like he can have considerable power over roster decisions and everything else, it's New Orleans Saints. But he would also be walking into a team that doesn't have a long-term answer at a quarterback and lacks weapons outside, especially if they lose a guy like they did in Chris Olave this season. What would you rather choose, that or a young team with a young quarterback and with some weapons at receiver of varying ages, but in need of serious direction and a GM that you would have to get to know in Ryan Polz. There are two very different situations, but if he wants to coach again, we'll see.

You'd rather have a quarterback. You'd rather have a quarterback to mold. Of course, it's Kyla Williams. The difference with that job is they've interviewed everyone. Everyone. They're interviewing the Iowa State head coach. He might not really have much reason to believe that he would be a favorite or one of the favorites in Chicago. Maybe he would be, but there's not any particular reason. Whereas in New Orleans, he might walk in as the favorite to get that job if they could figure it out. Who knows? But this cowboy situation means they missed an opportunity to interview Mike Vrabel, for instance, or Ben Johnson, or anyone that had to buy. So I guess that would have been Spagnola. It wouldn't have been that many different people. But there are costs. If you end up hiring your coach really late in the cycle, you have a harder time filling out that staff. I think it's one of the reasons why Vrabel wanted to get going quickly. I have some thoughts on his press conference, too, but we'll save those for Monday, for Tuesday's show that will come out actually Wednesday morning with Ollie Connolly. We don't want this to get too long.

It's a night of celebration, nick. I guess that's enough about the Cowboys, but just weird times for the Dallas Cowboys. What a night. What a weird week. It's been a tough week. My kids are going back to school, though, tomorrow. How about that?

That's awesome. A return to normalcy. And a great podcast. Look forward to tomorrow, for those of you who listen to NFL Daily, because no thoughts on the Patriots are as valuable as Greg Rosenthal when he comes away from a Mike Vrabel introductory presser, I promise you.

No, no, no. It was fine. It seemed a little tired, but it was fine.

You've seen some things. We all have.

We all have, including Sean McVade putting it to Brian Flores early in that first half. That offensive line was beleagered and injured, getting healthy and getting it done. It was in a full team effort, obviously, that defense flying around. Yes, they made I believe my wife and my daughter, who are Ram's Vans, very happy tonight. Yes, it's been a long week. We're keeping an eye out on this wind event that is starting. Apparently, it's going to pick up in the morning. The fires are mostly out near us. The smoke cloud is basically gone, but everyone's keeping an eye on this wind event for the next 36 hours or so. And so we're crossing our fingers and hope everything It doesn't get worse here, and we can keep getting better. The Red Cross has helped us to do that. Yes, we've been heartbroken by the destruction from these wildfires across the entire LA region. So families, a Connected by these fires, they do urgently need support. You can help the American Red Cross respond to and help people recover from these disasters. Donate today to support relief efforts by going to redcross. Org/nfl. Com. Nick, this is our last Monday night of the year.

I'm glad we had this playoff game to go out in style. It would have been sad if the last Monday night game of the year that we did was Packers 34 Saint Xero. Was that the one?

Yeah, we did that a few weeks ago.

That was rough. Doesn't that feel like another lifetime ago? This week has aged me. I'm really excited. Them going back to school actually is going to feel like a real return to some sense of normalcy. Last Tuesday, when this all started, it feels like two months ago. And so the Wild Card Weekend, not a lot of close games. Hopefully, we get better games. Divisional Round Weekend, the best weekend of the year. And you'll be helping us out Sunday night, right, nick?

You know it. You know it. I'll be there. Lock, stock, and barrel, baby. We got a lot of playoff games to get to. Okay.

That's it for tonight's show. Thanks, Eric. Thank you to nick. When the Rams are back in the Super Bowl mix, you know football is back. We'll see you Wednesday morning.